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Jetty
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Thu Jan 28, 2021 5:30 pm

GameStop unites Ted Cruz and AOC. Isn’t it a wonderful company? :couple: https://mobile.twitter.com/tedcruz/stat ... 85moe7YUY3
 
tommy1808
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Thu Jan 28, 2021 5:39 pm

Jetty wrote:
GameStop unites Ted Cruz and AOC. Isn’t it a wonderful company? :couple: https://mobile.twitter.com/tedcruz/stat ... 85moe7YUY3


If the app really blocks buying, but allows selling... well, there is your market manipulation.

Best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
Jetty
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Thu Jan 28, 2021 5:50 pm

tommy1808 wrote:
Jetty wrote:
GameStop unites Ted Cruz and AOC. Isn’t it a wonderful company? :couple: https://mobile.twitter.com/tedcruz/stat ... 85moe7YUY3


If the app really blocks buying, but allows selling... well, there is your market manipulation.

Best regards
Thomas

It’s outrageous, and that company names itself RobinHood :roll: They probably wanted to appease Wall Street because of their upcoming IPO. I hope management will go to jail for this. GameStop is holding strong though, dipped to 110 but now back at 300. :box:
 
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DarkSnowyNight
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Thu Jan 28, 2021 5:56 pm

Aaron747 wrote:
zkojq wrote:
Surely that's illegal? How can a broker legally stop you placing a legal bid? Obviously I've no objections to them not letting people buy those said stocks on margin, but if the customer has the money then the broker is obliged to execute the trade.


Apparently not if you decide some clients are more important than others. There were definitely some major calls made last night. I'd wager about ten million screenshots are being taken today in preparation for class action lawsuits.



Damn straight. There is nothing acceptable or legal about that. Nor do brokerages like that stand anything to lose. There is no reason nor legal relief to them preventing retail on these things.
Well, you know what they say. Whatever doesn't kill you...
... Must not be an MD-11.
 
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Aesma
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Thu Jan 28, 2021 6:05 pm

Aaron747 wrote:
So much for 'democratizing' investing - Robinhood has put stops on trading GME, AMC, NAKD, AAL, and others. That's only going to add fuel to the 'system is rigged' fire.

https://www.benzinga.com/news/21/01/193 ... and-others


It might be because of how Robinhood (and other similar apps) is working, aka bundling trades and settling them OTC.

Doing that on shares going crazy is probably very difficult.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
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Aesma
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Thu Jan 28, 2021 6:14 pm

DarkSnowyNight : they're not traditional brokers, that's why there are no fees for using them.

I was a bit pissed yesterday that my investments in the company I work at (and can't sell) went down because of this, triggering some buy orders I had set up, but today it made back all the fall and so I made money from the buy orders, so it's OK :p
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
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DarkSnowyNight
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Thu Jan 28, 2021 6:16 pm

tommy1808 wrote:
Jetty wrote:
GameStop unites Ted Cruz and AOC. Isn’t it a wonderful company? :couple: https://mobile.twitter.com/tedcruz/stat ... 85moe7YUY3


If the app really blocks buying, but allows selling... well, there is your market manipulation.

Best regards
Thomas


Yep. Hard to call it anything different.

From my TD Page...

"GameStop shares are trading lower. The stock has been increasingly volatile following interest from retail investors and Robinhood limited trading in the stock, telling users they can close their position but they cannot buy additional shares.

Jan 28, 2021 10:57a ETBenzinga Stock Analysis
"

Emphasis Mine.

I do not know what these rubes are thinking, but from this vantage point, the exposure to liability seems substantial. I do not use RH much, but I cleared out what little I did have left this morning. Should they be sued, my confidence is not high that access to funds will remain, based on this and yesterdays 'outages'.
Well, you know what they say. Whatever doesn't kill you...
... Must not be an MD-11.
 
dtw2hyd
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Thu Jan 28, 2021 6:20 pm

DarkSnowyNight wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
zkojq wrote:
Surely that's illegal? How can a broker legally stop you placing a legal bid? Obviously I've no objections to them not letting people buy those said stocks on margin, but if the customer has the money then the broker is obliged to execute the trade.


Apparently not if you decide some clients are more important than others. There were definitely some major calls made last night. I'd wager about ten million screenshots are being taken today in preparation for class action lawsuits.



Damn straight. There is nothing acceptable or legal about that. Nor do brokerages like that stand anything to lose. There is no reason nor legal relief to them preventing retail on these things.


Don't underestimate these crooks, 33 Million in float and 200+ Million buy requests, they will claim under oath it is simple math issue, nothing nefarious. Ask how they had 76 Million short orders on total 60 Million stock, different story.
All posts are just opinions.
 
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DarkSnowyNight
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Thu Jan 28, 2021 6:20 pm

Aesma wrote:
DarkSnowyNight : they're not traditional brokers, that's why there are no fees for using them.

I was a bit pissed yesterday that my investments in the company I work at (and can't sell) went down because of this, triggering some buy orders I had set up, but today it made back all the fall and so I made money from the buy orders, so it's OK :p


That is true, and I certainly understand that. But that does not provide room for them to restrict access in this manner. If the shares are available, they are available.

I do get that GME had a problem when over 140% of their available shares were earmarked in this way; that is a huge problem. But the numerous others being restricted just because something might happen? No, fee structure or otherwise, I am not ok with with a brokerage making decisions that way. As I mentioned in the above reply, my business with them is concluded.
Well, you know what they say. Whatever doesn't kill you...
... Must not be an MD-11.
 
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DarkSnowyNight
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Thu Jan 28, 2021 6:28 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
DarkSnowyNight wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:

Apparently not if you decide some clients are more important than others. There were definitely some major calls made last night. I'd wager about ten million screenshots are being taken today in preparation for class action lawsuits.



Damn straight. There is nothing acceptable or legal about that. Nor do brokerages like that stand anything to lose. There is no reason nor legal relief to them preventing retail on these things.


Don't underestimate these crooks, 33 Million in float and 200+ Million buy requests, they will claim under oath it is simple math issue, nothing nefarious. Ask how they had 76 Million short orders on total 60 Million stock, different story.


No argument there. I see litigation as the last real incentive to putting an ankle on all that. The SEC is a bit conflicted, interest wise, for my likings at the moment, and cancelling does not work in this business. So what then else?
Well, you know what they say. Whatever doesn't kill you...
... Must not be an MD-11.
 
cledaybuck
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Thu Jan 28, 2021 6:33 pm

Jetty wrote:
GameStop unites Ted Cruz and AOC. Isn’t it a wonderful company? :couple: https://mobile.twitter.com/tedcruz/stat ... 85moe7YUY3

Or, not so much.
https://mobile.twitter.com/AOC/status/1 ... 3729234944
As we celebrate mediocrity, all the boys upstairs want to see, how much you'll pay for what you used to get for free.
 
Okie
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Thu Jan 28, 2021 8:51 pm

DarkSnowyNight wrote:
No argument there. I see litigation as the last real incentive to putting an ankle on all that. The SEC is a bit conflicted, interest wise, for my likings at the moment, and cancelling does not work in this business. So what then else?


And we find that Yellen was paid $810,000 from her disclosure statement from Citadel who was on the hook for like $3,000,000.000.00 and some how all the sudden Robinhood was only allowing sell orders. :roll:

No problem at all it appears to save Citadel Billions.

Okie
 
slider
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Thu Jan 28, 2021 8:57 pm

Loving the chaos in action. Bring on more of this.

And piss on Robinhood...Citadel bails out Melvin and Robinhood sends all their orders to Citadel. No wonder RH stopped trading.
 
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DarkSnowyNight
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Thu Jan 28, 2021 9:18 pm

Okie wrote:
DarkSnowyNight wrote:
No argument there. I see litigation as the last real incentive to putting an ankle on all that. The SEC is a bit conflicted, interest wise, for my likings at the moment, and cancelling does not work in this business. So what then else?


And we find that Yellen was paid $810,000 from her disclosure statement from Citadel who was on the hook for like $3,000,000.000.00 and some how all the sudden Robinhood was only allowing sell orders. :roll:

No problem at all it appears to save Citadel Billions.

Okie



In what capacity and when? All by itself, that may not really be a story.

slider wrote:
Loving the chaos in action. Bring on more of this.

And piss on Robinhood...Citadel bails out Melvin and Robinhood sends all their orders to Citadel. No wonder RH stopped trading.


I do not understand who these actions can be seen as anything other than attacking confidence in their product. I had already only been using RH for one small and specific purpose. But having found a better vendor two weeks ago, and now this, it is beyond likely I will close out. They were useful at one point, but these things are not encouraging continued custom.

As for chaos... Likely not as much of that as we might think. And even so, that can be managed profitably with enough foresight. Entertaining perhaps, but hardly a major concern.
Well, you know what they say. Whatever doesn't kill you...
... Must not be an MD-11.
 
afgeneral
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Thu Jan 28, 2021 10:25 pm

people in this forum like to say it is a privilege and not a right to be allowed to fly

what about buying stocks? privilege or right?
 
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DarkSnowyNight
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Thu Jan 28, 2021 10:35 pm

afgeneral wrote:
people in this forum like to say it is a privilege and not a right to be allowed to fly

what about buying stocks? privilege or right?



Right. Investing functions as a form of Savings, and there is nothing in the rulebook that says it is ok to remove that ability. However, two things...

1. Investing on a professional level and as a service provided to others is very much a privilege and can and should be carefully regulated.

