Unauthorized rallies are planned for 50 Russian cities this Saturday. Putin seems to be getting worried:
https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2021/01/ ... sts-a72683

That sounds extreme.

I always wondered why Assange tried to hide. If Assange had to travel to the US, it would have been a disaster for the government.

It was Gandhis strategy:
There is a quiet majority. Many of them can be awoken if just people are willing to voluntarily suffer injustice. There is no way to make it work without this suffering.

My highest respect for Navalny. What a man.

Speaking of myself:
I wasn't sure what to believe of the poisoning. I wondered "Whom does it use? "
Only once the government refused to give back his clothes I got a strong view against the government. But the behaviour of the authorities now leave no doubt for myself.

The USA has a violent coup attempt and only 1 person dies by a law enforcement officer's direct action, 100's face or have been arrested and even the leaders have the opportunity of a trial.

In Russia, a potentially violent protest will likely mean 100's murdered by military forces and law enforcement, mass arrests with no trials, survivors dragged to jail and no or only a show trial and leaders summary executed.

Braybuddy wrote:

Unauthorized rallies are planned for 50 Russian cities this Saturday. Putin seems to be getting worried:
https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2021/01/ ... sts-a72683

Is anyone really surprised from the autocratic Putin regime? Economically things are not that great in Russia, so the population becomes unhappy. Creating a fantom enemy only gets you so far........

ltbewr wrote:

The USA has a violent coup attempt and only 1 person dies by a law enforcement officer's direct action, 100's face or have been arrested and even the leaders have the opportunity of a trial.

In Russia, a potentially violent protest will likely mean 100's murdered by military forces and law enforcement, mass arrests with no trials, survivors dragged to jail and no or only a show trial and leaders summary executed.

You mean like the Kent State shooting of students by (US) National Guard?
ref: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kent_State_shootings

You will have problems finding examples for your allegations of "hundreds dead" and "summary executions" in Russia in recent years.

Dutchy wrote:

Braybuddy wrote:

Unauthorized rallies are planned for 50 Russian cities this Saturday. Putin seems to be getting worried:
https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2021/01/ ... sts-a72683

Is anyone really surprised from the autocratic Putin regime? Economically things are not that great in Russia, so the population becomes unhappy. Creating a fantom enemy only gets you so far........

The opposition in Russia is on something to present the life of the "Tsar" Putin and his palaces.

This in combination with decreasing incomes from oil and gas, with EU even with the increase of gas export from Russia discussed EU in 10 years from now will use much less oil and gas then today. With Russia one of the biggest exporters the Russian regime gaining from Putin until now, the future of Russia is bleak if it cannot move its economy away from oil.

WIederling wrote:

You will have problems finding examples for your allegations of "hundreds dead" and "summary executions" in Russia in recent years.

Yeah Putin is more subtle than that. Except of course the occasional assassination of a journalist or an opponent, either by guns or by poison.

Seems to have been quite a turnout for the protests, with 1,600 people arrested so far:
https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2021/01/ ... sia-a72705

Aesma wrote:

WIederling wrote:

You will have problems finding examples for your allegations of "hundreds dead" and "summary executions" in Russia in recent years.

Yeah Putin is more subtle than that. Except of course the occasional assassination of a journalist or an opponent, either by guns or by poison.

You forgot the "suicides" by people jumping from buildings...

Braybuddy wrote:

Unauthorized rallies are planned for 50 Russian cities this Saturday. Putin seems to be getting worried:
https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2021/01/ ... sts-a72683

The truth hurts. Putin and his cronies are making themselves look even more guilty by these stupid measures.

johns624 wrote:

Aesma wrote:

WIederling wrote:

You will have problems finding examples for your allegations of "hundreds dead" and "summary executions" in Russia in recent years.

Yeah Putin is more subtle than that. Except of course the occasional assassination of a journalist or an opponent, either by guns or by poison.

You forgot the "suicides" by people jumping from buildings...

Indeed.

Should have taken a lesson from the Germans in dispursing protests by spraying them with water. Does wonders especially when it isn't too warm

ltbewr wrote:

The USA has a violent coup attempt and only 1 person dies by a law enforcement officer's direct action, 100's face or have been arrested and even the leaders have the opportunity of a trial.

In Russia, a potentially violent protest will likely mean 100's murdered by military forces and law enforcement, mass arrests with no trials, survivors dragged to jail and no or only a show trial and leaders summary executed.

