Moderators: richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
frmrCapCadet
Topic Author
Posts: 4808
Joined: Thu May 29, 2008 8:24 pm

Why News is Not Covered as Well and as Accurately as in Times of Yore

Sat Apr 24, 2021 5:02 pm

https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-ne ... ewspapers/

Read it and weep. Several centuries of what was part and parcel of the Enlightenment and our history is irrevocably gone. No one is really to blame, it just happens. Don't be quite so critical of reporters who are not quite accurate. They are spread so thin over so much.

What really jumped out at me was in the heydays of print the Seattle area had more than 400 reporters just covering the neighborhood newspapers. The big metropolitan newspapers had their own extensive staffs. Online is starting to effectively taking their place, but it is not happening quickly, and reporters cost money, say with benefits, business expenses about $100K a year apiece.
Buffet: the airline business...has eaten up capital...like..no other (business)
 
Virtual737
Posts: 1042
Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2016 6:16 am

Re: Why News is Not Covered as Well and as Accurately as in Times of Yore

Sat Apr 24, 2021 5:13 pm

Too much competition. Have to make a headline to make sales, even if it's made up.

What really gets my goat is the ridiculous amount of spelling and grammatical errors with online "news" sites - even the bigger ones such as Sky News.
 
luckyone
Posts: 3878
Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2008 1:50 pm

Re: Why News is Not Covered as Well and as Accurately as in Times of Yore

Sat Apr 24, 2021 5:14 pm

It's almost as if Politico read your mind:

https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/ ... ony-484072
 
Virtual737
Posts: 1042
Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2016 6:16 am

Re: Why News is Not Covered as Well and as Accurately as in Times of Yore

Sat Apr 24, 2021 5:25 pm

Forgot to mention and was reminded by the above. Many "news" sites aren't really news. They are opinion, with a semi permanent bias.
 
frmrCapCadet
Topic Author
Posts: 4808
Joined: Thu May 29, 2008 8:24 pm

Re: Why News is Not Covered as Well and as Accurately as in Times of Yore

Sat Apr 24, 2021 5:50 pm

Luckyone - interesting link, I don't regularly read Politico (too much time online as is)

And a more general comment. Wikipedia works hard at being accurate and most succeeds, but an ongoing battle. Local news blogs really need a paid editor or two, but it is difficult to come up with enough ad money to do it. I see the editor's job as assessing volunteers posts as to known reliability. Posts would be ranked as to how reliable that person has generally been. Some spelling and grammatical corrections could be made by the editor, but frankly, accuracy and clarity is more important than those minor errors.
Buffet: the airline business...has eaten up capital...like..no other (business)
 
User avatar
NWAESC
Posts: 1694
Joined: Thu Aug 30, 2007 1:02 pm

Re: Why News is Not Covered as Well and as Accurately as in Times of Yore

Sat Apr 24, 2021 6:46 pm

We all lament the loss of objective and long-form reporting but have repeatedly shown that by and large, we're not willing to pay for it.

We've decided that settling for access journalism and/or hot takes on FB are acceptable substitutes. It sucks.

That budget hearing in Ballard? The local school board elections? Those matter.

I do see glimmers of hope in the rise of platforms like Substack and other microblogging sites. It's not the same as the august papers of record we might be used to, but it's better than most of what's out there now.
"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
 
User avatar
lightsaber
Moderator
Posts: 22108
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2005 10:55 pm

Re: Why News is Not Covered as Well and as Accurately as in Times of Yore

Sat Apr 24, 2021 7:29 pm

Virtual737 wrote:
Forgot to mention and was reminded by the above. Many "news" sites aren't really news. They are opinion, with a semi permanent bias.

This I must agree with. Even some once respectable sites. I've seen uncut and unedited video that often told the opposite of what was reported.

I want facts and I'll form my own opinion.

Lightsaber
6 months without TV. The best decision of my life.
 
jetwet1
Posts: 3321
Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2007 4:42 am

Re: Why News is Not Covered as Well and as Accurately as in Times of Yore

Sat Apr 24, 2021 7:37 pm

The simple answer is money.

Rather than trying to appeal mass market, the channels (not counting NBC, ABC and CBS) who still somewhat (no matter what Trump says) report in a general manner, cable news channels are going after a small portion of the audience.

Roger Ailes figured this out and made News Corp a fortune in reporting the "news" in a manner that would only appeal to the right (politically speaking) and was able to corner a large part of that demographic.
 
davidjohnson6
Posts: 1387
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2016 10:10 pm

Re: Why News is Not Covered as Well and as Accurately as in Times of Yore

Sat Apr 24, 2021 7:55 pm

30 years ago, news reporting was remarkably slow-paced and people had limited access to it. If something major happened in a country far away, there was maybe 2 or 3 TV channels that might cover it - or you had to rely on the newspaper the following day. Now, if something happens in FarFarAwayiStan - I can read articles from local journalists who are on-site with knowledge of the area, written in their regional dialect and translated into English, largely for free. Unless you are a BBC, CNN or equivalent, you simply cannot compete - we simply have a surfeit of high quality and immediately reported news

So, to the OP - I think the situation is quite the contrary. We look to news gathering in the 1980s with rosy-eyes. What was deemed good quality then, would be out-of-date yesterday's news with a complete lack of detail by now
 
petertenthije
Posts: 4175
Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2001 10:00 pm

Re: Why News is Not Covered as Well and as Accurately as in Times of Yore

Sat Apr 24, 2021 8:36 pm

davidjohnson6 wrote:
30 years ago, news reporting was remarkably slow-paced and people had limited access to it. If something major happened in a country far away, there was maybe 2 or 3 TV channels that might cover it - or you had to rely on the newspaper the following day. Now, if something happens in FarFarAwayiStan - I can read articles from local journalists who are on-site with knowledge of the area, written in their regional dialect and translated into English, largely for free. Unless you are a BBC, CNN or equivalent, you simply cannot compete - we simply have a surfeit of high quality and immediately reported news

So, to the OP - I think the situation is quite the contrary. We look to news gathering in the 1980s with rosy-eyes. What was deemed good quality then, would be out-of-date yesterday's news with a complete lack of detail by now

There are two angles to that though.

Yes, it is good to get the local view, and it has certainly broadened perspectives for those willing to look for it. But those that only want to go to their local website(s) of choice, they get a more limited view and more politically slanted then in the days of yonder.

So, how many people are actually willing to look for the local news? To take the bother of reading foreign news in their local language. Keep in mind, Google translate is a great help, but not flawless either.

And even if the message is translated perfectly... do you know which local news agency is serious and which is the local version of "the onion"... or worse, some local propaganda mouth piece? Everyone that speaks English knows Fox News is biased, but do you know if Algemeen Dagblad, Gazet van Antwerpen, Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung, Izvestia or La Repubblica are biased?
The first thing to remember is always treat your kite like you treat your woman.
Get inside her five times a day and take her to heaven and back!
Lord Flashheart, 1989
 
frmrCapCadet
Topic Author
Posts: 4808
Joined: Thu May 29, 2008 8:24 pm

Re: Why News is Not Covered as Well and as Accurately as in Times of Yore

Sat Apr 24, 2021 11:57 pm

I started to quit watching TV news in the late 70s. (prior millennium - LOL). Still an inveterate newspaper reader (4-5 a day, sometimes more). Good news reporting is hard to find. VOX was great, but their 2 star reporters have moved on. I even miss the multiple page ads from Nordstrom, Bon Marche, and innumerable others in the Sunday papers. Reliable news is out there, but also a lot of institutionalized faux reporting.
Buffet: the airline business...has eaten up capital...like..no other (business)
 
NIKV69
Posts: 14262
Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2004 4:27 am

Re: Why News is Not Covered as Well and as Accurately as in Times of Yore

Sun Apr 25, 2021 12:51 am

There are no Walter Conkrites or Edward R Murrows anymore that is for sure.
90 Day Fiancé has taught me that Russian woman are excellent.
 
WIederling
Posts: 10044
Joined: Sun Sep 13, 2015 2:15 pm

Re: Why News is Not Covered as Well and as Accurately as in Times of Yore

Sun Apr 25, 2021 7:30 am

Virtual737 wrote:
Forgot to mention and was reminded by the above. Many "news" sites aren't really news. They are opinion, with a semi permanent bias.


Guess what the Hearst Empire got big on.
News outlets leading their readership by the nose is not new.
( just read newspapers from around Europe just before WWI )

What changed just slightly is
A: it is easier to compare sources ( and there are more of those )
B: some psychotic at home has more reach than in paper times.
C: tools of the trade for "moving the masses" have massively improved.
D: Most recipients have been (successfully) trained over decades to
act reflexively on their hind brain being triggered. They don't think.
Murphy is an optimist
 
WIederling
Posts: 10044
Joined: Sun Sep 13, 2015 2:15 pm

Re: Why News is Not Covered as Well and as Accurately as in Times of Yore

Sun Apr 25, 2021 7:37 am

petertenthije wrote:
And even if the message is translated perfectly... do you know which local news agency is serious and which is the local version of "the onion"... or worse, some local propaganda mouth piece? Everyone that speaks English knows Fox News is biased, but do you know if Algemeen Dagblad, Gazet van Antwerpen, Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung, Izvestia or La Repubblica are biased?


They are all biased in some way. ( and the educated part of the readership knows that and works with it.)

What makes the difference is omissions and plain lies.
( Myanmar: what is in the news is the military having putched and shooting at their own people.
what gets no mention is that _removing the constitutional blocking minority vote of the military_ was the starting point. )
Murphy is an optimist
 
Virtual737
Posts: 1042
Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2016 6:16 am

Re: Why News is Not Covered as Well and as Accurately as in Times of Yore

Sun Apr 25, 2021 7:39 am

WIederling wrote:
Virtual737 wrote:
Forgot to mention and was reminded by the above. Many "news" sites aren't really news. They are opinion, with a semi permanent bias.


Guess what the Hearst Empire got big on.
News outlets leading their readership by the nose is not new.
( just read newspapers from around Europe just before WWI )

What changed just slightly is
A: it is easier to compare sources ( and there are more of those )
B: some psychotic at home has more reach than in paper times.
C: tools of the trade for "moving the masses" have massively improved.
D: Most recipients have been (successfully) trained over decades to
act reflexively on their hind brain being triggered. They don't think.


Indeed. I'd also add that raw news is just boring to most people, or they don't have the thought process or can't be bothered to work out the implications of the facts for themselves. News needs to be entertaining, so it needs embellishment, exaggeration and opinion for many or they just don't give a toss.

We live in a world where a YouTube "influencer" can get more viewers than the 9 O'Clock news... which worries the hell out of me. Still, it's part of progress I guess.
 
User avatar
Aesma
Posts: 14277
Joined: Sat Nov 14, 2009 6:14 am

Re: Why News is Not Covered as Well and as Accurately as in Times of Yore

Sun Apr 25, 2021 12:36 pm

NWAESC wrote:
We all lament the loss of objective and long-form reporting but have repeatedly shown that by and large, we're not willing to pay for it.


I'm too young to have ever bought newspapers, but I see even my parents who did most of their lives have stopped.

I think a way to pay for online articles you found informative would be good, without having to subscribe to a newspaper or online TV channel for that matter.

Instead of a fixed price it could be a like or something like that, and you would pledge a certain amount every month to the system, that would then be redistributed according to your likes.

Basically like streaming services.

Paying to get access is problematic, it creates a barrier.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
Virtual737
Posts: 1042
Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2016 6:16 am

Re: Why News is Not Covered as Well and as Accurately as in Times of Yore

Sun Apr 25, 2021 12:40 pm

Aesma wrote:

I'm too young to have ever bought newspapers


In that one innocent comment you've made me feel like a dinosaur! :)
 
User avatar
casinterest
Posts: 13367
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 5:30 am

Re: Why News is Not Covered as Well and as Accurately as in Times of Yore

Sun Apr 25, 2021 3:34 pm

So much is gone, but so much has replaced it.

Many of the old print newspapers ran on advertising, and much of what you got was exactly that.

Nowadays we have facebook, Nextdoor, ebay. espn, ebay, google providing us of much of our information. Some of it is the locals pointing out the crashes, others are the nosy neighbors wondering why a building is going up, but we still get the info we want. We now have more information than we ever had. Sometimes though we don't have the right answers to the more public facing issues of government though, and that is where we need the most journalists.
Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did..So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.--Mark Twain
 
WidebodyPTV
Posts: 446
Joined: Fri Sep 20, 2019 9:06 pm

Re: Why News is Not Covered as Well and as Accurately as in Times of Yore

Sun Apr 25, 2021 4:28 pm

frmrCapCadet wrote:
https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/stopping-the-presses-again-the-story-ends-for-two-more-century-old-seattle-newspapers/

Read it and weep. Several centuries of what was part and parcel of the Enlightenment and our history is irrevocably gone. No one is really to blame, it just happens. Don't be quite so critical of reporters who are not quite accurate. They are spread so thin over so much.

What really jumped out at me was in the heydays of print the Seattle area had more than 400 reporters just covering the neighborhood newspapers. The big metropolitan newspapers had their own extensive staffs. Online is starting to effectively taking their place, but it is not happening quickly, and reporters cost money, say with benefits, business expenses about $100K a year apiece.


No, there are people to blame. Newspapers have been a declining media for years, but publishers have long maintained a legacy product, making (largely) proportional cuts throughout news rooms. For example.... rather than recognizing that the Internet had rendered food critics, travel features, sports journalism, etc. largely obsolete, publishers continued to maintain these departments, believing they sold newspapers (and thus attracted advertising). The problem is that these are the highest paid positions in a newsroom (e.g. 10 years ago I did taxes for several middle market pro sports beat writers and they were collecting $200K+ in W-2 wages). News rooms should've shed the legacy product a long time ago, and focused on local journalism. And then... there should've been industry consolidation. If I could pay $20 a month to have access to a plethora of virtual newspapers, I would happily do so. Kinda crazy that concept doesn't exist (*it kinda does with Apple and Google, but the newsrooms aren't being comped fairly, and it's heavily limited).

Disclaimer: I still received a print copy of the LA Times, OC Register and WSJ daily.
 
User avatar
seb146
Posts: 23605
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Why News is Not Covered as Well and as Accurately as in Times of Yore

Sun Apr 25, 2021 5:09 pm

Back in the day, our sources were limited. Now, we can find any article we want that aligns with our own opinions or vice versa.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
LittleFokker
Posts: 1392
Joined: Sat Sep 28, 2013 10:25 pm

Re: Why News is Not Covered as Well and as Accurately as in Times of Yore

Sun Apr 25, 2021 7:57 pm

NIKV69 wrote:
There are no Walter Conkrites or Edward R Murrows anymore that is for sure.


Even if there were, you would just dismiss them and call them "Fake News."
"All human activities are doomed to failure." - Jean Paul Sartre
 
GalaxyFlyer
Posts: 7601
Joined: Fri Jan 01, 2016 4:44 am

Re: Why News is Not Covered as Well and as Accurately as in Times of Yore

Wed Apr 28, 2021 12:29 am

Old line journalists were a hard bitten bunch that grew up street smart, skeptical and even cynical. They accepted that saying the “Emperor has no clothes” and backing it up. Nowadays, they’re pretty heads with journalism degrees from fancy colleges (glorified English courses) that have been marinated in one of the two political memes and can’t write a decent thought. About 90% are very left biased. I had great respect for Punch Sulzberger when I flew at NYT. Ex-Marine, could laugh at politics, was always ribbing Reagan about hiring PATCO back so he wouldn’t holding for 40 minutes to land at LGA after the WH dinner. Can you imagine Pinch doing that to Trump.

My local news media can’t get a paragraph car accident facts straight. Anyone who has read news about a subject that actually know about cannot be cynical about the news.
 
User avatar
seb146
Posts: 23605
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

Re: Why News is Not Covered as Well and as Accurately as in Times of Yore

Wed Apr 28, 2021 6:36 pm

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
Old line journalists were a hard bitten bunch that grew up street smart, skeptical and even cynical. They accepted that saying the “Emperor has no clothes” and backing it up. Nowadays, they’re pretty heads with journalism degrees from fancy colleges (glorified English courses) that have been marinated in one of the two political memes and can’t write a decent thought. About 90% are very left biased. I had great respect for Punch Sulzberger when I flew at NYT. Ex-Marine, could laugh at politics, was always ribbing Reagan about hiring PATCO back so he wouldn’t holding for 40 minutes to land at LGA after the WH dinner. Can you imagine Pinch doing that to Trump.

My local news media can’t get a paragraph car accident facts straight. Anyone who has read news about a subject that actually know about cannot be cynical about the news.


Like the melt down over Biden forcing us to being vegans or the melt down over book banning or the melt down over masks or the melt down over the outrage of the day? Maybe media is "left biased" because facts are "left biased"? Go look at all the "gotcha" questions being lobbed a Psaki every day by the right wing infotainment and square that up with the soft ball questions lobbed at Sara Sanders under MAGA.

Complain all you want about "left biased" reporting but if extremists infotainment sites like Fox and OAN and Newsmax are as popular as they say they are, they owe it to the American people to produce fact based reports and not sensationalized gotcha reporting.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: AABusDrvr, Baidu [Spider], mileduets and 28 guests

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos