Moderators: richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
af773atmsp
Topic Author
Posts: 2443
Joined: Mon Aug 28, 2006 1:37 am

Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Thu Feb 11, 2021 3:56 pm

https://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2021/02/ ... on-rapids/

As a person who lives in the region, I've always known that the name "Coon Rapids" was referring to raccoons. However I understand that for many people, especially those outside the region, they associate the first word of the name with a racial slur. If I lived in Coon Rapids and someone from outside the area asked where I live I would definitely say "a suburb north of Minneapolis."

A name change seems pretty simple in this case. Just rename the city Raccoon Rapids.
DC10-40,MD88,A319,A320,A332,717,722,733,737,738,752,ATR-72,736,788,74M
SY,DL,FI,FL,BA,EI,NW,MG,DY,EZY,F9,WN,SN,ET,SK,KL,B6
Too many airports to fit in signature.
 
phatfarmlines
Posts: 1786
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2001 12:06 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Thu Feb 11, 2021 4:52 pm

When I clicked on this thread, I figured it was referring to that part of Minneapolis. I don't see the big deal in the name change, several large cities have undergone name changes (Bombay to Mumbai, Saigon to Ho Chi Minh, etc.). I support a change to Raccoon Rapids (a cooler name BTW).
 
ltbewr
Posts: 15619
Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2004 1:24 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Thu Feb 11, 2021 5:04 pm

A number of postal districts, towns, rivers, mountains, schools, streets names in the USA have been changed in the last number of years due to changes in society and if any hint of racism or possibly offensive. I bet locals will still call it Coon Rapids for generations to come.
 
User avatar
Kiwirob
Posts: 13392
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2005 2:16 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Thu Feb 11, 2021 5:27 pm

Name changes are happening all over NZ. It’s just pandering to the PC crowd. If some people get there way we won’t even be New Zealand anymore.
 
User avatar
casinterest
Posts: 13158
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 5:30 am

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Thu Feb 11, 2021 5:53 pm

I would imagine from a city growth and image perspective, it would be better to change the name. Old habits will die hard, but at the end of the day the city isn't growing that fast.

https://datausa.io/profile/geo/coon-rapids-mn
Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did..So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.--Mark Twain
 
Arion640
Posts: 3257
Joined: Fri Mar 31, 2017 5:15 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Thu Feb 11, 2021 6:54 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
Name changes are happening all over NZ. It’s just pandering to the PC crowd. If some people get there way we won’t even be New Zealand anymore.


Same in the UK. London has a street name changing/statue removal committee packed full of left wing extremists.
 
stlgph
Posts: 11317
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 4:19 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Thu Feb 11, 2021 7:11 pm

How cute - a generation of people using slang words to shorten phrases and entire sentences (i.e. "Bet") is upset over the shortening of a word.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
FGITD
Posts: 1494
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 1:44 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Thu Feb 11, 2021 7:26 pm

stlgph wrote:
How cute - a generation of people using slang words to shorten phrases and entire sentences (i.e. "Bet") is upset over the shortening of a word.


Yes, because the offense is clearly over the word being shortened, nothing at all to do with the racist connotations of the word. The linguists and English language professors of the area are horrified.
 
User avatar
stl07
Posts: 2722
Joined: Mon May 01, 2017 8:57 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Thu Feb 11, 2021 8:50 pm

Meh, I was gonna complain at first but I can see why one would do this
Instead of typing in "mods", consider using the report function.
Love how every "travel blogger" says they will never fly AA/Ethihad again and then says it again and again on subsequent flights.
 
phatfarmlines
Posts: 1786
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2001 12:06 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Sat Feb 13, 2021 6:28 am

Interesting list of renamed places in the U.S. per Wikipedia:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_r ... ted_States

Though I don't see an entry for Tysons, Virginia, formerly known as Tyson's Corner in NOVA. I still (and will continue to) refer it as Tyson's Corner.
 