However in practice in Russia we get a couple thousand detained, most of which were released that same evening getting some pathetic fine, and the rest will get off with a couple days in jail. Compare that with your scenario in the US where the protestors face years of jail time.

I think this is way too soft. Hope they slap everyone who made posts to come to protest (starting with Navalny himself) with some hefty fines and hopefully a couple months in jail ay least. Plus all those parents that let their underage kids go there should at least get a meeting and a nice lecture from child services.

Strangely, the protests barely make the homepage of RT ("Question More"), with the focus more on someone knocking over a police officer. A protest in the US gets more prominence:
https://www.rt.com/

The Moscow Times covers them very differently:
https://www.themoscowtimes.com/

Braybuddy wrote:

Strangely, the protests barely make the homepage of RT ("Question More"), with the focus more on someone knocking over a police officer. A protest in the US gets more prominence:
https://www.rt.com/

The Moscow Times covers them very differently:
https://www.themoscowtimes.com/

Nothing strange that Russia Today not mentioning it or barely covering it. Remember that RT is a tool of the Kremlin propaganda machine, not an independent media outlet. Showing oppression of the Putin regime isn't part of the propaganda.

The Moscow Times is independent. Founded by Derk Sauer, but the harsh Russian media laws don't allow more than 20% foreign ownership. So The Moscow Times is being run as much independent as possible in Russia but is in English, so not for the general public.

Braybuddy wrote:

The Moscow Times covers them very differently:
https://www.themoscowtimes.com/

unsurprising.
an english only publication founded by a dutchman.
a sister project seems to be
"The New York Times International Edition"

which is a "lecture people globally about the US view on things and why it is the proper way to look at things."

soft washed continuation of Cold War things like Radio Free Europe. ..."
In that domain Navalny obviously is a beacon of true democracy.

Braybuddy wrote:

Strangely, the protests barely make the homepage of RT ("Question More"), with the focus more on someone knocking over a police officer. A protest in the US gets more prominence:

There's nothing strange about that, Russia Today is not about covering Russia. RT's mission is ...and you are lynching Negroes
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/And_you_a ... ng_Negroes
Larry King should've had known better.

Finnish YLE (same like BBC) Moscow correspondent was hit by batons when he was reporting live about those protests. He was wearing a vest that identified him as a reporter.

Sorry, link only in Finnish but watch the first clip.

https://yle.fi/uutiset/3-11752192

THS214 wrote:

Finnish YLE (same like BBC) Moscow correspondent was hit by batons when he was reporting live about those protests. He was wearing a vest that identified him as a reporter.

Sorry, link only in Finnish but watch the first clip.

https://yle.fi/uutiset/3-11752192

That is uncalled for, however when you go to an illegal and unauthorized protest, does one expect to get a pat on the back? Maybe a massage?

Spent an hour watching a bunch of different videos, only found one (in addition to yours) where police used excessive and un necessary force - gave some lady a pretty good kick. Short video, don't know what led up to it.

https://youtu.be/MjaqBA-330Y

tu204 wrote:

THS214 wrote:

Finnish YLE (same like BBC) Moscow correspondent was hit by batons when he was reporting live about those protests. He was wearing a vest that identified him as a reporter.

Sorry, link only in Finnish but watch the first clip.

https://yle.fi/uutiset/3-11752192

That is uncalled for, however when you go to an illegal and unauthorized protest, does one expect to get a pat on the back? Maybe a massage?

Spent an hour watching a bunch of different videos, only found one (in addition to yours) where police used excessive and un necessary force - gave some lady a pretty good kick. Short video, don't know what led up to it.

https://youtu.be/MjaqBA-330Y

He has been reported many demonstrations in Russia and other events and so far wearing the media vest and reporting openly has been enough to be allowed to do his job. There was no reason he would have expected something like that to happen. Something has changed.

And no he didn't expect a massage. Just being able to do his job as a reporter.

"And no he didn't expect a massage. Just being able to do his job as a reporter."

A tag of "reporter" on the outside does no longer guarantee that a reporter is inside.

WIederling wrote:

"And no he didn't expect a massage. Just being able to do his job as a reporter."

A tag of "reporter" on the outside does no longer guarantee that a reporter is inside.

Except that he was...

tu204 wrote:

THS214 wrote:

Finnish YLE (same like BBC) Moscow correspondent was hit by batons when he was reporting live about those protests. He was wearing a vest that identified him as a reporter.