B. Like any right, there are things that can cause a Court allowance to take that away or restrict it. People in the US have this weird idea that Right means you cannot be separated from that. And that is simply not the case.
Well, you know what they say. Whatever doesn't kill you...
... Must not be an MD-11.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Thu Jan 28, 2021 10:55 pm

Aesma wrote:
DarkSnowyNight : they're not traditional brokers, that's why there are no fees for using them.

I was a bit pissed yesterday that my investments in the company I work at (and can't sell) went down because of this, triggering some buy orders I had set up, but today it made back all the fall and so I made money from the buy orders, so it's OK :p


The thing is this did not happen only at Robinhood - there were ‘technical outages’ at multiple brokerages targeted to specific tickers. A friend of mine in Japan was able to use her overseas Schwab account
but could not search or access three of the tickers being blitzed.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
dtw2hyd
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Thu Jan 28, 2021 11:59 pm

Robinhood didn't live up to its name, ended up robbing Paul to pay Peter.
All posts are just opinions.
 
DTVG
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Fri Jan 29, 2021 1:00 am

dtw2hyd wrote:
Robinhood didn't live up to its name, ended up robbing Paul to pay Peter.


Well that has been known for years, but some people don’t care as long as they are “commission free”.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Fri Jan 29, 2021 1:10 am

Pretty embarassing Robinhood CEO interview on CNBC here. How do such bullshitters get through Series A, B, C meetings without getting laughed out? Actually they probably do 10 or more times before someone funds them...

https://twitter.com/sahilbloom/status/1 ... 68513?s=21
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
NIKV69
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Fri Jan 29, 2021 4:23 am

Aaron747 wrote:
NIKV69 wrote:
Gordon Gekko said it best.

“The illusion has become real, and the more real it becomes the more desperate they want it.”

https://youtu.be/QqjQxs9l5fg


Nick promoting Oliver Stone's uberleftist commentary on soulless capitalist excess? Whoa boy. :spin:


It’s not really capitalism when you break the law that is why Gekko ended up in jail.

Aaron747 wrote:
Pretty embarassing Robinhood CEO interview on CNBC here. How do such bullshitters get through Series A, B, C meetings without getting laughed out? Actually they probably do 10 or more times before someone funds them...

https://twitter.com/sahilbloom/status/1 ... 68513?s=21


It’s good to see that the term “misinformation” is being so overused and being used as a way to explain away ridiculous behavior. Good Lord.
90 Day Fiancé has taught me that Russian woman are excellent.
 
Jetty
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Fri Jan 29, 2021 6:24 am

Aaron747 wrote:
Pretty embarassing Robinhood CEO interview on CNBC here. How do such bullshitters get through Series A, B, C meetings without getting laughed out? Actually they probably do 10 or more times before someone funds them...

https://twitter.com/sahilbloom/status/1 ... 68513?s=21

CNN had an equally embarrassing interview with the guy, but with slightly better questions.

https://edition.cnn.com/videos/business ... pt-vpx.cnn
 
N867DA
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Fri Jan 29, 2021 6:26 am

This mess is revealing to younger people what millennials and Gen X-ers learned--there is no respect in work, effort, or labor. There is only respect in institutional wealth. Someone should be figuratively or financially crucified for the call to stop allowing acquisition of more shares of GME, BB, AMC, etc. Sometimes I think regardless of politics everyone wants to 'eat the rich' but we differ on how to do it.

As time goes, I feel movements like Occupy Wall Street, Trumpism, and this are all borne from people seeing the same systemic problems in America.

I'm afraid to leave the big, steady boat that stability offers but the current way of 'how the world works' is not sufficient. Something big needs to happen.
A nation turns its lonely eyes to you
 
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Aesma
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Fri Jan 29, 2021 6:33 am

I have no time to study this right now but this is how RobinHood makes money : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Payment_for_order_flow

A practice already under investigation by the SEC.

So there might be a link with what they're doing now.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
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Aesma
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Fri Jan 29, 2021 11:01 am

Indeed from what I'm seeing online RobinHood shot itself in the foot big time.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
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Kiwirob
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Fri Jan 29, 2021 12:09 pm

Alias1024 wrote:
Jetty wrote:
Even better is that if people just hold on to their shares many hedgefunds will go bankrupt. :house:


The fact that you’d be happy about this is frankly disturbing. There are more people on the losing end of a hedge fund imploding than just the manager, and most of them don’t drive Ferraris. Not every hedge fund investor is a Wall Street Fat Cat. You know who invests in hedge funds?

Pension funds. You may very well be gloating about and cheering on the destruction of retirements belonging to teachers, firefighters, and police officers.

Sovereign wealth funds. How’d you like to be a tax payer and find out your state or country lost investment income it needs to fix roads or schools or hospitals because of this?

Endowment funds. That’ll suck for the students that see university tuition go up because their school lost a chunk of its endowment in this fiasco. And I’m sure the non-tenure faculty that gets laid off will take comfort that some Reddit stock pickers got a kick out of bankrupting that fund.

Retail investors. Imagine the grandparent that sold a successful business after decades of hard work. They took some of the proceeds to create a fund for their grandchildren’s education and invested it in this hedge fund. Now they’re seeing that fund go up in smoke because some people want to give an imagined Wall Street tycoon the finger.

Charitable funds and trusts. Remember Bernie Madoff’s fraud? Scores of charities lost money in that disaster. This fund is much smaller, but there will still be people doing good work in society that are hurt if this fund blows up.


all that is the reason why short selling should be banned.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Fri Jan 29, 2021 12:19 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
Alias1024 wrote:
Jetty wrote:
Even better is that if people just hold on to their shares many hedgefunds will go bankrupt. :house:


The fact that you’d be happy about this is frankly disturbing. There are more people on the losing end of a hedge fund imploding than just the manager, and most of them don’t drive Ferraris. Not every hedge fund investor is a Wall Street Fat Cat. You know who invests in hedge funds?

Pension funds. You may very well be gloating about and cheering on the destruction of retirements belonging to teachers, firefighters, and police officers.

Sovereign wealth funds. How’d you like to be a tax payer and find out your state or country lost investment income it needs to fix roads or schools or hospitals because of this?

Endowment funds. That’ll suck for the students that see university tuition go up because their school lost a chunk of its endowment in this fiasco. And I’m sure the non-tenure faculty that gets laid off will take comfort that some Reddit stock pickers got a kick out of bankrupting that fund.

Retail investors. Imagine the grandparent that sold a successful business after decades of hard work. They took some of the proceeds to create a fund for their grandchildren’s education and invested it in this hedge fund. Now they’re seeing that fund go up in smoke because some people want to give an imagined Wall Street tycoon the finger.

Charitable funds and trusts. Remember Bernie Madoff’s fraud? Scores of charities lost money in that disaster. This fund is much smaller, but there will still be people doing good work in society that are hurt if this fund blows up.


all that is the reason why short selling should be banned.


Yes...that and the winning parties are not ‘imagined’ WS tycoons. Gabe Plotkin, the manager of Melvin Capital, has a net worth north of $300m. These people become insanely wealthy despite never producing a tangible product.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
dtw2hyd
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Fri Jan 29, 2021 12:26 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
Alias1024 wrote:
Jetty wrote:
Even better is that if people just hold on to their shares many hedgefunds will go bankrupt. :house:


The fact that you’d be happy about this is frankly disturbing. There are more people on the losing end of a hedge fund imploding than just the manager, and most of them don’t drive Ferraris. Not every hedge fund investor is a Wall Street Fat Cat. You know who invests in hedge funds?

Pension funds. You may very well be gloating about and cheering on the destruction of retirements belonging to teachers, firefighters, and police officers.

Sovereign wealth funds. How’d you like to be a tax payer and find out your state or country lost investment income it needs to fix roads or schools or hospitals because of this?

Endowment funds. That’ll suck for the students that see university tuition go up because their school lost a chunk of its endowment in this fiasco. And I’m sure the non-tenure faculty that gets laid off will take comfort that some Reddit stock pickers got a kick out of bankrupting that fund.

Retail investors. Imagine the grandparent that sold a successful business after decades of hard work. They took some of the proceeds to create a fund for their grandchildren’s education and invested it in this hedge fund. Now they’re seeing that fund go up in smoke because some people want to give an imagined Wall Street tycoon the finger.

Charitable funds and trusts. Remember Bernie Madoff’s fraud? Scores of charities lost money in that disaster. This fund is much smaller, but there will still be people doing good work in society that are hurt if this fund blows up.


all that is the reason why short selling should be banned.


Short selling is not the problem. Weaponizing short sale for greed is the problem.

Reddit Forum members used public information, if the hedge fund managers were in it together, that is collusion.

Without any mercy few hedge brokers want to run a B&M company with $5Billion revenue and 50,000 employees in the ground and no one can question them, something is wrong.

It is a usual technique to justify these actions by putting small guys on both sides of the debate to save the fat cats.

Sure Pension Funds with such manager may take a hit, should they be saved at the cost of 50,000 families livelihood.

It appears, the Melvin guy was charged with insider trading in the past, how did he become top hedge fund manager?
All posts are just opinions.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Fri Jan 29, 2021 12:42 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:
Alias1024 wrote:

The fact that you’d be happy about this is frankly disturbing. There are more people on the losing end of a hedge fund imploding than just the manager, and most of them don’t drive Ferraris. Not every hedge fund investor is a Wall Street Fat Cat. You know who invests in hedge funds?

Pension funds. You may very well be gloating about and cheering on the destruction of retirements belonging to teachers, firefighters, and police officers.

Sovereign wealth funds. How’d you like to be a tax payer and find out your state or country lost investment income it needs to fix roads or schools or hospitals because of this?

Endowment funds. That’ll suck for the students that see university tuition go up because their school lost a chunk of its endowment in this fiasco. And I’m sure the non-tenure faculty that gets laid off will take comfort that some Reddit stock pickers got a kick out of bankrupting that fund.

Retail investors. Imagine the grandparent that sold a successful business after decades of hard work. They took some of the proceeds to create a fund for their grandchildren’s education and invested it in this hedge fund. Now they’re seeing that fund go up in smoke because some people want to give an imagined Wall Street tycoon the finger.

Charitable funds and trusts. Remember Bernie Madoff’s fraud? Scores of charities lost money in that disaster. This fund is much smaller, but there will still be people doing good work in society that are hurt if this fund blows up.


all that is the reason why short selling should be banned.


Short selling is not the problem. Weaponizing short sale for greed is the problem.

Reddit Forum members used public information, if the hedge fund managers were in it together, that is collusion.

Without any mercy few hedge brokers want to run a B&M company with $5Billion revenue and 50,000 employees in the ground and no one can question them, something is wrong.

It is a usual technique to justify these actions by putting small guys on both sides of the debate to save the fat cats.

Sure Pension Funds with such manager may take a hit, should they be saved at the cost of 50,000 families livelihood.

It appears, the Melvin guy was charged with insider trading in the past, how did he become top hedge fund manager?


There was a big sweep up at his former employer, but it seems despite trading on insider tips he escaped prosecution while colleagues didn't.

https://www.investmentnews.com/senior-m ... raud-50572
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
jamincan
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Fri Jan 29, 2021 1:07 pm

Aaron747 wrote:
There was a big sweep up at his former employer, but it seems despite trading on insider tips he escaped prosecution while colleagues didn't.

https://www.investmentnews.com/senior-m ... raud-50572


Those who cheat best rise to the top.
 
AirWorthy99
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Fri Jan 29, 2021 1:47 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:

Short selling is not the problem. Weaponizing short sale for greed is the problem.

Reddit Forum members used public information, if the hedge fund managers were in it together, that is collusion.

Without any mercy few hedge brokers want to run a B&M company with $5Billion revenue and 50,000 employees in the ground and no one can question them, something is wrong.

It is a usual technique to justify these actions by putting small guys on both sides of the debate to save the fat cats.

Sure Pension Funds with such manager may take a hit, should they be saved at the cost of 50,000 families livelihood.

It appears, the Melvin guy was charged with insider trading in the past, how did he become top hedge fund manager?


Big thumbs up to this. No need to say anything more in this thread. :checkmark: :checkmark:

Just to add, Robinhood proved to be more corrupt than even the hedge fund managers. They all ought to go to prison.
“It’s easy to confuse ‘what is’ with ‘what ought to be,’ especially when ‘what is’ has worked out in your favor.” Tyrion Lannister
 
phatfarmlines
Posts: 1891
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Fri Jan 29, 2021 2:05 pm

Tucker Carlson, for once, is not talking about Trump or Biden. Here is an interesting take from him that insinuates "virtue signaling" from the Robinhood app. Time marker start at 7:02 in the linked video below.

Portnoy calls for people to be jailed over hedge fund scandal in scathing interview (Source: Fox News)
 
NIKV69
Posts: 14316
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Fri Jan 29, 2021 4:07 pm

Jetty wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
Pretty embarassing Robinhood CEO interview on CNBC here. How do such bullshitters get through Series A, B, C meetings without getting laughed out? Actually they probably do 10 or more times before someone funds them...

https://twitter.com/sahilbloom/status/1 ... 68513?s=21

CNN had an equally embarrassing interview with the guy, but with slightly better questions.

https://edition.cnn.com/videos/business ... pt-vpx.cnn


Watching it now, finally good to see Good Ol’ Chris ask some hardball questions. Wow.
90 Day Fiancé has taught me that Russian woman are excellent.
 
mxaxai
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Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Fri Jan 29, 2021 4:33 pm

Alias1024 wrote:
Jetty wrote:
Even better is that if people just hold on to their shares many hedgefunds will go bankrupt. :house:


The fact that you’d be happy about this is frankly disturbing. There are more people on the losing end of a hedge fund imploding than just the manager, and most of them don’t drive Ferraris. Not every hedge fund investor is a Wall Street Fat Cat. You know who invests in hedge funds?

Pension funds. ... Sovereign wealth funds. ... Endowment funds. ... Retail investors. ... Charitable funds and trusts.

That's why hedge funds need careful regulation. The charitable funds and private investors that give them their money rely on the hedge fund to invest carefully. Those investors aren't financial experts, they trust the fund managers to make wise decisions. If the hedge fund goes on some risky shenanigans with other peoples' money, the managers should be held personally liable.


FYI, just today China executed a banker for bigamy and accepting corruption. The US judicial system is vastly more lenient with business crimes. Managers have nothing to fear, only potential gains.
 