User avatar
scbriml
Posts: 19713
Joined: Wed Jul 02, 2003 10:37 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Sat Feb 13, 2021 9:00 am

phatfarmlines wrote:
When I clicked on this thread, I figured it was referring to that part of Minneapolis. I don't see the big deal in the name change, several large cities have undergone name changes (Bombay to Mumbai, Saigon to Ho Chi Minh, etc.). I support a change to Raccoon Rapids (a cooler name BTW).


Your cited city name changes were from Anglicised (often imperially imposed) versions to the native version.
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana!
There are 10 types of people in the World - those that understand binary and those that don't.
 
User avatar
scbriml
Posts: 19713
Joined: Wed Jul 02, 2003 10:37 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Sat Feb 13, 2021 9:02 am

Arion640 wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:
Name changes are happening all over NZ. It’s just pandering to the PC crowd. If some people get there way we won’t even be New Zealand anymore.


Same in the UK. London has a street name changing/statue removal committee packed full of left wing extremists.


And the problem is? Or are you happy to be seen to be celebrating and legitimising, for example, slave traders in the 2020s?
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana!
There are 10 types of people in the World - those that understand binary and those that don't.
 
Arion640
Posts: 3257
Joined: Fri Mar 31, 2017 5:15 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Sat Feb 13, 2021 11:20 am

scbriml wrote:
Arion640 wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:
Name changes are happening all over NZ. It’s just pandering to the PC crowd. If some people get there way we won’t even be New Zealand anymore.


Same in the UK. London has a street name changing/statue removal committee packed full of left wing extremists.


And the problem is? Or are you happy to be seen to be celebrating and legitimising, for example, slave traders in the 2020s?


How and when does anyone “celebrate” slave traders? If anything they should remain to remind us of how wrong the past was.
 
User avatar
Aaron747
Posts: 14135
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 2:07 am

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Sat Feb 13, 2021 11:50 am

Arion640 wrote:
scbriml wrote:
Arion640 wrote:

Same in the UK. London has a street name changing/statue removal committee packed full of left wing extremists.


And the problem is? Or are you happy to be seen to be celebrating and legitimising, for example, slave traders in the 2020s?


How and when does anyone “celebrate” slave traders? If anything they should remain to remind us of how wrong the past was.


Considering Maori are still nearly 20% of the NZ population, I can't see the harm in following their placename conventions. There's no harm in having both on a map.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
User avatar
scbriml
Posts: 19713
Joined: Wed Jul 02, 2003 10:37 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Sat Feb 13, 2021 12:17 pm

Arion640 wrote:
How and when does anyone “celebrate” slave traders?


That you have to ask says more about you than it does about the "left wing extremists" you're complaining about.
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana!
There are 10 types of people in the World - those that understand binary and those that don't.
 
Virtual737
Posts: 1020
Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2016 6:16 am

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Sat Feb 13, 2021 1:18 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
Name changes are happening all over NZ. It’s just pandering to the PC crowd. If some people get there way we won’t even be New Zealand anymore.


There is such a thing as political correctness (I hate that term anyway) gone too far, but I would hardly think that clarifying Coon Rapids to it's original full meaning of Racoon Rapids could or should be seen as over the top. If anyone living there was against clarifying the meaning of Coon in the name while distancing themselves from a term that is very much directly linked to slavery then it says a lot about them.

Arion640 wrote:
Same in the UK. London has a street name changing/statue removal committee packed full of left wing extremists.


Extremists? I thought you have to hold a gun, make bombs or chant "death to the infidels" to be deemed an extremists. Sounds like there are snowflakes all over the place.
 
GDB
Posts: 14116
Joined: Wed May 23, 2001 6:25 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Sat Feb 13, 2021 1:32 pm

scbriml wrote:
Arion640 wrote:
How and when does anyone “celebrate” slave traders?


That you have to ask says more about you than it does about the "left wing extremists" you're complaining about.


Quite, someone has been drinking the Farage/Laurence Fox/Hartley-Brewer kool aid, basically wealthy (as in real elitists) who distract the to put it mildly, not well informed lower orders with all this fake culture wars BS.
It's rather like how pickpocketing teams work, one distracts by say bumping into you, while the other picks your wallet. Just a political version of that, 'look at this thing we made up, now clap for carers while we screw them over', frankly a lot of mugs over here fall for it.

How are all the 90% of fishermen who voted Leave feeling now, by all accounts mostly betrayed and if some are honest, a bit stupid.
They are just the first, most immediate, the population of N.I. coming a close second with plenty more to come.
Expect no sympathy from me if you voted for any of it.

Many people in Bristol wanted that statue not toppled, rather for years they wanted it in a museum with the context of his life, how he made his money, what he did with it.
But they were always told no.
If you actually bother to look up say the blue plaques on homes that well known people lived in, they are a wide range of people, not the leftist demons those dopey enough to believe after listening to obvious con artists, including in their imagined 'Elite' epicenter of 'that London'.

https://www.english-heritage.org.uk/vis ... e-plaques/

(A search for that well known 'Cultural Marxist' George Orwell found he lived for a time in Kentish Town, there's a reference to him also not far from me, not a plaque though, hence the choice of search).
 
User avatar
Classa64
Posts: 333
Joined: Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:40 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Sat Feb 13, 2021 2:11 pm

I don't understand, my first thought of the name never occurred to me it was racist. I guess its all in how you think or what triggers you, I mean even the sign has a racoon and a set of rapids on it, and that's racist?. Are there a group of people just bored and looking for every little thing that they don't like? They asked 460 out of 62,000 people in the area, pretty small sample I think. Ya its a racial slur, there are tons of them, but its also short for Racoon, I wonder if the Racoon get mad when I call them trash panda's. Better start changing all the towns with Buck and Crow in there name to I guess. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_e ... _ethnicity
"Freedom is the miles i'm rolling on"
 
User avatar
Braybuddy
Posts: 6911
Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2004 8:14 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Sat Feb 13, 2021 2:45 pm

phatfarmlines wrote:
When I clicked on this thread, I figured it was referring to that part of Minneapolis. I don't see the big deal in the name change, several large cities have undergone name changes (Bombay to Mumbai, Saigon to Ho Chi Minh, etc.). I support a change to Raccoon Rapids (a cooler name BTW).

Only time I was in Ho Chi Minh city, admittedly over a decade ago, nobody in the city referred to it by that name. Everybody still called it Saigon. It's easier to pronounce, anyway.
 
User avatar
scbriml
Posts: 19713
Joined: Wed Jul 02, 2003 10:37 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Sat Feb 13, 2021 3:05 pm

Braybuddy wrote:
phatfarmlines wrote:
When I clicked on this thread, I figured it was referring to that part of Minneapolis. I don't see the big deal in the name change, several large cities have undergone name changes (Bombay to Mumbai, Saigon to Ho Chi Minh, etc.). I support a change to Raccoon Rapids (a cooler name BTW).

Only time I was in Ho Chi Minh city, admittedly over a decade ago, nobody in the city referred to it by that name. Everybody still called it Saigon. It's easier to pronounce, anyway.


I was there in 2012 and was surprised that every local I interacted with still called it Saigon.
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana!
There are 10 types of people in the World - those that understand binary and those that don't.
 
WIederling
Posts: 9988
Joined: Sun Sep 13, 2015 2:15 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Sat Feb 13, 2021 4:12 pm

scbriml wrote:
phatfarmlines wrote:
When I clicked on this thread, I figured it was referring to that part of Minneapolis. I don't see the big deal in the name change, several large cities have undergone name changes (Bombay to Mumbai, Saigon to Ho Chi Minh, etc.). I support a change to Raccoon Rapids (a cooler name BTW).


Your cited city name changes were from Anglicised (often imperially imposed) versions to the native version.

Ho Chi Minh like Leningrrad, Karl Marx Stadt ... were "progressive" political.

Leningrad has gone back to Saint Petersburg ( actually Санкт-Петербург :-)
Karl Marx Stadt is again known as Chemnitz
Murphy is an optimist
 
Arion640
Posts: 3257
Joined: Fri Mar 31, 2017 5:15 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Sat Feb 13, 2021 4:34 pm

GDB wrote:
scbriml wrote:
Arion640 wrote:
How and when does anyone “celebrate” slave traders?


