Moderators: richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
MaverickM11
Topic Author
Posts: 18546
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Wed Feb 24, 2021 3:08 pm

'Fraid that ship has sailed but it's good to see someone acknowledging the problem:

"It's very important for us to ignore the temptation to look away," Cheney said. "And it's very important, especially for us as Republicans, to make clear that we aren't the party of white supremacy.

"You certainly saw anti-Semitism. You saw the symbols of Holocaust denial... you saw a Confederate flag being carried through the rotunda," she said, referencing the January 6 assault on the U.S. Capitol. "We, as Republicans in particular, have a duty and an obligation to stand against that, to stand against insurrection."

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/liz-cheney ... supremacy/
Last edited by MaverickM11 on Wed Feb 24, 2021 3:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
I don't take responsibility at all
 
User avatar
Aesma
Posts: 14085
Joined: Sat Nov 14, 2009 6:14 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP must make clear "we aren't the party of white supremacy"

Wed Feb 24, 2021 3:16 pm

Isn't she being censored by several GOP legislatures ? There is no we in GOP...
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
User avatar
Aaron747
Posts: 14055
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 2:07 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP must make clear "we aren't the party of white supremacy"

Wed Feb 24, 2021 3:17 pm

Cheney is trying to tickle the toes of the rabid Trumpist crowd that is still hinging on every word from Q, Alex Jones, Laura Ingraham and Tucker Carlson.

According to the latter two, there's no such thing as white supremacy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LZHEFOBI1z4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CAXZK1nxuFI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=07gsqCwFZMc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qkP1SX8u7sQ

Oh look who Ingraham invites on her show - Stephen Miller. Wonderful.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-duNMNE1mw
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
NIKV69
Posts: 14214
Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2004 4:27 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Wed Feb 24, 2021 4:15 pm

The people carrying Confederate flags on Jan 6th are such a small % of the Republican party but the media will spin it. Doesn't really matter. The middle of the electorate will decide elections since they don't listen to this toxic rhetoric.
90 Day Fiancé has taught me that Russian woman are excellent.
 
User avatar
Aaron747
Posts: 14055
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 2:07 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Wed Feb 24, 2021 4:17 pm

NIKV69 wrote:
The people carrying Confederate flags on Jan 6th are such a small % of the Republican party but the media will spin it. Doesn't really matter. The middle of the electorate will decide elections since they don't listen to this toxic rhetoric.


You can say that easily because we live on the coasts.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
frmrCapCadet
Posts: 4741
Joined: Thu May 29, 2008 8:24 pm

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Wed Feb 24, 2021 4:48 pm

The problem for now is that the Republicans cannot win general elections without white nationalists, racists, neo-fascists, anti-science, and other 'know nothings'. It is compounded by the extreme right wing voters almost totally controls primary voting and reject anyone who makes any moves toward being center right. There is no center right party now. We need one.
Buffet: the airline business...has eaten up capital...like..no other (business)
 
MaverickM11
Topic Author
Posts: 18546
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Wed Feb 24, 2021 5:09 pm

NIKV69 wrote:
The people carrying Confederate flags on Jan 6th are such a small % of the Republican party but the media will spin it. Doesn't really matter. The middle of the electorate will decide elections since they don't listen to this toxic rhetoric.

You've clearly never driven anywhere in the south
I don't take responsibility at all
 
afcjets
Posts: 3616
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2015 6:20 pm

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Wed Feb 24, 2021 6:09 pm

NIKV69 wrote:
The people carrying Confederate flags on Jan 6th are such a small % of the Republican party but the media will spin it. Doesn't really matter. The middle of the electorate will decide elections since they don't listen to this toxic rhetoric.


Which is why she needs to go. You're never going to win being on the defensive of the Hypocrats, which is where they always put you, and too many ineffective Republicans fall for it every time.


MaverickM11 wrote:
You've clearly never driven anywhere in the south


You might see a few confederate flags and bumper stickers in some areas, but race relations for the most part are much better in the south and red states. In my experience, people get along with their neighbors, are friendlier, more likely to talk to strangers (black or white) and for the most part live harmoniously together. They also don't riot and destroy their cities and urban areas.
 
afcjets
Posts: 3616
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2015 6:20 pm

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Wed Feb 24, 2021 6:14 pm

frmrCapCadet wrote:
The problem for now is that the Republicans cannot win general elections without white nationalists, racists, neo-fascists, anti-science, and other 'know nothings'


Of course not when you label all of them racists anyways.
 
MaverickM11
Topic Author
Posts: 18546
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Wed Feb 24, 2021 6:18 pm

afcjets wrote:
You might see a few confederate flags and bumper stickers in some areas, but race relations for the most part are much better in the south and red states. In my experience, people get along with their neighbors, are friendlier, more likely to talk to strangers (black or white) and for the most part live harmoniously together. They also don't riot and destroy their cities and urban areas.

What's it like not living in reality and making everything up? :roll:
I don't take responsibility at all
 
apodino
Posts: 4063
Joined: Mon Apr 04, 2005 2:11 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Wed Feb 24, 2021 7:09 pm

There are plenty of minorities in the Republican party who would be great in office. I know this goes against GOP orthodoxy but maybe run more and more of these candidates next election cycle. Some guys I could see.

1. Hershel Walker - This guy spoke for Trump at the GOP convention, and if he were to run in Georgia against Rafael Warnock, he would be hard to beat.
2. Lynn Swann - Unsuccessfully ran for Governor of PA, but could win a Senate race in PA and has great name recognition, especially in Pittsburgh.
3. Jeanean Hampton - Was the first ever Black woman to win a statewide election in the South. Even though she was Lt. Governor in KY under a toxic Bevin, she distanced herself from him in the latter days of the administration, and I think could be a formidable challenge to Bashear.
4. Allan West - This guy is controversial, but has held office before.
5. Nikki Haley - Probably wont see her until 2024. Probably has the most name recognition of any Minority in the GOP right now.
 
cpd
Posts: 6715
Joined: Sat Jun 28, 2008 4:46 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Wed Feb 24, 2021 7:13 pm

afcjets wrote:
frmrCapCadet wrote:
The problem for now is that the Republicans cannot win general elections without white nationalists, racists, neo-fascists, anti-science, and other 'know nothings'


Of course not when you label all of them racists anyways.


Isn’t that the same as republicans labelling everyone else as socialists, “limousine leftists” (that from a post here a few days ago) or other various terms?

I’ll happily fire up that a.net search engine and drown you in examples of that.

If the Republican Party doesn’t want to be hit with those criticisms and names then perhaps it could disown the interesting characters and become a traditional Conservative party...
 
SL1200MK2
Posts: 182
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2008 11:00 pm

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Wed Feb 24, 2021 7:58 pm

NIKV69 wrote:
The people carrying Confederate flags on Jan 6th are such a small % of the Republican party but the media will spin it. Doesn't really matter. The middle of the electorate will decide elections since they don't listen to this toxic rhetoric.


Ignoring the fact of the actual percentage of racists and nazis within the republican party, I am curious as to why this is the party that they go towards. While I am sure its possible, I've never met a racist that votes democrat. In the end, I believe one can say that not all republicans are racists but can confidently say that all racists are republicans. Further, why would Cheney say such things? Why would she needlessly hurt her party's image with something that's simply not true? Unless there is some sort of secret racist democrat population, I think one could say that the GOP is certainly risking being the party of white supremacy. What other party would it be?
 
User avatar
casinterest
Posts: 13102
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 5:30 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Wed Feb 24, 2021 8:14 pm

The GOP tent is big enough that they have made a big home for White Supremacists.
Those that have never driven through the rural or suburban areas of many states do not realize how pervasive this line of thought is.

https://www.americanprogress.org/issues ... -politics/

For a starting point, one must look no further than President Donald Trump’s senior adviser for policy and chief speechwriter, Stephen Miller.

In December 2019, the Southern Poverty Law Center’s Hatewatch published a cache of more than 900 emails2 Miller wrote to his contacts at Breitbart News before the 2016 presidential election. Miller, who began his role in the Trump administration in 2017, is widely considered the president’s most ideologically extreme and bureaucratically effective adviser. Miller has been careful not to talk openly about his political views, so this correspondence proved to be revealing.

SUBSCRIBE TO INPROGRESS

In the emails, Miller, an adviser to the Trump campaign at the time, advocated many of the most extreme white supremacist concepts. These included the “great replacement” theory, fears of white genocide through immigration, race science, and eugenics; he also linked immigrants with crime, glorified the Confederacy, and promoted the genocidal book, The Camp of the Saints, as a roadmap for U.S. policy. Anti-Semitism was the only missing white nationalist trope in the emails—perhaps unsurprisingly, as Miller himself is Jewish.


https://www.npr.org/2021/02/24/97068590 ... ationalism

Even Pastors are starting to recognize the issue .

In an open letter, more than 100 pastors, ministry and seminary leaders, and other prominent evangelicals express concern about the growing "radicalization" they're seeing, particularly among white evangelicals.

The letter notes that some members of the mob that stormed the Capitol carried Christian symbols and signs that read, "Jesus Saves," and that one of the rioters stood on the Senate rostrum and led a Christian prayer. The letter calls on other Christian leaders to take a public stand against racism, Christian nationalism, conspiracy theories and political extremism.

The letter reads, in part:

"We recognize that evangelicalism, and white evangelicalism in particular, has been susceptible to the heresy of Christian nationalism because of a long history of faith leaders accommodating white supremacy. We choose to speak out now because we do not want to be quiet accomplices in this on-going sin."
Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did..So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.--Mark Twain
 
User avatar
c933103
Posts: 5289
Joined: Wed May 18, 2016 7:23 pm

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Wed Feb 24, 2021 8:16 pm

SL1200MK2 wrote:
Ignoring the fact of the actual percentage of racists and nazis within the republican party, I am curious as to why this is the party that they go towards. While I am sure its possible, I've never met a racist that votes democrat. In the end, I believe one can say that not all republicans are racists but can confidently say that all racists are republicans.

As an Asian who is not American I have heard of some other I know who are Asian and have American residence status with pretty racist view that decided to vote the Democratic party.
It's pointless to attempt winning internet debate. 求同存異. よく見て・よく聞いて・よく考える
A placeholder line
You are now at your youngest moment in your remaining life.
 
User avatar
Tugger
Posts: 11230
Joined: Tue Apr 18, 2006 8:38 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Wed Feb 24, 2021 8:19 pm

Sadly the Trumpist Republicans are killing the party. Though they are convinced they are saving it and that this is what is needed.

Very sad time for Republican's.

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. - W. Shatner
There are many kinds of sentences that we think state facts about the world but that are really just expressions of our attitudes. - F. Ramsey
 
User avatar
Tugger
Posts: 11230
Joined: Tue Apr 18, 2006 8:38 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Wed Feb 24, 2021 8:22 pm

SL1200MK2 wrote:
[...] While I am sure its possible, I've never met a racist that votes democrat. [...]

Without putting to fine a point a on it. I believe you are making the gross mistake of assuming racists are only white?

That would be inaccurate.

(I am not ignoring or discounting the historic power and privilege spanning generations that white males have far and above any other group in the USA. Just pointing out a glaring error.)
Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. - W. Shatner
There are many kinds of sentences that we think state facts about the world but that are really just expressions of our attitudes. - F. Ramsey
 
User avatar
Tugger
Posts: 11230
Joined: Tue Apr 18, 2006 8:38 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Wed Feb 24, 2021 8:28 pm

It's hilarious, the right wing media suddenly cares about the debt! Not a peep the last four years but now suddenly...
https://www.foxbusiness.com/politics/bi ... ng-amounts

Gee must be those conservative Republican values. :rotfl:

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. - W. Shatner
There are many kinds of sentences that we think state facts about the world but that are really just expressions of our attitudes. - F. Ramsey
 
SL1200MK2
Posts: 182
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2008 11:00 pm

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Wed Feb 24, 2021 8:38 pm

Tugger wrote:
SL1200MK2 wrote:
[...] While I am sure its possible, I've never met a racist that votes democrat. [...]

Without putting to fine a point a on it. I believe you are making the gross mistake of assuming racists are only white?

That would be inaccurate.

(I am not ignoring or discounting the historic power and privilege spanning generations that white males have far and above any other group in the USA. Just pointing out a glaring error.)
Tugg


You make a good point and I should have not said racists but rather, white supremacists.
 
SL1200MK2
Posts: 182
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2008 11:00 pm

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Wed Feb 24, 2021 8:39 pm

c933103 wrote:
SL1200MK2 wrote:
Ignoring the fact of the actual percentage of racists and nazis within the republican party, I am curious as to why this is the party that they go towards. While I am sure its possible, I've never met a racist that votes democrat. In the end, I believe one can say that not all republicans are racists but can confidently say that all racists are republicans.

As an Asian who is not American I have heard of some other I know who are Asian and have American residence status with pretty racist view that decided to vote the Democratic party.


You are correct and as I mentioned in a different response, I should have said "white supremacists" instead of "racist. Thanks for pointing that out!
 
User avatar
seb146
Posts: 23472
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Wed Feb 24, 2021 8:46 pm

afcjets wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
You've clearly never driven anywhere in the south


You might see a few confederate flags and bumper stickers in some areas, but race relations for the most part are much better in the south and red states. In my experience, people get along with their neighbors, are friendlier, more likely to talk to strangers (black or white) and for the most part live harmoniously together. They also don't riot and destroy their cities and urban areas.


I live in an area that is MAGA and Confederate flags constantly. There is no kumbayah at all. The racist Republicans here hate culture. The looks I get when I speak Spanish to Spanish speaking customers, the total lack of empathy for minorities, they just blame minorities and "liberals" for everything and do nothing but blame and complain. People around here don't talk to their neighbors at all and the only time they talk to strangers in public is complete rudeness. MAGA areas destroy their towns. Look at all the trash and unkempt yards in small towns. Drive down any small town street and it is an eyesore. They don't do anything about it. Unlike after protesting in cities where people will go in and clean things up.

We just spent a week in California. Completely different vibe. People don't talk to strangers but the attitude is more calm and relaxed. There are problems in cities to be sure, but a constant poor attitude is not one of them.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
afcjets
Posts: 3616
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2015 6:20 pm

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Wed Feb 24, 2021 11:37 pm

seb146 wrote:
afcjets wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
You've clearly never driven anywhere in the south


You might see a few confederate flags and bumper stickers in some areas, but race relations for the most part are much better in the south and red states. In my experience, people get along with their neighbors, are friendlier, more likely to talk to strangers (black or white) and for the most part live harmoniously together. They also don't riot and destroy their cities and urban areas.


