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zkojq
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"In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Tue Jun 14, 2022 10:03 am

Tweet from Trumpist former US Ambassador to Denmark, who is now running for congress:

I’ve seen this before. In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car. They have a bike and take the train for long trips. My embassy driver would bike an hour in the snow to get to work. That’s the future team Biden wants for Americans. Is this what you want?


https://twitter.com/CarlaHSands/status/ ... 9246340104

https://www.thelocal.dk/20220610/former ... ing-tweet/

Impressive that she apparently learned so little about the country during her multiple years living there. The reaction is as you'd expect:

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https://twitter.com/MarianneVind/status ... 2941970434

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https://twitter.com/casperpbl/status/15 ... 4226806786

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https://twitter.com/Dalbjerg/status/1535275508363104259

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https://twitter.com/erhanBLC/status/1535406215618088961

and of course it spread beyond Denmark:

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https://twitter.com/KoraGora/status/1536060734429351936

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https://twitter.com/MattBrookes3/status ... 3212261376

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https://twitter.com/docjosiahboone/stat ... 6659955713

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https://twitter.com/LeneWestgaard/statu ... 4797030401

Here in New Zealand, we're so poor that our Vice-Minister of Transport had to cycle to the hospital whilst in labour!

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politi ... our--again

Who else here comes from a really poor country?
 
luckyone
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Tue Jun 14, 2022 10:57 am

Who doesn’t love satire.
 
Jalap
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Tue Jun 14, 2022 11:06 am

It is well known Belgians can't afford to have a decent fast food meal, often having nothing more than fries with some salt and mayonnaise. Hamburgers, that we cannot afford.
This extends to the royal family, they pretend to be happy with nothing but fries, even on our national holiday...

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It is so depressing this is a common sight in Belgium. Long lines to get fries, no customers for proper fast food :(

Image
 
ltbewr
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Tue Jun 14, 2022 11:21 am

Most of Europe, Japan and other countries have had polices to limit the numbers of vehicles and use on the road since WW II to keep money in the countries for rebuilding and continued to keep a better quality of life. If have a car, it will only be 1, usually a fuel efficient small car or SUV. They also offer very good mass transit, most people live close to their jobs or schools and as most cities and towns were never designed for cars, keeps good order. Their quality life including their health is likely better from using bicycles, walking and mass transit.

What is also interesting is that their political leaders, including royals, can be in public with minimal or no security unlike the UK, USA, sadly due to risks of violence on them..

And the McD's french fries are garbage next to local 'frites' in Belgium.
Last edited by ltbewr on Tue Jun 14, 2022 11:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
Kent350787
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Tue Jun 14, 2022 11:24 am

Australia is so poor our new prime minister had to cycle to meet the Indonesian President - and the bike is made from bamboo! https://twitter.com/albomp/status/1533696174003134464?s=21&t=zM_61irTA5zkZ_6hwO0WgQ
 
JJJ
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Tue Jun 14, 2022 11:41 am

zkojq wrote:
bike an hour in the snow


I found Copenhagen in winter much more rainy than snowy actually.
 
cpd
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Tue Jun 14, 2022 12:16 pm

I’m not lucky enough to live in Europe full time, but provided it isn’t pouring down (or snowing - I’ve been caught in snow once), I’d take riding a bike over a car any time. It’s more enjoyable and I’m not just sitting around getting unhealthy.

Since I was badly injured (broken neck of femur) in March I cannot do that. I’ll be back into it eventually. I hate life without riding bikes.

Someone who rode for a team I knew packed up and went to Girona permanently. Rides his bike (extremely well) and lives a fairly basic life (compared to here) but is happy with that. It’s tempting.

Here by 35 you should have a huge house, a premium German SUV parked out the front, and be stomping your way up the corporate ladder over everyone else… bah.
 
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zkojq
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Tue Jun 14, 2022 1:06 pm

Spain is so poor they haven't been able to afford to finish this church in more than a hundred years:

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The Netherlands is so poor that the King hosts State Banquets at McDonalds:

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The King himself is so poor that he has to get a part time job at KLM:

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https://twitter.com/KLM/status/864782520897998848

And the Prime Minister of the Netherlands is so poor that he has to go and visit the King by Bicycle - and has to lock it so that one of the Royal kids doesn't steal it:

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In Spain the King is so poor he has to go hunting to feed his family:

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France's president is so poor that he was forced to find himself a Sugar-Momma to help make ends meet:

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France's old president was so poor that he couldn't afford to pay his fare on the metro:

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Germany is so poor that the ex-Chancellor has to buy cheap, screw-cap wine. Like a peasant!

