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Thunderboltdrgn
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European Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Fri Sep 24, 2021 1:23 pm

The European Comission have finally put forward a suggestion about a common charger solution or rather that all electronic devices
should be charged and/or connected via the USB-C interface. This both to prevent monopoly situations with proprietary interfaces
like Apple lighting) and to make all devices compatible with the same charger/cable to reduce electronic waste.

A few quotes from the press release

Why is the Commission acting to introduce a common charging solution?

Innovation and rapid development of the ICT market has led to high number of devices and charging solutions. While ICT innovation is generally welcome,
this has led to consumer overload and frustration with incompatible charging solutions and negative impact on the environment. Years of working with industry
in a voluntary approach already brought down the number of mobile phone chargers from 30 to 3 within the last decade, but could not deliver a complete solution


What are the measures the Commission is proposing today?

The Commission proposes to introduce new requirements to ensure the interoperability for the charging of a number of electronic devices. In particular, the Commission proposes to:


  • Harmonise the charging port: USB-C will become the standard one for all devices covered;
  • Harmonise the fast charging technology;
  • Give consumers the possibility of choosing whether to purchase a new electronic device with or without a new charger;
  • Inform consumers about charging characteristics of the electronic devices.

Which electronic devices are covered by today's proposal?

The products concerned by these new requirements are mobile phones, tablets, digital cameras, headphones, headsets, hand-held video game consoles,
and portable speakers. The broadening of the scope beyond mobile phones allows to further enhance the positive impacts of the requirements.


https://ec.europa.eu/commission/pressco ... DA_21_4614

Also note that this is just a proposition and I would assume it will be the EU parliament that will take the decision on whether or not to pass this proposition.
 
ltbewr
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Re: Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Fri Sep 24, 2021 1:46 pm

By having one standard other companies can offer - especially for Apple - cheaper aftermarket chargers and cords so a savings for consumers.
 
petertenthije
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Re: European Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Fri Sep 24, 2021 1:52 pm

Even apple is slowly switching to USB-C. My iPad for instance has USB-C. So the commission is a bit late to the game.
 
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Tugger
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Re: European Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Fri Sep 24, 2021 2:01 pm

Apple isn't really resisting. They would love to have the change mandated. It would allow them to make a change they actually want to make but if they did would cause a hue and cry from the millions of iPhone owners who will need to get a new universe of add-ons that have the new connector (Come on, you don't expect a simple adapter will satisfy the folk, do you?).

If the EU passes this they get to point to that as the cause and reason they have to make the change. You can hear the press release: "Unfortunately we are forced to make this unneeded change that will impact billions of iPhone users."

And at the next iPhone release they'd tout all the great new things you can do with the new port.

Well.. unless they just get rid of all the ports all together. Which I equally think is likely to happen.

Tugg
Edited to correct typo
Last edited by Tugger on Fri Sep 24, 2021 2:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
bpatus297
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Re: European Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Fri Sep 24, 2021 2:26 pm

Tugger wrote:
Apples isn't really resisting. They would love to have the change mandated. It would allow them to make a change they actually want to make but if they did would cause a hue and cry from the millions of iPhone owners who will need to get a new universe of add-ons that have the new connector (Come on, you don't expect a simple adapter will satisfy the folk, do you?).

If the EU passes this they get to point to that as the cause and reason they have to make the change. You can hear the press release: "Unfortunately we are forced to make this unneeded change that will impact billions of iPhone users."

And at the next iPhone release they'd tout all the great new things you can do with the new port.

Well.. unless they just get rid of all the ports all together. Which I equally think is likely to happen.

Tugg


It was a pain with the switch from USB-Micro to USB-C, but worth it in the end.
 
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DL717
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Re: European Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Fri Sep 24, 2021 3:16 pm

I’m all for USB-C. It’s the correct path to having a PC in hand when you consider the data transfer capability and how it can properly carry the video/audio component needed to drive a monitor. While it can be done right now with varying connection types, its ideal if every device can simply plug into a larger monitor, mirror the display and charge with a single port. Link up Bluetooth peripherals and go. We went with an iPad Pro recently and no longer have a need for a PC. We plug it into a monitor at home when we need a bigger screen, link it to the keyboard and mouse and it just works. Not the same as a PC, but we were only using the PC for picture management, emails and internet. With 2TB storage onboard and cloud storage, the PC became redundant for us.
 
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1337Delta764
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Re: European Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Fri Sep 24, 2021 4:52 pm

The EU should also close the "portless" loophole as well.
 
flyguy89
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Re: European Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Fri Sep 24, 2021 4:53 pm

It’s high time for the Commission to stop with this frivolous nonsense and get down to serious issues like ditching their preposterous plugs and outlets and aligning with North America so I can stop wasting money on adapters when I travel :duck:
 
StarAC17
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Re: European Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Fri Sep 24, 2021 6:32 pm

flyguy89 wrote:
It’s high time for the Commission to stop with this frivolous nonsense and get down to serious issues like ditching their preposterous plugs and outlets and aligning with North America so I can stop wasting money on adapters when I travel :duck:


Yeah us in North America need to have either the Australia/NZ or UK ones as they are better. :stirthepot: :stirthepot:

Their outlets have switches on them and fuses in each outlet which I think is the best thing to have. I wonder if our outlets could even handle the 220V or vice versa. We have developed an an electrical grid to far to make the voltage and currents the same globally. However I see a lot more universal plugs as I travel negating the need for adaptors. Also a good trick is to use the shaving outlet in hotel rooms as they are universal and the current drawn is enough to charge a phone.

petertenthije wrote:
Even apple is slowly switching to USB-C. My iPad for instance has USB-C. So the commission is a bit late to the game.


My mom got a new Iphone in July and I found it odd that Apple now has a USB-C to lightning cable included, however the watch has a standard USB to their adaptor. Neither device comes with charging blocks now.
I had to get her a USB-C charging block to use that cord but thankfully those are cheap and Apple probably sells it for $50.

The consistency is going to take time because transitioning everything to USB-C is going take a few years.

Europe is also mandating the same outlet for electric cars which is an even bigger mess than USB or standard electric outlets. Mr. Wendover explains.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pLcqJ2DclEg
 
cpd
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Re: European Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Fri Sep 24, 2021 8:32 pm

petertenthije wrote:
Even apple is slowly switching to USB-C. My iPad for instance has USB-C. So the commission is a bit late to the game.


Mine as well. It’s a lot newer than my iPhone.

My Mac desktops are much older so they don’t have USB-C unless I upgrade them:

2010 Mac Pro: 2x 3.46ghz 6 Core Xeon X5690, 128GB Ram, 8gb video.
2014 Mac Pro: 2.7ghz 12 Core Xeon E5 2697V2, 64gb ram, 12gb video.

I’m not replacing those soon as it would be extremely costly to replace machines with those specs and they are both still very quick. I could probably add USB-C to the 2010 Mac, but the 2014 one no chance at all.
 
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Revelation
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Re: European Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Sat Sep 25, 2021 6:56 pm

bpatus297 wrote:
It was a pain with the switch from USB-Micro to USB-C, but worth it in the end.

:checkmark:

Just fixing the "it can only go in one way and we don't mark the plug to show you which way that is" problem alone is worth going to USB-C.

Then add in the improvement in charging power and data transfer rate, and it's a huge win.

DL717 wrote:
I’m all for USB-C. It’s the correct path to having a PC in hand when you consider the data transfer capability and how it can properly carry the video/audio component needed to drive a monitor. While it can be done right now with varying connection types, its ideal if every device can simply plug into a larger monitor, mirror the display and charge with a single port. Link up Bluetooth peripherals and go. We went with an iPad Pro recently and no longer have a need for a PC. We plug it into a monitor at home when we need a bigger screen, link it to the keyboard and mouse and it just works. Not the same as a PC, but we were only using the PC for picture management, emails and internet. With 2TB storage onboard and cloud storage, the PC became redundant for us.

The thing is, such governmental mandates typically remove the incentive to invent new things like a serial bus fast enough to deliver video and the infrastructure to recognize that capability the instant you plug in a monitor.

