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AirWorthy99
Posts: 1333
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2020 7:57 pm

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Sat Mar 27, 2021 11:23 pm

910A wrote:
AirWorthy99 wrote:
Good for Georgia and doing this. But I understand the 'outrage' of the left, they want to force HR1 and have the elections be federally regulated, which is completely against federalism and unconstitutional.

I think Georgia should have gone farther, and have people voting only in election day.

If voting is so hard for you, then probably you should not vote.


Okay I'll bite..You only want people to vote on election day...So you're okay with disenfranchise military members, other government workers, employees of private businesses that are assigned overseas? How about the election poll workers that have to vote early? How about the disabled that can't make it to a polling location? How about the ones that go to their polling location and find the ballots haven't been delivered or the voting machines aren't working, do they lose their right to vote or wait hours until the problem is solve? Myself, I like to vote at home, and researching ballot initiatives while drinking my favorite adult beverage...Voting by mail has been ultra popular in the states that allow it. In some states like Washington, Oregon, Utah, Colorado it's the only approved method to cast your ballot.

This year’s August primary in Arizona showed similar results. The vast majority—88 percent—of voters cast their ballots early, and most of them by mail.

https://www.sightline.org/2020/09/14/in ... e-by-mail/


Absentee voting has existed for ever. I am not against it. What I think is regular voting should be on the voting day, like it is in Europe. If Tuesday is a problem, I am fine making it a Sunday. I just don't want the left to then complain that those religious conservatives go straight from church to the poll voting booth. Because is going to happen and we will certainly make the best of it.

In any case, I must say I have used early voting in the past, is convenient, I have used it because is there, but if you complain about 'losing democracy', Europeans don't complain at all for voting on just one day and showing government issued identification. Here in the US, we need to give people a month to vote, or even worse, bring the ballot to their beds or couches, and tell them how to vote and not ask for identification, that's what the left and democrats want. There is no 'voter suppression' in voting on election day and on a voting place and asking for identification.
“It’s easy to confuse ‘what is’ with ‘what ought to be,’ especially when ‘what is’ has worked out in your favor.” Tyrion Lannister
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Sat Mar 27, 2021 11:30 pm

AirWorthy99 wrote:
910A wrote:
AirWorthy99 wrote:
Good for Georgia and doing this. But I understand the 'outrage' of the left, they want to force HR1 and have the elections be federally regulated, which is completely against federalism and unconstitutional.

I think Georgia should have gone farther, and have people voting only in election day.

If voting is so hard for you, then probably you should not vote.


Okay I'll bite..You only want people to vote on election day...So you're okay with disenfranchise military members, other government workers, employees of private businesses that are assigned overseas? How about the election poll workers that have to vote early? How about the disabled that can't make it to a polling location? How about the ones that go to their polling location and find the ballots haven't been delivered or the voting machines aren't working, do they lose their right to vote or wait hours until the problem is solve? Myself, I like to vote at home, and researching ballot initiatives while drinking my favorite adult beverage...Voting by mail has been ultra popular in the states that allow it. In some states like Washington, Oregon, Utah, Colorado it's the only approved method to cast your ballot.

This year’s August primary in Arizona showed similar results. The vast majority—88 percent—of voters cast their ballots early, and most of them by mail.

https://www.sightline.org/2020/09/14/in ... e-by-mail/


Absentee voting has existed for ever. I am not against it. What I think is regular voting should be on the voting day, like it is in Europe. If Tuesday is a problem, I am fine making it a Sunday. I just don't want the left to then complain that those religious conservatives go straight from church to the poll voting booth. Because is going to happen and we will certainly make the best of it.

In any case, I must say I have used early voting in the past, is convenient, I have used it because is there, but if you complain about 'losing democracy', Europeans don't complain at all for voting on just one day and showing government issued identification. Here in the US, we need to give people a month to vote, or even worse, bring the ballot to their beds or couches, and tell them how to vote and not ask for identification, that's what the left and democrats want. There is no 'voter suppression' in voting on election day and on a voting place and asking for identification.


You’re not making any sense - in the first paragraph you have no problem with absentee voting - in the second, we’re ‘bringing the ballot to their beds and couches’. What are you on about?

Bottom line: do you support expanded access beyond election day so that single parents, multi-job workers, long shift medical professionals, and out of state military / contract workers can vote? Yes or no.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
AirWorthy99
Posts: 1333
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2020 7:57 pm

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Sat Mar 27, 2021 11:39 pm

Aaron747 wrote:
AirWorthy99 wrote:
910A wrote:

Okay I'll bite..You only want people to vote on election day...So you're okay with disenfranchise military members, other government workers, employees of private businesses that are assigned overseas? How about the election poll workers that have to vote early? How about the disabled that can't make it to a polling location? How about the ones that go to their polling location and find the ballots haven't been delivered or the voting machines aren't working, do they lose their right to vote or wait hours until the problem is solve? Myself, I like to vote at home, and researching ballot initiatives while drinking my favorite adult beverage...Voting by mail has been ultra popular in the states that allow it. In some states like Washington, Oregon, Utah, Colorado it's the only approved method to cast your ballot.


https://www.sightline.org/2020/09/14/in ... e-by-mail/


Absentee voting has existed for ever. I am not against it. What I think is regular voting should be on the voting day, like it is in Europe. If Tuesday is a problem, I am fine making it a Sunday. I just don't want the left to then complain that those religious conservatives go straight from church to the poll voting booth. Because is going to happen and we will certainly make the best of it.