Alias1024
Posts: 2796
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2004 11:13 am

Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Fri Jan 29, 2021 5:28 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
Alias1024 wrote:
Jetty wrote:
Even better is that if people just hold on to their shares many hedgefunds will go bankrupt. :house:


The fact that you’d be happy about this is frankly disturbing. There are more people on the losing end of a hedge fund imploding than just the manager, and most of them don’t drive Ferraris. Not every hedge fund investor is a Wall Street Fat Cat. You know who invests in hedge funds?

Pension funds. You may very well be gloating about and cheering on the destruction of retirements belonging to teachers, firefighters, and police officers.

Sovereign wealth funds. How’d you like to be a tax payer and find out your state or country lost investment income it needs to fix roads or schools or hospitals because of this?

Endowment funds. That’ll suck for the students that see university tuition go up because their school lost a chunk of its endowment in this fiasco. And I’m sure the non-tenure faculty that gets laid off will take comfort that some Reddit stock pickers got a kick out of bankrupting that fund.

Retail investors. Imagine the grandparent that sold a successful business after decades of hard work. They took some of the proceeds to create a fund for their grandchildren’s education and invested it in this hedge fund. Now they’re seeing that fund go up in smoke because some people want to give an imagined Wall Street tycoon the finger.

Charitable funds and trusts. Remember Bernie Madoff’s fraud? Scores of charities lost money in that disaster. This fund is much smaller, but there will still be people doing good work in society that are hurt if this fund blows up.


all that is the reason why short selling should be banned.


I’d have to give some thought to the second and third order effects, but my initial thought is I’d be ok with banning short selling. It has no productive use to society.
It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems with just potatoes.
 
FGITD
Posts: 1577
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 1:44 pm

Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Fri Jan 29, 2021 6:29 pm

N867DA wrote:
This mess is revealing to younger people what millennials and Gen X-ers learned--there is no respect in work, effort, or labor. There is only respect in institutional wealth. Someone should be figuratively or financially crucified for the call to stop allowing acquisition of more shares of GME, BB, AMC, etc. Sometimes I think regardless of politics everyone wants to 'eat the rich' but we differ on how to do it.

As time goes, I feel movements like Occupy Wall Street, Trumpism, and this are all borne from people seeing the same systemic problems in America.

I'm afraid to leave the big, steady boat that stability offers but the current way of 'how the world works' is not sufficient. Something big needs to happen.


Carlin said it best. It’s one big club, and you ain’t in it.

It’s interesting though...when something is done systematically by the professionals for decades, it’s OK. When the amateurs take advantage and do it, suddenly it’s a crisis. I’m ok with watching these major firms crash and burn. Rest assured, every time the rest of us crashed and burned, they didn't bat an eye. In fact, they almost definitely profited from it.

What’s more remarkable is how many people stick up for the billionaires. People who are one missed paycheck or one illness away from losing everything, yet try to defend those for whom “massive economic downturn” means a smaller yacht, or fewer luxury vacations.

So it bears repeating...it’s one big club, and we ain’t in It
 
johns624
Posts: 3776
Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2008 11:09 pm

Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Fri Jan 29, 2021 6:56 pm

As much as I hate hedge funds and how some act, they've never had an effect on my investments. The shenanigans of the last few days have. I'm sure it's temporary but like the old saying goes "all politics is local". That means that our view on anything depends on how it personally affects us.
 
Alias1024
Posts: 2796
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2004 11:13 am

Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Fri Jan 29, 2021 7:59 pm

FGITD wrote:

It’s interesting though...when something is done systematically by the professionals for decades, it’s OK. When the amateurs take advantage and do it, suddenly it’s a crisis.


I agree that this isn’t really anything new. Short squeezes have been going on a hundred years. Even the quasi-collusion aspect of it. The only thing novel about this, and why it’s getting so much attention, is the online organization by non-professionals.

There’s an interesting passage in one of stock pundit Jim Cramer’s books about when his hedge fund got caught in a short squeeze. He got a call from a friend saying that some small fund had gone short in a big way and was going to get blown up in a squeeze. A bunch of other funds were shooting against it and he should get in on the fun and profits. What his friend didn’t know was that it was his fund that was in trouble. So professional investors whining about collusion should get zero sympathy. They’ve been doing things like this for decades.
It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems with just potatoes.
 
CaptainHaresh
Posts: 58
Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2021 9:49 pm

Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Fri Jan 29, 2021 9:27 pm

Most likely hedge funds are the ones organizing these market manipulations to get out of long-term long positions with a loss.
Hedge funds don't hold big short positions and certainly not on cheap stocks, not much room for margin going short on those.
Pro's short big through derivatives and otherwise have safeguards in place, you're not going to catch them with something like this.
Novice traders are being told a nice story to become accomplices to mass market manipulation.

The SEC, like always, is doing nothing about it.

Short-selling is like gravity.
When companies are overvalued, short-selling helps push stock prices down to fair value.
People who don't understand trading and investing condemn short-selling and thereby promote the idea that poorly performing companies should not be punished. If you don't punish them, how are they going to get their act together?
 