Sorry, link only in Finnish but watch the first clip.

https://yle.fi/uutiset/3-11752192

That is uncalled for, however when you go to an illegal and unauthorized protest, does one expect to get a pat on the back? Maybe a massage?

Spent an hour watching a bunch of different videos, only found one (in addition to yours) where police used excessive and un necessary force - gave some lady a pretty good kick. Short video, don't know what led up to it.

https://youtu.be/MjaqBA-330Y

Participating and reporting on a protest are two entirely different things, at least in the West.

WIederling wrote:

"And no he didn't expect a massage. Just being able to do his job as a reporter."

A tag of "reporter" on the outside does no longer guarantee that a reporter is inside.

A bit like calling Russia a democracy doesn't guarantee it is one ?

johns624 wrote:

tu204 wrote:

THS214 wrote:

Finnish YLE (same like BBC) Moscow correspondent was hit by batons when he was reporting live about those protests. He was wearing a vest that identified him as a reporter.

Sorry, link only in Finnish but watch the first clip.

https://yle.fi/uutiset/3-11752192

That is uncalled for, however when you go to an illegal and unauthorized protest, does one expect to get a pat on the back? Maybe a massage?

Spent an hour watching a bunch of different videos, only found one (in addition to yours) where police used excessive and un necessary force - gave some lady a pretty good kick. Short video, don't know what led up to it.

https://youtu.be/MjaqBA-330Y

Participating and reporting on a protest are two entirely different things, at least in the West.

Not sure on the legality of this in Russia, police were ordering the illegal gathering to dispurse, whether you are a journalist or not may not matter in this case as a direct and lawful order may have been disobeyed. Interesting question though, will ask my lawyer friend what he says.

tu204 wrote:

Not sure on the legality of this in Russia, police were ordering the illegal gathering to dispurse, whether you are a journalist or not may not matter in this case as a direct and lawful order may have been disobeyed. Interesting question though, will ask my lawyer friend what he says.

Who decides what is a legal or illegal gathering in Russia? It's interesting that every illegal gathering includes opposition supporters to Putin.

Glad I live in a country with freedom of assembly and freedom of speach.

tu204 wrote:

Not sure on the legality of this in Russia, police were ordering the illegal gathering to dispurse, whether you are a journalist or not may not matter in this case as a direct and lawful order may have been disobeyed. Interesting question though, will ask my lawyer friend what he says.

It is only an "illegal gathering" because the protesters were opposed to Putin. Article 31 of the Russian Constitution guarantees the right to freedom of peaceful assembly. Russia's main legislation on public assemblies is found in the federal law “On assemblies, meetings, demonstrations, rallies and pickets”, which came into force on 19 June 2004. Unfortunately, Putin and his cronies have taken a "Constitution-be-damned" attitude and introduced, pushed-through, and enforced any and every possible excuse for a law to restrict, persecute, and prosecute anyone who calls them to task for their corruption and illegalities.

Russian people are not free to speak their minds; journalists are not free to speak the truth; and Russian politicians who oppose Putin are sidelined, poisoned, and/or killed. Let's hope Navalny escapes that last fate.

Reinhardt wrote:

Who decides what is a legal or illegal gathering in Russia? It's interesting that every illegal gathering includes opposition supporters to Putin.

Glad I live in a country with freedom of assembly and freedom of speech.

Aesma wrote:

WIederling wrote:

A tag of "reporter" on the outside does no longer guarantee that a reporter is inside.

A bit like calling Russia a democracy doesn't guarantee it is one ?

Braybuddy wrote:

Putin seems to be getting worried.....

He should be worried. He has been in power way to damn long, it is ridiculous. Not sure why Russia even allows someone to be president for 20+ years.

AirframeAS wrote:

Braybuddy wrote:

Putin seems to be getting worried.....

He should be worried. He has been in power way to damn long, it is ridiculous. Not sure why Russia even allows someone to be president for 20+ years.

Russia is an autocracy, so I don't know to whom you refer to as Russia in this case. In an autocracy, the autocratic regime and the institutions of the state are one and the same. Putin will rule Russia as long as he has the support of the group oligarchs surrounding him and thus they continue to benefit (read robbing Russia by corruption) from it. And perhaps if Putin would step down, some other autocrat will be in his place. I don't see any real move towards democracy in Russia.

One ingenious protester's way around the protest laws didn't stop her being detained:
https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2021/01/ ... ion-a72748

“Yelena Kalinina was detained for organizing a mass picket of snowmen,” Navalny’s former Arkhangelsk office coordinator wrote on Twitter."

