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Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Fri Jul 21, 2017 7:16 pm
by SANFan
jacob789456 wrote:
She just left, they pulled her over to T2, loaded and left in 45 minutes.

Hmmm. I wonder what/who the departure was loaded with?

It looks like (according to FltAware) the normal turn of JL66/65 will also be operating today; #66 is on the way to SAN as we speak. In any case, hopefully everything will return to normal now.

bb

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 12:01 am
by hawaiian717
Hi guys! Popped in and read the last couple of pages to catch up on what's been going on. Dunno if I'll be around more or not. Anyway...

SANFan wrote:
I fear that SAN-ORF is a low-yielding market even though it would certainly support a daily, permanent nonstop. Also, it is primarily flown by Navy folks whom might be restricted to flying only the carrier with the govt travel contract. I don't know who currently holds that contract, but they certainly are not flying between the two cities. (I wouldn't be surprised if there were a nice amount of military freight/cargo that might travel on such a nonstop flight...)


American has the SAN-ORF contract this year: https://cpsearch.fas.gsa.gov/cpsearch/m ... arch+FY+17

If another airline were to start a nonstop flight, that would give them an advantage in bidding for the contract for the route since GSA considers multiple factors, not just price, and nonstop service is one of them. Especially if it's not a redeye since they generally prefer to travel during working hours.

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 12:43 am
by mikeyp224
jacob789456 wrote:
She just left,

They pulled her over to T2, loaded and left in 45 minutes.


That is not true. It is still over by the north ramp.

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 3:18 am
by SANFan
At ~8pm, I just looked at FltAware and it's still showing both JL65 and JL65D enroute to NRT from SAN!

bb

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 2:50 pm
by DLSANMan
SANFan wrote:
At ~8pm, I just looked at FltAware and it's still showing both JL65 and JL65D enroute to NRT from SAN!

bb


One 787 is sitting at the east end of General AV wth hardstand. Has been since yesterday.
Think it's MTC?

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 4:38 pm
by SANFan
DLSANMan wrote:
SANFan wrote:
At ~8pm, I just looked at FltAware and it's still showing both JL65 and JL65D enroute to NRT from SAN!
bb

One 787 is sitting at the east end of General AV wth hardstand. Has been since yesterday.
Think it's MTC?

I still don't know how we ended up an "extra" 787 after (apparently) 2 JL65s flew SAN-NRT yesterday!

Then I'm sticking with my guess that it has something to do with a charter involving ComicCon...

hawaiian717 wrote:
Hi guys! Popped in and read the last couple of pages to catch up on what's been going on. Dunno if I'll be around more or not. Anyway...

SANFan wrote:
I fear that SAN-ORF is a low-yielding market even though it would certainly support a daily, permanent nonstop. Also, it is primarily flown by Navy folks whom might be restricted to flying only the carrier with the govt travel contract. I don't know who currently holds that contract, but they certainly are not flying between the two cities. (I wouldn't be surprised if there were a nice amount of military freight/cargo that might travel on such a nonstop flight...)

American has the SAN-ORF contract this year: https://cpsearch.fas.gsa.gov/cpsearch/m ... arch+FY+17

If another airline were to start a nonstop flight, that would give them an advantage in bidding for the contract for the route since GSA considers multiple factors, not just price, and nonstop service is one of them. Especially if it's not a redeye since they generally prefer to travel during working hours.

Hey HA717, it's always great to have you drop in on this thread; doesn't happen nearly enough!

And thanx for the update on ORF. I suppose maybe someday, out of the blue, someone will announce SAN-ORF service. It certainly won't be AA but I'm hoping for AS. I wouldn't rule out WN though. I know ORF is on SDIA's 'List" and the route is large enough to support a daily mainline jet but I just don't know about yields and expected profitability.

SAN-ORF is really the kind of market that AAG likes to grab these days out of SAN -- unserved, un-noticed, and certainly worth a try! They've done it with SAN-MCO/STS/LIH/FAT/MRY/MEX/BOI/OGG/PVR/OMA/KOA/MMH/HDN, all of which are still operating, and I hope ELP and ORF might be next.

Keep the posts coming, hawaiian'! (BTW, your hard work over on Wiki is also appreciated very much.)

bb

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 4:53 pm
by blacksoviet
SAN-ORF sounds like a good route for a 73G or 735.

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:38 am
by airmale757
As of 5:30pm Sunday, 23 July, JAL 787 is still parked on the north apron.

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:59 am
by SANFan
airmale757 wrote:
As of 5:30pm Sunday, 23 July, JAL 787 is still parked on the north apron.

I've got it! JAL donated the Dreamliner to the San Diego Air & Space Museum!

I still go with: a charter to take Comic-Con revelers home later tonight or tomorrow; today is the last day of Comic-Con 2017.

bb

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 1:19 am
by blacksoviet
It's a hot spare.

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 7:47 pm
by redrooster3
Hey everybody! To update you on JA824J, which is still, in SAN after five days is still 'broken.' In hindsight, the GPU (Ground Power) which connects to the aircraft to provide power to the plane while on the ground was Arching while connected to the aircraft. This resulted in a COMPLETE electrical failure of the plane. Local Contract Maintenance cannot fix this problem. I have seen American Airlines maintenance trucks from LA come down to try to resolve this issue, but there is no fix. Most likely, Boeing will have to be brought down from Seattle and have engineers fix the plane. The plane is not air-worthy at this moment. I'm pretty sure JAL is pissed at the airport for allowing this Faulty GPU provide power to their planes and get away with it, most likely it was a damaged plug that sourced the arching. Right now, there is still an investigation going on. And it would be smart for the airport to waive the overnight parking fees for the plane until this mess is resolved.

Image

Image

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 9:06 pm
by WN732
redrooster3 wrote:
Hey everybody! To update you on JA824J, which is still, in SAN after five days is still 'broken.' In hindsight, the GPU (Ground Power) which connects to the aircraft to provide power to the plane while on the ground was Arching while connected to the aircraft. This resulted in a COMPLETE electrical failure of the plane. Local Contract Maintenance cannot fix this problem. I have seen American Airlines maintenance trucks from LA come down to try to resolve this issue, but there is no fix. Most likely, Boeing will have to be brought down from Seattle and have engineers fix the plane. The plane is not air-worthy at this moment. I'm pretty sure JAL is pissed at the airport for allowing this Faulty GPU provide power to their planes and get away with it, most likely it was a damaged plug that sourced the arching. Right now, there is still an investigation going on. And it would be smart for the airport to waive the overnight parking fees for the plane until this mess is resolved.

Image

Image






Ouch, that's gotta be expensive. With the GPU being SDIA's property, that's gonna hurt to pay that bill.

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 9:35 pm
by irelayer
WN732 wrote:
redrooster3 wrote:
Hey everybody! To update you on JA824J, which is still, in SAN after five days is still 'broken.' In hindsight, the GPU (Ground Power) which connects to the aircraft to provide power to the plane while on the ground was Arching while connected to the aircraft. This resulted in a COMPLETE electrical failure of the plane. Local Contract Maintenance cannot fix this problem. I have seen American Airlines maintenance trucks from LA come down to try to resolve this issue, but there is no fix. Most likely, Boeing will have to be brought down from Seattle and have engineers fix the plane. The plane is not air-worthy at this moment. I'm pretty sure JAL is pissed at the airport for allowing this Faulty GPU provide power to their planes and get away with it, most likely it was a damaged plug that sourced the arching. Right now, there is still an investigation going on. And it would be smart for the airport to waive the overnight parking fees for the plane until this mess is resolved.

Image

Image






Ouch, that's gotta be expensive. With the GPU being SDIA's property, that's gonna hurt to pay that bill.


Wow that's a helluva mistake...

I've noticed this plane for 2 straight days now and was wondering why it was broken.

-IR

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 9:59 pm
by blacksoviet
One more mishap like this and JAL will threaten to reduce service to 3x weekly. This GPU is unacceptable.

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 10:20 pm
by bw50505
blacksoviet wrote:
One more mishap like this and JAL will threaten to reduce service to 3x weekly. This GPU is unacceptable.


Do you have a source or is that an opinion?

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 11:11 pm
by SANFan
bw50505 wrote:
blacksoviet wrote:
One more mishap like this and JAL will threaten to reduce service to 3x weekly. This GPU is unacceptable.


Do you have a source or is that an opinion?

(We've had this question asked before of this poster...)

Why in the world would JAL punish themselves by cutting a profitable daily route to less than daily?

I assume SDIA will try to pass the costs of this incident on to whomever handles JAL below the wings for not reporting the issue sooner so it could get fixed. It's possible that the arching occurred only once, when it was attached to this 787 in which case I bet SDIA will go after the manufacturer of the GPU, or will have insurance to cover it.

Maybe JAL and SDIA should hold an "open-aircraft" event for the public, charge $5 bucks a pop, and help pay for the repairs that way!

Anyway, this is a sad occurrence for both the airline and the airport and I hope they can get that beautiful bird back in service soon!

(And thanx, Red' for the info on what's been going on.)

bb

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 11:19 pm
by kliff0rd
San Diegan former lurker here. I think what's most likely is someone's insurance will pay for this, either SDIA or the handling company. Either way, I'm sure there will be new policies in place going forward for inspection of ground equipment.

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 11:51 pm
by SANFan
kliff0rd wrote:
San Diegan former lurker here. I think what's most likely is someone's insurance will pay for this, either SDIA or the handling company. Either way, I'm sure there will be new policies in place going forward for inspection of ground equipment.

Absolutely. And welcome, kliff', former lurker, to A.net and the San Diego thread! I hope you stay around and post a lot here.

I think those who called this a '"mistake" jumped the gun here. It's like a bad lamp chord in the living room; IF it's old, frayed or chewed-thru a while back by Rover, then yeah, if a fire starts, that's the homeowners fault (and insurance will hopefully take care of the damage.) But if something suddenly happens to the chord that immediately results in something bad happening, that's a different situation. (And of course, hopefully insurance will still take care of it.) That's how I see it anyway.

I can't believe that the airport doesn't inspect and replace these things on a regular basis. Heck, they just completed replacing the older jetways at SDIA. That's not a quick or cheap project...

bb

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 12:06 am
by Scooter
Thanks 'rooster for the explanation as to why that JAL 787 has been sitting for so long. I too thought it was a Comic Con charter.

Speaking of Comic Con charters, I was looking at the departures board after flying in on AC from YYZ this morning, and I noticed that there was a Delta flight (403 I think it was) with the destination listed as "London Heathrow" scheduled to depart at 12:45(ish). I thought that was really odd (and way cool) so I scurried over to the gate to see what was going on and it was just the normal 752 to JFK. I was hoping to see an A330 charter to LHR...

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 1:00 am
by blacksoviet
I still hope a hardstand can be made available so Mahan Air can begin 3x weekly service utilizing their former Air France 747-300M. Could a 747 fit at gate 22?

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 4:02 pm
by WN732
blacksoviet wrote:
I still hope a hardstand can be made available so Mahan Air can begin 3x weekly service utilizing their former Air France 747-300M. Could a 747 fit at gate 22?


Yes, they could - But why would they serve SAN over LAX?

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 5:41 pm
by blacksoviet
WN732 wrote:
blacksoviet wrote:
I still hope a hardstand can be made available so Mahan Air can begin 3x weekly service utilizing their former Air France 747-300M. Could a 747 fit at gate 22?


Yes, they could - But why would they serve SAN over LAX?

More convenient for people in Mexico. TIJ might also work.

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 6:18 pm
by SANFan
blacksoviet wrote:
I still hope a hardstand can be made available so Mahan Air can begin 3x weekly service utilizing their former Air France 747-300M. Could a 747 fit at gate 22?

BA flies a 747 to SAN daily for months at a time -- in the recent pass and the near future - like later this year. So yes, the 747 is welcome at Lindbergh.

bb

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 8:59 pm
by SANAV8R
blacksoviet wrote:
WN732 wrote:
blacksoviet wrote:
I still hope a hardstand can be made available so Mahan Air can begin 3x weekly service utilizing their former Air France 747-300M. Could a 747 fit at gate 22?


