luckyone wrote:

I also thought that was a bit presumptuous given the circumstances. Just...damn though the way that these hyenas are cackling.

Yep, presumption to the 100th degree. Isn't that sort of trespassing or squatting?

Harkeem Jeffries almost has more right to shelf space in that office right now

NIKV69 wrote:

Got to give Jim Jordan credit he is acting like an adult.

That's just it...'acting', he can actual act mature.

But him some 'power' and watch the 'ol familiar 'outta control poop-throwing screaming caged chimp' come to life...

McCarthy, looking like a complete fool today as his Trump Servitude came and swallowed him whole with Trump side-stepping all associations with McCarthy out as more 'Loser Stink' appears to be hovering above him (No question McCarthy was blowing up Trump's phone all day long - to no end)...

Indeed this shadenfruende is sooooooo tasty to watch this mayhem unfold, the Trump Effect...meeting the demise as everything he's touched in his life - crashing and burning frame by frame...

2023 starting off with a kick more interresting than if Dems had retained control as they did the Senate.

This is good stuff...


BN747

flyguy89 wrote:

This is spectacular. It’s amazing what a basket case Trump has made of the GOP. Truly the inmates running the asylum. I wish I could revel more in the schadenfreude of McCarthy and the utter ineptitude of the Trumpists, but it’s truly unfortunate to see the unraveling of anything resembling an effective opposition to the Democrats.

This happened long before Trump. This started in the 90's with Gingrich and has only gotten worse since. The swamp is there, its just is attracting bigger bugs

A decade ago the GOP has the chance under John Boehner to get a lot of legislation passed with Obama who IMO negotiated way to far to the right. The Freedom Caucus then stonewalled very centrist legislation.

McCarthy should withdraw and his concession speech should be this. Let the GOP dogs fight it out.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yi0uX2sZuFg

I am not sure how accurate this is but a progressive talk show host said that if the MAGA caucus simply votes "present" the threshold for a majority becomes lower and lower and could possibly see Hakeem Jeffries elected Speaker, if only for a day or two. That would be hilarious.

seb146 wrote:

I am not sure how accurate this is but a progressive talk show host said that if the MAGA caucus simply votes "present" the threshold for a majority becomes lower and lower and could possibly see Hakeem Jeffries elected Speaker, if only for a day or two. That would be hilarious.

I could see a few moderate republicans losing their mind and voting for Jeffries just to end this.

The whiny, foot stomping, meltdown and lashing out at Gaetz and Boebert by Margey T. Green has been a delightful element of all this - she is learning that being a loathsome empty vessel of little redeeming value beyond being a sycophant for a failed one-term President will only take you so far. Quell surprise!

In all seriousness, as amusing as it is to watch the GOP try and plan their way out of a wet paper bag - and struggle - it is sad given the importance and dignity that the Congress should command. The American people deserve better than the zero-sum game, race to the bottom, style politics that Trump perpetuated and the GOP all too gleefully fell in line behind.

So what do we do? Just don't have a House? That will work until the budget runs out.

skyservice_330 wrote:

The whiny, foot stomping, meltdown and lashing out at Gaetz and Boebert by Margey T. Green has been a delightful element of all this - she is learning that being a loathsome empty vessel of little redeeming value beyond being a sycophant for a failed one-term President will only take you so far. Quell surprise!

In all seriousness, as amusing as it is to watch the GOP try and plan their way out of a wet paper bag - and struggle - it is sad given the importance and dignity that the Congress should command. The American people deserve better than the zero-sum game, race to the bottom, style politics that Trump perpetuated and the GOP all too gleefully fell in line behind.

Ole' Marge has ambitions, she's just not very bright -- she bailed on her hard right clowns at the first opportunity. Lucky for her she's in a safe district and is clearly trying to parlay that into something bigger in the House -- she probably full well knows she would never win a statewide election in Georgia. Fun fact, my cousins went to the same high school she did.

I remember 2 months ago when there's an idea floating around about Liz Cheney being backed by all Dems and small percentages of Moderate Republicans to became the leader.

Now that would be a turn of an event.

A turn indeed.

Though I suspect her efforts on the Jan 6. committee and willingness to stand up for the rule of law and decency in the face of insurrection would put her offside of the obedience required of the MAGA wing of the party and the expectation to stand up for the Don and kiss the ring. She has questioned and challenged his actions and wisdom, which seems to be a big no-no

McCarthy goes down for the 4th time. His backers wanted to defer the vote, but don't have the votes for that either.

This happened even with Trump speaking out in McCarthy's favor. The Freedom Caucus and rebels are going to continue blackmailing the House and the nation.

Avatar2go wrote:

McCarthy goes down for the 4th time. His backers wanted to defer the vote, but don't have the votes for that either.

This happened even with Trump speaking out in McCarthy's favor. The Freedom Caucus and rebels are going to continue blackmailing the House and the nation.

The zany part of this is how those "rebels" are playing whack-a-mole with their votes. Losing any credibility that they can be worked with -- which his fine with them at least for now. How long until a few potentially retiring GOP reps see this pattern and say "f*** it," and throw their vote over to Jeffries. Likelihood? Low. But if these goons can't even coalesce around a single goal then it becomes more likely.

luckyone wrote:

The zany part of this is how those "rebels" are playing whack-a-mole with their votes. Losing any credibility that they can be worked with -- which his fine with them at least for now. How long until a few potentially retiring GOP reps see this pattern and say "f*** it," and throw their vote over to Jeffries. Likelihood? Low. But if these goons can't even coalesce around a single goal then it becomes more likely.

That's another interesting aspect of this. In less contentious times, there would be attempts to reach across the aisle, to either find Dems who would support McCarthy against the rebels, or find GOP who would support Jeffries against the rebels. In the current environment, neither is even on the table.

Also in the 4th attempt, the vote was exactly the same as in the 3rd ballot, the same 20 people voting against McCarthy. Hard to see what the path forward is for the GOP.

Even if McCarthy withdraws, it's not clear that there is any other GOP candidate that could win. Quite the mess.

Avatar2go wrote:

Also in the 4th attempt, the vote was exactly the same as in the 3rd ballot, the same 20 people voting against McCarthy. Hard to see what the path forward is for the GOP.

Even if McCarthy withdraws, it's not clear that there is any other GOP candidate that could win. Quite the mess.

Those 20 want capitulation, "my way or the highway", childlike tantrum "until my mommy and daddy give me what I want, and I want a pony!".

We'll see what happens and if the Republican's can control anything. And people mock the Dems for not controlling their own people or accuse them of being controlled by a few extreme people in the party.

Lame. That is what they have made their future Speaker (whoever it is) which is exactly what a Speaker can't afford to be.

Tugg

One might describe this entire debacle as a deplorable abdication of orderly governing and service of the people by the GOP, but I remembered we aren't allowed to use the d-word because of MAGA feels.. my bad.

The only question remain then. Would McCarthy follow the demand from the Far-Right wing on their party now?

Avatar2go wrote:

Also in the 4th attempt, the vote was exactly the same as in the 3rd ballot, the same 20 people voting against McCarthy. Hard to see what the path forward is for the GOP.

Even if McCarthy withdraws, it's not clear that there is any other GOP candidate that could win. Quite the mess.

Guess they don't care what Trump has to say.

ewt340 wrote:

The only question remain then. Would McCarthy follow the demand from the Far-Right wing on their party now?

There's nothing else he can give.

DocLightning wrote:

So what do we do? Just don't have a House? That will work until the budget runs out.

One of the major news websites has "Congress paralyzed as vote marathon continues". My flippant first thought was "what's the problem with that?" But yes, at some point the adults in the room* have to put together a budget so the government can pay its bills.

*Assuming there are still some adults in the room at this point.

luckyone wrote:

Guess they don't care what Trump has to say.

It's the common outcome when unprincipled people band together and use each other for a mutual interest. Trump thought he controlled the MAGA's, but is finding out that they controlled him just as much. Deals with the devil never work out.

skyservice_330 wrote:

In all seriousness, as amusing as it is to watch the GOP try and plan their way out of a wet paper bag - and struggle - it is sad given the importance and dignity that the Congress should command. The American people deserve better than the zero-sum game, race to the bottom, style politics that Trump perpetuated and the GOP all too gleefully fell in line behind.

Going to get flamed by many Americans for this but yes they do deserve this, just like we deserve Trudeau. Perhaps not all 330 million of them do but the fact that the functioning of the house of representatives can be held up by 20 people is laughable.

Every country deserves who they elect because its a reflection at that time of your nation as an aggregate.

luckyone wrote:

ewt340 wrote:

The only question remain then. Would McCarthy follow the demand from the Far-Right wing on their party now?

There's nothing else he can give.

He Has to bow out and let the anarchy begin. Let the inmates run the asylum.

Why isn't there a runoff?

Just watching an interview with Donalds. Pretty funny, he said of course he voted for himself, it was totally cool! But he has no desire to be Speaker. He sees it as drama that will eventually be worked out.

Now there have been 5 - FIVE - votes held and McCarthy has still lost. At what point should McCarthy just say "screw it, I am withdrawing my bid", maybe even resign from the House to get away from the insanity. He seems to be about as wanted as the latest variant of Covid-19 and even if won by 1 vote would be basically neutered anyway.

As a decorated WWII pilot, Nobel Peace Prize winner and author of 3 bestsellers, I really am surprised the GOP hasn't opted to put George Santos forward as speaker yet

Someone better do something this is going off the rails.

But, but, but.. Didn’t you say the republicans were the good ones?

NIKV69 wrote:

Someone better do something this is going off the rails.

Wow, will open a popcorn factory today. By the time the election is completed my company will be already as large as Coca Cola …

skyservice_330 wrote:

As a decorated WWII pilot, Nobel Peace Prize winner and author of 3 bestsellers, I really am surprised the GOP hasn't opted to put George Santos forward as speaker yet

Nah ! He's going to chair the Ethics Commitee.

Is anybody running a book on who, if/when somebody is elected, is going to be first to run to court asking for a rerun as the vote was rigged ?

N14AZ wrote:

Wow, will open a popcorn factory today. By the time the election is completed my company will be already as large as Coca Cola …

Sign me up for a shipment!

ltbewr wrote:

Now there have been 5 - FIVE - votes held and McCarthy has still lost. At what point should McCarthy just say "screw it, I am withdrawing my bid", maybe even resign from the House to get away from the insanity. He seems to be about as wanted as the latest variant of Covid-19 and even if won by 1 vote would be basically neutered anyway.

Thing is, if McCarthy withdraws his bid, who would be electable? Who among the other GOP representatives could garner enough votes? It's a s***storm for sure

Again, why do we give these clowns money and power? Idiots all.

GalaxyFlyer wrote:

Again, why do we give these clowns money and power? Idiots all.

I thought you wanted a Congress that refused to ever do anything.

I feel like this may be the final throes of the movement that advocates insurrection over negotiation and compromise. It has never been a good look. Not on Jan 6 and not today.

The question is, will the Republicans acknowledge this and deal with it within their party, or will they continue to defend it, while desperately trying to work around it?

And if it's the latter, how can the Republicans govern themselves over the next two years? It seems like this is just a preview of what is to come.

Some are describing it as the "Trump hangover", which I think is pretty accurate.

Newark727 wrote:

GalaxyFlyer wrote:

Again, why do we give these clowns money and power? Idiots all.

I thought you wanted a Congress that refused to ever do anything.

They’ve already done too much—repeal should be the order of Congress.

SIX votes and still no majority for Speaker. The Republicans are on the road to perdition, with the nut case extremists driving. At some point Republican Senators, Governors and party leaders must find some way to extort the extremists to back off their blocking the vote for speaker.

GalaxyFlyer wrote:

Again, why do we give these clowns money and power? Idiots all.

You get the politicians you vote for.

scbriml wrote:

GalaxyFlyer wrote:

Again, why do we give these clowns money and power? Idiots all.

You get the politicians you vote for.

I don’t vote, it only encourages the bar stewards.

GalaxyFlyer wrote:

scbriml wrote:

GalaxyFlyer wrote:

Again, why do we give these clowns money and power? Idiots all.

You get the politicians you vote for.

I don’t vote, it only encourages the bar stewards.

Your two Trump votes beg the differ...


McCarthy, souless meekest man to ever lead a major party, sucked Trump ass harder than Sessions, Priebus, YE-Dumbass, the entire parade of leeches...and who has not learned a lesson from the consequences and cost of Trump Suckage? Following an innately weak man always leads to failure.


BN747

GalaxyFlyer wrote:

Newark727 wrote:

GalaxyFlyer wrote:

Again, why do we give these clowns money and power? Idiots all.

I thought you wanted a Congress that refused to ever do anything.

They’ve already done too much—repeal should be the order of Congress.

I can't help but notice the way you bust out this whole "woe is us, all politicians are clowns, Congress is useless" schtick when Republicans look bad. When Democrats screw up, you're perfectly willing to blame specific people, policies, and factions.

GalaxyFlyer wrote:

scbriml wrote:

GalaxyFlyer wrote:

Again, why do we give these clowns money and power? Idiots all.

You get the politicians you vote for.

I don’t vote, it only encourages the bar stewards.

In which case your opinion literally counts for nothing. Got it.

skyservice_330 wrote:

One might describe this entire debacle as a deplorable abdication of orderly governing and service of the people by the GOP, but I remembered we aren't allowed to use the d-word because of MAGA feels.. my bad.

From outside the USA it really does seems that the two party system in the US currently has the Democrats and the anti-democratic party...

The only way out of the mire is for level heads to move back to negotiation and compromise. The Dems have already shown they can do this to advance legislation, but at the moment it must be fun watching the GoP smahing itself apart and just sitting back and saying "sucks to be you" to McCarthy etal.

luckyone wrote:

Well now it's getting interesting. The "boss man" is calling for all Republicans to fall in line behind McCarthy. Let's see how much clout he has with his drones. Or it could've been he enjoyed the chaos just as much as anybody else, and wants to be seen as a savior and unifier.

https://thehill.com/homenews/house/3797 ... -mccarthy/

And that makes Bobble Head Boebert an out and out liar. On the Congressional record. Have they no shame?

GalaxyFlyer wrote:

scbriml wrote:

GalaxyFlyer wrote:

Again, why do we give these clowns money and power? Idiots all.

You get the politicians you vote for.

I don’t vote, it only encourages the bar stewards.

Wow... I actually respect you and many of the posts you make, but this... this i do not respect. Not that you should care about some anonymous internet poster, still... dude, come on.

Tugg

Not so long ago people were squawking about Sen. Sinema and Sen. Manchin holding the Senate hostage. Now people, some of them the very same people, are squawking about Gaetz, Bobo & Co. holding the House hostage.

Well, like them or loathe them, of course they are. If you’re in politics and you have leverage then no one should be surprised if you use it.

Had McCarthy ridden the red wave he expected to ride he’d have had plenty of votes and wouldn’t be in this position.

The ironic thing is, the reason the red wave didn’t happen is because lots of voters were tired of the far right agenda and antics, which resulted in these members having outsized leverage. Unfortunately for them, by forcing McCarthy or whomever eventually gets elected Speaker to concede to their demands they will pull the entire party even further down the path that those lots of voters rejected last time.

So they may win the current battle only to lose the bigger war in two years at the next election.

StarAC17 wrote:

flyguy89 wrote:

This is spectacular. It’s amazing what a basket case Trump has made of the GOP. Truly the inmates running the asylum. I wish I could revel more in the schadenfreude of McCarthy and the utter ineptitude of the Trumpists, but it’s truly unfortunate to see the unraveling of anything resembling an effective opposition to the Democrats.

This happened long before Trump. This started in the 90's with Gingrich and has only gotten worse since. The swamp is there, its just is attracting bigger bugs

A decade ago the GOP has the chance under John Boehner to get a lot of legislation passed with Obama who IMO negotiated way to far to the right. The Freedom Caucus then stonewalled very centrist legislation.

McCarthy should withdraw and his concession speech should be this. Let the GOP dogs fight it out.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yi0uX2sZuFg

Don’t know that I particularly agree with your timeline, but either way, delicious to watch them struggle pitifully with the Frankenstein they’ve created. I think McCarthy eventually gets it, but at the expense of becoming one of the weakest Speakers in recent history.

It’s unfortunate however that that in this whole circus, there are some pretty grounded criticisms of the Speakership (under both Dems and GOP) that are getting lost. Former GOP Rep. Justin Amash has gone into some fascinating detail about how centralized and un-deliberative the House has become in recent decades under leadership from both parties wherein the rank-and-file is no longer allowed any meaningful input in the crafting of legislation or voting on amendments. These criticisms have also been echoed by many on the Dem side. Highly recommend giving him a listen…if nothing it’s interesting for the granular detail on just the day-to-day functioning of the House.

NIKV69 wrote:

Someone better do something this is going off the rails.

The solution is to wipe them out in elections so the party has no other option but to totally invent itself again.

It’s painful but it might work.

flyguy89 wrote:

It’s unfortunate however that that in this whole circus, there are some pretty grounded criticisms of the Speakership (under both Dems and GOP) that are getting lost. Former GOP Rep. Justin Amash has gone into some fascinating detail about how centralized and un-deliberative the House has become in recent decades under leadership from both parties wherein the rank-and-file is no longer allowed any meaningful input in the crafting of legislation or voting on amendments. These criticisms have also been echoed by many on the Dem side. Highly recommend giving him a listen…if nothing it’s interesting for the granular detail on just the day-to-day functioning of the House.

There are pluses and minuses to that argument. What some call non-deliberative, others call legislative discipline. I can remember members trying to attach everything under the sun, in the form of an amendment, during floor votes. So parties would work to develop consensus, that then would evaporate as amendments were piled on.

Now, that process happens in committee, where it comes up for a vote before it hits the floor. Which means it's difficult to mount a rogue amendment that doesn't have broad support. By design, that limits the kind of stuff the Freedom Caucus wants to add, and favors the party line instead.

That's their true goal, as I explained in a comment above. They want to be able to upend the process, if they don't get their way. What you see them doing right now, is what they would do with legislation as well. Also why they want a single member to be able to force a vote on the speaker.

It's all shenanigans that allow them outsized power relative to their numbers. That's what this is all about.

As far as the comparison to Manchin and Sinema, at least they were negotiating for real positions. As has been discussed all day today, the Freedom Caucus doesn't have an ask, they just want the power to decide the speaker. If they had an ask, or a reasonable position, there could be a negotiated compromise, as usually happens.

That malignant tumour known as Trump has metastasised, incredible viewing. Don’t think they are making America great again.

People worry about Putin/Xi, the US can apparently destroy itself much easier than any external force.