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Mortyman
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US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 10:58 am

US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

The Trump administration declared Saturday that all U.N. sanctions against Iran have been restored, a move most of the rest of the world rejects as illegal and sets the stage for an ugly showdown at the world body ahead of its annual General Assembly.


The White House plans to issue an executive order on Monday spelling out how the U.S. will enforce the restored sanctions, and the State and Treasury departments are expected to outline how foreign individuals and businesses will be penalized for violations.

“The United States expects all U.N, member states to fully comply with their obligations to implement these measures,” Pompeo said. “If U.N, member states fail to fulfill their obligations to implement these sanctions, the United States is prepared to use our domestic authorities to impose consequences for those failures and ensure that Iran does not reap the benefits of U.N.-prohibited activity.”



https://www.sfgate.com/news/article/US- ... 580938.php


So basically the USA threatens Europe / world with economic sanctions unless it cmplies with the US … Not sure how smart that is ...
 
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Aaron747
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 11:33 am

Mortyman wrote:
US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

The Trump administration declared Saturday that all U.N. sanctions against Iran have been restored, a move most of the rest of the world rejects as illegal and sets the stage for an ugly showdown at the world body ahead of its annual General Assembly.


The White House plans to issue an executive order on Monday spelling out how the U.S. will enforce the restored sanctions, and the State and Treasury departments are expected to outline how foreign individuals and businesses will be penalized for violations.

“The United States expects all U.N, member states to fully comply with their obligations to implement these measures,” Pompeo said. “If U.N, member states fail to fulfill their obligations to implement these sanctions, the United States is prepared to use our domestic authorities to impose consequences for those failures and ensure that Iran does not reap the benefits of U.N.-prohibited activity.”



https://www.sfgate.com/news/article/US- ... 580938.php


So basically the USA threatens Europe / world with economic sanctions unless it cmplies with the US … Not sure how smart that is ...


The UNSC rejected the US effort to restore sanctions on 8/25. Unilateral rejection of a standard resolution's result means other UNSC members like Russia and China don't have to abide by resolutions either. Nutty precedent to be setting over little 'ol Iran.
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Dahlgardo
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 11:43 am

Mortyman wrote:
US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply


Good move

Iran is a oppressive theocratic regime with an extremistic worldview, and with a glowing desire to acquire nuclear weapons.
What could possibly go wrong with that.

Obamas pandering to Iran was a big mistake .
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petertenthije
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 11:56 am

I'm pretty sure it's not the USA's call to make if UN sanctions are reinstated or not. The UN has to make that decision.

The USA can impose their own sanctions on Iran, which they will no doubt do being rather petty and all, but that does not make them UN sanctions.
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Aaron747
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 12:19 pm

Dahlgardo wrote:
Mortyman wrote:
US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply


Good move

Iran is a oppressive theocratic regime with an extremistic worldview, and with a glowing desire to acquire nuclear weapons.
What could possibly go wrong with that.

Obamas pandering to Iran was a big mistake .


You are misinformed. The growing desire to acquire weapons is in response to 1. unilateral US withdrawal from JPCOA and 2. Saudi’s stated intent to develop its nuclear program
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Francoflier
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 12:21 pm

Wait, is this part of Trump's 'Make Saudi Arabia Great Again' campaign, or the 'Make Israel Great Again' one?

I get confused sometimes...
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petertenthije
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 1:02 pm

Dahlgardo wrote:
Yeah right, always the fault of the US.

Iran have a huge interest of their own to develop nuclear weapons (like the DPRK).
It is, among other things, an insurance policy for the regime.

Also don't forget, that Iran has the annihilation of Israel as an official political doctrine.

An isurance policy is taken against outside factors. The only outside factor routinely threatening Iran are the USA, so I guess using your own analogy this time it is the USA's fault? ;)

Unless you believe that Iran's leaders want to use nuclear weapons against domestic uprisings?
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petertenthije
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 2:03 pm

Dahlgardo wrote:
Are you confident that a religious regime driven by religious dogma will not use or "sell" nukes to achieve their political goals?
That's a big leap of faith if you are. Perhaps you also don't care that the DPRK have nukes as well.

From "Yes Minister" - Salami tactics and the nuclear deterrent
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o861Ka9TtT4
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alfa164
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 2:05 pm

Dahlgardo wrote:
Good move

Iran is a oppressive theocratic regime with an extremistic worldview, and with a glowing desire to acquire nuclear weapons.
What could possibly go wrong with that.
Obamas pandering to Iran was a big mistake .