I live in an area that is MAGA and Confederate flags constantly. There is no kumbayah at all. The racist Republicans here hate culture. The looks I get when I speak Spanish to Spanish speaking customers, the total lack of empathy for minorities, they just blame minorities and "liberals" for everything and do nothing but blame and complain. People around here don't talk to their neighbors at all and the only time they talk to strangers in public is complete rudeness. MAGA areas destroy their towns. Look at all the trash and unkempt yards in small towns. Drive down any small town street and it is an eyesore. They don't do anything about it. Unlike after protesting in cities where people will go in and clean things up.

We just spent a week in California. Completely different vibe. People don't talk to strangers but the attitude is more calm and relaxed. There are problems in cities to be sure, but a constant poor attitude is not one of them.


You live near Portland, the epicenter of blue chaos and not exactly the American South, so you sorta prove my point Seb.
 
mjba257
Posts: 135
Joined: Tue Nov 17, 2020 1:21 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Thu Feb 25, 2021 12:39 am

Liz Cheney is part of the old guard GOP - the one that is pro-war (just look at her father), pro-corporate, pro-free trade, pro-national security state. But that is not in line with the GOP base, which is largely working class, residing in the middle of the country. You can look at polling data and find that most Republican voters are actually quite progressive on economic issues (cultural issues are what separate them from lefties). They are pro-healthcare, anti-free trade, anti-corporate, and anti-war. Trump played to those sentiments, which is why he was so beloved by the GOP base.

The GOP will go absolutely nowhere with the likes of Liz Cheney steering the ship. The only people her brand appeals to are corporate oligarchs, who make up such a minuscule amount of the electorate. There is a reason candidates like Romney and McCain lost - they appealed to nobody. Down the road, if the GOP is to win, they need to completely shun Corporate America and fully commit to being a workers party. The fact is that working class Americans far outnumber upper-middle class suburbanites.
 
User avatar
Aaron747
Posts: 14055
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 2:07 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Thu Feb 25, 2021 1:50 am

mjba257 wrote:
Liz Cheney is part of the old guard GOP - the one that is pro-war (just look at her father), pro-corporate, pro-free trade, pro-national security state. But that is not in line with the GOP base, which is largely working class, residing in the middle of the country. You can look at polling data and find that most Republican voters are actually quite progressive on economic issues (cultural issues are what separate them from lefties). They are pro-healthcare, anti-free trade, anti-corporate, and anti-war. Trump played to those sentiments, which is why he was so beloved by the GOP base.

The GOP will go absolutely nowhere with the likes of Liz Cheney steering the ship. The only people her brand appeals to are corporate oligarchs, who make up such a minuscule amount of the electorate. There is a reason candidates like Romney and McCain lost - they appealed to nobody. Down the road, if the GOP is to win, they need to completely shun Corporate America and fully commit to being a workers party. The fact is that working class Americans far outnumber upper-middle class suburbanites.


LOL the GOP cannot survive that way - the demographics don’t work out. It’s better for the Trumpian working class to split off and form their own Patriots’ Party or whatever. The core GOP is married to large corporate donations and will not give them up.

This way we can all heat up popcorn and see which bloc emerges the stronger party.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
mjba257
Posts: 135
Joined: Tue Nov 17, 2020 1:21 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Thu Feb 25, 2021 1:59 am

Aaron747 wrote:
mjba257 wrote:
Liz Cheney is part of the old guard GOP - the one that is pro-war (just look at her father), pro-corporate, pro-free trade, pro-national security state. But that is not in line with the GOP base, which is largely working class, residing in the middle of the country. You can look at polling data and find that most Republican voters are actually quite progressive on economic issues (cultural issues are what separate them from lefties). They are pro-healthcare, anti-free trade, anti-corporate, and anti-war. Trump played to those sentiments, which is why he was so beloved by the GOP base.

The GOP will go absolutely nowhere with the likes of Liz Cheney steering the ship. The only people her brand appeals to are corporate oligarchs, who make up such a minuscule amount of the electorate. There is a reason candidates like Romney and McCain lost - they appealed to nobody. Down the road, if the GOP is to win, they need to completely shun Corporate America and fully commit to being a workers party. The fact is that working class Americans far outnumber upper-middle class suburbanites.


LOL the GOP cannot survive that way - the demographics don’t work out. It’s better for the Trumpian working class to split off and form their own Patriots’ Party or whatever. The core GOP is married to large corporate donations and will not give them up.

This way we can all heat up popcorn and see which bloc emerges the stronger party.


You still subscribe to that "demographics are destiny" crap, which again, is an old way of thinking. The working class is multi-racial. Black, white, Hispanic, etc. And they all care about the same things - jobs, wages, healthcare, education, etc. What they don't care about are deficits, the stock market, corporate tax breaks, foreign policy. If the GOP drafted a platform that spoke to those key working class issues, they would be unstoppable. Yes, they would lose their corporate donors, but if you wanna talk demographics, there are far more workers than CEOs. They will make up for the lost money with more voters.
 
frmrCapCadet
Posts: 4741
Joined: Thu May 29, 2008 8:24 pm

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Thu Feb 25, 2021 2:03 am

Trump populism was and is as phony as anything else about him. No medical care for those losing theirs from unemployment, coal employment going down, begrudging unemployment insurance, huge tax cuts to the 1% - need I go on?
Buffet: the airline business...has eaten up capital...like..no other (business)
 
luckyone
Posts: 3767
Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2008 1:50 pm

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Thu Feb 25, 2021 2:28 am

afcjets wrote:
seb146 wrote:
afcjets wrote:

You might see a few confederate flags and bumper stickers in some areas, but race relations for the most part are much better in the south and red states. In my experience, people get along with their neighbors, are friendlier, more likely to talk to strangers (black or white) and for the most part live harmoniously together. They also don't riot and destroy their cities and urban areas.


I live in an area that is MAGA and Confederate flags constantly. There is no kumbayah at all. The racist Republicans here hate culture. The looks I get when I speak Spanish to Spanish speaking customers, the total lack of empathy for minorities, they just blame minorities and "liberals" for everything and do nothing but blame and complain. People around here don't talk to their neighbors at all and the only time they talk to strangers in public is complete rudeness. MAGA areas destroy their towns. Look at all the trash and unkempt yards in small towns. Drive down any small town street and it is an eyesore. They don't do anything about it. Unlike after protesting in cities where people will go in and clean things up.

We just spent a week in California. Completely different vibe. People don't talk to strangers but the attitude is more calm and relaxed. There are problems in cities to be sure, but a constant poor attitude is not one of them.


You live near Portland, the epicenter of blue chaos and not exactly the American South, so you sorta prove my point Seb.

Oh buddy. As a native Georgian who lived all over the state in urban, suburban, and rural areas, you are way off base. Being a native Southerner I can also tell you that Southerners are masters at double speak. They will say one thing in public, and something completely different in private. Race relations are great as long as they don’t live in “my neighborhood.”
 