That you have to ask says more about you than it does about the "left wing extremists" you're complaining about.


Quite, someone has been drinking the Farage/Laurence Fox/Hartley-Brewer kool aid, basically wealthy (as in real elitists) who distract the to put it mildly, not well informed lower orders with all this fake culture wars BS.
It's rather like how pickpocketing teams work, one distracts by say bumping into you, while the other picks your wallet. Just a political version of that, 'look at this thing we made up, now clap for carers while we screw them over', frankly a lot of mugs over here fall for it.

How are all the 90% of fishermen who voted Leave feeling now, by all accounts mostly betrayed and if some are honest, a bit stupid.
They are just the first, most immediate, the population of N.I. coming a close second with plenty more to come.
Expect no sympathy from me if you voted for any of it.

Many people in Bristol wanted that statue not toppled, rather for years they wanted it in a museum with the context of his life, how he made his money, what he did with it.
But they were always told no.
If you actually bother to look up say the blue plaques on homes that well known people lived in, they are a wide range of people, not the leftist demons those dopey enough to believe after listening to obvious con artists, including in their imagined 'Elite' epicenter of 'that London'.

https://www.english-heritage.org.uk/vis ... e-plaques/

(A search for that well known 'Cultural Marxist' George Orwell found he lived for a time in Kentish Town, there's a reference to him also not far from me, not a plaque though, hence the choice of search).


No farage or hartley B fan here.

List as follows, could be a bit more balanced eh?

If i’d called them right wing extremists then that would be fine of course.

https://order-order.com/2021/02/10/sadi ... ommission/
 
User avatar
Kiwirob
Posts: 13392
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2005 2:16 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Sun Feb 14, 2021 11:25 am

Aaron747 wrote:
Arion640 wrote:
scbriml wrote:

And the problem is? Or are you happy to be seen to be celebrating and legitimising, for example, slave traders in the 2020s?


How and when does anyone “celebrate” slave traders? If anything they should remain to remind us of how wrong the past was.


Considering Maori are still nearly 20% of the NZ population, I can't see the harm in following their placename conventions. There's no harm in having both on a map.


Maori are about 16% of the population, many of them being whiter than me, a lot of places in NZ never had Maori names because Maori never populated them or named them.
 
User avatar
Aaron747
Posts: 14135
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 2:07 am

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Mon Feb 15, 2021 12:58 am

Kiwirob wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
Arion640 wrote:

How and when does anyone “celebrate” slave traders? If anything they should remain to remind us of how wrong the past was.


Considering Maori are still nearly 20% of the NZ population, I can't see the harm in following their placename conventions. There's no harm in having both on a map.


Maori are about 16% of the population, many of them being whiter than me, a lot of places in NZ never had Maori names because Maori never populated them or named them.


How white they are or whether they populated a specific place has nothing to do with having both names on a map. There’s nothing unreasonable about doing so.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
User avatar
Kiwirob
Posts: 13392
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2005 2:16 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:01 am

Aaron747 wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:

Considering Maori are still nearly 20% of the NZ population, I can't see the harm in following their placename conventions. There's no harm in having both on a map.


Maori are about 16% of the population, many of them being whiter than me, a lot of places in NZ never had Maori names because Maori never populated them or named them.


How white they are or whether they populated a specific place has nothing to do with having both names on a map. There’s nothing unreasonable about doing so.


There comes a point where enough is enough, it's just gotten stupid, they don't keep both on the map, the English name goes, we're now also renaming and rebranding govt departments, to names that don't mean anything except to the tiny minority of people who can read Maori.
 
LCDFlight
Posts: 947
Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2020 9:22 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Mon Feb 15, 2021 2:10 pm

af773atmsp wrote:
https://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2021/02/09/debate-arises-anew-over-whether-to-change-the-name-of-coon-rapids/

As a person who lives in the region, I've always known that the name "Coon Rapids" was referring to raccoons. However I understand that for many people, especially those outside the region, they associate the first word of the name with a racial slur. If I lived in Coon Rapids and someone from outside the area asked where I live I would definitely say "a suburb north of Minneapolis."

