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NIKV69
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Naomi Osaka won't talk to press

Sun May 30, 2021 9:29 pm

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/tennis ... =undefined

Not sure what she is doing with this one. Mental health? Sure the press can be idiots most of the time but you have the mental strength to stare down Serena and beat her with the crowd totally against you well you can handle a few stupid questions. The powers that be are pushing back hard and she is going to lose this one I wonder when she changes course.
Last edited by SQ22 on Mon May 31, 2021 5:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Title was misleading
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luckyone
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Sun May 30, 2021 9:58 pm

Sometimes people get a little too full of themselves. This is one of those times. Last summer she was a media darling for her stance on racial justice. I’d be willing to bet she let that go to her head.

Naomi Osaka is young and rightly celebrated for using her success as a platform for change. But she’s also the best paid woman athlete on the planet, something she is privileged to be because of sponsorship deals, media buys, etc etc, and the efforts of women like Billie Jean King and the Original Nine who would take any opportunity they could get to promote tennis. She is a professional athlete (hardly a healthy choice for mental health) who plays a game of repetition, so it’s a little laughable that she complains about answering the same questions several times over. She used the media to exercise her rights of freedom of speech, but gets annoyed when they exercise theirs. It’s not somebody else’s fault that a question instill doubt in her mind. Sports has a mental component that is bigger than the physical, and while I guess somebody will make the argument that she is trying to tend to the mental side, my counter argument will be you can’t have your cake and eat it too. Serena Williams often shows up to conferences with her rear end on her shoulders but both she and Osaka take the paycheck and sponsorship deals. If Osaka truly does not do well with notoriety then she has a few more things to do than just not show up for a presser. Spoiler: she DID do a court side interview today which weakens her case.

Noteworthy in this discussion is she’s historically a terrible player off hard courts. Roland Garros is played on red clay.
 
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Revelation
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Sun May 30, 2021 10:17 pm

luckyone wrote:
Spoiler: she DID do a court side interview today which weakens her case.

Not really, those questions are being asked calmly, politely and respectfully, not like the pack of hyenas that the later media scrum becomes.

It is funny to see the haughty tennis world raise its hackles and descend on one of their darlings.

Good for her, complaining through channels will change nothing, she's using her star power for a good cause.

I'd hope we could do better than mediots screaming questions at athletes, a reform is needed.

Who are we to question what her inner response to all that is? How could we possibly know?
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luckyone
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Sun May 30, 2021 10:19 pm

Revelation wrote:
luckyone wrote:
Spoiler: she DID do a court side interview today which weakens her case.

Not really, those questions are being asked calmly, politely and respectfully, not like the pack of hyenas that the later media scrum becomes.

It is funny to see the haughty tennis world raise its hackles and descend on one of their darlings.

Good for her, complaining through channels will change nothing, she's using her star power for a good cause.

I'd hope we could do better than mediots screaming questions at athletes, a reform is needed.

Who are we to question what her inner response to all that is? How could we possibly know?

It would seem that you haven’t watched many tennis press conferences. Also, there’s two little words “No comment.”

She’s risking getting herself defaulted. The directors for the four majors are on record as trying to have reached out to her about the situation, but she hasn’t reached out. She’s looking for a fight, and one of my initial thoughts was she did this to distract herself from her historically poor clay court form.

If the response to notoriety is indeed that bad for her, she can do the following:
- give Nike back the money they’ve given her for plastering her face all over the world.
- Give Yonex the money back for the same.
- Give ANA back their sponsorship money.
- Break up with her boyfriend after she stood on Arthur Ashe Stadium with him, taking a picture while he gave the bird to the camera.
- After giving up her US Passport in accordance with Japanese law, she can go there and not be bothered by the world media, though the Japanese media is often the one taking more questions than others in her press conferences.
 
NIKV69
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Sun May 30, 2021 11:13 pm

Revelation wrote:
luckyone wrote:
Spoiler: she DID do a court side interview today which weakens her case.

Not really, those questions are being asked calmly, politely and respectfully, not like the pack of hyenas that the later media scrum becomes.

It is funny to see the haughty tennis world raise its hackles and descend on one of their darlings.

Good for her, complaining through channels will change nothing, she's using her star power for a good cause.

I'd hope we could do better than mediots screaming questions at athletes, a reform is needed.

Who are we to question what her inner response to all that is? How could we possibly know?


If Aaron Boone can talk to the press so can she.
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Aaron747
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 12:11 am

It’s part of the job, so to speak. If the other players have to deal with the media, so does she. I have been a tennis fan since teenage years but the snobby management structure at ATP/WTA and the tournament money machines are both annoying and vindictive. She will be sorry if she doesn’t get with the program and play ball.
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luckyone
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 12:52 am

Aaron747 wrote:
It’s part of the job, so to speak. If the other players have to deal with the media, so does she. I have been a tennis fan since teenage years but the snobby management structure at ATP/WTA and the tournament money machines are both annoying and vindictive. She will be sorry if she doesn’t get with the program and play ball.

From my perspective it’s not that every player has to deal with media, it’s moreso that she’s been perfectly happy to use the media and takes the cash, but then complains when the fiddler has to be paid. Pick your metaphor, but there’s no such thing as a free lunch.
 
sierrakilo44
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 1:27 am

I’m glad, those post match interviews after any sports game are generally quite boring and by the numbers:

If the player won: I’m happy with the effort I put in with the match and congratulate my opponent for trying.

If the player lost: I tried my hardest but need to improve a bit more and my opponent was just better on the day.

Boring.

As another point there’s no surprise in any sport but especially tennis the media has darlings. For whatever reason (I have my suspicions) Naomi is not a media darling, putting her alongside players like Novak.
 
ewt340
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 1:47 am

Those useless interviews nobody watch. Not even by people who enjoy tennis. Why can't they do something more exciting with interviews?

Soo much money wasted on an events that nobody cares about.
 
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 2:02 am

luckyone wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
It’s part of the job, so to speak. If the other players have to deal with the media, so does she. I have been a tennis fan since teenage years but the snobby management structure at ATP/WTA and the tournament money machines are both annoying and vindictive. She will be sorry if she doesn’t get with the program and play ball.

From my perspective it’s not that every player has to deal with media, it’s moreso that she’s been perfectly happy to use the media and takes the cash, but then complains when the fiddler has to be paid. Pick your metaphor, but there’s no such thing as a free lunch.


That's true too - but the junkets come with participating in the tournament, is all I'm saying. Athletes are expected to 'perform' on and off court.
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ewt340
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 2:13 am

Aaron747 wrote:
luckyone wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
It’s part of the job, so to speak. If the other players have to deal with the media, so does she. I have been a tennis fan since teenage years but the snobby management structure at ATP/WTA and the tournament money machines are both annoying and vindictive. She will be sorry if she doesn’t get with the program and play ball.

From my perspective it’s not that every player has to deal with media, it’s moreso that she’s been perfectly happy to use the media and takes the cash, but then complains when the fiddler has to be paid. Pick your metaphor, but there’s no such thing as a free lunch.


That's true too - but the junkets come with participating in the tournament, is all I'm saying. Athletes are expected to 'perform' on and off court.


Well I guess Naomi is using her platform to "negotiate" her contract for her "performances".
 
ltbewr
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 2:24 am

Many sports, other celebrities including politicians, want absolute control to how they want to be seen in public. Most have accounts with TicToc, Twitter, Facebook to bypass the media attempts to control their narrative. Many of the 'reporters' are looking for the 'gotcha' question, the info that will get them attention as well as their employer. Too often reporters ask questions are stupid, repetitive, embarrassing, offensive, insulting, sexist, racist, and potential tripping points in how they want to be seen by their fans. Some celebs just don't trust them due to past bad experiences. Yes, there is an obligation to participate in post-match media conference, that is part of the deal to payback the sponsors who put up the prize money but who can blame celebs not wanting to deal with them.
 
luckyone
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 2:32 am

ltbewr wrote:
Many sports, other celebrities including politicians, want absolute control to how they want to be seen in public. Most have accounts with TicToc, Twitter, Facebook to bypass the media attempts to control their narrative. Many of the 'reporters' are looking for the 'gotcha' question, the info that will get them attention as well as their employer. Too often reporters ask questions are stupid, repetitive, embarrassing, offensive, insulting, sexist, racist, and potential tripping points in how they want to be seen by their fans. Some celebs just don't trust them due to past bad experiences. Yes, there is an obligation to participate in post-match media conference, that is part of the deal to payback the sponsors who put up the prize money but who can blame celebs not wanting to deal with them.

Then don’t take the prize money. It’s a spectator sport and entry into tournaments is entirely voluntary.
 
luckyone
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 2:42 am

ewt340 wrote:
Those useless interviews nobody watch. Not even by people who enjoy tennis. Why can't they do something more exciting with interviews?

Soo much money wasted on an events that nobody cares about.

You may not. A lot of us do. And television schedulers count on the press conferences from the top names—they’re often aired as inserts during other matches. I watch them all the time—everybody watches a Serena Williams press conference and absolutely watched all of them after her multiple US Open final meltdowns. Caroline Wozniaki was a press conference darling due to being quite silly and her pressers were replayed many times. Osaka made her name with what were described as refreshing and candid press conferences, and this was before her US Open breakthrough in ‘18. For better or worse, particularly if a top player unexpectedly loses, their comments drive ratings, which drives prize money. They can’t have it both ways.
Last edited by luckyone on Mon May 31, 2021 2:56 am, edited 2 times in total.
 
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 2:43 am

ewt340 wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
luckyone wrote:
From my perspective it’s not that every player has to deal with media, it’s moreso that she’s been perfectly happy to use the media and takes the cash, but then complains when the fiddler has to be paid. Pick your metaphor, but there’s no such thing as a free lunch.


That's true too - but the junkets come with participating in the tournament, is all I'm saying. Athletes are expected to 'perform' on and off court.


Well I guess Naomi is using her platform to "negotiate" her contract for her "performances".

She’s going to have a hard time doing that considering her contract is with the WTA and major tournaments who have to have a uniform policy for hundreds of players. Guess we shall see.
 
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 2:52 am

luckyone wrote:
Then don’t take the prize money. It’s a spectator sport and entry into tournaments is entirely voluntary.


Exactly.

These interviews and all the media bullsh#t that comes with high level sport events are also the reason the prizes are so high and why athletes train and compete in them in the first place. No one would compete in Roland Garros or any of the Grand Slam tournaments if the top prize was $100 in supermarket coupons and a Wal Mart trophy.

In fact, many athletes were up in arms recently because Roland Garros wanted to reduce the prize money as the pandemic meant that attendance was going to be greatly reduced...
No one does it to parade on TV. They do it for money, and the money comes with strings... as it always does.
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Aaron747
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 4:15 am

Francoflier wrote:
luckyone wrote:
Then don’t take the prize money. It’s a spectator sport and entry into tournaments is entirely voluntary.


Exactly.

These interviews and all the media bullsh#t that comes with high level sport events are also the reason the prizes are so high and why athletes train and compete in them in the first place. No one would compete in Roland Garros or any of the Grand Slam tournaments if the top prize was $100 in supermarket coupons and a Wal Mart trophy.

In fact, many athletes were up in arms recently because Roland Garros wanted to reduce the prize money as the pandemic meant that attendance was going to be greatly reduced...
No one does it to parade on TV. They do it for money, and the money comes with strings... as it always does.


That's it in a nutshell. Anyone not interested in the money can just be king of the hill at their local tourney, and destroy any NTRP 5+ competition weekly like my cousin does, with no fanfare whatsoever.
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luckyone
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 4:39 am

sierrakilo44 wrote:
.

As another point there’s no surprise in any sport but especially tennis the media has darlings. For whatever reason (I have my suspicions) Naomi is not a media darling, putting her alongside players like Novak.

Umm wut?? Osaka is nothing but a media darling. Novak has the misfortune of having come just a little too late to the Rafa-Federer party, a situation he doesn’t help by: 1. Making it very obvious he wants attention, 2. The fact that he’s more than a little nuts (ie. his celiac diagnosis and belief that positivity can detoxify or rearrange molecules or whatever kooky pseudoscience he was babbling about last spring) and 3. Combine a temper with both 1 and 2 is sloppy and has a tendency to put his foot in his mouth.
 
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 4:44 am

luckyone wrote:
sierrakilo44 wrote:
.

As another point there’s no surprise in any sport but especially tennis the media has darlings. For whatever reason (I have my suspicions) Naomi is not a media darling, putting her alongside players like Novak.

Umm wut?? Osaka is nothing but a media darling. Novak has the misfortune of having come just a little too late to the Rafa-Federer party, a situation he doesn’t help by: 1. Making it very obvious he wants attention, 2. The fact that he’s more than a little nuts (ie. his celiac diagnosis and belief that positivity can detoxify or rearrange molecules or whatever kooky pseudoscience he was babbling about last spring) and 3. Combine a temper with both 1 and 2 is sloppy and has a tendency to put his foot in his mouth.


Djokovic thinks he's this generation's eastern European Agassi. The problem is he doesn't have even a third of Agassi's charm.
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Kiwirob
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 5:21 am

NIKV69 wrote:
https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/tennis/all-four-grand-slams-issue-joint-statement-threatening-naomi-osaka-with-disqualification-and-suspension-if-she-boycotts-media/ar-AAKxkuG?ocid=undefined

Not sure what she is doing with this one. Mental health? Sure the press can be idiots most of the time but you have the mental strength to stare down Serena and beat her with the crowd totally against you well you can handle a few stupid questions. The powers that be are pushing back hard and she is going to lose this one I wonder when she changes course.


Serena is relatively easy to beat today, most crowds are against here outside of the US rather than for her. Her career is done and dusted she just wont admit it.

Osaka is being a prima donna, she needs a kick up the butt and to be told that this is the price she has to pay for the $50m she made last year.
 
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 6:46 am

If she was sincere or smart she could have done things differently, say that she has mental health issues and that reporters are mean or something, but go to the pressers. Then either take nice questions and no comment the others or something like that. Pretty soon I'm sure should would only get "nice" pressers.
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 8:00 am

If she is having mental health issues, then she has my absolute sympathy. It's seems from many of the responses here that folks have obviously not witnessed a close, loved one suffering with mental health issues. I wouldn't wish it on anyone.

Aesma wrote:
Then either take nice questions and no comment the others or something like that. Pretty soon I'm sure should would only get "nice" pressers.


Exactly. If she's compelled to attend these cringe-fests, either just give "Yes", "No" or "No comment" answers. They'll get shorter very quickly.
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Aaron747
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 8:52 am

scbriml wrote:
Exactly. If she's compelled to attend these cringe-fests, either just give "Yes", "No" or "No comment" answers. They'll get shorter very quickly.


I wouldn't have as much issue with that. My thing is - attending the press thing goes with the gig, so you have to do it.
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sierrakilo44
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 9:53 am

luckyone wrote:

Umm wut?? Osaka is nothing but a media darling.


The reaction she got after the US Open 2018 would deny that. And US media never liked it when she relinquished her citizenship to play for Japan. And let’s not forget the current mood in the US towards those of Asian descent.

Despite having been raised in the US if you know a little about her she was raised with Japanese cultural traits, along with being naturally shy. It doesn’t lend itself to good engagement with western media.

Clay isn’t her best but she can hold it on other courts. Most grand slams of any current female player except Serena and she’s only 23. She’ll get into at least double digits. She seems to be willing to cop a disqualification from the tournament over this issue so her concern for her mental state will be valid.

I’m glad she’s boycotting the boring as anything press conferences where the media create drama to attract clicks and views. It’s time these post match conferences in all sports either changed dramatically where reporters asked sensible questions or they end.

Good for her.
 
luckyone
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 11:03 am

scbriml wrote:
If she is having mental health issues, then she has my absolute sympathy. It's seems from many of the responses here that folks have obviously not witnessed a close, loved one suffering with mental health issues. I wouldn't wish it on anyone.

Aesma wrote:
Then either take nice questions and no comment the others or something like that. Pretty soon I'm sure should would only get "nice" pressers.


Exactly. If she's compelled to attend these cringe-fests, either just give "Yes", "No" or "No comment" answers. They'll get shorter very quickly.

