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1337Delta764
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Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Tue Feb 23, 2021 10:47 pm

https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/th ... d=msedgdhp

It looks like Oshkosh Defense has won the contract to build the USPS' next generation delivery vehicles, replacing the Grumman LLV fleet. The new fleet will be a mix of internal combustion engines and battery electric engines, will have more room for packages, and will include heating/air conditioning as well as some other high-tech features.
 
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Tue Feb 23, 2021 11:39 pm

Good, a USA based company, with experience with making vehicles for the US Military and specialized commercial vehicles. Other competitors included a company based in Turkey, which of course that wasn't going to happen and another based in a former GM plant in Lordstown, OH lost out.
 
NIKV69
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Tue Feb 23, 2021 11:47 pm

Great but I think the USPS shortcoming are more human than mechanical.
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Tugger
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 12:48 am

And this is the winner apparently:
Image
https://www.theverge.com/2021/2/23/2229 ... -workhorse

NIKV69 wrote:
Great but I think the USPS shortcoming are more human than mechanical.

If by "people" you mean congressional then I agree.

If they were left to run as the independent institution they are supposed to be they wouldn't have the big a problem they have. They could raise rates or cut days as needed and would need to be competitive still.

Tugg
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Aesma
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 1:30 am

Why are military contractors involved in this (the previous one too), that seems a good way to pay 10 times more than necessary ? Why not look at what Amazon is doing ?
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
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1337Delta764
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 2:07 am

Aesma wrote:
Why are military contractors involved in this (the previous one too), that seems a good way to pay 10 times more than necessary ? Why not look at what Amazon is doing ?


Well, the requirements for the USPS are for RHD vehicles to easily access mailboxes on the curbside and be made in the USA. As far as I know there is no such off-the-shelf solution that is manufactured domestically.
 
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 3:19 am

1337Delta764 wrote:
Well, the requirements for the USPS are for RHD vehicles to easily access mailboxes on the curbside and be made in the USA. As far as I know there is no such off-the-shelf solution that is manufactured domestically.

Most major manufacturers have a RHD van design and setting up manufacturing in the USA wouldn't be hard as most have plants here already so know the ropes.

However, they didn't participate or bid so you have to deal with the ones that did. Finally, there are complexities to US FAR contracting that Oshkosh knows better than most. Sooo... Winner.

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. - W. Shatner
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Aesma
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 4:21 am

Amazon is getting tailor made vans, UPS too.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 4:25 am

Aesma wrote:
Amazon is getting tailor made vans, UPS too.


I wish Amazon took over the USPS believe me!
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JBo
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 4:52 am

1337Delta764 wrote:
Aesma wrote:
Why are military contractors involved in this (the previous one too), that seems a good way to pay 10 times more than necessary ? Why not look at what Amazon is doing ?


Well, the requirements for the USPS are for RHD vehicles to easily access mailboxes on the curbside and be made in the USA. As far as I know there is no such off-the-shelf solution that is manufactured domestically.


The first prototype from Oshkosh was designed and built in partnership with Ford and was based on the Transit. Looks like this version was designed fully in-house and might be a bit smaller than the Transit-based prototype.
I'd take the awe of understanding over the awe of ignorance any day.
 
slider
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 2:18 pm

Pardon my ignorance here, but isn't a production vehicle cheaper?

Assuming such a solution exists, you'd think they could have modification packages engineered to simply mod a current platform (or build off the line with said requirements) and it would be far more cost effective. I saw the features from that link, but even RHD isn't a showstopper.
 
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 2:38 pm

Is the ability to access mailboxes without getting out a major issue?.
 
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JBo
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 2:43 pm

slider wrote:
Pardon my ignorance here, but isn't a production vehicle cheaper?

Assuming such a solution exists, you'd think they could have modification packages engineered to simply mod a current platform (or build off the line with said requirements) and it would be far more cost effective. I saw the features from that link, but even RHD isn't a showstopper.


Cargo capacity and maneuverability are two big considerations. The LLV was designed to have a small footprint and turning radius. The Oshkosh design looks a bit larger, but mailbox accessibility might be an issue with production vehicles.

Also, I think USPS wants to have a dedicated production line so to replace the current fleet as quickly as possible. I'm not sure Ford, GM, or FCA would have that capacity. Plus, they didn't bid.
I'd take the awe of understanding over the awe of ignorance any day.
 
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casinterest
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 2:46 pm

This Contract indicates an area where the USPS is going to cost more and be less effective. I agree with the other posters that a production vehicle adapted for RHD would be much more cheaper than a Made in the USA under government contracts will be . We still have rural mail carriers using their own transportation and switching sides of the road to drop off mail for goodness sake.

However, since Oshkosh provides a lot of heavier duty military grade equipment, perhaps there is a unknown tradeoff here. More likely political money and donations are at work though.

I see Amazon and UPS eating USPS's lunch on this one. Especially in terms of package delivery.


//edit--- There is speculations that Ford may get the engine contract.
Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did..So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.--Mark Twain
 
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 3:08 pm

Maybe these can be used to repel a Soviet invasion ? Or Nazis from the other side of the Moon ?

Dumb question but from what I see in the US (on TV, or when I visit), there are often cars parked on the streets, so how does that work to deliver mail without stepping off the vehicle ?

Here in my French suburb mail is delivered by bicycle (now with electric assist) or 3-wheeled electric scooter for more mail capacity. More maneuverable than a truck. Packages are delivered separately by vans.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
Okie
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 3:16 pm

bennett123 wrote:
Is the ability to access mailboxes without getting out a major issue?.


Yes. Only some older urban areas of OKC still have front door delivery. Mail delivery has shifted to street side targets for cell phone distracted drivers.

casinterest wrote:
However, since Oshkosh provides a lot of heavier duty military grade equipment, perhaps there is a unknown tradeoff here. More likely political money and donations are at work though.


Sure there is, the process for replacement started clear back during the Obama administration, 2015 to be exact, sort of went on hold for about 4 years.

casinterest wrote:
//edit--- There is speculations that Ford may get the engine contract.


Going to have a tough time beating the old "GM Iron Duke" four cylinder with a Blue Oval Exploder.
Do you think Ford will have radios installed that mimics the distinctive sound of the old iron duke like the Mustang' radio mimics the sound of a high performance motor? :P

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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 3:39 pm

Aesma wrote:
Maybe these can be used to repel a Soviet invasion ? Or Nazis from the other side of the Moon ?

Dumb question but from what I see in the US (on TV, or when I visit), there are often cars parked on the streets, so how does that work to deliver mail without stepping off the vehicle ?

Here in my French suburb mail is delivered by bicycle (now with electric assist) or 3-wheeled electric scooter for more mail capacity. More maneuverable than a truck. Packages are delivered separately by vans.


There is much more to the US than urban areas where people park on the side of the street...
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alberchico
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 3:52 pm

I would love love to know what the exact breakdown is between the electric and conventional trucks in terms of number ordered. I wonder if not committing to an all electric fleet would was a mistake. The technology is available right now. For the routes that they serve range certainly can't be that big of an issue. Perhaps for some rural areas a conventional truck with longer range would be prudent but in a city like NYC the fleet could easily be all electric.

https://electrek.co/2021/02/23/usps-pos ... -electric/
Last edited by alberchico on Wed Feb 24, 2021 3:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 3:56 pm

Okie

You may be surprised to hear that in the UK that most items are posted through the letter box.

If it is too big, the Postman will knock on your door.

If there is no answer then they leave a card and you collect it from the depot.

Alternatively, some courier firms will leave it in your back garden or with a neighbour.
 
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 4:03 pm

bennett123 wrote:
Okie

You may be surprised to hear that in the UK that most items are posted through the letter box.