A name change seems pretty simple in this case. Just rename the city Raccoon Rapids.


How about Nugent Rapids?
 
User avatar
Aaron747
Posts: 14135
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 2:07 am

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Mon Feb 15, 2021 2:17 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:

Maori are about 16% of the population, many of them being whiter than me, a lot of places in NZ never had Maori names because Maori never populated them or named them.


How white they are or whether they populated a specific place has nothing to do with having both names on a map. There’s nothing unreasonable about doing so.


There comes a point where enough is enough, it's just gotten stupid, they don't keep both on the map, the English name goes, we're now also renaming and rebranding govt departments, to names that don't mean anything except to the tiny minority of people who can read Maori.


Arroyo Grande and Rancho Palos Verdes don't mean much to the white folks who settled California, yet we kept the names anyway. It's really not a big deal - they were there first.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
User avatar
DarkSnowyNight
Posts: 2824
Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2012 7:59 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Mon Feb 15, 2021 4:05 pm

Aaron747 wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:

How white they are or whether they populated a specific place has nothing to do with having both names on a map. There’s nothing unreasonable about doing so.


There comes a point where enough is enough, it's just gotten stupid, they don't keep both on the map, the English name goes, we're now also renaming and rebranding govt departments, to names that don't mean anything except to the tiny minority of people who can read Maori.


Arroyo Grande and Rancho Palos Verdes don't mean much to the white folks who settled California, yet we kept the names anyway. It's really not a big deal - they were there first.



Ah yes, Rancho Palos Verdes. That is Spanish for "Don't you dare call it Torrance!"
Well, you know what they say. Whatever doesn't kill you...
... Must not be an MD-11.
 
GalaxyFlyer
Posts: 7463
Joined: Fri Jan 01, 2016 4:44 am

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Mon Feb 15, 2021 6:37 pm

None Dare Call It McCarthyism
 
User avatar
stl07
Posts: 2722
Joined: Mon May 01, 2017 8:57 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Mon Feb 15, 2021 7:11 pm

My best friend is from coon rapids so I asked about this. They said they know why the name is controversial now but growing up they never thought about it that way. They are completely open to a name change
Instead of typing in "mods", consider using the report function.
Love how every "travel blogger" says they will never fly AA/Ethihad again and then says it again and again on subsequent flights.
 
User avatar
NWAESC
Posts: 1691
Joined: Thu Aug 30, 2007 1:02 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Mon Feb 15, 2021 8:37 pm

phatfarmlines wrote:
Interesting list of renamed places in the U.S. per Wikipedia:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_r ... ted_States

Though I don't see an entry for Tysons, Virginia, formerly known as Tyson's Corner in NOVA. I still (and will continue to) refer it as Tyson's Corner.


I didn't realize it had changed! When'd that happen (and why)?
"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
 
User avatar
cjg225
Posts: 2133
Joined: Sun Feb 24, 2013 8:59 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Mon Feb 15, 2021 11:16 pm

phatfarmlines wrote:
Though I don't see an entry for Tysons, Virginia, formerly known as Tyson's Corner in NOVA. I still (and will continue to) refer it as Tyson's Corner.

Why did that name change....?

I used to go there once a week when I worked for a defense consulting firm based there.
Restoring Penn State's transportation heritage...
 
phatfarmlines
Posts: 1786
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2001 12:06 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Sat Feb 27, 2021 2:55 am

Another interesting name change.

The town of F**king, Austria officially changed its name to Fugging on New Year's Day.

Fugging, Upper Austria (Source: Wikipedia)
 
User avatar
seb146
Posts: 23491
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Sun Feb 28, 2021 1:46 am

I don't understand why we have to be offended that there is white privilege. The name is offensive because of it's racist roots. Acknowledge it, change it, and move on. There are more than just the whites who live in this country.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
TSS
Posts: 3738
Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2006 3:52 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Mon Mar 01, 2021 6:04 am

seb146 wrote:
I don't understand why we have to be offended that there is white privilege.


