Thought i'd see if anyone would post anything regarding the 9th anniversary of the Sandy Hook mass school shooting (Where are ya ArchGuy1 when I need ya!) So nine years ago 20 children and 7 adults were killed in their classrooms. To most gun aficionados it was just a typical Friday, no big deal. To the rest of the civilized world, 20 children lost their lives. Since that day the US reacted positively with a little under two thousand seven hundred mass shootings, congrats! Did you know that the kids at Sandy Hook would have been starting their freshman year in high school? What a cool time, finally getting to high school, figuring out what colleges you'd like to attend, classes you'd like to take. Yeah no, not going to happen. You see our rights as "Murican"s and Muh Guns trumps your right to grow old and live a fruitful life. As one poster so aptly stated "Why bother with thoughts and prayers, I didn't have anything to do with it" Just like you do on new years eve, go outside and empty a clip into the air for the lost children.

Stop being silly. You know perfectly well there is a 230 year old law that says murica must be filled to the brim with privately owned guns. This must under no circumstance be changed. Because.

The mom should have been held partially responsible. She should be in prison today on gun fraud charges. Obviously she was a gun nut. The son was not well. You don’t do what she did.

This seems like a troll/flamebait post. Everyone I know was horrified by Sandy Hook. Unfortunately, some people didn't see dead kids that day but saw a pile of small caskets that they could stand on to attack the Constitutional rights of others with. Pretty disgusting, IMO.

CaptHadley wrote:

Thought i'd see if anyone would post anything regarding the 9th anniversary of the Sandy Hook mass school shooting (Where are ya ArchGuy1 when I need ya!) So nine years ago 20 children and 7 adults were killed in their classrooms. To most gun aficionados it was just a typical Friday, no big deal. To the rest of the civilized world, 20 children lost their lives. Since that day the US reacted positively with a little under two thousand seven hundred mass shootings, congrats! Did you know that the kids at Sandy Hook would have been starting their freshman year in high school? What a cool time, finally getting to high school, figuring out what colleges you'd like to attend, classes you'd like to take. Yeah no, not going to happen. You see our rights as "Murican"s and Muh Guns trumps your right to grow old and live a fruitful life. As one poster so aptly stated "Why bother with thoughts and prayers, I didn't have anything to do with it" Just like you do on new years eve, go outside and empty a clip into the air for the lost children.

Your post isn't about caring what happened at Sandy Hook, rather you are using the incident for politics. Pretty disgusting if you ask me.

TriJets wrote:

This seems like a troll/flamebait post. Everyone I know was horrified by Sandy Hook. Unfortunately, some people didn't see dead kids that day but saw a pile of small caskets that they could stand on to attack the Constitutional rights of others with. Pretty disgusting, IMO.

So if it wasn’t appropriate to talk about US gun culture in the aftermath of Sandy Hook (hold on don’t you also have a free speech 1st amendment?) is it appropriate 9 years later when there’s been an estimated 280 more school shootings and about 1600 children per year killed from gunshots?

So we now have two school shootings where stupid parents facilitated the massacre. Obviously the Sandy Hook shooter blasting his mother didn't stop the Michigan parents from giving their sick kid a gun.

Maybe 20 year sentences for the MI couple would cause other parents to question the risk reward of similar actions. Does a federal law exist that if your kid uses a firearm that you failed to store properly or you bought for him/her and it is used in a shooting, you would be charged as an Accessory. Just like when a murder occurs now and you didn't pull the trigger but were there?

M564038 wrote:

Stop being silly. You know perfectly well there is a 230 year old law that says murica must be filled to the brim with privately owned guns. This must under no circumstance be changed. Because.

I’ve also got a question for Second Amendment die hards. The Second Amendment clearly says if I’m an American citizen I have a right to bear arms.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weapon

From simple muskets that took a minute to reload the definition of arms” has greatly expanded to allow private owners in the US to own weapons that go well beyond self defence or hunting, like a military caliber belt fed machine gun or .50 cal anti material sniper rifle.

As they are “arms” they why can’t someone, under the Second Amendment, legally own an M1 Abrams tank, a 105mm Howitzer, an Apache attack helicopter and Hellfire missiles, and why not go full hog and get a nuclear tipped missile. Tossing up between a Minuteman ICBM or a B83 air dropped nuclear bomb.

Hey, they’re “arms”, the Constitution says my right to bear arms shall not be infringed......

sierrakilo44 wrote:

TriJets wrote:

This seems like a troll/flamebait post. Everyone I know was horrified by Sandy Hook. Unfortunately, some people didn't see dead kids that day but saw a pile of small caskets that they could stand on to attack the Constitutional rights of others with. Pretty disgusting, IMO.

So if it wasn’t appropriate to talk about US gun culture in the aftermath of Sandy Hook (hold on don’t you also have a free speech 1st amendment?) is it appropriate 9 years later when there’s been an estimated 280 more school shootings and about 1600 children per year killed from gunshots?

