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casinterest
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Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Mon Aug 23, 2021 5:53 pm

On my recent adventures, I traveled many states on the east coast. I every state I was able to pump my own gas, except in New Jersey.
It is illegal in NJ to do the thing I am forced to do should i hit a gas station on any border of NJ.

In days past, i used to tell myself it was fine, because the gas was cheaper than in NY and Delaware/Maryland. However now, the gas has gotten more expensive, and i don't see the benefit in letting someone pump my gas. I also don't see the reason to tip someone for something I am forced not to do.

More background on NJ law.
https://www.nj.gov/labor/lsse/laws/Reta ... _Regs.html


What do you all think of it?
 
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STT757
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Mon Aug 23, 2021 5:58 pm

It provides lots of jobs, I myself pumped gas as a 20 year old in College.

It helps seniors and disabled people.

People who jump in and out of cars quickly can build up static which is discharged when they touch the nozzle and may ignite the fumes.

It differentiates New Jersey.
 
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Dutchy
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Mon Aug 23, 2021 6:27 pm

casinterest wrote:
On my recent adventures, I traveled many states on the east coast. I every state I was able to pump my own gas, except in New Jersey.
It is illegal in NJ to do the thing I am forced to do should i hit a gas station on any border of NJ.

In days past, i used to tell myself it was fine, because the gas was cheaper than in NY and Delaware/Maryland. However now, the gas has gotten more expensive, and i don't see the benefit in letting someone pump my gas. I also don't see the reason to tip someone for something I am forced not to do.

More background on NJ law.
https://www.nj.gov/labor/lsse/laws/Reta ... _Regs.html


What do you all think of it?


is this serious a thing? What a ridiculous law. In the Netherlands, there are hardly any manned gas stations left. Just put in a card, full up and done.
 
luckyone
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Mon Aug 23, 2021 6:32 pm

Dutchy wrote:
casinterest wrote:
On my recent adventures, I traveled many states on the east coast. I every state I was able to pump my own gas, except in New Jersey.
It is illegal in NJ to do the thing I am forced to do should i hit a gas station on any border of NJ.

In days past, i used to tell myself it was fine, because the gas was cheaper than in NY and Delaware/Maryland. However now, the gas has gotten more expensive, and i don't see the benefit in letting someone pump my gas. I also don't see the reason to tip someone for something I am forced not to do.

More background on NJ law.
https://www.nj.gov/labor/lsse/laws/Reta ... _Regs.html


What do you all think of it?


is this serious a thing? What a ridiculous law. In the Netherlands, there are hardly any manned gas stations left. Just put in a card, full up and done.

New Jersey and Oregon both prohibit self-service gasoline sales. Oregon suspended the law due to COVID-19, though when I rolled through in August 2020 the gas station I stopped at pumped my gas for me.
 
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einsteinboricua
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Mon Aug 23, 2021 6:35 pm

casinterest wrote:
What do you all think of it?

So long as the price isn't higher because of the need to man the pumps, I don't mind. When I lived in WA and took trips south to OR, I had the same situation: not allowed to pump gas, but by law, gas could not be priced higher to account for someone pumping it (or so I was told).

I was actually reminiscing of the days when full serve gas stations were all over. Mother, in particular, always went for full serve because she never learned how to operate the pump, and the one time she had an attendant explain it to her, she essentially shut down the pump learning the mechanism (the pump was one of those where you had to lift the nozzle holder to activate it, so she kept raising and lowering it).
 
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einsteinboricua
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Mon Aug 23, 2021 6:40 pm

STT757 wrote:
People who jump in and out of cars quickly can build up static which is discharged when they touch the nozzle and may ignite the fumes.

I can't tell you the number of times I've seen someone pull up, start pumping, then get in their car again WHILE it's pumping, especially during winter. I'm surprised I haven't seen many fires ignited. I think you can spend 5 minutes out in the cold while you pump your gas, and if it's a temperature that is absolutely impossible to tolerate, you shouldn't be outside in the first place.

I'm VERY prone to static so I'm constantly grounding myself to avoid shocks. I'm amazed at how people don't even bother grounding themselves.
 
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seb146
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Mon Aug 23, 2021 6:47 pm

luckyone wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
casinterest wrote:
On my recent adventures, I traveled many states on the east coast. I every state I was able to pump my own gas, except in New Jersey.
It is illegal in NJ to do the thing I am forced to do should i hit a gas station on any border of NJ.

In days past, i used to tell myself it was fine, because the gas was cheaper than in NY and Delaware/Maryland. However now, the gas has gotten more expensive, and i don't see the benefit in letting someone pump my gas. I also don't see the reason to tip someone for something I am forced not to do.

More background on NJ law.
https://www.nj.gov/labor/lsse/laws/Reta ... _Regs.html


What do you all think of it?


is this serious a thing? What a ridiculous law. In the Netherlands, there are hardly any manned gas stations left. Just put in a card, full up and done.

New Jersey and Oregon both prohibit self-service gasoline sales. Oregon suspended the law due to COVID-19, though when I rolled through in August 2020 the gas station I stopped at pumped my gas for me.


Before covid, the Oregon Legislature passed a law that rural stations can set self-serve hours. There are "card lock" stations across Oregon that are self-serve only. Even without self-serve, much of Oregon has cheaper gas than Washington or California.
 
phluser
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Mon Aug 23, 2021 7:00 pm

casinterest wrote:
On my recent adventures, I traveled many states on the east coast. I every state I was able to pump my own gas, except in New Jersey.
It is illegal in NJ to do the thing I am forced to do should i hit a gas station on any border of NJ.

In days past, i used to tell myself it was fine, because the gas was cheaper than in NY and Delaware/Maryland. However now, the gas has gotten more expensive, and i don't see the benefit in letting someone pump my gas. I also don't see the reason to tip someone for something I am forced not to do.

More background on NJ law.
https://www.nj.gov/labor/lsse/laws/Reta ... _Regs.html


What do you all think of it?



You didn't have to tip the attendant.
 
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ER757
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Mon Aug 23, 2021 7:14 pm

I'm old enough to remember the days before self-service gas stations. The attendant would wash your windows, check your oil and tire pressure etc while the tank was filling up. And gas was like $0.25/gal
:old:

Sometimes when I am going thru Oregon I forget about their law and get out and grab the hose before somebody comes out and starts yelling at me :smile:
 
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casinterest
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Mon Aug 23, 2021 7:15 pm

STT757 wrote:
It helps seniors and disabled people.

People who jump in and out of cars quickly can build up static which is discharged when they touch the nozzle and may ignite the fumes.

It differentiates New Jersey.


Good points, and I used to think that when Gas was NC or Fl priced. Now it is more NY priced, which means taxes went up.

My biggest issue, and it is because it is the Turnpike is having to wait for the attendant to work through 4 pumps to get back to me.

phluser wrote:
You didn't have to tip the attendant.


No, I don't anymore, but in the old days they actually used to wash the windshield.
 
GalaxyFlyer
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Mon Aug 23, 2021 7:35 pm

I hate it, too. I just avoid buying in that ridiculous state. I frequently, 3 times a year, go to south Jersey for competitions, buy in NY, buy again across the bridge in DE. Waste of time, usually incomplete feelers that can’t understand English and, if they screw up can give you a “check engine” problem.
 
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STT757
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Mon Aug 23, 2021 11:16 pm

casinterest wrote:
STT757 wrote:
It helps seniors and disabled people.

People who jump in and out of cars quickly can build up static which is discharged when they touch the nozzle and may ignite the fumes.

It differentiates New Jersey.


Good points, and I used to think that when Gas was NC or Fl priced. Now it is more NY priced, which means taxes went up.

My biggest issue, and it is because it is the Turnpike is having to wait for the attendant to work through 4 pumps to get back to me.

phluser wrote:
You didn't have to tip the attendant.


No, I don't anymore, but in the old days they actually used to wash the windshield.


I never get gas on the Turnpike unless it’s an emergency, I usually hit Wawa or Quick check. They always offer great service whether it’s the 19 years olds or the 70 year olds pumping the gas. I have a soft spot for Shell as that’s where I worked. I remember the days when Sunoco used to differentiate themselves with Ultra 94. I used that on my Camaro and Mustangs ( both V-8s). Now it’s Ultra 93, which is what most Super is anyway.
 
phluser
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Mon Aug 23, 2021 11:27 pm

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
I hate it, too. I just avoid buying in that ridiculous state. I frequently, 3 times a year, go to south Jersey for competitions, buy in NY, buy again across the bridge in DE. Waste of time, usually incomplete feelers that can’t understand English and, if they screw up can give you a “check engine” problem.


Were you buying from a gas station in a service area on the NJ Turnpike?

It used to be gas was cheaper in South Jersey than Delaware, New York, Maryland and SE PA until last year. It's more recent that it is slightly more expensive in South Jersey than Delaware and Maryland. And Wawa is everywhere in the southern part of the state, and their gas attendants are typically not immigrant..

AAA's site shows back in 8/23/2020, NJ's gas prices on average were $2.17. Today it is $3.19, higher than Maryland and Delaware. But in 2020, it was lower than those two states. It is still (on average) less in NJ than in PA or NY.
 
GalaxyFlyer
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Mon Aug 23, 2021 11:53 pm

I didn’t buy on the NJ Turnpike, I’ve learned not to. Yes, it was a bit cheaper in Jersey for some odd reason, but I don’t care, they don’t touch my car. I will buy in service areas elsewhere when I can pump, saves time. A couple of weeks, I’ll be Swedesboro, check the prices out then.
 
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cjg225
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 12:10 am

One of the dumbest things about the armpit of America.

Definitely glad I don't cross the Delaware River into NJ for work all the time anymore despite my "office" having been in NJ for the last 8 years.
 
Kent350787
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 12:33 am

I used to get excited being allowed to pump gas for mum or dad

In 1977.

I do find some of the "make work" laws in the USA very interesting. I'd be surprised if there are more than a handful of full service filling stations in my city of over 6 million people.
 
CH47A
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 1:02 am

Oh come on, folks; the first response gave us the proper answer - - - static electricity is stronger in New Jersey than in any other state or territory until Mother Nature ramped up static electricity charges in Oregon to add balance of that same strength of charge in one state on the coasts of the mainland. Mother Nature was just a little slow getting that balance in and allowing a human a hint to help her fix that. Mother Nature is a busy one and she can't quickly fix all those things that need fixing. She just forgot about the west coast and balancing the charges and then she had to find some neat excuse to stick in some human's brain to get the same thing done on the west coast. Now it is all neatly balanced and everyone is happy, right?

Of course you are. Don't you feel great pleasure at pointing to that non-existing spot on the windshield that the attendant missed? Those attendant folks still clean the windshields while the gas is getting pumped from the oilfield to you?
 
ltbewr
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 2:38 am

As to why NJ doesn't allow self-service. Almost all gas stations by the 1940's had attendant service but in the late 1940's an independent gas station in the northern part of the state decided to have self-service, with prices 1-2 cents a gallon, a big deal when gas prices were about 20 cents a gallon (or about $1.60/gallon in today's money. The association of gas station owners pressured/bribed the state legislature to ban self-service. Despite calls to allow self-service many others like the idea of attendant service and yet to be overturned. I have pumped gas in 20 US States, in 5 countries, with no problem. I would note that during and after my college years in the 1970's. I pumped gas helping me make money to pay for college, allowing a place to fix my beater cars to keep them somewhat running.

As to gas prices in NJ, they can still be cheap and with attendant service. Costco near me is $2.99.9/Gallon (Visa Credit card only but due another quirk in NJ law, membership isn't needed - something but can't have selective discounts). Some major stations are $3.04 - 3.09/gallon cash and even credit. Our prices are somewhat lower as close to 2 major refineries, one operated by Philips 66 in NJ, Sun oil and others outside Philadelphia as well as easy access for imported oil by ship, tar oil by train and pipelines. Prices in NJ would be cheaper, but automatic annual tax increases were put in a few years ago to assure sufficient funds for politically critical road construction and maintenance.
 
GalaxyFlyer
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 2:49 am

One thing that irks me is people who leave the car running or put the gas cap in the handle and sit back in the car. I’ve called a few on it and they just shrug like I’m the one who’s wrong. One lady said she had a little one inside and didn’t want it get cold. We’re talking 2 minutes sitting in a warmed car. I asked if she wanted to previous one to burn to death. Not amused.
 
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seb146
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 2:51 am

ER757 wrote:
Sometimes when I am going thru Oregon I forget about their law and get out and grab the hose before somebody comes out and starts yelling at me :smile:


Depends on where in Oregon. I have finished pumping my gas at some border town stations and some tourist area stations. Especially if the attendant and I have a conversation going.
 
Virtual737
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 2:56 am

Many places in the world are not self service. I've had 40 years of self service and 7 of attended. Apart from the occasional initial wait, it bothers me not a bit and, now that I have a diesel, my shoes and hands stay perfectly clean with no effort.
 
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seb146
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 2:57 am

ltbewr wrote:
As to why NJ doesn't allow self-service. Almost all gas stations by the 1940's had attendant service but in the late 1940's an independent gas station in the northern part of the state decided to have self-service, with prices 1-2 cents a gallon, a big deal when gas prices were about 20 cents a gallon (or about $1.60/gallon in today's money. The association of gas station owners pressured/bribed the state legislature to ban self-service. Despite calls to allow self-service many others like the idea of attendant service and yet to be overturned. I have pumped gas in 20 US States, in 5 countries, with no problem. I would note that during and after my college years in the 1970's. I pumped gas helping me make money to pay for college, allowing a place to fix my beater cars to keep them somewhat running.

As to gas prices in NJ, they can still be cheap and with attendant service. Costco near me is $2.99.9/Gallon (Visa Credit card only but due another quirk in NJ law, membership isn't needed - something but can't have selective discounts). Some major stations are $3.04 - 3.09/gallon cash and even credit. Our prices are somewhat lower as close to 2 major refineries, one operated by Philips 66 in NJ, Sun oil and others outside Philadelphia as well as easy access for imported oil by ship, tar oil by train and pipelines. Prices in NJ would be cheaper, but automatic annual tax increases were put in a few years ago to assure sufficient funds for politically critical road construction and maintenance.


I usually buy my gas at Safeway. I use points and get so much off per gallon. It is 55 miles from here to I-5 or 60 miles north to Florence and another 50 east to I-5. Florence is in Lane county, which is in tier 2 of our minimum wage scale. There are three. I live in the lowest minimum wage tier and the Portland metro area is highest. What I don't get is I can drive up to Florence and save at least $.20 per gallon without my Safeway card. AFAIK, our gas is trucked down from Anacortes, WA. A little difference in mileage, but THAT much?
 
System07
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 4:40 am

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
One thing that irks me is people who leave the car running or put the gas cap in the handle and sit back in the car. I’ve called a few on it and they just shrug like I’m the one who’s wrong. One lady said she had a little one inside and didn’t want it get cold. We’re talking 2 minutes sitting in a warmed car. I asked if she wanted to previous one to burn to death. Not amused.


But didn’t you do in-air refueling with running jets?? Lol I kid. It bothers me too
 
tommy1808
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 4:53 am

einsteinboricua wrote:
STT757 wrote:
People who jump in and out of cars quickly can build up static which is discharged when they touch the nozzle and may ignite the fumes.

I can't tell you the number of times I've seen someone pull up, start pumping, then get in their car again WHILE it's pumping, especially during winter. I'm surprised I haven't seen many fires ignited..


ignition isn´t even the problem. People pulling out the pumping fuel line in panic once fumes have ignited is. That is how you get nasty fires. So the fuel flow is already shut of nothing will happen. If it is cold there essentially is no chance of enough fuel fumes being present to get ignited. Otherwise the intensity of the fire is very low and the tank opening makes for a fine flame holder until a gust of wind blows it out. Or someone just blows it out.

best regards
Thomas
 
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seb146
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 6:11 am

tommy1808 wrote:
einsteinboricua wrote:
STT757 wrote:
People who jump in and out of cars quickly can build up static which is discharged when they touch the nozzle and may ignite the fumes.

I can't tell you the number of times I've seen someone pull up, start pumping, then get in their car again WHILE it's pumping, especially during winter. I'm surprised I haven't seen many fires ignited..


ignition isn´t even the problem. People pulling out the pumping fuel line in panic once fumes have ignited is. That is how you get nasty fires. So the fuel flow is already shut of nothing will happen. If it is cold there essentially is no chance of enough fuel fumes being present to get ignited. Otherwise the intensity of the fire is very low and the tank opening makes for a fine flame holder until a gust of wind blows it out. Or someone just blows it out.

best regards
Thomas


Gas tanks have a valve that shuts of the flow when the nozzle is pulled. People freak out and keep the pump handle down and spray their car and the ground with gas. Which has fumes. I have seen several videos of people who do this. Too many. People drive off with the nozzle still in the tank but rarely start a fire. Temperature has nothing to do with starting a fire. It is about ignition.
 
tommy1808
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 6:13 am

seb146 wrote:
has nothing to do with starting a fire. It is about ignition.


the amount of flammable gas is highly dependent on temperature.

best regards
Thomas
 
max999
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 9:47 am

For electric cars in NJ, is it required that an employee plug the charger in the car for you? And the employee has to stand and observe the charging process?
 
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DarkSnowyNight
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 10:26 am

ltbewr wrote:
The association of gas station owners pressured/bribed the state legislature to ban self-service.



This is very common in the Automotive industry. A make-work gig. Look at NADA for example. They are why you still cannot order a Ford —or anything that is not a Tesla— online without going through a dealership.

tommy1808 wrote:

the amount of flammable gas is highly dependent on temperature.

best regards
Thomas


100% correct. Vapors matter.


System07 wrote:
GalaxyFlyer wrote:
One thing that irks me is people who leave the car running or put the gas cap in the handle and sit back in the car. I’ve called a few on it and they just shrug like I’m the one who’s wrong. One lady said she had a little one inside and didn’t want it get cold. We’re talking 2 minutes sitting in a warmed car. I asked if she wanted to previous one to burn to death. Not amused.


But didn’t you do in-air refueling with running jets?? Lol I kid. It bothers me too


I too wish I have had the experience of taking fuel aboard a C5 from a KC-10... Commercial flying is downright boring by comparison.

seb146 wrote:

I usually buy my gas at Safeway.


I prefer DangerMart.

Virtual737 wrote:
Many places in the world are not self service. I've had 40 years of self service and 7 of attended. Apart from the occasional initial wait, it bothers me not a bit and, now that I have a diesel, my shoes and hands stay perfectly clean with no effort.


I am all for expending less effort while employing more people.


GalaxyFlyer wrote:
One thing that irks me is people who leave the car running or put the gas cap in the handle and sit back in the car. I’ve called a few on it and they just shrug like I’m the one who’s wrong. One lady said she had a little one inside and didn’t want it get cold. We’re talking 2 minutes sitting in a warmed car. I asked if she wanted to previous one to burn to death. Not amused.


I literally once observed on the freeway a motorist driving with a gascap on a lanyard hanging from a fully closed gascap door. This told me in unspecific terms that someone observed this and did say to themselves 'I am ok with this.'

Faith in people at large is, needless to say, not among my strong suits.

cjg225 wrote:
One of the dumbest things about the armpit of America.


Southwestern VA is no part of this thread.


STT757 wrote:

I never get gas on the Turnpike unless it’s an emergency, I usually hit Wawa or Quick check. They always offer great service whether it’s the 19 years olds or the 70 year olds pumping the gas.


My years in CA have taught me to miss Wawa. Their Bagel sandwiches are worth getting out of the car for.
 
nkops
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 10:39 am

The worse part is when you grow up in NJ (like myself) , you get used to not pumping your own gas.. then look like an idiot the first time you try self-serve in another state
 
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cjg225
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 10:59 am

nkops wrote:
The worse part is when you grow up in NJ (like myself) , you get used to not pumping your own gas.. then look like an idiot the first time you try self-serve in another state

Haha i have encountered this with people I know. It's quite comical for a PA native, myself.
 
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einsteinboricua
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 12:08 pm

cjg225 wrote:
nkops wrote:
The worse part is when you grow up in NJ (like myself) , you get used to not pumping your own gas.. then look like an idiot the first time you try self-serve in another state

Haha i have encountered this with people I know. It's quite comical for a PA native, myself.

When I drove to Penn State a few years ago, I stopped at a rural gas station that had only one store clerk. The pump was an older model, so I needed to go in, leave a credit card (or predetermined amount) then fuel up. I remarked about this to the clerk (it had been years since I last saw those pumps). The clerk was telling me about how he sees folks confused, thinking they can pump without paying, but he said his favorite are people with NJ plates just sitting still waiting for service (and he can't leave the store unattended so they just sit there until they drive off or come inside).
 
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scbriml
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 1:04 pm

As a Brit, I used to find buying petrol in the US quite a stressful experience. Mainly because the machines on the pump won’t accept a UK credit card or refuse to recognise my post-code (because it isn’t a zip code). Now I don’t even bother trying, I just go to the kiosk, prepay and then pump.

I honestly can’t remember the last time I didn’t pump my own petrol, but it would probably have been when I worked in Dubai (2006/2007). Every petrol station there was full service - it was great, filling up from nearly empty, getting your windows cleaned, tyres and oil checked all cost about $12 at the time. I always used to drive out of them with a huge grin on my face because filling up in the UK would have cost about $90 in those days.
 
GalaxyFlyer
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 1:34 pm

I too wish I have had the experience of taking fuel aboard a C5 from a KC-10... Commercial flying is downright boring by comparison.


Nothing like hearing, “you’re taking gas, sir” after a difficult join up and you need the gas. Then it’s down to staying on the boom for 20 minutes. Then going to the second tanker.
 
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cjg225
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 2:02 pm

einsteinboricua wrote:
When I drove to Penn State a few years ago, I stopped at a rural gas station that had only one store clerk. The pump was an older model, so I needed to go in, leave a credit card (or predetermined amount) then fuel up. I remarked about this to the clerk (it had been years since I last saw those pumps). The clerk was telling me about how he sees folks confused, thinking they can pump without paying, but he said his favorite are people with NJ plates just sitting still waiting for service (and he can't leave the store unattended so they just sit there until they drive off or come inside).

Wow. I mean, Pennsylvania is Philadelphia and Pittsburgh with Alabama in the middle, so that doesn't surprise me, but I've never seen anything quite that bad. haha

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
I too wish I have had the experience of taking fuel aboard a C5 from a KC-10... Commercial flying is downright boring by comparison.


Nothing like hearing, “you’re taking gas, sir” after a difficult join up and you need the gas. Then it’s down to staying on the boom for 20 minutes. Then going to the second tanker.

Incredibly tangential story: Was moving back from North Carolina in November 2014. I stopped for gas in Virginia at a Sheetz. They were having problems with their pumps to the extent that flow rate was incredibly slow. It took me about 20 minutes to fill up what should've been about 12 gallons. As it got near the top, the gas started back washing out of my car onto the ground. Never saw anything like it. The attendant and another customer surmised that because the pumps were pumping so slowly that it was possible that concept that causes the valve to close when your tank is full was sort of "bypassed" because it would need faster flow to trigger. Where the pumps were were on a very slight incline, nose down, so we cleaned up around the car, I released the parking break, and we rolled the car out of the way and into a parking spot. I waited a while (actually had specifically gone to Sheetz because of the food) and then took off for home.

I was worried I broke the tank float because my tank gauge didn't drop below Full for the rest of the 150 miles home.
 
Virtual737
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 2:10 pm

scbriml wrote:
all cost about $12 at the time.


Yep. I remember being "fined" by a car hire company in Dubai during the 90s. I returned the car almost empty and they stung me for about $6 plus a service charge. Did exactly the same the next time I was there. less hassle than actually stopping at a petrol station.
 
CH47A
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 2:13 pm

Be careful what you wish for. Boring can be a problem, too. You sort of forget that Mother Nature has all sorts of surprises up there.

By the way, C130 to chopper air-to-air is . . . well, - - -

Kadena AB
The Commando II flies clandestine, or low visibility, single or multiship, low-level air refueling missions for special operations helicopters and tiltrotor aircraft, and infiltration, exfiltration, and resupply of special operations forces (SOF) by airdrop or airland intruding politically sensitive or hostile territories. The MC-130J primarily flies missions at night to reduce probability of visual acquisition and intercept by airborne threats. Its secondary mission includes the airdrop of leaflets.


By the way, on that topic of leaflets, somebody stateside has a neat collection of DPRK leaflets I collected and had to have sneaked out of country. Keeping them back in those days was illegal. ROK illegal. Don't know about now. Not stationed in that AO now.

Still, be careful about that boring. Just when you 'think' you're bored Mother Nature will try to pull a fast one on you and . . . Anybody ever hit clear air turbulence? It's all Mother Nature up there. She's the boss! Much safer on the ground in New Jersey having some student going for her/his Master's Degree pumping your gas. Don't forget to say thank you.

Oh yes, and don't forget to say thank you to Mother Nature when she allows you to get your bird down safely.
 
Dieuwer
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 2:30 pm

What happens if you drive an electric car? Does an attendant still needs to do the "fueling" for you in NJ and OR?
 
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Aesma
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 2:50 pm

In France I have never seen this, so self service has been the norm for more than 30 years. Personally I don't like wasting time at the pump (and often only go when I'm running on fumes) so if the pump can take a card it's even better.

I was thankful there was someone manning a station when I drove out of San Francisco as the pump was quite strange to me, with a rubber thinguy seeming to "suck" on the gas tank opening, it wouldn't start pumping. I had no problem at other self serve stations, although I found very annoying to have to pay first, then go back for change.

In Italy you can find both options, although I would imagine full service is disappearing. Diesel pumps seem to have much higher flow than in France, though.
 
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seb146
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 3:56 pm

Dieuwer wrote:
What happens if you drive an electric car? Does an attendant still needs to do the "fueling" for you in NJ and OR?


Assuming this is a serious question, Oregon has charging stations in many cities and towns. There is a bank of Tesla Superchargers in a small town near here. They are transferring electricity, not fuel, so they are "self serve". There are chargers at some grocery stores as well and those, too, are "self serve".
 
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Aesma
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Tue Aug 24, 2021 10:59 pm

From reading experiences of people with charging stations, these would need some attendant much more than gas pumps !
 
ltbewr
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Wed Aug 25, 2021 12:23 pm

Dieuwer wrote:
What happens if you drive an electric car? Does an attendant still needs to do the "fueling" for you in NJ and OR?

No, all public EV 'refueling' stations are self-service in NJ. So far. I don't expect the mandate to ever be applied to EV recharging as almost all of the 'station' I have seen so far are not affiliated with gas stations, often a spot in a parking lot for a fast food place or a shopping center.

As to the hassles of a UK national trying to use a USA petrol pump with their UK based CC, I had the same problem in 2017 using a USA CC in the UK, having to go inside to activate the pump and pay for the fuel.
 
DiamondFlyer
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Wed Aug 25, 2021 5:21 pm

The funny thing is, you can pump your own gas at an airport in NJ. I always got a kick out of that one, couldn't fill up the truck I drove to the airport, but I could fill up the airplane myself.
 
ACDC8
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Wed Aug 25, 2021 7:19 pm

I live in Richmond BC and we have a bylaw that prohibits self serve gas stations, but most people pump their own gas anyways. I'm not a fan of full service stations, had one attendant put a nick in my paint with the nozzle and another unscrewed the gas cap while my engine was still running causing a yellow check engine light.
 
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casinterest
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Wed Aug 25, 2021 7:46 pm

ACDC8 wrote:
I live in Richmond BC and we have a bylaw that prohibits self serve gas stations, but most people pump their own gas anyways. I'm not a fan of full service stations, had one attendant put a nick in my paint with the nozzle and another unscrewed the gas cap while my engine was still running causing a yellow check engine light.



This was kind of what prompted my post. I had me Check Engine light up 100 miles into NY, and when I went and checked my gas cap, it was not tightened.
 
GalaxyFlyer
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Wed Aug 25, 2021 10:59 pm

I was putting just enough fuel to take my trade to pick up my new car, years ago. Full serve in our village, the guy overfilled it and it wouldn’t run, thought he damaged the vapor capture system. We got it going and it was gone. Two gas stations in town, I’ve never been back in 20 years.
 
chimborazo
Posts: 445
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Thu Aug 26, 2021 6:16 pm

At many stations here in the UK you can’t yet pay with card at the pump (conversely there are some unstaffed stations that are card only). Here pretty much every station is self serve, pay after- of course you can do so even if there is pay at pump available. Pump pay is safer for the fuel station as it determines whether you have funds before drawing fuel, otherwise it’s up to the attendant in the shop looking at you to determine if they should authorise the pump to start. “Bilking” or making off without payment is rife, particularly on stolen cars for obvious reasons.

Some rural stations are still staff operated- assume precisely because of bilking.

In Cape Town a few years ago was chatting to the TWO operatives filling my car and they were gobsmacked when I note it we do it ourselves in the UK. Fair play if it gives people jobs… it took five people to process, make and pass me a coffee in one place :-)

Still amazed that in the US and other places there are hold-until-full, auto stop nozzles on petrol/gasoline. This allows you to wander off and create the static problems as noted. I can’t see any reason why anyone capable of driving a car can’t stand and squeeze a trigger for a few minutes. Further, if you’re actually holding the trigger you’re more likely to put it back when done and not provide us with the amusing YouTube videos driving down the road with the hose bouncing (I think the fact it happens in the first instance and then isn’t noticed speaks volumes).

For disabled drivers (who would then have a suitable vehicle for their situation) I can understand not doing it themselves- not because they can’t but it may take considerably longer to prepare. In this case, as I understand it, the staff are required to assist (here in UK - sound your horn a few times).

Not so much a problem with diesel (unless you turn up on a motorcyle after a spill!) and it makes sense for HGV fill nozzles to have the auto hold then because of the long duration to fill.

Once saw a truck pull out of a filling station and then driving over a metal sheet placed on a drain channel, the sheet tipped up and sliced the newly-filled tank open. Painful £££
 
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seb146
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Fri Aug 27, 2021 4:09 am

chimborazo wrote:
Still amazed that in the US and other places there are hold-until-full, auto stop nozzles on petrol/gasoline. This allows you to wander off and create the static problems as noted. I can’t see any reason why anyone capable of driving a car can’t stand and squeeze a trigger for a few minutes. Further, if you’re actually holding the trigger you’re more likely to put it back when done and not provide us with the amusing YouTube videos driving down the road with the hose bouncing (I think the fact it happens in the first instance and then isn’t noticed speaks volumes).

For disabled drivers (who would then have a suitable vehicle for their situation) I can understand not doing it themselves- not because they can’t but it may take considerably longer to prepare. In this case, as I understand it, the staff are required to assist (here in UK - sound your horn a few times).


We can't be expected to stand there and hold a nozzle for three minutes! That is an outrage! We have things to do, like get a coffee or chicken strips or use the wash room. Busy, busy, busy for some reason. I end up washing the windows of my car when waiting for the pump to shut off.

As far as disabled, someone must be available to pump gas if they display the proper sign or license plate. My aunt had a disabled mirror hanger for her late husband. She kept it and used it until it expired, which was long after he did. She said she did not like walking "all that way" across parking lots in rural Montana or pumping her own gas in rural Montana. She now lives in a border town and makes a 20 mile round trip into Oregon to get gas and makes someone else drive her to the market.

But I digress....
 
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Revelation
Posts: 26717
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Fri Aug 27, 2021 2:10 pm

Interesting thread. Two states follow archaic practices that are not in conformity with 48 other states and many international jurisdictions, let's discuss...

scbriml wrote:
As a Brit, I used to find buying petrol in the US quite a stressful experience. Mainly because the machines on the pump won’t accept a UK credit card or refuse to recognise my post-code (because it isn’t a zip code). Now I don’t even bother trying, I just go to the kiosk, prepay and then pump.

I honestly can’t remember the last time I didn’t pump my own petrol, but it would probably have been when I worked in Dubai (2006/2007). Every petrol station there was full service - it was great, filling up from nearly empty, getting your windows cleaned, tyres and oil checked all cost about $12 at the time. I always used to drive out of them with a huge grin on my face because filling up in the UK would have cost about $90 in those days.

As a USAian the shock at the UK pumps comes from the price.

In the 90s I was visiting my cousin and he drove me around the country for a week or more so I offered to pay when he filled up at the pumps and he kind of grinned and said okay. Then I did the math after I paid and my goodness...

Back then I was early in the SUV craze and he asked what mileage it got and I said I did not know. I said $40 fills it up for a week or more of driving so I don't even worry about mileage.

In those days I took a friend for an epic day of driving from Southern NH all around the White Mountains and back and realized I had only spent $20 in gas to do all that driving. It seemed like the greatest bargain ever, and in some ways it was. Don't tell Greta though.

chimborazo wrote:
At many stations here in the UK you can’t yet pay with card at the pump (conversely there are some unstaffed stations that are card only). Here pretty much every station is self serve, pay after- of course you can do so even if there is pay at pump available. Pump pay is safer for the fuel station as it determines whether you have funds before drawing fuel, otherwise it’s up to the attendant in the shop looking at you to determine if they should authorise the pump to start. “Bilking” or making off without payment is rife, particularly on stolen cars for obvious reasons.

Some rural stations are still staff operated- assume precisely because of bilking.

A friend of mine managed a convenience store with pumps and said a lot of these things were inside jobs. The attendant would have a friend pull up to the pumps and fill up. The friend would take off. The attendant would call the police but after a convenient gap. Helps to do this when the store is busy and police are also likely to be too busy to respond, which they rarely did for a theft of such a small amount by their standards.

Sooner or later they get caught and when asked why they do that stuff they justify it by saying the pay is so low yada yada. That doesn't mean if you're working with diamonds you can nick a few because your pay is so low compared to the value of the diamonds. People have such poor integrity these days, sigh.

Employees didn't seem to care if they got fired by cause and what that might do to their reputation. Seems the general ethical standard was so low that they knew it wouldn't be a problem for them.

Still amazed that in the US and other places there are hold-until-full, auto stop nozzles on petrol/gasoline. This allows you to wander off and create the static problems as noted. I can’t see any reason why anyone capable of driving a car can’t stand and squeeze a trigger for a few minutes. Further, if you’re actually holding the trigger you’re more likely to put it back when done and not provide us with the amusing YouTube videos driving down the road with the hose bouncing (I think the fact it happens in the first instance and then isn’t noticed speaks volumes).

I don't think it occurs that much. I've seen it in real live maybe once or twice in many decades of driving. Of course YouTube videos make it look like it happens all the time, but it doesn't. Clearly the cost saved by not having pump attendants covers the cost of people damaging the pumps, and insurance is there in case someone does something really stupid. I have seen someone smoking at the pumps while filling up a 5 gallon jug, one of the stupidest things I've ever seen.

For disabled drivers (who would then have a suitable vehicle for their situation) I can understand not doing it themselves- not because they can’t but it may take considerably longer to prepare. In this case, as I understand it, the staff are required to assist (here in UK - sound your horn a few times).

Same here, but staff is often required to empty the store of customers and lock up first if there is no second employee working, otherwise people would rob the place blind. Kind of sucks for the HCer to have to wait for all that to happen. I suppose they learn which stations have attendants or multiple employees.

seb146 wrote:
As far as disabled, someone must be available to pump gas if they display the proper sign or license plate. My aunt had a disabled mirror hanger for her late husband. She kept it and used it until it expired, which was long after he did. She said she did not like walking "all that way" across parking lots in rural Montana or pumping her own gas in rural Montana. She now lives in a border town and makes a 20 mile round trip into Oregon to get gas and makes someone else drive her to the market.

A relative was doing something similar, till a policeman saw her and two other visiting relatives get out of the car with none of them handicapped. A ticket was issued. That was the end of that practice, the embarrassment was so great.
 
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AirKevin
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Sun Aug 29, 2021 4:58 pm

chimborazo wrote:
Still amazed that in the US and other places there are hold-until-full, auto stop nozzles on petrol/gasoline. This allows you to wander off and create the static problems as noted. I can’t see any reason why anyone capable of driving a car can’t stand and squeeze a trigger for a few minutes.

Back in 2015, my parents and I came across a fuel station that didn't have this, so we had to manually hold the nozzle down in order to fill it. The problem is they were in the process of moving, so I was actually driving a rental truck that has double the fuel capacity than their SUV. This meant that I had to stand there for double the time waiting for this thing to fill up, and we were further delayed by me cleaning the windshield afterwards because trying to do it during the refueling process wasn't possible when I was standing at the side of the truck holding the nozzle down. The time it takes for the refueling is generally the time I use to clean my windows. On a long-haul trip, as was the case a few weeks ago, I would also check the oil. Having to stand there and hold the nozzle means I end up blocking the pump even longer than necessary when I have to do all these other things afterwards.
seb146 wrote:
We can't be expected to stand there and hold a nozzle for three minutes! That is an outrage! We have things to do, like get a coffee or chicken strips or use the wash room. Busy, busy, busy for some reason. I end up washing the windows of my car when waiting for the pump to shut off.

Most of the things you just listed you shouldn't be doing during the refueling anyway, otherwise who's watching the pump when you're in the store.
 
petertenthije
Posts: 4298
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Re: Why Can't I pump my own gas?

Sun Aug 29, 2021 5:03 pm

AirKevin wrote:
Back in 2015, my parents and I came across a fuel station that didn't have this, so we had to manually hold the nozzle down in order to fill it

You can wedge the fuel cap in the nozzle to keep it down. Assuming you don’t have an integrated fuel cap like some Fords do.

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