Because the term "white privilege" is racism itself, pure and simple. Here's a quick & easy, no-fail test for racism: In any phrase or sentence containing the word "white", replace that word with "black" and imagine if you'd get negative reactions or pushback for saying it out loud in a mixed crowd. If you suspect you would, then the phrase or sentence is racist.

seb146 wrote:
The name is offensive because of it's racist roots. Acknowledge it, change it, and move on.


I'm guessing you didn't read the linked article in the first post of this thread. In that article it states "In the 1800s, Coon Rapids was known as a place where land owners would hunt raccoons. Historians assume that is where where the city’s name derives from, but in more recent times, the name has been criticized." I'm guessing the criticism is coming from people who have no idea what a raccoon is.

This is a raccoon-

Image

More on raccoons- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raccoon

The colloquial term for a raccoon is "coon", similar to how the colloquial term for opossum is "possum".

seb146 wrote:
There are more than just the whites who live in this country.


True, but in this instance that is a moot point because the area was named after a furry woodland creature once found there in abundance with no racial connotations whatsoever.
Able to kill active threads stone dead with a single post!
 
User avatar
Aaron747
Posts: 14135
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 2:07 am

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Mon Mar 01, 2021 6:29 am

TSS wrote:
seb146 wrote:
I don't understand why we have to be offended that there is white privilege.


Because the term "white privilege" is racism itself, pure and simple. Here's a quick & easy, no-fail test for racism: In any phrase or sentence containing the word "white", replace that word with "black" and imagine if you'd get negative reactions or pushback for saying it out loud in a mixed crowd. If you suspect you would, then the phrase or sentence is racist.


Wow, that's a real head scratcher. :sarcastic: So instead of dealing with the fact something exists, you want to do logical handstands. Let's explain this like a five year-old is in the room:

Describing people as 'black' or 'Asian' is not inherently racist, they're accepted descriptors. Describing someone as 'white' is no different.

'White privilege' is a descriptor for situations in society where white people can often benefit from rules and/or systems they enacted. By benefit, it means NOT experiencing the same negative outcomes in some cases where some non-white people would. This is called a 'double standard'. As an example, if two people of the same employment and general disposition are treated differently by a mortgage lender or law enforcement merely because one is white and one is not, that's called 'white privilege'. Do you understand? Another example: my grandparents were turned down from six mortgage applications in the early 1960s in the San Jose area due to their Spanish family name (ironic, huh?). My grandfather's coworker had the last name 'Hart', made less money than him, had a criminal record, and still got approved quickly. That's called 'white privilege'.

Benefiting from white privilege does not necessarily mean you're a bad person, had a hand in its creation, or anything else, it simply means that society still has work to do. Refusing to acknowledge it's a thing or that people are impacted by it, only prolongs the situation. Being offended by the mention of its existence suggests you're less motivated by solutions and more by unspoken grievances.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
User avatar
seb146
Posts: 23491
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Mon Mar 01, 2021 6:49 am

TSS wrote:
seb146 wrote:
I don't understand why we have to be offended that there is white privilege.


Because the term "white privilege" is racism itself, pure and simple. Here's a quick & easy, no-fail test for racism: In any phrase or sentence containing the word "white", replace that word with "black" and imagine if you'd get negative reactions or pushback for saying it out loud in a mixed crowd. If you suspect you would, then the phrase or sentence is racist.


The history books are written by the winners. Those who say "but... wait... what about OUR story...." are told they are being whiners and don't know what they are talking about and their view of history is not right and how dare they challenge the view and they are "cancel culture" and so on and so forth.

In 1492, Columbus sailed the ocean blue.... is "white privilege" since we whites do not talk about the rape and genocide of Columbus and his crew. The landing at Plymouth Rock and the "first Thanksgiving" are peaceful as told by us Whites but the resulting genocide and disease killing who knows how many Natives are not talked about. Not to mention the rapes and murders of Natives and Africans forced into hard labor. And, we can't talk about Brionna Taylor, George Floyd, Tamir Rice, Andy Lopez, Standing Rock, Selma, AL, Central Park Five, Emmett Till, Tulsa........

