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N583JB
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Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Wed Apr 21, 2021 4:55 pm

Yesterday afternoon, the Columbus Police Department responded to a disturbance in progress regarding an attempted stabbing. Upon arriving at the scene, the first officer walked up to a group of people outside and was immediately confronted with a young woman with a knife who knocked over one person and then pinned another girl against the hood of a car and tried to stab her. The officer opened fire and hit the assailant, killing her. This was all captured on video, video that was released within a few hours by the police department.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/04/21/us/ohio- ... index.html

Of course, with society being wrecked the way it is, race-agitators and race-baiters immediately began attempting to spread false information. Famous attorney Ben Crump tweeted that the police killed an "unarmed" child, despite the girl clearly being armed and in the process of attempting to stab someone when she was shot. Despite Crump very clearly being mistaken and peddling lies, he has left his assertion up on Twitter and has refused to acknowledge reality-

https://twitter.com/AttorneyCrump

Other people at the scene immediately (and falsely) claimed that the girl had dropped the knife before she was shot. The video proved these claims wrong, as well. Despite all of this, the ACLU in Columbus called the shooting a "murder" and protesters marched in downtown Columbus last night.

Thankfully, authorities were quick to release video and the Mayor of Columbus plainly stated that the officer opened fire to protect an innocent child from being attacked. This whole situation goes to show the lengths that some people go to in order to push false narratives and stoke racial divides.
 
extender
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Wed Apr 21, 2021 5:06 pm

No brainer and justified.
 
extender
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Wed Apr 21, 2021 5:31 pm

What is just as sad is the male kicking the girl that fell down in the head.
 
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casinterest
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Wed Apr 21, 2021 5:39 pm

This one is a tough one. It appears like everyone is normal(probably a shouting match) until the officer arrives and then all hell breaks loose.

I feel for the officer here as there was not much else he could have done in that short reaction time with that imminent threat..


This incident does highlight misinformation that does swirl around. This officer followed the law and training as provided.
 
NIKV69
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Wed Apr 21, 2021 6:02 pm

N583JB wrote:

This whole situation goes to show the lengths that some people go to in order to push false narratives and stoke racial divides.


Just like the Michael Brown incident when the story didn't fit any of the evidence but the lie was pushed and pushed. I can list others as well but the media was derelict in their duties when it comes to reporting news.
 
flybaurlax
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Wed Apr 21, 2021 6:03 pm

Stupid question - could he have not tased her instead of shooting her? Genuinely asking.
 
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scbriml
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Wed Apr 21, 2021 6:05 pm

casinterest wrote:
This one is a tough one. It appears like everyone is normal(probably a shouting match) until the officer arrives and then all hell breaks loose.


The police were responding to a 911 call about an attempted stabbing. It would seem the hell had already broken loose before they arrived

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/20/us/c ... oting.html
 
extender
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Wed Apr 21, 2021 6:11 pm

flybaurlax wrote:
Stupid question - could he have not tased her instead of shooting her? Genuinely asking.


Tasers don't always work. And deadly force was imminent. The perpetrator was in the process of stabbing the victim.
 
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casinterest
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Wed Apr 21, 2021 6:13 pm

scbriml wrote:
casinterest wrote:
This one is a tough one. It appears like everyone is normal(probably a shouting match) until the officer arrives and then all hell breaks loose.


The police were responding to a 911 call about an attempted stabbing. It would seem the hell had already broken loose before they arrived

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/20/us/c ... oting.html


I get that, but by looking at the video, they were outside in a standoff, and then when the officer arrived, the deceased seemed to go completely berserk. Not faulting the officer , or what brought them there.
 
johns624
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Wed Apr 21, 2021 6:23 pm

extender wrote:
flybaurlax wrote:
Stupid question - could he have not tased her instead of shooting her? Genuinely asking.


Tasers don't always work. And deadly force was imminent. The perpetrator was in the process of stabbing the victim.
Correct. Tasers are good for subduing unarmed, but belligerent people, but when a deadly weapon is involved and the person is already using it, then it's a case of bringing a knife to a gunfight.
 
phatfarmlines
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Wed Apr 21, 2021 6:50 pm

N583JB wrote:
.

Thankfully, authorities were quick to release video and the Mayor of Columbus plainly stated that the officer opened fire to protect an innocent child from being attacked. This whole situation goes to show the lengths that some people go to in order to push false narratives and stoke racial divides.


The same could be said of the Chauvin trial, especially the Fox News angle.

Regarding this case, as I mentioned in the Chauvin thread about this case, I do not think the cop will be prosecuted for shooting the teen with the knife.
 
Okie
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Wed Apr 21, 2021 7:00 pm

The police clearly need to adopt the Baltimore model when responding to a call.

Okie
 
bennett123
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Wed Apr 21, 2021 7:15 pm

Frankly, having the bodycam it is hard to fault the officer.

He/she had excellent reactions and was a damned good shot.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Wed Apr 21, 2021 10:58 pm

phatfarmlines wrote:
N583JB wrote:
.

Thankfully, authorities were quick to release video and the Mayor of Columbus plainly stated that the officer opened fire to protect an innocent child from being attacked. This whole situation goes to show the lengths that some people go to in order to push false narratives and stoke racial divides.


The same could be said of the Chauvin trial, especially the Fox News angle.

Regarding this case, as I mentioned in the Chauvin thread about this case, I do not think the cop will be prosecuted for shooting the teen with the knife.


Naturally there is nothing to prosecute for. But the media will again fail in their duty and gloss over how the teen who got shot got there.

As I said in the other thread regarding the attacker, she seemed to be in the throes of a mental episode that was violent. Not atypical of teens in foster homes, as she was. As a volunteer years ago, I encountered many similar individuals in halfway houses and SROs in inner city San Francisco, and they can go from zero to violent in seconds with variable triggers. Their amygdalas don't function properly, in addition to whatever else is part of their psyche from the emotional and physical abuse histories typical in foster care. These kids need proper professional care in a facility that knows what it's doing, but that costs money and we're not setup for that as a society - especially for lower income people.

Agitators and baiters don't help anything, but they exist on both sides. They distract from the conversation we should be having about prevention. One wants to make it all about power, the other wants to make it all about 'culture'. Way oversimplified - nobody wants to have the difficult discussions about the actual class and societal issues that underpin a lot of this. Nobody asked to be born to parents who were unfit - which happens to people of all ethnicities - and at least until 18 society needs to be doing a much better job for them.
 
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Kiwirob
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Thu Apr 22, 2021 4:46 am

When I watched this on CNN yesterday the anchors were clearly wanting to throw the officer under the bus, luckily the bodycam evidence is rock solid, I don't honestly believe there was any other course of action available to the officer other than this. Despite the media wanting another Floyd, this is clearly not it.
 
extender
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Thu Apr 22, 2021 7:23 am

Is it me or does the cop look like the guy from Burn Notice?

It isn't the usual agitators getting in on the narrative, LeBron James tweets "You're Next." Two black lives were saved, yet cry for the assailant. What is a cop to do next time? Let the knife fight go on and let them sort it out? Next will come the cries of why didn't the police do something?
 
vrbarreto
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Thu Apr 22, 2021 7:36 am

extender wrote:
Is it me or does the cop look like the guy from Burn Notice?

It isn't the usual agitators getting in on the narrative, LeBron James tweets "You're Next." Two black lives were saved, yet cry for the assailant. What is a cop to do next time? Let the knife fight go on and let them sort it out? Next will come the cries of why didn't the police do something?


Take some bets on who will win?

Her mother was saying that she had a 'motherly nature and promoted peace'. Either in shock or doesn't know the true nature of her daughter.
 
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Kiwirob
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Thu Apr 22, 2021 8:03 am

extender wrote:
Is it me or does the cop look like the guy from Burn Notice?

It isn't the usual agitators getting in on the narrative, LeBron James tweets "You're Next." Two black lives were saved, yet cry for the assailant. What is a cop to do next time? Let the knife fight go on and let them sort it out? Next will come the cries of why didn't the police do something?


How long will it be before police officers refuse to go to callouts in black neighbourhoods?
 
extender
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Thu Apr 22, 2021 8:59 am

How long before they refuse to go out on calls, period? Blu flu?


The video shows the teen wielding a knife as she rushes toward another girl. An officer yells “Get down! Get down!” then fires four shots as the girl swings at another with the knife.
Link

Nothing but an offensive move against an un-armed girl in a pink track suit.

Ma’khia Bryant, 16 years old, collapsed to the ground. A man can be heard yelling, “She’s just a [profamity] kid, man!”
Link

A kid with a knife with at least the intent to do great bodily harm, if not kill the other teen.

“She was a good kid. She was loving,” Hazel Bryant, who said the child was her niece, told reporters. “She didn’t deserve to die like a dog in the street.”
Link

So the other girl was supposed to die like a dog in the street?

Bryant said her niece had been living in a foster home on the east side of Columbus, where the fatal shooting took place. She said several adult women had come to the foster home and started an altercation with the teenager, who called police, and her biological father and grandmother for help. She grabbed a knife to defend herself, Bryant said.
Link

All fine up until she went from defense to offense.

Bryant, who said she had been told of the events by Ma’Khia’s grandmother and father, said Ma’khia was in front of the house fending off a physical assault when police arrived.
Link

Video shows Bryant as the agressor.

“The police are going to lie. I’m so thankful that someone from the family was actually on the scene,” Bryant said before the release of the bodycam footage.
Link

No, the family lies. What were they thinking? Stir the racist pot? Convince the world of her innocense? Going for a Crump Payday? Disgusting.

“The police are going to lie. The police are going to cover up for themselves. They don’t care. At this point, I feel like they’re just out to kill Black people. They’re not here to protect and serve. That isn’t happening. That’s been over a long time ago. They’re not here to protect and serve. They’re here to kill Black folks.”
Link

So it is OK for black people to kill black people? It was a justified use of force on the officer's behalf.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Thu Apr 22, 2021 9:36 am

extender wrote:
How long before they refuse to go out on calls, period? Blu flu?


The video shows the teen wielding a knife as she rushes toward another girl. An officer yells “Get down! Get down!” then fires four shots as the girl swings at another with the knife.
Link

Nothing but an offensive move against an un-armed girl in a pink track suit.

Ma’khia Bryant, 16 years old, collapsed to the ground. A man can be heard yelling, “She’s just a [profamity] kid, man!”
Link

A kid with a knife with at least the intent to do great bodily harm, if not kill the other teen.

“She was a good kid. She was loving,” Hazel Bryant, who said the child was her niece, told reporters. “She didn’t deserve to die like a dog in the street.”
Link

So the other girl was supposed to die like a dog in the street?

Bryant said her niece had been living in a foster home on the east side of Columbus, where the fatal shooting took place. She said several adult women had come to the foster home and started an altercation with the teenager, who called police, and her biological father and grandmother for help. She grabbed a knife to defend herself, Bryant said.
Link

All fine up until she went from defense to offense.

Bryant, who said she had been told of the events by Ma’Khia’s grandmother and father, said Ma’khia was in front of the house fending off a physical assault when police arrived.
Link

Video shows Bryant as the agressor.

“The police are going to lie. I’m so thankful that someone from the family was actually on the scene,” Bryant said before the release of the bodycam footage.
Link

No, the family lies. What were they thinking? Stir the racist pot? Convince the world of her innocense? Going for a Crump Payday? Disgusting.

“The police are going to lie. The police are going to cover up for themselves. They don’t care. At this point, I feel like they’re just out to kill Black people. They’re not here to protect and serve. That isn’t happening. That’s been over a long time ago. They’re not here to protect and serve. They’re here to kill Black folks.”
Link

So it is OK for black people to kill black people? It was a justified use of force on the officer's behalf.


Extensive coverage in the above but not a single question about the obvious tragic concern here: what was going on in this girl's family that she was staying in foster care?

And what is innocense? Is that like an aromatic form of non offense?
 
NIKV69
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Thu Apr 22, 2021 2:02 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
When I watched this on CNN yesterday the anchors were clearly wanting to throw the officer under the bus, luckily the bodycam evidence is rock solid, I don't honestly believe there was any other course of action available to the officer other than this. Despite the media wanting another Floyd, this is clearly not it.



The LeBron incident is worse. A law enforcement officer did his job with what he was given to work with in a tenth of a second and may saved that other girls life and instead of being thankful LeBron attacked him and the deleted the tweet like a coward and blamed hatred for having to do so and not his stupidity. Speaks volumes.
 
wingman
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Thu Apr 22, 2021 2:19 pm

NIKV69 wrote:
The LeBron incident is worse. A law enforcement officer did his job with what he was given to work with in a tenth of a second and may saved that other girls life and instead of being thankful LeBron attacked him and the deleted the tweet like a coward and blamed hatred for having to do so and not his stupidity. Speaks volumes.


People say stupid things and overreact all the time. Fox New does it every day. The other day a white guy on that network said other networks were trying to "lynch" Chauvin, as if he understood the meaning of the word. That's about the most supremacist, racist statement a #1 prime time "news anchor" could possibly make in front of 40M viewers. It doesn't excuse anything but I bet if you tried really hard you might understand how LeBron comes up with that tweet. Police and regular civilians alike have been disenfranchising, beating, lynching, enslaving and murdering blacks for 200+ years now. It affects the psyche. I don't see how this makes him any worse than the daily line up of racist mouthpieces that dominate our airwaves.

Stupid comment, but consider the emotional context.
 
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casinterest
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Thu Apr 22, 2021 2:26 pm

wingman wrote:
NIKV69 wrote:
The LeBron incident is worse. A law enforcement officer did his job with what he was given to work with in a tenth of a second and may saved that other girls life and instead of being thankful LeBron attacked him and the deleted the tweet like a coward and blamed hatred for having to do so and not his stupidity. Speaks volumes.


People say stupid things and overreact all the time. Fox New does it every day. The other day a white guy on that network said other networks were trying to "lynch" Chauvin, as if he understood the meaning of the word. That's about the most supremacist, racist statement a #1 prime time "news anchor" could possibly make in front of 40M viewers. It doesn't excuse anything but I bet if you tried really hard you might understand how LeBron comes up with that tweet. Police and regular civilians alike have been disenfranchising, beating, lynching, enslaving and murdering blacks for 200+ years now. It affects the psyche. I don't see how this makes him any worse than the daily line up of racist mouthpieces that dominate our airwaves.

Stupid comment, but consider the emotional context.



Lebron posted follow ups. and i think he deleted the initial tweet, because it does not reflect what happened, and he got flamed for it hard.

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/leb ... 00163.html

"Minutes later, he added in a second tweet that the message he deleted was "being used to create more hate."

He wrote, "I'm so damn tired of seeing Black people killed by police. I took the tweet down because its being used to create more hate -This isn't about one officer. it's about the entire system and they always use our words to create more racism. I am so desperate for more ACCOUNTABILITY."


There does need to be accountability, but not anger and vengeful actions. That is how George Floyd died. Being mad at the system does not help when the system actually gets it right, which is what happened in this case.
 
NIKV69
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Thu Apr 22, 2021 2:58 pm

wingman wrote:

People say stupid things and overreact all the time. Fox New does it every day. The other day a white guy on that network said other networks were trying to "lynch" Chauvin, as if he understood the meaning of the word. That's about the most supremacist, racist statement a #1 prime time "news anchor" could possibly make in front of 40M viewers. It doesn't excuse anything but I bet if you tried really hard you might understand how LeBron comes up with that tweet. Police and regular civilians alike have been disenfranchising, beating, lynching, enslaving and murdering blacks for 200+ years now. It affects the psyche. I don't see how this makes him any worse than the daily line up of racist mouthpieces that dominate our airwaves..


Maybe because LeBron's audience will go burn businesses to the ground like in Ferguson when similar lies led to riotiing. You can't use whataboutism to explain away this one. Get the facts straight before you hit send. It's not hard. Unless of course you loathe law enforcement which is easy to see.
 
wingman
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Thu Apr 22, 2021 3:31 pm

NIKV69 wrote:
wingman wrote:

People say stupid things and overreact all the time. Fox New does it every day. The other day a white guy on that network said other networks were trying to "lynch" Chauvin, as if he understood the meaning of the word. That's about the most supremacist, racist statement a #1 prime time "news anchor" could possibly make in front of 40M viewers. It doesn't excuse anything but I bet if you tried really hard you might understand how LeBron comes up with that tweet. Police and regular civilians alike have been disenfranchising, beating, lynching, enslaving and murdering blacks for 200+ years now. It affects the psyche. I don't see how this makes him any worse than the daily line up of racist mouthpieces that dominate our airwaves..


Maybe because LeBron's audience will go burn businesses to the ground like in Ferguson when similar lies led to riotiing. You can't use whataboutism to explain away this one. Get the facts straight before you hit send. It's not hard. Unless of course you loathe law enforcement which is easy to see.


Nope, you're not seeing anything. I know that for a fact. I support, donate to and appreciate law enforcement as much as any other American in this country. But I'm trying my level best to understand how and why people say and do things. It goes both ways. The real lie in all of this is how long we went without proof that bad cops have been lying for a hundred years. It's just now a lot of us are seeing the truth in video. 20 years ago Chauvin would've had a medal for bravery pinned to his lapel. Not today though. It's decades of that truth that drive black rage. People that can't understand that will simply need to die of old age before we start healing this racial divide. You're equating riots to all of that history and believing that LeBron and MSNBC pull the strings. The other side's been pulling ropes for a lot longer and the black body count is in the hundreds of thousands. The pictures are right their in the history books.
 
phatfarmlines
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Thu Apr 22, 2021 3:37 pm

Aaron747 wrote:

As I said in the other thread regarding the attacker, she seemed to be in the throes of a mental episode that was violent. Not atypical of teens in foster homes, as she was. As a volunteer years ago, I encountered many similar individuals in halfway houses and SROs in inner city San Francisco, and they can go from zero to violent in seconds with variable triggers. Their amygdalas don't function properly, in addition to whatever else is part of their psyche from the emotional and physical abuse histories typical in foster care. These kids need proper professional care in a facility that knows what it's doing, but that costs money and we're not setup for that as a society - especially for lower income people.

Agitators and baiters don't help anything, but they exist on both sides. They distract from the conversation we should be having about prevention. One wants to make it all about power, the other wants to make it all about 'culture'. Way oversimplified - nobody wants to have the difficult discussions about the actual class and societal issues that underpin a lot of this. Nobody asked to be born to parents who were unfit - which happens to people of all ethnicities - and at least until 18 society needs to be doing a much better job for them.


Okie wrote:
The police clearly need to adopt the Baltimore model when responding to a call.

Okie


I do agree with cities expanding the "Baltimore model" to send in mental health professionals to someone with a crisis. Granted, in this case, I don't think they would have been much help to assist someone with a deadly weapon. At that point, it's the jurisdiction of the police to protect the safety of the public.

I guess then this goes back to the foster system and its lack of mental health resources for those in foster care.
 
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casinterest
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Thu Apr 22, 2021 4:08 pm

Longer video and statements were released including the 911 calls.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/04/21/us/ohio- ... index.html

Should be noted the girl in pink definitely thought she was in danger.
 
FGITD
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Thu Apr 22, 2021 4:11 pm

NIKV69 wrote:
wingman wrote:

People say stupid things and overreact all the time. Fox New does it every day. The other day a white guy on that network said other networks were trying to "lynch" Chauvin, as if he understood the meaning of the word. That's about the most supremacist, racist statement a #1 prime time "news anchor" could possibly make in front of 40M viewers. It doesn't excuse anything but I bet if you tried really hard you might understand how LeBron comes up with that tweet. Police and regular civilians alike have been disenfranchising, beating, lynching, enslaving and murdering blacks for 200+ years now. It affects the psyche. I don't see how this makes him any worse than the daily line up of racist mouthpieces that dominate our airwaves..


Maybe because LeBron's audience will go burn businesses to the ground like in Ferguson when similar lies led to riotiing. You can't use whataboutism to explain away this one. Get the facts straight before you hit send. It's not hard. Unless of course you loathe law enforcement which is easy to see.


I remember a similar incident a few months ago. The news, social media, etc were blowing up with exaggerated lies. Whipped the people up into a frenzy and resulted in an angry mob that injured more than 130 police officers. All based on a lie.

Of course you don’t care because in that case they were trying to attack legally elected democratic leadership, and clearly it’s only worth noting when the mob goes after Nike stores and Best Buy.

Oops, I guess that’s whataboutism. Don’t care. One group used lies to try and overthrow the government, that pretty much supersedes the other. There’s no coming back from that
 
AirbusCheerlead
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Thu Apr 22, 2021 4:23 pm

Maybe someone can explain the pro and cons. But when I was younger, in the Swiss Air Force, the few times we trained, we always had to go for a non lethal shot.

I was in no way a good shoter, but still always managed to hit the "leg" even if the target was mobile...

Best regards and stay safe,
Jonas
 
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Kiwirob
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Thu Apr 22, 2021 5:00 pm

AirbusCheerlead wrote:
Maybe someone can explain the pro and cons. But when I was younger, in the Swiss Air Force, the few times we trained, we always had to go for a non lethal shot.

I was in no way a good shoter, but still always managed to hit the "leg" even if the target was mobile...

Best regards and stay safe,
Jonas


The femoral artery is pretty big if you shoot the thigh chances are you might sever it, then they’re dead in minutes.
 
extender
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Thu Apr 22, 2021 5:06 pm

Plenty of videos out there of femoral bleed outs. If you don't wrap a tourniquet immediately, they have a few minutes. Law enforcement, and defensive training is made to hit center mass. No way of knowing if the shot placement will be lethal or non-lethal.
 
bennett123
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Thu Apr 22, 2021 5:25 pm

According to her mother, she was 'a loving, peaceful girl'

Could have fooled me.
 
AirbusCheerlead
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Thu Apr 22, 2021 5:44 pm

extender wrote:
Plenty of videos out there of femoral bleed outs. If you don't wrap a tourniquet immediately, they have a few minutes. Law enforcement, and defensive training is made to hit center mass. No way of knowing if the shot placement will be lethal or non-lethal.


Thanks for the answer (also Kiwirob).

True about the femoral bleed. But in our training we were also told that after the shot we must assist the person we shot and were trained to to do so.
It seem to me legs and shoulder shot have better chance of survival than upper body...

Is Center mass = upper body? And when you say "Law enforcement, and defensive training" is that in the US or all over the world?

Best regards and stay safe,
Jonas
 
extender
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Thu Apr 22, 2021 6:07 pm

AirbusCheerlead wrote:

Is Center mass = upper body? And when you say "Law enforcement, and defensive training" is that in the US or all over the world?

Best regards and stay safe,
Jonas


Yes, imagine the body center line, from the top of the breastbone. to about 125mm below the bottom of the sternum.
 
johns624
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Thu Apr 22, 2021 6:19 pm

AirbusCheerlead wrote:
Maybe someone can explain the pro and cons. But when I was younger, in the Swiss Air Force, the few times we trained, we always had to go for a non lethal shot.
I was in no way a good shoter, but still always managed to hit the "leg" even if the target was mobile...

Best regards and stay safe,
Jonas

Do Swiss fighter pilots train for non lethal missile launches and gun attacks? You aim for center of mass to stop the assailant as fast as possible. Not necessarily to kill, but to stop as soon as possible. In a stressful situation, you aim for center of mass because it's the easiest area to hit and has the most organs that, if hit, will incapacitate quicker.
 
art
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Thu Apr 22, 2021 6:36 pm

AirbusCheerlead wrote:
extender wrote:
Plenty of videos out there of femoral bleed outs. If you don't wrap a tourniquet immediately, they have a few minutes. Law enforcement, and defensive training is made to hit center mass. No way of knowing if the shot placement will be lethal or non-lethal.


Thanks for the answer (also Kiwirob).

True about the femoral bleed. But in our training we were also told that after the shot we must assist the person we shot and were trained to to do so.
It seem to me legs and shoulder shot have better chance of survival than upper body...


The assailant needed to be disabled immediately once she made to stab the female in pink. She was what,,, a half second to a second and a half away from sinking a knife into her target? To aim elsewhere than the largest target (the assailant's torso) would have risked missing or not incapacitating the assailant. I think that at the moment the intended assault unfolded the police officer took the right course of action. Sadly the assailant's action proved lethal to herself.
 
dfwjim1
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Fri Apr 23, 2021 12:15 am

Kiwirob wrote:
extender wrote:
Is it me or does the cop look like the guy from Burn Notice?

It isn't the usual agitators getting in on the narrative, LeBron James tweets "You're Next." Two black lives were saved, yet cry for the assailant. What is a cop to do next time? Let the knife fight go on and let them sort it out? Next will come the cries of why didn't the police do something?


How long will it be before police officers refuse to go to callouts in black neighbourhoods?


In my opinion large black urban areas/communities should be patrolled only by black officers.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Fri Apr 23, 2021 12:22 am

dfwjim1 wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:
extender wrote:
Is it me or does the cop look like the guy from Burn Notice?

It isn't the usual agitators getting in on the narrative, LeBron James tweets "You're Next." Two black lives were saved, yet cry for the assailant. What is a cop to do next time? Let the knife fight go on and let them sort it out? Next will come the cries of why didn't the police do something?


How long will it be before police officers refuse to go to callouts in black neighbourhoods?


In my opinion large black urban areas/communities should be patrolled only by black officers.


Another measure - though hard to enforce - is hiring people who live within/near the served community. Commuting into higher crime areas from suburbs 30 miles away leads to being less invested in the community.
 
johns624
Posts: 4000
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Fri Apr 23, 2021 1:02 am

Aaron747 wrote:
dfwjim1 wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:

How long will it be before police officers refuse to go to callouts in black neighbourhoods?


In my opinion large black urban areas/communities should be patrolled only by black officers.


Another measure - though hard to enforce - is hiring people who live within/near the served community. Commuting into higher crime areas from suburbs 30 miles away leads to being less invested in the community.
Just to be a devil's advocate, it also prevents the officer's children from being harassed because their dad is the local cop.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Fri Apr 23, 2021 1:18 am

johns624 wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
dfwjim1 wrote:

In my opinion large black urban areas/communities should be patrolled only by black officers.


Another measure - though hard to enforce - is hiring people who live within/near the served community. Commuting into higher crime areas from suburbs 30 miles away leads to being less invested in the community.
Just to be a devil's advocate, it also prevents the officer's children from being harassed because their dad is the local cop.


Understandable but that cuts both ways. Plenty of small town folks will tell you the local cop’s kid was the king bully in high school.
 
CaptHadley
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Fri Apr 23, 2021 2:02 am

Aaron747 wrote:
dfwjim1 wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:

How long will it be before police officers refuse to go to callouts in black neighbourhoods?


In my opinion large black urban areas/communities should be patrolled only by black officers.


Another measure - though hard to enforce - is hiring people who live within/near the served community. Commuting into higher crime areas from suburbs 30 miles away leads to being less invested in the community.


The Detroit Police Dept had that residency clause on it's books for many years. The Michigan legislature passed a law prohibiting cities from requiring any employees to live within the city boundaries. I believe Chicago still has that requirement however a majority of the police/fire live in one area of the city. I can't recall the name of the area and Google was no help. Basically a city within a city, cops only selling to other cops when they move, quit or retire. The whole "live in the community" is moot when you make your own city.
 
johns624
Posts: 4000
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Fri Apr 23, 2021 2:06 am

Aaron747 wrote:
johns624 wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
G
Another measure - though hard to enforce - is hiring people who live within/near the served community. Commuting into higher crime areas from suburbs 30 miles away leads to being less invested in the community.
Just to be a devil's advocate, it also prevents the officer's children from being harassed because their dad is the local cop.


Understandable but that cuts both ways. Plenty of small town folks will tell you the local cop’s kid was the king bully in high school.
Good point!
In my 15 years of working in gun shops with a large LE clientele, I learned that many (probably majority) fell into one of two groups. First was ex-HS jocks who wanted to keep picking on people. Or, late bloomers who were picked on in HS and wanted to get back at the bullies.
What was surprising was that the most low key ones were from Detroit. It was mainly the suburban ones with the shaved heads and attitudes.
 
CaptHadley
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Fri Apr 23, 2021 2:31 am

johns624 wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
johns624 wrote:
Just to be a devil's advocate, it also prevents the officer's children from being harassed because their dad is the local cop.


Understandable but that cuts both ways. Plenty of small town folks will tell you the local cop’s kid was the king bully in high school.
Good point!
In my 15 years of working in gun shops with a large LE clientele, I learned that many (probably majority) fell into one of two groups. First was ex-HS jocks who wanted to keep picking on people. Or, late bloomers who were picked on in HS and wanted to get back at the bullies.


You deduced all of that by being a gun salesman?
Neighbor of mine who is a now retired police officer said when he was on the interview committee for new applicants the one sure thing to get you out of the running was having work/worked at a gun shop. If they saw that on an application or it came up in the interview you were done. He said "Those people were just plain scary"
 
johns624
Posts: 4000
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Fri Apr 23, 2021 2:35 am

CaptHadley wrote:
johns624 wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:

Understandable but that cuts both ways. Plenty of small town folks will tell you the local cop’s kid was the king bully in high school.
Good point!
In my 15 years of working in gun shops with a large LE clientele, I learned that many (probably majority) fell into one of two groups. First was ex-HS jocks who wanted to keep picking on people. Or, late bloomers who were picked on in HS and wanted to get back at the bullies.


You deduced all of that by being a gun salesman?
Neighbor of mine who is a now retired police officer said when he was on the interview committee for new applicants the one sure thing to get you out of the running was having work/worked at a gun shop. If they saw that on an application or it came up in the interview you were done. He said "Those people were just plain scary"
Yeah, I did. Part of selling guns is "getting to know the customer". The ATF even has a video about it. Many of them had a bad attitude. They didn't seem to know that they were off duty and didn't have to be aggressive and treat everyone like a criminal. What's so scary about gun shop workers? It's no different than any other selling job...everyone's different.
 
CaptHadley
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Fri Apr 23, 2021 2:47 am

johns624 wrote:
CaptHadley wrote:
johns624 wrote:
Good point!
In my 15 years of working in gun shops with a large LE clientele, I learned that many (probably majority) fell into one of two groups. First was ex-HS jocks who wanted to keep picking on people. Or, late bloomers who were picked on in HS and wanted to get back at the bullies.


You deduced all of that by being a gun salesman?
Neighbor of mine who is a now retired police officer said when he was on the interview committee for new applicants the one sure thing to get you out of the running was having work/worked at a gun shop. If they saw that on an application or it came up in the interview you were done. He said "Those people were just plain scary"
Yeah, I did. Part of selling guns is "getting to know the customer". The ATF even has a video about it. Many of them had a bad attitude. They didn't seem to know that they were off duty and didn't have to be aggressive and treat everyone like a criminal. What's so scary about gun shop workers? It's no different than any other selling job...everyone's different.


Going by what he said, that they were overly enthralled with firearms, every aspect of firearms to the point where they came across as just hoping someone would come in to rob the place. Plus he said he never understood why you needed to carry two guns on your belt and one on your ankle. His words were "Are you gonna get into a firefight with the local cartel? What I did notice is that you got defensive about gun salesman but had no problem painting police officers with a wide brush. Everyone is different, cept of course the popo, probs majority right?
 
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DIRECTFLT
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Fri Apr 23, 2021 5:47 am

dfwjim1 wrote:
In my opinion large black urban areas/communities should be patrolled only by black officers.


I have also thought that if a race has a majority in a community, the police hired and trained should be of that majority race. I'll leave it a race, and not require the major sexual identity or the major religion (or denomination, or sect) to have to be required.

And, I have serious question to add... Do rubber bullets work??
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Fri Apr 23, 2021 6:10 am

DIRECTFLT wrote:
dfwjim1 wrote:
In my opinion large black urban areas/communities should be patrolled only by black officers.


I have also thought that if a race has a majority in a community, the police hired and trained should be of that majority race. I'll leave it a race, and not require the major sexual identity or the major religion (or denomination, or sect) to have to be required.

And, I have serious question to add... Do rubber bullets work??


Of course - they hurt like hell and stun the target. But also impractical because how would you know which type to use in advance on a call?
 
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casinterest
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Fri Apr 23, 2021 12:37 pm

Aaron747 wrote:
art wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
What gives?


Good question. A girl makes a move to stab another girl. The girl with the knife is shot. What was the street protest protesting about?


I don’t know - my point was CNN is reporting what all sides are saying about it. As I stated upthread, this should be an opportunity to discuss how to prevent at risk teens from becoming mental cases. If we could get the Ben Crumps and police union advocates out of the way, it might be possible to address major issues.



Every story is unique. Folks that like to use the "far left" media are usually parroting the party line of media companies that exist to demonize people and create fear.

It would be interesting to see other solutions for policing and takedowns, because having to gun someone down in 15 seconds, tends to leave everyone affected by a traumatic event

I think the officer had no choice but to fire in this case, but one person still wound up dead. It just wasn't the potential knifing victim.
 
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c933103
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Fri Apr 23, 2021 1:29 pm

DIRECTFLT wrote:
dfwjim1 wrote:
In my opinion large black urban areas/communities should be patrolled only by black officers.


I have also thought that if a race has a majority in a community, the police hired and trained should be of that majority race. I'll leave it a race, and not require the major sexual identity or the major religion (or denomination, or sect) to have to be required.

And, I have serious question to add... Do rubber bullets work??

According to my understanding, rubber bullets usually work as deterrent and make one feel pain, sometimes causing injuries, unlikely but not impossible to have fatal consequences, whether that works at stopping offender/suspect depends on mental status and determination of the offender/suspect
 
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c933103
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Re: Columbus Police Shooting and Misinformation

Fri Apr 23, 2021 1:37 pm

Okie wrote:
The police clearly need to adopt the Baltimore model when responding to a call.

Okie

According to quick internet search, Baltimore model of handling 911 call can only makes a different when there aren't life endangering emergency being reported

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