It's probably best to sit back and let the market weed out the weaker solutions, but on the other hand, Microsoft is still in business so that isn't guaranteed to work.
 
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Aesma
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Re: European Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Sat Sep 25, 2021 7:54 pm

Thunderboltdrgn wrote:
Also note that this is just a proposition and I would assume it will be the EU parliament that will take the decision on whether or not to pass this proposition.


It's not just a proposition, it's how bills are made by the EU. The commission writes them, then they go to the parliament. Unless Apple can buy half the parliament it will pass easily.

petertenthije wrote:
Even apple is slowly switching to USB-C. My iPad for instance has USB-C. So the commission is a bit late to the game.


No the EU isn't late to the game, the EU pushed for this for more than 10 years, Apple saw the writing on the wall (and customer demand). Also for a tablet, Apple could justify not using USB and requiring an adapter to plug say a thumb drive, because USB A is big and ugly, and USB mini/micro B is a bit crappy, but with USB C, there is no excuse not to have it.
 
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c933103
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Re: European Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Sat Sep 25, 2021 7:57 pm

EU already made some similar regulation with micro USB last decade. And Apple's answer to that was selling a micro USB to their port at the time's converter.
Not sure whether it is possible to bypass this new regulation with the same trick again
 
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Aesma
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Re: European Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Sat Sep 25, 2021 8:04 pm

c933103 wrote:
EU already made some similar regulation with micro USB last decade. And Apple's answer to that was selling a micro USB to their port at the time's converter.
Not sure whether it is possible to bypass this new regulation with the same trick again


No the new one doesn't allow for an adapter. It allows having 2 ports, but Apple won't do that.
 
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c933103
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Re: European Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Sat Sep 25, 2021 8:04 pm

1337Delta764 wrote:
The EU should also close the "portless" loophole as well.

It is explicitly allowed from what I read
There are already devices with only wireless charging and no charging port or nay other port being sold around the world
 
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c933103
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Re: European Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Sat Sep 25, 2021 8:12 pm

Which electronic devices are covered by today's proposal?

The products concerned by these new requirements are mobile phones, tablets, digital cameras, headphones, headsets, hand-held video game consoles,
and portable speakers. The broadening of the scope beyond mobile phones allows to further enhance the positive impacts of the requirements.

What about in situation like Nintendo Switch, where its port is indeed USB C, but some combination with some charging cable not authorized by Nintendo have risk to brick the device?

Also, why headphones? Some earphones are charged by having metal contact points attaching to a base, and I am pretty sure the size of earphone aren't something that could waste as much space on it for a USB-C port.

And is there size limit on "Tablet" included? Since devices like this https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/ ... 15076WLvz7 should use the type of power supply similar to laptop or desktop computer, instead of merely a USB cable, despite still being a tablet.
 
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Aesma
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Re: European Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Sat Sep 25, 2021 8:40 pm

I wouldn't call that a tablet, it weighs 2,5Kg ! The rule is for handheld devices.

Also it specifies a 12V/3A adapter. USB-C can do up to 20V/5A.
 
cpd
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Re: European Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Sat Sep 25, 2021 8:55 pm

c933103 wrote:
Which electronic devices are covered by today's proposal?

The products concerned by these new requirements are mobile phones, tablets, digital cameras, headphones, headsets, hand-held video game consoles,
and portable speakers. The broadening of the scope beyond mobile phones allows to further enhance the positive impacts of the requirements.

What about in situation like Nintendo Switch, where its port is indeed USB C, but some combination with some charging cable not authorized by Nintendo have risk to brick the device?

Also, why headphones? Some earphones are charged by having metal contact points attaching to a base, and I am pretty sure the size of earphone aren't something that could waste as much space on it for a USB-C port.

And is there size limit on "Tablet" included? Since devices like this https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/ ... 15076WLvz7 should use the type of power supply similar to laptop or desktop computer, instead of merely a USB cable, despite still being a tablet.


The charging base probably covers the requirement for earphones/compact headphones.

My original Bose noise canceling headphones had rechargeable batteries but not any plug in recharging themselves. So you took the little Bose charger with you.

Same as for things like my group set batteries on my two bikes, they are removed from the bike and charged on a little charger that plugs in to any USB port or SRAMs own little power adapter.
 
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Thunderboltdrgn
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Re: European Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Sun Sep 26, 2021 5:40 am

petertenthije wrote:
Even apple is slowly switching to USB-C. My iPad for instance has USB-C. So the commission is a bit late to the game.


Since this isn't just about Apple or mobile phones but all kinds of electronic devices I'd say that they are not "late to the game".
 
PPVRA
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Re: European Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Tue Sep 28, 2021 9:34 pm

20 years ago, this was a huge pain. But we’re down to 2 standards already and lightning is slowly dying. The market has sorted itself out already. It’s a waste of time to pursue this any further.
 
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Aesma
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Re: European Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Tue Sep 28, 2021 10:08 pm

It's not "the market", the EU has been very active in getting to where we're at now. There are still plenty of gadgets sold with micro USB ports, probably because there are millions of these ports in stock in China, so the faster they're effectively banned, the better. I'm anti Apple so don't care that much about them or the fact people are fine being stuck in that environment.
 
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WesternDC6B
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Re: European Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Tue Sep 28, 2021 10:46 pm

StarAC17 wrote: Yeah us in North America need to have either the Australia/NZ or UK ones as they are better. :stirthepot::stirthepot:

Their outlets have switches on them and fuses in each outlet which I think is the best thing to have.

---

One thing I noticed in my travels, in both UK/UK influenced, and European areas: the prongs on the plugs have metal tips but plastic for the rest of the prong. This strikes me as a good safety feature.

By the way, those UK plugs? A friend of mine from Alabama was with us on a business trip and described them as looking like "young welder plugs!". They ARE a bit large...
 
Kent350787
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Re: European Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Tue Sep 28, 2021 10:59 pm

WesternDC6B wrote:
StarAC17 wrote: Yeah us in North America need to have either the Australia/NZ or UK ones as they are better. :stirthepot::stirthepot:

Their outlets have switches on them and fuses in each outlet which I think is the best thing to have.

---

One thing I noticed in my travels, in both UK/UK influenced, and European areas: the prongs on the plugs have metal tips but plastic for the rest of the prong. This strikes me as a good safety feature.

By the way, those UK plugs? A friend of mine from Alabama was with us on a business trip and described them as looking like "young welder plugs!". They ARE a bit large...


Australian outlets have switches but not fuses in the outlet. They do have a third, ground, prong, but not all devices use this. An annoyance is still the weak 110v current when we travel overseas, and the fact we can't buy anything that isn't designed as universal when in the US (the step down transformer I would have needed for my cute waffle maker would have cost 5x what I paid for it)

RCDs have been a requirement in household electrics for around three decades. We have one for the whole board plus individual breakers on each circuit.

But back on topic, I conceptually support a single port, but am worried it will stifle innovation, and licensing issues will see us end up with a poor form factor. Lightning was way ahead of Micro USB, and is still a smaller form than USB-C. And let's not get started with how to accommodate wired headphones.....
 
Toenga
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Re: European Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Tue Sep 28, 2021 11:59 pm

The UK was very late in developing a modernised live and neutral selective plug and socket. Hence a much more capable and robust pairing rated up to 13Amps
The plug itself contains a fuse selected at a rating, normally 13A or 3A to protect the downstream device and cord, not the upstream circuit which is protected by the breaker at the board.
Does make them big and uncomfortable to stand on though.
 
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Thunderboltdrgn
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Re: European Commission proposes a common charging solution for electronic devices

Wed Sep 29, 2021 4:19 am

Aesma wrote:
It's not "the market", the EU has been very active in getting to where we're at now. There are still plenty of gadgets sold with micro USB ports, probably because there are millions of these ports in stock in China, so the faster they're effectively banned, the better. I'm anti Apple so don't care that much about them or the fact people are fine being stuck in that environment.


Not only Micro-USB but also Mini-USB (usually digital cameras and such). There also different types of Micro-USB.

Image

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB_hardware#Connectors

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