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dtw2hyd
Posts: 8901
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Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Thu Jan 14, 2021 11:24 am

AirframeAS wrote:
Reading AWS's brief to the TRO by Parler, I gotta say that once this case is going to be ruled, Parler is going to have a very BAD day! Parler is going to lose.


AWS also hosts most of the world's porn and CIA. It can shut down either or anything in the middle if it pleases to do so.

Imagine Amazon saying I don't like what CIA is doing, so I am going to shut down their servers.
And imagine a world without free porn.

Whataboutism, maybe, but one need to know to have a comprehensive discussion.

Recent events opened a can of worms, good in a way because these were swept under the rug for too long.
All posts are just opinions.
 
bennett123
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Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Thu Jan 14, 2021 12:33 pm

Perhaps the CIA needs it's own infrastructure.
 
dtw2hyd
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Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Thu Jan 14, 2021 1:00 pm

bennett123 wrote:
Perhaps the CIA needs it's own infrastructure.


Too late because everybody jumped on Cloud bandwagon not knowing the consequences. Reverting it will be a boom for enterprise server, storage and services market.
All posts are just opinions.
 
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seahawk
Posts: 10171
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Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Thu Jan 14, 2021 1:49 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
AirframeAS wrote:
Reading AWS's brief to the TRO by Parler, I gotta say that once this case is going to be ruled, Parler is going to have a very BAD day! Parler is going to lose.


AWS also hosts most of the world's porn and CIA. It can shut down either or anything in the middle if it pleases to do so.

Imagine Amazon saying I don't like what CIA is doing, so I am going to shut down their servers.
And imagine a world without free porn.

Whataboutism, maybe, but one need to know to have a comprehensive discussion.

Recent events opened a can of worms, good in a way because these were swept under the rug for too long.


If the CIA signed a contract that allows AWS to do this, it is the CIA´s fault. And normally big government institutions have contracts with service providers that allows the institution to take control of the server to keep the service running.This is just a whataboutism.
 
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casinterest
Posts: 13064
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Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Thu Jan 14, 2021 2:24 pm

tommy1808 wrote:
casinterest wrote:
ThePointblank wrote:

Read Amazon's response here:

https://beta.documentcloud.org/document ... n_response

It's a very well written legal brief, at only 13 pages; it appears their lawyers understand brevity and got straight to the point. This is one of the times where you really see the skills top lawyers are capable of, certainly based in no small amount on the infinitely deep pockets of the client.

I expect Amazon to win the case, either outright, or by being able to throw way more resources in defence compared to what Parler is capable of doing. I believe Parler is being represented by a single lawyer, while Amazon has an entire army of lawyers working for them.


Those specific examples are quite edgy. I can see why AWS thought it's TOS was being violated. Those items of hate speech are downright not protected.


"After the firing squads are done with the politicians the teachers are next"

The similarities with the Taliban and ISIS are hard to ignore....

best regards
Thomas


Yep, I think I saw yesterday the CEO of parler didn't think the app would return anytime soon.
Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did..So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.--Mark Twain
 
AirframeAS
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Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Thu Jan 14, 2021 6:26 pm

seahawk wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:
AirframeAS wrote:
Reading AWS's brief to the TRO by Parler, I gotta say that once this case is going to be ruled, Parler is going to have a very BAD day! Parler is going to lose.


AWS also hosts most of the world's porn and CIA. It can shut down either or anything in the middle if it pleases to do so.

Imagine Amazon saying I don't like what CIA is doing, so I am going to shut down their servers.
And imagine a world without free porn.

Whataboutism, maybe, but one need to know to have a comprehensive discussion.

Recent events opened a can of worms, good in a way because these were swept under the rug for too long.


If the CIA signed a contract that allows AWS to do this, it is the CIA´s fault. And normally big government institutions have contracts with service providers that allows the institution to take control of the server to keep the service running.This is just a whataboutism.


Agreed! We don't even know what the extent, if any, is in the contract between AWS & CIA.

Remember folks: AWS, Twitter, Facebook and any social media platform or any internet services are not subject to the first amendment and is NOT a government agency. CIA, FBI, DOJ, or any government office is subject to the first amendment. In other words, you have freedom of speech (1st Amend.) protections from the goverment, but not the consequences. At the same time, you don't have 1st amend. rights on social media since you agree to a TOS, this includes airliners.net.
A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
 
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seb146
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Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Thu Jan 14, 2021 8:17 pm

AirframeAS wrote:
seahawk wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:

AWS also hosts most of the world's porn and CIA. It can shut down either or anything in the middle if it pleases to do so.

Imagine Amazon saying I don't like what CIA is doing, so I am going to shut down their servers.
And imagine a world without free porn.

Whataboutism, maybe, but one need to know to have a comprehensive discussion.

Recent events opened a can of worms, good in a way because these were swept under the rug for too long.


If the CIA signed a contract that allows AWS to do this, it is the CIA´s fault. And normally big government institutions have contracts with service providers that allows the institution to take control of the server to keep the service running.This is just a whataboutism.


Agreed! We don't even know what the extent, if any, is in the contract between AWS & CIA.

Remember folks: AWS, Twitter, Facebook and any social media platform or any internet services are not subject to the first amendment and is NOT a government agency. CIA, FBI, DOJ, or any government office is subject to the first amendment. In other words, you have freedom of speech (1st Amend.) protections from the goverment, but not the consequences. At the same time, you don't have 1st amend. rights on social media since you agree to a TOS, this includes airliners.net.


People still have freedom of speech. People are still out there on social media and in the general public repeating the lie that the election was stolen and that votes were fraudulently cast and so forth. All of that was being said before the attempted coup. Freedom of speech only goes so far. A person can absolutely believe the election was stolen. They can hold a sign on the street corner saying so. They can talk about it with others. But, attempting a coup is not protected speech. Planning a violent overthrow of the government is not protected speech.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
Redd
Topic Author
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Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Sat Jan 16, 2021 11:06 am

[quote="M564038"]I will answer you so explicably clearly that you will never have to have this constant wonder about the difference is again:

Burning and looting is not the problem.


