StarAC17 wrote:casinterest wrote:77Phoebe wrote:
AHH, you're one of those 'The only deaths that are directly caused by Covid-19 are important all the other problem caused by lockdowns and other pointless measures are utterly irrelevant.' people. Gotcha.
"Kid's will catch up if their parents and teachers help them." Dear God how utterly, utterly clueless. Of course the well off engaged kids in good schools will be fine, they always were going to be. What proportion of children in the US (for example) have parents that are unable or unwilling to help their children catch up? 25%? How's the US public school system? Robust? How are teachers meant to find time to 'help them out'?, it's just utter nonsense. And the most vulnerable will be the most affected.
If you think that we have not just caused massive, long term avoidable damage to our children by our actions over the last two years then I dispare. The loss of education will knock on to future generations. Jesus, kids don't even get it badly.
What kind of gotcha game are you playing ? We had a pandemic, and while you worry about kids education, the issue when we didn't have vaccines is that although kids are resillent, they are also the most socially interactive age group, and they can spread germs lighting quick. Saving lives and educating kids remotely was a good choice. As we have gone onwards to a time when vaccines are available, the kids have been in school with and without masks. And now due to that and a whole misinformed group of souls, we now have lighting quick transmission of a virus on it's 4th/'5th wave wreaking havoc though the world. Here locally we had to send schools remote, because their aren't enough teachers well enough to teach. Kids aren't getting to school because the bus drivers are sick, and teachers are quitting due to a host of issues.
So remote learning? Yes it was effective for all. And it was worthwhile to save lives and continue the education of the kids.
In person, always better, but the strains it is putting on the system will cause years of issues as their won't be enough teachers left.
I think the school closures made sense up until August/September 2021 when we didn't have vaccines widely available. Now they are not to protect the kids but to protect the much more fearful staff and if you are scared wear a mask and/or get the vaccine. A risk free environment doesn't exist and trying to create what isn't possible will only end in frustration. We can take steps to minimize risk but it can never be eliminated. If you are vaccinated and mask up there is literally nothing else you can do to protect yourself outside of living in a bubble.
Kids are low risk and vaccines are available for 5+ so what sense does isolating them have now. Bring the vaccines to the schools would be a good starting point which was what was done for many of the vaccines I got were at school.
Outside of the valid claim that the staff shortages are the issue that a school cannot function, fair point there but that is a school by school issue and not a general issue.
This is my opinion but I am concerned that we get so worried about illness with kids in general today. Maybe we were all abused in the past but I remember as a kid getting sick constantly, sometimes back to back flu's, chickenpox and cold after cold. (Chickenpox is a non-issue as there is a vaccine) but after time with the same interactions I stopped getting sick because our immune system has learned how to fight these things and you get less sick as you get older.
I understand the increased risk for Covid but these actions I hope aren't taken on a mass scale when flu outbreaks happen or even future covid ones as this will be endemic going forward. This is a reality of human life that isn't going away.
I don't know how it is stateside but there is a debate here in Canada as the pediatric society is pushing back against the general public health advice and pushing for the schools to be open. They cite the risk to Covid is less than the mental health and well being of children. Open the schools and bring the vaccines to the schools, if parents protest then give the parent the benefit of the doubt as the school. You will get 80% of the kids vaccinated. If a mandate is needed later implement that clear rationale.
https://www.cp24.com/news/pediatrician- ... -1.5732019
On a larger note we need to have a risk stratified approach going forward as we need to let those who are vaccinated and lower risk re-enter society with little to no restrictions. If you are scared or high risk then you don't have to interact. I actually think the US, Europe, Australia and Israel are moving in this direction.
https://www.ctvnews.ca/health/coronavir ... -1.5738198
This article states that 70% of the ICU beds in Ontario are taken up by unvaccinated people, hospitalizations are 55% unvaxxed to 45% vaxxed. This is despite a full non-essential lockdown and capacity restrictions before this. If it were 90%-10% or 99%-5% then the argument can be made that the vaccine is much more of a shield than it is. A significant amount of people getting admitted to the ICU have failing health and that is just the reality of life.
I am not sure that 100% vaccination rate would alleviate the strain on hospitals to a point where we can say that things are good.
We now generally accept that Covid will infect essentially everyone and if we took this a risk stratified approach and did what Sweden had been doing since the beginning would be have managed the same, better or worse? Had we invested more in early treatment would be further ahead?
Look, my kids have been back since the fall of 2020, with a brief break at the start of 2021. However in that time they were masked and distancing was followed. As of now, we can have all 5 and ups vaccinated, and classes are no issue. The problem being faced now is that we have so many unvaccinated, and we also have rules surrounding isolations. Schools are shutting down, not because teachers are afraid to teach, but because if anyone in their household is exposed, they have to isolate for 5-7 days. And repeat if the other members get sick.
This should be the last big deadly wave. Omicron is contagious enough and less severe enough to give a good push through the population.
However hundreds of thousands are dead because people pushed to keep masks off and remain unvaccinated, and that is where this original discussion started.