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Aaron747
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Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Sat Nov 06, 2021 5:41 am

A friend of mine saw the Rolling Stones show in Dallas a few days ago and we chatted about it today. He said parts of it were excellent and and other parts not. Among his observations: as usual there were a lot of crowd sing-a-longs on fan favorites and Jagger's energy was unsurprisingly impressive for a guy almost 80. Their backing musicians are very strong, which makes up for some of the not-good parts. It seems Wood needs to sit down for breaks here and there, and Richards is having difficulty landing chords cleanly. I'm not saying legacy isn't a thing, but product still matters when your tickets vary from $100 to $5000+.

My friend said in more than a few songs there were parts Richards played that were either mangled or just flat landed way out of tune. One thing my friend found surprising was how many people under 40 were there.

I looked up the same show and found some good clips on YT. A sampling:

Satisfaction (Richards's playing is not great here)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ihn7i-9DADA

Jagger defying age on the opener, Street Fighting Man

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2RUxt9SxFA

Miss You

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zGHBwZ8Ad08
 
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DIRECTFLT
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Sat Nov 06, 2021 5:46 am

The entire Cotton Bowl show. I think that the Stones can still bring it. Some real special moments.

https://youtu.be/U6byVrDbUM8
 
jetwet1
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Sat Nov 06, 2021 7:18 am

Having seen the Stones a few times, there are good shows and there are not so good shows. It's been that way for the last 20 years.

The same can be said for a lot of the bands from that era. I'm going to see Whitesnake next year and honestly, I am just praying that David still has one tour left in him as they used to put on a fantastic show.
 
ltbewr
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Sat Nov 06, 2021 7:26 am

As long as they can make money from performing, they will do so even if halfway into a coffin. The Stones are far more talented on a 'bad' night than most modern performers who use auto-tune, sing nonsense lyrics and have only a fraction of their talent and musicianship. I am 67 years old. I have been hearing their music since 1964-65 and preferring them to The Beatles at the time. Maybe they are around for a year too long but the Pandemic delayed their final concerts. That many in the crowd were under 40 shows how well loved they are for their music.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Sat Nov 06, 2021 9:41 am

ltbewr wrote:
As long as they can make money from performing, they will do so even if halfway into a coffin. The Stones are far more talented on a 'bad' night than most modern performers who use auto-tune, sing nonsense lyrics and have only a fraction of their talent and musicianship.


No argument from me - there are very few new acts from 2005 on that are worth paying to see.
 
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WesternDC6B
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Sat Nov 06, 2021 12:51 pm

Too many top stars hang on too long, and ended up with performances that are cringe-making.

Frank Sinatra - once he reached the time when he recorded "Something Stupid" - slid downhill into mawkish, self-pitying cry-fests and the voice was gone. Throw in the live recordings where his stage persona was crude language and being "too cool for the room", and he was finished. I treasure my Sinatra albums of Songs for Swingin' Lovers, and my late-issue Come Fly With Me, arguably his best two LPs of an amazing era. (I still comb the thrift shops and used record stores for the CFWM album that has a Constellation in the background...)

Ella Fitzgerald made recordings far too late. Ella, the First Lady of Song, introduced my then- 5 year old ears to the Great American Songbook. There was one disc I bought later in my life where she was unable to hold notes, warbled in place of vibrato, no range, and other things that said "I'm past it". I just took the disc out of my player, and put it on the shelf;' I don't have the heart to throw it away. I then cleansed my aural palate with her Cole Porter Songbook album.

Other entertainers had the good sense to follow that old show-biz saying, "Leave the audience begging for more". Carol Burnett and the late Mary Tyler Moore are prime examples.
 
M564038
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Sat Nov 06, 2021 2:03 pm

Keith’s playing in those clips is exactly as it has always been. Mick sings really flat, and seems to have lost it, however.
 
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Aesma
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Sat Nov 06, 2021 2:47 pm

In my opinion you go see old musicians with the expectation they will be old...

I saw Bob Dylan a few years ago and my disappointment wasn't about his singing but about the fact I didn't know any song, as he was on tour singing old folk tunes or something like that.

Deep Purple are doing their last tour (for 3 years...) and they're great.
 
NIKV69
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Sat Nov 06, 2021 9:23 pm

The Stones are probably the best band ever so nothing really to prove. I have seem them live and they were great and I remember a SB halftime show where they sucked because they were probably drunk.

RIP Charlie Watts
 
Max Q
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Sun Nov 07, 2021 11:20 pm

I love the Stones, they move me like no other band, their music is Classic and timeless


I’m glad I saw them live in their prime, once in Dallas and once in Hong Kong
 
Kent350787
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Sun Nov 07, 2021 11:30 pm

Aesma wrote:
In my opinion you go see old musicians with the expectation they will be old...

I saw Bob Dylan a few years ago and my disappointment wasn't about his singing but about the fact I didn't know any song, as he was on tour singing old folk tunes or something like that.

Deep Purple are doing their last tour (for 3 years...) and they're great.


Mind you, Deep Purple's keyboard player (and heavy metal god) Jon Lord was replaced with a younger player, and Steve Morse is only around 60. They ahve refreshed more than the Stones in the key lineup.

Qudos to the Stones for continuing on, but I agree that you should go and see them as the great-grandfathers some of them are.
 
melpax
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Mon Nov 08, 2021 12:15 am

I saw AC/DC live in Melbourne a few years back. Was one of Brian's last live shows before he was told to stop live performances due to hearing loss. They copped some criticism in the press for stopping for breaks in between songs. But you had Brian & Angus, both in their 60's, running around the stage, and Angus doing cartwheels. So the breaks were well & truly justified! The crowd knew that this was likely the last time they'd be performing live in their spiritual home, which added to the atmosphere.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Mon Nov 08, 2021 12:17 am

melpax wrote:
I saw AC/DC live in Melbourne a few years back. Was one of Brian's last live shows before he was told to stop live performances due to hearing loss. They copped some criticism in the press for stopping for breaks in between songs. But you had Brian & Angus, both in their 60's, running around the stage, and Angus doing cartwheels. So the breaks were well & truly justified! The crowd knew that this was likely the last time they'd be performing live in their spiritual home, which added to the atmosphere.


What an awesome experience - would love to have seen them on home turf like that
 
KFLLCFII
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Mon Nov 08, 2021 12:27 am

When they did their combined webcast from their homes for the COVID concert (or whatever they called it) last year and played 'You Can't Always Get What You Want', Mick with his acoustic guitar was clearly the *one* who still had any performing mojo left in the group and singlehandedly carried the song. He put a smile on my face, and I appreciated the others for trying.

I'm sure the video is available on YouTube.
 
melpax
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Mon Nov 08, 2021 12:32 am

Aaron747 wrote:
What an awesome experience - would love to have seen them on home turf like that


Would have to rate as the best live show I've been to.

Doubt there would have been any groupies backstage, more likely a team of Physios & couple of salt baths!
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Mon Nov 08, 2021 12:47 am

melpax wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
What an awesome experience - would love to have seen them on home turf like that


Would have to rate as the best live show I've been to.

Doubt there would have been any groupies backstage, more likely a team of Physios & couple of salt baths!


LOL and instead of the whiskey/blow table, a nice setup with bananas and multigrain bars.
 
IPFreely
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Mon Nov 08, 2021 3:04 am

Aaron747 wrote:
product still matters when your tickets vary from $100 to $5000+


The product is irrelevant until people quit buying tickets. They will shuffle onto the stage with walkers and whisper mangled chords and lyrics as long as people keep giving them money.
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Mon Nov 08, 2021 3:45 am

IPFreely wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
product still matters when your tickets vary from $100 to $5000+


The product is irrelevant until people quit buying tickets. They will shuffle onto the stage with walkers and whisper mangled chords and lyrics as long as people keep giving them money.


That's also true, of course. I'll just tell my pal his VFM expectations were too high :duck:
 
LCDFlight
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Mon Nov 08, 2021 4:35 am

IMO even old men can play music pretty well. A few can sing well in old age also. Bands are about chemistry. The stones have always known how to keep their chemistry alive, without requiring youth to do so.
 
Kent350787
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Mon Nov 08, 2021 5:51 am

Aaron747 wrote:
melpax wrote:
I saw AC/DC live in Melbourne a few years back. Was one of Brian's last live shows before he was told to stop live performances due to hearing loss. They copped some criticism in the press for stopping for breaks in between songs. But you had Brian & Angus, both in their 60's, running around the stage, and Angus doing cartwheels. So the breaks were well & truly justified! The crowd knew that this was likely the last time they'd be performing live in their spiritual home, which added to the atmosphere.


What an awesome experience - would love to have seen them on home turf like that


Splitter! - AC/DC are a Sydney band!

I saw them in Sydney in 1981 - and enjoyed the support acts more. The fact that the bell wasn't in tune with the band didn't help with Hell's Bells as the opening song.

And to link this back on topic, I do think it woul dhave been fun to see the Stones at the Enmore Theatre in Sydney at a surpise gig in 2003. It seats around 1500 people (I last saw The Darkness there last year, Greta Van Fleet the year before). Angus and Malcolm joined them for Rock Me Baby
 
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Aaron747
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Mon Nov 08, 2021 6:22 am

Kent350787 wrote:
Aaron747 wrote:
melpax wrote:
I saw AC/DC live in Melbourne a few years back. Was one of Brian's last live shows before he was told to stop live performances due to hearing loss. They copped some criticism in the press for stopping for breaks in between songs. But you had Brian & Angus, both in their 60's, running around the stage, and Angus doing cartwheels. So the breaks were well & truly justified! The crowd knew that this was likely the last time they'd be performing live in their spiritual home, which added to the atmosphere.


What an awesome experience - would love to have seen them on home turf like that


Splitter! - AC/DC are a Sydney band!

I saw them in Sydney in 1981 - and enjoyed the support acts more. The fact that the bell wasn't in tune with the band didn't help with Hell's Bells as the opening song.

And to link this back on topic, I do think it woul dhave been fun to see the Stones at the Enmore Theatre in Sydney at a surpise gig in 2003. It seats around 1500 people (I last saw The Darkness there last year, Greta Van Fleet the year before). Angus and Malcolm joined them for Rock Me Baby


I meant in 'Straya, not any particular city ;) I last saw the Stones in 1998 on their Bridges to Babylon tour. That was an incredible show - I went in as a teenager thinking 'they're old - my dad's taking me to some real BS' and came out a fan.
 
vikkyvik
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Mon Nov 08, 2021 2:29 pm

Aaron747 wrote:
My friend said in more than a few songs there were parts Richards played that were either mangled or just flat landed way out of tune.


Ever listened to a Stones album? Same deal there, which is much more inexcusable than a live show, if you want to be critical of such things.

The Stones were never about perfection. They were about looseness, feel.....rock'n'roll, to sum it up.

ltbewr wrote:
I am 67 years old.


It shows in your comment.

There are plenty of newer bands who have come up in the last couple decades who are amazing. If you can't or don't find them, that's not their fault.
 
ltbewr
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Mon Nov 08, 2021 2:42 pm

ltbewr wrote:
I am 67 years old.


It shows in your comment.

There are plenty of newer bands who have come up in the last couple decades who are amazing. If you can't or don't find them, that's not their fault.[/quote]
Actually I do like some (relatively) newer groups like Coldplay, Cold War Kids, I don't just listen to 'oldies'. I often listen to a radio station via Alexa that plays a good mix of music. Still I love the rock music of my youth in the 1960's-1970's.
 
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Revelation
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Mon Nov 08, 2021 3:34 pm

IPFreely wrote:
The product is irrelevant until people quit buying tickets. They will shuffle onto the stage with walkers and whisper mangled chords and lyrics as long as people keep giving them money.

It sounds like you are describing the latest Genesis tour. Phil of course no longer plays drums. His spine is in such bad shape, he sits throughout the show. More power to him/them if they fans still will pay for that. Personally, I don't. Seek out Steve Hackett (he just announced a new US tour) if you want to hear 70s era Genesis stuff performed at a high level.

My "bucket list" of shows I care to see is pretty much empty. Most of the shows I did get to see, or the performers kicked the bucket. Still one or two very local/regional bands I'll go to see if they ever choose to perform again, but mostly for nostalgia's sake. TBH I kinda dislike the whole concert experience these days, at least for stadium rock such as the Stones. I'll leave that to others.
 