Image

ltbewr wrote:
Most of Europe, Japan and other countries have had polices to limit the numbers of vehicles and use on the road since WW II to keep money in the countries for rebuilding and continued to keep a better quality of life. If have a car, it will only be 1, usually a fuel efficient small car or SUV. They also offer very good mass transit, most people live close to their jobs or schools and as most cities and towns were never designed for cars, keeps good order. Their quality life including their health is likely better from using bicycles, walking and mass transit.


Denmark actually has higher car ownership per capita than the US. Yet still spends substantially less - per capita - on transport.

https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/documents ... 6838187622

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FU8uVEOWIAA ... name=large

ltbewr wrote:
What is also interesting is that their political leaders, including royals, can be in public with minimal or no security unlike the UK, USA, sadly due to risks of violence on them..


Benefits of not being drowned in guns. :)
 
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Kiwirob
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Tue Jun 14, 2022 1:31 pm

zkojq wrote:

Denmark actually has higher car ownership per capita than the US. Yet still spends substantially less - per capita - on transport.



No Denmark does not have a higher rate of vehicle ownership than the US. It doesn't have a higher rate than wealthier Norway or poorer New Zealand.

Denmark 455 vehicles per 1000 people
Norway 522 vehicles per 1000 people
USA 812 vehicles per 1000 people
New Zealand 837 vehicles per 1000 people

https://www.wikiwand.com/en/List_of_cou ... per_capita

When I lived at home with my parents we all had a car, 4 people 4 cars, this is almost unheard of in Scandinavia. Denmark is home to some of the most expensive vehicles in the world due to extreme taxation, so yes I actually agree with your post, a lot of lower middle class people in Denmark won't have a car.
 
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Mortyman
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Tue Jun 14, 2022 1:31 pm

In Norway we are so poor, that we force former US vice presidents and lady to take the airport train into the city ...

Image

Image

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Luckily we are nice enough to give a consolation prize in the form of a bouquet of flowers ...

Image
 
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Kiwirob
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Tue Jun 14, 2022 1:35 pm

Mortyman wrote:
In Norway we are so poor, that we force former US vice presidents and lady to take the airport train into the city ...

Image

Image

Image


Luckily we are nice enough to give a consolation prize in the form of a bouquet of flowers ...

Image


The train is 21 minutes a car is 3 times longer.
 
Jalap
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Tue Jun 14, 2022 2:34 pm

zkojq wrote:
My embassy driver would bike an hour in the snow to get to work.

He has little reason to complain, look at these Polish middle class commuters:

Image
 
phugoid1982
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Tue Jun 14, 2022 3:12 pm

What utter stupidity. Maybe because Europeans bike more and don't add that second slice of bread is why they are so much thinner than the average American here who is overweight/borderline obese. I do low carb/KETO and only on a cheat day would I even consider adding even a slice of bread. Two would've have to special occasion. My best friend lives in Stockholm and says after moving to Europe said it's virtually impossible to find an overweight woman or man. There is a fair amount of fat shaming apparently over there as opposed to Body Positivity nonsense spewed here in the US that is only making people unhealthier. Exercise more fat, far less refined carbs and sugar, and that will keep you thin and healthy for years to come.
 
zhiao
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Tue Jun 14, 2022 3:52 pm

I am willing to bet Europeans eat way more bread, actually. The low carb BS is more of an American thing. And yes it's BS, because you can't eat much fruit, no carrots, no beets, no squashes, potatoes, no whole grains, etc. Lots of fiber and vitamins are missed because people are essentially eating animal fat and protein all day. LDL cholesterol skyrockets and unless you are taking in foods that are high in HDL you are screwed. A quick look at foods that lower bad cholesterol show that most are not Keto.

As a prime example, look at the countries with the lowest obesity rates (that aren't low due to hunger). The Japanese and Koreans eat RICE with literally EVERY meal. Europeans are way closer to American levels of obesity than to Japanese. Most European countries are in the low to mid 20% range. USA is at 36%. Japan 4%
 
LabQuest
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Tue Jun 14, 2022 3:54 pm

phugoid1982 wrote:
What utter stupidity. Maybe because Europeans bike more and don't add that second slice of bread is why they are so much thinner than the average American here who is overweight/borderline obese. I do low carb/KETO and only on a cheat day would I even consider adding even a slice of bread. Two would've have to special occasion. My best friend lives in Stockholm and says after moving to Europe said it's virtually impossible to find an overweight woman or man. There is a fair amount of fat shaming apparently over there as opposed to Body Positivity nonsense spewed here in the US that is only making people unhealthier. Exercise more fat, far less refined carbs and sugar, and that will keep you thin and healthy for years to come.


Sir this is a Wendys.
 
phugoid1982
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Tue Jun 14, 2022 4:10 pm

zhiao wrote:
I am willing to bet Europeans eat way more bread, actually. The low carb BS is more of an American thing. And yes it's BS, because you can't eat much fruit, no carrots, no beets, no squashes, potatoes, no whole grains, etc. Lots of fiber and vitamins are missed because people are essentially eating animal fat and protein all day. LDL cholesterol skyrockets and unless you are taking in foods that are high in HDL you are screwed. A quick look at foods that lower bad cholesterol show that most are not Keto.

As a prime example, look at the countries with the lowest obesity rates (that aren't low due to hunger). The Japanese and Koreans eat RICE with literally EVERY meal. Europeans are way closer to American levels of obesity than to Japanese. Most European countries are in the low to mid 20% range. USA is at 36%. Japan 4%


So this a good point too. However, I'm genetically Indian and many of my family members are diabetic. Indians eat a lot of rice and still are the diabetic capital of the world. Indians are super prone to diabetes and metabolic syndrome at lower weights. I suspects years of vegetarianism is the culprit as well as having much more fat "the dad bod" around the abdominal organs. My mom is super thin and vegetarian and still has high cholesterol and diabetes. When I was eating more of a traditional diet, by my late 20's, even with exercise I already had stroke-level high cholesterol, T2 diabetes and super high BP. I was165 lbs then and 5'10 so I doubt you could call me overweight. My LDL was higher than many people's normal cholesterol level. Docs just put me on me meds and blamed "Genetics". I decided to give KETO a try in my mid 30s and it literally boosted my HDL to 80 and LDL rock bottom low and my BP is normal without medication. I still take meds for diabetes but only half what I took before which already was the minimum dosage so all in all It's good for me. I will admit, I don't overload on saturated fat, so I will eat far more lean meat but I 'm not afraid of adding garlic butter to it to make it tastier. But yeah, I eat a ton of vegetables. I absolutely agree you need the fiber. Your stomach will thank you. I could never do the so called carnivore diet. I can't profess to be some expert but It's worked for me and is keeping alive so I'd rather do this than take pills and worry about long term side effects...
 
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SQ22
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Tue Jun 14, 2022 4:31 pm

A friendly reminder to provide a link to your source when posting any kind of image unless they are clearly marked as your own ones. Thanks.
 
Bricktop
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Tue Jun 14, 2022 5:26 pm

Mortyman wrote:
In Norway we are so poor, that we force former US vice presidents and lady to take the airport train into the city ...

420 NOK or $42 round trip. It's an excellent service but not cheap, especially compared to CPH where you can get downtown from the airport for much less, because it's a part of the subway system,
not a dedicated express. Same for the Arlanda Express.

I avoid Oslo at all costs because their airport security or passport control has hassled either me or my wife every single time we went through. They make TSA look like white glove service. Great city, but I won't be back. If I fly SAS I will use ARN or CPH. I do love my Norway bobble hat and woolen gloves though.
 
af773atmsp
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Tue Jun 14, 2022 6:15 pm

Biden wants to make biking easier in America so we're not overly dependent on cars and gasoline? Well, sign me up!

Every American should visit a Scandinavian country at least once. It's a breath of fresh air being able to bike or even just walk to places like the grocery store. Meanwhile in America we think a 20-minute drive is short.
 
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Kiwirob
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Tue Jun 14, 2022 6:32 pm

Bricktop wrote:
Mortyman wrote:
In Norway we are so poor, that we force former US vice presidents and lady to take the airport train into the city ...

420 NOK or $42 round trip. It's an excellent service but not cheap, especially compared to CPH where you can get downtown from the airport for much less, because it's a part of the subway system,
not a dedicated express. Same for the Arlanda Express.

I avoid Oslo at all costs because their airport security or passport control has hassled either me or my wife every single time we went through. They make TSA look like white glove service. Great city, but I won't be back. If I fly SAS I will use ARN or CPH. I do love my Norway bobble hat and woolen gloves though.


There’s also the local train, it’s 114 NOK and takes 23 minutes. Unless the company is paying I’m happy paying less for a 3/4 minute longer trip.

You must look dodgy security at OSL is a breeze, LHR used to be annoying but now Kiwis have access to the electronic gates it’s also really easy, Aberdeen on the other hand is a real pain in the arse.
 
Bricktop
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Tue Jun 14, 2022 6:53 pm

af773atmsp wrote:
Biden wants to make biking easier in America so we're not overly dependent on cars and gasoline? Well, sign me up!

Every American should visit a Scandinavian country at least once. It's a breath of fresh air being able to bike or even just walk to places like the grocery store. Meanwhile in America we think a 20-minute drive is short.

I could not agree more. In the last few years we have been to Norway, Sweden and Denmark, and apart from the OSL airport crap each of them have been AWESOME. Super clean and friendly and they speak excellent English (at least the areas we went). They were fairly expensive, but so is Paris, London or NY. SAS is a decent airline and they have cheap flights from the US to Scandinavia. As for biking, when we were last in Copenhagen we walked from our hotel in Christianshavn to breakfast over by Amalienborg and marveled at the peletons of cyclists on their way to work. Very competitive, it struck me.
 
GalaxyFlyer
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Wed Jun 15, 2022 1:20 am

That Spanish Royal might have to hunt to feed his family, but he does it with a $100,000 double rifle
 
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c933103
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Thu Jun 16, 2022 2:04 am

ltbewr wrote:
Most of Europe, Japan and other countries have had polices to limit the numbers of vehicles and use on the road since WW II to keep money in the countries for rebuilding and continued to keep a better quality of life. If have a car, it will only be 1, usually a fuel efficient small car or SUV.

I do not recall any policies like this happened in Japan, South Korea, Taiwan.
They also offer very good mass transit, most people live close to their jobs or schools and as most cities and towns were never designed for cars, keeps good order. Their quality life including their health is likely better from using bicycles, walking and mass transit.

Fantasy won't help solving transit issue in America.
Even in Japan, South Korea, and Taiwan, essentially only Tokyo Osaka, Seoul and Taipei have a really attractive transit network that can win over traffic share of automobiles. Cities that are still large but smaller than those, like Nagoya, Fukuoka, Sendai, Kaohsiung, are already rather significantly car centric (despite still an order of magnitude better than usual American cities), not to mention other even smaller cities and counties.
And commute in these cities are also not short distance in general. There are nearby employment opportunities in communities but they won't be enough to absorb any significant percentage of population, not to mention jobs of specific expertise are usually clustered within specific parts of a city and thus long distance commuting are needed.
 
johns624
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Thu Jun 16, 2022 3:07 pm

Bricktop wrote:
Mortyman wrote:
In Norway we are so poor, that we force former US vice presidents and lady to take the airport train into the city ...

420 NOK or $42 round trip. It's an excellent service but not cheap, especially compared to CPH where you can get downtown from the airport for much less, because it's a part of the subway system,
not a dedicated express. Same for the Arlanda Express.

I avoid Oslo at all costs because their airport security or passport control has hassled either me or my wife every single time we went through. They make TSA look like white glove service. Great city, but I won't be back. If I fly SAS I will use ARN or CPH. I do love my Norway bobble hat and woolen gloves though.
My wife and I normally stay at the airport hotel in CPH due to the metro into the city being so convenient and cheap. We just get a couple day pass. We normally get off at Kongens Nytorv and just walk the pedestrian streets.
 
sierrakilo44
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Sat Jun 18, 2022 12:23 pm

The automobile is a double edged sword.

Sure it has increased mobility but who really wants to be stuck in a freeway traffic jam every morning to get to work?

And cars are getting bigger. Now everyone has to have a massive SUV even though they mostly drive it alone.

Ideally a car would be for fun and freedom. I’d like just a small car, maybe an Abarth Spider, a Mazda MX-5 or a Toyota 86. It would be for freewheeling and touring on quiet back country roads, cruising up and down hills and exploring the countryside where you can actually drive it for fun.

In the city and getting between cities I’m more than happy to use clean, efficient and frequent high speed rail. And ultimately instead of packing a massive SUV full of groceries from a massive shopping mall then fighting traffic to return to a cookie cutter suburb miles away from anywhere, I’d love to live in a village style high density urban area, where there are independent grocers and markets, and pedestrian and bike friendly streets are filled with resident enjoying cafes, restaurants and outdoor green spaces.
 
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Dutchy
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Sat Jun 18, 2022 1:03 pm

zkojq wrote:
Tweet from Trumpist former US Ambassador to Denmark, who is now running for congress:


Yeah, some American politicians are quite ignorant about other countries, on purpose or for electorial purposes. The hole "America is the greatest country on earth"-thing. Selling something which is not the case is kind of difficult.

Twitter is kind of funny though.
 
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TWA772LR
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Sat Jun 18, 2022 5:33 pm

sierrakilo44 wrote:
The automobile is a double edged sword.

Sure it has increased mobility but who really wants to be stuck in a freeway traffic jam every morning to get to work?

And cars are getting bigger. Now everyone has to have a massive SUV even though they mostly drive it alone.

Ideally a car would be for fun and freedom. I’d like just a small car, maybe an Abarth Spider, a Mazda MX-5 or a Toyota 86. It would be for freewheeling and touring on quiet back country roads, cruising up and down hills and exploring the countryside where you can actually drive it for fun.

In the city and getting between cities I’m more than happy to use clean, efficient and frequent high speed rail. And ultimately instead of packing a massive SUV full of groceries from a massive shopping mall then fighting traffic to return to a cookie cutter suburb miles away from anywhere, I’d love to live in a village style high density urban area, where there are independent grocers and markets, and pedestrian and bike friendly streets are filled with resident enjoying cafes, restaurants and outdoor green spaces.

Funny you mention that, if/when I move back to Texas, I'd love to have even a Miada just for some middle of nowhere cruising.
 
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Dutchy
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Mon Jun 20, 2022 9:29 am

sierrakilo44 wrote:
The automobile is a double edged sword.

Sure it has increased mobility but who really wants to be stuck in a freeway traffic jam every morning to get to work?

And cars are getting bigger. Now everyone has to have a massive SUV even though they mostly drive it alone.

Ideally a car would be for fun and freedom. I’d like just a small car, maybe an Abarth Spider, a Mazda MX-5 or a Toyota 86. It would be for freewheeling and touring on quiet back country roads, cruising up and down hills and exploring the countryside where you can actually drive it for fun.

In the city and getting between cities I’m more than happy to use clean, efficient and frequent high speed rail. And ultimately instead of packing a massive SUV full of groceries from a massive shopping mall then fighting traffic to return to a cookie cutter suburb miles away from anywhere, I’d love to live in a village style high density urban area, where there are independent grocers and markets, and pedestrian and bike friendly streets are filled with resident enjoying cafes, restaurants and outdoor green spaces.


The 15-minute concept for a city. Normal everyday life should be facilitated within a 15-minute radius. The discussion if you could own a car or not, is not the right one. It should be a choice if you want to own a car or not, it should not be a necessity. The way cities in the US are set up, means you need to own a car, which is not good for an number of reasons: health, enviourment, climate, public finances etc,
 
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WildcatYXU
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Mon Jun 20, 2022 1:07 pm

Dutchy wrote:
The 15-minute concept for a city. Normal everyday life should be facilitated within a 15-minute radius. The discussion if you could own a car or not, is not the right one. It should be a choice if you want to own a car or not, it should not be a necessity. The way cities in the US are set up, means you need to own a car, which is not good for an number of reasons: health, enviourment, climate, public finances etc,


Is is 15 minutes of walking distance? That would be beautiful, but having jobs for both parents and schools for kids (and kids grow, so requirements are changing over time) is virtually impossible.
I past I tried something similar. When I got the job at Inbev and we moved because of it to YXU, we picked a house that wasn't too far from the brewery. By car it was a 7 to 10 minute commute. Fast forward: got fired from Inbev. Now I work for a company located 150 km away. But my workplace location varies. The closest so far was 100km, currently I'm on a site 3000km away.
 
bpatus297
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Tue Jun 21, 2022 12:33 pm

TWA772LR wrote:
sierrakilo44 wrote:
The automobile is a double edged sword.

Sure it has increased mobility but who really wants to be stuck in a freeway traffic jam every morning to get to work?

And cars are getting bigger. Now everyone has to have a massive SUV even though they mostly drive it alone.

Ideally a car would be for fun and freedom. I’d like just a small car, maybe an Abarth Spider, a Mazda MX-5 or a Toyota 86. It would be for freewheeling and touring on quiet back country roads, cruising up and down hills and exploring the countryside where you can actually drive it for fun.

In the city and getting between cities I’m more than happy to use clean, efficient and frequent high speed rail. And ultimately instead of packing a massive SUV full of groceries from a massive shopping mall then fighting traffic to return to a cookie cutter suburb miles away from anywhere, I’d love to live in a village style high density urban area, where there are independent grocers and markets, and pedestrian and bike friendly streets are filled with resident enjoying cafes, restaurants and outdoor green spaces.

Funny you mention that, if/when I move back to Texas, I'd love to have even a Miada just for some middle of nowhere cruising.


They are a nice cheaper convertible.
 
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Dutchy
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Tue Jun 21, 2022 5:32 pm

WildcatYXU wrote:
Dutchy wrote:
The 15-minute concept for a city. Normal everyday life should be facilitated within a 15-minute radius. The discussion if you could own a car or not, is not the right one. It should be a choice if you want to own a car or not, it should not be a necessity. The way cities in the US are set up, means you need to own a car, which is not good for an number of reasons: health, enviourment, climate, public finances etc,


Is is 15 minutes of walking distance? That would be beautiful, but having jobs for both parents and schools for kids (and kids grow, so requirements are changing over time) is virtually impossible.
I past I tried something similar. When I got the job at Inbev and we moved because of it to YXU, we picked a house that wasn't too far from the brewery. By car it was a 7 to 10 minute commute. Fast forward: got fired from Inbev. Now I work for a company located 150 km away. But my workplace location varies. The closest so far was 100km, currently I'm on a site 3000km away.


For more info: link. It is not a new concept, it is a way of thinking for urban planners. Mobility itself can be lowered by good city planning.
 
LCDFlight
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Re: "In Denmark, middle class people can’t afford to drive a car"

Sun Jun 26, 2022 1:19 pm

sierrakilo44 wrote:
The automobile is a double edged sword.

Sure it has increased mobility but who really wants to be stuck in a freeway traffic jam every morning to get to work?

And cars are getting bigger. Now everyone has to have a massive SUV even though they mostly drive it alone.

Ideally a car would be for fun and freedom. I’d like just a small car, maybe an Abarth Spider, a Mazda MX-5 or a Toyota 86. It would be for freewheeling and touring on quiet back country roads, cruising up and down hills and exploring the countryside where you can actually drive it for fun.

In the city and getting between cities I’m more than happy to use clean, efficient and frequent high speed rail. And ultimately instead of packing a massive SUV full of groceries from a massive shopping mall then fighting traffic to return to a cookie cutter suburb miles away from anywhere, I’d love to live in a village style high density urban area, where there are independent grocers and markets, and pedestrian and bike friendly streets are filled with resident enjoying cafes, restaurants and outdoor green spaces.


Lol at “I’d be more than happy to use clean, efficient and frequent high speed rail.” And i would be more than happy to reach peak physical fitness by eating pizza. It is fun to have illogical dreams like this.

Cars work fairly well, and their efficiency is climbing. Aircraft are more efficient than ever, and currently exceed rail efficiency in the US in passenger miles per gallon.

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