But, yeah, "white privilege" is totally racist....
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
User avatar
Braybuddy
Posts: 6911
Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2004 8:14 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Mon Mar 01, 2021 8:45 am

Aaron747 wrote:
'White privilege' is a descriptor for situations in society where white people can often benefit from rules and/or systems they enacted. By benefit, it means NOT experiencing the same negative outcomes in some cases where some non-white people would. This is called a 'double standard'. As an example, if two people of the same employment and general disposition are treated differently by a mortgage lender or law enforcement merely because one is white and one is not, that's called 'white privilege'. Do you understand? Another example: my grandparents were turned down from six mortgage applications in the early 1960s in the San Jose area due to their Spanish family name (ironic, huh?). My grandfather's coworker had the last name 'Hart', made less money than him, had a criminal record, and still got approved quickly. That's called 'white privilege'.

Out of curiosity, do the same standards apply when someone who is non-white gets preferential treatment because they belong to a minority?
 
User avatar
Aaron747
Posts: 14135
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 2:07 am

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Mon Mar 01, 2021 9:23 am

Braybuddy wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
'White privilege' is a descriptor for situations in society where white people can often benefit from rules and/or systems they enacted. By benefit, it means NOT experiencing the same negative outcomes in some cases where some non-white people would. This is called a 'double standard'. As an example, if two people of the same employment and general disposition are treated differently by a mortgage lender or law enforcement merely because one is white and one is not, that's called 'white privilege'. Do you understand? Another example: my grandparents were turned down from six mortgage applications in the early 1960s in the San Jose area due to their Spanish family name (ironic, huh?). My grandfather's coworker had the last name 'Hart', made less money than him, had a criminal record, and still got approved quickly. That's called 'white privilege'.

Out of curiosity, do the same standards apply when someone who is non-white gets preferential treatment because they belong to a minority?


Of course. In the HR business, there are still many strides being made in this area, often to mitigate the overreach affirmative action brought upon some industries where it was implemented. Nobody should receive job offers or legal reprieve they are not eligible for. DE&I measures give organizations tools to foment a welcoming atmosphere for all.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
af773atmsp
Topic Author
Posts: 2443
Joined: Mon Aug 28, 2006 1:37 am

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Mon Mar 01, 2021 1:04 pm

TSS wrote:
seb146 wrote:
I don't understand why we have to be offended that there is white privilege.


Because the term "white privilege" is racism itself, pure and simple. Here's a quick & easy, no-fail test for racism: In any phrase or sentence containing the word "white", replace that word with "black" and imagine if you'd get negative reactions or pushback for saying it out loud in a mixed crowd. If you suspect you would, then the phrase or sentence is racist.

seb146 wrote:
The name is offensive because of it's racist roots. Acknowledge it, change it, and move on.


I'm guessing you didn't read the linked article in the first post of this thread. In that article it states "In the 1800s, Coon Rapids was known as a place where land owners would hunt raccoons. Historians assume that is where where the city’s name derives from, but in more recent times, the name has been criticized." I'm guessing the criticism is coming from people who have no idea what a raccoon is.

This is a raccoon-

Image

More on raccoons- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raccoon

The colloquial term for a raccoon is "coon", similar to how the colloquial term for opossum is "possum".

seb146 wrote:
There are more than just the whites who live in this country.


True, but in this instance that is a moot point because the area was named after a furry woodland creature once found there in abundance with no racial connotations whatsoever.


You seem to be ignoring the fact that "coon" can also be used as a racial slur, and the fact that changing the name of the suburb would be very easy while still keeping the heritage of what the original name referenced.
DC10-40,MD88,A319,A320,A332,717,722,733,737,738,752,ATR-72,736,788,74M
SY,DL,FI,FL,BA,EI,NW,MG,DY,EZY,F9,WN,SN,ET,SK,KL,B6
Too many airports to fit in signature.
 
User avatar
Tugger
Posts: 11230
Joined: Tue Apr 18, 2006 8:38 am

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Mon Mar 01, 2021 2:44 pm

My god people, some are debating this? It's "Racoon Rapids" that is what the place is really named for and there is no argument on that. Just call it that and let anyone call it whatever they want after. There is not reason to not do that.