In any case, I must say I have used early voting in the past, is convenient, I have used it because is there, but if you complain about 'losing democracy', Europeans don't complain at all for voting on just one day and showing government issued identification. Here in the US, we need to give people a month to vote, or even worse, bring the ballot to their beds or couches, and tell them how to vote and not ask for identification, that's what the left and democrats want. There is no 'voter suppression' in voting on election day and on a voting place and asking for identification.


You’re not making any sense - in the first paragraph you have no problem with absentee voting - in the second, we’re ‘bringing the ballot to their beds and couches’. What are you on about?

Bottom line: do you support expanded access beyond election day so that single parents, multi-job workers, long shift medical professionals, and out of state military / contract workers can vote? Yes or no.


Absentee voting is not the same as the vote by mail methods used recently because of COVID. This was widely used in this country in 2020.

Absentee voting has existed for a long time, and I do support. What I believe should be rescinded is mail by vote without verification and justification. Is just my opinion.
“It’s easy to confuse ‘what is’ with ‘what ought to be,’ especially when ‘what is’ has worked out in your favor.” Tyrion Lannister
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Sat Mar 27, 2021 11:48 pm

AirWorthy99 wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
AirWorthy99 wrote:

Absentee voting has existed for ever. I am not against it. What I think is regular voting should be on the voting day, like it is in Europe. If Tuesday is a problem, I am fine making it a Sunday. I just don't want the left to then complain that those religious conservatives go straight from church to the poll voting booth. Because is going to happen and we will certainly make the best of it.

In any case, I must say I have used early voting in the past, is convenient, I have used it because is there, but if you complain about 'losing democracy', Europeans don't complain at all for voting on just one day and showing government issued identification. Here in the US, we need to give people a month to vote, or even worse, bring the ballot to their beds or couches, and tell them how to vote and not ask for identification, that's what the left and democrats want. There is no 'voter suppression' in voting on election day and on a voting place and asking for identification.


You’re not making any sense - in the first paragraph you have no problem with absentee voting - in the second, we’re ‘bringing the ballot to their beds and couches’. What are you on about?

Bottom line: do you support expanded access beyond election day so that single parents, multi-job workers, long shift medical professionals, and out of state military / contract workers can vote? Yes or no.


Absentee voting is not the same as the vote by mail methods used recently because of COVID. This was widely used in this country in 2020.

Absentee voting has existed for a long time, and I do support. What I believe should be rescinded is mail by vote without verification and justification. Is just my opinion.


That’s a false Fox/talk radio claim. Absentee voting is not significantly different from mail-in voting - what do you think states based the standards from? ID check is not used by the majority of state absentee systems, including many red states:

https://www.ncsl.org/research/elections ... entee.aspx
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
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seb146
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Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Sun Mar 28, 2021 4:04 am

What is the break down of registered voters in Georgia? Like how many are registered as Democrat, how many registered as Republican, how many registered as Libertarian and so on?
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
LNCS0930
Posts: 180
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Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Sun Mar 28, 2021 4:22 am

Aaron747 wrote:
AirWorthy99 wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:

You’re not making any sense - in the first paragraph you have no problem with absentee voting - in the second, we’re ‘bringing the ballot to their beds and couches’. What are you on about?

Bottom line: do you support expanded access beyond election day so that single parents, multi-job workers, long shift medical professionals, and out of state military / contract workers can vote? Yes or no.


Absentee voting is not the same as the vote by mail methods used recently because of COVID. This was widely used in this country in 2020.

Absentee voting has existed for a long time, and I do support. What I believe should be rescinded is mail by vote without verification and justification. Is just my opinion.


That’s a false Fox/talk radio claim. Absentee voting is not significantly different from mail-in voting - what do you think states based the standards from? ID check is not used by the majority of state absentee systems, including many red states:

https://www.ncsl.org/research/elections ... entee.aspx


It’s way different dude. If it wasn’t then why did practically no states have results on election night this year where as in 2016 Michigan PA GA AZ were basically called on election night and 99% in. It’s remarkable how Ohio and Florida had no problems counting all their mailin ballots before election night but those other states all decide not to start counting til that day
 
LNCS0930
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Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Sun Mar 28, 2021 4:25 am

seb146 wrote:
Let's also not forget that Gov. Kemp oversaw an election he was running in. He was running for governor against Stacy Abrahms. But, instead of recusing himself from the tally, he remained as Secretary Of State in Georgia. HUGE conflict of interest. Now, he is guaranteeing his party, the party of MAGA, will be the only ones in control of Georgia. Until his plan backfires in 2022!


Warnock will probably lose in 2022, Democrats aren’t necessarily off to a good start here and in today’s electorate the party in power gets absolutely creamed in midterms every time. I don’t know what to think as far as the GA gov election in 2022 but Kemp will likely be primaried making it tough for Abrams to win. Personally I feel Abrams is a moron anyway for turning down several offers for positions in DC to be the governor of a rinky dink state
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Sun Mar 28, 2021 5:16 am

LNCS0930 wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
AirWorthy99 wrote:

Absentee voting is not the same as the vote by mail methods used recently because of COVID. This was widely used in this country in 2020.

Absentee voting has existed for a long time, and I do support. What I believe should be rescinded is mail by vote without verification and justification. Is just my opinion.


That’s a false Fox/talk radio claim. Absentee voting is not significantly different from mail-in voting - what do you think states based the standards from? ID check is not used by the majority of state absentee systems, including many red states:

https://www.ncsl.org/research/elections ... entee.aspx


It’s way different dude. If it wasn’t then why did practically no states have results on election night this year where as in 2016 Michigan PA GA AZ were basically called on election night and 99% in. It’s remarkable how Ohio and Florida had no problems counting all their mailin ballots before election night but those other states all decide not to start counting til that day


Anyone who works in a resource-limited organization can understand why. Turnout surged in all the places you name with similar budget and personnel to 2016, and FL really had their shit together and had been counting mail in ballots prior to election night. Other states' rules precluded doing so and they were not counted until polls were closed. Like, duh, dude.

Michigan 4.8 to 5.5 million 2016/2020

https://www.fox2detroit.com/news/michig ... et-in-2008

In any case your response is a non sequitur because the poster I replied to was talking about how ballots were mailed out, not how they were counted on election night. :boggled:
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DIRECTFLT
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Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Sun Mar 28, 2021 5:59 am

I enjoy voting early at any polling location in Dallas County. The last time I voted on a Presidential Election Day in 2008, there was inadequate parking at the polling site. People's cars were being towed.
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WIederling
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Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Sun Mar 28, 2021 11:58 am

seb146 wrote:
So, this whole notion of "Republicans can't get elected if we let people vote" is nonsense. i Maybe put up descent candidates and they will win elections instead of simply changing the rules so they stay in power. That's what these restrictive laws are about.


That imho is the wrong set of arguments to bring up.
Maybe there are overwhelmingly good reasons around why republicans should not get votes?

With their behavior they have left the "loyal in system (opposition or not)" grounds defined by the constitution.
( all are equal and such tripe.)
Vulgo: Enemies of the System.
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seb146
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Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Sun Mar 28, 2021 5:13 pm

WIederling wrote:
seb146 wrote:
So, this whole notion of "Republicans can't get elected if we let people vote" is nonsense. i Maybe put up descent candidates and they will win elections instead of simply changing the rules so they stay in power. That's what these restrictive laws are about.


That imho is the wrong set of arguments to bring up.
Maybe there are overwhelmingly good reasons around why republicans should not get votes?

With their behavior they have left the "loyal in system (opposition or not)" grounds defined by the constitution.
( all are equal and such tripe.)
Vulgo: Enemies of the System.


Republican party leaders admit they lose when people are allowed to vote

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/202 ... oronavirus
https://www.motherjones.com/politics/20 ... ople-vote/

They have no real ideas other than name calling and lying. Oh, and they took credit for the covid relief bill they voted against.
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victrola
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Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Sun Mar 28, 2021 5:49 pm

Here in Illinois, I have never waited more than a few minutes to vote. Any state where people have wait more than a few minutes to vote is obviously too incompetent to hold a free and fair election.
 
FGITD
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Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Sun Mar 28, 2021 5:57 pm

victrola wrote:
Here in Illinois, I have never waited more than a few minutes to vote. Any state where people have wait more than a few minutes to vote is obviously too incompetent to hold a free and fair election.


The issue is that they aren’t incompetent. Rather, they’re possibly a little too aware of how elections work. That enables them to do things like make 1 polling station for an area occupied by hundreds of thousands, etc.

If the only way for you to win an election is by limiting voters, you haven’t really won.

Also I’d love to see a higher court handle a case in which someone was arrested for giving another human water.

But hey, the republicans are the party of God. You all remember that section of the Bible wherein Jesus talked about how it was totally ok to not help your fellow man, right?
 
ltbewr
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Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Sun Mar 28, 2021 6:33 pm

To add to the controversy with this law in Georgia: The infamous and racially biased law was signed by Gov. Kemp in a closed room at the State Capital with only several other Republican legislative leaders and an 'official' photographer, kept out any possible objectors including arresting on trumped up felony charges of a Black Democrat member of the Legislature and in a photograph, in the background on the wall behind the Governor while doing the signing is a painting of a plantation house which had slaves. You can't make this stuff up. https://www.alternet.org/2021/03/brian-kemp/
 
bennett123
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Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Sun Mar 28, 2021 6:56 pm

FGITD wrote:
victrola wrote:
Here in Illinois, I have never waited more than a few minutes to vote. Any state where people have wait more than a few minutes to vote is obviously too incompetent to hold a free and fair election.


The issue is that they aren’t incompetent. Rather, they’re possibly a little too aware of how elections work. That enables them to do things like make 1 polling station for an area occupied by hundreds of thousands, etc.

If the only way for you to win an election is by limiting voters, you haven’t really won.

Also I’d love to see a higher court handle a case in which someone was arrested for giving another human water.

But hey, the republicans are the party of God. You all remember that section of the Bible wherein Jesus talked about how it was totally ok to not help your fellow man, right?


Which section of the bible is that. I always understood that helping your fellow man was encouraged.
 
victrola
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Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Sun Mar 28, 2021 10:41 pm

Do people really think you can buy someone's vote by offering them a bottle of water??? Last time I checked, we had secret ballots in this country. If someone gives you a bottle of water to support their candidate, how are they going to know if you voted for him or not? The simple fact is that Republicans in Georgia want people in certain districts to wait in long lines without water so that they get discouraged and go home.
 
luckyone
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Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Sun Mar 28, 2021 11:48 pm

LNCS0930 wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
AirWorthy99 wrote:

Absentee voting is not the same as the vote by mail methods used recently because of COVID. This was widely used in this country in 2020.