It is always appropriate to talk about. However, there is a difference between discussing guns in the United States and intentionally antagonizing and attacking the tens of millions of lawful gun owners in the US who had nothing to do with the shooting. Most of the shootings you discuss are gang violence and involve illegal handguns....better enforcement of existing laws would go a long ways at reducing them.

sierrakilo44 wrote:

M564038 wrote:

Stop being silly. You know perfectly well there is a 230 year old law that says murica must be filled to the brim with privately owned guns. This must under no circumstance be changed. Because.

I’ve also got a question for Second Amendment die hards. The Second Amendment clearly says if I’m an American citizen I have a right to bear arms.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weapon

From simple muskets that took a minute to reload the definition of arms” has greatly expanded to allow private owners in the US to own weapons that go well beyond self defence or hunting, like a military caliber belt fed machine gun or .50 cal anti material sniper rifle.

As they are “arms” they why can’t someone, under the Second Amendment, legally own an M1 Abrams tank, a 105mm Howitzer, an Apache attack helicopter and Hellfire missiles, and why not go full hog and get a nuclear tipped missile. Tossing up between a Minuteman ICBM or a B83 air dropped nuclear bomb.

Hey, they’re “arms”, the Constitution says my right to bear arms shall not be infringed......

The short answer is, with the exception of the nukes, you can own pretty much any of those things. They just cost tens to hundreds of millions of dollars and no gazillionaire wants to waste their money.

Until we deal with the deeper social culture as to guns in the USA, more horrible gun terror events like Sandy Hook will continue. Sadly since Sandy Hook, we have regressed in doing so.

Yes! This! I agree completely!
We must not attack amurican culture and decent law abiding citizens with these kinds of dirty tricks.
Comparing the right to live with the right to bear arms is disgusting! Dead kids doesn’t have a right to have an opinion about this! More guns means less people die, this is God’s law.
Nothing to see, move along!

TriJets wrote:

This seems like a troll/flamebait post. Everyone I know was horrified by Sandy Hook. Unfortunately, some people didn't see dead kids that day but saw a pile of small caskets that they could stand on to attack the Constitutional rights of others with. Pretty disgusting, IMO.

M564038 wrote:

Yes! This! I agree completely!
We must not attack amurican culture and decent law abiding citizens with these kinds of dirty tricks.
Comparing the right to live with the right to bear arms is disgusting! Dead kids doesn’t have a right to have an opinion about this! More guns means less people die, this is God’s law.
Nothing to see, move along!

TriJets wrote:

This seems like a troll/flamebait post. Everyone I know was horrified by Sandy Hook. Unfortunately, some people didn't see dead kids that day but saw a pile of small caskets that they could stand on to attack the Constitutional rights of others with. Pretty disgusting, IMO.

Countless Americans are alive today because they own firearms and were able to use those firearms to defend their lives and the lives of their family members. Instances of defensive gun use dramatically outnumber gun homicides in the United States. Here's just a sampling of instances that made the news recently- https://datavisualizations.heritage.org ... in-the-us/

If you don't want a gun, don't buy one. You aren't taking mine, though.

Do not discuss other users, please see forum rules. This is your warning.

ltbewr wrote:

Until we deal with the deeper social culture as to guns in the USA, more horrible gun terror events like Sandy Hook will continue. Sadly since Sandy Hook, we have regressed in doing so.

This is about exactly what I was going to say. There have been no advances in mental health screening, or in Gun culture in the US.

Yes! Again I agree completely, as your numbers tell us , 674 people used firearms to defend themselves in 2020. Countless!! Thats even slightly more than people killed by accidental discharge! These numbers seems to come from a bigly neutral trustworthy source too!
LESS THAN 20 000 people where killed in firearm homicides. Would you believe that? Clearly outnumbered by good cutizens protecting themselves. The years before that there were even less!!
There’s almost only Zeroes in that number, too. Clearly not a problem.

We should use guns as much as possible, since they are nice, cool, fun, healthy and keep people safe.

TriJets wrote:

M564038 wrote:

Yes! This! I agree completely!
We must not attack amurican culture and decent law abiding citizens with these kinds of dirty tricks.
Comparing the right to live with the right to bear arms is disgusting! Dead kids doesn’t have a right to have an opinion about this! More guns means less people die, this is God’s law.
Nothing to see, move along!

TriJets wrote:

This seems like a troll/flamebait post. Everyone I know was horrified by Sandy Hook. Unfortunately, some people didn't see dead kids that day but saw a pile of small caskets that they could stand on to attack the Constitutional rights of others with. Pretty disgusting, IMO.

Countless Americans are alive today because they own firearms and were able to use those firearms to defend their lives and the lives of their family members. Instances of defensive gun use dramatically outnumber gun homicides in the United States. Here's just a sampling of instances that made the news recently- https://datavisualizations.heritage.org ... in-the-us/

If you don't want a gun, don't buy one. You aren't taking mine, though.

M564038 wrote:

Yes! Again I agree completely, as your numbers tell us , 674 people used firearms to defend themselves in 2020. Countless!! Thats even slightly more than people killed by accidental discharge! These numbers seems to come from a bigly neutral trustworthy source too!
LESS THAN 20 000 people where killed in firearm homicides. Would you believe that? Clearly outnumbered by good cutizens protecting themselves. The years before that there were even less!!
There’s almost only Zeroes in that number, too. Clearly not a problem.

We should use guns as much as possible, since they are nice, cool, fun, healthy and keep people safe.

TriJets wrote:

M564038 wrote:

Yes! This! I agree completely!
We must not attack amurican culture and decent law abiding citizens with these kinds of dirty tricks.
Comparing the right to live with the right to bear arms is disgusting! Dead kids doesn’t have a right to have an opinion about this! More guns means less people die, this is God’s law.
Nothing to see, move along!

Countless Americans are alive today because they own firearms and were able to use those firearms to defend their lives and the lives of their family members. Instances of defensive gun use dramatically outnumber gun homicides in the United States. Here's just a sampling of instances that made the news recently- https://datavisualizations.heritage.org ... in-the-us/

If you don't want a gun, don't buy one. You aren't taking mine, though.

Those were just a sampling of instances reported on by the news. The reality is that while there are roughly 20,000 gun homicides each year, there are an estimated 100,000-3,000,000 instances of defensive gun use in the United States each year- https://www.realclearinvestigations.com ... 94461.html

Absolutely, those numbers from the Heritage Foundation are probably tainted by liberals. 3 million it is, more than 99% of all gun homicides were prevented by good guys with guns, and none of those potential 3.02 million gun homicide had anything to do with merciful and honest to God and flag gun culture.

TriJets wrote:

M564038 wrote:

Yes! Again I agree completely, as your numbers tell us , 674 people used firearms to defend themselves in 2020. Countless!! Thats even slightly more than people killed by accidental discharge! These numbers seems to come from a bigly neutral trustworthy source too!
LESS THAN 20 000 people where killed in firearm homicides. Would you believe that? Clearly outnumbered by good cutizens protecting themselves. The years before that there were even less!!
There’s almost only Zeroes in that number, too. Clearly not a problem.

We should use guns as much as possible, since they are nice, cool, fun, healthy and keep people safe.

TriJets wrote:

Countless Americans are alive today because they own firearms and were able to use those firearms to defend their lives and the lives of their family members. Instances of defensive gun use dramatically outnumber gun homicides in the United States. Here's just a sampling of instances that made the news recently- https://datavisualizations.heritage.org ... in-the-us/

If you don't want a gun, don't buy one. You aren't taking mine, though.

Those were just a sampling of instances reported on by the news. The reality is that while there are roughly 20,000 gun homicides each year, there are an estimated 100,000-3,000,000 instances of defensive gun use in the United States each year- https://www.realclearinvestigations.com ... 94461.html

TriJets wrote:

M564038 wrote:

Yes! Again I agree completely, as your numbers tell us , 674 people used firearms to defend themselves in 2020. Countless!! Thats even slightly more than people killed by accidental discharge! These numbers seems to come from a bigly neutral trustworthy source too!
LESS THAN 20 000 people where killed in firearm homicides. Would you believe that? Clearly outnumbered by good cutizens protecting themselves. The years before that there were even less!!
There’s almost only Zeroes in that number, too. Clearly not a problem.

We should use guns as much as possible, since they are nice, cool, fun, healthy and keep people safe.

TriJets wrote:

Countless Americans are alive today because they own firearms and were able to use those firearms to defend their lives and the lives of their family members. Instances of defensive gun use dramatically outnumber gun homicides in the United States. Here's just a sampling of instances that made the news recently- https://datavisualizations.heritage.org ... in-the-us/

If you don't want a gun, don't buy one. You aren't taking mine, though.

Those were just a sampling of instances reported on by the news. The reality is that while there are roughly 20,000 gun homicides each year, there are an estimated 100,000-3,000,000 instances of defensive gun use in the United States each year- https://www.realclearinvestigations.com ... 94461.html

Sorry, Harvard says someone’s full of it.
https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/hicrc/fire ... gun-use-2/

CaptHadley wrote:

TriJets wrote:

M564038 wrote:

Yes! Again I agree completely, as your numbers tell us , 674 people used firearms to defend themselves in 2020. Countless!! Thats even slightly more than people killed by accidental discharge! These numbers seems to come from a bigly neutral trustworthy source too!
LESS THAN 20 000 people where killed in firearm homicides. Would you believe that? Clearly outnumbered by good cutizens protecting themselves. The years before that there were even less!!
There’s almost only Zeroes in that number, too. Clearly not a problem.

We should use guns as much as possible, since they are nice, cool, fun, healthy and keep people safe.

