Republican audit backers theorise that if they can find substantive evidence of fraud then it means Trump really won Arizona. If Trump really won Arizona, maybe he really won other states he narrowly lost. And if he really won enough other states, then he really won the election

All this requires extreme logical contortions, but it's what they're rolling with.

It's also worth noting that the Republican-controlled Maricopa County Board of Supervisors, which ran the county's election process and reviewed its results, stands behind their original tally and has had no interest in participating in the process.

The Arizona Senate is paying $150,000 for the audit to be conducted by a private Florida-based company, Cyber Ninjas, that has never done anything like this before and isn't certified by the federal government to test voting systems.

The process by which the Senate chose the company is opaque, and extra costs are being covered by right-wing fundraising.

Already, Cyber Ninjas - which is paying individuals $15 an hour to conduct the audit - has made some basic mistakes, such as allowing blue pens to be used on the ballots. Blue ink is used to vote so this could potentially alter voters' intentions.

The company also has been accused of leaving ballots and computers unsecured.

AirframeAS wrote:

They're doing this, 6 months after the election. Haven't we dealt with this enough already? (Nothing against you, Seb...at all.)

Aesma wrote:

Who is preventing them to create the fraud after the fact ?

seb146 wrote:

Who is preventing them to create the fraud after the fact ?

Truth. Facts. Actual numbers.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bush_v._Gore wrote:

On December 9, the five conservative justices on the Court granted the stay for Bush, with Scalia citing "irreparable harm" that could befall Bush, as the recounts would cast "a needless and unjustified cloud" over Bush's legitimacy.

910A wrote:

I'm still waiting for these crazies to prove that a Korean Air 747 arrived in PHX in the early morning hours of Nov 7, 2020 and dropped off 40,000 ballots made of bamboo paper marked for Joe Biden and Mark Kelly.

Under the new lease signed Wednesday, the ballots, computers, tables and related equipment will be stored elsewhere at the state fairgrounds next week. The Senate will regain access to the coliseum on May 23 and have it through the end of June.

The effort has gone far slower than expected, and only a fraction of the ballots have been counted. The audit was to stop Thursday evening, then packing would begin and continue into Friday, said Ken Bennett, a former Republican secretary of state who is serving as the Senate’s liaison to the auditors.

EA CO AS wrote:

As a resident of both Arizona and Maricopa County, I think this is a waste of time and money. Having said that, if it helps whomever sleep better at night in the name of "transparency," then have at it. No one blinked at the numerous audits - both months and years later - of the Florida 2000 election, so I don't see why there's an issue here.

Just as with FL in 2000, the outcome here won't change anything. The Electoral College voted. The winner was sworn in. Both sides used recounts as a way to cast doubt on the legitimacy of the election. I don't like it, but what's good for the goose...

Aaron747 wrote:

EA CO AS wrote:

As a resident of both Arizona and Maricopa County, I think this is a waste of time and money. Having said that, if it helps whomever sleep better at night in the name of "transparency," then have at it. No one blinked at the numerous audits - both months and years later - of the Florida 2000 election, so I don't see why there's an issue here.

Just as with FL in 2000, the outcome here won't change anything. The Electoral College voted. The winner was sworn in. Both sides used recounts as a way to cast doubt on the legitimacy of the election. I don't like it, but what's good for the goose...

Except the FL 2000 case was deemed worthy of review by SCOTUS - the cases from 2020 were complete junk in all but one instance. That bears pointing out.

EA CO AS wrote:

Aaron747 wrote:

EA CO AS wrote:

As a resident of both Arizona and Maricopa County, I think this is a waste of time and money. Having said that, if it helps whomever sleep better at night in the name of "transparency," then have at it. No one blinked at the numerous audits - both months and years later - of the Florida 2000 election, so I don't see why there's an issue here.

Just as with FL in 2000, the outcome here won't change anything. The Electoral College voted. The winner was sworn in. Both sides used recounts as a way to cast doubt on the legitimacy of the election. I don't like it, but what's good for the goose...

Except the FL 2000 case was deemed worthy of review by SCOTUS - the cases from 2020 were complete junk in all but one instance. That bears pointing out.

Regardless, you and I both know that to many people, both on the left and the right, perception is reality. And right now there's a perception that things like illegal drop boxes, late ballots processed, states changing election laws right before the election, and of course indefinitely confined voters, could have altered the outcome of the election. Right, wrong, or indifferent, that's the issue. And if I'm the Biden Administration I'm wholeheartedly backing this.

Why?

Because overwhelming odds are it won't change a damn thing in terms of who carried AZ, and that's when you get to point your finger at the opposition and say, "Clearly, we won. Counts, recounts, and now an independent audit confirmed that," so you can once and for all toss any hint of "It was stolen!" and not have distractions while attempting to govern.

Aaron747 wrote:

that actually suggests is people are even dumber now than in 2000

AirframeAS wrote:

They're doing this, 6 months after the election. Haven't we dealt with this enough already?

sierrakilo44 wrote:

AirframeAS wrote:

They're doing this, 6 months after the election. Haven't we dealt with this enough already?

The GOP has just removed one of the most prominent Republicans from her leadership position as punishment for telling the truth about the election. They obviously want to keep the fraud narrative for the long term, so you’ll be hearing more about it.

The company contracted to perform the Arizona recount, Cyber Ninjas, is pro Trump. Their CEO is a Trump supporter who was tweeting election fraud and pro Qanon posts. One of their members was at the Capitol on Insurrection Day and another was a prominent Obama birther.

So expect Fox News to put the breaking news alert up when these guys provide “irrefutable” proof Trump won Arizona.....

EA CO AS wrote:

Aaron747 wrote:

EA CO AS wrote:

As a resident of both Arizona and Maricopa County, I think this is a waste of time and money. Having said that, if it helps whomever sleep better at night in the name of "transparency," then have at it. No one blinked at the numerous audits - both months and years later - of the Florida 2000 election, so I don't see why there's an issue here.

Just as with FL in 2000, the outcome here won't change anything. The Electoral College voted. The winner was sworn in. Both sides used recounts as a way to cast doubt on the legitimacy of the election. I don't like it, but what's good for the goose...

Except the FL 2000 case was deemed worthy of review by SCOTUS - the cases from 2020 were complete junk in all but one instance. That bears pointing out.

Regardless, you and I both know that to many people, both on the left and the right, perception is reality. And right now there's a perception that things like illegal drop boxes, late ballots processed, states changing election laws right before the election, and of course indefinitely confined voters, could have altered the outcome of the election. Right, wrong, or indifferent, that's the issue. And if I'm the Biden Administration I'm wholeheartedly backing this.

Why?

Because overwhelming odds are it won't change a damn thing in terms of who carried AZ, and that's when you get to point your finger at the opposition and say, "Clearly, we won. Counts, recounts, and now an independent audit confirmed that," so you can once and for all toss any hint of "It was stolen!" and not have distractions while attempting to govern.

sierrakilo44 wrote:

AirframeAS wrote:

They're doing this, 6 months after the election. Haven't we dealt with this enough already?

The GOP has just removed one of the most prominent Republicans from her leadership position as punishment for telling the truth about the election. They obviously want to keep the fraud narrative for the long term, so you’ll be hearing more about it.

The company contracted to perform the Arizona recount, Cyber Ninjas, is pro Trump. Their CEO is a Trump supporter who was tweeting election fraud and pro Qanon posts. One of their members was at the Capitol on Insurrection Day and another was a prominent Obama birther.

So expect Fox News to put the breaking news alert up when these guys provide “irrefutable” proof Trump won Arizona.....

bennett123 wrote:

Will another audit actually convince anyone?.

Aesma wrote:

I'm a member of another forum where threads can run for years. There is one thread about the "myth" of the Moon landings. After following it for a couple years, with both "sides" represented, all kinds of debunkings etc., I came to the conclusion that you could put these doubters on top of a Saturn V, send them to the Moon, and they would still argue it's fake.

Jack Sellers, the Republican chairman of the Maricopa County Board of Supervisors, questioned why Cyber Ninjas "can't even find files that were already given to them by Maricopa county."

"We wouldn't be asked to do this on-the-job training if qualified auditors had been hired to do this work," Sellers said. At the end of Monday's meeting he asserted that he "will not be responding to any more requests from this sham process."

casinterest wrote:

The GOP is starting to realize they have screwed themselves and are calling for an end to the audit.

That, or the civil war is just getting started.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/maricopa-c ... s-for-end/

Jack Sellers, the Republican chairman of the Maricopa County Board of Supervisors, questioned why Cyber Ninjas "can't even find files that were already given to them by Maricopa county."

"We wouldn't be asked to do this on-the-job training if qualified auditors had been hired to do this work," Sellers said. At the end of Monday's meeting he asserted that he "will not be responding to any more requests from this sham process."

Just called out the Cyber Ninjas as "spoon pudding trainees"

Aaron747 wrote:

casinterest wrote:

The GOP is starting to realize they have screwed themselves and are calling for an end to the audit.

That, or the civil war is just getting started.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/maricopa-c ... s-for-end/

Jack Sellers, the Republican chairman of the Maricopa County Board of Supervisors, questioned why Cyber Ninjas "can't even find files that were already given to them by Maricopa county."

"We wouldn't be asked to do this on-the-job training if qualified auditors had been hired to do this work," Sellers said. At the end of Monday's meeting he asserted that he "will not be responding to any more requests from this sham process."

Just called out the Cyber Ninjas as "spoon pudding trainees"

Not only that, but there are also accusations from Mariposa County that CN auditors are liars :

https://www.maricopa.gov/DocumentCenter ... nn---FINAL

You can't make this stuff up!

EA CO AS wrote:

Aaron747 wrote:

EA CO AS wrote:

As a resident of both Arizona and Maricopa County, I think this is a waste of time and money. Having said that, if it helps whomever sleep better at night in the name of "transparency," then have at it. No one blinked at the numerous audits - both months and years later - of the Florida 2000 election, so I don't see why there's an issue here.

Just as with FL in 2000, the outcome here won't change anything. The Electoral College voted. The winner was sworn in. Both sides used recounts as a way to cast doubt on the legitimacy of the election. I don't like it, but what's good for the goose...

Except the FL 2000 case was deemed worthy of review by SCOTUS - the cases from 2020 were complete junk in all but one instance. That bears pointing out.

Regardless, you and I both know that to many people, both on the left and the right, perception is reality.

bennett123 wrote:

Will another audit actually convince anyone?.

sierrakilo44 wrote:

AirframeAS wrote:

They're doing this, 6 months after the election. Haven't we dealt with this enough already?

The GOP has just removed one of the most prominent Republicans from her leadership position as punishment for telling the truth about the election. They obviously want to keep the fraud narrative for the long term, so you’ll be hearing more about it.

The company contracted to perform the Arizona recount, Cyber Ninjas, is pro Trump. Their CEO is a Trump supporter who was tweeting election fraud and pro Qanon posts. One of their members was at the Capitol on Insurrection Day and another was a prominent Obama birther.

So expect Fox News to put the breaking news alert up when these guys provide “irrefutable” proof Trump won Arizona.....

Aaron747 wrote:

casinterest wrote:

The GOP is starting to realize they have screwed themselves and are calling for an end to the audit.

That, or the civil war is just getting started.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/maricopa-c ... s-for-end/

Jack Sellers, the Republican chairman of the Maricopa County Board of Supervisors, questioned why Cyber Ninjas "can't even find files that were already given to them by Maricopa county."

"We wouldn't be asked to do this on-the-job training if qualified auditors had been hired to do this work," Sellers said. At the end of Monday's meeting he asserted that he "will not be responding to any more requests from this sham process."

Just called out the Cyber Ninjas as "spoon pudding trainees"

Not only that, but there are also accusations from Mariposa County that CN auditors are liars :

https://www.maricopa.gov/DocumentCenter ... nn---FINAL

You can't make this stuff up!

VolvoBus wrote:

Maybe it is time for the Democrat members of the Arizona Senate to demand some answers from Senate President Fann, to questions like :

1 Who hired these bozoes to undertake the audit ?

2 What qualifications did they have to be awarded the contract ?

3 What other bids were sought/requested/obtained ,and at what rates, before the contract was awarded ?

910A wrote:

VolvoBus wrote:

Maybe it is time for the Democrat members of the Arizona Senate to demand some answers from Senate President Fann, to questions like :

1 Who hired these bozoes to undertake the audit ?

2 What qualifications did they have to be awarded the contract ?

3 What other bids were sought/requested/obtained ,and at what rates, before the contract was awarded ?

Answers:
#1 - Senate President Fann

#2 - None, except being friends of friend.

#3 - None
Now Maricopa County will have to get new voting machines since the chain of custody has been broken, and who knows what these idiots have done to them.

seb146 wrote:

I am not calling anyone out but I am asking a legitimate question I want answered. I have my answers but I want to hear from legitimate MAGAs why we must put one person in charge and force one style of government on everyone?

casinterest wrote:

The sad fact about all of this occurring is that the GOP is not a decent organization anymore. They are a fraud based money laundering scheme for dishonorable folks.

seb146 wrote:

I am not calling anyone out but I am asking a legitimate question I want answered. I have my answers but I want to hear from legitimate MAGAs why we must put one person in charge and force one style of government on everyone?

You should start a new thread on the Congressional investigations or lack thereof into January 6. An armed mob backed by the GOP wanted to overthrow the government, and the majority of the GOP want to avoid any investigation into their misdeeds and ignorance.

910A wrote:

VolvoBus wrote:

Maybe it is time for the Democrat members of the Arizona Senate to demand some answers from Senate President Fann, to questions like :

1 Who hired these bozoes to undertake the audit ?

2 What qualifications did they have to be awarded the contract ?

3 What other bids were sought/requested/obtained ,and at what rates, before the contract was awarded ?

Answers:
#1 - Senate President Fann

#2 - None, except being friends of friend.

#3 - None
Now Maricopa County will have to get new voting machines since the chain of custody has been broken, and who knows what these idiots have done to them.

Aaron747 wrote:

casinterest wrote:

The sad fact about all of this occurring is that the GOP is not a decent organization anymore. They are a fraud based money laundering scheme for dishonorable folks.

seb146 wrote:

I am not calling anyone out but I am asking a legitimate question I want answered. I have my answers but I want to hear from legitimate MAGAs why we must put one person in charge and force one style of government on everyone?

You should start a new thread on the Congressional investigations or lack thereof into January 6. An armed mob backed by the GOP wanted to overthrow the government, and the majority of the GOP want to avoid any investigation into their misdeeds and ignorance.

We all know why - a real investigation will show a couple Senators and a gaggle of the House GOP caucus assisted them. And were possibly in league with the WH too.

Auditors conducting the Republican-commissioned recount of 2020 votes in Arizona's Maricopa County said they found election data that former President Donald Trump falsely claimed had been destroyed.

art wrote:

Auditors conducting the Republican-commissioned recount of 2020 votes in Arizona's Maricopa County said they found election data that former President Donald Trump falsely claimed had been destroyed.

https://www.businessinsider.com/arizona ... ?r=US&IR=T

If they found something I presume it was lost before. Does that mean the votes they found were not included in the count in the election?

seb146 wrote:

An interesting point was made during a progressive talk show today. I don't remember which one because I want to give credit. The point was that Republicans who so desperately want one man to rule the country and throw out the Constitution want everyone to believe voting is fraud. This is how they think they will do it. By spoiling voting machines and casting doubt on votes. Demanding audits by right wing groups looking for pieces of bamboo and harassing voters because the election was rigged. This is the new Republican plan to stay in power. Not actual governance, just creating doubt. And, unfortunately, there are enough in the Republican party to believe it they can convince this is the case.

phatfarmlines wrote:

seb146 wrote:

An interesting point was made during a progressive talk show today. I don't remember which one because I want to give credit. The point was that Republicans who so desperately want one man to rule the country and throw out the Constitution want everyone to believe voting is fraud. This is how they think they will do it. By spoiling voting machines and casting doubt on votes. Demanding audits by right wing groups looking for pieces of bamboo and harassing voters because the election was rigged. This is the new Republican plan to stay in power. Not actual governance, just creating doubt. And, unfortunately, there are enough in the Republican party to believe it they can convince this is the case.

And to further bolster that claim, the GOP is looking at another Georgia audit for Fulton County (Metro Atlanta). The GOP will seek every opportunity they have for election audits as they start campaigning for the 2022 midterms.

Another ballot audit set to move ahead in Fulton County, Georgia, as judge rules absentee ballots can be unsealed

Source: CNN

seb146 wrote:

phatfarmlines wrote:

seb146 wrote:

An interesting point was made during a progressive talk show today. I don't remember which one because I want to give credit. The point was that Republicans who so desperately want one man to rule the country and throw out the Constitution want everyone to believe voting is fraud. This is how they think they will do it. By spoiling voting machines and casting doubt on votes. Demanding audits by right wing groups looking for pieces of bamboo and harassing voters because the election was rigged. This is the new Republican plan to stay in power. Not actual governance, just creating doubt. And, unfortunately, there are enough in the Republican party to believe it they can convince this is the case.

And to further bolster that claim, the GOP is looking at another Georgia audit for Fulton County (Metro Atlanta). The GOP will seek every opportunity they have for election audits as they start campaigning for the 2022 midterms.

Another ballot audit set to move ahead in Fulton County, Georgia, as judge rules absentee ballots can be unsealed

Source: CNN

In other words:

They have no ideas to lead, they simply want to be in power.

“This is not motivated by any kind of serious worry that something went wrong,” said Michael Kang, a law professor at Northwestern University and an expert in election law. “It seems to be prompted by political motivations because the earlier counts and checks didn’t produce the outcome that the legislators wanted.”

e GOP state senators who ordered the review have been battling local election officials since November over the results. Even after the majority-Republican Maricopa County Board of Supervisors hired two separate, independent firms to perform a forensic audit of the voting equipment used — an audit which found no irregularities — the state Senate was unsatisfied.

casinterest wrote:

538 has released a pretty good summary of what is going on in Maricopa county. it isn't an audit.

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/po ... thing-but/

“This is not motivated by any kind of serious worry that something went wrong,” said Michael Kang, a law professor at Northwestern University and an expert in election law. “It seems to be prompted by political motivations because the earlier counts and checks didn’t produce the outcome that the legislators wanted.”

Is it the republican's new platform to waste money for their wildish dreams and fantasies?

e GOP state senators who ordered the review have been battling local election officials since November over the results. Even after the majority-Republican Maricopa County Board of Supervisors hired two separate, independent firms to perform a forensic audit of the voting equipment used — an audit which found no irregularities — the state Senate was unsatisfied.

If the voters of Arizona were paying any real attention, they would ask for a recall of these wasteful liars .

Aaron747 wrote:

casinterest wrote:

538 has released a pretty good summary of what is going on in Maricopa county. it isn't an audit.

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/po ... thing-but/

“This is not motivated by any kind of serious worry that something went wrong,” said Michael Kang, a law professor at Northwestern University and an expert in election law. “It seems to be prompted by political motivations because the earlier counts and checks didn’t produce the outcome that the legislators wanted.”

Is it the republican's new platform to waste money for their wildish dreams and fantasies?

e GOP state senators who ordered the review have been battling local election officials since November over the results. Even after the majority-Republican Maricopa County Board of Supervisors hired two separate, independent firms to perform a forensic audit of the voting equipment used — an audit which found no irregularities — the state Senate was unsatisfied.

If the voters of Arizona were paying any real attention, they would ask for a recall of these wasteful liars .

Oh but but but they are just doing what the base demands, to ‘restore confidence’, is what the State Senate Prez told CNN the other day.

EA CO AS wrote:

Aaron747 wrote:

that actually suggests is people are even dumber now than in 2000

Well...

¯\_(ツ)_/¯