Kent350787 wrote:

Don’t want to Godwin the thread, but how has that approach got down for repressed groups over the years in the face of authoritarian bigotry?

We're starting to go off-topic here, so all I have to say to that is that we've done pretty well, considering. If you think we're repressed, talk to someone from a real authoritarian regime.

Braybuddy wrote:

Kent350787 wrote:

Don’t want to Godwin the thread, but how has that approach got down for repressed groups over the years in the face of authoritarian bigotry?

We're starting to go off-topic here, so all I have to say to that is that we've done pretty well, considering. If you think we're repressed, talk to someone from a real authoritarian regime.

Yeah, I do get that point. It really is the populist authoritarian depths of ignorance that get me on this one. I suppose banning drag isn't too bad - at least they're not banning books....

Kent350787 wrote:

I suppose banning drag isn't too bad - at least they're not banning books....

It is bad because that slippery slope ends only in one place.... the authoritarianism that the defenders of such measures very ironically refuse to understand they're facilitating.

That path is nowhere clearer than in Florida, especially with regards to the severe censorship on education they are setting up, among all the other social restrictions they are implementing in order to curtail freedoms and force their citizens to abide by certain arbitrary behaviors dictated by their government.

All of this is autocracy 101. It has happened countless times over the ages and obviously keeps happening because no one bothers to read or understand history... especially Floridians.

Francoflier wrote:

Kent350787 wrote:

I suppose banning drag isn't too bad - at least they're not banning books....

It is bad because that slippery slope ends only in one place.... the authoritarianism that the defenders of such measures very ironically refuse to understand they're facilitating.

You missed my sarcasm - they are effectively banning books too https://www.tennessean.com/story/news/p ... 570712002/

Kent350787 wrote:

Yeah, I do get that point. It really is the populist authoritarian depths of ignorance that get me on this one. I suppose banning drag isn't too bad - at least they're not banning books....

But it's the thin edge of the wedge, that's the danger.

It's also massively hypocritical of those that claim to be such huge supporters of the constitution, but it seems only some of it and only when it suits them.


Edit: Ignore, I've just seen your other post. In my defence, it's very early here.

“I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue!”
- Barry Goldwater, Republican National Convention, 1964

Kent350787 wrote:

Braybuddy wrote:

Kent350787 wrote:

Don’t want to Godwin the thread, but how has that approach got down for repressed groups over the years in the face of authoritarian bigotry?

We're starting to go off-topic here, so all I have to say to that is that we've done pretty well, considering. If you think we're repressed, talk to someone from a real authoritarian regime.

Yeah, I do get that point. It really is the populist authoritarian depths of ignorance that get me on this one. I suppose banning drag isn't too bad - at least they're not banning books....

How about some equal 'banning'...the guys in dresses and gowns that most Tennesseans chuck their kids of to church every Sunday, yeah those guys. And they give them money too (tithes).
Their history of molesting kids compared to drag queens merely influencing kids is like comparing a SRB to a fire cracker.

BN747

BN747 wrote:

How about some equal 'banning'...the guys in dresses and gowns that most Tennesseans chuck their kids of to church every Sunday, yeah those guys.

Already in the works:
https://nypost.com/2023/03/23/utah-pare ... aphic/amp/

“A Utah parent is calling for the removal of the Bible, citing the state's law, passed last year, that bans materials that are "pornographic" or "indecent."

(…)

The parent cited the Bible’s “incest, onanism, bestiality, prostitution, genital mutilation, fellatio, dildos, rape and even infanticide” as cause for its removal.“

I must read my Bible again.

petertenthije wrote:

BN747 wrote:

How about some equal 'banning'...the guys in dresses and gowns that most Tennesseans chuck their kids of to church every Sunday, yeah those guys.

Already in the works:
https://nypost.com/2023/03/23/utah-pare ... aphic/amp/

“A Utah parent is calling for the removal of the Bible, citing the state's law, passed last year, that bans materials that are "pornographic" or "indecent."

(…)

The parent cited the Bible’s “incest, onanism, bestiality, prostitution, genital mutilation, fellatio, dildos, rape and even infanticide” as cause for its removal.“

But the lord clearly intended us to be exposed to those things!

Whereas one of the World's great works of art is, apparently, "pornography"!
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=1482711

They will never catch on to how the things they fear the most..is right under their noses...and it's bigger, wider than they'll ever suspect.

Abilene Christian University professor arrested, accused of sexually abusing adopted children
https://www.bigcountryhomepage.com/news ... -children/

The Bible, perfect cover to mask true intentions reaped on the masses of gullible least-suspecting.


BN747

Fun fact, the evangelical and conservative Messiah is holding a rally in Waco today, near the 30th anniversary of a violent christian pedophile's cult coming to a murderous end. Everyone is v v concerned for the children of course.

The former president will gather with supporters at an airport in Waco, which will mark the 30th anniversary of the Waco massacre next month. In 1993, an attempted raid by law enforcement of a compound belonging to the Branch Davidians, a religious cult, resulted in a shootout that led to a 51-day siege, ending in a blaze that left dozens dead.
https://apnews.com/article/trump-waco-r ... 0216d0a6a8

Kent350787 wrote:

Yeah, I do get that point. It really is the populist authoritarian depths of ignorance that get me on this one. I suppose banning drag isn't too bad - at least they're not banning books....

And I get it that a lot of US posters on here post solely through the prism of partisan politics. Sometimes it does no harm to take the blinkers off.

Yes, the US constitution grants freedoms across the USA.. but the principle of "When in Rome, do as the Romans do" is centuries older and is still widely recognised as good practice across the world. Perhaps those on here might wish to consider that the residents of an area, be it in the USA or anywhere else, can consider some things to be offensive. If you go to a Muslim area of Detroit and burn a copy of the Koran, the local residents are unlikely to have much respect for your constitutional rights.

You may be outraged at denial of your freedoms... but the locals may be outraged at somebody's actions. Both sides have a right to having their opinions respected. If you want your freedoms, you have to talk to people of rural Tennessee, treat them as your peers and listen to what they say... not denigrate them as a kneejek react as being village idiots

davidjohnson6 wrote:

Yes, the US constitution grants freedoms across the USA.. but the principle of "When in Rome, do as the Romans do" is centuries older and is still widely recognised as good practice across the world. Perhaps those on here might wish to consider that the residents of an area, be it in the USA or anywhere else, can consider some things to be offensive. If you go to a Muslim area of Detroit and burn a copy of the Koran, the local residents are unlikely to have much respect for your constitutional rights.

You may be outraged at denial of your freedoms... but the locals may be outraged at somebody's actions. Both sides have a right to having their opinions respected. If you want your freedoms, you have to talk to people of rural Tennessee, treat them as your peers and listen to what they say... not denigrate them as a kneejek react as being village idiots

If they are behaving as village idiots, they deserve to be called out for it. If their opinions and beliefs run contrary to the interests and rights of specific groups, should they not be called out for it?

MaverickM11 wrote:

Fun fact, the evangelical and conservative Messiah is holding a rally in Waco today, near the 30th anniversary of a violent christian pedophile's cult coming to a murderous end. Everyone is v v concerned for the children of course.

The former president will gather with supporters at an airport in Waco, which will mark the 30th anniversary of the Waco massacre next month. In 1993, an attempted raid by law enforcement of a compound belonging to the Branch Davidians, a religious cult, resulted in a shootout that led to a 51-day siege, ending in a blaze that left dozens dead.
https://apnews.com/article/trump-waco-r ... 0216d0a6a8

This is even better than Reagan giving a speech about states' rights in a town where civil rights activists were murdered...

davidjohnson6 wrote:

Yes, the US constitution grants freedoms across the USA.. but the principle of "When in Rome, do as the Romans do" is centuries older and is still widely recognised as good practice across the world. Perhaps those on here might wish to consider that the residents of an area, be it in the USA or anywhere else, can consider some things to be offensive. If you go to a Muslim area of Detroit and burn a copy of the Koran, the local residents are unlikely to have much respect for your constitutional rights.

You may be outraged at denial of your freedoms... but the locals may be outraged at somebody's actions. Both sides have a right to having their opinions respected. If you want your freedoms, you have to talk to people of rural Tennessee, treat them as your peers and listen to what they say... not denigrate them as a kneejek react as being village idiots

wait... wait... wait....

So people who play dress-up on weekends have to be respectful and listen and not denigrate anyone because people playing dress-up on weekends are criminals? That is how I read this and no. This whole "children are in danger because adults do adult things in adult places so let's make it illegal" is insane. I can count on less than one finger the number of children I have seen at drag shows. I can count on less than one finger the number of children being groomed at libraries by adults playing dress-up. But adults playing dress-up need to be respectful? no. nope. sorry, but... no.

Thank GAWD TN banned drag queens

Nashville school shooting: Three children fatally shot at Covenant School, hospital officials say; suspect dead
https://www.tennessean.com/story/news/2 ... 052363007/

MaverickM11 wrote:

Thank GAWD TN banned drag queens

It's important to focus on what the real threat to children is, you see...

So awful they want to ban drag shows in Tennessee, but refuse to pass strict gun control. It is disgusting.

Meanwhile, the real perversions go entirely unnoticed...


Houston GOP activist knew for years of child sex abuse claims against Southern Baptist leader, law partner
https://www.texastribune.org/2023/03/27 ... n-baptist/

...ad they will continue to deliver their kids to the wolves.


BN747

And, also, how many children go hungry every year and sleep in the cold every year but THE CHILDREN!!! WE MUST THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!! but they do not deserve free food or a warm place to sleep because those evil drag queens but don't worry about guns because THE CHILDREN!!!! THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!! PROTECT THE CHILDREN FROM EVIL DRAG AND FREE FOOD!!! HORRORS ALL!!! but guns are okay.... so sayeth the party of life and the party of children

Federal Judge blocks Tennessee's anti drag law for now.

MEMPHIS, Tenn. (WKRN) — A controversial law that targets the LGBTQ community in Tennessee has hit a bump in the road.
On Friday, a federal judge in Shelby County issued a temporary restraining order, prohibiting Governor Bill Lee, Attorney General Jonathan Skrmetti, and Shelby County District Attorney Steven Mulroy from enforcing the “anti-drag” law.

https://www.wkrn.com/news/tennessee-pol ... -drag-law/

The temporary restraining order is in effect for 14 days, starting Friday, March 31. The court will schedule future hearings on the matter next week.

seb146 wrote:

And, also, how many children go hungry every year and sleep in the cold every year but THE CHILDREN!!! WE MUST THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!! but they do not deserve free food or a warm place to sleep because those evil drag queens but don't worry about guns because THE CHILDREN!!!! THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!! PROTECT THE CHILDREN FROM EVIL DRAG AND FREE FOOD!!! HORRORS ALL!!! but guns are okay.... so sayeth the party of life and the party of children

Kids are just pieces of hardware used to build votes for these assholes, and said assholes manage to get re-elected

BN747 wrote:

Meanwhile, the real perversions go entirely unnoticed...


Houston GOP activist knew for years of child sex abuse claims against Southern Baptist leader, law partner
https://www.texastribune.org/2023/03/27 ... n-baptist/

...ad they will continue to deliver their kids to the wolves.


BN747

Your children are infinitely safer around a drag queen than at church. Or around a conservative.
https://apnews.com/article/lazzaro-repu ... 4b924b9092

MaverickM11 wrote:

BN747 wrote:

Meanwhile, the real perversions go entirely unnoticed...


Houston GOP activist knew for years of child sex abuse claims against Southern Baptist leader, law partner
https://www.texastribune.org/2023/03/27 ... n-baptist/

...ad they will continue to deliver their kids to the wolves.


BN747

Your children are infinitely safer around a drag queen than at church. Or around a conservative.
https://apnews.com/article/lazzaro-repu ... 4b924b9092

Very true, fortunately I've avoided that option and hold no regrets about.
But in my daily scan of news trending topics, just this week alone, the number offending adults against children is astonishing and mind blowing it it's frequency and MOST of this savage behavior is coming from conservative communities and mainly in the South. But I know that shit occurs in every single state - no exceptions.

I really find it hard to believe at this point in time, that people are behaving this way. I've just come to believe adult pervs of the pedo persuasion hold religious beliefs.
The scary ones are the young offenders, 18-25 or so. My guess is these are the always online types to who have little to no real adult friends, loners and introverts - and the frustrations
of the internet connected of this demographic under the religious environments - are the most active due to the natural inclination of that secreted, hidden (forbidden) nature religion creates in human beings..especially these days.

It's gotta be worse than what reports are reflecting...and just as typical of them (conservatives) having the green lie to "LIE' and lie your ass off (from the leaders of dedicated liars) -that hidden
other self can run rampant, just be loud and accuse others of exactly what they are doing themselves..
The people moral faith have no morals-at-all - none! I mean look at their voting patterns and their stance social issues especially anything regarding sex, like the who new 'Trans' thing.
They are running with that like wide receiver. You have no morals if consistently vote against the Right Thing...and telling one's self, the liberal social agenda is some BS philosophy they can hide behind...it's working so well, lying and deception is their norm. A fn tragic mess in the social order.


BN747

Source : twitter, Financial Times

I am somewhat surprised how much lower life expectancy is in the US from 1990 onwards.

At the Country Music Television awards, Kelsea Ballerini had 4 drag queens as her backup dancers while performing one of her songs in Nashville. A pretty strong message to the governor, from fairly conservative group, as music goes.

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/kel ... 37106.html

Avatar2go wrote:

At the Country Music Awards, Kelsea Ballerini had 4 drag queens as her backup dancers while performing one of her songs in Nashville. A pretty strong message to the governor, from fairly conservative group, as music goes.

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/kel ... 37106.html

A nitpick, but it was the Country Music Television (CMT) awards. The (arguably more prestigious) Country Music Awards (CMAs) are held later in the year. Either way, good for her.

luckyone wrote:

A nitpick, but it was the Country Music Television (CMT) awards. The (arguably more prestigious) Country Music Awards (CMAs) are held later in the year. Either way, good for her.

Thanks, corrected now.

BN747 wrote:

I really find it hard to believe at this point in time, that people are behaving this way.

Respectfully, did you not take a History course at some point in your education?

I find it depressingly believable that people are behaving this way.

DocLightning wrote:

BN747 wrote:

I really find it hard to believe at this point in time, that people are behaving this way.

Respectfully, did you not take a History course at some point in your education?

I find it depressingly believable that people are behaving this way.

No history classes on Earth speak to the perversions of the religious...but their religious text does instruct them 'how to'.

But feel free to prove me wrong.

BN747

When you see what is happening in "Red States" across the US, you can get a hint of what the US would look like if Republicans and their religious conservative backers had their way. Kiss freedom goodbye. Their definition of freedom seems to be "you can do what you like as long as we approve of it". Republicans in many Red state seem to be working towards their final solution (or as close as they can get) for Trans people; one speaker admitted as much at the recent CPAC conference.

Republicans criticize Liberals an democrats for wanting to roll back second amendment rights, but what about the separation of Church and State?

And isn't interesting that many of the states in which oppressive new laws are being brought in to marginalize further an already marginalized group are among the lowest when it comes to literacy, highest when it comes to infant mortality and generally towards the bottom of markers for quality of life, but oh do go ahead and create moral panics and target those you regard as not having a role in your vision of society, quite apart from offering nothing more than thoughts and prayers to the victims of mass shootings.

kaitak wrote:

When you see what is happening in "Red States" across the US, you can get a hint of what the US would look like if Republicans and their religious conservative backers had their way. Kiss freedom goodbye. Their definition of freedom seems to be "you can do what you like as long as we approve of it". Republicans in many Red state seem to be working towards their final solution (or as close as they can get) for Trans people; one speaker admitted as much at the recent CPAC conference.

Republicans criticize Liberals an democrats for wanting to roll back second amendment rights, but what about the separation of Church and State?

And isn't interesting that many of the states in which oppressive new laws are being brought in to marginalize further an already marginalized group are among the lowest when it comes to literacy, highest when it comes to infant mortality and generally towards the bottom of markers for quality of life, but oh do go ahead and create moral panics and target those you regard as not having a role in your vision of society, quite apart from offering nothing more than thoughts and prayers to the victims of mass shootings.

On Netflix is the series called 'The Family'..it's about the National Prayer Breakfast event, I thought was just a pandering event to pacify America's religious figures.

The National Prayer Breakfast is way worse and dangerous, these mthrfkrs are behind proliferation of religious nonsense like the Kill the Gays in Uganda and who knows what else across that continent and anywhere else where the RCC is strong (South America).
It shows how deported Maria Butina, the fake Russian NRA rep revealed as an operative (who corralled tons of GOP'ers up to Trump) used the religious conduit to infiltrate American politics...scary stuff as far their reach goes in this country. DeSantis, the Tennessee Drag Wars all of this insulting nonsense has far deeper roots than most who detest it all ...are even aware.

This is the epi-center of the current culture war - Dark Wicked Politicians flying behind the veil of Religion... in the same way Europeans fear a suicide bomber wearing a burka.

BN747

Gay commentator Amir Odon contributes to the drag debate, and explains why he feels the LGBTQ+ community has gone off the rails:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rBC0Nc ... l=AmirOdom

Braybuddy wrote:

Gay commentator Amir Odon contributes to the drag debate, and explains why he feels the LGBTQ+ community has gone off the rails:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rBC0Nc ... l=AmirOdom

Who? More importantly--who cares?

BN747 wrote:

The National Prayer Breakfast is way worse and dangerous, these mthrfkrs are behind proliferation of religious nonsense like the Kill the Gays in Uganda and who knows what else across that continent and anywhere else where the RCC is strong (South America).
It shows how deported Maria Butina, the fake Russian NRA rep revealed as an operative (who corralled tons of GOP'ers up to Trump) used the religious conduit to infiltrate American politics...scary stuff as far their reach goes in this country. DeSantis, the Tennessee Drag Wars all of this insulting nonsense has far deeper roots than most who detest it all ...are even aware.
BN747

Impossible to overstate how little their ideology extends beyond violent vengeance:

Today @WilliamLamberth, a Tennessee state representative, asked students protesting gun violence which gun they’d like him to use when shooting them: “If there’s a firearm out there you’re comfortable being shot with, please show me which one it is.”
https://twitter.com/shannonrwatts/statu ... 42OJ9wLdAg

Braybuddy wrote:

Gay commentator Amir Odon contributes to the drag debate, and explains why he feels the LGBTQ+ community has gone off the rails:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rBC0Nc ... l=AmirOdom

Do you struggle with some internalized homophobia dude?

Braybuddy wrote:

Gay commentator Amir Odon contributes to the drag debate, and explains why he feels the LGBTQ+ community has gone off the rails:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rBC0Nc ... l=AmirOdom

Neither you nor the YT commentator know what the "T" stands for in LGBTQ. I posted a link to what actually happens when youth say they want gender affirming care. No surgery. I know that does not line up with the Republican talking points, but it is true. Go look it up. And exactly zero children are "groomed" to be gay or trans by adults playing dress-up reading to them. Talk to any actual gay person and we will tell you we knew we were different from as young as 5 years old but didn't actually do anything or say anything until after puberty hit. Listening to trans people, it is the same.

For reference, I was born in the early 1970s and hit puberty during the beginning of the AIDS crisis and I grew up in a very conservative small town in Oregon. Who groomed me? How many drag shows do you think I went to when I was 5 and 6 years old? There were at least two other gays I grew up with who are my age. Who groomed them to be gay? How many drag shows and drag queen story times do you think they went to when they were 5 and 6 years old?

BN747 wrote:

DocLightning wrote:

BN747 wrote:

I really find it hard to believe at this point in time, that people are behaving this way.

Respectfully, did you not take a History course at some point in your education?

I find it depressingly believable that people are behaving this way.

No history classes on Earth speak to the perversions of the religious...but their religious text does instruct them 'how to'.

But feel free to prove me wrong.

BN747

I think that that was his point...That history is taught, but no lesson learned and thus we repeat the same mistakes as a society. Its really easy to think "oh, thats what those clowns from a hundred or so years ago did, no way us modern people could fall into the same trap."

So I guess the GOP has imposed a statewide “dress code.” Interesting. Very, very interested in men’s clothing. Like unusually interested. Just saying

MaverickM11 wrote:

Braybuddy wrote:

Gay commentator Amir Odon contributes to the drag debate, and explains why he feels the LGBTQ+ community has gone off the rails:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rBC0Nc ... l=AmirOdom

Who? More importantly--who cares?

BN747 wrote:

The National Prayer Breakfast is way worse and dangerous, these mthrfkrs are behind proliferation of religious nonsense like the Kill the Gays in Uganda and who knows what else across that continent and anywhere else where the RCC is strong (South America).
It shows how deported Maria Butina, the fake Russian NRA rep revealed as an operative (who corralled tons of GOP'ers up to Trump) used the religious conduit to infiltrate American politics...scary stuff as far their reach goes in this country. DeSantis, the Tennessee Drag Wars all of this insulting nonsense has far deeper roots than most who detest it all ...are even aware.
BN747

Impossible to overstate how little their ideology extends beyond violent vengeance:

Today @WilliamLamberth, a Tennessee state representative, asked students protesting gun violence which gun they’d like him to use when shooting them: “If there’s a firearm out there you’re comfortable being shot with, please show me which one it is.”
https://twitter.com/shannonrwatts/statu ... 42OJ9wLdAg

I saw that, this is why a vote needs to be brought to the Floor of the House and get everyone on the record as 'guns killing kids' is not going to pause...get these ass clowns on teh record and bring the record back to haunt them (along with kids gone because of their stance) on their next round of elections.

These people aren't messing around, they are out own the bodies of women, own the sexuality of 'individuals' (incase you don't know it..Your sex and what you do with it is yours and yours alone) not to be decided by anyone else regardless of their beliefs.

But the Repugs have gone there and they make no apologies for their brazen conduct.

Make them own every word..they will run and hide when you do.

BN747

luckyone wrote:

Do you struggle with some internalized homophobia dude?

It's hardly a struggle anymore . . . . But seriously, being out and on the gay scene for 49 years now it's only in the last decade or so I feel that it's lost the plot. We fought for equality, got it, now want to push the boundaries even further. I don't understand why we want to paint targets on our backs.

seb146 wrote:

Neither you nor the YT commentator know what the "T" stands for in LGBTQ. I posted a link to what actually happens when youth say they want gender affirming care. No surgery. I know that does not line up with the Republican talking points, but it is true. Go look it up. And exactly zero children are "groomed" to be gay or trans by adults playing dress-up reading to them. Talk to any actual gay person and we will tell you we knew we were different from as young as 5 years old but didn't actually do anything or say anything until after puberty hit. Listening to trans people, it is the same.

For reference, I was born in the early 1970s and hit puberty during the beginning of the AIDS crisis and I grew up in a very conservative small town in Oregon. Who groomed me? How many drag shows do you think I went to when I was 5 and 6 years old? There were at least two other gays I grew up with who are my age. Who groomed them to be gay? How many drag shows and drag queen story times do you think they went to when they were 5 and 6 years old?

Your first sentence makes no sense, so I'm not going to bother responding. You make other good points, so I will to those. Similar to yourself I know only too well what it's like growing up with absolutely no "gay" influences, although as young boys there was plenty of experimenting! This had no influence on my sexuality as I was already attracted to boys and was only working on my desires, presumably like my other mates. Like I said in my first post, drag has been around for centuries (indeed probably millennia), so seeing a man in a dress is not automatically going to make anyone gay. That has nothing to do with my point at all: I was simply making the point that, if you're going to add any -- even remotely -- sexualised content when performing in front of kids you're asking for trouble. It's silly to ban drag, but even sillier to court controversy.

Your posts seem to boil down to an obsession with American domestic politics. Like other posters on here, everything seems to be filtered through them. I have absolutely no interest in contributing to that aspect of the debate.

Braybuddy wrote:

luckyone wrote:

Do you struggle with some internalized homophobia dude?

It's hardly a struggle anymore . . . . But seriously, being out and on the gay scene for 49 years now it's only in the last decade or so I feel that it's lost the plot. We fought for equality, got it, now want to push the boundaries even further. I don't understand why we want to paint targets on our backs.

Your premise is misguided and all it does is reinforce the mentality that marginalized the LGBT community for years. The target was already there. Your premise of "ok, we'll take this little bit of freedom and not excessively indulge in it like everybody else, and just be grateful we finally have a small piece of what we should've had all along," just reinforces the stigma. Do I agree with everything everybody does? Absolutely not. But if nobody is complaining or making laws about seeing nipples and boobs on Bourbon Street, or any of the excesses of college spring break (ever been to pretty much any beach in Florida in March??), or Miami Beach on any given weekend, or never complained about seeing Milton Berle in a dress on prime time television, then the indulgences that occur at a gay pride or trans event, or drag show (whether I'd ever go there or not)...and let's not even get into the issue of what we allow religious institutions to indulge in...is sheer hypocrisy. Your attitude perpetuates the bigotry, that the behavior is icky, and that the LGBT community shouldn't be as foolish or indulgent as anybody else.

luckyone wrote:

Braybuddy wrote:

luckyone wrote:

Do you struggle with some internalized homophobia dude?

It's hardly a struggle anymore . . . . But seriously, being out and on the gay scene for 49 years now it's only in the last decade or so I feel that it's lost the plot. We fought for equality, got it, now want to push the boundaries even further. I don't understand why we want to paint targets on our backs.

Your premise is misguided and all it does is reinforce the mentality that marginalized the LGBT community for years. The target was already there. Your premise of "ok, we'll take this little bit of freedom and not excessively indulge in it like everybody else, and just be grateful we finally have a small piece of what we should've had all along," just reinforces the stigma. Do I agree with everything everybody does? Absolutely not. But if nobody is complaining or making laws about seeing nipples and boobs on Bourbon Street, or any of the excesses of college spring break (ever been to pretty much any beach in Florida in March??), or Miami Beach on any given weekend, or never complained about seeing Milton Berle in a dress on prime time television, then the indulgences that occur at a gay pride or trans event, or drag show (whether I'd ever go there or not)...and let's not even get into the issue of what we allow religious institutions to indulge in...is sheer hypocrisy. Your attitude perpetuates the bigotry, that the behavior is icky, and that the LGBT community shouldn't be as foolish or indulgent as anybody else.

Hahahaha...your forgot their hero, Rudy Giuliani running around in drag, boy they'd ditch Rudy in a heartbeat today in Tennessee..over this silliness.

BN747

Braybuddy wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Neither you nor the YT commentator know what the "T" stands for in LGBTQ. I posted a link to what actually happens when youth say they want gender affirming care. No surgery. I know that does not line up with the Republican talking points, but it is true. Go look it up. And exactly zero children are "groomed" to be gay or trans by adults playing dress-up reading to them. Talk to any actual gay person and we will tell you we knew we were different from as young as 5 years old but didn't actually do anything or say anything until after puberty hit. Listening to trans people, it is the same.

For reference, I was born in the early 1970s and hit puberty during the beginning of the AIDS crisis and I grew up in a very conservative small town in Oregon. Who groomed me? How many drag shows do you think I went to when I was 5 and 6 years old? There were at least two other gays I grew up with who are my age. Who groomed them to be gay? How many drag shows and drag queen story times do you think they went to when they were 5 and 6 years old?

Your first sentence makes no sense, so I'm not going to bother responding. You make other good points, so I will to those. Similar to yourself I know only too well what it's like growing up with absolutely no "gay" influences, although as young boys there was plenty of experimenting! This had no influence on my sexuality as I was already attracted to boys and was only working on my desires, presumably like my other mates. Like I said in my first post, drag has been around for centuries (indeed probably millennia), so seeing a man in a dress is not automatically going to make anyone gay. That has nothing to do with my point at all: I was simply making the point that, if you're going to add any -- even remotely -- sexualised content when performing in front of kids you're asking for trouble. It's silly to ban drag, but even sillier to court controversy.

Your posts seem to boil down to an obsession with American domestic politics. Like other posters on here, everything seems to be filtered through them. I have absolutely no interest in contributing to that aspect of the debate.

This thread is about American politics. One of our American states has banned female impersonation. Yes, it can be sexualized in a bar or nightclub where there are only adults. But things like family friendly pride or drag queen story time are only sexualized by Republicans.

Further, Republicans, somehow, believe that simply seeing a man in a sparkly dress and fabulous heels and big hair will turn everyone gay so it must be banned. I have no idea how that works but it does because Republicans say it does.

seb146 wrote:

Braybuddy wrote:

seb146 wrote:

Neither you nor the YT commentator know what the "T" stands for in LGBTQ. I posted a link to what actually happens when youth say they want gender affirming care. No surgery. I know that does not line up with the Republican talking points, but it is true. Go look it up. And exactly zero children are "groomed" to be gay or trans by adults playing dress-up reading to them. Talk to any actual gay person and we will tell you we knew we were different from as young as 5 years old but didn't actually do anything or say anything until after puberty hit. Listening to trans people, it is the same.

For reference, I was born in the early 1970s and hit puberty during the beginning of the AIDS crisis and I grew up in a very conservative small town in Oregon. Who groomed me? How many drag shows do you think I went to when I was 5 and 6 years old? There were at least two other gays I grew up with who are my age. Who groomed them to be gay? How many drag shows and drag queen story times do you think they went to when they were 5 and 6 years old?

Your first sentence makes no sense, so I'm not going to bother responding. You make other good points, so I will to those. Similar to yourself I know only too well what it's like growing up with absolutely no "gay" influences, although as young boys there was plenty of experimenting! This had no influence on my sexuality as I was already attracted to boys and was only working on my desires, presumably like my other mates. Like I said in my first post, drag has been around for centuries (indeed probably millennia), so seeing a man in a dress is not automatically going to make anyone gay. That has nothing to do with my point at all: I was simply making the point that, if you're going to add any -- even remotely -- sexualised content when performing in front of kids you're asking for trouble. It's silly to ban drag, but even sillier to court controversy.

Your posts seem to boil down to an obsession with American domestic politics. Like other posters on here, everything seems to be filtered through them. I have absolutely no interest in contributing to that aspect of the debate.

This thread is about American politics. One of our American states has banned female impersonation. Yes, it can be sexualized in a bar or nightclub where there are only adults. But things like family friendly pride or drag queen story time are only sexualized by Republicans.

Further, Republicans, somehow, believe that simply seeing a man in a sparkly dress and fabulous heels and big hair will turn everyone gay so it must be banned. I have no idea how that works but it does because Republicans say it does.

Of course it doesn't. They know it doesn't, and individually they don't really care. But it's a hot button, and it's the boogeyman du jour, and most people have moved on from the panic that a boy kissing a boy is going to result in mass child raping. Transgender still makes a lot of people uncomfortable and emotion results in irrational behavior, so it's the easy target. Populist politics require a boogeyman.

Braybuddy wrote:

I was simply making the point that, if you're going to add any -- even remotely -- sexualised content when performing in front of kids you're asking for trouble. It's silly to ban drag, but even sillier to court controversy.

It has nothing to do with sexualized content--that's just a red herring. Conservatives want to erase LGBTQ people, period. These are the people that want to "protect kids"--they're literally either covering up abuse or perpetrating it themselves while fanning the flames of drag queen hysteria:

Houston GOP activist knew for years of child sex abuse claims against Southern Baptist leader, law partner
https://www.rawstory.com/houston-gop-ac ... w-partner/

The Sunday guys in dresses busted again...

Report details 'staggering' church sex abuse in Maryland
https://www.yahoo.com/news/maryland-ag- ... 12895.html

BN747

luckyone wrote:

Your premise is misguided and all it does is reinforce the mentality that marginalized the LGBT community for years. The target was already there. Your premise of "ok, we'll take this little bit of freedom and not excessively indulge in it like everybody else, and just be grateful we finally have a small piece of what we should've had all along," just reinforces the stigma. Do I agree with everything everybody does? Absolutely not. But if nobody is complaining or making laws about seeing nipples and boobs on Bourbon Street, or any of the excesses of college spring break (ever been to pretty much any beach in Florida in March??), or Miami Beach on any given weekend, or never complained about seeing Milton Berle in a dress on prime time television, then the indulgences that occur at a gay pride or trans event, or drag show (whether I'd ever go there or not)...and let's not even get into the issue of what we allow religious institutions to indulge in...is sheer hypocrisy. Your attitude perpetuates the bigotry, that the behavior is icky, and that the LGBT community shouldn't be as foolish or indulgent as anybody else.

That's either a deliberate misrepresentation, or you haven't been reading my posts. What exactly is this "small piece of what we should've had all along"? We have achieved equality. There's a world of difference between partial nudity at a Pride event and what we see in the video clips involving kids online. THIS is the stuff that perpetuates the bigotry towards us, and our enemies are going to use it. Can you not see this, or do you not care?

seb146 wrote:

This thread is about American politics. One of our American states has banned female impersonation. Yes, it can be sexualized in a bar or nightclub where there are only adults. But things like family friendly pride or drag queen story time are only sexualized by Republicans.

Further, Republicans, somehow, believe that simply seeing a man in a sparkly dress and fabulous heels and big hair will turn everyone gay so it must be banned. I have no idea how that works but it does because Republicans say it does.

It's also about the LGBTQ+ community. As I've already said, banning drag is silly, but it's obvious where this has all come from. Join the dots.