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Waterbomber2
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Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 3:44 am

Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 12:36 am

Tugger wrote:
LittleFokker wrote:
You know what would be the real October surprise? If it turns out the White House was being honest about all of these positive tests.

This administration has demonstrated they are willing to lie about anything and everything, including matters concerning the President's health, I wouldn't put it past them to fake all these people having COVID as a desperate attempt to attract sympathy and distract from all of the scandalous news of the last few weeks.

I don't have any proof that this is a hoax, but I do know they are depraved enough to try and wouldn't be the least bit shocked if it was a stunt.

Hell, if the press secretary said Trump died from the virus, I would want to be able to touch the cold body along with DNA confirmation that it really is Trump. The boys who cried wolf have lost all credibility with information.

The scale of the conspiracy, involving 10's to hundreds of people, that would be needed has me not really considering that to be possible. But that's me.

Tugg


10's to hundreds of people on the same team, that's not that hard.
In an earlier post that got deleted, I wrote that I think that it's too convenient for Trump to be diagnosed when his reelection bid is falling apart based on the poor debate performance and his mismanagement of Covid.
It's also very convenient that he wasn't tested ahead of the debate because he was late.

As I said, I'll believe it if he dies of Covid.
Otherwise, this could all be a ploy to try to turn the election around.

If he comes on the stage in a week looking like Covid was not worse than a flu and shouting it over the roofs, claiming that it's ridiculous to change our way of lives for this little ailment, hailing Remdesivir and Regeneron as definite cures, 100% this was all fake. Remdisivir by itself should humble him, these antivirals turn your stomach completely upside down and then some.

If he comes on the stage in a few weeks looking humble, announcing that it was pretty bad and that he is going to take more measures to curb the spread and begging everyone to wear masks, in a U-turn similar to good ol' Boris Johnson's (whom became a lot wiser after catching Covid), it is probably real.


This virus has the power to humble and inject realism to its victims, even the ones with big mouths.

Former Italian premier Silvio Berlusconi left hospital on Monday 11 days after being admitted with coronavirus, an experience he described as perhaps "the most difficult" in his life.

https://www.thelocal.it/20200914/once-a ... -treatment
 
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einsteinboricua
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 1:09 am

NIKV69 wrote:
I don't entertain statements or questions that the underlying context is wishing someone dies to gain a political advantage. Passive aggression is not my thing.

I don't know how you're getting that he's wishing for Trump to die (though to be fair, it's not like Trump has made himself a darling of Americans everywhere). The question is related to what happens to Pence's role in the Senate if he is sworn as POTUS. Trump is sick with a disease for which he's high-risk. Asking about a hypothetical scenario in which he passes away is not wishing for his death; it's actually an actual scenario we should entertain.
"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."
 
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Pellegrine
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 1:14 am

T4thH wrote:
art wrote:
Pellegrine wrote:
In addition to the Regeneron therapy, the President is also now on Remdesivir, although he is not on supplemental oxygen.


I'm not a medic of any kind.

I seem to recall that Remdesivir was first used in the UK for severe cases where patients were being ventilated, reducing mortality by 30%. Is there any evidence that this drug - which I understand reduces inflammation or reduces the side effects of inflammation - can prevent inflammation if used pre-empitively?

Sorry. but here you are wrong. Remdesivir impacts the reproduction of the virus. It helps to prevent, that an infection goes serious, a patient has to be hospitalized and helps, that a patient get out of the hospital a little bit earlier. The effect is more or less low/not really high but still significant. And till now, it is the only approved treatment, which supports in the early part of the infection.So Remdesivir is no game changer, it supports.

You have mixed it with Dexamethasone (or all other corticosteroids, it is the general corticosteroid effect, which is here important and there are calculation tables, to compare the effectiveness and the dose of the different mild, middle and strong corticosteroids). Corticosteroids have an effect for severe and hospitalized cases in the second phase of the illness, reducing the death rate by minimum around 30%. It has no effect in the first phase, so around the first 7 to 10 days of the illness. COVID-19 kills you, by actively triggering the immune system, so your own immune system gets crazy and kills you. Here the ant-inflammatory effect of corticosteroid is important, but the anti- immune suppressive effect of Corticosteroid treatment is the main effect.
For severe cases, Corticosteroid treatment is signifcant..

The second is, it triggers a group of the white blood cells (the Granolocytes) to agglutinate, so they got Thromboses without Thrombocytes, insted with Granolocytes, a patient can get dozens of small infarcts, like small strokes,small embolisms,cardiac infarcts, "covid toes" (these are often rash of the skin but also often small infarcts", infarcts of the kidney and all other organs. This can be treated with anti coagulates like Heparin.
Also the anti coagulates treatment is significant.

Anti coagulates + Corticosteroid treatment is for severe to critical cases the most important treatment.


That's an awesome and informative post. I've been reading studies, but haven't yet been able to determine why remdesivir is only partially effective on SARS-Cov-2 and why it didn't really work for EBOV. We really need more effective antiviral therapies, especially for EBOV.
We fly JETS, we don't fly donkeys. Citizenship/Residence::: Washington DC, US; Vaud, CH; Providenciales, TCI (hence my avi)
 
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Pellegrine
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 1:33 am

dtw2hyd wrote:
So we know that he took HCQ in the past, two days back a high dose of Regeneron, yesterday Remidvisir.

Are these single dose treatments? I thought otherwise.

What are we missing here? I thought experimental drugs are for young and healthy (or) for compassion reasons.

And why are they trying different drugs on different day on a 74-year-old.


Remdesivir is usually a 5 day treatment that has to be given in hospital setting. The Regeneron monoclonal antibody therapy is one dose given IV or IM (intramuscular). Remdesivir is under EUA, and a doctor would determine when it is fit to use. Also, some studies suggest (reading one in The Lancet right now) that remdesivir is most effective the earliest it can be given. Obviously most patients present with severe enough symptoms to be admitted to ICU at 10-12 days post-infection, so this is too late for it to affect things more than a little bit.
We fly JETS, we don't fly donkeys. Citizenship/Residence::: Washington DC, US; Vaud, CH; Providenciales, TCI (hence my avi)
 
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seb146
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 1:53 am

I hope he survives. He needs to see the consequences of his actions. He needs to pay for his law breaking. This "law and order" person needs to be held accountable. Clinton and Obama (McCain and GWB for that matter) never put themselves on such high pedestals. They didn't have far to fall. Not even Reagan had this ego.

Of course, MAGA will blame "liberals" and Hillary and Obama and literally anyone else when he is put on trial. Personal responsibility, you know.......
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
acavpics
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 2:03 am

I also don't wish immediate death upon him. But rather, a long, intense disease that makes him realize how much suffering he has inflicted on the common middle class American man during the last 4 years.
 
alfa164
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 3:17 am

acavpics wrote:
I also don't wish immediate death upon him. But rather, a long, intense disease that makes him realize how much suffering he has inflicted on the common middle class American man during the last 4 years.


:checkmark: . Over the past four years, Donald J. Trump has done immeasurable damage to our country, to our citizens, and to the entire world. He’s done that damage gleefully, absolutely unconcerned with our suffering. He revels in it. He has no capability for empathy; he has no ability to show concern for anyone but himself. And as he jailed immigrants and demonized Black people and vilified the press and enriched himself and his children, he only sought more power. I don’t want Donald Trump to die. I want Donald Trump to suffer - to suffer from the disease he maliciously ignored, to the detriment of millions of Americans; to suffer from the shame of admitting that he has been wrong in everything he has said and done during this pandemic; and to suffer from the ignobility of a devastating, humiliating defeat on November 3rd. I want him to suffer the consequences of his hubris, cruelty, and greed - to wake up on the 4th of November alive, but broken in soul and spirit; rejected by this nation as a whole.

His ignorance, depravity, and narcissism has brought death to more than 200,000 Americans, and pain and suffering to millions more; I want him to feel what they have felt. They say, "payback is hell". It is time for payback. I want Herr Trump to suffer through hell.
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johnboy
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 3:40 am

NIKV69 wrote:

To say this statement is ghoulish is an understatement.


I’ve been here a long time and know how you react, so spare me.
 
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WarRI1
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 3:46 am

alfa164 wrote:
acavpics wrote:
I also don't wish immediate death upon him. But rather, a long, intense disease that makes him realize how much suffering he has inflicted on the common middle class American man during the last 4 years.


:checkmark: . Over the past four years, Donald J. Trump has done immeasurable damage to our country, to our citizens, and to the entire world. He’s done that damage gleefully, absolutely unconcerned with our suffering. He revels in it. He has no capability for empathy; he has no ability to show concern for anyone but himself. And as he jailed immigrants and demonized Black people and vilified the press and enriched himself and his children, he only sought more power. I don’t want Donald Trump to die. I want Donald Trump to suffer - to suffer from the disease he maliciously ignored, to the detriment of millions of Americans; to suffer from the shame of admitting that he has been wrong in everything he has said and done during this pandemic; and to suffer from the ignobility of a devastating, humiliating defeat on November 3rd. I want him to suffer the consequences of his hubris, cruelty, and greed - to wake up on the 4th of November alive, but broken in soul and spirit; rejected by this nation as a whole.

His ignorance, depravity, and narcissism has brought death to more than 200,000 Americans, and pain and suffering to millions more; I want him to feel what they have felt. They say, "payback is hell". It is time for payback. I want Herr Trump to suffer through hell.



We all know what Hitler was, yet he had millions of followers. I am not comparing this man to Hitler, but what what I do not understand is how after all these years and millions dead, we have another Madman sowing the seeds of hatred like Hitler did. We now see millions of Americans following this Buffoon, this Caricature of a leader while he rips apart our nation and institutions and sows the same seeds as Hitler. They do have similarities and that is scary. They both had and have now, the same type of followers and that is really scary in this supposedly enlightened era.
It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
 
emperortk
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 4:15 am

NIKV69 wrote:
emperortk wrote:
Trump only cares about people to the extent that they provide him adulation to fuel his narcissism.


You realize this is true of just about every politician?


Trump is a politician? I thought he was beloved because he was a bigly successful businessman who was going to drain the swamp?
:confused:
 
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DocLightning
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 4:47 am

cpd wrote:

It is interesting they are giving him this treatment, maybe it is low risk, but it's still not approved as yet. I'd say his condition has worsened enough that they are pulling all the stops.


That's about what I think is happening. The treatment itself, REGN-COV2, is a combination of two monoclonal antibodies. In and of themselves, antibodies that are not directed against a host target will have no specific side-effects. Antibodies are extremely specific and bind to only their target protein, which is, in this case, the surface glycoprotein (spike) of SARS-CoV-2. If no SARS-CoV-2 is around, the antibodies will have no effect. Two antibodies are used so that the virus cannot develop an "escape mutant" that escapes one of the antibodies. It would be shockingly unlikely (practically impossible) for the virus to undergo two such mutations simultaneously.