Those were just a sampling of instances reported on by the news. The reality is that while there are roughly 20,000 gun homicides each year, there are an estimated 100,000-3,000,000 instances of defensive gun use in the United States each year- https://www.realclearinvestigations.com ... 94461.html

Sorry, Harvard says someone’s full of it.
https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/hicrc/fire ... gun-use-2/

Looks like the Feds disagree with Harvard-

Data also suggest that a significant number of Americans use guns for self-defense purposes. A 2017 report published by researchers at Pew Charitable trust estimated that approximately 1 in 6 gun owners had used their weapon to defend themselves, their families, or their possessions at some point in their life (Parker et al., 2017). While estimates vary greatly, it is speculated that the prevalence of defensive gun usage in the United States ranges from 60,000 to 2.5 million incidents annually (National Research Council, 2013), and whenever guns are used in self-defense, the odds of injury to potential victims is significantly reduced (Cook et al., 2011; Kleck & Gertz, 1995).

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8482364/

As I have stated numerous times, no one is forcing you to buy a gun. If you don't feel safe around one, don't buy one. That's the great thing about this country! You don't get to tell me what to do, and vice versa.

TriJets wrote:

The reality is that while there are roughly 20,000 gun homicides each year, there are an estimated 100,000-3,000,000 instances of defensive gun use in the United States each year- https://www.realclearinvestigations.com ... 94461.html

That's such a BS "estimate".

When do you think you'll get here? I estimate it will be some time between ten minutes and five hours.

TriJets wrote:

there are an estimated 100,000-3,000,000 instances of defensive gun use

A 3000% spread! That research must have been done on the cheap. That’s a useless research.

scbriml wrote:

TriJets wrote:

The reality is that while there are roughly 20,000 gun homicides each year, there are an estimated 100,000-3,000,000 instances of defensive gun use in the United States each year- https://www.realclearinvestigations.com ... 94461.html

That's such a BS "estimate".

When do you think you'll get here? I estimate it will be some time between ten minutes and five hours.

It isn't a single estimate...the range is because multiple studies have been done and they have all produced widely ranging conclusions. Most instances of DGU aren't reported to the media or even law enforcement because most of them involve simply brandishing a firearm and the threatening individual usually goes away. So, the researchers have to rely on polls and other data sets which can produce a wide variety of outcomes.

TriJets wrote:

CaptHadley wrote:

TriJets wrote:

Those were just a sampling of instances reported on by the news. The reality is that while there are roughly 20,000 gun homicides each year, there are an estimated 100,000-3,000,000 instances of defensive gun use in the United States each year- https://www.realclearinvestigations.com ... 94461.html

Sorry, Harvard says someone’s full of it.
https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/hicrc/fire ... gun-use-2/

Looks like the Feds disagree with Harvard-

Data also suggest that a significant number of Americans use guns for self-defense purposes. A 2017 report published by researchers at Pew Charitable trust estimated that approximately 1 in 6 gun owners had used their weapon to defend themselves, their families, or their possessions at some point in their life (Parker et al., 2017). While estimates vary greatly, it is speculated that the prevalence of defensive gun usage in the United States ranges from 60,000 to 2.5 million incidents annually (National Research Council, 2013), and whenever guns are used in self-defense, the odds of injury to potential victims is significantly reduced (Cook et al., 2011; Kleck & Gertz, 1995).

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8482364/

As I have stated numerous times, no one is forcing you to buy a gun. If you don't feel safe around one, don't buy one. That's the great thing about this country! You don't get to tell me what to do, and vice versa.

Yes, no one is forcing me to buy a gun. However, when YOUR guns affect me, my friends, family and other innocent people then I have an issue with them. Something, jeebus willing, California will take care of.

TriJets wrote:

scbriml wrote:

TriJets wrote:

The reality is that while there are roughly 20,000 gun homicides each year, there are an estimated 100,000-3,000,000 instances of defensive gun use in the United States each year- https://www.realclearinvestigations.com ... 94461.html

That's such a BS "estimate".

When do you think you'll get here? I estimate it will be some time between ten minutes and five hours.

It isn't a single estimate...the range is because multiple studies have been done and they have all produced widely ranging conclusions. Most instances of DGU aren't reported to the media or even law enforcement because most of them involve simply brandishing a firearm and the threatening individual usually goes away. So, the researchers have to rely on polls and other data sets which can produce a wide variety of outcomes.

Lol, yeah, please emphasize “Wide” You move those goalposts any farther and they’ll be out of the stadium!

CaptHadley wrote:

TriJets wrote:

CaptHadley wrote:

Sorry, Harvard says someone’s full of it.
https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/hicrc/fire ... gun-use-2/

Looks like the Feds disagree with Harvard-

Data also suggest that a significant number of Americans use guns for self-defense purposes. A 2017 report published by researchers at Pew Charitable trust estimated that approximately 1 in 6 gun owners had used their weapon to defend themselves, their families, or their possessions at some point in their life (Parker et al., 2017). While estimates vary greatly, it is speculated that the prevalence of defensive gun usage in the United States ranges from 60,000 to 2.5 million incidents annually (National Research Council, 2013), and whenever guns are used in self-defense, the odds of injury to potential victims is significantly reduced (Cook et al., 2011; Kleck & Gertz, 1995).