User avatar
zkojq
Posts: 4606
Joined: Fri Sep 02, 2011 12:42 am

Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Fri Jan 29, 2021 10:51 pm

CaptainHaresh wrote:
Most likely hedge funds are the ones organizing these market manipulations to get out of long-term long positions with a loss.
Hedge funds don't hold big short positions and certainly not on cheap stocks, not much room for margin going short on those.
Pro's short big through derivatives and otherwise have safeguards in place, you're not going to catch them with something like this.
Novice traders are being told a nice story to become accomplices to mass market manipulation.

The SEC, like always, is doing nothing about it.

Short-selling is like gravity.
When companies are overvalued, short-selling helps push stock prices down to fair value.
People who don't understand trading and investing condemn short-selling and thereby promote the idea that poorly performing companies should not be punished. If you don't punish them, how are they going to get their act together?


Overvalued companies don't need short selling for their price to be corrected.
First to fly the 787-9
 
User avatar
DIRECTFLT
Posts: 2548
Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2010 3:00 am

Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Fri Jan 29, 2021 10:58 pm

Alias1024 wrote:
Jetty wrote:
Even better is that if people just hold on to their shares many hedgefunds will go bankrupt. :house:


The fact that you’d be happy about this is frankly disturbing. There are more people on the losing end of a hedge fund imploding than just the manager, and most of them don’t drive Ferraris. Not every hedge fund investor is a Wall Street Fat Cat. You know who invests in hedge funds?

Pension funds. You may very well be gloating about and cheering on the destruction of retirements belonging to teachers, firefighters, and police officers.

Sovereign wealth funds. How’d you like to be a tax payer and find out your state or country lost investment income it needs to fix roads or schools or hospitals because of this?

Endowment funds. That’ll suck for the students that see university tuition go up because their school lost a chunk of its endowment in this fiasco. And I’m sure the non-tenure faculty that gets laid off will take comfort that some Reddit stock pickers got a kick out of bankrupting that fund.

Retail investors. Imagine the grandparent that sold a successful business after decades of hard work. They took some of the proceeds to create a fund for their grandchildren’s education and invested it in this hedge fund. Now they’re seeing that fund go up in smoke because some people want to give an imagined Wall Street tycoon the finger.

Charitable funds and trusts. Remember Bernie Madoff’s fraud? Scores of charities lost money in that disaster. This fund is much smaller, but there will still be people doing good work in society that are hurt if this fund blows up.


So hedgefunds are now "Too Big To Fail" ? ? ?
Smoothest Ride so far ~ AA A300B4-600R ~~ Favorite Aviation Author ~ Robert J. Serling
 
Jetty
Posts: 1386
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2015 12:27 pm

Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Fri Jan 29, 2021 11:17 pm

CaptainHaresh wrote:
Hedge funds don't hold big short positions and certainly not on cheap stocks, not much room for margin going short on those.

Margin requirements and risk calculations never took into account a dying company like GameStop going up 1000% out of practically nowhere. That's why this worked and hedgefunds needed a bailout. You don't need a big short to get into trouble because with shorts losses are uncapped an can be many times the initial investment even without margin.

Novice traders are being told a nice story to become accomplices to mass market manipulation.

Novice traders started this story months ago, it's all on the internet so there's no doubt about this.

Short-selling is like gravity. When companies are overvalued, short-selling helps push stock prices down to fair value. People who don't understand trading and investing condemn short-selling and thereby promote the idea that poorly performing companies should not be punished. If you don't punish them, how are they going to get their act together?

Fine, and just like that we are punishing hedgefunds with poor risk management that think it's a smart idea to short 140% of a stock. How else are they going to get their act together? :lol:
 
User avatar
DIRECTFLT
Posts: 2548
Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2010 3:00 am

Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Sat Jan 30, 2021 12:58 am

Barstool Sports founder and President Dave Portnoy weighs in on the GameStop stock price stock surge and how Robinhood and Wall Street have reacted to the short squeeze. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWBtQgxSSLs

Dave believes that Robinhood acted criminally when they stopped/restricted GME buying.
Smoothest Ride so far ~ AA A300B4-600R ~~ Favorite Aviation Author ~ Robert J. Serling
 
Elkadad313
Posts: 159
Joined: Thu Aug 20, 2020 12:55 am

Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Sat Jan 30, 2021 1:48 am

Jetty wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
Pretty embarassing Robinhood CEO interview on CNBC here. How do such bullshitters get through Series A, B, C meetings without getting laughed out? Actually they probably do 10 or more times before someone funds them...

https://twitter.com/sahilbloom/status/1 ... 68513?s=21

CNN had an equally embarrassing interview with the guy, but with slightly better questions.

https://edition.cnn.com/videos/business ... pt-vpx.cnn

Vlad Tenev (Robinhood) speaks with forked tongue.
 
steveinbc
Posts: 353
Joined: Sun Sep 13, 2015 4:30 pm

Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Sat Jan 30, 2021 2:41 am

TangoandCash wrote:
The wolves of Wall Street don't like competition from the sheep of Main Street.