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WildcatYXU
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Wed Nov 10, 2021 12:19 am

Kent350787 wrote:
Aesma wrote:
In my opinion you go see old musicians with the expectation they will be old...

I saw Bob Dylan a few years ago and my disappointment wasn't about his singing but about the fact I didn't know any song, as he was on tour singing old folk tunes or something like that.

Deep Purple are doing their last tour (for 3 years...) and they're great.


Mind you, Deep Purple's keyboard player (and heavy metal god) Jon Lord was replaced with a younger player, and Steve Morse is only around 60. They ahve refreshed more than the Stones in the key lineup.



Actually, while Don Airey is 7 years younger than Jon Lord would be, he's definitely not a spring chicken. Ian Paice and Roger Glover are funding members and Ian Gillan joined in 1969. Is that so much of refresh, especially considering that Lord is in no condition to step in? (For those who don't know, he passed away in 2012).
Even the "youngster" Steve Morse is 67 years old. That said it would be great to see them with Ritchie Blackmore.
 
Kent350787
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Wed Nov 10, 2021 1:22 am

WildcatYXU wrote:
Kent350787 wrote:
Aesma wrote:
In my opinion you go see old musicians with the expectation they will be old...

I saw Bob Dylan a few years ago and my disappointment wasn't about his singing but about the fact I didn't know any song, as he was on tour singing old folk tunes or something like that.

Deep Purple are doing their last tour (for 3 years...) and they're great.


Mind you, Deep Purple's keyboard player (and heavy metal god) Jon Lord was replaced with a younger player, and Steve Morse is only around 60. They ahve refreshed more than the Stones in the key lineup.



Actually, while Don Airey is 7 years younger than Jon Lord would be, he's definitely not a spring chicken. Ian Paice and Roger Glover are funding members and Ian Gillan joined in 1969. Is that so much of refresh, especially considering that Lord is in no condition to step in? (For those who don't know, he passed away in 2012).
Even the "youngster" Steve Morse is 67 years old. That said it would be great to see them with Ritchie Blackmore.


I reckon we're at least 30 years too late for Ritchie at his peak.

I've noticed with friends and family, that their 70s have been an obvious time of decline. Paraphrasing what I said upthread, go to a gig of these 1960s/1970s bands with your eyes open.
 
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ER757
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Wed Nov 10, 2021 6:52 pm

I think a lot of the bands from that era stayed on too long. I am a huge Stones fan and last saw then live in 1975 (yeah I am old). I appreciate that they still want to get out there and it is probably what keeps them alive but they are far past their prime. When Charlie passed away they should have called it a career. Just like The Who should have when Entwhistle left us. And as much as millions of fans wanted Zeppelin to tour after their O2 concert, credit to Robert Plant for realizing they were a shadow of their former selves. Some guys can stay at their peak well into old age - Jeff Beck is as good or better than he ever was. Paul Rodgers sings as well as when he was in Free, both seem ageless. Others need to know when to hang it up.
 
BlueberryWheats
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Wed Nov 10, 2021 7:20 pm

I saw Fleetwood Mac about 5 or so years ago, they definitely still had it. Belting out the hits like their heyday.
 
LCDFlight
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Re: Are the Stones Done? Cotton Bowl Dallas Performance

Thu Nov 11, 2021 2:32 am

ER757 wrote:
I think a lot of the bands from that era stayed on too long. I am a huge Stones fan and last saw then live in 1975 (yeah I am old). I appreciate that they still want to get out there and it is probably what keeps them alive but they are far past their prime. When Charlie passed away they should have called it a career. Just like The Who should have when Entwhistle left us. And as much as millions of fans wanted Zeppelin to tour after their O2 concert, credit to Robert Plant for realizing they were a shadow of their former selves. Some guys can stay at their peak well into old age - Jeff Beck is as good or better than he ever was. Paul Rodgers sings as well as when he was in Free, both seem ageless. Others need to know when to hang it up.


There is a lot to be said for that. I still think in a bizarre sense, The Rolling Stones peaked in 1969-1973, but then they grew back into themselves in 2012 or so. Keith’s grace has been that he accepted himself, at whatever age he was. There is coolness in every age. People are not necessarily at their coolest at age 23. In fact, most men are not. Age 60 can reasonably be your coolest age IMO.

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