If it is too big, the Postman will knock on your door.

If there is no answer then they leave a card and you collect it from the depot.

Alternatively, some courier firms will leave it in your back garden or with a neighbour.


Karen phones me and asks what she should do, she lives next door to my parents (1 mile by road on her way home) So i often pick up my parcels from them. :lol:

Fred
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 5:36 pm

alberchico wrote:
I would love love to know what the exact breakdown is between the electric and conventional trucks in terms of number ordered. I wonder if not committing to an all electric fleet would was a mistake. The technology is available right now. For the routes that they serve range certainly can't be that big of an issue. Perhaps for some rural areas a conventional truck with longer range would be prudent but in a city like NYC the fleet could easily be all electric.

https://electrek.co/2021/02/23/usps-pos ... -electric/


I’d like to know can all-electric vehicle that size operate with heat or AC for eight hours in one charge? That might be the short pole in the tent.
 
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1337Delta764
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 5:56 pm

casinterest wrote:
I see Amazon and UPS eating USPS's lunch on this one. Especially in terms of package delivery.

.


UPS vehicles are not off-the-shelf, they are custom made for UPS, and are never resold to the public. FedEx on the other hand uses off-the-shelf vehicles.
 
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 7:39 pm

1337Delta764 wrote:
casinterest wrote:
I see Amazon and UPS eating USPS's lunch on this one. Especially in terms of package delivery.

.


UPS vehicles are not off-the-shelf, they are custom made for UPS, and are never resold to the public. FedEx on the other hand uses off-the-shelf vehicles.


UPS uses some off-the-shelf vehicles in certain areas, but when they do they strip off all manufacturer branding and nameplates.
I'd take the awe of understanding over the awe of ignorance any day.
 
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 8:07 pm

NIKV69 wrote:
Aesma wrote:
Amazon is getting tailor made vans, UPS too.


I wish Amazon took over the USPS believe me!

No you don't. Not if you actually thought about it.

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. - W. Shatner
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Tugger
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 8:16 pm

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
I’d like to know can all-electric vehicle that size operate with heat or AC for eight hours in one charge? That might be the short pole in the tent.

Ummm.. The Tesla Model S can do that.

Not saying the Model S is good for this task but it can be done. Just depends on the size of the battery. (And I guarantee you Telsa would LOVE a nice fat government contract for a large battery pack. They only need to develop more supply sources to meet all production needs.)

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. - W. Shatner
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casinterest
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 8:17 pm

1337Delta764 wrote:
casinterest wrote:
I see Amazon and UPS eating USPS's lunch on this one. Especially in terms of package delivery.

.


UPS vehicles are not off-the-shelf, they are custom made for UPS, and are never resold to the public. FedEx on the other hand uses off-the-shelf vehicles.


It's an economy of scale item though. UPS has always been packaging. and they are a private company concerned with costs.
The USPS is not private, and sometimes relies a bit to much on Government procurement.
Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did..So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.--Mark Twain
 
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 8:55 pm

Having a military contractor design and build these vehicles is a good idea. Rural areas need a heavy duty vehicle. Some places still have unpaved and poorly maintained roads. A military based vehicle would be good for those.
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1337Delta764
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Feb 24, 2021 10:06 pm

JBo wrote:
1337Delta764 wrote:
casinterest wrote:
I see Amazon and UPS eating USPS's lunch on this one. Especially in terms of package delivery.

.


UPS vehicles are not off-the-shelf, they are custom made for UPS, and are never resold to the public. FedEx on the other hand uses off-the-shelf vehicles.


UPS uses some off-the-shelf vehicles in certain areas, but when they do they strip off all manufacturer branding and nameplates.


And also, due to the shortage of LLVs, the USPS has bought several Ram Promaster and Mercedes-Benz Metris vans. For the latter, the USPS has replaced the Mercedes Star emblem with a USPS Eagle.
 
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Thu Feb 25, 2021 3:11 am

1337Delta764 wrote:
Aesma wrote:
Why are military contractors involved in this (the previous one too), that seems a good way to pay 10 times more than necessary ? Why not look at what Amazon is doing ?


Well, the requirements for the USPS are for RHD vehicles to easily access mailboxes on the curbside and be made in the USA. As far as I know there is no such off-the-shelf solution that is manufactured domestically.


From the article you posted in the OP, there is an article explaining why the product looks so strange and in that article, they also go into some of the requirements the USPS has. https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/enthusi ... d=msedgdhp

As far as I know, nobody except the USPS and the resident at the address are legally permitted to go into a mailbox. Among other things, there are national standards about how high a mailbox is and how far it is to be from the curb and the vehicles are designed around these standards.
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Fri Feb 26, 2021 4:57 pm

https://electrek.co/2021/02/25/postmast ... -electric/

So only 10% of the fleet will be electric at first. Didn't Biden promise that most future purchases of government vehicles would be electric ? This looks like a huge missed opportunity. Even though the USPS claims that vehicles with conventional engines could be converted over to electric at some point in the future I just don't see that happening.
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casinterest
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Fri Feb 26, 2021 5:05 pm

alberchico wrote:
https://electrek.co/2021/02/25/postmaster-general-commits-to-only-10-of-new-usps-fleet-going-fully-electric/

So only 10% of the fleet will be electric at first. Didn't Biden promise that most future purchases of government vehicles would be electric ? This looks like a huge missed opportunity. Even though the USPS claims that vehicles with conventional engines could be converted over to electric at some point in the future I just don't see that happening.


There were no promises of how much.

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/25/biden-p ... icles.html


10% is quite a bit, but i expect as time goes on it will increase.
Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did..So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.--Mark Twain
 
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Aesma
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Fri Feb 26, 2021 6:05 pm

Biden has no power over the USPS from my understanding.
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luckyone
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Fri Feb 26, 2021 6:27 pm

casinterest wrote:
alberchico wrote:
https://electrek.co/2021/02/25/postmaster-general-commits-to-only-10-of-new-usps-fleet-going-fully-electric/

So only 10% of the fleet will be electric at first. Didn't Biden promise that most future purchases of government vehicles would be electric ? This looks like a huge missed opportunity. Even though the USPS claims that vehicles with conventional engines could be converted over to electric at some point in the future I just don't see that happening.


There were no promises of how much.

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/25/biden-p ... icles.html


10% is quite a bit, but i expect as time goes on it will increase.

The vehicle also has the capability of being converted to electric propulsion.
 
Sokes
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Mar 03, 2021 2:55 am

A postal car has to accelerate/ break all the time. Is there any better application for a battery car?
Why can't the world be a little bit more autistic?
 
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JBo
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Mar 03, 2021 10:35 pm

Aesma wrote:
Biden has no power over the USPS from my understanding.


The President can replace/appoint the Postmaster General, but that's about all the authority he has.
I'd take the awe of understanding over the awe of ignorance any day.
 
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Moose135
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Wed Mar 03, 2021 10:52 pm

JBo wrote:
Aesma wrote:
Biden has no power over the USPS from my understanding.


The President can replace/appoint the Postmaster General, but that's about all the authority he has.


Actually, he can only appoint members to the Board of Governors, who in turn, select the Postmaster General. If he had the power to replace the PG, the current occupant of that position would have been shown the door on January 21.
KC-135 - Passing gas and taking names!
 
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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Thu Mar 04, 2021 12:39 am

For the conventional trucks, which engine and transmission won? Oshkosh always uses (modified) off the shelf.

The cameras are past due as well as airbag.

Am I the only one who likes unique mail trucks?

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Re: Oshkosh wins USPS Next Generation Delivery Vehicle Contract

Thu Mar 04, 2021 3:23 pm

36 replies and no one asked if the trucks will be pink?

Hmmm.
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