The problem is a fascist attempt at overthrowing the US democratically elected government and throw the worlds oldest democracy into authoritarian dystopia.

That is what Donald Trump attempted, and that is why he is banned from social media.





No offence, but that was one of the most absent-minded responses I've ever heard. Burning and looting is *****A***** problem. So is Trump and many of his followers, they are also ******A****** problem. They are both problems. There is no *****THE***** problem. Much like aircraft accident investigations, there is never one single cause.
 
M564038
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Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Sat Jan 16, 2021 12:05 pm

Feel free to disagree, but when democracy and the fabric of society is in real and imminent danger, that is THE problem, compared to the very things you are comparing them to.

There are several orders of magnitude difference in how big those problems are.

A bird shitting on the frontscreen of the captain’s car on his way to the airport might very well have contributed to his mental state which might again contribute to the accident, but we don’t equal the bird with the engine that exploded.

One of the things that enabled the precarious situation the US is in right now, is how the fascists got away with the «both sides are equally bad»-strategy for a long time.
Several people here are trying the same thing, comparing a fascists attempt of overthrowing government with small time, frustrated anarchists setting fire to a shop. It’s disgusting.


Redd wrote:
M564038 wrote:
I will answer you so explicably clearly that you will never have to have this constant wonder about the difference is again:

Burning and looting is not the problem.


The problem is a fascist attempt at overthrowing the US democratically elected government and throw the worlds oldest democracy into authoritarian dystopia.

That is what Donald Trump attempted, and that is why he is banned from social media.





No offence, but that was one of the most absent-minded responses I've ever heard. Burning and looting is *****A***** problem. So is Trump and many of his followers, they are also ******A****** problem. They are both problems. There is no *****THE***** problem. Much like aircraft accident investigations, there is never one single cause.
 
KWexpress
Posts: 95
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Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Sat Jan 16, 2021 3:02 pm

scbriml wrote:
LCDFlight wrote:
Deplatforming, however, is a serious threat to civilization.


Hyperbole.

LCDFlight wrote:
There is no difference to me between Facebook censoring messages and US Postal Service or Verizon removing a person's account based on their politics.


There is a significant difference. Facebook is a private business that has rules, if you break the rules then your post, or eventually your account, gets canned. Now, given the USPS is a government run entity, if they refused to send out your mailshot because they disagree with the message, then that would be a breach of you First Amendment rights. Verizon is another private company.

These people have been "deplatformed" not because of who they are (your claim), but because of what they said. Constitutional rights are not without limits. Free speech is not without limits and certainly has consequences.

AirWorthy99 wrote:
If you have one party government control, the private entities lose any liberty in running their business freely as they would like.


Were you as concerned when the GOP controlled both houses during Trump's first two years?

AirWorthy99 wrote:
For crying out loud they are shutting down book stores because they don't like certain books https://www.oregonlive.com/books/2021/0 ... rrent.html


Who's "they"? It's certainly not the Democrat Party. Seems like it's a few citizens exercising their constitutional right to free speech in expressing their dislike of Ngo's book. You support that, presumably? Just like you presumably support the right of a christian baker to not serve gay customers? For the record, the book store should, IMHO, be able to stock any book it wants. It may not be good business in the long run, but it should definitely be their decision. If you don't like that as a customer, then you have the freedom to buy your books from another store.


You are correct. YouTube and Facebook should have the right to censor content. As a result they should lose the government protection that prevents them for being sued for any defamatory content they allow to remain on the site. They're either a publisher or a platform. Can't be both.
 
tommy1808
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Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Sat Jan 16, 2021 6:19 pm

KWexpress wrote:
scbriml wrote:
LCDFlight wrote:
Deplatforming, however, is a serious threat to civilization.


Hyperbole.

LCDFlight wrote:
There is no difference to me between Facebook censoring messages and US Postal Service or Verizon removing a person's account based on their politics.


There is a significant difference. Facebook is a private business that has rules, if you break the rules then your post, or eventually your account, gets canned. Now, given the USPS is a government run entity, if they refused to send out your mailshot because they disagree with the message, then that would be a breach of you First Amendment rights. Verizon is another private company.

These people have been "deplatformed" not because of who they are (your claim), but because of what they said. Constitutional rights are not without limits. Free speech is not without limits and certainly has consequences.

AirWorthy99 wrote:
If you have one party government control, the private entities lose any liberty in running their business freely as they would like.


Were you as concerned when the GOP controlled both houses during Trump's first two years?

AirWorthy99 wrote:
For crying out loud they are shutting down book stores because they don't like certain books https://www.oregonlive.com/books/2021/0 ... rrent.html


Who's "they"? It's certainly not the Democrat Party. Seems like it's a few citizens exercising their constitutional right to free speech in expressing their dislike of Ngo's book. You support that, presumably? Just like you presumably support the right of a christian baker to not serve gay customers? For the record, the book store should, IMHO, be able to stock any book it wants. It may not be good business in the long run, but it should definitely be their decision. If you don't like that as a customer, then you have the freedom to buy your books from another store.


You are correct. YouTube and Facebook should have the right to censor content. As a result they should lose the government protection that prevents them for being sued for any defamatory content they allow to remain on the site. They're either a publisher or a platform. Can't be both.


Of course you can have both. The fix would be putting a time limit on the protection, i.e. 24 hours after learning about a ToS violating is known to them it is either deleted or they become liable, as they otherwise have to censor ALL content before it becomes visible. That would give them, by forcing them, the absolute control of the opinions you can express online.
The other alternative is ISIS and alike doing recruiting without limitation.

Best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
LCDFlight
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Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Sat Jan 16, 2021 8:49 pm

tommy1808 wrote:
KWexpress wrote:
scbriml wrote:

Hyperbole.



There is a significant difference. Facebook is a private business that has rules, if you break the rules then your post, or eventually your account, gets canned. Now, given the USPS is a government run entity, if they refused to send out your mailshot because they disagree with the message, then that would be a breach of you First Amendment rights. Verizon is another private company.

These people have been "deplatformed" not because of who they are (your claim), but because of what they said. Constitutional rights are not without limits. Free speech is not without limits and certainly has consequences.



Were you as concerned when the GOP controlled both houses during Trump's first two years?



Who's "they"? It's certainly not the Democrat Party. Seems like it's a few citizens exercising their constitutional right to free speech in expressing their dislike of Ngo's book. You support that, presumably? Just like you presumably support the right of a christian baker to not serve gay customers? For the record, the book store should, IMHO, be able to stock any book it wants. It may not be good business in the long run, but it should definitely be their decision. If you don't like that as a customer, then you have the freedom to buy your books from another store.


You are correct. YouTube and Facebook should have the right to censor content. As a result they should lose the government protection that prevents them for being sued for any defamatory content they allow to remain on the site. They're either a publisher or a platform. Can't be both.


Of course you can have both. The fix would be putting a time limit on the protection, i.e. 24 hours after learning about a ToS violating is known to them it is either deleted or they become liable, as they otherwise have to censor ALL content before it becomes visible. That would give them, by forcing them, the absolute control of the opinions you can express online.
The other alternative is ISIS and alike doing recruiting without limitation.

Best regards
Thomas


I promised not to post again so I'm sorry.

There are other options. They can do the same as telephone networks, which is say anything you want, as long as it's not against DHS / military / Secret Service priorities, which are mostly codified in law (no running the mob, doing ISIS attacks, or capturing the Capitol by force). Just use that standard. That's fine.

Tech companies are having a fourth option, which is, let people post things that obey a corporation's TOS (designed to aid the corporation's profit maximization and virtue signaling), while *at the same time* also becoming people's primary means of communication *and* distributing news. Fully capturing most of the population's ideas and shaping them!

That's a very uncomfortable and conflicted set of priorities. No citizen or policymaker wanted this situation to happen. They knew corporate media was dangerous, giving rise to Equal Time doctrine, flawed as it was. Today's situation was weaseled into by greedy tech companies, who really don't care if they make society burn.
 
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Aaron747
Posts: 14005
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Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Sun Jan 17, 2021 12:19 am

LCDFlight wrote:
tommy1808 wrote:
KWexpress wrote:

You are correct. YouTube and Facebook should have the right to censor content. As a result they should lose the government protection that prevents them for being sued for any defamatory content they allow to remain on the site. They're either a publisher or a platform. Can't be both.


Of course you can have both. The fix would be putting a time limit on the protection, i.e. 24 hours after learning about a ToS violating is known to them it is either deleted or they become liable, as they otherwise have to censor ALL content before it becomes visible. That would give them, by forcing them, the absolute control of the opinions you can express online.
The other alternative is ISIS and alike doing recruiting without limitation.

Best regards
Thomas


I promised not to post again so I'm sorry.

There are other options. They can do the same as telephone networks, which is say anything you want, as long as it's not against DHS / military / Secret Service priorities, which are mostly codified in law (no running the mob, doing ISIS attacks, or capturing the Capitol by force). Just use that standard. That's fine.

Tech companies are having a fourth option, which is, let people post things that obey a corporation's TOS (designed to aid the corporation's profit maximization and virtue signaling), while *at the same time* also becoming people's primary means of communication *and* distributing news. Fully capturing most of the population's ideas and shaping them!

That's a very uncomfortable and conflicted set of priorities. No citizen or policymaker wanted this situation to happen. They knew corporate media was dangerous, giving rise to Equal Time doctrine, flawed as it was. Today's situation was weaseled into by greedy tech companies, who really don't care if they make society burn.


Too simplistic to simply label the companies themselves greedy when many are underpinned by VC firms and investors with a very diverse set of priorities and monetization strategies.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
tommy1808
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Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Tue Jan 19, 2021 8:35 am

Seems Parler has found a hoster with sufficient lack of ethics when it comes to terrorism:

https://twitter.com/LindsayPGorman/stat ... 5511855107

The same one that hosts the Hamas website. Given all the "Allahu Ak...." sorry, "Jesus is King" yelling in the Capitol that seems to be the right business partner for them.

best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
ThePointblank
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Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Fri Jan 22, 2021 12:13 am

Surprising absolutely nobody, a judge has ruled against Parler's request for a Temporary Restraining Order and/or Preliminary Injunction:

https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/29 ... vices-inc/

Reading over it, it looks like the judge doesn't buy any of Parler's arguments in court, and is telling them that they have a very low chance in court. The judge has basically told Parler that their claims about anti-trust violations was just a bunch of inaccurate speculation, and that they were in breach of contract with Amazon (and they knew about it).
 
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seb146
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Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Fri Jan 22, 2021 4:30 am

Redd wrote:
M564038 wrote:
I will answer you so explicably clearly that you will never have to have this constant wonder about the difference is again:

Burning and looting is not the problem.


The problem is a fascist attempt at overthrowing the US democratically elected government and throw the worlds oldest democracy into authoritarian dystopia.

That is what Donald Trump attempted, and that is why he is banned from social media.





No offence, but that was one of the most absent-minded responses I've ever heard. Burning and looting is *****A***** problem. So is Trump and many of his followers, they are also ******A****** problem. They are both problems. There is no *****THE***** problem. Much like aircraft accident investigations, there is never one single cause.


The problem is the false equivalency the right is throwing around. Protesting police brutality is not at all in any way the same as storming the Capital Building while Congress is in session in order to overturn a legitimate election. The whole "but the looting" angle is just MAGAs and Republicans trying to excuse their attempted violent coup.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 18539
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Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Fri Jan 22, 2021 4:11 pm

Redd wrote:
M564038 wrote:
I will answer you so explicably clearly that you will never have to have this constant wonder about the difference is again:

Burning and looting is not the problem.


The problem is a fascist attempt at overthrowing the US democratically elected government and throw the worlds oldest democracy into authoritarian dystopia.

That is what Donald Trump attempted, and that is why he is banned from social media.





No offence, but that was one of the most absent-minded responses I've ever heard. Burning and looting is *****A***** problem. So is Trump and many of his followers, they are also ******A****** problem. They are both problems. There is no *****THE***** problem. Much like aircraft accident investigations, there is never one single cause.

LOL Republicans encouraging republicans to overthrow the government and murder anyone in their path including their own republican VP, in support of their republican messiah and white rage is THE problem. Until republicans deal with the problem that they're bloodthirsty seditious flying monkeys (narrator: they won't), it will continue to be THE problem. They're already busy little bees working to deplatform any GOP members that demand even the faintest whiff of accountability for the Metamucil Hall Putsch.
I don't take responsibility at all
 
Redd
Topic Author
Posts: 1359
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2013 3:40 am

Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Sat Jan 23, 2021 9:46 am

MaverickM11 wrote:
Redd wrote:
M564038 wrote:
I will answer you so explicably clearly that you will never have to have this constant wonder about the difference is again:

Burning and looting is not the problem.


The problem is a fascist attempt at overthrowing the US democratically elected government and throw the worlds oldest democracy into authoritarian dystopia.

That is what Donald Trump attempted, and that is why he is banned from social media.





No offence, but that was one of the most absent-minded responses I've ever heard. Burning and looting is *****A***** problem. So is Trump and many of his followers, they are also ******A****** problem. They are both problems. There is no *****THE***** problem. Much like aircraft accident investigations, there is never one single cause.

LOL Republicans encouraging republicans to overthrow the government and murder anyone in their path including their own republican VP, in support of their republican messiah and white rage is THE problem. Until republicans deal with the problem that they're bloodthirsty seditious flying monkeys (narrator: they won't), it will continue to be THE problem. They're already busy little bees working to deplatform any GOP members that demand even the faintest whiff of accountability for the Metamucil Hall Putsch.


Was it Trump supporters or BLM that caused more damage than at anytime since American Civil War on American soil? Not to mention the actual murders, and child victims caught in the middle. So yeah. There are problems on both sides, but due to the tribalism you're so proudly displaying, people are willing to overlook the wrongs and ills of ''their own side''.

So if there is a problem, it's not so much the left or right, it's people like you that are THE problem. That kind of attitude makes it impossible to reconcile.
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 18539
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Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Sat Jan 23, 2021 2:49 pm

Redd wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
Redd wrote:

LOL Republicans encouraging republicans to overthrow the government and murder anyone in their path including their own republican VP, in support of their republican messiah and white rage is THE problem. Until republicans deal with the problem that they're bloodthirsty seditious flying monkeys (narrator: they won't), it will continue to be THE problem. They're already busy little bees working to deplatform any GOP members that demand even the faintest whiff of accountability for the Metamucil Hall Putsch.


Was it Trump supporters or BLM that caused more damage than at anytime since American Civil War on American soil? Not to mention the actual murders, and child victims caught in the middle. So yeah. There are problems on both sides, but due to the tribalism you're so proudly displaying, people are willing to overlook the wrongs and ills of ''their own side''.

So if there is a problem, it's not so much the left or right, it's people like you that are THE problem. That kind of attitude makes it impossible to reconcile.

The knots you will twist your self into trying to play down your buddies violently storming the capitol ending the long standing tradition of peaceful transfer of power is unreal, and totally expected. It wasn't BLM that erected a gallows on the Capitol lawn, it was republicans. It wasn't BLM wearing shirts that said "6 Million is not enough". It was republicans. It wasn't BLM that brought the seditious Confederate flag into the Capitol. It was republicans. It wasn't BLM beating a cop to death with a fire extinguisher or beating another cop with the American flag. It was republicans--the Blue Lives Matter/ReSpEcT tHe FlAg crowd. There were no congressmen involved in BLM related violence. Again, those were republican congressmen storming the Capitol. There was no Democratic congressman egging on the violence that may have occurred around the BLM protests. Again, the majority of republicans supported Trump's lie and incitement of violence, until 1/6 when they all got a collective case of amnesia. And that's before you even consider all the right wing militias that gladly set off the violence around BLM protests, whether it's the MSP police station, or conservative hero white supremacist Kyle Rittenhouse, or the vast majority of domestic terrorism murders that is right wing--more than the nearly non existent left wing terrorism and Muslim extremism combined, doubled. So I get that you're so far down the rabbit hole you want to find a way to justify your guys' behavior that makes 'deplorable' look like a stretch goal. But reality is not on your side. There is no reconciliation with any of that. Maybe y'all can move to Argentina and change your name and hope for the best.
I don't take responsibility at all
 
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seb146
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Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Sat Jan 23, 2021 4:37 pm

Redd wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
Redd wrote:

LOL Republicans encouraging republicans to overthrow the government and murder anyone in their path including their own republican VP, in support of their republican messiah and white rage is THE problem. Until republicans deal with the problem that they're bloodthirsty seditious flying monkeys (narrator: they won't), it will continue to be THE problem. They're already busy little bees working to deplatform any GOP members that demand even the faintest whiff of accountability for the Metamucil Hall Putsch.


Was it Trump supporters or BLM that caused more damage than at anytime since American Civil War on American soil? Not to mention the actual murders, and child victims caught in the middle. So yeah. There are problems on both sides, but due to the tribalism you're so proudly displaying, people are willing to overlook the wrongs and ills of ''their own side''.

So if there is a problem, it's not so much the left or right, it's people like you that are THE problem. That kind of attitude makes it impossible to reconcile.