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8482364/

As I have stated numerous times, no one is forcing you to buy a gun. If you don't feel safe around one, don't buy one. That's the great thing about this country! You don't get to tell me what to do, and vice versa.

Yes, no one is forcing me to buy a gun. However, when YOUR guns affect me, my friends, family and other innocent people then I have an issue with them. Something, jeebus willing, California will take care of.

Good things my guns to affect you, then. In fact the only way they will ever affect you is if you personally try to harm me. Also, I don't live in California. Thank goodness the SCOTUS's rulings apply to all 50 states, though!

CaptHadley wrote:

TriJets wrote:

scbriml wrote:

That's such a BS "estimate".

When do you think you'll get here? I estimate it will be some time between ten minutes and five hours.

It isn't a single estimate...the range is because multiple studies have been done and they have all produced widely ranging conclusions. Most instances of DGU aren't reported to the media or even law enforcement because most of them involve simply brandishing a firearm and the threatening individual usually goes away. So, the researchers have to rely on polls and other data sets which can produce a wide variety of outcomes.

Lol, yeah, please emphasize “Wide” You move those goalposts any farther and they’ll be out of the stadium!

They aren't "goalposts", they are varying estimates....even the smallest of which dwarfs the number of gun homicides in the United States.

TriJets wrote:

CaptHadley wrote:

TriJets wrote:

It isn't a single estimate...the range is because multiple studies have been done and they have all produced widely ranging conclusions. Most instances of DGU aren't reported to the media or even law enforcement because most of them involve simply brandishing a firearm and the threatening individual usually goes away. So, the researchers have to rely on polls and other data sets which can produce a wide variety of outcomes.

Lol, yeah, please emphasize “Wide” You move those goalposts any farther and they’ll be out of the stadium!

They aren't "goalposts", they are varying estimates....even the smallest of which dwarfs the number of gun homicides in the United States.

Absolutely no idea what you’re trying to say there. But don’t you worry, it’s only a matter of time before gun control arrives. And before that the lawsuits will start flying, gun owners getting sued and having to sit in court explaining why they need an AR, AK and any other assault rifle along with the need for 6 different handguns. It’s going to be a wonderful thing!

CaptHadley wrote:

TriJets wrote:

CaptHadley wrote:

Lol, yeah, please emphasize “Wide” You move those goalposts any farther and they’ll be out of the stadium!

They aren't "goalposts", they are varying estimates....even the smallest of which dwarfs the number of gun homicides in the United States.

Absolutely no idea what you’re trying to say there. But don’t you worry, it’s only a matter of time before gun control arrives. And before that the lawsuits will start flying, gun owners getting sued and having to sit in court explaining why they need an AR, AK and any other assault rifle along with the need for 6 different handguns. It’s going to be a wonderful thing!

You'd have a better chance of electing a unnicorn in 2025 than any of that happening. Even the Democrats are moving away from gun control....over the past two years gun ownership has skyrocketed and there are more first-time gun owners than ever before. It certainly is a wonderful thing seeing so many millions and millions of Americans exercising their 2nd Amendment rights. In fact, I can't wait to buy another handgun!

CaptHadley wrote:

TriJets wrote:

CaptHadley wrote:

Lol, yeah, please emphasize “Wide” You move those goalposts any farther and they’ll be out of the stadium!

They aren't "goalposts", they are varying estimates....even the smallest of which dwarfs the number of gun homicides in the United States.

Absolutely no idea what you’re trying to say there. But don’t you worry, it’s only a matter of time before gun control arrives. And before that the lawsuits will start flying, gun owners getting sued and having to sit in court explaining why they need an AR, AK and any other assault rifle along with the need for 6 different handguns. It’s going to be a wonderful thing!

Gun rights have never been as relaxed as they are today...and continue to be relaxed in virtually every state.

LCDFlight wrote:

The mom should have been held partially responsible. She should be in prison today on gun fraud charges. Obviously she was a gun nut. The son was not well. You don’t do what she did.

If memory serves me, she was the first person he killed.

TriJets wrote:

They aren't "goalposts", they are varying estimates....even the smallest of which dwarfs the number of gun homicides in the United States.

Those numbers are suspect:

https://www.npr.org/2018/04/13/60214382 ... lf-defense

From personal experience in a (relatively) gun free country I can tell you if you take away guns en masse there’s no impetus here to have a gun for self defence. We protect ourselves from crime via other means. I’ve never been in a situation where I think “jeez wish I had a gun to protect me” because I know a potential threat is almost certainly unarmed too. And yes I freely walk the streets at night minus fear.

Firearms were sort of common about two generations ago, but the government rightly moved to restrict them, and because we lack a powerful gun lobby the citizenry mostly accepted they didn’t need a gun. Lo and behold 30 years later the government hasn’t become tyrannical and started herding citizens into concentration camps because we can’t defend ourselves.

But I can walk the streets safely in the knowledge a mentally ill person or wannabe petty crook doesn’t have a concealed gun, or worse a high powered rifle ready to start blasting.

sierrakilo44 wrote:

TriJets wrote:

They aren't "goalposts", they are varying estimates....even the smallest of which dwarfs the number of gun homicides in the United States.

Those numbers are suspect:

https://www.npr.org/2018/04/13/60214382 ... lf-defense

From personal experience in a (relatively) gun free country I can tell you if you take away guns en masse there’s no impetus here to have a gun for self defence. We protect ourselves from crime via other means. I’ve never been in a situation where I think “jeez wish I had a gun to protect me” because I know a potential threat is almost certainly unarmed too. And yes I freely walk the streets at night minus fear.

Firearms were sort of common about two generations ago, but the government rightly moved to restrict them, and because we lack a powerful gun lobby the citizenry mostly accepted they didn’t need a gun. Lo and behold 30 years later the government hasn’t become tyrannical and started herding citizens into concentration camps because we can’t defend ourselves.

But I can walk the streets safely in the knowledge a mentally ill person or wannabe petty crook doesn’t have a concealed gun, or worse a high powered rifle ready to start blasting.

I'm glad to hear that. The difference is, in the United States there are more guns than there are people, and criminals are already heavily armed. Restricting access to firearms amongst law-abiding people will just mean that criminals can continue to do as they wish. With the pandemic, spike in violent crime, riots, and nationwide police shortage, more and more people have realized that it is largely up to then to protect themselves and their families; the number of first time gun owners has skyrocketed.. When seconds count, the police are minutes away.

It was a very sad anniversary, both in terms of the needless deaths of the innocents and the incident as flamebait for conspiracy theorists.

To we in Australia, these murders seemed to have the potential for positive reform in the US that the Port Arthur massacre had in Australia.

Instead, approximately zero positive happened, with one side in fact hardening its position against any real change that may address gun homicide in the USa in any form.

TriJets wrote:

sierrakilo44 wrote:

TriJets wrote:

They aren't "goalposts", they are varying estimates....even the smallest of which dwarfs the number of gun homicides in the United States.

Those numbers are suspect:

https://www.npr.org/2018/04/13/60214382 ... lf-defense

From personal experience in a (relatively) gun free country I can tell you if you take away guns en masse there’s no impetus here to have a gun for self defence. We protect ourselves from crime via other means. I’ve never been in a situation where I think “jeez wish I had a gun to protect me” because I know a potential threat is almost certainly unarmed too. And yes I freely walk the streets at night minus fear.

Firearms were sort of common about two generations ago, but the government rightly moved to restrict them, and because we lack a powerful gun lobby the citizenry mostly accepted they didn’t need a gun. Lo and behold 30 years later the government hasn’t become tyrannical and started herding citizens into concentration camps because we can’t defend ourselves.

But I can walk the streets safely in the knowledge a mentally ill person or wannabe petty crook doesn’t have a concealed gun, or worse a high powered rifle ready to start blasting.

I'm glad to hear that. The difference is, in the United States there are more guns than there are people, and criminals are already heavily armed. Restricting access to firearms amongst law-abiding people will just mean that criminals can continue to do as they wish. With the pandemic, spike in violent crime, riots, and nationwide police shortage, more and more people have realized that it is largely up to then to protect themselves and their families; the number of first time gun owners has skyrocketed.. When seconds count, the police are minutes away.

Congrats, you hit every talking point used by the gun aficionados. Need to be armed to the teeth, it’s a jungle out there! Surprised the home invasion fable wasn’t included.

Kent350787 wrote:

It was a very sad anniversary, both in terms of the needless deaths of the innocents and the incident as flamebait for conspiracy theorists.

To we in Australia, these murders seemed to have the potential for positive reform in the US that the Port Arthur massacre had in Australia.

Instead, approximately zero positive happened, with one side in fact hardening its position against any real change that may address gun homicide in the USa in any form.

There is a significant population of americans who still feel we are still in the 1700’s and need to be armed to the teeth with an assortment of assault rifles. The paranoia runs rampant with this group of people. They show absolutely no empathy or concern for the numerous mass school shootings. They resort to circling the wagons when these weekly shootings occur as they fear their beloved firearms will be taken from them. We can only hope that this will occur, it starts with California and spreads east.

A daily example of a good guy with a gun. Added bonus a MAGA fella.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.housto ... iracy/amp/

CaptHadley wrote:

TriJets wrote:

sierrakilo44 wrote:

Those numbers are suspect:

https://www.npr.org/2018/04/13/60214382 ... lf-defense

From personal experience in a (relatively) gun free country I can tell you if you take away guns en masse there’s no impetus here to have a gun for self defence. We protect ourselves from crime via other means. I’ve never been in a situation where I think “jeez wish I had a gun to protect me” because I know a potential threat is almost certainly unarmed too. And yes I freely walk the streets at night minus fear.

Firearms were sort of common about two generations ago, but the government rightly moved to restrict them, and because we lack a powerful gun lobby the citizenry mostly accepted they didn’t need a gun. Lo and behold 30 years later the government hasn’t become tyrannical and started herding citizens into concentration camps because we can’t defend ourselves.

But I can walk the streets safely in the knowledge a mentally ill person or wannabe petty crook doesn’t have a concealed gun, or worse a high powered rifle ready to start blasting.

I'm glad to hear that. The difference is, in the United States there are more guns than there are people, and criminals are already heavily armed. Restricting access to firearms amongst law-abiding people will just mean that criminals can continue to do as they wish. With the pandemic, spike in violent crime, riots, and nationwide police shortage, more and more people have realized that it is largely up to then to protect themselves and their families; the number of first time gun owners has skyrocketed.. When seconds count, the police are minutes away.

Congrats, you hit every talking point used by the gun aficionados. Need to be armed to the teeth, it’s a jungle out there! Surprised the home invasion fable wasn’t included.

Imagine being so privileged that you don't think home invasions are a real thing.

As for myself, our home invasion was no "fable". It was most certainly a real thing, as the security camera footage and police report can attest to. But, I guess that isn't a worry for people in ivory towers. Just the rest of us living down here in reality.

CaptHadley wrote:

Kent350787 wrote:

It was a very sad anniversary, both in terms of the needless deaths of the innocents and the incident as flamebait for conspiracy theorists.

To we in Australia, these murders seemed to have the potential for positive reform in the US that the Port Arthur massacre had in Australia.

Instead, approximately zero positive happened, with one side in fact hardening its position against any real change that may address gun homicide in the USa in any form.

There is a significant population of americans who still feel we are still in the 1700’s and need to be armed to the teeth with an assortment of assault rifles. The paranoia runs rampant with this group of people. They show absolutely no empathy or concern for the numerous mass school shootings. They resort to circling the wagons when these weekly shootings occur as they fear their beloved firearms will be taken from them. We can only hope that this will occur, it starts with California and spreads east.

If you are that terrified of your fellow Americans you are more than welcome to stay home. After all, it sounds like your ivory tower is very safe...you don't even appear to believe that home invasions are "real". Thankfully, the SCOTUS's rulings apply to all 50 states, and with the Democrats backing away from gun control, our right to protect ourselves is here to stay.

TriJets wrote:

CaptHadley wrote:

TriJets wrote:

I'm glad to hear that. The difference is, in the United States there are more guns than there are people, and criminals are already heavily armed. Restricting access to firearms amongst law-abiding people will just mean that criminals can continue to do as they wish. With the pandemic, spike in violent crime, riots, and nationwide police shortage, more and more people have realized that it is largely up to then to protect themselves and their families; the number of first time gun owners has skyrocketed.. When seconds count, the police are minutes away.

Congrats, you hit every talking point used by the gun aficionados. Need to be armed to the teeth, it’s a jungle out there! Surprised the home invasion fable wasn’t included.

Imagine being so privileged that you don't think home invasions are a real thing.

As for myself, our home invasion was no "fable". It was most certainly a real thing, as the security camera footage and police report can attest to. But, I guess that isn't a worry for people in ivory towers. Just the rest of us living down here in reality.

Hey it’s your story, you tell it however you want.

TriJets wrote:

CaptHadley wrote:

Kent350787 wrote:

It was a very sad anniversary, both in terms of the needless deaths of the innocents and the incident as flamebait for conspiracy theorists.

To we in Australia, these murders seemed to have the potential for positive reform in the US that the Port Arthur massacre had in Australia.

Instead, approximately zero positive happened, with one side in fact hardening its position against any real change that may address gun homicide in the USa in any form.

There is a significant population of americans who still feel we are still in the 1700’s and need to be armed to the teeth with an assortment of assault rifles. The paranoia runs rampant with this group of people. They show absolutely no empathy or concern for the numerous mass school shootings. They resort to circling the wagons when these weekly shootings occur as they fear their beloved firearms will be taken from them. We can only hope that this will occur, it starts with California and spreads east.

If you are that terrified of your fellow Americans you are more than welcome to stay home. After all, it sounds like your ivory tower is very safe...you don't even appear to believe that home invasions are "real". Thankfully, the SCOTUS's rulings apply to all 50 states, and with the Democrats backing away from gun control, our right to protect ourselves is here to stay.

I’m not the one going on and on about how scary the US of A is. And if it makes you sleep well at night keep thinking that whole scotus and dem thing. The boogey man might be hanging around the house! You know, I can’t remember the name but there was someone here that had the exact same analogies. He just upped and disappeared, I know you just signed up recently. Do you happen to know whom I’m referring to???

CaptHadley wrote:

TriJets wrote:

CaptHadley wrote:

Congrats, you hit every talking point used by the gun aficionados. Need to be armed to the teeth, it’s a jungle out there! Surprised the home invasion fable wasn’t included.

Imagine being so privileged that you don't think home invasions are a real thing.

As for myself, our home invasion was no "fable". It was most certainly a real thing, as the security camera footage and police report can attest to. But, I guess that isn't a worry for people in ivory towers. Just the rest of us living down here in reality.

Hey it’s your story, you tell it however you want.

It is indeed my story, and if you keep trying to troll and minimize a very real traumatic event for my family by calling it a "fable", I'll see what the moderators can do about it.

CaptHadley wrote:

TriJets wrote:

CaptHadley wrote:

There is a significant population of americans who still feel we are still in the 1700’s and need to be armed to the teeth with an assortment of assault rifles. The paranoia runs rampant with this group of people. They show absolutely no empathy or concern for the numerous mass school shootings. They resort to circling the wagons when these weekly shootings occur as they fear their beloved firearms will be taken from them. We can only hope that this will occur, it starts with California and spreads east.

If you are that terrified of your fellow Americans you are more than welcome to stay home. After all, it sounds like your ivory tower is very safe...you don't even appear to believe that home invasions are "real". Thankfully, the SCOTUS's rulings apply to all 50 states, and with the Democrats backing away from gun control, our right to protect ourselves is here to stay.

I’m not the one going on and on about how scary the US of A is. And if it makes you sleep well at night keep thinking that whole scotus and dem thing. The boogey man might be hanging around the house!

I sleep pretty well at night knowing if the boogey man returns he'll catch more 9mm on his one-way trip than he knows what to do with.

TriJets wrote:

CaptHadley wrote:

TriJets wrote:

Imagine being so privileged that you don't think home invasions are a real thing.

As for myself, our home invasion was no "fable". It was most certainly a real thing, as the security camera footage and police report can attest to. But, I guess that isn't a worry for people in ivory towers. Just the rest of us living down here in reality.

Hey it’s your story, you tell it however you want.

It is indeed my story, and if you keep trying to troll and minimize a very real traumatic event for my family by calling it a "fable", I'll see what the moderators can do about it.

It’s unfortunate that you seem to think someone who has a different opinion as yours is “trolling” And you should well know that people on the internet embelish all the time to bolster their claims.

CaptHadley wrote:

TriJets wrote:

CaptHadley wrote:

Hey it’s your story, you tell it however you want.

It is indeed my story, and if you keep trying to troll and minimize a very real traumatic event for my family by calling it a "fable", I'll see what the moderators can do about it.

It’s unfortunate that you seem to think someone who has a different opinion as yours is “trolling” And you should well know that people on the internet embelish all the time to bolster their claims.

You weren't there so your "opinion" about something that happened to my family is useless and unwelcome. It is indeed trolling. And if you keep it up, I'll ask the moderators to intervene.

You may believe that crime doesn't exist and that home invasions are make believe, but unless you can back up your delusions with facts, your opinions on that matter are "trolling" as well.

I like the word «Home invasion». That’s proper! Here, we usually just have break ins and burglaries, and no one ever shoots anyone. So boring. Hope you got them, TriJets! I wish I could live in a western- or Mad Max-movie, too! Like in Amurica! Only commie-hell pacifists around here. It’s a sign of the end-times coming when even the criminals don’t bother shooting anyone, I tell you!

CaptHadley wrote:

Yes, no one is forcing me to buy a gun. However, when YOUR guns affect me, my friends, family and other innocent people then I have an issue with them. Something, jeebus willing, California will take care of.

It's interesting that in this statement you speak of a gun as it can function on it's own and don't lend any credence to the fact it's a tool that has to be handled and used by a human being. It's this syndrome that plays a big part in why no meaningful gun reform ever gets done.

TriJets wrote:

CaptHadley wrote:

TriJets wrote:

I sleep pretty well at night knowing if the boogey man returns he'll catch more 9mm on his one-way trip than he knows what to do with.

9MM? Heck, you'll just piss him off with that pop gun - hope you've got something with a little more firepower than that

I remember that day, I was walking out of a Randall's while on the phone with a buddy and he mentioned it. Thought it was pretty damn sad and then went on to follow it as it unfolded.

Responsible gun owners and their guns are caught in the middle of a vicious tug-of-war between gun grabbers and criminals. Responsible gun owners will not give up their guns, nor will criminals.

Which would you rather disarm?

N626AA wrote:

Which would you rather disarm?

Since you ask. I would start with average gun owners.
Someone needs to stop it from escalating further.
Criminals use guns because they «have to».

M564038 wrote:

N626AA wrote:

Which would you rather disarm?

Since you ask. I would start with average gun owners.
Someone needs to stop it from escalating further.
Criminals use guns because they «have to».

I am an average gun owner. Sure, you can take my gun and give it to the criminal who "has to" use it.