Dutchy wrote:

AirframeAS wrote:

Braybuddy wrote:

Putin seems to be getting worried.....

He should be worried. He has been in power way to damn long, it is ridiculous. Not sure why Russia even allows someone to be president for 20+ years.

Russia is an autocracy, so I don't know to whom you refer to as Russia in this case. In an autocracy, the autocratic regime and the institutions of the state are one and the same. Putin will rule Russia as long as he has the support of the group oligarchs surrounding him and thus they continue to benefit (read robbing Russia by corruption) from it. And perhaps if Putin would step down, some other autocrat will be in his place. I don't see any real move towards democracy in Russia.

So, if I am understanding this correctly... Russia isnt for the people, by the people like it is here in the U.S. If that is the case, then Russia's elections are just basically moot with no purpose behind them. Ergo, just a show and tell.

AirframeAS wrote:

Dutchy wrote:

AirframeAS wrote:

He should be worried. He has been in power way to damn long, it is ridiculous. Not sure why Russia even allows someone to be president for 20+ years.

Russia is an autocracy, so I don't know to whom you refer to as Russia in this case. In an autocracy, the autocratic regime and the institutions of the state are one and the same. Putin will rule Russia as long as he has the support of the group oligarchs surrounding him and thus they continue to benefit (read robbing Russia by corruption) from it. And perhaps if Putin would step down, some other autocrat will be in his place. I don't see any real move towards democracy in Russia.

So, if I am understanding this correctly... Russia isnt for the people, by the people like it is here in the U.S. If that is the case, then Russia's elections are just basically moot with no purpose behind them. Ergo, just a show and tell.

In North Korea there are elections, the dear leader is elected with 99% of the votes. It gives kind of legitimacy, but it has nothing to do with fair and free elections, it is propaganda. Russia is an autocracy and not a full democracy. So elections are kind of show and tell, especially on the national level. What Navalny did on the regional level was making an analysis, which of the other candidates other than the party of Putin had the most chance to beat the Putin party, didn't matter what kind of candidate it was. He promoted that candidate. He had moderate success with that stragety. In that way, he tried to erode the Putin base.

Navalny jailed for 2,5 years for breaking parole conditions while in coma....
https://edition.cnn.com/2021/02/02/euro ... index.html

SAS A340 wrote:

Navalny jailed for 2,5 years for breaking parole conditions while in coma....
https://edition.cnn.com/2021/02/02/euro ... index.html

And the parole was for "embezzlement" which was a political hit job.

SAS A340 wrote:

Navalny jailed for 2,5 years for breaking parole conditions while in coma....
https://edition.cnn.com/2021/02/02/euro ... index.html

This is the Putin way of finishing him off. In prison where nobody can save him.

casinterest wrote:

SAS A340 wrote:

Navalny jailed for 2,5 years for breaking parole conditions while in coma....
https://edition.cnn.com/2021/02/02/euro ... index.html

And the parole was for "embezzlement" which was a political hit job.

An independent justice system is indeed a long way off in Russia. The embezzlement charge is quite bizarre and ironic since he has shown so many corruption cases. But indeed, Navalny will be in prison for the next couple of years to come. Perhaps he will be viewed as a martyr or he will be locked up and forgotten by his supporters. Time will tell.

Amd quite predictable: hundereds of protesters are arrested in Russia

code word: Brjansk sever

https://www.is.fi/ulkomaat/art-2000007779862.html scroll down to the first video. Police infiltrated.

Why faux 'strong man' Putin is so frightened by this man;
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... ns-kremlin

Should the header of this thread change?

The word "Threatens" looks at least partly out of context after thousands of protesters right now lost their freedom.

olle wrote:

Should the header of this thread change?

The word "Threatens" looks at least partly out of context after thousands of protesters right now lost their freedom.

Russia Threatens Arrests, Prosecutions for Promoting Navalny Protests --> Russia authorities Arrests, Prosecutions of Navalny Protesters

ltbewr wrote:

The USA has a violent coup attempt and only 1 person dies by a law enforcement officer's direct action, 100's face or have been arrested and even the leaders have the opportunity of a trial.

In Russia, a potentially violent protest will likely mean 100's murdered by military forces and law enforcement, mass arrests with no trials, survivors dragged to jail and no or only a show trial and leaders summary executed.

Except they don't have the death penalty in Russia,the last execution was in 1996, Russia's not America you know.

Kiwirob wrote:

ltbewr wrote:

The USA has a violent coup attempt and only 1 person dies by a law enforcement officer's direct action, 100's face or have been arrested and even the leaders have the opportunity of a trial.

In Russia, a potentially violent protest will likely mean 100's murdered by military forces and law enforcement, mass arrests with no trials, survivors dragged to jail and no or only a show trial and leaders summary executed.

Except they don't have the death penalty in Russia,the last execution was in 1996, Russia's not America you know.

Not officially...

Kiwirob wrote:

Except they don't have the death penalty in Russia,the last execution was in 1996, Russia's not America you know.

Boris Nemtsov - among others - would probably disagree with that claim...




https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wor ... ious-ways/

alfa164 wrote:

Kiwirob wrote:

Except they don't have the death penalty in Russia,the last execution was in 1996, Russia's not America you know.

Boris Nemtsov - among others - would probably disagree with that claim...




https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wor ... ious-ways/

Being Journalist in Russia not presenting oficial government view means that you are on death row.

After Politkovskaya's murder, Vyacheslav Izmailov, her colleague at Novaya Gazeta—a military man who had helped negotiate the release of dozens of hostages in Chechnya before 1999—said that he knew of at least nine previous occasions when Politkovskaya had faced death, commenting "Frontline soldiers do not usually go into battle so often and survive".[32]

Politkovskaya herself did not deny being afraid, but felt responsible and concerned for her informants. While attending a December 2005 conference on the freedom of the press in Vienna organised by Reporters Without Borders, she said "People sometimes pay with their lives for saying aloud what they think. In fact, one can even get killed for giving me information. I am not the only one in danger. I have examples that prove it."[33] She often received death threats as a result of her work, including being threatened with rape and experiencing a mock execution after being arrested by the military in Chechnya.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anna_Politkovskaya

SAS A340 wrote:

Navalny jailed for 2,5 years for breaking parole conditions while in coma....
https://edition.cnn.com/2021/02/02/euro ... index.html

Nope. For breaking parole conditions the two months after he came out a coma and was touring around Germany, clearly in good health and more than able to come back to Russia.

tu204 wrote:

SAS A340 wrote:

Navalny jailed for 2,5 years for breaking parole conditions while in coma....
https://edition.cnn.com/2021/02/02/euro ... index.html

Nope. For breaking parole conditions the two months after he came out a coma and was touring around Germany, clearly in good health and more than able to come back to Russia.

Sure.
Good sleep means good health.

cpd wrote:

SAS A340 wrote:

Navalny jailed for 2,5 years for breaking parole conditions while in coma....
https://edition.cnn.com/2021/02/02/euro ... index.html

This is the Putin way of finishing him off. In prison where nobody can save him.

If they wanted him dead, he would be. Long ago.

tu204 wrote:

cpd wrote:

SAS A340 wrote:

Navalny jailed for 2,5 years for breaking parole conditions while in coma....
https://edition.cnn.com/2021/02/02/euro ... index.html

This is the Putin way of finishing him off. In prison where nobody can save him.

If they wanted him dead, he would be. Long ago.

Sorry to disagree. This time, they wanted him dead,
They failed, miserably.
That's the risk when you try to show off.
They could have had him shot 1000 times, but that wouldn't have been any different than if it was from a lowly mafia. They wanted him to die with a message to all of Putin's oponents, with means that only Russia's secret services could use, and the denegations with a smile would have been part of their game.

tu204 wrote:

johns624 wrote:

tu204 wrote:

That is uncalled for, however when you go to an illegal and unauthorized protest, does one expect to get a pat on the back? Maybe a massage?

Spent an hour watching a bunch of different videos, only found one (in addition to yours) where police used excessive and un necessary force - gave some lady a pretty good kick. Short video, don't know what led up to it.

https://youtu.be/MjaqBA-330Y

Participating and reporting on a protest are two entirely different things, at least in the West.

Not sure on the legality of this in Russia, police were ordering the illegal gathering to dispurse, whether you are a journalist or not may not matter in this case as a direct and lawful order may have been disobeyed. Interesting question though, will ask my lawyer friend what he says.

Imagine the terrible world we’d live in today if everyone sheepishly bowed down to authority which is what you seem to support. Authority can only exist if people are willing to recognize it. We’d live in a very dark world if no one questioned or challenged authority. Also, it’s very nature is fleeting. Whatever authority you recognize today will eventually cease to exist and be replaced by something else. Better to spend your life as an independent thinker instead of blindly following the powers of the state that just happens to exist during your lifetime.