So it will be expected to have minimal side effects (although the dose of eight grams is a bit shocking...seems like a large amount of protein to dump into an elderly man's circulatory system, amassing about 0.1% of his total blood volume). But will it be helpful? I'm skeptical.

In every acute viral illness (as opposed to the chronic ones like HIV and Hepatitis C) for which we have come up with antiviral therapies, the therapies give at best, a modest improvement in symptoms and shortening of the illness. This is because by the time the patient has symptoms, the patient's immune response has kicked in and viral loads are already decreasing. To prevent the disease in the first place, antiviral therapy should be given before the patient ever gets symptoms. That raises an obvious logistical problem of how to predict the future. For antibody drugs like this one, one option would be to administer the medication by injection every month. Palivizumab ("SYNAGIS") is just such a treatment given to high-risk infants to prevent infection with Respiratory Syncyctial Virus (RSV). Perhaps if the President had been getting monthly infusions (or injections) of REGN-COV2 before being infected, he wouldn't have become ill at all.

But by the time the patient is sick, the immune response has started. For COVID-19 in the elderly, there seems to be a very high chance that this immune response will be dysregulated and result in inappropriate immune reactions that do nothing to fight the virus, but cause extensive damage to the patient's body. Lowering the viral load more quickly with drugs like remdesivir does speed recovery and reduce mortality by ~15%, but it is no silver bullet. Rather, at this point, the trick is to attack the aberrant immune response. Steroids have been used for this with again a 15-30% reduction in mortality. IL-17A inhibitors also have shown positive, but modest results. The patients are still very sick.

In addition, most patients who survive severe COVID-19 are left with a post-COVID-19 syndrome that people are calling the "long haul." "Long haulers," while negative for the virus, may have fever, cough, pain, poor sleep, hair loss, extreme fatigue, shortness-of-breath, and even inability to work. There doesn't seem to be a good treatment for "long haulers."

Finally, Mr. Trump may be improving today, but I am reminded by the warnings of our medical colleagues in Italy during their February crisis. The intensivists in Italy all had the same message: "DO NOT TRUST THE FIRST IMPROVEMENT. DO NOT BE CAUGHT UNPREPARED!"
-Doc Lightning-

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cpd
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 4:57 am

NIKV69 wrote:
Newark727 wrote:
You're a very poor judge of character if you see Trump's narcissism as comparable to the average among politicians generally. It's a little like comparing a warm day on the beach to high summer in Death Valley - technically accurate but incredibly misleading.


I have met more politicians than you. Trust me they all use people as means to an end.


There are a lot of respectable ones out there who are very reasonable and care about people and the best outcomes. They've been from both sides of politics, funny enough.

Some of them have been from parties that I'd never vote for, but I would say that individually they are doing a good job from my experience dealing with them. One thing in common among all of them is no hubris and no loud-mouth statements - they all let their work do the talking.
Last edited by cpd on Sun Oct 04, 2020 5:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
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Pellegrine
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 4:59 am

DocLightning wrote:
cpd wrote:

It is interesting they are giving him this treatment, maybe it is low risk, but it's still not approved as yet. I'd say his condition has worsened enough that they are pulling all the stops.


That's about what I think is happening. The treatment itself, REGN-COV2, is a combination of two monoclonal antibodies. In and of themselves, antibodies that are not directed against a host target will have no specific side-effects. Antibodies are extremely specific and bind to only their target protein, which is, in this case, the surface glycoprotein (spike) of SARS-CoV-2. If no SARS-CoV-2 is around, the antibodies will have no effect. Two antibodies are used so that the virus cannot develop an "escape mutant" that escapes one of the antibodies. It would be shockingly unlikely (practically impossible) for the virus to undergo two such mutations simultaneously.

So it will be expected to have minimal side effects (although the dose of eight grams is a bit shocking...seems like a large amount of protein to dump into an elderly man's circulatory system, amassing about 0.1% of his total blood volume). But will it be helpful? I'm skeptical.

In every acute viral illness (as opposed to the chronic ones like HIV and Hepatitis C) for which we have come up with antiviral therapies, the therapies give at best, a modest improvement in symptoms and shortening of the illness. This is because by the time the patient has symptoms, the patient's immune response has kicked in and viral loads are already decreasing. To prevent the disease in the first place, antiviral therapy should be given before the patient ever gets symptoms. That raises an obvious logistical problem of how to predict the future. For antibody drugs like this one, one option would be to administer the medication by injection every month. Palivizumab ("SYNAGIS") is just such a treatment given to high-risk infants to prevent infection with Respiratory Syncyctial Virus (RSV). Perhaps if the President had been getting monthly infusions (or injections) of REGN-COV2 before being infected, he wouldn't have become ill at all.

But by the time the patient is sick, the immune response has started. For COVID-19 in the elderly, there seems to be a very high chance that this immune response will be dysregulated and result in inappropriate immune reactions that do nothing to fight the virus, but cause extensive damage to the patient's body. Lowering the viral load more quickly with drugs like remdesivir does speed recovery and reduce mortality by ~15%, but it is no silver bullet. Rather, at this point, the trick is to attack the aberrant immune response. Steroids have been used for this with again a 15-30% reduction in mortality. IL-17A inhibitors also have shown positive, but modest results. The patients are still very sick.

In addition, most patients who survive severe COVID-19 are left with a post-COVID-19 syndrome that people are calling the "long haul." "Long haulers," while negative for the virus, may have fever, cough, pain, poor sleep, hair loss, extreme fatigue, shortness-of-breath, and even inability to work. There doesn't seem to be a good treatment for "long haulers."

Finally, Mr. Trump may be improving today, but I am reminded by the warnings of our medical colleagues in Italy during their February crisis. The intensivists in Italy all had the same message: "DO NOT TRUST THE FIRST IMPROVEMENT. DO NOT BE CAUGHT UNPREPARED!"


I agree he could still crash. I'm worried about Chris Christie too...he is extremely overweight, possibly with metabolic syndrome...I wonder how he is doing.
We fly JETS, we don't fly donkeys. Citizenship/Residence::: Washington DC, US; Vaud, CH; Providenciales, TCI (hence my avi)
 
cpd
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 5:12 am

DocLightning wrote:
cpd wrote:

It is interesting they are giving him this treatment, maybe it is low risk, but it's still not approved as yet. I'd say his condition has worsened enough that they are pulling all the stops.


That's about what I think is happening. The treatment itself, REGN-COV2, is a combination of two monoclonal antibodies. In and of themselves, antibodies that are not directed against a host target will have no specific side-effects. Antibodies are extremely specific and bind to only their target protein, which is, in this case, the surface glycoprotein (spike) of SARS-CoV-2. If no SARS-CoV-2 is around, the antibodies will have no effect. Two antibodies are used so that the virus cannot develop an "escape mutant" that escapes one of the antibodies. It would be shockingly unlikely (practically impossible) for the virus to undergo two such mutations simultaneously.

So it will be expected to have minimal side effects (although the dose of eight grams is a bit shocking...seems like a large amount of protein to dump into an elderly man's circulatory system, amassing about 0.1% of his total blood volume). But will it be helpful? I'm skeptical.

In every acute viral illness (as opposed to the chronic ones like HIV and Hepatitis C) for which we have come up with antiviral therapies, the therapies give at best, a modest improvement in symptoms and shortening of the illness. This is because by the time the patient has symptoms, the patient's immune response has kicked in and viral loads are already decreasing. To prevent the disease in the first place, antiviral therapy should be given before the patient ever gets symptoms. That raises an obvious logistical problem of how to predict the future. For antibody drugs like this one, one option would be to administer the medication by injection every month. Palivizumab ("SYNAGIS") is just such a treatment given to high-risk infants to prevent infection with Respiratory Syncyctial Virus (RSV). Perhaps if the President had been getting monthly infusions (or injections) of REGN-COV2 before being infected, he wouldn't have become ill at all.

But by the time the patient is sick, the immune response has started. For COVID-19 in the elderly, there seems to be a very high chance that this immune response will be dysregulated and result in inappropriate immune reactions that do nothing to fight the virus, but cause extensive damage to the patient's body. Lowering the viral load more quickly with drugs like remdesivir does speed recovery and reduce mortality by ~15%, but it is no silver bullet. Rather, at this point, the trick is to attack the aberrant immune response. Steroids have been used for this with again a 15-30% reduction in mortality. IL-17A inhibitors also have shown positive, but modest results. The patients are still very sick.

In addition, most patients who survive severe COVID-19 are left with a post-COVID-19 syndrome that people are calling the "long haul." "Long haulers," while negative for the virus, may have fever, cough, pain, poor sleep, hair loss, extreme fatigue, shortness-of-breath, and even inability to work. There doesn't seem to be a good treatment for "long haulers."

Finally, Mr. Trump may be improving today, but I am reminded by the warnings of our medical colleagues in Italy during their February crisis. The intensivists in Italy all had the same message: "DO NOT TRUST THE FIRST IMPROVEMENT. DO NOT BE CAUGHT UNPREPARED!"


Thanks for the clarification - this is obviously an area I don't profess to know much about. But I do know that a fairly healthy doctor in Sydney who got the virus ended up very sick and with debilitating side-effects after it, seizures and heart problems (which you've probably read about). He rode bicycles a lot and was a member of one of the clubs I know. He wasn't particularly older than me. Because of the seizures he isn't allowed to drive anymore and because of the heart problems, he cannot do any riding because it knocks him about too much.

When that can happen to someone who is taking precautions and who knows the dangers, then it's a big red warning sign, take this seriously.
 
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scbriml
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 7:33 am

Revelation wrote:
From what I've been reading, the general opinion on the odds of him not making it are around 5%.


So there is a chance, however small, that Trump could actually get that which he desires most - to be president for the rest of his life. :duck:
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WIederling
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 8:00 am

acavpics wrote:
I also don't wish immediate death upon him. But rather, a long, intense disease that makes him realize how much suffering he has inflicted on the common middle class American man during the last 4 years.


Karma is intrinsic not extrinsic :-)
Murphy is an optimist
 
flipdewaf
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 8:28 am

NIKV69 wrote:
I don't entertain statements or questions that the underlying context is wishing someone dies to gain a political advantage. Passive aggression is not my thing.

Interesting, your not liking a statement and therefore not engaging however has no bearing on its inherent validity.

Fred


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keesje
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 9:05 am

Trump must retire, take care of his grand children, go back in business. Best for every one.

Have Pen run the show for the next three months (short enough to avoid un-charitable laws) and have 2 fresh new candidates decently compete.

Both in their forties, not poisoned by the crazy polarisation that severely weakened the nation, but uniting.

I think US voters together demand this from the house, WH, high court. They have the right on capable, reliable leadership.

Leadership that generally gets approval from a majority of the population. Not the lowest ever. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_ ... val_rating

Out with Trumps, Pelosi, Biden the hawkish nationalists and dumb opportunists.
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Aaron747
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 10:59 am

Can’t understand why the WH is insulting the intelligence of the public with fake timelines, insufficient medical statements and now fake photos. Unbelievable incompetence and PR buffoonery.

https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-h ... 020-10?amp
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
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casinterest
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 11:16 am

Aaron747 wrote:
Can’t understand why the WH is insulting the intelligence of the public with fake timelines, insufficient medical statements and now fake photos. Unbelievable incompetence and PR buffoonery.

https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-h ... 020-10?amp



They are going to take the precautionary story and run with it for the election. Never mind that Melania, Hope, and the others are not checked into the hospital.

Something is wrong for him to be there, and whether they had serious concerns , or an abundance of caution, their are underlying conditions that got the doctors to get him to go to the hospital.
Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did..So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.--Mark Twain
 
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Francoflier
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 11:27 am

Aaron747 wrote:
Can’t understand why the WH is insulting the intelligence of the public with fake timelines, insufficient medical statements and now fake photos. Unbelievable incompetence and PR buffoonery.

https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-h ... 020-10?amp


Lol, interesting that Jon Ostrower, of all people, if the one who called the WH out on the PR stunt bullcr#p. Nice.
I'll do my own airline. With Blackjack. And hookers. In fact, forget the airline.
 
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Aesma
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 11:49 am

NIKV69 wrote:
I don't entertain statements or questions that the underlying context is wishing someone dies to gain a political advantage. Passive aggression is not my thing.


Unless it's a Supreme Court Justice, then being gleeful 5 minutes after their death is fine.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
dtw2hyd
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 12:20 pm

Some could call photos a PR stunt others could call it reassuring the nation.
All posts are just opinions.
 
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SheikhDjibouti
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 12:21 pm

Newark727 wrote:
You're a very poor judge of character if you see Trump's narcissism as comparable to the average among politicians generally. It's a little like comparing a warm day on the beach to high summer in Death Valley - technically accurate but incredibly misleading.

NIKV69 wrote:
I have met more politicians than you.
Really? You are intimately acquainted with Newark727 and his circle of friends? :shakehead:
Here's the kicker; I am now going to claim that I have met more politicians than you
The reason being by virtue of one of my jobs {clue; it's to do with management of elections}
Of course I don't know if you are in the same line of work, but I have my doubts.
FWIW the politicians I have met have not been restricted to one candidate, or even one party. Unlike some here, I'm not a party animal. ;)

NIKV69 wrote:
If you want to infer that Trump is the only one.....
Source please? Who here on a.net is making that claim? It certainly wasn't in the post you were responding too. Not even close.
But to address your spurious claim; Trump is obviously not "the only one", and definitely not "the chosen one". He is just at the extreme end of human behavior. Somewhere south of "barely acceptable", and probably closer to "outright insanity." Other politicians occasionally drift into this zone, but the smart ones usually claw their way back towards normal.


NIKV69 wrote:
... but trust me Pelosi, Reid and Schumer are the exact same person.
I assume you know this because these are some of the "more politicians than you" that you have actually met?
Wow! I didn't realize you moved in such exalted circles. But ...why on earth have you been consorting with "the enemy"? :o

NIKV69 wrote:
You just share their beliefs.
You clearly share the same beliefs as Trump, but that's ok.
Others share the same beliefs as Pelosi et al, and yet that somehow clouds their judgement. But not yours.....
If only we were all as balanced and level-headed as you.
:rotfl:

NIKV69 wrote:
Passive aggression is not my thing.
Um pot.....um kettle.... um black.
Nothing to see here; move along please.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 12:28 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
Some could call photos a PR stunt others could call it reassuring the nation.


The Constitution already has procedures for when the chief executive is sick or unable to perform their duties. There's no shame in it - invoking the 25th for 2-3 days or whatever it took would reassure the nation far more than photographic fakery easily seen for the BS it is. Integrity is reassuring, not BS.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
dtw2hyd
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 12:40 pm

Aaron747 wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:
Some could call photos a PR stunt others could call it reassuring the nation.


The Constitution already has procedures for when the chief executive is sick or unable to perform their duties. There's no shame in it - invoking the 25th for 2-3 days or whatever it took would reassure the nation far more than photographic fakery easily seen for the BS it is. Integrity is reassuring, not BS.


Information from current WH leaks in minutes, I doubt Trump can hide anything. Yes, lack of integrity is a bad thing, but we know(though leaks) lot more than this admiration than previous ones. His own cabinet and advisors are not capable of keeping secrets. Setup mic on WH lawn, and they will happily fumble and spill beans everywhere.
All posts are just opinions.
 
Waterbomber2
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 2:57 pm

Image

https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-h ... &r=US&IR=T

Trump is seen giving Carte Blanche.
He may not be long anymore.

When King Charles the Second was fleeing the Roundheads, he is reputed to have offered his helpers a 'Carte Blanche'. This was a 'White Card', a blank sheet of paper with his signature at the bottom. The recipient of this could then write anything they wanted above the royal signature and it would be legal.


https://www.theguardian.com/notesandque ... 43,00.html
 
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DocLightning
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 3:48 pm

Pellegrine wrote:
I agree he could still crash. I'm worried about Chris Christie too...he is extremely overweight, possibly with metabolic syndrome...I wonder how he is doing.


I fear this will go very poorly for him.
-Doc Lightning-

"The sky calls to us. If we do not destroy ourselves, we will one day venture to the stars."
-Carl Sagan
 
wingman
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 3:49 pm

He must've yelled "Do you know who I am?" at the first nurse that denied him a Big Mac. So here he is taking the test. It's not easy to see but that sure as hell doesn't look like a T-r-u-m to me. I don't think he really knows, he just thinks of himself as "I!" or "ME!!!". A few days ago he said people with COVID were "nobody's", it has to be confusing as hell.
 
FGITD
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 3:55 pm

Waterbomber2 wrote:

https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-h ... &r=US&IR=T

Trump is seen giving Carte Blanche.
He may not be long anymore.

When King Charles the Second was fleeing the Roundheads, he is reputed to have offered his helpers a 'Carte Blanche'. This was a 'White Card', a blank sheet of paper with his signature at the bottom. The recipient of this could then write anything they wanted above the royal signature and it would be legal.


https://www.theguardian.com/notesandque ... 43,00.html


Good thing we don't live in the mid 1600s where a signature was enough to get anything you want.

Complete nonsense, it's a photo op to make it look like he's working that they didn't expect would be scrutinised to this degree.
 
NIKV69
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 4:07 pm

Aesma wrote:
NIKV69 wrote:
I don't entertain statements or questions that the underlying context is wishing someone dies to gain a political advantage. Passive aggression is not my thing.


Unless it's a Supreme Court Justice, then being gleeful 5 minutes after their death is fine.


Funny I don't remember being gleeful about RBG dying but feel free to produce the post.

SheikhDjibouti wrote:

You clearly share the same beliefs as Trump, but that's ok.


Do you even know his beliefs? If you knew anything about Trump you would know he is a moderate Democrat. I am a Libertarian and probably is close to as Rand Paul. I know the game here is identity politics but..
90 Day Fiancé has taught me that Russian woman are excellent.
 
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seb146
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 4:24 pm

NIKV69 wrote:
Aesma wrote:
NIKV69 wrote:
I don't entertain statements or questions that the underlying context is wishing someone dies to gain a political advantage. Passive aggression is not my thing.


Unless it's a Supreme Court Justice, then being gleeful 5 minutes after their death is fine.


Funny I don't remember being gleeful about RBG dying but feel free to produce the post.

SheikhDjibouti wrote:

You clearly share the same beliefs as Trump, but that's ok.


Do you even know his beliefs? If you knew anything about Trump you would know he is a moderate Democrat. I am a Libertarian and probably is close to as Rand Paul. I know the game here is identity politics but..


Not you specifically, Nik, but there was a deafening silence from the right over people celebrating RGB being sick and dying or running over protesters and sympathy and support of "churches" raising money for the Kenosha shooter.

BTW, he thinks religion is stupid

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/ar ... rs/616522/
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
N867DA
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 4:43 pm

There are people who have gotten this disease after taking every precaution--washing hands, avoiding crowds where possible, wearing a mask when outside, encouraging others to follow safety protocols, and working remotely. My heart goes out to them.

That ain't the West Wing, or its top leadership. He has made fun of people for wearing masks, corralled thousands in auditoriums with no mask mandate--often in indoor spaces, and even encouraged attending very personal events in person when it's not necessary. He played with fire and I'm not sure why anyone is shocked that he got burned, or are doling out sympathy at this point. This is, "man deliberately jumps into cage of hungry lions and gets bitten" level shock.

I hope every afflicted person recovers 100% with no lasting physical or mental health issues. People make mistakes all the time; maybe after they recover (which to reiterate, I truly hope they all do for America's sake and their family's sake) they will make better policy. Or better yet, are relieved from being in a position to make policy--once again, for America's sake.
A nation turns its lonely eyes to you
 
flipdewaf
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Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 5:15 pm

Why on earth would it be an issue to be gleeful in someone’s death?
Bad people aren’t suddenly pardoned because they die or are ill. Are we to suddenly think that Osama bin laden should not be bad mouthed or that hitler should somehow get a pardon because he’s dead?

Edit: would it be unreasonable to think that Trumps deliberate lack of following the expert advice on the coronavirus response caused more additional deaths than that caused by the sept 11th attacks....to what level should we advocate a death of one person orchestrating one set of deaths through dogmatic beliefs vs someone else doing the same.

Fred


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Image
 
FGITD
Posts: 1494
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 5:39 pm

flipdewaf wrote:
Why on earth would it be an issue to be gleeful in someone’s death?
Bad people aren’t suddenly pardoned because they die or are ill. Are we to suddenly think that Osama bin laden should not be bad mouthed or that hitler should somehow get a pardon because he’s dead?

Edit: would it be unreasonable to think that Trumps deliberate lack of following the expert advice on the coronavirus response caused more additional deaths than that caused by the sept 11th attacks....to what level should we advocate a death of one person orchestrating one set of deaths through dogmatic beliefs vs someone else doing the same.

Fred


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


It's a strange phenomenon to not speak ill of the dead. Common human decency still applies, I would never badmouth the deceased to their family at the funeral, for example. But there's too much of a pedestal simply because someone died.

Barely even a month ago Trump said "it is what it is" about what now totals over 200,000 dead Americans.

So in regards to his health, all I can say is "i really don't care, do u?"


Also worth remembering that he and all the others in Washington get to use that socialised healthcare that the rest of Americans don't deserve for some reason. But rest assured, everyone else gets to pay for his healthcare because oops, he only paid $750 in taxes.
 
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scbriml
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 5:43 pm

N867DA wrote:
corralled thousands in auditoriums with no mask mandate--often in indoor spaces


Yeah, but only after making them all sign waivers so he wouldn’t get the blame if they all caught it. :sarcastic:
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana!
There are 10 types of people in the World - those that understand binary and those that don't.
 
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einsteinboricua
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 8:31 pm

Pellegrine wrote:
I agree he could still crash. I'm worried about Chris Christie too...he is extremely overweight, possibly with metabolic syndrome...I wonder how he is doing.

Oddly enough, I have more sympathy for Chris Christie and would root for a recovery for him. He still had some decency before joining the Trump train and has been given the worst treatment since. Still doesn't mean I feel sad (frankly, anyone who stayed quiet at or supported Trump and his actions deserves no sympathy, but certain people still have some human in them to at least feel something).
"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."
 
meecrob
Posts: 267
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 10:41 pm

FGITD wrote:
flipdewaf wrote:
Why on earth would it be an issue to be gleeful in someone’s death?
Bad people aren’t suddenly pardoned because they die or are ill. Are we to suddenly think that Osama bin laden should not be bad mouthed or that hitler should somehow get a pardon because he’s dead?

Edit: would it be unreasonable to think that Trumps deliberate lack of following the expert advice on the coronavirus response caused more additional deaths than that caused by the sept 11th attacks....to what level should we advocate a death of one person orchestrating one set of deaths through dogmatic beliefs vs someone else doing the same.

Fred


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


It's a strange phenomenon to not speak ill of the dead. Common human decency still applies, I would never badmouth the deceased to their family at the funeral, for example. But there's too much of a pedestal simply because someone died.

Barely even a month ago Trump said "it is what it is" about what now totals over 200,000 dead Americans.

So in regards to his health, all I can say is "i really don't care, do u?"


Also worth remembering that he and all the others in Washington get to use that socialised healthcare that the rest of Americans don't deserve for some reason. But rest assured, everyone else gets to pay for his healthcare because oops, he only paid $750 in taxes.


Its definitely new territory in the sense that many lives might be saved if the President dies.
 
Waterbomber2
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Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 3:44 am

Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 10:53 pm

meecrob wrote:
FGITD wrote:
flipdewaf wrote:
Why on earth would it be an issue to be gleeful in someone’s death?
Bad people aren’t suddenly pardoned because they die or are ill. Are we to suddenly think that Osama bin laden should not be bad mouthed or that hitler should somehow get a pardon because he’s dead?

Edit: would it be unreasonable to think that Trumps deliberate lack of following the expert advice on the coronavirus response caused more additional deaths than that caused by the sept 11th attacks....to what level should we advocate a death of one person orchestrating one set of deaths through dogmatic beliefs vs someone else doing the same.

Fred


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


It's a strange phenomenon to not speak ill of the dead. Common human decency still applies, I would never badmouth the deceased to their family at the funeral, for example. But there's too much of a pedestal simply because someone died.

Barely even a month ago Trump said "it is what it is" about what now totals over 200,000 dead Americans.

So in regards to his health, all I can say is "i really don't care, do u?"


Also worth remembering that he and all the others in Washington get to use that socialised healthcare that the rest of Americans don't deserve for some reason. But rest assured, everyone else gets to pay for his healthcare because oops, he only paid $750 in taxes.


Its definitely new territory in the sense that many lives might be saved if the President dies.


One could go as far as describing it as a genocide of the elderly or geronticide.
200.000 dead are genocidal proportions.

I don't agree with the words of sympathy expressed by many, including leaders.
No sympathies at all.

All leaders who are failing to protect public health to save the stock markets are committing crimes against humanity and shall face trial for their actions during this pandemic.
 
winginit
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Joined: Sat Feb 23, 2013 9:23 pm

Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 11:01 pm

While we all chit chat here, it would appear the President is going on a joyride for no other reason than to waive at supporters. He is putting his secret service detail at risk in doing so.

A disgraceful act.
 
Waterbomber2
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 11:28 pm

winginit wrote:
While we all chit chat here, it would appear the President is going on a joyride for no other reason than to waive at supporters. He is putting his secret service detail at risk in doing so.

A disgraceful act.


Look at all those idiots in the crowd not even wearing masks:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6YdxOsnOOuc


So is this the new United States of America?
If he is reelected, nobody's going to take Americans seriously anymore.
 
dtw2hyd
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 11:48 pm

I feel sorry for his staff and security detail. They should be in full PPE, not just wearing masks as he sheds billions of particles.

This reminds of memes comparing how COVID-19 patients are transported in the USA (Seattle at that time) and the rest of the world.

Nothing changed.
All posts are just opinions.
 
T4thH
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Sun Oct 04, 2020 11:55 pm

I have to say sorry, but...I have to recognize, if he will die, I will just not be happy or sad, that he is dead. You will not hear something like: RIP. But I will also not make a party. I will just not care.

So he has had developed a serious COVID-19 illness. Will be interesting to know, which regular symptoms he has developed.
With 80% most common is: Neuro-Covid
Second most with around 75%....myocarditis and after around 64 to 90 days, the rate has just gone down to 60%.

Does someone has the complete listing of treatments, he has received till now?
 
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Pellegrine
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Mon Oct 05, 2020 2:23 am

dtw2hyd wrote:
I feel sorry for his staff and security detail. They should be in full PPE, not just wearing masks as he sheds billions of particles.

This reminds of memes comparing how COVID-19 patients are transported in the USA (Seattle at that time) and the rest of the world.

Nothing changed.


They really should have been in Ebola PPE protocol, or at least full Tyvek suits, sealed goggles, respirators, double gloves, maybe even a bottled oxygen source, everything sealed up with tape. Ebola protocol would call for Trump to be in the same thing to limit transmission. Instead this was just a joke. I'd refuse to treat him if I were on his team and he did this.
We fly JETS, we don't fly donkeys. Citizenship/Residence::: Washington DC, US; Vaud, CH; Providenciales, TCI (hence my avi)
 
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WarRI1
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Mon Oct 05, 2020 2:27 am

T4thH wrote:
I have to say sorry, but...I have to recognize, if he will die, I will just not be happy or sad, that he is dead. You will not hear something like: RIP. But I will also not make a party. I will just not care.

So he has had developed a serious COVID-19 illness. Will be interesting to know, which regular symptoms he has developed.
With 80% most common is: Neuro-Covid
Second most with around 75%....myocarditis and after around 64 to 90 days, the rate has just gone down to 60%.

Does someone has the complete listing of treatments, he has received till now?


I agree, just like he said, It is what it is. So if he does succumb, naturally and correctly it will be, it is what it is. Nothing more to me either. He will always be known by that line, even more so than by the Author JE. Lawrence.
It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Mon Oct 05, 2020 2:59 am

Pellegrine wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:
I feel sorry for his staff and security detail. They should be in full PPE, not just wearing masks as he sheds billions of particles.

This reminds of memes comparing how COVID-19 patients are transported in the USA (Seattle at that time) and the rest of the world.

Nothing changed.


They really should have been in Ebola PPE protocol, or at least full Tyvek suits, sealed goggles, respirators, double gloves, maybe even a bottled oxygen source, everything sealed up with tape. Ebola protocol would call for Trump to be in the same thing to limit transmission. Instead this was just a joke. I'd refuse to treat him if I were on his team and he did this.


Very telling that one of the Walter Reed attending physicians broke protocol and vented on Twitter about the irresponsibility of putting the USSS agents at risk.

https://twitter.com/DrPhillipsMD/status ... 29827?s=20
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
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Pellegrine
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Mon Oct 05, 2020 3:07 am

Aaron747 wrote:
Pellegrine wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:
I feel sorry for his staff and security detail. They should be in full PPE, not just wearing masks as he sheds billions of particles.

This reminds of memes comparing how COVID-19 patients are transported in the USA (Seattle at that time) and the rest of the world.

Nothing changed.


They really should have been in Ebola PPE protocol, or at least full Tyvek suits, sealed goggles, respirators, double gloves, maybe even a bottled oxygen source, everything sealed up with tape. Ebola protocol would call for Trump to be in the same thing to limit transmission. Instead this was just a joke. I'd refuse to treat him if I were on his team and he did this.


Very telling that one of the Walter Reed attending physicians broke protocol and vented on Twitter about the irresponsibility of putting the USSS agents at risk.

https://twitter.com/DrPhillipsMD/status ... 29827?s=20



He needs to be in a negative pressure room, and not messing around outside it.
We fly JETS, we don't fly donkeys. Citizenship/Residence::: Washington DC, US; Vaud, CH; Providenciales, TCI (hence my avi)
 
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Pellegrine
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Mon Oct 05, 2020 3:15 am

I'll give everyone an example. When the 2014 West African Ebola outbreak was going on, if patients got in an ambulance or car with an EBOV+ patient...you then assumed ALL of the people in that vehicle were EBOV+. They were all exposed. You didn't mess around with it and take them on a tour. SARS-CoV-2 is contagious in different ways, but less lethat.
We fly JETS, we don't fly donkeys. Citizenship/Residence::: Washington DC, US; Vaud, CH; Providenciales, TCI (hence my avi)
 
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seb146
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Mon Oct 05, 2020 4:19 am

Pellegrine wrote:
I'll give everyone an example. When the 2014 West African Ebola outbreak was going on, if patients got in an ambulance or car with an EBOV+ patient...you then assumed ALL of the people in that vehicle were EBOV+. They were all exposed. You didn't mess around with it and take them on a tour. SARS-CoV-2 is contagious in different ways, but less lethat.


Not even the same considering Obama told everyone Ebola was a huge threat and he told us all to take Ebola very seriously and that he himself was taking precautions and how terrible Ebola was. Compare that with "china virus is fake" and "covid is just a bad flu" and "there are like 15 cases and ti will be zero by next week" and "people wearing masks are weak". But, other than that, totally the same.

I like my presidents who treat pandemics as serious and listen to science.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
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flyingclrs727
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Re: Hope Hicks. President Trump and wife all test positive for COVID

Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:08 am

einsteinboricua wrote:
NIKV69 wrote:
I don't entertain statements or questions that the underlying context is wishing someone dies to gain a political advantage. Passive aggression is not my thing.


I don't know how you're getting that he's wishing for Trump to die (though to be fair, it's not like Trump has made himself a darling of Americans everywhere). The question is related to what happens to Pence's role in the Senate if he is sworn as POTUS. Trump is sick with a disease for which he's high-risk. Asking about a hypothetical scenario in which he passes away is not wishing for his death; it's actually an actual scenario we should entertain.


On the other hand as POTUS, Trump has access to experimental drugs and therapies that very few people have access to without being part of a clinical trial. There is no FDA approved therapy for people who have just been diagnosed with COVID-19 till admission to a hospital. Normally people aren't treated with Remdesivir till they are much sicker than Trump was. The monoclonal antibody therapy he is on has only been used by 10 patients outside of a study that has about 250 people. Furthermore, the monoclonal antibodies are not mass produced yet. They are only available in limited quantities for the study and a very limited number of people outside the study. I wouldn't bet against him making a full recovery.

Given that the POTUS has access to experimental treatments outside of trials, I'm appalled that he hadn't considered getting vaccinated by one of the vaccines currently in phase 3 trials.
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