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Aaron747
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Trump Threatens Defense Funding Bill Veto Over Section 230 Tech Liability Shield

Thu Dec 03, 2020 1:59 am

Things are really coming to a head and GOP members of Congress may be tested on this as the NDAA (National Defense Authorization Act) usually includes provisos on US military pay increases. Tying signing of NDAA to repeal of Section 230 in the CDA is an attempt to exert power over tech giants the White House simply doesn’t like (supporters online continue to field wildly inaccurate 1st amendment arguments about Twitter, for example).

This is a real opportunity to see how much influence Trump does/doesn’t still have. He is probably unaware that the NDAA almost always passes with a veto-propf bipartisan supermajority.

https://thehill.com/policy/defense/5285 ... fense-bill
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c933103
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Re: Trump Threatens Defense Funding Bill Veto Over Section 230 Tech Liability Shield

Thu Dec 03, 2020 5:38 am

Thing is, most Republicans also hate section 230, as they think it enable "censoring" by internet platforms
Many Democrats also hate section 230, as they think internet platforms should bear more responsibility for contents published on them
And then social media companies like Facebook also want this section 230 to be repelled, as that can enhance the ebtry varrier entrenching their position, making it more difficult for small startup to compete agaonst them by requiring them to havr resource to review and be responsible for everything users published on them
It's pointless to attempt winning internet debate. 求同存異. よく見て・よく聞いて・よく考える
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Aaron747
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Re: Trump Threatens Defense Funding Bill Veto Over Section 230 Tech Liability Shield

Thu Dec 03, 2020 6:36 am

c933103 wrote:
Thing is, most Republicans also hate section 230, as they think it enable "censoring" by internet platforms
Many Democrats also hate section 230, as they think internet platforms should bear more responsibility for contents published on them
And then social media companies like Facebook also want this section 230 to be repelled, as that can enhance the ebtry varrier entrenching their position, making it more difficult for small startup to compete agaonst them by requiring them to havr resource to review and be responsible for everything users published on them


There are a number of easily available counterarguments against all of the above positions. But the biggest of all is the simple fact that the CDA (and section 230) pre-date the advent of social media, and internet platforms have been granted inclusion by subsequent acts of Congress. There would have to be a significant public interest in a sweeping regulatory change to how private companies manage content they do not produce themselves (and do not charge for).
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bennett123
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Re: Trump Threatens Defense Funding Bill Veto Over Section 230 Tech Liability Shield

Thu Dec 03, 2020 8:43 am

My understanding is that a Presidential Veto can be overruled by Congress.
 
tommy1808
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Re: Trump Threatens Defense Funding Bill Veto Over Section 230 Tech Liability Shield

Thu Dec 03, 2020 8:48 am

bennett123 wrote:
My understanding is that a Presidential Veto can be overruled by Congress.


Republicans voting against Trump? They couldn´t even find the courage to listen to evidence that Trump is a criminal and rather violated their oath to be impartial jurors ......

So.. no.. not gonne happen.

best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
petertenthije
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Re: Trump Threatens Defense Funding Bill Veto Over Section 230 Tech Liability Shield

Thu Dec 03, 2020 9:02 am

tommy1808 wrote:
Republicans voting against Trump? They couldn´t even find the courage to listen to evidence that Trump is a criminal and rather violated their oath to be impartial jurors ......

So.. no.. not gonne happen.
You don't know, now that Trump is just a few weeks away from being unemployed, maybe the Republicans can find their spine again. If only to cover their backs so that, should it come to convictions against Trump or senior Trump administration officials, they can point to this vote and say they have a history of voting against Trump so their conscience is clean.
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tommy1808
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Re: Trump Threatens Defense Funding Bill Veto Over Section 230 Tech Liability Shield

Thu Dec 03, 2020 9:19 am

petertenthije wrote:
tommy1808 wrote:
Republicans voting against Trump? They couldn´t even find the courage to listen to evidence that Trump is a criminal and rather violated their oath to be impartial jurors ......

So.. no.. not gonne happen.
You don't know, now that Trump is just a few weeks away from being unemployed, maybe the Republicans can find their spine again. If only to cover their backs so that, should it come to convictions against Trump or senior Trump administration officials, they can point to this vote and say they have a history of voting against Trump so their conscience is clean.


If they do, Trump is going to do a house to house in GA to tell every single Republican voter not to vote in the runoff.

best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
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Aesma
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Re: Trump Threatens Defense Funding Bill Veto Over Section 230 Tech Liability Shield

Thu Dec 03, 2020 1:19 pm

First of all, this has nothing to do with defense...

Secondly, isn't he already threatening to veto it over language renaming bases named after confederates ? I've seen this on TYT, with outrage because Dems were seeming to be backing down on this, even though it has bipartisan support and basically only Trump is in the way.
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luckyone
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Re: Trump Threatens Defense Funding Bill Veto Over Section 230 Tech Liability Shield

Thu Dec 03, 2020 4:57 pm

tommy1808 wrote:
petertenthije wrote:
tommy1808 wrote:
Republicans voting against Trump? They couldn´t even find the courage to listen to evidence that Trump is a criminal and rather violated their oath to be impartial jurors ......

So.. no.. not gonne happen.
You don't know, now that Trump is just a few weeks away from being unemployed, maybe the Republicans can find their spine again. If only to cover their backs so that, should it come to convictions against Trump or senior Trump administration officials, they can point to this vote and say they have a history of voting against Trump so their conscience is clean.


If they do, Trump is going to do a house to house in GA to tell every single Republican voter not to vote in the runoff.

best regards
Thomas

Well, that's already happening so what's the difference? Trump's little FU to the GOP for not blindly following him in his Quixotic quest. It's pretty clear that he will still send his minions to sabotage even outwardly loyal Republicans -- in this case both Senators from Georgia. It's quite sad watching the GOP feast on its own...sadly avoidable if just a few of them had a spine a few years back.
 
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Re: Trump Threatens Defense Funding Bill Veto Over Section 230 Tech Liability Shield

Thu Dec 03, 2020 5:11 pm

luckyone wrote:
tommy1808 wrote:
petertenthije wrote:
You don't know, now that Trump is just a few weeks away from being unemployed, maybe the Republicans can find their spine again. If only to cover their backs so that, should it come to convictions against Trump or senior Trump administration officials, they can point to this vote and say they have a history of voting against Trump so their conscience is clean.


If they do, Trump is going to do a house to house in GA to tell every single Republican voter not to vote in the runoff.

best regards
Thomas

Well, that's already happening so what's the difference? .


You underestimate the flexibility of his fans. How many times did they defend one statement, only to defend the total opposite after Trump had alzheimered his opinion away and said something else?

If he goes on TV on election eve telling his supporters to vote like hell, heels will snap together and there is a chorus of "how many times?" echoing over Georgia.

Best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
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Dutchy
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Re: Trump Threatens Defense Funding Bill Veto Over Section 230 Tech Liability Shield

Thu Dec 03, 2020 5:42 pm

Aaron747 wrote:
Things are really coming to a head and GOP members of Congress may be tested on this as the NDAA (National Defense Authorization Act) usually includes provisos on US military pay increases. Tying signing of NDAA to repeal of Section 230 in the CDA is an attempt to exert power over tech giants the White House simply doesn’t like (supporters online continue to field wildly inaccurate 1st amendment arguments about Twitter, for example).


Strange way to conduct politics. Two totally different subjects, tieing the outcome together and play hardball.
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luckyone
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Re: Trump Threatens Defense Funding Bill Veto Over Section 230 Tech Liability Shield

Thu Dec 03, 2020 6:01 pm

Dutchy wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
Things are really coming to a head and GOP members of Congress may be tested on this as the NDAA (National Defense Authorization Act) usually includes provisos on US military pay increases. Tying signing of NDAA to repeal of Section 230 in the CDA is an attempt to exert power over tech giants the White House simply doesn’t like (supporters online continue to field wildly inaccurate 1st amendment arguments about Twitter, for example).


Strange way to conduct politics. Two totally different subjects, tieing the outcome together and play hardball.

It is not at all strange for President Trump. Give me what I want or I'll do my best to sink it.
 
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Tugger
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Re: Trump Threatens Defense Funding Bill Veto Over Section 230 Tech Liability Shield

Thu Dec 03, 2020 6:07 pm

Dutchy wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
Things are really coming to a head and GOP members of Congress may be tested on this as the NDAA (National Defense Authorization Act) usually includes provisos on US military pay increases. Tying signing of NDAA to repeal of Section 230 in the CDA is an attempt to exert power over tech giants the White House simply doesn’t like (supporters online continue to field wildly inaccurate 1st amendment arguments about Twitter, for example).


Strange way to conduct politics. Two totally different subjects, tieing the outcome together and play hardball.

It's done fairly often. Varying bills and amendments are often attached to "must pass/sign" legislation in the hopes that the overall bill/act whatever must be signed. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't.

Tugg
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bhill
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Re: Trump Threatens Defense Funding Bill Veto Over Section 230 Tech Liability Shield

Thu Dec 03, 2020 6:34 pm

Yeahhh...lets screw with Service members' pay...reaaal smart GOP..
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Tugger
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Re: Trump Threatens Defense Funding Bill Veto Over Section 230 Tech Liability Shield

Thu Dec 03, 2020 6:48 pm

bhill wrote:
Yeahhh...lets screw with Service members' pay...reaaal smart GOP..

It's not the GOP, it's Trump. Tantrum Trump

The GOP has a real problem on their hands with a "leader" that does not care at all about the GOP or Republican's. He cares about himself and creating the buzz his followers desire. Sure, he cloaks himself in conservative demagoguery and does stuff that appears to be Republican "values" but it's done solely for his benefit to obtain cheers and attention from his base.

And now he is set loose, no longer needing to appease Republi... wait did he ever appease them? He basically did whatever he wanted, threw what he knew would be red meat to the GOP faithful and his base and had fun doing what he wanted. Now in theory he is going to have to work with others, quite a few that are not fond of his style, to get his way. No way is he going to do that, he will drag and taunt and drive Republican's before him, as they will all be in fear of his base and splitting the party etc. It is going to be a hard next few years for the GOP.

Tugg
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c933103
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Re: Trump Threatens Defense Funding Bill Veto Over Section 230 Tech Liability Shield

Fri Dec 04, 2020 8:33 pm

Dutchy wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
Things are really coming to a head and GOP members of Congress may be tested on this as the NDAA (National Defense Authorization Act) usually includes provisos on US military pay increases. Tying signing of NDAA to repeal of Section 230 in the CDA is an attempt to exert power over tech giants the White House simply doesn’t like (supporters online continue to field wildly inaccurate 1st amendment arguments about Twitter, for example).


Strange way to conduct politics. Two totally different subjects, tieing the outcome together and play hardball.

IIRC US Congress do that every year with their omnibus budget bill
It's pointless to attempt winning internet debate. 求同存異. よく見て・よく聞いて・よく考える
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Aaron747
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Re: Trump Threatens Defense Funding Bill Veto Over Section 230 Tech Liability Shield

Fri Dec 04, 2020 10:51 pm

c933103 wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
Things are really coming to a head and GOP members of Congress may be tested on this as the NDAA (National Defense Authorization Act) usually includes provisos on US military pay increases. Tying signing of NDAA to repeal of Section 230 in the CDA is an attempt to exert power over tech giants the White House simply doesn’t like (supporters online continue to field wildly inaccurate 1st amendment arguments about Twitter, for example).


Strange way to conduct politics. Two totally different subjects, tieing the outcome together and play hardball.

IIRC US Congress do that every year with their omnibus budget bill


Yes there are many riders attached to the omnibus bill. The difference here is that a bipartisan bill always passed by supermajority is being targeted by POTUS for a pet cause of perceived personal benefit.
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apodino
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Re: Trump Threatens Defense Funding Bill Veto Over Section 230 Tech Liability Shield

Sat Dec 05, 2020 5:25 am

Interestingly enough, the Veto Threat actually has bipartisan support. Tulsi Gabbard has come out and is in favor of Trump using his veto pen on this.

https://www.newsweek.com/tulsi-gabbard-donald-trump-section-230-battle-1552336
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Trump Threatens Defense Funding Bill Veto Over Section 230 Tech Liability Shield

Sat Dec 05, 2020 5:36 am

apodino wrote:
Interestingly enough, the Veto Threat actually has bipartisan support. Tulsi Gabbard has come out and is in favor of Trump using his veto pen on this.

https://www.newsweek.com/tulsi-gabbard-donald-trump-section-230-battle-1552336


Not sure how much I would call that 'support'. A few voices here and there supporting a nutty threat is not exactly broad support.
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zkojq
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Re: Trump Threatens Defense Funding Bill Veto Over Section 230 Tech Liability Shield

Sat Dec 05, 2020 6:05 am

So defund the police because of police violence against minorities = bad....but defunding the entire military because the internet is sometimes mean to Donnie = good? :scratchchin:
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Palop
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Re: Trump Threatens Defense Funding Bill Veto Over Section 230 Tech Liability Shield

Sat Dec 05, 2020 1:47 pm

zkojq wrote:
So defund the police because of police violence against minorities = bad....but defunding the entire military because the internet is sometimes mean to Donnie = good? :scratchchin:

Simple. In this day and age, an action’s goodness is not judged by the action’s results. What an action is, is irrelevant. What is important is who does the action. A previously evil action can be good simply by being carried out by the correct person, even if the action itself remains unchanged.
 
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STT757
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Re: Trump Threatens Defense Funding Bill Veto Over Section 230 Tech Liability Shield

Fri Dec 11, 2020 8:06 pm

The Defense Bill passed the Senate with a veto proof margin,

https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/529808-senate-passes-defense-bill-setting-up-trump-veto-fight

Besides the Tech liability shield the bill instructs the DOD to rename US Army bases named after Confederates.
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cledaybuck
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Re: Trump Threatens Defense Funding Bill Veto Over Section 230 Tech Liability Shield

Fri Dec 11, 2020 10:11 pm

zkojq wrote:
So defund the police because of police violence against minorities = bad....but defunding the entire military because the internet is sometimes mean to Donnie = good? :scratchchin:

Republicans are very much for defunding the police. Just look at how much they are fighting any funding for state and local governments in any stimulus package. Who do they think pays the police?
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Drafran
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Re: Trump Threatens Defense Funding Bill Veto Over Section 230 Tech Liability Shield

Wed Dec 16, 2020 12:50 pm

Doesn't matter if the bill passes "veto proof." Several of Trump's stooges in both the House and Senate have said that if Trump vetoes the bill they will not vote in it's favor the second time. I am not sure if that number will be enough to sustain the veto, however.

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