The USA should move.

Saudi Arabia is a oppressive theocratic regime with an extremist worldview, and with a glowing desire to acquire nuclear weapons.
What could possibly go wrong with that.

Trump's pandering to the Saudis is a big mistake.



There; I fixed it for you...
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Aesma
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 2:11 pm

If the UN isn't behind the move, then by definition these aren't UN sanctions. We know already that the US under Trump (and not just him) only like the UN when it goes one way, but that's not why the UN exists. It's a body for diplomacy, a word Trump barely knows exist.
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Aesma
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 2:12 pm

A notable precedent is of course the Iraq war, which W tried to sell to the UN, unsuccessfully.
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Dahlgardo
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 2:50 pm

alfa164 wrote:
The USA should move.

Saudi Arabia is a oppressive theocratic regime with an extremist worldview, and with a glowing desire to acquire nuclear weapons.
What could possibly go wrong with that.

Trump's pandering to the Saudis is a big mistake.



There; I fixed it for you...


If you think that two wrongs make one right, you're welcome to think so.
And if you fine with Iran getting nukes, you're entitled to that opinion.

I'm no fan of the Kingdom either, but in real world politics you need allies. Especially in the ME.
Saudi Arabia is a complex, but somewhat predictable, and reasonably politically friendly nation, but it has it's problems too.
I wouldn't like Saudi Arabia to get nukes either.
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Aaron747
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 2:55 pm

Dahlgardo wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
You are misinformed. The growing desire to acquire weapons is in response to 1. unilateral US withdrawal from JPCOA and 2. Saudi’s stated intent to develop its nuclear program


Yeah right, always the fault of the US.

Iran have a huge interest of their own to develop nuclear weapons (like the DPRK).
It is, among other things, an insurance policy for the regime.

Also don't forget, that Iran has the annihilation of Israel as an official political doctrine.


JPCOA was agreed to between eight parties including Russia and China, who have been Iranian allies to varying degrees since ‘79. Even they recognized an arms race in the Gulf is undesirable. The US is the only country to walk away from an ostensibly successful non-proliferation pact. Your position is indefensible on the facts.

China has the recapture of Taiwan as an official political doctrine, and we are not sanctioning them for their nukes or anti-sovereignty statements. Stop polluting reasonable foreign policy discussion with your hyperbolic banter.
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Aaron747
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 2:56 pm

Dahlgardo wrote:
alfa164 wrote:
The USA should move.

Saudi Arabia is a oppressive theocratic regime with an extremist worldview, and with a glowing desire to acquire nuclear weapons.
What could possibly go wrong with that.

Trump's pandering to the Saudis is a big mistake.



There; I fixed it for you...


If you think that two wrongs make one right, you're welcome to think so.
And if you fine with Iran getting nukes, you're entitled to that opinion.

I'm no fan of the Kingdom either, but in real world politics you need allies. Especially in the ME.
Saudi Arabia is a complex, but somewhat predictable, and reasonably politically friendly nation, but it has it's problems too.
I wouldn't like Saudi Arabia to get nukes either.


They’re getting them now and Trump’s son in law sold them the tech. I wonder why you’re not starting threads about it?
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Reinhardt
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 3:02 pm

Iran was just starting to come back into some sense of 'Western' accepted behavior. The hard liners in Iran were starting to be kept in check and Obama and the EU did what they did to further increase this. This is all obviously too nuanced and complex for Trump who only see's Iran as one person in charge, one opinion, one risk. That is not and has not been the situation. Trump re-imposing of sanctions, his killing of Soleimani has only done one thing - pushed the more moderate forces on the back foot and made life much easier for the hard liners to say 'look at what the US, our enemy is doing'. You can't win this with sanctions, you can't win this by killing off generals. If you continue to push it, you will get a hardline Iranian govenment and then any action by them is back on the table. Then you'll be screaming from the roofs for some sort of military intervention.

Yes yes yes, we know certain Religious hard line nutters there want Israel gone, but that's not all of Iran (it's an opinion held by many in the ME but that's another topic). That's an isolated section that you are now at grave risk of putting the power back into the hands of. As mentioned by others, maybe the UK and US should stop supporting Saudi Arabia (and selling them weapons) if you want a stable middle east.
Last edited by Reinhardt on Sun Sep 20, 2020 3:07 pm, edited 2 times in total.
 
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Dahlgardo
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 3:03 pm

Aaron747 wrote:
They’re getting them now and Trump’s son in law sold them the tech. I wonder why you’re not starting threads about it?


This thread is about Iranian sanctions, not Saudi Arabia.

The sanctions are definately warrented; and I fully support the US attempt to assert its political powers to force other nations to follow.

Iran, like the DPRK, is a nation that poses a big risk to the US and the West.

If you want to discuss Saudi Arabia feel free yourself to start a thread about that.
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Aaron747
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 3:04 pm

Reinhardt wrote:
Iran was just starting to come back into some sense of 'Western' accepted behavior. The hard liners in Iran were starting to be kept in check and Obama and the EU did what they did to further increase this. This is all obviously too nuanced and complex for Trump who only see's Iran as one person in charge, one opinion, one risk. That is not and has not been the situation. Trump re-imposing of sanctions, his killing of Soleimani has only done one thing - pushed the more moderate forces on the back foot and made life much easier for the hard liners to say 'look at what the US, our enemy is doing'. You can't win this with sanctions, you can win this by killing off generals. If you continue to push it, you will get a hardline Iran govenment and then any action by them is on the table.

Yes yes yes, we know certain Religious hard line nutters there want Israel gone, but that's not all of Iran. That's an isolated section that you are now putting the power back into the hands of. As mentioned above, maybe the UK and US should stop supporting Saudi Arabia (and selling them weapons) if you want a stable middle east.


We don’t need their oil anymore, so it wouldn’t be a herculean task...but petrodollars and rich SA investors with US assets :sarcastic:
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Aaron747
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 3:05 pm

Dahlgardo wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
They’re getting them now and Trump’s son in law sold them the tech. I wonder why you’re not starting threads about it?


This thread is about Iranian sanctions, not Saudi Arabia.

The sanctions are definately warrented; and I fully support the US attempt to assert its political powers to force other nations to follow.

Iran, like the DPRK, is a nation that poses a big risk to the US and the West.

If you want to discuss Saudi Arabia feel free yourself to start a thread about that.


Odd that you responded to that post and not the preceding one. :scratchchin:
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Dahlgardo
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 4:07 pm

Aaron747 wrote:
Odd that you responded to that post and not the preceding one. :scratchchin:


I was on my way out of the door, so didn't have the time, now you ask.

As for the JCPOA agreement, I'm under no illusion the Iran has not been working on their nuclear program in hidden military facilities.
These agreements mean nothing if you are not 100% transparent.

Iran is not a democracy. It's a theocratic dictatorship.
I have hard time understanding how everybody here can get so wind up about Trump, and then don't care about Iran getting nuclear weapons.
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Dahlgardo
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 4:09 pm

Mortyman wrote:
I'm not confident that the religious regime driven by religious dogma like the USA will not use or "sell" nukes to achieve their political goals, no … ;-) :-)


I'm not sure what point you are making, but if you think the US and Iran are the same, then good for you :roll:
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Nick614
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 4:18 pm

Reinhardt wrote:
Iran was just starting to come back into some sense of 'Western' accepted behavior.


Not even remotely true in any sense.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 4:27 pm

Dahlgardo wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
Odd that you responded to that post and not the preceding one. :scratchchin:


I was on my way out of the door, so didn't have the time, now you ask.

As for the JCPOA agreement, I'm under no illusion the Iran has not been working on their nuclear program in hidden military facilities.
These agreements mean nothing if you are not 100% transparent.

Iran is not a democracy. It's a theocratic dictatorship.
I have hard time understanding how everybody here can get so wind up about Trump, and then don't care about Iran getting nuclear weapons.


Oh for crying out loud - so right wing radio hosts and yourself know more than inspectors assigned to check Iran’s compliance? You have no evidence for what you’re claiming when several IAEA reports clearly stated they were in compliance with JPCOA terms.

https://www.armscontrol.org/act/2019-04 ... clear-deal
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Dahlgardo
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 4:50 pm

Aaron747 wrote:
Oh for crying out loud - so right wing radio hosts and yourself know more than inspectors assigned to check Iran’s compliance? You have no evidence for what you’re claiming when several IAEA reports clearly stated they were in compliance with JPCOA terms.

https://www.armscontrol.org/act/2019-04 ... clear-deal


You certainly have a lot of faith in the Iranians

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-50382219
Uranium particles at a "carpet cleaning facility"....go figure :roll:
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Aaron747
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 5:01 pm

Dahlgardo wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
Oh for crying out loud - so right wing radio hosts and yourself know more than inspectors assigned to check Iran’s compliance? You have no evidence for what you’re claiming when several IAEA reports clearly stated they were in compliance with JPCOA terms.

https://www.armscontrol.org/act/2019-04 ... clear-deal


You certainly have a lot of faith in the Iranians

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-50382219
Uranium particles at a "carpet cleaning facility"....go figure :roll:


Those incidents were after US killed JPCOA in May of ‘18. :sarcastic: The international system and diplomacy can’t ever work if we don’t give them a chance to. Iran is no direct threat to the US with its current capabilities - it’s highly prudent to give diplomacy a chance. So again I ask you - why no zeal for de-arming China? Are they simply too big?
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Dahlgardo
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 5:11 pm

Aaron747 wrote:
Those incidents were after US killed JPCOA in May of ‘18. :sarcastic: The international system and diplomacy can’t ever work if we don’t give them a chance to. Iran is no direct threat to the US with its current capabilities - it’s highly prudent to give diplomacy a chance. So again I ask you - why no zeal for de-arming China? Are they simply too big?


I don't think it's a coincidence these things turn so quickly, because Iran never stopped their nuclear program.

As for China, Taiwan and whatever, that's for another thread, but for the record I believe the West should take up a confrontational line with China, which should include minimizing trade, end production ependency, and they sould provide substantional military support to Taiwan, including building up bases.
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Aaron747
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 5:14 pm

Dahlgardo wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
Those incidents were after US killed JPCOA in May of ‘18. :sarcastic: The international system and diplomacy can’t ever work if we don’t give them a chance to. Iran is no direct threat to the US with its current capabilities - it’s highly prudent to give diplomacy a chance. So again I ask you - why no zeal for de-arming China? Are they simply too big?


I don't think it's a coincidence these things turn so quickly, because Iran never stopped their nuclear program.

As for China, Taiwan and whatever, that's for another thread, but for the record I believe the West should take up a confrontational line with China, which should include minimizing trade, end production ependency, and they sould provide substantional military support to Taiwan, including building up bases.


Perpetual war - how quaint.
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Aesma
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 5:45 pm

Dahlgardo wrote:
alfa164 wrote:
The USA should move.

Saudi Arabia is a oppressive theocratic regime with an extremist worldview, and with a glowing desire to acquire nuclear weapons.
What could possibly go wrong with that.

Trump's pandering to the Saudis is a big mistake.



There; I fixed it for you...


If you think that two wrongs make one right, you're welcome to think so.
And if you fine with Iran getting nukes, you're entitled to that opinion.

I'm no fan of the Kingdom either, but in real world politics you need allies. Especially in the ME.
Saudi Arabia is a complex, but somewhat predictable, and reasonably politically friendly nation, but it has it's problems too.
I wouldn't like Saudi Arabia to get nukes either.


In an ideal world nobody would have nukes. Since that's not the world we're in, then I feel countries with nukes are the last ones whose opinion matters on who should and who shouldn't have nukes. My country has them, I pay for them and don't want to get rid of them, hence I understand Iran's position.
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Aesma
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 5:47 pm

The only country that has actually used nuclear weapons on people, on questionable targets to boot, and for questionable reasons, has even less standing on the matter.
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Aesma
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 5:50 pm

Dahlgardo wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
They’re getting them now and Trump’s son in law sold them the tech. I wonder why you’re not starting threads about it?


This thread is about Iranian sanctions, not Saudi Arabia.

The sanctions are definately warrented; and I fully support the US attempt to assert its political powers to force other nations to follow.

Iran, like the DPRK, is a nation that poses a big risk to the US and the West.

If you want to discuss Saudi Arabia feel free yourself to start a thread about that.


You're an ocean away from both countries, what's the risk ? Why do you care, really ? Why aren't you listening to your allies much closer to the situation ? And whom obviously have read the Middle East much better than the US over the years ?
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
AeroVega
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 6:13 pm

Dahlgardo wrote:
petertenthije wrote:
An isurance policy is taken against outside factors. The only outside factor routinely threatening Iran are the USA, so I guess using your own analogy this time it is the USA's fault? ;)

Unless you believe that Iran's leaders want to use nuclear weapons against domestic uprisings?


Well that's the big question.
Are you confident that a religious regime driven by religious dogma will not use or "sell" nukes to achieve their political goals?
That's a big leap of faith if you are. Perhaps you also don't care that the DPRK have nukes as well.

Again, don't forget that the annihilation of Israel is official political doctrine in Iran.
Should scare the hell out of you.