I’m a psychiatrist who’s watched family suffer from mental illness. I think I’m fairly qualified to speak on the topic. Press conferences putting “doubt” into her mind as she describes it, and having to answer the same question over and over again, does not mental health constitute. Now, she could further clarify if she so chooses, but she’s not obliged to beyond the fact that now that she’s brought it up she’s opened herself to cross evaluation. The bottom line is you cannot have it both ways. If her mental health is so fragile she cannot answer difficult questions or be exposed to negative attention then she’s no business participating in a spectator sport.

sierrakilo44 wrote:
luckyone wrote:

Umm wut?? Osaka is nothing but a media darling.


The reaction she got after the US Open 2018 would deny that. And US media never liked it when she relinquished her citizenship to play for Japan. And let’s not forget the current mood in the US towards those of Asian descent.

Despite having been raised in the US if you know a little about her she was raised with Japanese cultural traits, along with being naturally shy. It doesn’t lend itself to good engagement with western media.

Clay isn’t her best but she can hold it on other courts. Most grand slams of any current female player except Serena and she’s only 23. She’ll get into at least double digits. She seems to be willing to cop a disqualification from the tournament over this issue so her concern for her mental state will be valid.

I’m glad she’s boycotting the boring as anything press conferences where the media create drama to attract clicks and views. It’s time these post match conferences in all sports either changed dramatically where reporters asked sensible questions or they end.

Good for her.

That pesky cancel culture.

Thanks I know quite a bit about her. I would say clearly we aren’t watching the same media coverage of Osaka. She was widely lauded for her ‘18 US Open—she had nothing to do with the Serena umpire hissy fit and the negative reactions were directed at the umpire. I’ll happily point to my own comments from a thread here at the time.

As for media click bait...she keeps a very active social media profile and again, it’s a spectator sport and she takes the cash. It’s also more than a little ironic that she’s using the media to tell the media she isn’t going to talk to them.

As for her relinquishing her US citizenship, again the overall theme here is people seem to ignore that actions have implications. This case, IMHO she forfeited some of her entitlement as a US Citizen—she now resides in the US at the grace and favor of the country, which she will always get because she makes a lot of money and pays US taxes. She relinquished her right for reasons that are valid to her, but she cannot vote. As such, it’s understandable that some people might respond with criticism because she is longer completely part of the group by choice, even though IMHO she was not out of line in her racial justice comments. She’s effectively saying she wants to be Japanese for her job but I’ll take the benefits of living in the US, where her status as a multicultural woman is actually far better accepted than the place of her birth—and if you know anything about her family you know that she was not welcomed by her grandparents for many years. Meanwhile, if it’s all about heritage she never talks about being Haitian.
 
luckyone
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 11:45 am

Kiwirob wrote:
NIKV69 wrote:
https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/tennis/all-four-grand-slams-issue-joint-statement-threatening-naomi-osaka-with-disqualification-and-suspension-if-she-boycotts-media/ar-AAKxkuG?ocid=undefined

Not sure what she is doing with this one. Mental health? Sure the press can be idiots most of the time but you have the mental strength to stare down Serena and beat her with the crowd totally against you well you can handle a few stupid questions. The powers that be are pushing back hard and she is going to lose this one I wonder when she changes course.


Serena is relatively easy to beat today, most crowds are against here outside of the US rather than for her. Her career is done and dusted she just wont admit it.

Osaka is being a prima donna, she needs a kick up the butt and to be told that this is the price she has to pay for the $50m she made last year.

Relatively easy is a relative term. Either way, I wouldn’t call Osaka’s 2018 US Open easy. Serena Williams may be at least 20 pounds heavier than she used to be, but she’s still one of the greatest singles player that ever played the game*. And you have to bring your game to win as convincingly as Osaka did that day. That is not an easy thing to do and she did it.

*I say one of because I don’t compare players across eras. Serena is an amazingly gifted athlete and would’ve been successful in any era, but there’s always caveats. We don’t know what she would play like with wooden racquets. We don’t know how many slams Navratilova would’ve won if she hadn’t had to basically be a stateless orphan the first few years of her career. We don’t know how many Slams Seles would’ve won if she hadn’t been stabbed. We don’t know how many slams 22-time champion Graf would’ve won if she had played into her mid 30s like Serena and not retired at 29.
 
johns624
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 12:52 pm

I remember reading a quote many years ago from a reporter who covered the tennis circuit. It could've been as far back as the Connors/McEnroe era. To paraphrase it, he said that a plane carrying the Top 100 players could crash into a mountain and the world would be a better place. Tennis has more prima donnas than any other sport.
 
luckyone
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 1:02 pm

Aaron747 wrote:
luckyone wrote:
sierrakilo44 wrote:
.

As another point there’s no surprise in any sport but especially tennis the media has darlings. For whatever reason (I have my suspicions) Naomi is not a media darling, putting her alongside players like Novak.

Umm wut?? Osaka is nothing but a media darling. Novak has the misfortune of having come just a little too late to the Rafa-Federer party, a situation he doesn’t help by: 1. Making it very obvious he wants attention, 2. The fact that he’s more than a little nuts (ie. his celiac diagnosis and belief that positivity can detoxify or rearrange molecules or whatever kooky pseudoscience he was babbling about last spring) and 3. Combine a temper with both 1 and 2 is sloppy and has a tendency to put his foot in his mouth.


Djokovic thinks he's this generation's eastern European Agassi. The problem is he doesn't have even a third of Agassi's charm.

Indeed. It’s not apparent on TV due to replays and commentators, but if you’ve ever seen him play in person, he spends a lot of time yelling at his box, even when he’s winning. Then we can talk about how after he accidentally pelts a lines woman in the throat one of the first things he says to a tournament referee is how a default will impact his tally of Grand Slams.
 
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 2:43 pm

johns624 wrote:
I remember reading a quote many years ago from a reporter who covered the tennis circuit. It could've been as far back as the Connors/McEnroe era. To paraphrase it, he said that a plane carrying the Top 100 players could crash into a mountain and the world would be a better place. Tennis has more prima donnas than any other sport.


Sorry my vote has to go to CL or PL footy for that. Have you seen those soccer guys preening for the camera and feigning injury? Oscar performances they are not :lol:
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 3:09 pm

luckyone wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:
NIKV69 wrote:
https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/tennis/all-four-grand-slams-issue-joint-statement-threatening-naomi-osaka-with-disqualification-and-suspension-if-she-boycotts-media/ar-AAKxkuG?ocid=undefined

Not sure what she is doing with this one. Mental health? Sure the press can be idiots most of the time but you have the mental strength to stare down Serena and beat her with the crowd totally against you well you can handle a few stupid questions. The powers that be are pushing back hard and she is going to lose this one I wonder when she changes course.


Serena is relatively easy to beat today, most crowds are against here outside of the US rather than for her. Her career is done and dusted she just wont admit it.

Osaka is being a prima donna, she needs a kick up the butt and to be told that this is the price she has to pay for the $50m she made last year.

Relatively easy is a relative term. Either way, I wouldn’t call Osaka’s 2018 US Open easy. Serena Williams may be at least 20 pounds heavier than she used to be, but she’s still one of the greatest singles player that ever played the game*. And you have to bring your game to win as convincingly as Osaka did that day. That is not an easy thing to do and she did it.

*I say one of because I don’t compare players across eras. Serena is an amazingly gifted athlete and would’ve been successful in any era, but there’s always caveats. We don’t know what she would play like with wooden racquets. We don’t know how many slams Navratilova would’ve won if she hadn’t had to basically be a stateless orphan the first few years of her career. We don’t know how many Slams Seles would’ve won if she hadn’t been stabbed. We don’t know how many slams 22-time champion Graf would’ve won if she had played into her mid 30s like Serena and not retired at 29.


Serena in 2018 was in the way down, Serena today is basically making up the numbers, players are no longer intimidated by her, she’s old and slow.

I believe Navratilova is the greatest female tennis player of all time, bar non.

Graf is probably the GOAT at singles, her career was a lot shorter than Serena’s, she spent nearly 60 more weeks at number one, won more titles and has a better win loss ratio.
 
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 3:39 pm

scbriml wrote:
If she is having mental health issues, then she has my absolute sympathy. It's seems from many of the responses here that folks have obviously not witnessed a close, loved one suffering with mental health issues. I wouldn't wish it on anyone.

It's strange to keep reading here that the stress of playing the sport in an arena is the same as the stress of facing media members whose questions are "offensive, insulting, sexist, racist, and potential tripping points in how they want to be seen by their fans" as stated so well by ltbewr above.

To me they are pretty different challenges to face.

The fact that others bear up well under such without resulting mental health issues doesn't mean she can/does.

I'm surprised most people here don't see room for reform in the process.

"Just suck it up" IMO is not a great answer.

scbriml wrote:
Aesma wrote:
Then either take nice questions and no comment the others or something like that. Pretty soon I'm sure should would only get "nice" pressers.

Exactly. If she's compelled to attend these cringe-fests, either just give "Yes", "No" or "No comment" answers. They'll get shorter very quickly.

If she genuinely is having mental health issues triggered by the pressers, going there at all is a problem.

Maybe she can get some coaching or counseling then do as you suggest.

Maybe then she can follow Marshawn Lynch's path: https://www.espn.com/nfl/playoffs/2014/ ... -get-fined
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 5:04 pm

Revelation wrote:
scbriml wrote:
If she is having mental health issues, then she has my absolute sympathy. It's seems from many of the responses here that folks have obviously not witnessed a close, loved one suffering with mental health issues. I wouldn't wish it on anyone.

It's strange to keep reading here that the stress of playing the sport in an arena is the same as the stress of facing media members whose questions are "offensive, insulting, sexist, racist, and potential tripping points in how they want to be seen by their fans" as stated so well by ltbewr above.

To me they are pretty different challenges to face.

The fact that others bear up well under such without resulting mental health issues doesn't mean she can/does.

I'm surprised most people here don't see room for reform in the process.

"Just suck it up" IMO is not a great answer.

scbriml wrote:
Aesma wrote:
Then either take nice questions and no comment the others or something like that. Pretty soon I'm sure should would only get "nice" pressers.

Exactly. If she's compelled to attend these cringe-fests, either just give "Yes", "No" or "No comment" answers. They'll get shorter very quickly.

If she genuinely is having mental health issues triggered by the pressers, going there at all is a problem.

Maybe she can get some coaching or counseling then do as you suggest.

Maybe then she can follow Marshawn Lynch's path: https://www.espn.com/nfl/playoffs/2014/ ... -get-fined

Have you ever played sanctioned competitive sports? I have at the college level. Putting yourself on display and being judged solely based on physical merits is far more stressful than having to answer gotcha questions.

With respect to counseling or sports psychology, sure. She could make use of that. For all we know that was one of the things the tournament directors would/could have discussed with her when they tried to speak to her and she did not engage.
 
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 5:16 pm

luckyone wrote:
Putting yourself on display and being judged solely based on physical merits is far more stressful than having to answer gotcha questions.

You seem to be assuming your psychological make up is the same as hers, which you can't know. You also haven't faced such questions at the highest level of the sport year after year as she has. Media members don't reach that level by tossing softball questions. It's not hard for me to picture how that could wear a person down mentally and become a real problem. I hope a more workable approach can be found.
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 5:16 pm

Revelation wrote:
luckyone wrote:
Putting yourself on display and being judged solely based on physical merits is far more stressful than having to answer gotcha questions.

You seem to be assuming your psychological make up is the same as hers, which you can't know. You also haven't faced such questions at the highest level of the sport year after year as she has. Media members don't reach that level by tossing softball questions. It's not hard for me to picture how that could wear a person down mentally and become a real problem. I hope a more workable approach can be found.

I also didn’t get paid $50,000,000 last year...if she can’t answer, for better or worse, to people paying her bills (ie media, advertisers) then she needs to take her well-earned cash and do something else. Period.
 
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 5:26 pm

luckyone wrote:
Revelation wrote:
luckyone wrote:
Putting yourself on display and being judged solely based on physical merits is far more stressful than having to answer gotcha questions.

You seem to be assuming your psychological make up is the same as hers, which you can't know. You also haven't faced such questions at the highest level of the sport year after year as she has. Media members don't reach that level by tossing softball questions. It's not hard for me to picture how that could wear a person down mentally and become a real problem. I hope a more workable approach can be found.

I also didn’t get paid $50,000,000 last year...if she can’t answer, for better or worse, to people paying her bills (ie media advertisers) then she needs to take her well-earned cash and do something else. Period.

I find it pretty incongruous that you say you are a mental health professional yet are so unilateral and fixated in your approach.

She is not answering to advertisers, she is answering to media members of the modern era, whose job it is to trip her up in any way they can.

Sure she can go home and count her money, but who exactly does that benefit?

I think it's better she push the issue to see if improvements can't be made while she has the power to make an issue out of it.

This thread shows the huge amount of close-mindedness and inertia she's having to deal with.
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 5:42 pm

Revelation wrote:
luckyone wrote:
Revelation wrote:
You seem to be assuming your psychological make up is the same as hers, which you can't know. You also haven't faced such questions at the highest level of the sport year after year as she has. Media members don't reach that level by tossing softball questions. It's not hard for me to picture how that could wear a person down mentally and become a real problem. I hope a more workable approach can be found.

I also didn’t get paid $50,000,000 last year...if she can’t answer, for better or worse, to people paying her bills (ie media advertisers) then she needs to take her well-earned cash and do something else. Period.

I find it pretty incongruous that you say you are a mental health professional yet are so unilateral and fixated in your approach.

She is not answering to advertisers, she is answering to media members of the modern era, whose job it is to trip her up in any way they can.

Sure she can go home and count her money, but who exactly does that benefit?

I think it's better she push the issue to see if improvements can't be made while she has the power to make an issue out of it.

This thread shows the huge amount of close-mindedness and inertia she's having to deal with.

Perhaps you need to know a little bit more about mental health. For starters, in my care right now is a young person who jumped out of a window because they believed they were the devil and were going to hurt their family. I’ve taken care of people who jumped in front of buses because they believed they were children of god and believed their action was a demonstration of faith and God would save them. Ive cared for drug users who’ve effectively fried their brains but at the same time have abscesses in their spines that require weeks of medical treatment and I have to advocate to the court why they need it because they literally can’t process cause and effect. I’ve taken care of veterans who are haunted for decades by nightmares of attacks and landslides that have literally buried entire towns. I’ve taken care of people who cannot get out of bed for weeks. I’ve taken care of people who are so catatonic they can’t talk. You? Talk to me again about “gotcha questions” about a job that you chose to do and reap the financial rewards. Now, unfortunately for Osaka she has chosen to complain about mental health in terms of reporters putting “doubt” in her mind. Call me rigidly fixated but I’m not sold and quite frankly bristling at the notion that she’s using the description of “mental health,” which has become a catch all for things that annoy us. I have to deal with stigma from other doctors, family members, public officials, and the public at large all of whom are suddenly experts in mental health. “Doubt” in a well paid athlete who’s complaining about an unpleasant aspect of her cushy life doesn’t do me or my patients any favors. She’s under no obligation to discuss her personal issues in public, except now she’s made them a public issue and from a professional perspective there’s some notable gaps in her initial statements.

We often tell people if they can’t change their attitude to change the situation. But this situation is she earns a living as a public figure and makes a LOT of money due to media promotion of her chosen sport. The two are inseparable.
Last edited by luckyone on Mon May 31, 2021 6:10 pm, edited 2 times in total.
 
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 5:45 pm

Revelation wrote:
luckyone wrote:
Revelation wrote:
You seem to be assuming your psychological make up is the same as hers, which you can't know. You also haven't faced such questions at the highest level of the sport year after year as she has. Media members don't reach that level by tossing softball questions. It's not hard for me to picture how that could wear a person down mentally and become a real problem. I hope a more workable approach can be found.

I also didn’t get paid $50,000,000 last year...if she can’t answer, for better or worse, to people paying her bills (ie media advertisers) then she needs to take her well-earned cash and do something else. Period.

I find it pretty incongruous that you say you are a mental health professional yet are so unilateral and fixated in your approach.

She is not answering to advertisers, she is answering to media members of the modern era, whose job it is to trip her up in any way they can.

Sure she can go home and count her money, but who exactly does that benefit?

I think it's better she push the issue to see if improvements can't be made while she has the power to make an issue out of it.

This thread shows the huge amount of close-mindedness and inertia she's having to deal with.

According to news, it seems like her rejection against press meeting could lead to her being banned from participating any major sport competition, and when that become consequence of her action then sponsor aren't going to sit ideally and pay their money to a figure who cannot represent their brand on the field?
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 5:50 pm

c933103 wrote:
Revelation wrote:
luckyone wrote:
I also didn’t get paid $50,000,000 last year...if she can’t answer, for better or worse, to people paying her bills (ie media advertisers) then she needs to take her well-earned cash and do something else. Period.

I find it pretty incongruous that you say you are a mental health professional yet are so unilateral and fixated in your approach.

She is not answering to advertisers, she is answering to media members of the modern era, whose job it is to trip her up in any way they can.

Sure she can go home and count her money, but who exactly does that benefit?

I think it's better she push the issue to see if improvements can't be made while she has the power to make an issue out of it.

This thread shows the huge amount of close-mindedness and inertia she's having to deal with.

According to news, it seems like her rejection against press meeting could lead to her being banned from participating any major sport competition, and when that become consequence of her action then sponsor aren't going to sit ideally and pay their money to a figure who cannot represent their brand on the field?

Advertisers also pay the salaries of those members of the media.
 
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Re: Naomi Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 6:03 pm

And this just in — Osaka withdraws from Roland Garros. I can respect that a lot more than vague sound bytes and piecemeal engagement. If she needs help then I hope she gets it. And in private.
 
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Re: Naomi Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 6:19 pm

Revelation wrote:
It's strange to keep reading here that the stress of playing the sport in an arena is the same as the stress of facing media members whose questions are "offensive, insulting, sexist, racist, and potential tripping points in how they want to be seen by their fans" as stated so well by ltbewr above.

To me they are pretty different challenges to face.

The fact that others bear up well under such without resulting mental health issues doesn't mean she can/does.

I'm surprised most people here don't see room for reform in the process.

"Just suck it up" IMO is not a great answer.


A couple of England cricketers who were both exceptional at international level quit playing at that level because of the damage the stress was causing them. You would never have known it because their performances didn’t suffer, but they both just reached the point where they couldn’t take it any more. Before my first-hand experience of seeing a close, loved one suffer with mental health issues, I would likely have taken the view that they should both “just man up” and get on with it because they had what I would consider a dream job.

There seems to be a theme here that how dare she earn the money that her skill deserves if she feels unable to attend pressers because it’s part of the job. Frankly, it comes across as petty jealousy.

Revelation wrote:
If she genuinely is having mental health issues triggered by the pressers, going there at all is a problem.


Of course, hence why I said “If compelled…”
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Re: Naomi Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 6:31 pm

scbriml wrote:
Revelation wrote:
It's strange to keep reading here that the stress of playing the sport in an arena is the same as the stress of facing media members whose questions are "offensive, insulting, sexist, racist, and potential tripping points in how they want to be seen by their fans" as stated so well by ltbewr above.

To me they are pretty different challenges to face.

The fact that others bear up well under such without resulting mental health issues doesn't mean she can/does.

I'm surprised most people here don't see room for reform in the process.

"Just suck it up" IMO is not a great answer.


A couple of England cricketers who were both exceptional at international level quit playing at that level because of the damage the stress was causing them. You would never have known it because their performances didn’t suffer, but they both just reached the point where they couldn’t take it any more. Before my first-hand experience of seeing a close, loved one suffer with mental health issues, I would likely have taken the view that they should both “just man up” and get on with it because they had what I would consider a dream job.

There seems to be a theme here that how dare she earn the money that her skill deserves if she feels unable to attend pressers because it’s part of the job. Frankly, it comes across as petty jealousy.

Speaking only for myself it’s not jealousy. But reflective of either poor communication or misguided priorities. In her initial statement she came across as biting the hand that feeds her. It’s not just about being grateful and not having problems just because she’s paid well. The initial message was one that did not appear to reflect that she was complaining about something from which she benefitted.
 
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Re: Naomi Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 6:38 pm

luckyone wrote:
And this just in — Osaka withdraws from Roland Garros. I can respect that a lot more than vague sound bytes and piecemeal engagement. If she needs help then I hope she gets it. And in private.


What on earth is she doing? Unreal. This is getting out of control.
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Re: Naomi Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 6:41 pm

NIKV69 wrote:
luckyone wrote:
And this just in — Osaka withdraws from Roland Garros. I can respect that a lot more than vague sound bytes and piecemeal engagement. If she needs help then I hope she gets it. And in private.


What on earth is she doing? Unreal. This is getting out of control.


Why do you have a problem with her decision to withdraw?
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Re: Naomi Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 6:49 pm

scbriml wrote:
NIKV69 wrote:
luckyone wrote:
And this just in — Osaka withdraws from Roland Garros. I can respect that a lot more than vague sound bytes and piecemeal engagement. If she needs help then I hope she gets it. And in private.


What on earth is she doing? Unreal. This is getting out of control.


Why do you have a problem with her decision to withdraw?

I know you’re not quoting me, but I don’t. Her subsequent statement was much clearer than her initial one, and a lesson that you’ve really only got one shot to make an effective public statement. I’ve had a period in my life wherein I was so overwhelmed with a situation that I couldn’t appropriately process the situation until I had no choice. We may be seeing that with Naomi in which case the withdrawal was wise. Unfortunately her initial statements made her sound like an entitled little girl—when we feel vulnerable and defensive our mature defenses break down. I hope her team learns a lesson too about having some supports and stop-checks before public statements are made.
 
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Re: Naomi Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 7:21 pm

NIKV69 wrote:

What on earth is she doing? Unreal. This is getting out of control.


If you read her statement posted on her Twitter she indicates she’s suffered depression as a result of what happened to her at the 2018 US Open.

After being put through that abuse at what should’ve been one of the highlights of her career it inflamed her anxiety and she’s been suffering it ever since.

So I hope those who didn’t take her seriously and suggested she’s a Prima Donna, entitled or can’t handle criticism now apologise as her health condition is serious enough for her to leave the competition. Tennis officials now have egg on their face for not supporting her.

It would be a disgrace if a potential superstar of the sport was bullied out of playing. It’s also going to affect ratings and drive down popularity of the tournament, Naomi brought in many new viewers (esp younger and Asian) to the sport.
 
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Re: Naomi Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 7:30 pm

sierrakilo44 wrote:
NIKV69 wrote:

What on earth is she doing? Unreal. This is getting out of control.


If you read her statement posted on her Twitter she indicates she’s suffered depression as a result of what happened to her at the 2018 US Open.

After being put through that abuse at what should’ve been one of the highlights of her career it inflamed her anxiety and she’s been suffering it ever since.

Other than Serena Williams showing her ugly side (yet again) what abuse did Osaka suffer winning the ‘18 Open? Osaka was widely (and rightly) applauded for her match and composure under pressure. I read her statement as one of difficult dealing with notoriety and fame. If she suffered any abuse due to that match she needs to squarely blame that on her idol, Serena Williams.
 
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Re: Naomi Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 8:00 pm

NIKV69 wrote:
luckyone wrote:
And this just in — Osaka withdraws from Roland Garros. I can respect that a lot more than vague sound bytes and piecemeal engagement. If she needs help then I hope she gets it. And in private.


What on earth is she doing? Unreal. This is getting out of control.


It’s absolutely not out of control, it’s for her to decide that she wishes to withdraw from the tournament.

I agree with luckyone. And I’ll go further by saying that it’s so simple to criticise from the luxury of ones lounge chair.
 
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 9:05 pm

luckyone wrote:

We often tell people if they can’t change their attitude to change the situation.

I think she was trying to change her situation, just did so in a way that triggered a lot of people including yourself.

From her statement:

I announced it preemptively because I do feel like the rules are quite outdated in parts and I wanted to highlight that. I wrote privately to the tournament apologizing and saying that I would be more than happy to speak with them after the tournament as the Slams are intense.

Ref: https://edition.cnn.com/2021/05/31/tenn ... index.html

luckyone wrote:

But this situation is she earns a living as a public figure and makes a LOT of money due to media promotion of her chosen sport. The two are inseparable.

I'm sure there's some room for negotiation on exactly how this is accomplished.

luckyone wrote:
Unfortunately her initial statements made her sound like an entitled little girl—when we feel vulnerable and defensive our mature defenses break down. I hope her team learns a lesson too about having some supports and stop-checks before public statements are made.

Yes, and IMO there's some room for international federations to move away from the current feeding frenzy approach to media appearances.

From my link:

Following her decision to opt out of media duties last week, the French Open was criticized for posting a tweet -- which it has since deleted -- with photos of Rafael Nadal, Kei Nishikori, Aryna Sabalenka and Coco Gauff engaging in media duties with the caption: "They understood the assignment."

Four-time grand slam doubles winner Rennae Stubbs tweeted: "This is some serious shade from Roland Garros & the FFT (French Tennis Federation).

"I understand your attempt at making a point but this isn't a good look. I mean these particular players are a great look for tennis but making a player feel guilty & humiliating her is NOT a good look for a tennis fed."

I agree it was not a good look for them, they took out the big guns and fired without considering collateral damage.

It seems many people think money solves all problems and would prevent the depression and the anxiety she is reporting, but I would hope we could understand this is not always the case.

"Just think of how much money you have" is not a clinical cure for depression and anxiety, I think it is safe to say, any more than "think of the children starving in third word nations" is a cure for anorexia.
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Re: Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 9:07 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
Serena in 2018 was in the way down, Serena today is basically making up the numbers, players are no longer intimidated by her, she’s old and slow.

I believe Navratilova is the greatest female tennis player of all time, bar non.

Graf is probably the GOAT at singles, her career was a lot shorter than Serena’s, she spent nearly 60 more weeks at number one, won more titles and has a better win loss ratio.


You haven't been watching women's tennis. Serena is still pretty tough. I loved Martina and Graf but Serena is heads above them. If she didn't have her idiot father and bad attitude she would have won much more.

luckyone wrote:
sierrakilo44 wrote:
NIKV69 wrote:

What on earth is she doing? Unreal. This is getting out of control.


If you read her statement posted on her Twitter she indicates she’s suffered depression as a result of what happened to her at the 2018 US Open.

After being put through that abuse at what should’ve been one of the highlights of her career it inflamed her anxiety and she’s been suffering it ever since.

Other than Serena Williams showing her ugly side (yet again) what abuse did Osaka suffer winning the ‘18 Open? Osaka was widely (and rightly) applauded for her match and composure under pressure. I read her statement as one of difficult dealing with notoriety and fame. If she suffered any abuse due to that match she needs to squarely blame that on her idol, Serena Williams.


I can see her being effected by the 18" Open but that got washed away with that amazing performance when she beat her with a hostile crowd,
I am not buying the mental health thing. I think she thought that powers that be in tennis would fold and cave to her and when they came back at her now she doesn't know what to do because she has to talk to the press now or be DQd.
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Re: Naomi Osaka won't talk to press

Mon May 31, 2021 9:27 pm

NIKV69 wrote:

What on earth is she doing? Unreal. This is getting out of control.

Apparently someone doesn't believe the seriousness of mental health issues and the effect it can have on people dealing with day to day issues.

Steph Curry tweeted this today;
You shouldn't ever have to make a decision like this-but so damn impressive taking the high road when the powers that be don't protect their own. major respect
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Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos