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NIKV69
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Tue May 18, 2021 10:09 pm

stl07 wrote:
As Dave Ramsey said, money for coins should come out of your fun money, similar to money you would spend at the casino. They should not come out of your investment money


Love him! Correct as well.
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stl07
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Tue May 18, 2021 10:54 pm

NIKV69 wrote:
stl07 wrote:
As Dave Ramsey said, money for coins should come out of your fun money, similar to money you would spend at the casino. They should not come out of your investment money


Love him! Correct as well.

Yup! He's got some solid advice. Lot's of things I disagree with him though, like that you should buy a car/house in cash. You should obviously budget for it, but you don't need to buy in cash
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DarkSnowyNight
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Wed May 19, 2021 5:01 am

stl07 wrote:
Yup! He's got some solid advice. Lot's of things I disagree with him though, like that you should buy a car/house in cash. You should obviously budget for it, but you don't need to buy in cash


Dave Ramsey is, on a very good day, rudimentary and extremely immature WRT finances in general. His outlook relies on a comically large amount of blue sky days being applied to a given situation and is generally seen as being a generation or six behind the times by more credible professionals. Personally, it is true that if I had taken his advice, I would still be lower middle class. This obviously colors my perspective, but that is what it is.

Having that been said, —stuck clock or otherwise— he is right about this. Everything I have made in crypto comes out at predetermined margins and placed either back into Dry Powder, Bonds or Property. Losses are... just that. Though lately I am finding that not cashing out and writing those down works out well enough if I just hang in long enough. In any case, we do not bet the mortgage or union dues on it.

NIKV69 wrote:
Love him! Correct as well.


He does sell a lot of Ramen.
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stl07
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Wed May 19, 2021 5:33 am

DarkSnowyNight wrote:
stl07 wrote:
Yup! He's got some solid advice. Lot's of things I disagree with him though, like that you should buy a car/house in cash. You should obviously budget for it, but you don't need to buy in cash


Dave Ramsey is, on a very good day, rudimentary and extremely immature WRT finances in general. His outlook relies on a comically large amount of blue sky days being applied to a given situation and is generally seen as being a generation or six behind the times by more credible professionals. Personally, it is true that if I had taken his advice, I would still be lower middle class. This obviously colors my perspective, but that is what it is.

Having that been said, —stuck clock or otherwise— he is right about this. Everything I have made in crypto comes out at predetermined margins and placed either back into Dry Powder, Bonds or Property. Losses are... just that. Though lately I am finding that not cashing out and writing those down works out well enough if I just hang in long enough. In any case, we do not bet the mortgage or union dues on it.

NIKV69 wrote:
Love him! Correct as well.


He does sell a lot of Ramen.

Here's the thing about Dave Ramsey...he is also a therapist and has a psychologist on his shows a lot. He helps people navigate the emotional side of things and puts them on his way of personal finance to get them out of a rut when all hell lets loose. His show helped me get back on my feet. I'm smart enough to know that his way of doing things is not the only way things should be done. But he helped me when I was at rock bottom mentally, and for that, I will always be grateful
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DarkSnowyNight
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Wed May 19, 2021 11:54 am

stl07 wrote:
Here's the thing about Dave Ramsey...he is also a therapist and has a psychologist on his shows a lot. He helps people navigate the emotional side of things and puts them on his way of personal finance to get them out of a rut when all hell lets loose. His show helped me get back on my feet. I'm smart enough to know that his way of doing things is not the only way things should be done. But he helped me when I was at rock bottom mentally, and for that, I will always be grateful


I suppose that is worth something.

In any case, as it pertains to the thread, I am going to break a rule this morning and swap over another 5% or so of expendables into crypto. It got a pretty good thrashing overnight and looks as though the morning should be a good buying opportunity.
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ikramerica
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Wed May 19, 2021 6:08 pm

Dave Ramsey’s views on vehicles are half nonsense.

Should you buy more car than you can afford? No.

Should you drive around your family in a 15 year old unsafe, polluting, repair fiasco, rust bucket because you can pay cash for it? That’s his advice.

He ignores that there are very good deals to be had that are only applied to NEW cars that are financed or leased. Anyone can find zero interest deals on last years leftovers that are severely discounted, have full warranties, the latest safety features. Might not be your dream car, but it’s much better sense than his dumb advice.

Considering how much time people spend in their vehicles, shouldn’t it be a safe and comfortable place to be?
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flyingturtle
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Wed May 19, 2021 6:08 pm

Yes, I'm a shareholder....

If a quirky rocket builder can crack some jokes and crypto currencies are crashing by 15 or even 30%, then it's nothing I would ever consider to put my money in.
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StarAC17
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Wed May 19, 2021 6:15 pm

Alias1024 wrote:
VSMUT wrote:

I wouldn't say it is a scheme. But it is worth pointing out that it is only worth what people are willing to pay for it, no different than stocks.


Crypto is different from stocks.

It’s worse.

With a stock you are buying an ownership share in an operating company. If the company is profitable a rational investor can choose to ignore the sentiment of others as to the proper price for long periods of time as either dividends are distributed or the book value of the company rises. In other words you can wait it out until the market realizes the true economic power of the company and assesses it properly. If it’s not profitable you can either try to change that or liquidate assets and distribute the proceeds to shareholders.

Cryptocurrency isn’t a productive asset. It doesn’t make anything. It’s value is entirely dependent on what others think of it.


Also it escapes all regulations on currency and equity trading that are there for a reason. Things such as a pump and dump, insider trading etc.
When Elon Musk hosted SNL and told Michael Che that Dogecoin was a hustle there are no consequences for it.

He says that amount a competitor or even one of his own companies and he can get into big trouble.

luckyone wrote:
Meanwhile, approximately two months after investing $1 billion in Bitcoin, Tesla says they will suspend accepting the currency due to energy consumption concerns. Draw your own conclusions.


Again this probably would have got Elon in a lot of trouble if he goes and says this about another publicly traded company. Crypto is not regulated so no consequences for pumping and dumping it here.

DarkSnowyNight wrote:
stl07 wrote:
Yup! He's got some solid advice. Lot's of things I disagree with him though, like that you should buy a car/house in cash. You should obviously budget for it, but you don't need to buy in cash


Dave Ramsey is, on a very good day, rudimentary and extremely immature WRT finances in general. His outlook relies on a comically large amount of blue sky days being applied to a given situation and is generally seen as being a generation or six behind the times by more credible professionals. Personally, it is true that if I had taken his advice, I would still be lower middle class. This obviously colors my perspective, but that is what it is.

Having that been said, —stuck clock or otherwise— he is right about this. Everything I have made in crypto comes out at predetermined margins and placed either back into Dry Powder, Bonds or Property. Losses are... just that. Though lately I am finding that not cashing out and writing those down works out well enough if I just hang in long enough. In any case, we do not bet the mortgage or union dues on it.



Ramsay gives solid personal financial advice.

If you follow one thing he says you will be in a good place and that is debt 90% of the time is bad. Some people can leverage credit into investing into things like real estate and profit from that but for most average people the less debt you have the better. I'm a financial advisor and see many people refinancing their homes for renovations and other luxuries (that in my opinion is something you should save for).

The problem I have with him is that he an evangelical and spins his advice with that nonsense (my opinion). I also think his work culture is discriminates against the non-religious and if very catty and destructive behind the scenes.
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TWA772LR
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Wed May 19, 2021 8:58 pm

Update. The whole crypto market is taking a huge dump. I foolishly pulled out of ethereum and paid a fee. I got back in to it with another fee this morning and went down even more. I then converted it to USDC, USD Coin, a crypto that is always 1:1 with the USD. I'm gonna ride out the storm with that and jump in when things get better. Ethereum and crypto as a whole just had a huge peak so I believe this is a correction, but a big one nonetheless. Overall, my initial investment is down around $70.

Coinbase does give you some freebies in more obscure cryptos by taking quizzes about them so I'm kinda letting those ride. I'm ok gambling with the free money.
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flyingturtle
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Wed May 19, 2021 9:22 pm

TWA772LR wrote:
Update. The whole crypto market is taking a huge dump.


Yay. China is imposing strict controls on crypto currencies... and it's the country where lots of those coins were mined, thanks to low energy prices.

When prices crash, you can only sell when somebody else is willing to buy. So, your sell order is waiting, waiting, waiting... until the price drops a lot more until there is finally somebody willing to buy.

TWA772LR wrote:
I foolishly pulled out of ethereum and paid a fee. I got back in to it with another fee this morning and went down even more.


Those fees are the reason one should revisit the holdings perhaps twice a month. But not more often. Frequent trading is one of the biggest errors made by newcomers - together with small positions (e.g. shares worth 300 bucks, but the transaction fee is $20 for buying + selling).

Given that cryptos do not have an inherent value (in contrast to shares, bonds or commodities), the only motivation to buy them is the belief that somebody else will pay more for your cryptos than you've paid. Basically, the only profits to be made with cryptos is investing early enough before the bubble bursts.

I've read some lunatic comments like "Bitcoin will rise to 600'000 in a year", "There's a limited amount of bitcoin... that's why they're precious." When I put a bag of trash outside, there's exactly one identical bag in the whole world. Its content is unique. There's no practicable way to forge one of my trash bags. They're almost pieces of art. But nobody wants to buy my trash... :-(

In other news, I'm offering my own cryptos. Their value is backed with tulip bulbs. In fact, they're onions, just painted blue.
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Aesma
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Wed May 19, 2021 9:36 pm

ikramerica wrote:
Dave Ramsey’s views on vehicles are half nonsense.

Should you buy more car than you can afford? No.

Should you drive around your family in a 15 year old unsafe, polluting, repair fiasco, rust bucket because you can pay cash for it? That’s his advice.

He ignores that there are very good deals to be had that are only applied to NEW cars that are financed or leased. Anyone can find zero interest deals on last years leftovers that are severely discounted, have full warranties, the latest safety features. Might not be your dream car, but it’s much better sense than his dumb advice.

Considering how much time people spend in their vehicles, shouldn’t it be a safe and comfortable place to be?


I don't follow his advice since I'm not in the US but what about financing a car you could buy outright ?

I was looking at buying a Tesla before this, as there are big incentives to buy one here and Tesla lowered the price to benefit from it. I can buy it cash, or I can buy it with a 0.99% credit. And put the cash into something that will bring in 2-3% safely at least. It seems to me the credit is the better option.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
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DarkSnowyNight
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Thu May 20, 2021 3:14 am

StarAC17 wrote:

Ramsay gives solid personal financial advice.

If you follow one thing he says you will be in a good place and that is debt 90% of the time is bad. Some people can leverage credit into investing into things like real estate and profit from that but for most average people the less debt you have the better.

I think this is where we differ. I agree that it is nice to not have debt, but Ramsey has no understanding of what a luxury that is for most people. Paying down debt ahead of schedule should never be prioritized above necessities or required capital expenditures which would result in overall improvements.

And there are plenty of instances where creating new debt is a fantastic idea —student loans anyone?— that he consistently advises against. I understand that excessive voluntary debt is usually a poor decision —as do most people— but I have observed that he is way too blanket about all that.

Having that been said...


StarAC17 wrote:
I'm a financial advisor and see many people refinancing their homes for renovations and other luxuries (that in my opinion is something you should save for).


I agree that that would be an example of a foolish expenditure. Even trying to justify that as a CapEx seems hairy if one is not selling the property in the next 18 months.

I doubt he would have approved of what I did though. I took out a Home Equity Loan at the front of the Covid crisis when it became clear my old job would be soon coming to an end. I took out enough for two years worth of expenses to write a pair of books and spend the time necessary to build contacts and book gigs along a new career path.

Cons: High Risk.

Pros: I knew exactly what I was doing and I generally trust how smart I am.

It is not the sort of advice one can give on a radio show. But OTOH, I would be astonished if Dave had done something much different himself to start his own franchise.



StarAC17 wrote:
The problem I have with him is that he an evangelical and spins his advice with that nonsense (my opinion). I also think his work culture is discriminates against the non-religious and if very catty and destructive behind the scenes.


I did not know about the behind the scenes part. But the rest makes sense. I think it is the rigidity of his ideology that is of the least use to me.



ikramerica wrote:
He ignores that there are very good deals to be had that are only applied to NEW cars that are financed or leased. Anyone can find zero interest deals on last years leftovers that are severely discounted, have full warranties, the latest safety features. Might not be your dream car, but it’s much better sense than his dumb advice.

Considering how much time people spend in their vehicles, shouldn’t it be a safe and comfortable place to be?


Quite true. In addition to the safety aspect, there is efficiency to consider as well. A more fuel efficient conveyance that is also more reliable will certainly return better results where budgets are concerned.

If Ramsey ran DL, they would still be flying NW's DC-10s and printing paper tickets.
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stl07
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Thu May 20, 2021 3:29 am

flyingturtle wrote:
Yes, I'm a shareholder....

If a quirky rocket builder can crack some jokes and crypto currencies are crashing by 15 or even 30%, then it's nothing I would ever consider to put my money in.

End thread
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Newark727
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Thu May 20, 2021 3:36 am

DarkSnowyNight wrote:
If Ramsey ran DL, they would still be flying NW's DC-10s and printing paper tickets.


that would be awesome though? :P
 
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Aaron747
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Thu May 20, 2021 4:24 am

stl07 wrote:
flyingturtle wrote:
Yes, I'm a shareholder....

If a quirky rocket builder can crack some jokes and crypto currencies are crashing by 15 or even 30%, then it's nothing I would ever consider to put my money in.

End thread


Seriously. Retail investor tools are a fantastic addition to the marketplace. Retail investors themselves - especially the Twitter crowd - dear Lawdamercy.
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Pellegrine
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Fri May 21, 2021 8:10 am

TWA772LR wrote:
Update. The whole crypto market is taking a huge dump. I foolishly pulled out of ethereum and paid a fee. I got back in to it with another fee this morning and went down even more. I then converted it to USDC, USD Coin, a crypto that is always 1:1 with the USD. I'm gonna ride out the storm with that and jump in when things get better. Ethereum and crypto as a whole just had a huge peak so I believe this is a correction, but a big one nonetheless. Overall, my initial investment is down around $70.

Coinbase does give you some freebies in more obscure cryptos by taking quizzes about them so I'm kinda letting those ride. I'm ok gambling with the free money.



Study trading psychology. It will make you a better trader and investor. Things like pullbacks and corrections are normal. Your success depends on your ability to withstand them. I wouldn't advise anyone use leverage on crypto for example, and only devote a portion of your portfolio to crypto.
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Pellegrine
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Fri May 21, 2021 8:12 am

Aaron747 wrote:
stl07 wrote:
flyingturtle wrote:
Yes, I'm a shareholder....

If a quirky rocket builder can crack some jokes and crypto currencies are crashing by 15 or even 30%, then it's nothing I would ever consider to put my money in.

End thread


Seriously. Retail investor tools are a fantastic addition to the marketplace. Retail investors themselves - especially the Twitter crowd - dear Lawdamercy.


Retail investors buying in raises all institutional boats. *********sideeye************* Lawwwwwwdddddd.......
We fly JETS, we don't fly donkeys. Citizenship/Residence::: Washington DC, US; Vaud, CH; Providenciales, TCI (hence my avi)
 
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Aaron747
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Fri May 21, 2021 8:25 am

Pellegrine wrote:
TWA772LR wrote:
Update. The whole crypto market is taking a huge dump. I foolishly pulled out of ethereum and paid a fee. I got back in to it with another fee this morning and went down even more. I then converted it to USDC, USD Coin, a crypto that is always 1:1 with the USD. I'm gonna ride out the storm with that and jump in when things get better. Ethereum and crypto as a whole just had a huge peak so I believe this is a correction, but a big one nonetheless. Overall, my initial investment is down around $70.

Coinbase does give you some freebies in more obscure cryptos by taking quizzes about them so I'm kinda letting those ride. I'm ok gambling with the free money.



Study trading psychology. It will make you a better trader and investor. Things like pullbacks and corrections are normal. Your success depends on your ability to withstand them. I wouldn't advise anyone use leverage on crypto for example, and only devote a portion of your portfolio to crypto.


Schadenfreude is untoward generally, but I have to say it's just a little satisfying seeing some of these 20-somethings on Twitter take a dive. No more bandying about the flashy cars and ridiculous jewelry like they have over the last year. Get rich quick almost never imparts good financial habits.
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flyingturtle
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Fri May 21, 2021 9:35 am

Crypto currencies and blockchains are basically good ideas. But there is quite a cult surrounding both.

Blockchain is mostly a solution in search of a problem. It solves only one problem, namely: You have to store data decentrally, and you cannot trust those who store the data. If data is stored centrally, there are already other solutions. (And funnily, despite the promise of "decentralizing" money, next to nobody keeps a copy of the distributed ledger on his computer.)

And cryptos:
- are not suitable as a means of payment, because it's too volatile. A $100 bill will buy me +/- the same amount of food today as in two months.
- are not suitable to store wealth, because crypto currencies do not have an inherent value. Crypto currency fetishists say that they want to overcome fiat money. But most cryptos are, funnily, the ultimate fiat money.
- are not suitable for investment, because they embody no inherent value that can grow. It's just data stored somewhere. The prices just increase and decrease on a whim, backed only by the user's belief in those cryptos.
- some implementations just keep old power stations busy, and through crypto mining, Iran, Venezuela and other countries can raise foreign currency

If there just was a computationally efficient cryptocurrency that is, somehow, pegged to an international currency basket. Like the Special Drawing Rights (XDR).

Oh, Christine Lagarde, chief of the IMF, floated such an idea two years ago...
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flyingturtle
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Fri May 21, 2021 6:26 pm

In the past two hours, Bitcoin crashed from 41'700 to 37'000, because the U.S. Treasury has called for every crypto asset transfer exceeding $10'000 to be registered.

Gawd, I should have shorted Bitcoin.
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luckyone
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Fri May 21, 2021 7:35 pm

Aaron747 wrote:
Pellegrine wrote:
TWA772LR wrote:
Update. The whole crypto market is taking a huge dump. I foolishly pulled out of ethereum and paid a fee. I got back in to it with another fee this morning and went down even more. I then converted it to USDC, USD Coin, a crypto that is always 1:1 with the USD. I'm gonna ride out the storm with that and jump in when things get better. Ethereum and crypto as a whole just had a huge peak so I believe this is a correction, but a big one nonetheless. Overall, my initial investment is down around $70.

Coinbase does give you some freebies in more obscure cryptos by taking quizzes about them so I'm kinda letting those ride. I'm ok gambling with the free money.



Study trading psychology. It will make you a better trader and investor. Things like pullbacks and corrections are normal. Your success depends on your ability to withstand them. I wouldn't advise anyone use leverage on crypto for example, and only devote a portion of your portfolio to crypto.


Schadenfreude is untoward generally, but I have to say it's just a little satisfying seeing some of these 20-somethings on Twitter take a dive. No more bandying about the flashy cars and ridiculous jewelry like they have over the last year. Get rich quick almost never imparts good financial habits.

Due to differences in personality, outlook, and background I'm not in frequent communication with them, but there are one or two that pop up on my social media accounts. All I can think when I see those folks is "Good for you. Why aren't you SAVING that money instead of flying to Miami every other week, renting Lambos, eating $1,500 gold leaf encased steaks, and advertising your recent purchase of $4,000 shoes..." You could've bought a house with all those gain.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Fri May 21, 2021 10:56 pm

luckyone wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
Pellegrine wrote:


Study trading psychology. It will make you a better trader and investor. Things like pullbacks and corrections are normal. Your success depends on your ability to withstand them. I wouldn't advise anyone use leverage on crypto for example, and only devote a portion of your portfolio to crypto.


Schadenfreude is untoward generally, but I have to say it's just a little satisfying seeing some of these 20-somethings on Twitter take a dive. No more bandying about the flashy cars and ridiculous jewelry like they have over the last year. Get rich quick almost never imparts good financial habits.

Due to differences in personality, outlook, and background I'm not in frequent communication with them, but there are one or two that pop up on my social media accounts. All I can think when I see those folks is "Good for you. Why aren't you SAVING that money instead of flying to Miami every other week, renting Lambos, eating $1,500 gold leaf encased steaks, and advertising your recent purchase of $4,000 shoes..." You could've bought a house with all those gain.


I don’t communicate with that lot either but their detritus does flood some of the trading groups I pop into. Exactly as you say, they could learn about money instead of flaunting it.
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Aesma
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Sat May 22, 2021 12:16 pm

Elon tweeted he's on the side of crypto, he must have figured he pissed off many of his fans.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
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flyingturtle
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Sat May 22, 2021 12:55 pm

Aesma wrote:
Elon tweeted he's on the side of crypto, he must have figured he pissed off many of his fans.


He's absolutely free to manipulate crypto currencies. To benefit himself, or Tesla's crypto dealing. Cryptos are not regulated like securities. Shush. Elon Musk is both a troll and a genius.

I just saw a cartoon... "I'm doing a fundamental analysis of bitcoin." - "Huh, fundamental what?" - "Well, I'm just checking Elon's tweets..."
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jetmatt777
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Sat May 22, 2021 1:05 pm

I spent around $600 on DOGE as a gamble. It’s cheap entertainment. I have 10,000 coins at an average of $0.065. That $600 is worth $3600 at the moment.

It’s fun but not an investment. If It crashes to a penny tomorrow I will have gotten 5 months of entertainment of watching it do its thing. If it goes up again it might mean a nice payday and I can put some money back into savings and treat myself to a nice vacation without guilt.

Compare that to gambling $600 on a sports bet or at a casino where that $600 of entertainment only lasts an hour or two.
 
luckyone
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Sat May 22, 2021 4:13 pm

jetmatt777 wrote:
I spent around $600 on DOGE as a gamble. It’s cheap entertainment. I have 10,000 coins at an average of $0.065. That $600 is worth $3600 at the moment.

It’s fun but not an investment. If It crashes to a penny tomorrow I will have gotten 5 months of entertainment of watching it do its thing. If it goes up again it might mean a nice payday and I can put some money back into savings and treat myself to a nice vacation without guilt.

Compare that to gambling $600 on a sports bet or at a casino where that $600 of entertainment only lasts an hour or two.

Jeez o Pete’s why don’t you just set money on fire.
 
jetmatt777
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Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Sat May 22, 2021 5:26 pm

luckyone wrote:
jetmatt777 wrote:
I spent around $600 on DOGE as a gamble. It’s cheap entertainment. I have 10,000 coins at an average of $0.065. That $600 is worth $3600 at the moment.

It’s fun but not an investment. If It crashes to a penny tomorrow I will have gotten 5 months of entertainment of watching it do its thing. If it goes up again it might mean a nice payday and I can put some money back into savings and treat myself to a nice vacation without guilt.

Compare that to gambling $600 on a sports bet or at a casino where that $600 of entertainment only lasts an hour or two.

Jeez o Pete’s why don’t you just set money on fire.


I have $40k saved in a 401k, I purchased a $270k house (on my own without family help or a co-signer) which is now worth $360k, which at the age of 28 is well ahead of the game.

I can afford to gamble with $600. It is no different than gambling in a casino, or on sports, which in moderation is entertainment.


At the same time I gambled $600 on DOGE, I bought $600 in company stock. That stock purchase has appreciated about $25 in the same time period the DOGE coins appreciated $3,000.

I work hard for my money and am free to do with it as I please.
 
NIKV69
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Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2004 4:27 am

Re: I'm in Crypto Now

Sat May 22, 2021 11:33 pm

90 Day Fiancé has taught me that Russian woman are excellent.

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