One side demands equal justice for minorities, the other demands millions of votes are fraudulent so they storm the Capital and beat and kill anyone in their way. BTW,

https://apnews.com/article/riley-june-w ... 6b35a4aacb

The woman who stole Pelosi's laptop and tried to sell it to the Russians is free.

https://theappeal.org/maricopa-county-b ... g-charges/
https://www.forbes.com/sites/roberthart ... 3a14575706

People taking umbrellas to BLM protests are also charged with gang crimes. When BLM protested on The Mall in Washington, police were out in full force.

But, yeah, totally the same....
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
AirWorthy99
Posts: 1333
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2020 7:57 pm

Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Sat Jan 23, 2021 4:45 pm

MaverickM11 wrote:
Redd wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
LOL Republicans encouraging republicans to overthrow the government and murder anyone in their path including their own republican VP, in support of their republican messiah and white rage is THE problem. Until republicans deal with the problem that they're bloodthirsty seditious flying monkeys (narrator: they won't), it will continue to be THE problem. They're already busy little bees working to deplatform any GOP members that demand even the faintest whiff of accountability for the Metamucil Hall Putsch.


Was it Trump supporters or BLM that caused more damage than at anytime since American Civil War on American soil? Not to mention the actual murders, and child victims caught in the middle. So yeah. There are problems on both sides, but due to the tribalism you're so proudly displaying, people are willing to overlook the wrongs and ills of ''their own side''.

So if there is a problem, it's not so much the left or right, it's people like you that are THE problem. That kind of attitude makes it impossible to reconcile.

The knots you will twist your self into trying to play down your buddies violently storming the capitol ending the long standing tradition of peaceful transfer of power is unreal, and totally expected. It wasn't BLM that erected a gallows on the Capitol lawn, it was republicans. It wasn't BLM wearing shirts that said "6 Million is not enough". It was republicans. It wasn't BLM that brought the seditious Confederate flag into the Capitol. It was republicans. It wasn't BLM beating a cop to death with a fire extinguisher or beating another cop with the American flag. It was republicans--the Blue Lives Matter/ReSpEcT tHe FlAg crowd. There were no congressmen involved in BLM related violence. Again, those were republican congressmen storming the Capitol. There was no Democratic congressman egging on the violence that may have occurred around the BLM protests. Again, the majority of republicans supported Trump's lie and incitement of violence, until 1/6 when they all got a collective case of amnesia. And that's before you even consider all the right wing militias that gladly set off the violence around BLM protests, whether it's the MSP police station, or conservative hero white supremacist Kyle Rittenhouse, or the vast majority of domestic terrorism murders that is right wing--more than the nearly non existent left wing terrorism and Muslim extremism combined, doubled. So I get that you're so far down the rabbit hole you want to find a way to justify your guys' behavior that makes 'deplorable' look like a stretch goal. But reality is not on your side. There is no reconciliation with any of that. Maybe y'all can move to Argentina and change your name and hope for the best.


How unfortunate this is.

Redd is a liberal not a conservative. Granted an old school liberal, not the “illiberal” types we see presently.

The type of liberal that tolerates others opinions. So much so that despite our very opposing views we actually come together to discuss subjects which are of significance.

You know, the sort of discussion this forum and other social media sites were created for. Substantive discussions.

I know, very hard thing to do for most people who really want to avoid presenting serious and real thinking is easier to shut down the other side by saying nasty things and lumping them together with other sorts of people.
“It’s easy to confuse ‘what is’ with ‘what ought to be,’ especially when ‘what is’ has worked out in your favor.” Tyrion Lannister
 
Redd
Topic Author
Posts: 1359
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2013 3:40 am

Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Sat Jan 23, 2021 5:05 pm

AirWorthy99 wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
Redd wrote:

Was it Trump supporters or BLM that caused more damage than at anytime since American Civil War on American soil? Not to mention the actual murders, and child victims caught in the middle. So yeah. There are problems on both sides, but due to the tribalism you're so proudly displaying, people are willing to overlook the wrongs and ills of ''their own side''.

So if there is a problem, it's not so much the left or right, it's people like you that are THE problem. That kind of attitude makes it impossible to reconcile.

The knots you will twist your self into trying to play down your buddies violently storming the capitol ending the long standing tradition of peaceful transfer of power is unreal, and totally expected. It wasn't BLM that erected a gallows on the Capitol lawn, it was republicans. It wasn't BLM wearing shirts that said "6 Million is not enough". It was republicans. It wasn't BLM that brought the seditious Confederate flag into the Capitol. It was republicans. It wasn't BLM beating a cop to death with a fire extinguisher or beating another cop with the American flag. It was republicans--the Blue Lives Matter/ReSpEcT tHe FlAg crowd. There were no congressmen involved in BLM related violence. Again, those were republican congressmen storming the Capitol. There was no Democratic congressman egging on the violence that may have occurred around the BLM protests. Again, the majority of republicans supported Trump's lie and incitement of violence, until 1/6 when they all got a collective case of amnesia. And that's before you even consider all the right wing militias that gladly set off the violence around BLM protests, whether it's the MSP police station, or conservative hero white supremacist Kyle Rittenhouse, or the vast majority of domestic terrorism murders that is right wing--more than the nearly non existent left wing terrorism and Muslim extremism combined, doubled. So I get that you're so far down the rabbit hole you want to find a way to justify your guys' behavior that makes 'deplorable' look like a stretch goal. But reality is not on your side. There is no reconciliation with any of that. Maybe y'all can move to Argentina and change your name and hope for the best.


How unfortunate this is.

Redd is a liberal not a conservative. Granted an old school liberal, not the “illiberal” types we see presently.

The type of liberal that tolerates others opinions. So much so that despite our very opposing views we actually come together to discuss subjects which are of significance.

You know, the sort of discussion this forum and other social media sites were created for. Substantive discussions.

I know, very hard thing to do for most people who really want to avoid presenting serious and real thinking is easier to shut down the other side by saying nasty things and lumping them together with other sorts of people.


Thanks Airworthy. No matter how many times I make my position clear they're all going to throw me into the right wing camp, unless I agree with everything they say. Liberals have forgotten what liberalism actually is.
 
FGITD
Posts: 1478
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 1:44 pm

Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Sat Jan 23, 2021 5:13 pm

I'm actually completely ok with lumping traitors and those willing to forgive them into the same trash heap. I'm proud to be an American, and anyone who participated or gives them "pity" is no American.

You really find equivalence between:

Widespread civil rights protest turning into a riot that results in windows getting smashed and burnt down buildings.

And

An armed insurrection to overthrow the sitting US government, execute members of Congress, and install an illegitimate leader.

Remind me, what oppression did the traitors have to overthrow? Was it being part of arguably one of the most privileged classes to ever exist? Was it all those rights that they have undoubtedly lost since Jan 20? Haven't seen much in the news about that, huh?

Pathetic
 
GDB
Posts: 14110
Joined: Wed May 23, 2001 6:25 pm

Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Sat Jan 23, 2021 5:24 pm

Redd wrote:
AirWorthy99 wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
The knots you will twist your self into trying to play down your buddies violently storming the capitol ending the long standing tradition of peaceful transfer of power is unreal, and totally expected. It wasn't BLM that erected a gallows on the Capitol lawn, it was republicans. It wasn't BLM wearing shirts that said "6 Million is not enough". It was republicans. It wasn't BLM that brought the seditious Confederate flag into the Capitol. It was republicans. It wasn't BLM beating a cop to death with a fire extinguisher or beating another cop with the American flag. It was republicans--the Blue Lives Matter/ReSpEcT tHe FlAg crowd. There were no congressmen involved in BLM related violence. Again, those were republican congressmen storming the Capitol. There was no Democratic congressman egging on the violence that may have occurred around the BLM protests. Again, the majority of republicans supported Trump's lie and incitement of violence, until 1/6 when they all got a collective case of amnesia. And that's before you even consider all the right wing militias that gladly set off the violence around BLM protests, whether it's the MSP police station, or conservative hero white supremacist Kyle Rittenhouse, or the vast majority of domestic terrorism murders that is right wing--more than the nearly non existent left wing terrorism and Muslim extremism combined, doubled. So I get that you're so far down the rabbit hole you want to find a way to justify your guys' behavior that makes 'deplorable' look like a stretch goal. But reality is not on your side. There is no reconciliation with any of that. Maybe y'all can move to Argentina and change your name and hope for the best.


How unfortunate this is.

Redd is a liberal not a conservative. Granted an old school liberal, not the “illiberal” types we see presently.

The type of liberal that tolerates others opinions. So much so that despite our very opposing views we actually come together to discuss subjects which are of significance.

You know, the sort of discussion this forum and other social media sites were created for. Substantive discussions.

I know, very hard thing to do for most people who really want to avoid presenting serious and real thinking is easier to shut down the other side by saying nasty things and lumping them together with other sorts of people.


Thanks Airworthy. No matter how many times I make my position clear they're all going to throw me into the right wing camp, unless I agree with everything they say. Liberals have forgotten what liberalism actually is.


Give it a rest, the days of Bull Conner, Jim Crow and the mobs of inbreds assaulting, often murdering peaceful demonstrators is over, Trump (who like a guy who also egged on a riot in 1923 Germany and who also ran like a pussy), his mob, his enablers have all been about bringing back the good ol' days. When 'those people' knew their place.
You lost. Get over it.
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 18539
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Sat Jan 23, 2021 5:44 pm

Redd wrote:
AirWorthy99 wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
The knots you will twist your self into trying to play down your buddies violently storming the capitol ending the long standing tradition of peaceful transfer of power is unreal, and totally expected. It wasn't BLM that erected a gallows on the Capitol lawn, it was republicans. It wasn't BLM wearing shirts that said "6 Million is not enough". It was republicans. It wasn't BLM that brought the seditious Confederate flag into the Capitol. It was republicans. It wasn't BLM beating a cop to death with a fire extinguisher or beating another cop with the American flag. It was republicans--the Blue Lives Matter/ReSpEcT tHe FlAg crowd. There were no congressmen involved in BLM related violence. Again, those were republican congressmen storming the Capitol. There was no Democratic congressman egging on the violence that may have occurred around the BLM protests. Again, the majority of republicans supported Trump's lie and incitement of violence, until 1/6 when they all got a collective case of amnesia. And that's before you even consider all the right wing militias that gladly set off the violence around BLM protests, whether it's the MSP police station, or conservative hero white supremacist Kyle Rittenhouse, or the vast majority of domestic terrorism murders that is right wing--more than the nearly non existent left wing terrorism and Muslim extremism combined, doubled. So I get that you're so far down the rabbit hole you want to find a way to justify your guys' behavior that makes 'deplorable' look like a stretch goal. But reality is not on your side. There is no reconciliation with any of that. Maybe y'all can move to Argentina and change your name and hope for the best.


How unfortunate this is.

Redd is a liberal not a conservative. Granted an old school liberal, not the “illiberal” types we see presently.

The type of liberal that tolerates others opinions. So much so that despite our very opposing views we actually come together to discuss subjects which are of significance.

You know, the sort of discussion this forum and other social media sites were created for. Substantive discussions.

I know, very hard thing to do for most people who really want to avoid presenting serious and real thinking is easier to shut down the other side by saying nasty things and lumping them together with other sorts of people.


Thanks Airworthy. No matter how many times I make my position clear they're all going to throw me into the right wing camp, unless I agree with everything they say. Liberals have forgotten what liberalism actually is.

You guys can lie to yourselves and each other and high five each other for being so unity. Much open minded. But you're not fooling anyone. A violent coup is not an "opinion". Gallows on the Capitol lawn to hang the VP isn't an "opinion". Pathologically lying--knowingly--about an election outcome is not an "opinion". We can disagree about the threat of structural racism in the country, but when you violently suppress BLM protests in DC but then watch your very own violent coup from a heated tent surrounded by your family and withhold law enforcement's response to it you give up the game. Again. And once again confirm that conservatism has devolved into nothing more than unhinged white grievance.
I don't take responsibility at all
 
M564038
Posts: 587
Joined: Sun Jan 03, 2016 11:16 am

Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Sat Jan 23, 2021 8:11 pm

It is like 45/46.
Whenever I I hear republicans say things like this I picture it in black and white and with the same sound as in Nürnberg.
It is over. It is to late. You had years and years to get your act together, but you just kept on pushing to the right. Into insane conspiracy theories, glorification of violence, a destructive macho culture and exceptionalism, and now, after having embarrassed yourself and the US in front of the whole world, bringing the country over the edge of the cliff, finding yourself bruised and bleeding hanging by a couple of fingers, now you want to be taken serious as a rational voice? After accepting all of the intolerance the right is built upon for years, you want to lecture the center and left on tolerance?

Simple madness.


AirWorthy99 wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
Redd wrote:

Was it Trump supporters or BLM that caused more damage than at anytime since American Civil War on American soil? Not to mention the actual murders, and child victims caught in the middle. So yeah. There are problems on both sides, but due to the tribalism you're so proudly displaying, people are willing to overlook the wrongs and ills of ''their own side''.

So if there is a problem, it's not so much the left or right, it's people like you that are THE problem. That kind of attitude makes it impossible to reconcile.

The knots you will twist your self into trying to play down your buddies violently storming the capitol ending the long standing tradition of peaceful transfer of power is unreal, and totally expected. It wasn't BLM that erected a gallows on the Capitol lawn, it was republicans. It wasn't BLM wearing shirts that said "6 Million is not enough". It was republicans. It wasn't BLM that brought the seditious Confederate flag into the Capitol. It was republicans. It wasn't BLM beating a cop to death with a fire extinguisher or beating another cop with the American flag. It was republicans--the Blue Lives Matter/ReSpEcT tHe FlAg crowd. There were no congressmen involved in BLM related violence. Again, those were republican congressmen storming the Capitol. There was no Democratic congressman egging on the violence that may have occurred around the BLM protests. Again, the majority of republicans supported Trump's lie and incitement of violence, until 1/6 when they all got a collective case of amnesia. And that's before you even consider all the right wing militias that gladly set off the violence around BLM protests, whether it's the MSP police station, or conservative hero white supremacist Kyle Rittenhouse, or the vast majority of domestic terrorism murders that is right wing--more than the nearly non existent left wing terrorism and Muslim extremism combined, doubled. So I get that you're so far down the rabbit hole you want to find a way to justify your guys' behavior that makes 'deplorable' look like a stretch goal. But reality is not on your side. There is no reconciliation with any of that. Maybe y'all can move to Argentina and change your name and hope for the best.


How unfortunate this is.

Redd is a liberal not a conservative. Granted an old school liberal, not the “illiberal” types we see presently.

The type of liberal that tolerates others opinions. So much so that despite our very opposing views we actually come together to discuss subjects which are of significance.

You know, the sort of discussion this forum and other social media sites were created for. Substantive discussions.

I know, very hard thing to do for most people who really want to avoid presenting serious and real thinking is easier to shut down the other side by saying nasty things and lumping them together with other sorts of people.
 
Redd
Topic Author
Posts: 1359
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2013 3:40 am

Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Sat Jan 23, 2021 9:51 pm

Alright boys, I'm outta here for good. Best of luck with everything!
 
User avatar
seb146
Posts: 23466
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Sun Jan 24, 2021 6:24 pm

AirWorthy99 wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
Redd wrote:

Was it Trump supporters or BLM that caused more damage than at anytime since American Civil War on American soil? Not to mention the actual murders, and child victims caught in the middle. So yeah. There are problems on both sides, but due to the tribalism you're so proudly displaying, people are willing to overlook the wrongs and ills of ''their own side''.

So if there is a problem, it's not so much the left or right, it's people like you that are THE problem. That kind of attitude makes it impossible to reconcile.

The knots you will twist your self into trying to play down your buddies violently storming the capitol ending the long standing tradition of peaceful transfer of power is unreal, and totally expected. It wasn't BLM that erected a gallows on the Capitol lawn, it was republicans. It wasn't BLM wearing shirts that said "6 Million is not enough". It was republicans. It wasn't BLM that brought the seditious Confederate flag into the Capitol. It was republicans. It wasn't BLM beating a cop to death with a fire extinguisher or beating another cop with the American flag. It was republicans--the Blue Lives Matter/ReSpEcT tHe FlAg crowd. There were no congressmen involved in BLM related violence. Again, those were republican congressmen storming the Capitol. There was no Democratic congressman egging on the violence that may have occurred around the BLM protests. Again, the majority of republicans supported Trump's lie and incitement of violence, until 1/6 when they all got a collective case of amnesia. And that's before you even consider all the right wing militias that gladly set off the violence around BLM protests, whether it's the MSP police station, or conservative hero white supremacist Kyle Rittenhouse, or the vast majority of domestic terrorism murders that is right wing--more than the nearly non existent left wing terrorism and Muslim extremism combined, doubled. So I get that you're so far down the rabbit hole you want to find a way to justify your guys' behavior that makes 'deplorable' look like a stretch goal. But reality is not on your side. There is no reconciliation with any of that. Maybe y'all can move to Argentina and change your name and hope for the best.


How unfortunate this is.

Redd is a liberal not a conservative. Granted an old school liberal, not the “illiberal” types we see presently.

The type of liberal that tolerates others opinions. So much so that despite our very opposing views we actually come together to discuss subjects which are of significance.

You know, the sort of discussion this forum and other social media sites were created for. Substantive discussions.

I know, very hard thing to do for most people who really want to avoid presenting serious and real thinking is easier to shut down the other side by saying nasty things and lumping them together with other sorts of people.


Republicans have been standing with their now former leader since 2016. Party before country has been their motto since Reagan. They are also great at projection. Republicans accuse others of doing and saying things they themselves actually do. Look at the recent censure of Sen. McCain, Gov. Ducey, and former Sen. Flake in Arizona. Because they did not toe the party MAGA line, the Republican party in Arizona punished them.

Democrats are fine with calling out our leaders. We do it all the time. It is called democracy. It is called being active in a democracy. Right now, Democrats are angry at Pelosi and Schumer for caving into McConnell's demands and Biden for some of his Executive Orders. Democrats were angry at Obama for some of his environmental policies and trade deals. It is okay to hold your own accountable.

Republicans had four years to hold their racist leader accountable and did nothing except blame Hillary, blame Pelosi, blame Obama, blame BLM, blame anyone else. Non-partisan groups who were raising all sorts of red flags over this rise in white supremacy were told "but freedom of speech!" and "but First Amendment!" and "look at those protests over there!"

Just keep in mind that no one on the right had their First Amendment rights taken from them until they stormed the Capital in an attempted violent coup. They were even posting selfies as they were trying to stop democracy. They were waiving their racist and anti-American flags all over the Capital. But, please go on about how "liberals" hate democracy and how "liberals" try to silence the opposition. Remind us again how many times "liberals" stormed a capital building just to stop democracy?

https://www.oregonlive.com/politics/201 ... -vote.html
https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watc ... imate-bill

oh, wait.....
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
User avatar
Aesma
Posts: 14060
Joined: Sat Nov 14, 2009 6:14 am

Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Mon Jan 25, 2021 2:00 pm

About Parler, they might have a good point against Amazon, since apparently they were in fact deleting "problematic" posts by the thousands when they were shut down. I guess free speech isn't that free even there.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
User avatar
casinterest
Posts: 13064
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 5:30 am

Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Mon Jan 25, 2021 2:19 pm

Aesma wrote:
About Parler, they might have a good point against Amazon, since apparently they were in fact deleting "problematic" posts by the thousands when they were shut down. I guess free speech isn't that free even there.



I don't think they do. Their whole popularity was driven by "free speech" . This indicates lax moderation.
Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did..So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.--Mark Twain
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 18539
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Mon Jan 25, 2021 2:44 pm

Redd wrote:
Alright boys, I'm outta here for good. Best of luck with everything!

Make sure to tell everyone you were deplatformed :roll:

casinterest wrote:
Aesma wrote:
About Parler, they might have a good point against Amazon, since apparently they were in fact deleting "problematic" posts by the thousands when they were shut down. I guess free speech isn't that free even there.



I don't think they do. Their whole popularity was driven by "free speech" . This indicates lax moderation.

I still have no idea why conservatives are so gung ho about repealing section 230, which would absolutely vaporize conservative speech online since it's so fundamentally dishonest. You think they're "deplatformed" now, wait until those platforms are legally responsible for their seditious lunatic flying monkey rantings :rotfl: Conservatives can still perpetuate the lie of election fraud to their heart's delight, but imagine when Dominion's $1.2B against Giuliani morphs into a lawsuit against Twitter/Parler/4Chan for joeblow1488 for pushing the same lies....it's game over.
I don't take responsibility at all
 
tommy1808
Posts: 14424
Joined: Thu Nov 21, 2013 3:24 pm

Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Mon Jan 25, 2021 3:51 pm

MaverickM11 wrote:
Redd wrote:
Alright boys, I'm outta here for good. Best of luck with everything!

Make sure to tell everyone you were deplatformed :roll:

casinterest wrote:
Aesma wrote:
About Parler, they might have a good point against Amazon, since apparently they were in fact deleting "problematic" posts by the thousands when they were shut down. I guess free speech isn't that free even there.



I don't think they do. Their whole popularity was driven by "free speech" . This indicates lax moderation.

I still have no idea why conservatives are so gung ho about repealing section 230, which would absolutely vaporize conservative speech online since it's so fundamentally dishonest. You think they're "deplatformed" now, wait until those platforms are legally responsible for their seditious lunatic flying monkey rantings :rotfl: Conservatives can still perpetuate the lie of election fraud to their heart's delight, but imagine when Dominion's $1.2B against Giuliani morphs into a lawsuit against Twitter/Parler/4Chan for joeblow1488 for pushing the same lies....it's game over.


They know that section 230 will not be revoked, and they understand why it won't. That is why it makes such a good rallying point, since the target audience doesn't.
It's like the ACA...awesome really point for almost a decade, but zero interest in actually actually getting rid of it. If Republicans had a house majority, votes to repeal it would already be on the schedule.

Best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
ltbewr
Posts: 15610
Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2004 1:24 pm

Re: Is Deplatforming Conservatives Strenthening Them?

Mon Jan 25, 2021 4:15 pm

The actions of social media and website sever companies as to certain 'right wing extremists' sites and posters after the US Capital attack was in necessary response as a line too far as advocated violence, the murder of certain persons, offensive to an overwhelming number of people, the greater good of their businesses and their revenues. Some sites I suspect faced withdrawal of ads or able to do business as those advertisers and vendors had to take positions so don't look like they supported the Insurrection, racism, sexism and other issues We saw recently some credit card issuers threaten to terminate handling payments from the mega porn site PornHub as to issues of videos of underage persons, 'revenge porn', non-consensual, racist and violent porn.

I suspect many since the US Capital insurrection attack are not posting on social media sites, have 'de-friended' those they oppose the views of reducing posts or suspending activity or accounts to keep their jobs and friends. Even here there are rules to prevent abuses, personal attacks, unsubstantiated comments, disclosures of private information, advocating violence and so on we follow or face penalties up to and including termination of an account. The rules are revised from time to time to recognize changes in society and we have moderation to keep the community in good order. We see from time to time here certain discussions closed or removed as insulting, have false allegations or too controversial (like with the politics of Israel).

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