:lol: that's the best quote I've seen in ages
Funny and true..a rare combination
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Aaron747
Topic Author
Posts: 14930
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 2:07 am

Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Sat Jan 30, 2021 3:10 am

There are some entities out there that likely made out much bigger this week than the retail investors did (if they unloaded in time).

https://www.nasdaq.com/articles/some-as ... 2021-01-28
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
Alias1024
Posts: 2796
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2004 11:13 am

Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Sat Jan 30, 2021 6:41 am

DIRECTFLT wrote:
Alias1024 wrote:
Jetty wrote:
Even better is that if people just hold on to their shares many hedgefunds will go bankrupt. :house:


The fact that you’d be happy about this is frankly disturbing. There are more people on the losing end of a hedge fund imploding than just the manager, and most of them don’t drive Ferraris. Not every hedge fund investor is a Wall Street Fat Cat. You know who invests in hedge funds?

Pension funds. You may very well be gloating about and cheering on the destruction of retirements belonging to teachers, firefighters, and police officers.

Sovereign wealth funds. How’d you like to be a tax payer and find out your state or country lost investment income it needs to fix roads or schools or hospitals because of this?

Endowment funds. That’ll suck for the students that see university tuition go up because their school lost a chunk of its endowment in this fiasco. And I’m sure the non-tenure faculty that gets laid off will take comfort that some Reddit stock pickers got a kick out of bankrupting that fund.

Retail investors. Imagine the grandparent that sold a successful business after decades of hard work. They took some of the proceeds to create a fund for their grandchildren’s education and invested it in this hedge fund. Now they’re seeing that fund go up in smoke because some people want to give an imagined Wall Street tycoon the finger.

Charitable funds and trusts. Remember Bernie Madoff’s fraud? Scores of charities lost money in that disaster. This fund is much smaller, but there will still be people doing good work in society that are hurt if this fund blows up.


So hedgefunds are now "Too Big To Fail" ? ? ?


Nope. If the fund blows up, so be it. In the end that’s the risk you take when you invest in the market, either by yourself or paying someone else to do it for you.

I’m just trying to point out that people will be hurt by it and not all of them are ultra-wealthy. There’s no need for anyone to act like a dick and be gleeful about the fund being in trouble.
It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems with just potatoes.
 
User avatar
Pellegrine
Posts: 2651
Joined: Thu Mar 29, 2007 10:19 am

Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Sat Jan 30, 2021 7:36 am

I wish I knew about GME. I dont follow Reddit/WallStreetBets. Man I wish I did...but I'm doing pretty well for January. Longed BTCUSD at around 28k last year, and sold a lot of my position around 40.5k. I'm in on ETH too. Still long somewhat, but I agree with those saying BTC is highly speculative. I've done well scalping BTC too, but that's very dangerous and I'm done for now. One other thing I've done extremely well with the past month or two is a basket of US mid-cap gas/oil producers/services/explorers stock. I think it's too late to get into most of these trades, including GME, now though.
We fly JETS, we don't fly donkeys. Citizenship/Residence::: Washington DC, US; Vaud, CH; Providenciales, TCI (hence my avi)
 
User avatar
Pellegrine
Posts: 2651
Joined: Thu Mar 29, 2007 10:19 am

Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Sat Jan 30, 2021 7:38 am

Aaron747 wrote:
There are some entities out there that likely made out much bigger this week than the retail investors did (if they unloaded in time).

https://www.nasdaq.com/articles/some-as ... 2021-01-28


As a retail investor one needs to learn about what the INSTITUTIONAL sentiment is, and FOLLOW along.... Don't try to swim up a river, lol. You'll never make money placing trades against the likes of C, GS, MS.....
We fly JETS, we don't fly donkeys. Citizenship/Residence::: Washington DC, US; Vaud, CH; Providenciales, TCI (hence my avi)
 
Jetty
Posts: 1386
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2015 12:27 pm

Re: GameStop Stock Fiasco

Sat Jan 30, 2021 8:17 am

Alias1024 wrote:
There’s no need for anyone to act like a dick and be gleeful about the fund being in trouble.

The shorting is a 0 sum game. The hedgefunds were gleefull about good old GameStop being in trouble. In return fans of GameStop who like the stock are gleefull that hedgefunds are in trouble. Either the people who do like GameStop would have lost big or the hedgefunds would be in trouble. You can’t have it both ways. Why is the first thing fine and the second thing ‘acting like a dick’? It’s the hedgefunds that started betting on a bad outcome for someone else, not the people that bet on a bad outcome for the hedgefunds in return... :?
Last edited by Jetty on Sat Jan 30, 2021 8:24 am, edited 1 time in total.

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