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. - W. Shatner
There are many kinds of sentences that we think state facts about the world but that are really just expressions of our attitudes. - F. Ramsey
 
User avatar
T18
Posts: 764
Joined: Sat Jan 31, 2009 12:28 am

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Mon Mar 01, 2021 2:59 pm

I think we need to proverbially cut the child in half here. Therefore I propose the a name of Garbage Rapids, that way everyone can hate the name equally. Or yeah just add the Ra to it. Although I'm sure Peta will get mad at some point....
“Racing's important to men who do it well. When you're racing, it's life. Anything that happens before or after is just waiting.” ― Steve McQueen (Le Mans) 1971
 
User avatar
NWAESC
Posts: 1691
Joined: Thu Aug 30, 2007 1:02 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Mon Mar 01, 2021 4:48 pm

"Trash Panda Town" has a nice ring to it.
"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
 
TSS
Posts: 3738
Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2006 3:52 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Mon Mar 01, 2021 8:05 pm

Tugger wrote:
My god people, some are debating this? It's "Racoon Rapids" that is what the place is really named for and there is no argument on that. Just call it that and let anyone call it whatever they want after. There is not reason to not do that.


There you go again, trying to inject logic and rationality into a heated, (over)emotional debate.

T18 wrote:
I think we need to proverbially cut the child in half here. Therefore I propose the a name of Garbage Rapids, that way everyone can hate the name equally. Or yeah just add the Ra to it. Although I'm sure Peta will get mad at some point....


In my earlier post I started to touch on the patently insane but nonetheless a thing "speciesist" aspect of the name, but I decided to let someone else bring that up. Nobody asked the raccoons if it was okay to use their nickname as part of the name of a suburb, and they have not been paid royalties from the sale of homes there.

NWAESC wrote:
"Trash Panda Town" has a nice ring to it.


It does indeed! That's still "speciesist" though, and a slur against the noble raccoon. I suggest they go full affirmative action and rename the suburb either Honkey Heights or possibly Cracker Cove to atone for past perceived but wholly unintentional misdeeds of the nomenclature variety.
Able to kill active threads stone dead with a single post!
 
User avatar
Braybuddy
Posts: 6911
Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2004 8:14 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Tue Mar 02, 2021 8:28 am

Aaron747 wrote:
Of course. In the HR business, there are still many strides being made in this area, often to mitigate the overreach affirmative action brought upon some industries where it was implemented. Nobody should receive job offers or legal reprieve they are not eligible for. DE&I measures give organizations tools to foment a welcoming atmosphere for all.

I'm not so much thinking of employment, more on a social level. I think it's pretty-much a given that any negative depiction of minorities is socially unacceptable nowadays, which, by its nature, means these minorities have their own privilege too.
 
User avatar
Aaron747
Posts: 14135
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 2:07 am

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Tue Mar 02, 2021 9:00 am

Braybuddy wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
Of course. In the HR business, there are still many strides being made in this area, often to mitigate the overreach affirmative action brought upon some industries where it was implemented. Nobody should receive job offers or legal reprieve they are not eligible for. DE&I measures give organizations tools to foment a welcoming atmosphere for all.

I'm not so much thinking of employment, more on a social level. I think it's pretty-much a given that any negative depiction of minorities is socially unacceptable nowadays, which, by its nature, means these minorities have their own privilege too.


We're talking about *actual* preferential treatment, not how people's opinions are regarded. Opinions are like assholes, as the old saying goes...
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
User avatar
Braybuddy
Posts: 6911
Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2004 8:14 pm

Re: Debate over Changing Name of Minnesota Suburb

Tue Mar 02, 2021 4:54 pm

Aaron747 wrote:
We're talking about *actual* preferential treatment, not how people's opinions are regarded. Opinions are like assholes, as the old saying goes...

Fair enough, we're talking about different aspects of privilege, though it now seems to be measured in many different ways.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Aaron747, AirbusCheerlead, casinterest, Electra, JJJ, petertenthije, Virtual737 and 60 guests

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos