AirCop
Topic Author
Posts: 5553
Joined: Mon Nov 28, 2005 2:39 am

Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Tue May 20, 2008 7:48 pm

It was suggested to me by other members of the forum to start a thread on this topic.

What ever happen to civil discussions regarding politics on this board?
Have we become a group of individuals that hide behind screen names to display our callousness towards others by calling people that disagree with your views names?

I was shocked to see the thread about Senator Kennedy's seizure hijacked by individuals that celebrated his illness with hopes for his death or worst. I just don't understand how anyone could celebrate someone's misfortune in this manner.

Apparently if someone disagrees with you, that gives the right to call them names, question their right to live, and ridicule their families and their patriotism. I think not.

Our county (United States) relies on the exchange of ideas of ALL of its people. Some of the best programs came as a result of both sides meshing each other ideas to form a finish project that benefited ALL of us. How can we has members have a civil discussion, if we allow our discussions to get into the gutter. (name calling, insults, ridicule)

I really don't know what the cause of this is, perhaps its the anonymous of the internet, maybe it because some people didn't have the proper upbringing or just maybe it's lack of maturity.

Anyways that my 26 cents worth, I just hoping people will treat other members with a little more respect.
 
LH423
Posts: 5924
Joined: Sun Jul 11, 1999 6:27 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Tue May 20, 2008 7:52 pm

I couldn't agree more.

As I said in another post, I respect many of the individuals on this board who are on the opposite side of the political spectrum because they make thought-provoking, interesting posts that stand their ground and may state why they disagree with the opposing view but don't resort to personal attacks on either an individual or those sharing that person's view.

Then there are some, on both sides of the aisle, who consistently resort to cheap attacks. Those people I don't respect, regardless of their political viewpoints, and often will completely ignore their posts since I usually find little to be gained from reading it other than the usual, bitter partisan attacks.

LH423
« On ne voit bien qu'avec le cœur. L'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux » Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
 
Dougloid
Posts: 7248
Joined: Tue Jul 05, 2005 2:44 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Tue May 20, 2008 7:54 pm

It's worth noting that disrespect is fundamentally an ad hominem attack. It doesn't make for good argumentation and discourse. People can really show their brass ones when they're separated from your fist by several thousand miles of wire. The most chickenshit ones are the ones who use anonymous remailers.

Here's something you can quote me on.

The internet gave everybody a voice but it didn't guarantee they have anything worthwhile to say.
If you believe in coincidence, you haven't looked close enough-Joe Leaphorn
 
Boeing4ever
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RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Tue May 20, 2008 7:58 pm

Well to be blunt, it's the fault of the politicians who blazed the trail for such behavior.

The past 8 years especially have seen nothing but poison come from Washington. The media doesn't help. FOX News for example does cheerlead for the GOP. MSNBC fired back by hiring Keith Olbermann for the sole purpose of competing with Bill O'Reilly. The media has fostered a massive "us vs. them" mentality with Red state vs. Blue state as well. Last time I checked, when flying above the US, the ground beneath has no shades of dark red or blue.

You cannot sum up America in a TV map graphic. But that's what has been done. And the politicians have tried to make gains on those divisions. You cannot rile people up and then whine about the lack of civility.

My severe contempt for the White House and Capitol Hill and the vermin that occupy them are no secret and they exist for VERY GOOD reason.

That said, I wish Sen. Kennedy well. Noone deserves a tumor. And any bit of civility we can get nowadays may not be much in this sea of venom...but it's better than adding more poison.

 airplane B4e-Forever New Frontiers airplane 
 
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OA260
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RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Tue May 20, 2008 7:58 pm

I have to say its sad to see how much disrespect there is notably by American members who think its good to make degrading comments on people/politians who have have become ill or worse who have died. Theres a good saying that people should take on board ''never speak ill of the dead'' . I can only guess that either their parents were equally as disrespectful or that they ignored their parents values.
 
kmh1956
Posts: 2854
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2005 4:08 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Tue May 20, 2008 8:01 pm

I usually try to avoid the political posts for exactly the reasons cited above...childish name-calling etc. I had hopes that the thread on Sen Kennedy's would be different and perhaps filled wth respect for a man who, whether or not you agreed with him, has served the USA well for many years and is now facing a life-threatening challenge. I was wrong. How dreadfully sad that supposed adults cannot behave in a way that shows at least a modicum of respect.
'Somebody tell me why I'm on my own if there's a soulmate for everyone' :Natasha Bedingfield
 
Pope
Posts: 3995
Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2005 5:57 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Tue May 20, 2008 8:05 pm



Quoting AirCop (Thread starter):
What ever happen to civil discussions regarding politics on this board?



Quoting AirCop (Thread starter):
Have we become a group of individuals that hide behind screen names to display our callousness towards others by calling people that disagree with your views names?



Quoting AirCop (Thread starter):
Apparently if someone disagrees with you, that gives the right to call them names, question their right to live, and ridicule their families and their patriotism. I think not.

How can any of this surprise you? This isn't new. How many thousand posts have been made about the "idiot", "retard", "asshole" in the White House and similar posts.

Some members went as far as self-deleting after the 2004 election in attempts to get away from the crap they posted.
Hypocrisy. It's the new black for liberals.
 
TedTAce
Posts: 9098
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 12:31 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Tue May 20, 2008 8:23 pm



Quoting AirCop (Thread starter):

What ever happen to civil discussions regarding politics on this board?

Since I have been a member here (as long as you have) nothing has changed.

Quoting AirCop (Thread starter):
Have we become a group of individuals that hide behind screen names to display our callousness towards others by calling people that disagree with your views names?

For those who don't have logic and reason to back them up,  yes 

Quoting AirCop (Thread starter):
I was shocked to see the thread about Senator Kennedy's seizure hijacked by individuals that celebrated his illness with hopes for his death or worst. I just don't understand how anyone could celebrate someone's misfortune in this manner.

I'm not.

Quoting AirCop (Thread starter):
Apparently if someone disagrees with you, that gives the right to call them names, question their right to live, and ridicule their families and their patriotism. I think not.

It shows a weak mind, why bother paying it any attention?

Quoting AirCop (Thread starter):
I really don't know what the cause of this is, perhaps its the anonymous of the internet, maybe it because some people didn't have the proper upbringing or just maybe it's lack of maturity.

See:

Quoting Boeing4ever (Reply 3):
Well to be blunt, it's the fault of the politicians who blazed the trail for such behavior.

and: (but the last 20 years/since Regan)

Quoting Boeing4ever (Reply 3):
The past 8 years especially have seen nothing but poison come from Washington.

and:

Quoting Boeing4ever (Reply 3):
The media has fostered a massive "us vs. them" mentality with Red state vs. Blue state as well.



Quoting Pope (Reply 6):

How can any of this surprise you? This isn't new. How many thousand posts have been made about the "idiot", "retard", "asshole" in the White House and similar posts.

There is a difference (to me anyway) between calling W a retard (which he is) and calling another member of the board a name for the opinion they hold. The problem is that some people take offense at the politician being called a name (which it is our (excuse this expression Pope) God given right to do). So in this context (and for example purposes only) I call W a dork, Pope takes offense and calls ME a name and things tend to decline from there. The problem (which last time I checked this board has rules that deal with it) is when it comes to disrespecting other users. Some users can handle their favorite politician's being mindlessly dragged through the mud, and others can't and turn it into a 'personal' issue.

The key HERE is don't equate name calling of a politician with an attack on you and your beliefs, and when you come across a post calling you a name, hit the SD button and let the mods handle it.

Quoting Pope (Reply 6):
Some members went as far as self-deleting after the 2004 election in attempts to get away from the crap they posted.

Can you PM me the list? I somehow missed that, or probably just forgot.
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amberair732
Posts: 47
Joined: Thu Apr 20, 2006 8:44 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Tue May 20, 2008 8:40 pm



Quoting AirCop (Thread starter):
I really don't know what the cause of this is, perhaps its the anonymous of the internet, maybe it because some people didn't have the proper upbringing or just maybe it's lack of maturity.

Anyways that my 26 cents worth, I just hoping people will treat other members with a little more respect.

Mixed feelings about this one AirCop. I was as shocked as you to see some of the comments regarding Ted Kennedy. Regardless of political persuasion, we should all wish him the best in his recovery.

It's almost election time in the US, so I guess we can forgive the Conservative/Democrat rivalry becoming a little more heated over the coming weeks. However there can be no excuse for wishing an ill man death or worse - the one solution to posts of that nature is to bring them to the attention of the mods.

There has been a lot of sniping on this forum lately, which I admit to participating in at times. There appears to be increasing xenophobia on the forum, with persons of the same or neighbouring nationality replying almost exclusively to their compatriot's posts.

Many of the non Americans on this forum feel isolated and pushed into their own regional groups, and, in the instance of the British/European contingent, usually results in threads consisting of extensive banter and innuendo-laden posts. Our brand of humour can be full on & is sometimes misunderstood by members of other nationalities. Recently this has led to members taking offense at posts which meant no harm.

Quoting AirCop (Thread starter):
Our county (United States) relies on the exchange of ideas of ALL of its people. Some of the best programs came as a result of both sides meshing each other ideas to form a finish project that benefited ALL of us. How can we has members have a civil discussion, if we allow our discussions to get into the gutter. (name calling, insults, ridicule)

A perfect example. This website is not Airliners.us , and is viewed by people form across the world. I have learned much about the US democratic process from reading threads on this website, but wish there were more universal threads. This, coupled with the previously mentioned election rivalry, seems to me to be the source of a great deal of the rude and abusive posts that have appeared lately. I don't think it's anything to do with upbringing, and of course there are some members on here that lack maturity. It's called youth.
 
Zach60
Posts: 2
Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:35 pm

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Tue May 20, 2008 8:49 pm

On many of the posts I read, I think that many of the people on this site seem to be under 25 and are more concerned about "stirring the pot" and adding stupid comments then really adding anything of value.
 
Falcon84
Posts: 13775
Joined: Fri Sep 10, 2004 11:52 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Tue May 20, 2008 8:50 pm

I'm as blunt as anyone on here in arguing my point, but I've made a conscious effort-and not always successfully-to keep the personal business out of it.

I think the divide, especially in the U.S. on politics has become so acute, with the nation being so evenly divided, is one reason for more heated discussions. But, honestly, I think the tone is probably not a lot different than it's ever been, but iwth global communications-like this forum-it's easier for one to vent their point and frustrations than it was, say back in the 1860's during the Civil War, or even 25 years ago.

The world is getting smaller in many regards, and when it does, I think people can just get on each others' nerves far easier.
Work Right, Fly Hard
 
TedTAce
Posts: 9098
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 12:31 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Tue May 20, 2008 8:58 pm



Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 10):
and when it does

I dunno about you, but 300 Million in the US is about 290 million too many. How the Japanese Chinese and Indians do it, is beyond me, much respect.
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AR385
Posts: 6930
Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2003 8:25 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Tue May 20, 2008 9:10 pm

The name calling. The Xenophobia. The racism and the immaturity displayed by many users plus the insulting posts, intolerance ladened rants and personal attacks in the threads about immigration is why I don't even read them anymore, let alone participate in them. It is also the reason why when one of this type of threads comes up, I immediately suggest deletion. it's impossible for a civilized discussion to develop in them.

A shame, really, because if discussed intelligently, great ideas would result.
 
Pope
Posts: 3995
Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2005 5:57 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Tue May 20, 2008 9:29 pm



Quoting TedTAce (Reply 7):
I call W a dork, Pope takes offense and calls ME a name and things tend to decline from there.

Ted, can you link to a single instance were I've called you a name? Or were you just using this as an example?
Hypocrisy. It's the new black for liberals.
 
amberair732
Posts: 47
Joined: Thu Apr 20, 2006 8:44 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Tue May 20, 2008 9:46 pm



Quoting Pope (Reply 13):
Quoting TedTAce (Reply 7):
I call W a dork, Pope takes offense and calls ME a name and things tend to decline from there.

Ted, can you link to a single instance were I've called you a name? Or were you just using this as an example?

Why do you two turn every previously reasonable thread into a personal argument? You're having the same argument in the " What has God done for you lately thread "

Can you not accept you have differing political & ideological viewpoints & avoid baiting each other on such topics.
 
helvknight
Posts: 784
Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2006 10:35 pm

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Tue May 20, 2008 9:52 pm



Quoting Amberair732 (Reply 8):
This, coupled with the previously mentioned election rivalry, seems to me to be the source of a great deal of the rude and abusive posts that have appeared lately. I don't think it's anything to do with upbringing, and of course there are some members on here that lack maturity. It's called youth.

Personally I'd call it immaturity rather than youth. Some of the offenders are in their 30s according to their profiles, really at that age you should have better command of the English language. Instead these folks simply abuse members that disagree with them or accuse them of being on drugs (which normally gets a SD from me).

I read the political threads a bit but tend not to participate as I know that, as a European lefty, expressing my views would lead to me being called everything from a communist to a traitor or worse. My response would probably lead to my spending some time in the cooler.

The mods do have a responsibility here, I'm always surprised you don't see more bans handed out. Certainly if I'd been a mod some of the more egregious offenders in the Kennedy thread would be on vacation for a month or two.

A lot of this is down to the us - or - them culture that is prevalent in US and British politics, not so much in the rest of Europe. In particular both parties in the US are moving towards their more committed supporters and the some of members on here tend to reflect this.
I refuse to join any club that would have me as a member - Groucho Marx
 
amberair732
Posts: 47
Joined: Thu Apr 20, 2006 8:44 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Tue May 20, 2008 10:05 pm



Quoting Helvknight (Reply 15):
Personally I'd call it immaturity rather than youth. Some of the offenders are in their 30s according to their profiles, really at that age you should have better command of the English language.

Fair point.

Quoting Helvknight (Reply 15):
I read the political threads a bit but tend not to participate as I know that, as a European lefty, expressing my views would lead to me being called everything from a communist to a traitor or worse. My response would probably lead to my spending some time in the cooler.

 checkmark   checkmark   checkmark 

I recently experienced this ( though not a spell in the cooler ) with the Aussie Paedophile thread. The vitriol levelled in my direction, for suggesting that the Aussie PM looked inwards before trying to sort out the rest of the world, was astounding. Although I didn't complain to the mods, it did lead to a rash of post deletions.

Quoting Helvknight (Reply 15):
The mods do have a responsibility here, I'm always surprised you don't see more bans handed out. Certainly if I'd been a mod some of the more egregious offenders in the Kennedy thread would be on vacation for a month or two.

Agreed. They seem to turn a blind eye to some threads that are out of hand, yet delete entire threads for minor rule infringements.
 
TedTAce
Posts: 9098
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 12:31 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Tue May 20, 2008 11:29 pm



Quoting Pope (Reply 13):
Ted, can you link to a single instance were I've called you a name? Or were you just using this as an example?

see:

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 7):
(and for example purposes only)

While the punks of the board who want to name call for the sake of it are a problem; it's the reactionaries who jump at the first clue they are being slammed (when they really aren't) that make the other part of the equation.
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diamond
Posts: 3000
Joined: Sun Apr 11, 2004 8:01 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Tue May 20, 2008 11:45 pm

Many of the people who are being spoken of here are in the cross-hairs because they want to be. They are usually not "for" much of anything - but "anti" many things.

Said another way: many people define who they are and what they believe by taking taking the most polar-opposite view they can from who they perceive to be "the other side."

Using the Ted Kennedy thread as an example (which required 62 posts to be removed): the extremists came out of the woodwork to post all sorts of hate and vitriol about the guy - yet they won't spend 1/10th of the same effort in praise of their own candidates. They don't know how to honestly support anyone .. they only know how to attack. It speaks to some significant underlying issues.

Yes, a very similar argument can be made toward people who spend all their time ranting about GWB. The occasional rant might be acceptable if it is balanced by some support and enthusiasm for someone. But all-rants-all-the-time is a pretty weak way to go through life.







(edit: typo)

[Edited 2008-05-20 16:53:49]
Blank.
 
bezoar
Posts: 746
Joined: Sun Nov 04, 2001 4:47 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Wed May 21, 2008 12:19 am

This rather insensitive attitude on the internet extends not only to politics, but any potentially controversial or charged topic. It seems like it occurs even when there should be no controversy. Many people simply want to pick a fight, and will do so eagerly on the internet because they are able to hide behind a screen name and don't have to actually stand up to their own words.

It is a measure of immaturity and shallowness when one's only argument is an insult. It is the proverbial bullying tactic, elevating one's self by lowering others. It doesn't work, and never has except in the mind of the bully. At worst, it is an abuse that stifles open discourse and sharing of information, the fundamental reason these forums - perhaps even the entire internet - exist in the first place.

I find posting in the forums an excellent opportunity to formulate my thoughts on important subjects into a cohesive string of words. Though we all would like for others, I sure I benefit far more from my posts than anyone else. However, if I ever sense that I've spoken less than respectfully to others, then I've already lost any argument.

Cheers to this thread. I hope it doesn't get hijacked by senseless bickering.

Peace,

Bezoar
"There are none so blind as those who will not see."
 
srbmod
Posts: 15446
Joined: Tue Mar 20, 2001 1:32 pm

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Wed May 21, 2008 1:10 am

Two words: Suggest Deletion

If you see someone whose post has the potential to turn matters ugly or is in your opinions a violation of the forum rules, use the Suggest Deletion button. It's not there to make the forum layout look pretty, it's there for a reason. The Moderators cannot read every single post in every single thread in every single forum on the site. That's where the Suggest Deletion button comes into play. If more users would make the effort to use the Suggest Deletion button instead of responding to a post that violates the rules, things could be a bit more civil in disagreements. Most of the time, by the time the Moderators get the first Deletion Suggestion in a thread that's gone downhill, things have gotten way out of hand. Had someone alerted the Moderators earlier, there would be times where threads don't get gutted or deleted or locked because of the actions of a few. In addition, the Moderators would be less likely to have to ban members.

If you see that a user is trying to inflame things, instead of throwing more fuel to the fire, don't respond to it and alert the Moderators to the situation.
 
RJdxer
Posts: 3523
Joined: Thu Nov 09, 2006 1:14 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Wed May 21, 2008 5:49 am



Quoting AirCop (Thread starter):
I was shocked to see the thread about Senator Kennedy's seizure hijacked by individuals that celebrated his illness with hopes for his death or worst.

Really? When Jerry Fawell passed away that thread was kicked off with a "burn in hell" post by our very own Ted T Ace.

https://www.airliners.net/aviation-fo...archid=1622216&s=falwell#ID1622216

And the hits kept on coming and bled (no pun intended) over to the Tammy Faye thread when she passed.

I wasn't a fan of either of the two, nor am I a fan of Senator Kennedy but you won't hear me say anything close to what was in those two threads. Shocked? Really?
Warm winds blowing, heating blue skies, and a road that goes forever. I'm going to Texas!
 
baroque
Posts: 12302
Joined: Thu Apr 27, 2006 2:15 pm

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Wed May 21, 2008 12:12 pm

With you at least most of the way Aircop. Especially with:

Quoting AirCop (Thread starter):
Apparently if someone disagrees with you, that gives the right to call them names, question their right to live, and ridicule their families and their patriotism. I think not.

Aside from that wish, perhaps another. That would be not to respond to what is perceived as an insult until it is clear that is was meant as such (in which case it would probably be better to suggest deletion).

I have in mind a recent discussion where I was trying to write where the interests of the US might reside and wrote US lie. That was interpreted as implying that the US was not telling the truth. In terms of parsing the sentence, the untruth interpretation was tenuous to say the least, but it seems it was honestly made.

Quoting Amberair732 (Reply 14):
Quoting Pope (Reply 13):
Quoting TedTAce (Reply 7):
I call W a dork, Pope takes offense and calls ME a name and things tend to decline from there.

Ted, can you link to a single instance were I've called you a name? Or were you just using this as an example?

Why do you two turn every previously reasonable thread into a personal argument?

Indeed, as Ronnie R would have said, there you two go again. This particular example is fascinating as clearly Amberair and I both understood the post as an example, but for a moment, I thought we might need Ban Ki Moon - if Diamond was not available.

It might have been dangerous to invoke a particular user in an fictitious example, but surely the (incorrectly) insulted party would have been better to request an explanation via an instant message, or to have responded along the lines of "surely not me". Anything to put water on the fuse rather than petrol???

I don't happen to like W, but I also don't like him being called a dork (or any other abusive term) without any specific justification. X did Z and therefore he/she qualifies as a Q seems possible, although dangerous. But X is a dork is not really helpful.

The non-US world also has a few problems with lack of detection of the light side of comments made by many non-US posters. Especially a problem with UK, Aus and to some extent Canadian posters but I have noticed similar problems where continental humour (humor if you insist) has gone  duck  without a neck muscle being moved. Yes, Germans, contrary to the advertisements do have a sense of humour. And French and Low Countries humour is way beyond most of us.

It does appear at times that what is water outside the US, is close to racing fuel inside it. This is a bit of a puzzle, as few of the non US posters have not spent quite a while in the US. Maybe times they are a changing and the internet is altering this world more that we what of.

Quoting AirCop (Thread starter):
I was shocked to see the thread about Senator Kennedy's seizure hijacked by individuals that celebrated his illness with hopes for his death or worst. I just don't understand how anyone could celebrate someone's misfortune in this manner.

Fair comment. If there were other threads where similar occurred, also fair comment. I cannot observe directly as that is the first such thread I happen to have read. I must confess to being a bit selective. With Kennedy, I thought it might be interesting to read a little insightful comment on his contributions - fat chance is all I can say.

So just as well Bruce Schapiro (Columnist with the Nation magazine and Executive Director Dart Center for Journalism and Trauma University of Washington) is giving me a precis of his achievements in the Senate as I type.

The only problem I have with this thread, is I would not have found it had I not been told it existed and so its effect might be a bit lost. But I am at a total loss as to how that might be remedied, this is the best place for it. Maybe, we can all make a resolution to cite this thread when a thread comes up in Non-av that has the potential of the Senator Kennedy thread.
 
NIKV69
Posts: 13207
Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2004 4:27 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Wed May 21, 2008 3:46 pm



Quoting AirCop (Thread starter):
It was suggested to me by other members of the forum to start a thread on this topic.

 faint 

Quoting AirCop (Thread starter):
Have we become a group of individuals that hide behind screen names to display our callousness towards others by calling people that disagree with your views names?

There is a hatred not only on this site but in society when certain people don't get their way. We saw it when Kerry lost and we will see it now. Unfortunately this will always be the case and you have to let it roll off your back. A huge divide exists between people that believe different things and it is settled in the voting booth. No need to let your blood pressure rise over it.

Quoting AirCop (Thread starter):
I was shocked to see the thread about Senator Kennedy's seizure hijacked by individuals that celebrated his illness with hopes for his death or worst. I just don't understand how anyone could celebrate someone's misfortune in this manner.

I am not participating in that thread but even though I disagree with Ted Kennedy's views I think that behavior is terrible and hope it was moderated properly.

Quoting Boeing4ever (Reply 3):
The past 8 years especially have seen nothing but poison come from Washington. The media doesn't help. FOX News for example does cheerlead for the GOP

Give me a break, they treat both parties equally and are not cheerlead for anyone.

Quoting Diamond (Reply 18):
Many of the people who are being spoken of here are in the cross-hairs because they want to be. They are usually not "for" much of anything - but "anti" many things.

 checkmark 
I am the Googlizer!!!
 
TedTAce
Posts: 9098
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 12:31 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Fri May 23, 2008 1:28 am

Quoting RJdxer (Reply 21):
When Jerry Fawell passed away that thread was kicked off with a "burn in hell" post by our very own Ted T Ace.

There is a HUGE difference between wishing someone who deserves it (and is dead) a nice painful eternity in the place where they belong versus wishing such things on someone who is alive. That's just RUDE.

Quoting RJdxer (Reply 21):
Tammy Faye

I liked her.

Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 23):
we will see it now

Maybe the board ought to adopt a 'no politics' stance until the end of January when the fat lady has sung on whatever atrocity is about to occur before us.

[Edited 2008-05-22 18:35:22]

[Edited 2008-05-22 18:36:15]
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allstarflyer
Posts: 3264
Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2005 7:32 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Fri May 23, 2008 1:43 am



Quoting TedTAce (Reply 25):
There is a HUGE difference between wishing someone who deserves it (and is dead) a nice painful eternity in the place where they belong versus wishing such things on someone who is alive.

And the part about the dead guy is all opinion, still.
Living the American Dream
 
Newark777
Posts: 8283
Joined: Thu Dec 02, 2004 6:23 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Fri May 23, 2008 3:28 am



Quoting TedTAce (Reply 24):

There is a HUGE difference between wishing someone who deserves it (and is dead) a nice painful eternity in the place where they belong versus wishing such things on someone who is alive. That's just RUDE.

So once he kicks the can, he's fair game? I'll keep that in mind.

And who cares if it's rude, it's not like he reads the site.
Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
 
TedTAce
Posts: 9098
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 12:31 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Fri May 23, 2008 6:53 am



Quoting Newark777 (Reply 26):

So once he kicks the can, he's fair game? I'll keep that in mind.

As far as I'm concerned, yes.  Smile
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Boeing4ever
Posts: 4479
Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2001 12:06 pm

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Fri May 23, 2008 7:35 pm



Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 23):
Give me a break, they treat both parties equally and are not cheerlead for anyone.

Let's try again...

A lot of the disrespect in these forums comes from A) the politicians who foster such attitudes, and B) chearleading media folk.

Sorry, but the media is not without some bias. And it affects A.net when certain members rally around these talking heads. Look at Bill O'Reilly vs. Keith Olberman. Olberman was clearly ONLY hired to comete with Bill O'Reilly capturing the "liberal" market left behind when O'Reilly was targeted at the "conservative" market. Otherwise, I assure you, Olberman would not be employed. He and O'Reilly are terrible but they make money for their networks by sewing these political divides...divides seen in Non-Av.

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halls120
Posts: 8724
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2005 3:24 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Mon May 26, 2008 7:30 pm

Interesting thread.

Not sure why it is in SR, because it really is just another flavor of the disputes we see in the non-av board.

It's almost a "let's bash the people who were bashing Senator Kennedy from the safety of the Site Related" board.

Could anybody explain why this discussion isn't being conducted in non-av?
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
amberair732
Posts: 47
Joined: Thu Apr 20, 2006 8:44 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Mon May 26, 2008 7:56 pm



Quoting Halls120 (Reply 29):
Interesting thread.

Not sure why it is in SR, because it really is just another flavor of the disputes we see in the non-av board.

It's almost a "let's bash the people who were bashing Senator Kennedy from the safety of the Site Related" board.

Could anybody explain why this discussion isn't being conducted in non-av?

This thread was originally in non-av, but was moved to site related. Possibly because a number of the early posts in the thread questioned the actions of the moderators.
 
aloges
Posts: 14807
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RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Mon May 26, 2008 11:20 pm

I've stopped reading the "political threads", i.e. mudslinging meetings, a while ago and usually bang my head into some convenient nearby object if I do happen to open one and see it degenerate after the first three posts. All I'll say is that I agree this climate has been caused by American politicians and the "news media" making the money off of them - why invite someone sensible if Ann Coulter will get better ratings? - and that, as for these forums, a lot of crew attention has gone the wrong way during the last year or so.

Quoting Newark777 (Reply 26):
And who cares if it's rude, it's not like he reads the site.

I care. AirCop cares. So do some more people posting in this thread, which is the point. If I called Jesus a  censored  crackhead hippie, I'd get flamed even though he's been dead for the best part of 2000 years. The same would go for calling all sorts of people names - just to different magnitudes.
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
halls120
Posts: 8724
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2005 3:24 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Tue May 27, 2008 1:20 am



Quoting Amberair732 (Reply 30):
Quoting Halls120 (Reply 29):
Interesting thread.

Not sure why it is in SR, because it really is just another flavor of the disputes we see in the non-av board.

It's almost a "let's bash the people who were bashing Senator Kennedy from the safety of the Site Related" board.

Could anybody explain why this discussion isn't being conducted in non-av?

This thread was originally in non-av, but was moved to site related. Possibly because a number of the early posts in the thread questioned the actions of the moderators.

I'm not sure I understand why it was moved over here. This discussion is clearly one about the posting styles of members - specifically, was it bad taste to take joy in the news about Senator Kennedy, and in general, the perceived level of rudeness on Anet.

According to the description of this board, "This is the place where Airliners.net related information will be posted like dates for scheduled downtime, info about new sections and features etc. This is also the forum for suggestions, comments and constructive criticism related to any part of Airliners.net."

Sorry, I just don't see how this discussion is properly being conducted in this locale.
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
khelmDTW
Posts: 204
Joined: Thu Jun 07, 2007 1:55 pm

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Fri May 30, 2008 12:12 am



Quoting AirCop (Thread starter):
AirCop

Well said my friend. It's getting ridiculous around here.
"Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration"
 
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TVNWZ
Posts: 2244
Joined: Fri Feb 17, 2006 9:28 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Fri May 30, 2008 3:07 am



Quoting KhelmDTW (Reply 33):
It's getting ridiculous around here

Since Cain killed Able. If you believe that.
 
halls120
Posts: 8724
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2005 3:24 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Fri May 30, 2008 3:34 am



Quoting KhelmDTW (Reply 33):
Quoting AirCop (Thread starter):
AirCop

Well said my friend. It's getting ridiculous around here.

Concur. There seems to be a lack of respect flowing in many different directions, and it doesn't bode well for the site.
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
Acheron
Posts: 1851
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2005 1:14 am

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Fri May 30, 2008 4:18 am



Quoting AR385 (Reply 12):
the immaturity displayed by many users plus the insulting posts, intolerance ladened rants and personal attacks

Indeed. Although to me it has happened in the threads related to the guy in my country's office whenever I have made the mistake of opening them. Think whatever you want of the guy(and politicians around the world in general), but that doesn't give you the right to go onto personal attacks.

Quoting Aloges (Reply 31):
I've stopped reading the "political threads", i.e. mudslinging meetings

 checkmark  Pretty much. It's a waste of time.
 
baroque
Posts: 12302
Joined: Thu Apr 27, 2006 2:15 pm

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Fri May 30, 2008 6:58 am



Quoting Acheron (Reply 36):
Quoting Aloges (Reply 31):
I've stopped reading the "political threads", i.e. mudslinging meetings

checkmark Pretty much. It's a waste of time.

At least the thread has been worth moving since AirCop intervened. So whatever the reasons and whatever the logic, the outcome has been a distinct improvement.

I cannot think that even those doing the mudslinging got much pleasure from it, dirty hands are not usually a convenience in everyday life??

Oh dear God, the spelling has gone mad again stretching the text over about a metre in a 10 cm window, which is why I looked up site related in the first place!! Now to see if there is a thread.
 
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czbbflier
Posts: 866
Joined: Fri Jul 07, 2006 1:28 pm

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Mon Jun 02, 2008 3:27 am



Quoting Boeing4ever (Reply 28):
A lot of the disrespect in these forums comes from A) the politicians who foster such attitudes, and B) chearleading media folk.

Sorry, but the media is not without some bias. And it affects A.net when certain members rally around these talking heads. Look at Bill O'Reilly vs. Keith Olberman. Olberman was clearly ONLY hired to comete with Bill O'Reilly capturing the "liberal" market left behind when O'Reilly was targeted at the "conservative" market. Otherwise, I assure you, Olberman would not be employed. He and O'Reilly are terrible but they make money for their networks by sewing these political divides...divides seen in Non-Av.

I suppose my comments that follow fall under the typical non-av debate formula of "What is" versus "What ought to be". Apples and Oranges. A pointless argument between forum members. So my question is, How do we communicate that the level of debate is too poor or should we even try?

I can see where Boeing4ever is coming from, but I really think we all ought to be striving for something better.

To use the behaviour of politicians and the media as a justification for one's own actions is a sad commentary on the forum and what it has come to be. NONE of this reprehensible behaviour on the part of any participant is ever acceptable- or excusable.

I am quite certain that members from the United States represent the majority here. However there is a very large minority on this board who don't even know who Bill O'Reilly and Keith Olberman are.

Why should this minority be exposed to the deplorable level of debate that these commentators employ?
Isn't the forum supposed to be a way to share ideas?
To achieve that exchange of ideas you have to kick the quality of the discussion up a bit, no?
Should we all expect better of each other and how does each person do so?
Or should one even try?

In short, to bring this back into the realm of "Site-related", I have sometimes considered canceling my membership altogether because of the anger, hate, and vitriol that sometimes spews forth in my favoured forum. And I am certain that I am not the only one who feels that way.

Without question, the site's reputation for quality is tarnished a bit because of this brainless and repetitive ranting and bickering.
 
Boeing4ever
Posts: 4479
Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2001 12:06 pm

RE: Disagreement Now Becoming Disrespect

Mon Jun 02, 2008 5:05 pm



Quoting Czbbflier (Reply 38):

I'm not using politicians and the media as justification. They are just responsible for proliferating an ugly trend.

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