GDB wrote:cpd wrote:TheSonntag wrote:Aren't the Polish Mig-29s ex-Luftwaffe ones and therefore they would need German government approval to send them to the Ukraine.
Some are, not all though.
Which are ex-Soviet, so how far back along the line do you go with this government approval needed?
Just deliver them if they are needed…
They are ex German, flown from 1990-2003.
Never used operationally such as in Operation Allied Force in 1999, where Germany used air power in action for the first time post WW2, with SEAD Tornado ECR's.
Since though the Mig was seen as very good at lower speed dogfights, the helmet mounted sight and at the time, the IR missile, was better than what the West had.
But not the case with BVR, inferior radar, previous generation fire control, poor displays and situational awareness, these also were export model downgrades in the first place.
Add in poor range, at least prior to Polish use they had non NATO standard IFF and poor nav equipment.
Poland did install NATO standard equipment to allow them to operate longer term, the above though should demonstrate that against the one overmatch besides sheer numbers that Russia has, is their long and longer ranged radars and AAM's from upgraded SU-27's and Mig-31's respectively, if anyone thinks that more Mig 29's are the answer, they are not.
Maybe that has been a consideration in supplying Ukraine with them too.
They've integrated HARM, doing so with JDAM, however the basic limitation of the radar and fire control means it's very doubtful you can stick a better BVR AAM on them,
Those Russian types also stay within their airspace, especially for the short ranged Mig-29.
The post reunification German AF's evaluation was that it was good for point defence against major targets, like cities.
I know what the MiGs are, I remember them well. My point was about the "Germany must give permission" stuff, and the irony given where East Germany got the MiGs from in the first place.
Agree also that they are now too old.