Absentee voting has existed for a long time, and I do support. What I believe should be rescinded is mail by vote without verification and justification. Is just my opinion.


That’s a false Fox/talk radio claim. Absentee voting is not significantly different from mail-in voting - what do you think states based the standards from? ID check is not used by the majority of state absentee systems, including many red states:

https://www.ncsl.org/research/elections ... entee.aspx


It’s way different dude. If it wasn’t then why did practically no states have results on election night this year where as in 2016 Michigan PA GA AZ were basically called on election night and 99% in. It’s remarkable how Ohio and Florida had no problems counting all their mailin ballots before election night but those other states all decide not to start counting til that day

The difference was Florida authorized their polling centers to count ballots received in the mail before Election Day. Georgia and Pennsylvania notably did NOT and the sheer volume of mail in ballots overwhelmed the polling centers (mail in ballots were originally permitted by the Republican state legislature which has controlled Georgia for over twenty years until they found the rule to be a straw man). Off the top of my head I can’t recall about Arizona. Georgia adjusted that rule to permit the counting of absentee ballots for the special runoff and but still took an extra day or two to completely count the numbers.
 
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c933103
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Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Sun Mar 28, 2021 11:50 pm

victrola wrote:
Do people really think you can buy someone's vote by offering them a bottle of water??? Last time I checked, we had secret ballots in this country. If someone gives you a bottle of water to support their candidate, how are they going to know if you voted for him or not? The simple fact is that Republicans in Georgia want people in certain districts to wait in long lines without water so that they get discouraged and go home.

It can make the reveivers feel they're being taken care of by one who hand them such items
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Aaron747
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Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Sun Mar 28, 2021 11:53 pm

c933103 wrote:
victrola wrote:
Do people really think you can buy someone's vote by offering them a bottle of water??? Last time I checked, we had secret ballots in this country. If someone gives you a bottle of water to support their candidate, how are they going to know if you voted for him or not? The simple fact is that Republicans in Georgia want people in certain districts to wait in long lines without water so that they get discouraged and go home.

It can make the reveivers feel they're being taken care of by one who hand them such items


Have you spent a lot of time in the US? Nobody will be moved by a bottle of water.
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LMP737
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Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Mon Mar 29, 2021 12:30 am

AirWorthy99 wrote:

Absentee voting is not the same as the vote by mail methods used recently because of COVID. This was widely used in this country in 2020


It gets to and from you house the same way does it not. Sounds like the same thing to me.

AirWorthy99 wrote:
Absentee voting has existed for a long time, and I do support. What I believe should be rescinded is mail by vote without verification and justification. Is just my opinion.


IMO states should just take the plunge and go to mail in voting. You attack it for the simple reason that it supposedly cost Donald Trump the election. But you really don't know much about it. I live in Washington state where voting is done by mail in ballots. They system works quite well and has bipartisan support in Olympia. With mail in voting you eliminate the issue of lines at polling stations, where to have them, how long they should be open etc. And you don't have to worry about arresting people because they gave someone a bottle of water.
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mjba257
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Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Mon Mar 29, 2021 12:47 am

My ideal electoral system:
- Election day is on Saturday
- All voting must occur in person on election day. Exceptions given to members of the military, people living overseas, etc.
- Mandatory voter ID
- Universal paper ballots. Electronic voting machines are vulnerable to hacking
- Regulation are how long campaigns can last. People are already talking about the 2024 election. In about a year and a half from now, people are going to start announcing their candidacies, almost two years out from election day. That is ridiculous. All campaigning should take place within a 6 week timeframe
- Green and Libertarian candidates are allowed to debate
- Proportional representation. The winner-take-all system is incredibly flawed and leads to skewed representation. How does it make any sense for somebody to win a state by a mere 537 votes and get ALL of said states electors? (I'm looking at you, 2000). And I'm a Republican who is saying that.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Mon Mar 29, 2021 12:53 am

mjba257 wrote:
My ideal electoral system:
- Election day is on Saturday
- All voting must occur in person on election day. Exceptions given to members of the military, people living overseas, etc.
- Mandatory voter ID
- Universal paper ballots. Electronic voting machines are vulnerable to hacking
- Regulation are how long campaigns can last. People are already talking about the 2024 election. In about a year and a half from now, people are going to start announcing their candidacies, almost two years out from election day. That is ridiculous. All campaigning should take place within a 6 week timeframe
- Green and Libertarian candidates are allowed to debate
- Proportional representation. The winner-take-all system is incredibly flawed and leads to skewed representation. How does it make any sense for somebody to win a state by a mere 537 votes and get ALL of said states electors? (I'm looking at you, 2000). And I'm a Republican who is saying that.


You have good points regarding winner take all apportionment, party showing, and campaign length. Another popular idea is public funding of campaigns only. A pool of taxpayer money is available, equal draw to all candidates in the primaries. The victor can then use fund set aside for winners for the home stretch. This takes the fundraising advantage out of the equation and forces candidates to win based on the best ideas and presentation of them.

As for voting only in person and allowing absentee only for expats and military: will you require Saturday employers to provide paid time off to vote, regardless of operational need?
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
mjba257
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Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Mon Mar 29, 2021 1:01 am

Aaron747 wrote:
mjba257 wrote:
My ideal electoral system:
- Election day is on Saturday
- All voting must occur in person on election day. Exceptions given to members of the military, people living overseas, etc.
- Mandatory voter ID
- Universal paper ballots. Electronic voting machines are vulnerable to hacking
- Regulation are how long campaigns can last. People are already talking about the 2024 election. In about a year and a half from now, people are going to start announcing their candidacies, almost two years out from election day. That is ridiculous. All campaigning should take place within a 6 week timeframe
- Green and Libertarian candidates are allowed to debate
- Proportional representation. The winner-take-all system is incredibly flawed and leads to skewed representation. How does it make any sense for somebody to win a state by a mere 537 votes and get ALL of said states electors? (I'm looking at you, 2000). And I'm a Republican who is saying that.


You have good points regarding winner take all apportionment, party showing, and campaign length. Another popular idea is public funding of campaigns only. A pool of taxpayer money is available, equal draw to all candidates in the primaries. The victor can then use fund set aside for winners for the home stretch. This takes the fundraising advantage out of the equation and forces candidates to win based on the best ideas and presentation of them.

As for voting only in person and allowing absentee only for expats and military: will you require Saturday employers to provide paid time off to vote, regardless of operational need?


As I've said, absentee voting will be permitted for certain people. There will be an application process etc to prove that you qualify to vote absentee. As for public funding of campaigns, I am open to said idea. I've long opposed the influence big money has in politics. I'm also an advocate of grassroots campaigning as well. Even though I am no fan of him politically, I do give praise to Bernie Sanders for proving that grassroots campaigning can work.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Mon Mar 29, 2021 1:09 am

mjba257 wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
mjba257 wrote:
My ideal electoral system:
- Election day is on Saturday
- All voting must occur in person on election day. Exceptions given to members of the military, people living overseas, etc.
- Mandatory voter ID
- Universal paper ballots. Electronic voting machines are vulnerable to hacking
- Regulation are how long campaigns can last. People are already talking about the 2024 election. In about a year and a half from now, people are going to start announcing their candidacies, almost two years out from election day. That is ridiculous. All campaigning should take place within a 6 week timeframe
- Green and Libertarian candidates are allowed to debate
- Proportional representation. The winner-take-all system is incredibly flawed and leads to skewed representation. How does it make any sense for somebody to win a state by a mere 537 votes and get ALL of said states electors? (I'm looking at you, 2000). And I'm a Republican who is saying that.


You have good points regarding winner take all apportionment, party showing, and campaign length. Another popular idea is public funding of campaigns only. A pool of taxpayer money is available, equal draw to all candidates in the primaries. The victor can then use fund set aside for winners for the home stretch. This takes the fundraising advantage out of the equation and forces candidates to win based on the best ideas and presentation of them.

As for voting only in person and allowing absentee only for expats and military: will you require Saturday employers to provide paid time off to vote, regardless of operational need?


As I've said, absentee voting will be permitted for certain people. There will be an application process etc to prove that you qualify to vote absentee. As for public funding of campaigns, I am open to said idea. I've long opposed the influence big money has in politics. I'm also an advocate of grassroots campaigning as well. Even though I am no fan of him politically, I do give praise to Bernie Sanders for proving that grassroots campaigning can work.


One would hope your application process was simple and flexible enough for the situations people have out there. Some PT and shift workers don’t know their schedules until the day or a couple days before. And medical professionals like RNs may find themselves suddenly covering shifts on planned days off. Same with reserve pilots.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
mjba257
Posts: 135
Joined: Tue Nov 17, 2020 1:21 am

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Mon Mar 29, 2021 1:15 am

Aaron747 wrote:
mjba257 wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:

You have good points regarding winner take all apportionment, party showing, and campaign length. Another popular idea is public funding of campaigns only. A pool of taxpayer money is available, equal draw to all candidates in the primaries. The victor can then use fund set aside for winners for the home stretch. This takes the fundraising advantage out of the equation and forces candidates to win based on the best ideas and presentation of them.

As for voting only in person and allowing absentee only for expats and military: will you require Saturday employers to provide paid time off to vote, regardless of operational need?


As I've said, absentee voting will be permitted for certain people. There will be an application process etc to prove that you qualify to vote absentee. As for public funding of campaigns, I am open to said idea. I've long opposed the influence big money has in politics. I'm also an advocate of grassroots campaigning as well. Even though I am no fan of him politically, I do give praise to Bernie Sanders for proving that grassroots campaigning can work.


One would hope your application process was simple and flexible enough for the situations people have out there. Some PT and shift workers don’t know their schedules until the day or a couple days before. And medical professionals like RNs may find themselves suddenly covering shifts on planned days off. Same with reserve pilots.


Again, I'm no policy genius. Exceptions can be made to the rules. But as a general rule, I want people voting in person on election day. It's the most secure way.
 
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Aaron747
Topic Author
Posts: 14501
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 2:07 am

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Mon Mar 29, 2021 2:04 am

mjba257 wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
mjba257 wrote:

As I've said, absentee voting will be permitted for certain people. There will be an application process etc to prove that you qualify to vote absentee. As for public funding of campaigns, I am open to said idea. I've long opposed the influence big money has in politics. I'm also an advocate of grassroots campaigning as well. Even though I am no fan of him politically, I do give praise to Bernie Sanders for proving that grassroots campaigning can work.


One would hope your application process was simple and flexible enough for the situations people have out there. Some PT and shift workers don’t know their schedules until the day or a couple days before. And medical professionals like RNs may find themselves suddenly covering shifts on planned days off. Same with reserve pilots.


Again, I'm no policy genius. Exceptions can be made to the rules. But as a general rule, I want people voting in person on election day. It's the most secure way.


Perhaps so, but that's up to each state, yeah? If Washingtonians or Alaskans prefer mail, so be it.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
mjba257
Posts: 135
Joined: Tue Nov 17, 2020 1:21 am

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Mon Mar 29, 2021 2:17 am

Aaron747 wrote:
mjba257 wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:

One would hope your application process was simple and flexible enough for the situations people have out there. Some PT and shift workers don’t know their schedules until the day or a couple days before. And medical professionals like RNs may find themselves suddenly covering shifts on planned days off. Same with reserve pilots.


Again, I'm no policy genius. Exceptions can be made to the rules. But as a general rule, I want people voting in person on election day. It's the most secure way.


Perhaps so, but that's up to each state, yeah? If Washingtonians or Alaskans prefer mail, so be it.


We can debate that all day, but my big issue is the winner-take-all system. I'm glad we agree that proportional representation is far preferable and would lead to a much more representative democracy. I've long been in favor of adopting a parliamentary system, although I don't know if that would be possible given constitutional constraints.
 
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Aaron747
Topic Author
Posts: 14501
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Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Mon Mar 29, 2021 3:40 am

mjba257 wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
mjba257 wrote:

Again, I'm no policy genius. Exceptions can be made to the rules. But as a general rule, I want people voting in person on election day. It's the most secure way.


Perhaps so, but that's up to each state, yeah? If Washingtonians or Alaskans prefer mail, so be it.


We can debate that all day, but my big issue is the winner-take-all system. I'm glad we agree that proportional representation is far preferable and would lead to a much more representative democracy. I've long been in favor of adopting a parliamentary system, although I don't know if that would be possible given constitutional constraints.


Parliamentary systems allow the government to be much more responsive and decisive. Obviously winner take all promotes gridlock and citizen grudges, and only moreso with stronger divisions.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
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casinterest
Posts: 13349
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Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Mon Mar 29, 2021 2:08 pm

c933103 wrote:
victrola wrote:
Do people really think you can buy someone's vote by offering them a bottle of water??? Last time I checked, we had secret ballots in this country. If someone gives you a bottle of water to support their candidate, how are they going to know if you voted for him or not? The simple fact is that Republicans in Georgia want people in certain districts to wait in long lines without water so that they get discouraged and go home.

It can make the reveivers feel they're being taken care of by one who hand them such items


Except that is the effect of the long lines at urban polling districts by the racist policies of the Georgia elections boards. The current laws only inflict more pain on the situation and make voting harder. The GOP in Georgia has put themselves on an Anti-American and Anti Democratic tilt, and it will continue for some time.
Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did..So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.--Mark Twain
 
victrola
Posts: 728
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 5:31 pm

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Mon Mar 29, 2021 4:12 pm

The only problem with the 2020 elections in Georgia was that some people in urban polling districts were forced to wait hours to vote. Why has the Georgia legislature, that is so taken in by the Republican Big Lie, done absolutely nothing to address the long waits? The only reason is blatant racism.
 
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seb146
Posts: 23579
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Mon Mar 29, 2021 5:56 pm

mjba257 wrote:
Again, I'm no policy genius. Exceptions can be made to the rules. But as a general rule, I want people voting in person on election day. It's the most secure way.


Oregon has been voting by mail for about 20 years with zero problems. We also have a program where, when someone goes to the DMV for their state issued ID or drivers license, as long as they are an eligible United States citizen, they are automatically registered to vote. Again, there have been no problems. We make it easier for legal Americans to vote, not harder for specific groups. My county has even expanded the number of drop sites for the next election making it even easier to vote.

Just for some perspective, Coos County has a huge majority of far right wing evangelicals. There are a large number of veterans and seniors as well. Much of the work force is in the service industry but fishing and timber are still huge money makers here. Loggers and fishers and retail/restaurant employees are not going to lose money to stand on line to vote. This way, their vote counts because they vote when they can.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
FGITD
Posts: 1529
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 1:44 pm

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Mon Mar 29, 2021 7:44 pm

Once again, the question is why.

Keep asking it and go down that rabbit hole.

Why does Georgia need these laws? It’s nothing to do with election security, because no cases of electoral fraud were found.

So again...why?

Keep going and eventually you end up at the answer, and it’s just plain old fashioned racism and control. Best way to keep winning is to prevent certain groups from voting.
 
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seb146
Posts: 23579
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Tue Mar 30, 2021 3:59 am

It was hard for minorities to vote before

https://www.ajc.com/politics/politics-b ... CTYS7DNPQ/

Republicans are just making it more difficult.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
LNCS0930
Posts: 180
Joined: Sun Mar 01, 2020 9:17 pm

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Tue Mar 30, 2021 4:27 am

victrola wrote:
The only problem with the 2020 elections in Georgia was that some people in urban polling districts were forced to wait hours to vote. Why has the Georgia legislature, that is so taken in by the Republican Big Lie, done absolutely nothing to address the long waits? The only reason is blatant racism.



This is BS. I saw 3-4 hour lines in white areas too
 
tommy1808
Posts: 14515
Joined: Thu Nov 21, 2013 3:24 pm

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Tue Mar 30, 2021 5:33 am

LNCS0930 wrote:
victrola wrote:
The only problem with the 2020 elections in Georgia was that some people in urban polling districts were forced to wait hours to vote. Why has the Georgia legislature, that is so taken in by the Republican Big Lie, done absolutely nothing to address the long waits? The only reason is blatant racism.



This is BS. I saw 3-4 hour lines in white areas too


what sort of income level where those?

Regardless, 3-4 hour lines are about 3-4 hours too long.

best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
AirbusCheerlead
Posts: 117
Joined: Mon Oct 11, 2010 4:20 pm

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Tue Mar 30, 2021 7:58 pm

Here in Switzerland, 23 years ago when I turned 18, I was automatically added to the voting register, and since then I get 3 to 4 big envelopes each year from my canton (~ a state). Inside are the ballots (or liste of the political parties when electing our government), my "Stimmrechtsausweis" (voting card) and usually 3 little pamphlet and a envelope with little holes.

During the voting weekend I can go to the polling place with my voting card and ballots in person or much easier, vote by mail.
To vote by mail I just have to put my ballots in the envelope with holes, and sign my voting card and put them back in the envelope that was sent to me (must be open carefully so that original envelope can be reused again).
On the voting card the address of the counting station is preprinted (put the card inside so that this part is in the window of the envelope). The envelope is prepaid so that the entire process is free of charge.

Usually I get three sets of ballots since ballots initiatives/referendums are on local, state and federal level.
In the pamphlets I see the exact text I have to vote on, and both sides (in favour or opposed) can explain there reasons.

When we elect our governments the process is the similar and in the last election I got to choose people from 13 political parties (of which 12 were finally represented in the cantonal parliament).

I don't know if we have the best voting system, but like to think that we have one of the best in the world.
 
phatfarmlines
Posts: 1840
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2001 12:06 pm

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Wed Mar 31, 2021 5:18 pm

DL CEO Ed Bastian responds. Buckle up, it's going to get messy in Georgia.

After backlash, Delta CEO says Ga. voting law ‘unacceptable’ (Source: AP News)

The Atlanta Journal-Constitution has a response from Governor Kemp, but it's behind a paywall.
 
User avatar
seb146
Posts: 23579
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Wed Mar 31, 2021 5:34 pm

phatfarmlines wrote:
DL CEO Ed Bastian responds. Buckle up, it's going to get messy in Georgia.

After backlash, Delta CEO says Ga. voting law ‘unacceptable’ (Source: AP News)

The Atlanta Journal-Constitution has a response from Governor Kemp, but it's behind a paywall.


It would be easy for Coca Cola and CNN and Tyler Perry Studios and so many businesses to simply move but how can one of the largest airline hubs simply move? It will get interesting!
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
LNCS0930
Posts: 180
Joined: Sun Mar 01, 2020 9:17 pm

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Wed Mar 31, 2021 5:57 pm

seb146 wrote:
phatfarmlines wrote:
DL CEO Ed Bastian responds. Buckle up, it's going to get messy in Georgia.

After backlash, Delta CEO says Ga. voting law ‘unacceptable’ (Source: AP News)

The Atlanta Journal-Constitution has a response from Governor Kemp, but it's behind a paywall.


It would be easy for Coca Cola and CNN and Tyler Perry Studios and so many businesses to simply move but how can one of the largest airline hubs simply move? It will get interesting!


It won’t even be a story in a few weeks. You don’t pick up and move over an election bill that the media is spinning being something it’s not. Relocation just aggravates your employees and results in unwanted costs. Also where are they doing business that’s cheaper? Florida? Texas? Tennesse? More red states.
 
Chemist
Posts: 872
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2015 4:46 am

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Wed Mar 31, 2021 10:09 pm

Texas will swing Blue soon enough.
Florida will go more blue when all the seniors die off.
Tennessee will probably always be red, though.
 
bhill
Posts: 1887
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2001 8:28 am

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Wed Mar 31, 2021 10:17 pm

c933103 wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
4. Prohibition of food/water assistance to people waiting in line. This is just nuts - unless the state will massively expand voting hours or drop box locations, long lines like we saw last year will return. Ridiculous and inhumane. The law notes that election workers can set up water tables. What if they don't? Someone can get arrested for bringing their wife / grandmother water? Total BS.

This is something I have read about from other sources and I don't understand why is it not being banned until now? Giving material benefits to voters right before they vote is one of the easiest way to influence their voting decision


Bullshit. Folks that are willing to stand in line for hours..half a day it is looking like, have already FIRMLY made up their mind who they are going to vote for...and with the shit the GOP is doing there....guess who they will NOT be voting for.
Carpe Pices
 
User avatar
seb146
Posts: 23579
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Thu Apr 01, 2021 5:07 pm

LNCS0930 wrote:
seb146 wrote:
phatfarmlines wrote:
DL CEO Ed Bastian responds. Buckle up, it's going to get messy in Georgia.

After backlash, Delta CEO says Ga. voting law ‘unacceptable’ (Source: AP News)

The Atlanta Journal-Constitution has a response from Governor Kemp, but it's behind a paywall.


It would be easy for Coca Cola and CNN and Tyler Perry Studios and so many businesses to simply move but how can one of the largest airline hubs simply move? It will get interesting!


It won’t even be a story in a few weeks. You don’t pick up and move over an election bill that the media is spinning being something it’s not. Relocation just aggravates your employees and results in unwanted costs. Also where are they doing business that’s cheaper? Florida? Texas? Tennesse? More red states.


This will continue to be a story since other MAGA states are trying the same thing.

https://www.brennancenter.org/our-work/ ... acker-2021

Again, the only way Republicans stay in power is keep everyone from voting, not actually doing anything productive.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
phatfarmlines
Posts: 1840
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2001 12:06 pm

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Fri Apr 02, 2021 1:38 am

Georgia House of Representatives vote to remove DL tax breaks to counter Bastian's claims:

“They like our public policy when we’re doing things that benefit them,” Ralston said, adding, “You don’t feed a dog that bites your hand. You got to keep that in mind sometimes.”

Georgia Senate did not bring the measure up for a vote before adjourning:

Georgia’s State Senate did not bring the House-backed measure up for a vote, effectively scuttling the GOP’s push to revoke the tax break. Some senators reportedly had reservations about revoking a financial incentive as Delta and other airlines contend with the negative effects of the coronavirus pandemic.

Georgia House votes to strip Delta of tax break after CEO criticized voting law (Source: Fox News)

Recall then-Lieutenant Gov. Casey Cagle attempted to threaten DL by removing tax breaks for cancelling its sales contract with the NRA, following the Parkland, FL high school shooting.

Georgia's Lt. Gov. Threatens To Kill Tax Break For Delta Air Lines Amid NRA Spat (Source: NPR)
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 18621
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Fri Apr 02, 2021 1:15 pm

FGITD wrote:
Once again, the question is why.

Keep asking it and go down that rabbit hole.

Why does Georgia need these laws? It’s nothing to do with election security, because no cases of electoral fraud were found.

So again...why?

Keep going and eventually you end up at the answer, and it’s just plain old fashioned racism and control. Best way to keep winning is to prevent certain groups from voting.

:checkmark: :checkmark: :checkmark: Even if we all know why.

phatfarmlines wrote:
DL CEO Ed Bastian responds. Buckle up, it's going to get messy in Georgia.

After backlash, Delta CEO says Ga. voting law ‘unacceptable’ (Source: AP News)

The Atlanta Journal-Constitution has a response from Governor Kemp, but it's behind a paywall.

GOP: Corporations are people subject to free speech.
Corporations: Stop transparently suppressing voters
GOP: Not like that.
Image
I don't take responsibility at all
 
SL1200MK2
Posts: 186
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2008 11:00 pm

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Fri Apr 02, 2021 8:01 pm

Looks like the MLB took some decisive action and moved the All Star Game from the state. Good for them.

https://www.sfgate.com/news/article/MLB ... 073086.php
 
Newark727
Posts: 2355
Joined: Tue Dec 29, 2009 6:42 pm

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Fri Apr 02, 2021 8:15 pm

SL1200MK2 wrote:
Looks like the MLB took some decisive action and moved the All Star Game from the state. Good for them.

https://www.sfgate.com/news/article/MLB ... 073086.php


I understand why they're doing it, but I feel sorry for the Atlanta baseball fans who'll miss out, especially because a lot of them probably abhor this law too.
 
LNCS0930
Posts: 180
Joined: Sun Mar 01, 2020 9:17 pm

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Fri Apr 02, 2021 8:19 pm

SL1200MK2 wrote:
Looks like the MLB took some decisive action and moved the All Star Game from the state. Good for them.

https://www.sfgate.com/news/article/MLB ... 073086.php


MLB in one day managed to outdo the dumbness of all the dumb things the NBA and NFL combined have ever done. That’s quite an accomplishment there
 
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Aaron747
Topic Author
Posts: 14501
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 2:07 am

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Fri Apr 02, 2021 8:29 pm

LNCS0930 wrote:
SL1200MK2 wrote:
Looks like the MLB took some decisive action and moved the All Star Game from the state. Good for them.

https://www.sfgate.com/news/article/MLB ... 073086.php


MLB in one day managed to outdo the dumbness of all the dumb things the NBA and NFL combined have ever done. That’s quite an accomplishment there


Oh I think you’ll find companies and fans across the land are behind the decision.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
LNCS0930
Posts: 180
Joined: Sun Mar 01, 2020 9:17 pm

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Fri Apr 02, 2021 8:41 pm

Aaron747 wrote:
LNCS0930 wrote:
SL1200MK2 wrote:
Looks like the MLB took some decisive action and moved the All Star Game from the state. Good for them.

https://www.sfgate.com/news/article/MLB ... 073086.php


MLB in one day managed to outdo the dumbness of all the dumb things the NBA and NFL combined have ever done. That’s quite an accomplishment there


Oh I think you’ll find companies and fans across the land are behind the decision.


I highly doubt that based off Twitter at the moment
 
AirWorthy99
Posts: 1333
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2020 7:57 pm

Re: Georgia Election Law Controversy

Fri Apr 02, 2021 9:09 pm

LNCS0930 wrote:
SL1200MK2 wrote:
Looks like the MLB took some decisive action and moved the All Star Game from the state. Good for them.

https://www.sfgate.com/news/article/MLB ... 073086.php


MLB in one day managed to outdo the dumbness of all the dumb things the NBA and NFL combined have ever done. That’s quite an accomplishment there


The left has managed to politicize everything in this country, this is the result.

They were so concerned about mis information, there has been so much of that with this law.

Yet these are the people who have no issue at all dealing with China, who doesnt even celebrate free elections, have concentration camps for ethinc minorities and last year let a virus that has killed millions of people spread.

But the “problem” is Georgia folks.
“It’s easy to confuse ‘what is’ with ‘what ought to be,’ especially when ‘what is’ has worked out in your favor.” Tyrion Lannister

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