User avatar
Aaron747
Posts: 14055
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 2:07 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Thu Feb 25, 2021 2:47 am

mjba257 wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
mjba257 wrote:
Liz Cheney is part of the old guard GOP - the one that is pro-war (just look at her father), pro-corporate, pro-free trade, pro-national security state. But that is not in line with the GOP base, which is largely working class, residing in the middle of the country. You can look at polling data and find that most Republican voters are actually quite progressive on economic issues (cultural issues are what separate them from lefties). They are pro-healthcare, anti-free trade, anti-corporate, and anti-war. Trump played to those sentiments, which is why he was so beloved by the GOP base.

The GOP will go absolutely nowhere with the likes of Liz Cheney steering the ship. The only people her brand appeals to are corporate oligarchs, who make up such a minuscule amount of the electorate. There is a reason candidates like Romney and McCain lost - they appealed to nobody. Down the road, if the GOP is to win, they need to completely shun Corporate America and fully commit to being a workers party. The fact is that working class Americans far outnumber upper-middle class suburbanites.


LOL the GOP cannot survive that way - the demographics don’t work out. It’s better for the Trumpian working class to split off and form their own Patriots’ Party or whatever. The core GOP is married to large corporate donations and will not give them up.

This way we can all heat up popcorn and see which bloc emerges the stronger party.


You still subscribe to that "demographics are destiny" crap, which again, is an old way of thinking. The working class is multi-racial. Black, white, Hispanic, etc. And they all care about the same things - jobs, wages, healthcare, education, etc. What they don't care about are deficits, the stock market, corporate tax breaks, foreign policy. If the GOP drafted a platform that spoke to those key working class issues, they would be unstoppable. Yes, they would lose their corporate donors, but if you wanna talk demographics, there are far more workers than CEOs. They will make up for the lost money with more voters.


That’s not what I was referring to - you immediately assume the demographic reference is ethnic when it’s economic. 19% of the labor force is industry, and 78% is services. That means most of the lower middle class is dependent on the success of corporations in that sector for jobs, not manufacturing. Trump was playing to the latter, not former.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
Newark727
Posts: 2326
Joined: Tue Dec 29, 2009 6:42 pm

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Thu Feb 25, 2021 6:09 am

mjba257 wrote:
You still subscribe to that "demographics are destiny" crap, which again, is an old way of thinking. The working class is multi-racial. Black, white, Hispanic, etc. And they all care about the same things - jobs, wages, healthcare, education, etc. What they don't care about are deficits, the stock market, corporate tax breaks, foreign policy. If the GOP drafted a platform that spoke to those key working class issues, they would be unstoppable. Yes, they would lose their corporate donors, but if you wanna talk demographics, there are far more workers than CEOs. They will make up for the lost money with more voters.


That would require a massive, generational change in the way the GOP does politics. They have never campaigned on unifying the working class - always on dividing it. Look about how they talk about welfare recipients and illegal immigrants. Look at how they use abortion and guns - they aren't called wedge issues for nothing.
 
User avatar
seb146
Posts: 23472
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Thu Feb 25, 2021 7:01 am

afcjets wrote:
seb146 wrote:
afcjets wrote:

You might see a few confederate flags and bumper stickers in some areas, but race relations for the most part are much better in the south and red states. In my experience, people get along with their neighbors, are friendlier, more likely to talk to strangers (black or white) and for the most part live harmoniously together. They also don't riot and destroy their cities and urban areas.


I live in an area that is MAGA and Confederate flags constantly. There is no kumbayah at all. The racist Republicans here hate culture. The looks I get when I speak Spanish to Spanish speaking customers, the total lack of empathy for minorities, they just blame minorities and "liberals" for everything and do nothing but blame and complain. People around here don't talk to their neighbors at all and the only time they talk to strangers in public is complete rudeness. MAGA areas destroy their towns. Look at all the trash and unkempt yards in small towns. Drive down any small town street and it is an eyesore. They don't do anything about it. Unlike after protesting in cities where people will go in and clean things up.

We just spent a week in California. Completely different vibe. People don't talk to strangers but the attitude is more calm and relaxed. There are problems in cities to be sure, but a constant poor attitude is not one of them.


You live near Portland, the epicenter of blue chaos and not exactly the American South, so you sorta prove my point Seb.


ummmm.... no.... I live on the south coast. OTH is like a five minute drive from here. Coast Guard is constantly going out in either helicopters or high speed boats to put pilots on ships to guide them across the bar and into port to avoid another New Carissa. Portland is like five hours' drive. I live along 101 about 2 hours north of California. I know the urban areas anywhere across the country are more diverse but rural areas are racist anywhere across the country. I hate being in rural areas like this because of all the open and overt and aggressive racism. And they are proud of it and think it is patriotic to be racist! That is the worst part. "I am Republican and racist and you are hateful for calling me out" is the attitude. They claim to love "blue lives" and "all lives" but are ready to draw guns and be violent when confronted with actual race issues. How many officers were hospitalized and killed during the attempted violent Republican MAGA coup on 1/6 but "blue lives/all lives matter"? Assuming their white, evangelical, hetero ways are the only way this country should be and how dare anyone challenge their opinion.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
afcjets
Posts: 3616
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2015 6:20 pm

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Thu Feb 25, 2021 7:16 am

seb146 wrote:
afcjets wrote:
seb146 wrote:

I live in an area that is MAGA and Confederate flags constantly. There is no kumbayah at all. The racist Republicans here hate culture. The looks I get when I speak Spanish to Spanish speaking customers, the total lack of empathy for minorities, they just blame minorities and "liberals" for everything and do nothing but blame and complain. People around here don't talk to their neighbors at all and the only time they talk to strangers in public is complete rudeness. MAGA areas destroy their towns. Look at all the trash and unkempt yards in small towns. Drive down any small town street and it is an eyesore. They don't do anything about it. Unlike after protesting in cities where people will go in and clean things up.

We just spent a week in California. Completely different vibe. People don't talk to strangers but the attitude is more calm and relaxed. There are problems in cities to be sure, but a constant poor attitude is not one of them.


You live near Portland, the epicenter of blue chaos and not exactly the American South, so you sorta prove my point Seb.


ummmm.... no.... I live on the south coast. OTH is like a five minute drive from here. Coast Guard is constantly going out in either helicopters or high speed boats to put pilots on ships to guide them across the bar and into port to avoid another New Carissa. Portland is like five hours' drive. I live along 101 about 2 hours north of California. I know the urban areas anywhere across the country are more diverse but rural areas are racist anywhere across the country. I hate being in rural areas like this because of all the open and overt and aggressive racism. And they are proud of it and think it is patriotic to be racist! That is the worst part. "I am Republican and racist and you are hateful for calling me out" is the attitude. They claim to love "blue lives" and "all lives" but are ready to draw guns and be violent when confronted with actual race issues. How many officers were hospitalized and killed during the attempted violent Republican MAGA coup on 1/6 but "blue lives/all lives matter"? Assuming their white, evangelical, hetero ways are the only way this country should be and how dare anyone challenge their opinion.


We can disagree that Oregon is not a red state and that it's southern coast is not the American South. I don't know the exact number but it was approximately 45 lives less than were killed in the BLM/antifa riots since last summer, but the Hypocrats don't care about those lives, black or white.
 
User avatar
Aaron747
Posts: 14055
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 2:07 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Thu Feb 25, 2021 7:29 am

afcjets wrote:
seb146 wrote:
afcjets wrote:

You live near Portland, the epicenter of blue chaos and not exactly the American South, so you sorta prove my point Seb.


ummmm.... no.... I live on the south coast. OTH is like a five minute drive from here. Coast Guard is constantly going out in either helicopters or high speed boats to put pilots on ships to guide them across the bar and into port to avoid another New Carissa. Portland is like five hours' drive. I live along 101 about 2 hours north of California. I know the urban areas anywhere across the country are more diverse but rural areas are racist anywhere across the country. I hate being in rural areas like this because of all the open and overt and aggressive racism. And they are proud of it and think it is patriotic to be racist! That is the worst part. "I am Republican and racist and you are hateful for calling me out" is the attitude. They claim to love "blue lives" and "all lives" but are ready to draw guns and be violent when confronted with actual race issues. How many officers were hospitalized and killed during the attempted violent Republican MAGA coup on 1/6 but "blue lives/all lives matter"? Assuming their white, evangelical, hetero ways are the only way this country should be and how dare anyone challenge their opinion.


We can disagree that Oregon is not a red state and that it's southern coast is not the American South. I don't know the exact number but it was approximately 45 lives less than were killed in the BLM/antifa riots since last summer, but the Hypocrats don't care about those lives, black or white.


There you go again conflating BLM protesters with anarchist rioters, almost a year later and still no evidence. Repeating something again and again and again does not make it true. Sad!
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
User avatar
seb146
Posts: 23472
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Thu Feb 25, 2021 7:43 am

afcjets wrote:
seb146 wrote:
afcjets wrote:

You live near Portland, the epicenter of blue chaos and not exactly the American South, so you sorta prove my point Seb.


ummmm.... no.... I live on the south coast. OTH is like a five minute drive from here. Coast Guard is constantly going out in either helicopters or high speed boats to put pilots on ships to guide them across the bar and into port to avoid another New Carissa. Portland is like five hours' drive. I live along 101 about 2 hours north of California. I know the urban areas anywhere across the country are more diverse but rural areas are racist anywhere across the country. I hate being in rural areas like this because of all the open and overt and aggressive racism. And they are proud of it and think it is patriotic to be racist! That is the worst part. "I am Republican and racist and you are hateful for calling me out" is the attitude. They claim to love "blue lives" and "all lives" but are ready to draw guns and be violent when confronted with actual race issues. How many officers were hospitalized and killed during the attempted violent Republican MAGA coup on 1/6 but "blue lives/all lives matter"? Assuming their white, evangelical, hetero ways are the only way this country should be and how dare anyone challenge their opinion.


We can disagree that Oregon is not a red state and that it's southern coast is not the American South. I don't know the exact number but it was approximately 45 lives less than were killed in the BLM/antifa riots since last summer, but the Hypocrats don't care about those lives, black or white.


There is a stretch of I-5 between EUG and PDX that is solidly Democrat. The rest is "all lives matter if they have our skin color and our holy book" people and secretly Democrat because, if they actually said anything, they would be (at best) banned from the market or (at worse) left to die on the side of the road. Because "all lives matter" you know. So, you agree that not all lives matter. Not a question, a statement. When a life is lost to unfair police violence, BLM mourns. MAGA blames BLM and "antifa". Just because 75% of land is Republican does not mean EVERYONE believes that. Republicans keep saying "do not paint us all with a broad brush" when Republicans constantly paint all Democrats with a broad brush.

If you don't like it, don't do it.

BTW, in BLM protests, it was BLM protesters who were killed. Kyle Rittenhouse?
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
User avatar
seahawk
Posts: 10177
Joined: Fri May 27, 2005 1:29 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Thu Feb 25, 2021 8:40 am

The GOP can not move away from those people, as without them they can hardly win an election. If those people stay at home on election day, or vote for a right wing candidate, the GOP has no chance of winning, especially in the rather conservative 2 party system of the USA. In the end even the Democrats would be seen as a conservative to centrist party in most other western countries.
 
User avatar
RyanairGuru
Posts: 8634
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 3:59 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Thu Feb 25, 2021 11:34 am

afcjets wrote:
seb146 wrote:
afcjets wrote:

You live near Portland, the epicenter of blue chaos and not exactly the American South, so you sorta prove my point Seb.


ummmm.... no.... I live on the south coast. OTH is like a five minute drive from here. Coast Guard is constantly going out in either helicopters or high speed boats to put pilots on ships to guide them across the bar and into port to avoid another New Carissa. Portland is like five hours' drive. I live along 101 about 2 hours north of California. I know the urban areas anywhere across the country are more diverse but rural areas are racist anywhere across the country. I hate being in rural areas like this because of all the open and overt and aggressive racism. And they are proud of it and think it is patriotic to be racist! That is the worst part. "I am Republican and racist and you are hateful for calling me out" is the attitude. They claim to love "blue lives" and "all lives" but are ready to draw guns and be violent when confronted with actual race issues. How many officers were hospitalized and killed during the attempted violent Republican MAGA coup on 1/6 but "blue lives/all lives matter"? Assuming their white, evangelical, hetero ways are the only way this country should be and how dare anyone challenge their opinion.


We can disagree that Oregon is not a red state and that it's southern coast is not the American South. I don't know the exact number but it was approximately 45 lives less than were killed in the BLM/antifa riots since last summer, but the Hypocrats don't care about those lives, black or white.


I shouldn’t be, but I am shocked to see you try and squirm out of acknowledging Oregon’s troubled past just because it doesn’t suit your narrative.

Oregon was, arguably, the only state in the Union which was founded on the basis of white supremacy. It wasn’t a slave state, but in many ways something worse: a place only for white people. Even today rural Oregon is every bit as racist as rural Alabama. The fact it is not in the south is a misnomer.
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
User avatar
Aesma
Posts: 14085
Joined: Sat Nov 14, 2009 6:14 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Thu Feb 25, 2021 1:40 pm

It's not always and everywhere obvious that politicians care about people, but in the US it seems it's the exception rather than the rule, at least at the top. Or not so top, look at that Texan mayor, unbelievable ! There are dictators who care more than that.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
LCDFlight
Posts: 941
Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2020 9:22 pm

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Thu Feb 25, 2021 1:42 pm

mjba257 wrote:
You can look at polling data and find that most Republican voters are actually quite progressive on economic issues (cultural issues are what separate them from lefties). They are pro-healthcare, anti-free trade, anti-corporate, and anti-war. Trump played to those sentiments, which is why he was so beloved by the GOP base.

The GOP will go absolutely nowhere with the likes of Liz Cheney steering the ship. The only people her brand appeals to are corporate oligarchs, who make up such a minuscule amount of the electorate. There is a reason candidates like Romney and McCain lost - they appealed to nobody. Down the road, if the GOP is to win, they need to completely shun Corporate America and fully commit to being a workers party. The fact is that working class Americans far outnumber upper-middle class suburbanites.


Fascinating post. It is hard to fault. I thought it was weird that people described Trump as hard-right. I don't think so. I think he was far to the left of Cheney. On some issues (such as war entanglements, free trade and overall class sophistication), Trump was significantly to the left of Hillary Clinton. He's hard right? No, Dick Cheney was hard right. Trump was IMO a colorful and extremely vulgar moderate.

I liked the article that said people on the extreme right and extreme left tend to have lower IQ. The smarter people (and by the way, a majority of the electorate) are in the middle.

For sensible government, there need to be 2 parties. We should isolate extremism. To summarize what extremism is, it is anything that Hitler, Stalin or Mao, or Bin Laden, or their supporters, would be likely to say.
 
User avatar
Aaron747
Posts: 14055
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 2:07 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Thu Feb 25, 2021 1:55 pm

LCDFlight wrote:
mjba257 wrote:
You can look at polling data and find that most Republican voters are actually quite progressive on economic issues (cultural issues are what separate them from lefties). They are pro-healthcare, anti-free trade, anti-corporate, and anti-war. Trump played to those sentiments, which is why he was so beloved by the GOP base.

The GOP will go absolutely nowhere with the likes of Liz Cheney steering the ship. The only people her brand appeals to are corporate oligarchs, who make up such a minuscule amount of the electorate. There is a reason candidates like Romney and McCain lost - they appealed to nobody. Down the road, if the GOP is to win, they need to completely shun Corporate America and fully commit to being a workers party. The fact is that working class Americans far outnumber upper-middle class suburbanites.


Fascinating post. It is hard to fault. I thought it was weird that people described Trump as hard-right. I don't think so. I think he was far to the left of Cheney. On some issues (such as war entanglements, free trade and overall class sophistication), Trump was significantly to the left of Hillary Clinton. He's hard right? No, Dick Cheney was hard right. Trump was IMO a colorful and extremely vulgar moderate.

I liked the article that said people on the extreme right and extreme left tend to have lower IQ. The smarter people (and by the way, a majority of the electorate) are in the middle.

For sensible government, here need to be 2 parties. We should isolate extremism. And to summarize what extremism is, it would be to say anything that Hitler, Stalin or Mao, or Bin Laden, or their supporters, would be likely to say.


I'm with you if you throw in the belief that disagreements with the other party/other views may best be resolved through violence. There's a reason the FBI are on the case with these nuts - and they aint on the left generally.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
User avatar
Tugger
Posts: 11230
Joined: Tue Apr 18, 2006 8:38 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Thu Feb 25, 2021 3:47 pm

It's called compromise.

Unfortunately there are entire sectors of MSM that are based on saying any progress forward by the other party is a a failure and wrong as "I don't want to move at all , so ANY movement means they win". I hear them everyday on the radio. They make fake news and create controversy from clips and distort the reality of anyone's position that is not theirs. Convincing Republican and conservative listeners that any movement up from whatever the floor currently is, any change from an often extreme right agenda, is failure and a gross accepatance of "totalitarianism" or "socialism" etc.

I can't speak to Dem stuff as I don't listen to that.

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. - W. Shatner
There are many kinds of sentences that we think state facts about the world but that are really just expressions of our attitudes. - F. Ramsey
 
User avatar
seahawk
Posts: 10177
Joined: Fri May 27, 2005 1:29 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Thu Feb 25, 2021 4:39 pm

LCDFlight wrote:
mjba257 wrote:
You can look at polling data and find that most Republican voters are actually quite progressive on economic issues (cultural issues are what separate them from lefties). They are pro-healthcare, anti-free trade, anti-corporate, and anti-war. Trump played to those sentiments, which is why he was so beloved by the GOP base.

The GOP will go absolutely nowhere with the likes of Liz Cheney steering the ship. The only people her brand appeals to are corporate oligarchs, who make up such a minuscule amount of the electorate. There is a reason candidates like Romney and McCain lost - they appealed to nobody. Down the road, if the GOP is to win, they need to completely shun Corporate America and fully commit to being a workers party. The fact is that working class Americans far outnumber upper-middle class suburbanites.


Fascinating post. It is hard to fault. I thought it was weird that people described Trump as hard-right. I don't think so. I think he was far to the left of Cheney. On some issues (such as war entanglements, free trade and overall class sophistication), Trump was significantly to the left of Hillary Clinton. He's hard right? No, Dick Cheney was hard right. Trump was IMO a colorful and extremely vulgar moderate.

I liked the article that said people on the extreme right and extreme left tend to have lower IQ. The smarter people (and by the way, a majority of the electorate) are in the middle.

For sensible government, there need to be 2 parties. We should isolate extremism. To summarize what extremism is, it is anything that Hitler, Stalin or Mao, or Bin Laden, or their supporters, would be likely to say.


I am sure people said the same about the Hitler and the NSDAP in 1935.
 
MaverickM11
Topic Author
Posts: 18546
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Thu Feb 25, 2021 4:41 pm

afcjets wrote:
TSS wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:

Y'all realize Portland and Oregon is like ground zero for Trump's very fine people, and militia central right? Where do you think all those Vanilla Isis caravans were rolling in from?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racism_in_Oregon


Thank you for for agreeing with what Afcjets and I were saying about Portland/Oregon versus the South.


Exactly, if Nashville were like Portland you might have militia forming in the rural areas of Tennessee.

Ummm...not sure what your point is but Trump's racist supporters are everywhere. No one has suggested otherwise. They're just (more) proud to let their freak seditious flag fly in the South, but again Trump has given them permission to come out of their bigot glass closets just about anywhere.

afcjets wrote:
seb146 wrote:
afcjets wrote:

You live near Portland, the epicenter of blue chaos and not exactly the American South, so you sorta prove my point Seb.


ummmm.... no.... I live on the south coast. OTH is like a five minute drive from here. Coast Guard is constantly going out in either helicopters or high speed boats to put pilots on ships to guide them across the bar and into port to avoid another New Carissa. Portland is like five hours' drive. I live along 101 about 2 hours north of California. I know the urban areas anywhere across the country are more diverse but rural areas are racist anywhere across the country. I hate being in rural areas like this because of all the open and overt and aggressive racism. And they are proud of it and think it is patriotic to be racist! That is the worst part. "I am Republican and racist and you are hateful for calling me out" is the attitude. They claim to love "blue lives" and "all lives" but are ready to draw guns and be violent when confronted with actual race issues. How many officers were hospitalized and killed during the attempted violent Republican MAGA coup on 1/6 but "blue lives/all lives matter"? Assuming their white, evangelical, hetero ways are the only way this country should be and how dare anyone challenge their opinion.


We can disagree that Oregon is not a red state and that it's southern coast is not the American South. I don't know the exact number but it was approximately 45 lives less than were killed in the BLM/antifa riots since last summer, but the Hypocrats don't care about those lives, black or white.


Even Trump's own acting DHS secretary Chad Wolf admitted Trump's supporters are the biggest danger to the country:

DHS: White Supremacists ‘The Most Persistent and Lethal Threat’ Within the U.S.
https://www.usnews.com/news/national-ne ... hin-the-us


LCDFlight wrote:
mjba257 wrote:
You can look at polling data and find that most Republican voters are actually quite progressive on economic issues (cultural issues are what separate them from lefties). They are pro-healthcare, anti-free trade, anti-corporate, and anti-war. Trump played to those sentiments, which is why he was so beloved by the GOP base.

The GOP will go absolutely nowhere with the likes of Liz Cheney steering the ship. The only people her brand appeals to are corporate oligarchs, who make up such a minuscule amount of the electorate. There is a reason candidates like Romney and McCain lost - they appealed to nobody. Down the road, if the GOP is to win, they need to completely shun Corporate America and fully commit to being a workers party. The fact is that working class Americans far outnumber upper-middle class suburbanites.


Fascinating post. It is hard to fault. I thought it was weird that people described Trump as hard-right. I don't think so. I think he was far to the left of Cheney. On some issues (such as war entanglements, free trade and overall class sophistication), Trump was significantly to the left of Hillary Clinton. He's hard right? No, Dick Cheney was hard right. Trump was IMO a colorful and extremely vulgar moderate.

His actions debunk all of that, beyond a few token gestures. He may have the cult like support of this "middle" you speak of, but nearly all of his actions were lock step traditional, old school corporate republicans. Because after all, Trump hates his supporters, and loves money even though he's terrible at making any of it--he'd rather golf with the CEO of a Fortune 500 company any day than Joe Blow from East Upchuck Alabama.
I don't take responsibility at all
 
User avatar
seb146
Posts: 23472
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Thu Feb 25, 2021 6:31 pm

Tugger wrote:
It's called compromise.

Unfortunately there are entire sectors of MSM that are based on saying any progress forward by the other party is a a failure and wrong as "I don't want to move at all , so ANY movement means they win". I hear them everyday on the radio. They make fake news and create controversy from clips and distort the reality of anyone's position that is not theirs. Convincing Republican and conservative listeners that any movement up from whatever the floor currently is, any change from an often extreme right agenda, is failure and a gross accepatance of "totalitarianism" or "socialism" etc.

I can't speak to Dem stuff as I don't listen to that.

Tugg


I listen to progressive talk show hosts every day. Their basic mantra is "Republicans are the party of moving backward so here are Democrats who are moving the country forward".
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
User avatar
seb146
Posts: 23472
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Thu Feb 25, 2021 6:35 pm

RyanairGuru wrote:
afcjets wrote:
seb146 wrote:

ummmm.... no.... I live on the south coast. OTH is like a five minute drive from here. Coast Guard is constantly going out in either helicopters or high speed boats to put pilots on ships to guide them across the bar and into port to avoid another New Carissa. Portland is like five hours' drive. I live along 101 about 2 hours north of California. I know the urban areas anywhere across the country are more diverse but rural areas are racist anywhere across the country. I hate being in rural areas like this because of all the open and overt and aggressive racism. And they are proud of it and think it is patriotic to be racist! That is the worst part. "I am Republican and racist and you are hateful for calling me out" is the attitude. They claim to love "blue lives" and "all lives" but are ready to draw guns and be violent when confronted with actual race issues. How many officers were hospitalized and killed during the attempted violent Republican MAGA coup on 1/6 but "blue lives/all lives matter"? Assuming their white, evangelical, hetero ways are the only way this country should be and how dare anyone challenge their opinion.


We can disagree that Oregon is not a red state and that it's southern coast is not the American South. I don't know the exact number but it was approximately 45 lives less than were killed in the BLM/antifa riots since last summer, but the Hypocrats don't care about those lives, black or white.


I shouldn’t be, but I am shocked to see you try and squirm out of acknowledging Oregon’s troubled past just because it doesn’t suit your narrative.

Oregon was, arguably, the only state in the Union which was founded on the basis of white supremacy. It wasn’t a slave state, but in many ways something worse: a place only for white people. Even today rural Oregon is every bit as racist as rural Alabama. The fact it is not in the south is a misnomer.


I have mentioned in other threads that there were "sundown laws" across rural Oregon until the 1970s. Grants Pass, most notably, had "n**gers go home" signs all across their town into the 1990s. There is a sense of hate and mistrust in rural Oregon over "newcomers", especially those of color. This is how rural Oregon is. Residents of rural Oregon are proud of their racism, even before MAGA. Which is unfortunate because there are some really beautiful things to see out there.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
LCDFlight
Posts: 941
Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2020 9:22 pm

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Thu Feb 25, 2021 10:21 pm

MaverickM11 wrote:
afcjets wrote:
TSS wrote:

Thank you for for agreeing with what Afcjets and I were saying about Portland/Oregon versus the South.


Exactly, if Nashville were like Portland you might have militia forming in the rural areas of Tennessee.

Ummm...not sure what your point is but Trump's racist supporters are everywhere. No one has suggested otherwise. They're just (more) proud to let their freak seditious flag fly in the South, but again Trump has given them permission to come out of their bigot glass closets just about anywhere.

afcjets wrote:
seb146 wrote:

ummmm.... no.... I live on the south coast. OTH is like a five minute drive from here. Coast Guard is constantly going out in either helicopters or high speed boats to put pilots on ships to guide them across the bar and into port to avoid another New Carissa. Portland is like five hours' drive. I live along 101 about 2 hours north of California. I know the urban areas anywhere across the country are more diverse but rural areas are racist anywhere across the country. I hate being in rural areas like this because of all the open and overt and aggressive racism. And they are proud of it and think it is patriotic to be racist! That is the worst part. "I am Republican and racist and you are hateful for calling me out" is the attitude. They claim to love "blue lives" and "all lives" but are ready to draw guns and be violent when confronted with actual race issues. How many officers were hospitalized and killed during the attempted violent Republican MAGA coup on 1/6 but "blue lives/all lives matter"? Assuming their white, evangelical, hetero ways are the only way this country should be and how dare anyone challenge their opinion.


We can disagree that Oregon is not a red state and that it's southern coast is not the American South. I don't know the exact number but it was approximately 45 lives less than were killed in the BLM/antifa riots since last summer, but the Hypocrats don't care about those lives, black or white.


Even Trump's own acting DHS secretary Chad Wolf admitted Trump's supporters are the biggest danger to the country:

DHS: White Supremacists ‘The Most Persistent and Lethal Threat’ Within the U.S.
https://www.usnews.com/news/national-ne ... hin-the-us


LCDFlight wrote:
mjba257 wrote:
You can look at polling data and find that most Republican voters are actually quite progressive on economic issues (cultural issues are what separate them from lefties). They are pro-healthcare, anti-free trade, anti-corporate, and anti-war. Trump played to those sentiments, which is why he was so beloved by the GOP base.

The GOP will go absolutely nowhere with the likes of Liz Cheney steering the ship. The only people her brand appeals to are corporate oligarchs, who make up such a minuscule amount of the electorate. There is a reason candidates like Romney and McCain lost - they appealed to nobody. Down the road, if the GOP is to win, they need to completely shun Corporate America and fully commit to being a workers party. The fact is that working class Americans far outnumber upper-middle class suburbanites.


Fascinating post. It is hard to fault. I thought it was weird that people described Trump as hard-right. I don't think so. I think he was far to the left of Cheney. On some issues (such as war entanglements, free trade and overall class sophistication), Trump was significantly to the left of Hillary Clinton. He's hard right? No, Dick Cheney was hard right. Trump was IMO a colorful and extremely vulgar moderate.

His actions debunk all of that, beyond a few token gestures. He may have the cult like support of this "middle" you speak of, but nearly all of his actions were lock step traditional, old school corporate republicans. Because after all, Trump hates his supporters, and loves money even though he's terrible at making any of it--he'd rather golf with the CEO of a Fortune 500 company any day than Joe Blow from East Upchuck Alabama.


Trump received very, very few corporate donations unless you consider Mypillow and Las Vegas Sands to be the most important businesses in the US. Put simply, the idea that Trump was the corporate candidate was false and actually a little bit bizarre. Take a look. Biden was easily the business favorite. Although his tax ideas are higher, his fiscal largesse ideas (apparently boundless) and his support for effectively unlimited supply of new laborers to US employers, smashing down wages, clearly wins.

https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2020 ... en-donors/
 
MaverickM11
Topic Author
Posts: 18546
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Fri Feb 26, 2021 12:47 am

LCDFlight wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
afcjets wrote:

Exactly, if Nashville were like Portland you might have militia forming in the rural areas of Tennessee.

Ummm...not sure what your point is but Trump's racist supporters are everywhere. No one has suggested otherwise. They're just (more) proud to let their freak seditious flag fly in the South, but again Trump has given them permission to come out of their bigot glass closets just about anywhere.

afcjets wrote:

We can disagree that Oregon is not a red state and that it's southern coast is not the American South. I don't know the exact number but it was approximately 45 lives less than were killed in the BLM/antifa riots since last summer, but the Hypocrats don't care about those lives, black or white.


Even Trump's own acting DHS secretary Chad Wolf admitted Trump's supporters are the biggest danger to the country:

DHS: White Supremacists ‘The Most Persistent and Lethal Threat’ Within the U.S.
https://www.usnews.com/news/national-ne ... hin-the-us


LCDFlight wrote:

Fascinating post. It is hard to fault. I thought it was weird that people described Trump as hard-right. I don't think so. I think he was far to the left of Cheney. On some issues (such as war entanglements, free trade and overall class sophistication), Trump was significantly to the left of Hillary Clinton. He's hard right? No, Dick Cheney was hard right. Trump was IMO a colorful and extremely vulgar moderate.

His actions debunk all of that, beyond a few token gestures. He may have the cult like support of this "middle" you speak of, but nearly all of his actions were lock step traditional, old school corporate republicans. Because after all, Trump hates his supporters, and loves money even though he's terrible at making any of it--he'd rather golf with the CEO of a Fortune 500 company any day than Joe Blow from East Upchuck Alabama.


Trump received very, very few corporate donations unless you consider Mypillow and Las Vegas Sands to be the most important businesses in the US. Put simply, the idea that Trump was the corporate candidate was false and actually a little bit bizarre. Take a look. Biden was easily the business favorite. Although his tax ideas are higher, his fiscal largesse ideas (apparently boundless) and his support for effectively unlimited supply of new laborers to US employers, smashing down wages, clearly wins.

https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2020 ... en-donors/

That's why I said actions. I think most corporations were getting wary of associating with a white nationalist administration, and more importantly, a mercurial, unpredictable one. Companies largely would prefer predictability over the occasional favor, or grenade out of left field. What populist measures did Trump push, besides the low hanging fruit of nuclear bigotry?
I don't take responsibility at all
 
User avatar
seb146
Posts: 23472
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Fri Feb 26, 2021 3:46 am

LCDFlight wrote:
MaverickM11 wrote:
afcjets wrote:

Exactly, if Nashville were like Portland you might have militia forming in the rural areas of Tennessee.

Ummm...not sure what your point is but Trump's racist supporters are everywhere. No one has suggested otherwise. They're just (more) proud to let their freak seditious flag fly in the South, but again Trump has given them permission to come out of their bigot glass closets just about anywhere.

afcjets wrote:

We can disagree that Oregon is not a red state and that it's southern coast is not the American South. I don't know the exact number but it was approximately 45 lives less than were killed in the BLM/antifa riots since last summer, but the Hypocrats don't care about those lives, black or white.


Even Trump's own acting DHS secretary Chad Wolf admitted Trump's supporters are the biggest danger to the country:

DHS: White Supremacists ‘The Most Persistent and Lethal Threat’ Within the U.S.
https://www.usnews.com/news/national-ne ... hin-the-us


LCDFlight wrote:

Fascinating post. It is hard to fault. I thought it was weird that people described Trump as hard-right. I don't think so. I think he was far to the left of Cheney. On some issues (such as war entanglements, free trade and overall class sophistication), Trump was significantly to the left of Hillary Clinton. He's hard right? No, Dick Cheney was hard right. Trump was IMO a colorful and extremely vulgar moderate.

His actions debunk all of that, beyond a few token gestures. He may have the cult like support of this "middle" you speak of, but nearly all of his actions were lock step traditional, old school corporate republicans. Because after all, Trump hates his supporters, and loves money even though he's terrible at making any of it--he'd rather golf with the CEO of a Fortune 500 company any day than Joe Blow from East Upchuck Alabama.


Trump received very, very few corporate donations unless you consider Mypillow and Las Vegas Sands to be the most important businesses in the US. Put simply, the idea that Trump was the corporate candidate was false and actually a little bit bizarre. Take a look. Biden was easily the business favorite. Although his tax ideas are higher, his fiscal largesse ideas (apparently boundless) and his support for effectively unlimited supply of new laborers to US employers, smashing down wages, clearly wins.

https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2020 ... en-donors/


One source following one right wing and one left wing site. Sounds kinda skewed to me.

All I know is he kept saying what a great business man he is and his legions of adoring fans kept saying what a great business man he is and he kept saying how rich he is and his legions of adoring fans kept saying how rich he is. No need to question anything. He said it, it was repeated ad nauseum, so it must be true.

Even with Biden wanting a minimum wage increase as well as universal health care for all, industry still wanted Biden as president. Speaks volumes, doesn't it?
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
Kno
Posts: 605
Joined: Mon Aug 15, 2016 10:08 pm

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Fri Feb 26, 2021 4:24 am

The overwhelming majority of white supremacists vote republican, this isn't a secret or a surprise to anyone, and some of the more high profile white supremacists have large followings, through their own volition regardless of how the media portrays them, so yes, of course republicans are known as the white supremacist party.
 
Kno
Posts: 605
Joined: Mon Aug 15, 2016 10:08 pm

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Fri Feb 26, 2021 4:28 am

afcjets wrote:

You might see a few confederate flags and bumper stickers in some areas, but race relations for the most part are much better in the south and red states. In my experience, people get along with their neighbors, are friendlier, more likely to talk to strangers (black or white) and for the most part live harmoniously together. They also don't riot and destroy their cities and urban areas.


Surface level observations don't address issues that run this deep
 
Newark727
Posts: 2326
Joined: Tue Dec 29, 2009 6:42 pm

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Fri Feb 26, 2021 4:38 am

LCDFlight wrote:
Fascinating post. It is hard to fault. I thought it was weird that people described Trump as hard-right. I don't think so. I think he was far to the left of Cheney. On some issues (such as war entanglements, free trade and overall class sophistication), Trump was significantly to the left of Hillary Clinton. He's hard right? No, Dick Cheney was hard right. Trump was IMO a colorful and extremely vulgar moderate.


Telling white nationalist militias to "stand by" during a nationally televised debate: a very moderate thing to do. And all those moderates in his inner circle too, like Steve Bannon and Stephen Miller. And certainly let's remember all those political moderates in the Capitol rotunda! Just looking for a more centrist position on free trade, that's all they were doing!
 
ltbewr
Posts: 15613
Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2004 1:24 pm

Re: Liz Cheney: GOP risks becoming known as "the party of white supremacy"

Fri Feb 26, 2021 8:31 am

Rep. Liz Cheney is looking at the long term for the Republican Party, that the following of Trump is like that of the mythical Pied Piper, one that leads to unintended or terrible things. In the case of the Republican party, to their ruin due to open support of a President who cannot be trusted, had horrible policies, encouraged terrorism on 1/6/21 at the Capital, won't accept the results of an election and distracts from their goals. https://www.urbandictionary.com/define. ... ed%20Piper

Who is online

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos