20 years of the Euro

Aesma · Sat Jan 01, 2022 5:40 pm

All Eurozone currencies were already pegged to the Euro since 1999, but 2002 is when we started to have the coins and bills in our pockets and bank accounts.

I was 18 at the time, I remember it was a change of course, but not a difficult one, I'm good at mental calculation so could estimate prices in French Francs to Euros and the reverse easily. All prices were displayed in both currencies for years anyway. Today I really don't think at all about Francs anymore, and couldn't relate to it. Unlike my grandparents who I remember would always talk about "old Francs" when the "new Franc" had been around for decades. So everything for them was in millions (the new Franc was = 100 old Francs).

A big change for me was when travelling to Italy, since I have family there, the liras that were always a bit cumbersome, with cars worth millions and houses worth billions, suddenly we were using the same currency, it was great. And still is.

It goes well with crossing borders with ease, for example I had to work in Valenciennes once, and hotels there were expensive because of some event happening on the same dates, I could easily figure out that staying in Belgium would be cheaper, and did so. Working cross borders is also made easier, no surprise with the money you're getting, no change risk, no fees. I sell items to people all across Europe with ease, thanks to SEPA transfers and dealing with a single currency.

What are your thoughts about the Euro ?

Europe marks 20 years of the euro | DW News : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jwewlKg0EPI

20 years of the euro in your pocket! Ursula von der Leyen celebrates 20 years of the #EURO €€€ : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yvn9IoCBms0

Dutchy · Sat Jan 01, 2022 6:01 pm

Yeah, a historic event. Euro's in our pockets. I was 23 at the time. The Euro has had a rough ride, to say the least, but if it doesn't break you, it will make one stronger and that is certainly the case for the Euro. The Euro has been great benefits to all its members.

Worthwhile to check out the historic topic about it, and what people thought about it back then.

flyguy89 · Sat Jan 01, 2022 6:15 pm

Aesma wrote:
All Eurozone currencies were already pegged to the Euro since 1999, but 2002 is when we started to have the coins and bills in our pockets and bank accounts.

I was 18 at the time, I remember it was a change of course, but not a difficult one, I'm good at mental calculation so could estimate prices in French Francs to Euros and the reverse easily. All prices were displayed in both currencies for years anyway. Today I really don't think at all about Francs anymore, and couldn't relate to it. Unlike my grandparents who I remember would always talk about "old Francs" when the "new Franc" had been around for decades. So everything for them was in millions (the new Franc was = 100 old Francs).

A big change for me was when travelling to Italy, since I have family there, the liras that were always a bit cumbersome, with cars worth millions and houses worth billions, suddenly we were using the same currency, it was great. And still is.

It goes well with crossing borders with ease, for example I had to work in Valenciennes once, and hotels there were expensive because of some event happening on the same dates, I could easily figure out that staying in Belgium would be cheaper, and did so. Working cross borders is also made easier, no surprise with the money you're getting, no change risk, no fees. I sell items to people all across Europe with ease, thanks to SEPA transfers and dealing with a single currency.

What are your thoughts about the Euro ?

Europe marks 20 years of the euro | DW News : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jwewlKg0EPI

20 years of the euro in your pocket! Ursula von der Leyen celebrates 20 years of the #EURO €€€ : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yvn9IoCBms0

I remember my host family in France complained that the switch to the Euro raised costs for them on everyday staples like bread and groceries. Not sure how true that is however.

mad99 · Sat Jan 01, 2022 7:25 pm

166,386 to the euro
Spanish peseta to euro rate
It made things dearer but it’s so much better travelling

Kiwirob · Sat Jan 01, 2022 7:38 pm

Aesma wrote:

What are your thoughts about the Euro ?

I love it, it makes travelling around Europe so much easier, I dearly wish Norway would join, then we could throw away the worthless NOK for good.

ACDC8 · Sat Jan 01, 2022 9:35 pm

I think I still have a couple of those "welcome baggies" with the coins that Germany issued with the Euro rollout laying around somewhere.

I loved it, living right beside the Dutch border, made shopping so much easier as well as travelling around the rest of Europe. I just wish Canada, Mexico and the US would come up with the same thing.

Sucked my paycheque was "cut it half", but groceries being "half" the price of what they were before - it didn't take long to adjust :bigthumbsup:

johns624 · Sat Jan 01, 2022 9:48 pm

ACDC8 wrote:
I just wish Canada, Mexico and the US would come up with the same thing.

I could maybe see Canada but Mexico's economy is too different (and screwed up) to include them in it.

ACDC8 · Sat Jan 01, 2022 9:55 pm

johns624 wrote:
I could maybe see Canada but Mexico's economy is too different (and screwed up) to include them in it.

Meh, buying my cerveza and tacos without having to switch currencies is much more interesting than the whole economics of it all :biggrin:

johns624 · Sat Jan 01, 2022 9:57 pm

ACDC8 wrote:
johns624 wrote:
I could maybe see Canada but Mexico's economy is too different (and screwed up) to include them in it.

Meh, buying my cerveza and tacos without having to switch currencies is much more interesting than the whole economics of it all

As long as I can get my Timmy's and Molson's, eh?

ACDC8 · Sat Jan 01, 2022 11:00 pm

johns624 wrote:
As long as I can get my Timmy's and Molson's, eh?

Thats the spirit :bigthumbsup:

T18 · Sat Jan 01, 2022 11:01 pm

johns624 wrote:
ACDC8 wrote:
johns624 wrote:
I could maybe see Canada but Mexico's economy is too different (and screwed up) to include them in it.

Meh, buying my cerveza and tacos without having to switch currencies is much more interesting than the whole economics of it all
As long as I can get my Timmy's and Molson's, eh?

I don't see the US allowing money with the Queen and I doubt Canada wants a genocidal racist like Jackson on theirs. So maybe we nix them both for William Shatner or Alex Trebec

WildcatYXU · Sat Jan 01, 2022 11:12 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
Aesma wrote:

What are your thoughts about the Euro ?

I love it, it makes travelling around Europe so much easier, I dearly wish Norway would join, then we could throw away the worthless NOK for good.

Yes. I remember when living in the old country I had a lot of useless small change from business trips and vacations taken. The Euro eliminated this problem. Too late for me. When the old country started to use the Euro, I already lived in Canada for 8 years.
That said, what makes traveling easier are credit cards.

johns624 · Sat Jan 01, 2022 11:20 pm

T18 wrote:
johns624 wrote:
ACDC8 wrote:
Meh, buying my cerveza and tacos without having to switch currencies is much more interesting than the whole economics of it all
As long as I can get my Timmy's and Molson's, eh?

I don't see the US allowing money with the Queen and I doubt Canada wants a genocidal racist like Jackson on theirs. So maybe we nix them both for William Shatner or Alex Trebec

How about Ted Cruz? He was born in Canada and now we're stuck with him... :stirthepot:

FlapOperator · Sat Jan 01, 2022 11:57 pm

T18 wrote:
johns624 wrote:
ACDC8 wrote:
Meh, buying my cerveza and tacos without having to switch currencies is much more interesting than the whole economics of it all
As long as I can get my Timmy's and Molson's, eh?

I don't see the US allowing money with the Queen and I doubt Canada wants a genocidal racist like Jackson on theirs. So maybe we nix them both for William Shatner or Alex Trebec

I guess if racists are out, no FDR, either.

johns624 · Sun Jan 02, 2022 12:03 am

FlapOperator wrote:
T18 wrote:
johns624 wrote:
As long as I can get my Timmy's and Molson's, eh?

I don't see the US allowing money with the Queen and I doubt Canada wants a genocidal racist like Jackson on theirs. So maybe we nix them both for William Shatner or Alex Trebec

I guess if racists are out, no FDR, either.

Maybe Eisenhower? Or Meghan? :lol:

petertenthije · Sun Jan 02, 2022 12:10 am

johns624 wrote:
FlapOperator wrote:
T18 wrote:

I don't see the US allowing money with the Queen and I doubt Canada wants a genocidal racist like Jackson on theirs. So maybe we nix them both for William Shatner or Alex Trebec

I guess if racists are out, no FDR, either.
Maybe Eisenhower? Or Meghan?

You could go for designs without people?

Maybe North American animals? The eagle, the buffalo, the brown bear, the NYC pizza rat….

petertenthije · Sun Jan 02, 2022 12:19 am

I think the euro has, generally speaking, been a good thing. It makes trade easier, and a united European block can stand against the USD and the CNY, which individually would not be feasible (except maybe Germany).

That said, it is easy for me to say living in the Netherlands. I would guess someone from Greece does not share my opinion.

It would be nice to see some better designs though. The current euro designs are quite bland, in particular the notes.

FlapOperator · Sun Jan 02, 2022 12:47 am

petertenthije wrote:

Maybe North American animals? The eagle, the buffalo, the brown bear, the NYC pizza rat….

Hahahahaha. Yes.

ACDC8 · Sun Jan 02, 2022 1:22 am

johns624 wrote:
]How about Ted Cruz? He was born in Canada and now we're stuck with him...

No backsie's :rotfl:

The Euro was great, loved everything about it - lots of hesitation and complaining at first by many coworkers and friends, but that subsided pretty quick.

einsteinboricua · Sun Jan 02, 2022 1:22 am

The concept of a monetary union is interesting, especially in the context of allowing national economies to become more closely linked, but we saw the pitfalls between 2007 and 2014 with many southern EU countries unable to adapt and requiring bailouts. A currency union works if all economies are roughly on par with each other or if it's meant to be a small one with one country being a satellite of a larger (like Switzerland and Liechtenstein).

This is why the idea of an Amero will likely never happen: the US's economy is 7x larger than Canada and Mexico combined. Monetary policy meant to help Canada or Mexico may hurt the US a lot more; monetary policy meant to keep the US in check means depressed conditions for Canada and Mexico (likely too strong a currency).

LCDFlight · Sun Jan 02, 2022 1:28 am

petertenthije wrote:
I think the euro has, generally speaking, been a good thing. It makes trade easier, and a united European block can stand against the USD and the CNY, which individually would not be feasible (except maybe Germany).

That said, it is easy for me to say living in the Netherlands. I would guess someone from Greece does not share my opinion.

It would be nice to see some better designs though. The current euro designs are quite bland, in particular the notes.

I think (viewing from the US) that Spain, Italy and Greece used to be accustomed to a different style of government than Germany and Netherlands. They have been harmed by the Euro.

S Europe used to borrow locally denominated currency, spend it, not really collect taxes, inflate their currency (which is a tax) and repeat. This worked pretty well for them. The hard (German) currency has harmed Southern Europe's cost competitiveness and ability to employ young people. It has also led to crushing debt.

There should have been a "Southern Euro" and a "Northern Euro."

OTOH, imo stitching Europe together has gone really well, with the exception of currency in Southern Europe. They need to make sure there is political accountability in Brussels, however. Unaccountability breeds rot. Power corrupts.

prebennorholm · Sun Jan 02, 2022 2:56 am

Aesma wrote:
Europe marks 20 years of the euro.....

It might have been better if it had been 10 years instead of 20. That would have given a string of southern countries a chance to adapt to the budget discipline needed to share currency with other countries, instead of bending or ignoring all rules and keep on financing their national budget with inflation almost as if it was Germany 1920'es.

That might have avoided all or most of the disasters at the beginning of the Euro.

That way there might also have been more EU countries today using the Euro instead of their own currency. It may take a hundred years to have them reverse their decision to not adopt the Euro. The scary situation 15 years ago will not be forgotten any day soon.

Instead of celebrating 20 years of pure existence we should wait and celebrate 20 years of the ECB successfully enforcing the rules governing the Euro.

Virtual737 · Sun Jan 02, 2022 3:35 am

The Euro for sure has offered its users advantages. However, for me, part of the joy of foreign travel was to be using "foreign" money, so switching to the Euro would not only mean giving up our beloved Pound Sterling (one of the world's oldest currencies) and part of our national identity, but also giving up some of the more educational differences between our nations.

I don't particularly want to travel to different places and see them becoming more "same same" each time. I was (and am) English before British, British before European and European before whatever comes next. To be frank, I think the French were mad to give up the..... Franc, the Germans missed the mark in more ways that one and I miss being able to be a cheap millionaire by changing pounds to Italian Lira, especially since the Bulgarians revalued the Lev.

Sure there are some benefits, but giving up our local histories to move towards this more global federalism isn't a plane I wanted to fly.

chimborazo · Sun Jan 02, 2022 2:49 pm

Virtual737 wrote:
The Euro for sure has offered its users advantages. However, for me, part of the joy of foreign travel was to be using "foreign" money, so switching to the Euro would not only mean giving up our beloved Pound Sterling (one of the world's oldest currencies) and part of our national identity, but also giving up some of the more educational differences between our nations.

I don't particularly want to travel to different places and see them becoming more "same same" each time. I was (and am) English before British, British before European and European before whatever comes next. To be frank, I think the French were mad to give up the..... Franc, the Germans missed the mark in more ways that one and I miss being able to be a cheap millionaire by changing pounds to Italian Lira, especially since the Bulgarians revalued the Lev.

Sure there are some benefits, but giving up our local histories to move towards this more global federalism isn't a plane I wanted to fly.

Indeed. For the average punter, it makes life easier when travelling around Europe. It also made and makes the cost of living higher for a lot of people who live in what should have been economically failed states in Europe until the “project leaders” decided to get the cheque book out to save political face.

It makes sense from an economic perspective when in a political union but as you note, also adds to the creep of the world becoming a more boring shade of grey. It was fun thinking you’d got a bargain in a shop when there were so many 0000s it got confusing and then when you worked it out later it cost more than “at home”.

I like that you can spend EUR 500 notes and people actually take them: it’s hard enough trying to spend a GBP 50 note in the UK! (Not that I have many 500 EURO notes but they often got dished out as float money for expenses).

petertenthije · Sun Jan 02, 2022 3:54 pm

chimborazo wrote:
I like that you can spend EUR 500 notes and people actually take them

Don’t count on that in the Netherlands! The 200 and 500 notes can be rejected, in particular in smaller stores. Large sums are handled by debit card and (to a lesser extent) credit card.

Kiwirob · Sun Jan 02, 2022 4:00 pm

WildcatYXU wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:
Aesma wrote:

What are your thoughts about the Euro ?

I love it, it makes travelling around Europe so much easier, I dearly wish Norway would join, then we could throw away the worthless NOK for good.

Yes. I remember when living in the old country I had a lot of useless small change from business trips and vacations taken. The Euro eliminated this problem. Too late for me. When the old country started to use the Euro, I already lived in Canada for 8 years.
That said, what makes traveling easier are credit cards.

I agree credit cards are good, but you're constantly doing the math converting everything back to NOK, if Norway dumped the NOK and went with the EUR the price is the price, not surprises.

Kiwirob · Sun Jan 02, 2022 4:07 pm

Virtual737 wrote:
The Euro for sure has offered its users advantages. However, for me, part of the joy of foreign travel was to be using "foreign" money, so switching to the Euro would not only mean giving up our beloved Pound Sterling (one of the world's oldest currencies) and part of our national identity, but also giving up some of the more educational differences between our nations.

I don't particularly want to travel to different places and see them becoming more "same same" each time. I was (and am) English before British, British before European and European before whatever comes next. To be frank, I think the French were mad to give up the..... Franc, the Germans missed the mark in more ways that one and I miss being able to be a cheap millionaire by changing pounds to Italian Lira, especially since the Bulgarians revalued the Lev.

Sure there are some benefits, but giving up our local histories to move towards this more global federalism isn't a plane I wanted to fly.

If Britain had joi9nged the currency union the stupidity that ended in Brexit would have been a lot harder to achieve.

Aesma · Sun Jan 02, 2022 5:36 pm

For information the 500€ note is being phased out. It stays legal tender (for the time being) but isn't being printed anymore :

The note is being phased out due to concerns of widespread use for illegal purposes. Most printing of new €500 notes ceased in 2019, although existing notes will remain legal tender until further notice.

Initially it was Germany which insisted on its existence, in France for example we had the 500F note as the biggest one, worth less than 100€.

A roll of 25,000 euros can be hidden inside a cigarette packet with 500€ bills.

Reinhardt · Sun Jan 02, 2022 6:07 pm

Aesma wrote:

Initially it was Germany which insisted on its existence, in France for example we had the 500F note as the biggest one, worth less than 100€.

Germans love paperwork, and paying in cash. For some bizarre reason. Hopefully one of these days it'll join the modern age.

B777LRF · Sun Jan 02, 2022 6:27 pm

I moved abroad to a Eurozone country just as the EUR was introduced, and it did take a bit of getting used to. Didn’t help me one little bit that the prices were displayed both in EUR and the local old currency, as I had zero relation to either.

With that move came a lot, like a whole boatload lot, of business travel within the EU. Having the EUR as the single currency made that life a lot easier, and probably stopped me from making serious and costly errors converting currencies.

Agree wholeheartedly that certain southern European countries should not have been let in from the start, and should only have been admitted based on honest and open data. Didn’t personally affect me, but did have very detrimental effects on many people living in those countries. One might put forward the cynical argument it was their own damn fault, and their own corrupt structures, which brought them there. And it would be a fair critique too, but perhaps not so much for the average Jose, Leonardo or Dimitris, who were sent up shyte creek without a paddle by their governments.

chimborazo · Sun Jan 02, 2022 7:51 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
Virtual737 wrote:
The Euro for sure has offered its users advantages. However, for me, part of the joy of foreign travel was to be using "foreign" money, so switching to the Euro would not only mean giving up our beloved Pound Sterling (one of the world's oldest currencies) and part of our national identity, but also giving up some of the more educational differences between our nations.

I don't particularly want to travel to different places and see them becoming more "same same" each time. I was (and am) English before British, British before European and European before whatever comes next. To be frank, I think the French were mad to give up the..... Franc, the Germans missed the mark in more ways that one and I miss being able to be a cheap millionaire by changing pounds to Italian Lira, especially since the Bulgarians revalued the Lev.

Sure there are some benefits, but giving up our local histories to move towards this more global federalism isn't a plane I wanted to fly.

If Britain had joi9nged the currency union the stupidity that ended in Brexit would have been a lot harder to achieve.

Which is another great reason we didn’t join. We set our own currency rate. It’s hard to understand from those who like being dominated by France and Germany, but it’s actually a good thing for us.

noviorbis77 · Sun Jan 02, 2022 8:48 pm

It is handy for holidays that is for sure. But I do miss the variety.

noviorbis77 · Sun Jan 02, 2022 8:51 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
Virtual737 wrote:
The Euro for sure has offered its users advantages. However, for me, part of the joy of foreign travel was to be using "foreign" money, so switching to the Euro would not only mean giving up our beloved Pound Sterling (one of the world's oldest currencies) and part of our national identity, but also giving up some of the more educational differences between our nations.

I don't particularly want to travel to different places and see them becoming more "same same" each time. I was (and am) English before British, British before European and European before whatever comes next. To be frank, I think the French were mad to give up the..... Franc, the Germans missed the mark in more ways that one and I miss being able to be a cheap millionaire by changing pounds to Italian Lira, especially since the Bulgarians revalued the Lev.

Sure there are some benefits, but giving up our local histories to move towards this more global federalism isn't a plane I wanted to fly.

If Britain had joi9nged the currency union the stupidity that ended in Brexit would have been a lot harder to achieve.

We were never going to join. The majority of the public were always against it, suggested by poll after poll.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_ ... d_the_euro

Kiwirob · Sun Jan 02, 2022 9:19 pm

noviorbis77 wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:
Virtual737 wrote:
The Euro for sure has offered its users advantages. However, for me, part of the joy of foreign travel was to be using "foreign" money, so switching to the Euro would not only mean giving up our beloved Pound Sterling (one of the world's oldest currencies) and part of our national identity, but also giving up some of the more educational differences between our nations.

I don't particularly want to travel to different places and see them becoming more "same same" each time. I was (and am) English before British, British before European and European before whatever comes next. To be frank, I think the French were mad to give up the..... Franc, the Germans missed the mark in more ways that one and I miss being able to be a cheap millionaire by changing pounds to Italian Lira, especially since the Bulgarians revalued the Lev.

Sure there are some benefits, but giving up our local histories to move towards this more global federalism isn't a plane I wanted to fly.

If Britain had joi9nged the currency union the stupidity that ended in Brexit would have been a lot harder to achieve.

We were never going to join. The majority of the public were always against it, suggested by poll after poll.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_ ... d_the_euro

In a couple of decades time when the Brexit experiment ends you’ll need to rejoin due to immense financial hardship, you will be forced to accept the EUR, all those nice opt outs you had won’t come back either. At that point Scotland and Wales will likely be independent and Ireland reunited.

Mortyman · Sun Jan 02, 2022 9:20 pm

Happy to have the Norwegian Krone ( NOK )

johns624 · Sun Jan 02, 2022 9:35 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
noviorbis77 wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:

If Britain had joi9nged the currency union the stupidity that ended in Brexit would have been a lot harder to achieve.

We were never going to join. The majority of the public were always against it, suggested by poll after poll.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_ ... d_the_euro

In a couple of decades time when the Brexit experiment ends you’ll need to rejoin due to immense financial hardship, you will be forced to accept the EUR, all those nice opt outs you had won’t come back either. At that point Scotland and Wales will likely be independent and Ireland reunited.

Or they'll join with Australia, Canada and us in the Semi-Englishing Speaking States of the World. :lol:

noviorbis77 · Sun Jan 02, 2022 11:21 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
noviorbis77 wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:

If Britain had joi9nged the currency union the stupidity that ended in Brexit would have been a lot harder to achieve.

We were never going to join. The majority of the public were always against it, suggested by poll after poll.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_ ... d_the_euro

In a couple of decades time when the Brexit experiment ends you’ll need to rejoin due to immense financial hardship, you will be forced to accept the EUR, all those nice opt outs you had won’t come back either. At that point Scotland and Wales will likely be independent and Ireland reunited.

If you say so. You can have your own little fantasy I guess.

But can you keep this on topic rather than yet another UK Brexit thread?

Lets discuss 20 years of the Euro.

Funny really, I still find old French franc coins at home from time to time.

PS - if we had the immense financial hardships your economic expertise forecasts, we wouldn’t meet the criteria for joining the Euro

einsteinboricua · Sun Jan 02, 2022 11:46 pm

I'm actually confused as to why Sweden hasn't negotiated the opt-out from the Euro officially. Sweden's accession agreement calls for the country to adopt the Euro (as did Austria and Finland who joined the same day) but it hasn't joined the ERM2 yet (and that's voluntarily) so it is willingly flouting the rules. With Brexit, I'm surprised that Sweden did not request the opt-out that the UK had be transferred or created or whatever.

johns624 · Mon Jan 03, 2022 12:28 am

If I were stuck in some Third World country and had to bribe my way out of it, the Euro would probably be my third choice. First two would be USD and GBP.

noviorbis77 · Mon Jan 03, 2022 12:28 am

einsteinboricua wrote:
I'm actually confused as to why Sweden hasn't negotiated the opt-out from the Euro officially. Sweden's accession agreement calls for the country to adopt the Euro (as did Austria and Finland who joined the same day) but it hasn't joined the ERM2 yet (and that's voluntarily) so it is willingly flouting the rules. With Brexit, I'm surprised that Sweden did not request the opt-out that the UK had be transferred or created or whatever.

Is it not the same for Poland and Czech Republic?

A101 · Mon Jan 03, 2022 12:44 am

johns624 wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:
noviorbis77 wrote:

We were never going to join. The majority of the public were always against it, suggested by poll after poll.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_ ... d_the_euro

In a couple of decades time when the Brexit experiment ends you’ll need to rejoin due to immense financial hardship, you will be forced to accept the EUR, all those nice opt outs you had won’t come back either. At that point Scotland and Wales will likely be independent and Ireland reunited.
Or they'll join with Australia, Canada and us in the Semi-Englishing Speaking States of the World.

We already have rejoined, it’s called being fully sovereign in its own right just as Australia Canada New Zealand Japan Sth Korea and the United States are just to name a few

einsteinboricua · Mon Jan 03, 2022 1:54 am

noviorbis77 wrote:
Is it not the same for Poland and Czech Republic?

Poland and the Czech Republic joined in 2004 when the Euro already was physical so it's one thing to join when something is just a concept but another to join when it's a reality.

Unlike Sweden, both are nowhere near ready to adopt the currency; Sweden is, except for ERM2 membership, but that's voluntary so no EU institution can force Sweden to enter (and technically, that also extends to all members without an opt-out).

Aesma · Mon Jan 03, 2022 4:01 am

chimborazo wrote:
Which is another great reason we didn’t join. We set our own currency rate. It’s hard to understand from those who like being dominated by France and Germany, but it’s actually a good thing for us.

Are you saying the UK is a currency manipulator ?

Kiwirob · Mon Jan 03, 2022 6:31 am

A101 wrote:
johns624 wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:

In a couple of decades time when the Brexit experiment ends you’ll need to rejoin due to immense financial hardship, you will be forced to accept the EUR, all those nice opt outs you had won’t come back either. At that point Scotland and Wales will likely be independent and Ireland reunited.
Or they'll join with Australia, Canada and us in the Semi-Englishing Speaking States of the World.

We already have rejoined, it’s called being fully sovereign in its own right just as Australia Canada New Zealand Japan Sth Korea and the United States are just to name a few

I think one of the biggest mistakes NZ ever made was not federating with Australia.

A101 · Mon Jan 03, 2022 6:40 am

Kiwirob wrote:
A101 wrote:
johns624 wrote:
Or they'll join with Australia, Canada and us in the Semi-Englishing Speaking States of the World.

We already have rejoined, it’s called being fully sovereign in its own right just as Australia Canada New Zealand Japan Sth Korea and the United States are just to name a few

I think one of the biggest mistakes NZ ever made was not federating with Australia.

That would be interesting to see why you think that, but off topic here

TokyoImperialPa · Mon Jan 03, 2022 7:00 am

Aesma wrote:
chimborazo wrote:
Which is another great reason we didn’t join. We set our own currency rate. It’s hard to understand from those who like being dominated by France and Germany, but it’s actually a good thing for us.

Are you saying the UK is a currency manipulator ?

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-06- ... ients.html

Kiwirob · Mon Jan 03, 2022 7:50 am

A101 wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:
A101 wrote:

We already have rejoined, it’s called being fully sovereign in its own right just as Australia Canada New Zealand Japan Sth Korea and the United States are just to name a few

I think one of the biggest mistakes NZ ever made was not federating with Australia.

That would be interesting to see why you think that, but off topic here

Simple, isolation from the rest of the world and size.

A101 · Mon Jan 03, 2022 8:06 am

Kiwirob wrote:
A101 wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:

I think one of the biggest mistakes NZ ever made was not federating with Australia.

That would be interesting to see why you think that, but off topic here

Simple, isolation from the rest of the world and size.

We’ll isolation and size was never going to change, if you felt that NZ was to small you had the option of staying a colonial colony of the UK

L410Turbolet · Mon Jan 03, 2022 9:22 am

einsteinboricua wrote:
noviorbis77 wrote:
Is it not the same for Poland and Czech Republic?

Unlike Sweden, both are nowhere near ready to adopt the currency;

The "only" obstacle in pre-covid Czech Republic was lack of public support (polls show 60-80% of population oppose adoption of Euro) and no political will accross the political spectrum.
Now it's also inflation and the previous government's "southern" spending habits. The new center-right government has no plans regarding euro adoption nor
to set any target dates for ERM2.

Braybuddy · Mon Jan 03, 2022 2:33 pm

petertenthije wrote:
It would be nice to see some better designs though. The current euro designs are quite bland, in particular the notes.

I tend to agree, but IIRC the winning designs were chosen by a committee made up of the EU central banks, so it's probably not surprising :roll:

. It wouldn't cost anything to change them: there are dozens alternative designs and another set could have been used when the notes were changed a few years ago. Maybe the next time, though I won't be holding my breath. I particularly liked the designs by Hannu Järviö and Karin Mörck-Hamilton:

https://www.ecb.europa.eu/pub/pdf/other ... ogueen.pdf

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