Annihilation is a big word. Iran does not recognize Israel as a political entity because it is built on stolen Palestinian land. Iran want the Palestinians to get their land back with Jerusalem as their capital. Nuking that same land does not make much sense, does it? Reality is that Iran wants to get nukes to have a credible threat of retaliation when Israel/US decide to attack Iran.
 
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Dahlgardo
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 8:04 pm

Aesma wrote:
In an ideal world nobody would have nukes. Since that's not the world we're in, then I feel countries with nukes are the last ones whose opinion matters on who should and who shouldn't have nukes. My country has them, I pay for them and don't want to get rid of them, hence I understand Iran's position.


Well, don't forget the Iranian nuclear program is not there to benifit the Iranians, but the Iranian regime.

A regime that is a destabilizing factor in the ME, by being the closest ally and support of the Assad regime in Syria, the force behind Hizbollah in Lebanon, supporter of Shia death squads in Iraq, and not least a paria to it's own people that is kept in an iron grip by the IRGC with massive amount of political oppression, executions etc. etc.

I find it hard to understand how you can compare that to a free open western democracy.

The Iranian regime is driven by religious dogma, and for that reason alone I worry about Irans motives for acquiring nuclear weapons.
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kaitak
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 8:13 pm

Is it really a sensible, sustainable long term strategy to isolate and contain one of the largest and most populous country in the ME? Has anyone considered the long game on this. America's (which is, let's face it, Israel's) policy towards Iran is stick, stick, stick and has been as long as the current administration has been in power (and will continue to be, if by some misfortune, it's re-elected).

There are lots of things I don't like about Iran, but the current strategy is not going to work, is not going to help moderates and if anything, is only going to strengthen the hand of extremists. Perhaps more importantly, no one has considered the kind of Iran that would be the biggest contributor to regional peace. It's not one that is permanently under sanctions; that Iran has really nothing to lose by creating regional mischief (which, as demonstrated in Yemen, the KSA is allowed to do with impunity). Pulling out of the JCPOA was the worst foreign policy decision America could have made, because it would make (if the next administration chose to do so) getting back on track very difficult. America should be working to secure regional peace and stability; its policies have militated greatly against that. That will remain the case as long as Iran is kept out on the cold. Give them a chance to rebuild their economy and trade normally with the rest of the world and you'll see them appreciate the value of stability.

The current policy is doomed to fail and really makes America look stupid, willfully blind and arrogant.
 
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 8:29 pm

Dahlgardo wrote:
Aesma wrote:
In an ideal world nobody would have nukes. Since that's not the world we're in, then I feel countries with nukes are the last ones whose opinion matters on who should and who shouldn't have nukes. My country has them, I pay for them and don't want to get rid of them, hence I understand Iran's position.


Well, don't forget the Iranian nuclear program is not there to benifit the Iranians, but the Iranian regime.

A regime that is a destabilizing factor in the ME, by being the closest ally and support of the Assad regime in Syria, the force behind Hizbollah in Lebanon, supporter of Shia death squads in Iraq, and not least a paria to it's own people that is kept in an iron grip by the IRGC with massive amount of political oppression, executions etc. etc.

I find it hard to understand how you can compare that to a free open western democracy.

The Iranian regime is driven by religious dogma, and for that reason alone I worry about Irans motives for acquiring nuclear weapons.


Yada, yada.

Everything you've said can be turned round against America and its support for illegal land grabs by Israel and their brutal suppression of Palestinians, their endless support of the corrupt regime in Saudi Arabia and Trump's bestie in North Korea. Have you forgotten who was actually responsible for 9/11? It wasn't Afghanistan, it wasn't Iraq, it wasn't Iran, it wasn't North Korea. So while Trump's America works tirelessly to deny Iran nuclear weapons, they twiddle their thumbs while helping Saudi Arabia to get them and turning a blind eye to North Korea actually testing them. But Iran is the Republican's big boogie man. Laughable.
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Dahlgardo
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 8:31 pm

scbriml wrote:
Yada, yada.

Everything you've said can be turned round against America and its support for illegal land grabs by Israel and their brutal suppression of Palestinians, their endless support of the corrupt regime in Saudi Arabia and Trump's bestie in North Korea. Have you forgotten who was actually responsible for 9/11? It wasn't Afghanistan, it wasn't Iraq, it wasn't Iran, it wasn't North Korea. So while Trump's America works tirelessly to deny Iran nuclear weapons, they twiddle their thumbs while helping Saudi Arabia to get them and turning a blind eye to North Korea actually testing them. But Iran is the Republican's big boogie man. Laughable.


Yada yada, start a your own thread about those topics.
I neither like wahabism or what-about-ism.

This thread is about US sanctions on Iran.
leave your nines at home and bring your skills to the battle
 
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lightsaber
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Sun Sep 20, 2020 9:31 pm

Delete
Winter is coming.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Mon Sep 21, 2020 2:32 am

Dahlgardo wrote:
scbriml wrote:
Yada, yada.

Everything you've said can be turned round against America and its support for illegal land grabs by Israel and their brutal suppression of Palestinians, their endless support of the corrupt regime in Saudi Arabia and Trump's bestie in North Korea. Have you forgotten who was actually responsible for 9/11? It wasn't Afghanistan, it wasn't Iraq, it wasn't Iran, it wasn't North Korea. So while Trump's America works tirelessly to deny Iran nuclear weapons, they twiddle their thumbs while helping Saudi Arabia to get them and turning a blind eye to North Korea actually testing them. But Iran is the Republican's big boogie man. Laughable.


Yada yada, start a your own thread about those topics.
I neither like wahabism or what-about-ism.

This thread is about US sanctions on Iran.


Which have no effect as of 8/25 in the UNSC where Iran’s Chinese and Russian allies voted against sanction renewal. The US cannot force financial institutions in the EU to comply.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
Mortyman
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Mon Sep 21, 2020 4:25 am

Dahlgardo wrote:
scbriml wrote:
Yada, yada.

Everything you've said can be turned round against America and its support for illegal land grabs by Israel and their brutal suppression of Palestinians, their endless support of the corrupt regime in Saudi Arabia and Trump's bestie in North Korea. Have you forgotten who was actually responsible for 9/11? It wasn't Afghanistan, it wasn't Iraq, it wasn't Iran, it wasn't North Korea. So while Trump's America works tirelessly to deny Iran nuclear weapons, they twiddle their thumbs while helping Saudi Arabia to get them and turning a blind eye to North Korea actually testing them. But Iran is the Republican's big boogie man. Laughable.


Yada yada, start a your own thread about those topics.
I neither like wahabism or what-about-ism.

This thread is about US sanctions on Iran.



and the world reaction to them wich is part of a bigger problem with US foreign policy.

I
 
tommy1808
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Mon Sep 21, 2020 4:39 am

Dahlgardo wrote:
Mortyman wrote:
US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply


Good move

Iran is a oppressive theocratic regime with an extremistic worldview, and with a glowing desire to acquire nuclear weapons.
What could possibly go wrong with that.

Obamas pandering to Iran was a big mistake .


interesting position .... so how was getting Iran to give up the 10 ~ 12 nuclear weapons they already effectively had at the time of the deal a mistake? Without the deal they would have had many more by now after all....

AeroVega wrote:
Dahlgardo wrote:
petertenthije wrote:
An isurance policy is taken against outside factors. The only outside factor routinely threatening Iran are the USA, so I guess using your own analogy this time it is the USA's fault? ;)

Unless you believe that Iran's leaders want to use nuclear weapons against domestic uprisings?


Well that's the big question.
Are you confident that a religious regime driven by religious dogma will not use or "sell" nukes to achieve their political goals?
That's a big leap of faith if you are. Perhaps you also don't care that the DPRK have nukes as well.

Again, don't forget that the annihilation of Israel is official political doctrine in Iran.
Should scare the hell out of you.


Annihilation is a big word..


:checkmark: :checkmark: :checkmark: :checkmark:
It borders on willful ignorance to think for a minute that Iran needs nuclear weapons to annihilate Israel if that was really their goal. They could just use their existing reactors, technically they wouldn´t even need reactors, to irradiate some cobalt and loft that over to Israel. Missile defenses would just facilitate the spread of the material all over Israel, and the place would be uninhabitable for north of 100 years..... annihilation done, at a tiny fraction of the cost of an enrichment program.

best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
AeroVega
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Mon Sep 21, 2020 6:28 am

Dahlgardo wrote:
The sanctions are definately warrented; and I fully support the US attempt to assert its political powers to force other nations to follow.

Iran, like the DPRK, is a nation that poses a big risk to the US and the West.


But that's the strange thing. Iran does not pose a threat to the US and the West.

Do you know what did pose a real threat to the West?

ISIS

And do you remember who took care of them?

Iran
 
Kiwirob
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Mon Sep 21, 2020 6:49 am

Dahlgardo wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
Odd that you responded to that post and not the preceding one. :scratchchin:


I was on my way out of the door, so didn't have the time, now you ask.

As for the JCPOA agreement, I'm under no illusion the Iran has not been working on their nuclear program in hidden military facilities.
These agreements mean nothing if you are not 100% transparent.

Iran is not a democracy. It's a theocratic dictatorship.
I have hard time understanding how everybody here can get so wind up about Trump, and then don't care about Iran getting nuclear weapons.


Iran wouldn't need a nuclear program is Israel wasn't nuclear armed. Take the nukes away from them, then nobody in the ME would look at getting them.
 
WIederling
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Mon Sep 21, 2020 6:55 am

Aaron747 wrote:
Which have no effect as of 8/25 in the UNSC where Iran’s Chinese and Russian allies voted against sanction renewal. The US cannot force financial institutions in the EU to comply.


They are busily trying .. with a crowbar.
Same for ( against! ) Nord Stream 2.
This "Dropping the Mask" would indicate that the US sees itself in the "end game"
: ALL Nanometers away from fingertips
or nothing ( by way of global devastation )
Murphy is an optimist
 
Kiwirob
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Mon Sep 21, 2020 6:57 am

Aaron747 wrote:
Dahlgardo wrote:
scbriml wrote:
Yada, yada.

Everything you've said can be turned round against America and its support for illegal land grabs by Israel and their brutal suppression of Palestinians, their endless support of the corrupt regime in Saudi Arabia and Trump's bestie in North Korea. Have you forgotten who was actually responsible for 9/11? It wasn't Afghanistan, it wasn't Iraq, it wasn't Iran, it wasn't North Korea. So while Trump's America works tirelessly to deny Iran nuclear weapons, they twiddle their thumbs while helping Saudi Arabia to get them and turning a blind eye to North Korea actually testing them. But Iran is the Republican's big boogie man. Laughable.


Yada yada, start a your own thread about those topics.
I neither like wahabism or what-about-ism.

This thread is about US sanctions on Iran.


Which have no effect as of 8/25 in the UNSC where Iran’s Chinese and Russian allies voted against sanction renewal. The US cannot force financial institutions in the EU to comply.


They can't but they do, like the sanctions against Russia most EU banks are too afraid of US penalties to go against them. My previous employer had a very successful business in Russia which US sanctions killed, put simply European banks will not accept payments from companies on the OFAC list. Even if they had Norwegian Foreign Ministry approval to export the banks killed it.
 
VSMUT
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Mon Sep 21, 2020 8:11 am

Dahlgardo wrote:
Well, don't forget the Iranian nuclear program is not there to benifit the Iranians, but the Iranian regime.


Depends how you look at it. Over a million Iraqi civilians died in the wake of the US' decision to topple Saddam. Over 4 million fled the country. Safeguarding yourself from further American social experiments is in everyone's best interest, not least us in Denmark, since we are the ones that get overrun with refugees every time.


AeroVega wrote:
Dahlgardo wrote:
petertenthije wrote:
An isurance policy is taken against outside factors. The only outside factor routinely threatening Iran are the USA, so I guess using your own analogy this time it is the USA's fault? ;)

Unless you believe that Iran's leaders want to use nuclear weapons against domestic uprisings?


Well that's the big question.
Are you confident that a religious regime driven by religious dogma will not use or "sell" nukes to achieve their political goals?
That's a big leap of faith if you are. Perhaps you also don't care that the DPRK have nukes as well.

Again, don't forget that the annihilation of Israel is official political doctrine in Iran.
Should scare the hell out of you.


Annihilation is a big word. Iran does not recognize Israel as a political entity because it is built on stolen Palestinian land. Iran want the Palestinians to get their land back with Jerusalem as their capital. Nuking that same land does not make much sense, does it? Reality is that Iran wants to get nukes to have a credible threat of retaliation when Israel/US decide to attack Iran.


Khamenei specifically points out that Iran only has an issue with the Israeli government (or regime as they put it). They aren't against the jews, as he correctly noted, there is a Jewish population in Iran who are allowed to practice their beliefs. Iran wants representation for the Palestinians who already live in Israel. Bombing Israel would be counter intuitive, since they would also be bombing the people they claim to protect.
 
tommy1808
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Mon Sep 21, 2020 11:20 am

Kiwirob wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
Dahlgardo wrote:

Yada yada, start a your own thread about those topics.
I neither like wahabism or what-about-ism.

This thread is about US sanctions on Iran.


Which have no effect as of 8/25 in the UNSC where Iran’s Chinese and Russian allies voted against sanction renewal. The US cannot force financial institutions in the EU to comply.


They can't but they do, like the sanctions against Russia most EU banks are too afraid of US penalties to go against them.


The EU could just decide that Council Regulation (EC) No 2271/96 applies to anyone using the SWIFT network, and banks obeying unilateral US Sanctions are to be excluded. That is essentially the card the US admin is playing in reverse. A limited nuclear exchange would do less damage to the US economy than that. Which is why they don´t do it, but turn up the heat enough ....

best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
Sokes
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Mon Sep 21, 2020 12:23 pm

What hasn't been asked yet: What is Trump's motivation?

Clinton went against the military industrial complex, but in exchange he did what the banking lobby wanted. Was Bush the reaction of the military industrial complex?
Obama was supposed to be the prince of peace. He wasn't in good terms with the Israel lobby, but avoided upsetting the banking lobby or the military industrial complex.
Trump so far avoided war, but IIRC didn't cut the attack budget. Looking at the media it seems the establishment doesn't like outsiders to become president. It seems Trump tries to please the Israel lobby. Trump's warnings of Iran would be more credible if he had not been such a strong supporter of Israel.

The argument about opposing a religious regime is good. But then Saudi's wahhabism defeats it.

Does Trump need a war to win the elections? How strong is the influence of the Israel lobby in US media?
Why can't the world be a little bit more autistic?
 
tommy1808
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Mon Sep 21, 2020 12:28 pm

Sokes wrote:
What hasn't been asked yet: What is Trump's motivation?


Being tough on Iran just scores point among the uninformed. That is plenty enough.

And anger:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/worl ... 61736.html

The Iranian revolutionary guards may have simply not given him a large enough cut when he went on laundering money for them.

best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
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einsteinboricua
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Mon Sep 21, 2020 1:41 pm

Dahlgardo wrote:
Mortyman wrote:
US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply


Good move

Iran is a oppressive theocratic regime with an extremistic worldview, and with a glowing desire to acquire nuclear weapons.
What could possibly go wrong with that.

Obamas pandering to Iran was a big mistake .

How is Iran any different from North Korea? I don't see you criticizing Trump's love affair with Kim Jong-Un.
"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."
 
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Dahlgardo
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Mon Sep 21, 2020 4:08 pm

einsteinboricua wrote:
How is Iran any different from North Korea? I don't see you criticizing Trump's love affair with Kim Jong-Un.


Apparently on this site, you have to take an anti-US, and certainly an anti Trump stance no matter what the issue.
I guess it makes people feel virtuos.

DPRK and Iran are alike in many ways, and certainly in the way that they are run by extremely oppressive regimes with pathological ideologies.

It is fully understandable states like that want to acquire nuclear weapons, as they will secure them from invasion no matter what they do and how they treat their populations.

The US never lifted sanctions against DPRK which is major difference, and I guess Trump naively tried to see if the DPRK regime could be influenced in some way.

The laissez faire attitude on this forum towards Iran is just staggering.
leave your nines at home and bring your skills to the battle
 
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einsteinboricua
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Mon Sep 21, 2020 4:39 pm

Dahlgardo wrote:
Apparently on this site, you have to take an anti-US, and certainly an anti Trump stance no matter what the issue.

Point to the rule that people in this forum must ALWAYS stand by the US and its leader, no matter what. I hear Parler is an alternative aligned with your beliefs. This may be a US-based website, but there's no requirement for it to be patriotic. You're more than welcome to open one.

Dahlgardo wrote:
The US never lifted sanctions against DPRK which is major difference, and I guess Trump naively tried to see if the DPRK regime could be influenced in some way.

Lifting sanctions is not the only way to give a country something it wants. Meeting with KJU, canceling war games with South Korea (all while getting nothing in return)...North Korea can reap a whole lot more with that than lifting sanctions.

Dahlgardo wrote:
The laissez faire attitude on this forum towards Iran is just staggering.

1. Point to the rule that states Iran must be demonized at all times in this forum.
2. Maybe some of us believe that Iran, being a regional power, has more to give to the general community than North Korea, and that if we're in bed with the Saudis (you know, the country where half the 9/11 terrorists came from), why should we exclude Iran?
"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."
 
petertenthije
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Re: US says all UN sanctions on Iran restored and threatens world to comply

Mon Sep 21, 2020 4:46 pm

einsteinboricua wrote:
This may be a US-based website, but there's no requirement for it to be patriotic.
[/quote]As if blindly accepting everything your country or political leaders does makes you patriotic.
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