Yes, they could - But why would they serve SAN over LAX?

More convenient for people in Mexico. TIJ might also work.


I'm very curious about this sudden demand to Iran from SAN and TIJ.
Mexicans that would travel to Iran can easily connect at MEX and onward by many European hubs (AF, LH, BA, etc.)

Anyways, no Iranian carrier could serve the U.S. until diplomatic relations are established between the two countries.

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:13 pm
by Coronado990
SANAV8R wrote:
blacksoviet wrote:
WN732 wrote:

Yes, they could - But why would they serve SAN over LAX?

More convenient for people in Mexico. TIJ might also work.


I'm very curious about this sudden demand to Iran from SAN and TIJ.
Mexicans that would travel to Iran can easily connect at MEX and onward by many European hubs (AF, LH, BA, etc.)

Anyways, no Iranian carrier could serve the U.S. until diplomatic relations are established between the two countries.


Then TIJ may be their only option to serve the region.

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:53 pm
by DLSANMan
redrooster3 wrote:
Hey everybody! To update you on JA824J, which is still, in SAN after five days is still 'broken.' In hindsight, the GPU (Ground Power) which connects to the aircraft to provide power to the plane while on the ground was Arching while connected to the aircraft. This resulted in a COMPLETE electrical failure of the plane. Local Contract Maintenance cannot fix this problem. I have seen American Airlines maintenance trucks from LA come down to try to resolve this issue, but there is no fix. Most likely, Boeing will have to be brought down from Seattle and have engineers fix the plane. The plane is not air-worthy at this moment. I'm pretty sure JAL is pissed at the airport for allowing this Faulty GPU provide power to their planes and get away with it, most likely it was a damaged plug that sourced the arching. Right now, there is still an investigation going on. And it would be smart for the airport to waive the overnight parking fees for the plane until this mess is resolved.

Image

Image



Thanks Rooster!!! Not good for SAN. I'm sure it is not costing anything to park. That could be the least they could do.

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 10:16 pm
by blacksoviet
Why was the original Main Terminal demolished in 1968? When was the PSA Commuter Terminal built?

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 10:17 pm
by SANFan
Something about the electrical issue with the JAL 787 just occurred to me. Maybe someone with knowledge of aircraft e systems can help.

Wouldn't a very expensive piece of equipment like a 787 have some sort of fuse that would blow before letting a short or super-jolt go through the airplane ruining almost all electronics on board? I would think such an obvious (and vulnerable?) entry point into an aircraft's electrical system as a GPU plug-in would have some sort of fuse or breaker that would stop whatever bad has come through the GPU, saving everything else downline.

Heck, my $4 set of Christmas lights has a fuse and my house has a breaker panel. Why not a $250M state-of-the-art jetliner?

Just wondering...

bb

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2017 6:16 am
by amadorE175
http://www.philstar.com/business/2017/07/24/1720755/pal-sets-aside-2-b-fleet-expansion-program

"PAL senior vice president for corporate planning Angelito Alvarez, for his part, said the airline is also looking into mounting flights from Manila to Chicago and Seattle."

I know a few years back PAL was talking about SAN as a possible destination and I was still holding out some hope that they would. However, based on this, it looks like other cities are a higher priority for PAL right now. Maybe if they continue with their expansion and add more planes on top of their current orders they'd be open to the idea of coming to San Diego. It's a shame. A PAL A350 would look quite pretty landing during sunset.

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2017 6:36 am
by Yahnih
Condor airlines officially dropped the route to San Diego in 2018. Hoping for a Thomas Cook announcement


http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/bus ... story.html

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2017 3:33 pm
by SANFan
Yahnih wrote:
Condor airlines officially dropped the route to San Diego in 2018. Hoping for a Thomas Cook announcement
http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/bus ... story.html

Just to clarify, the "Hoping for a T C announcement" was NOT part of the article in the U-T; I'm pretty sure the paper knows nothing about the rumors concerning MT possibly replacing DE at SAN next year. Awaiting MT's next announcements about new U.S. routes from MAN, those rumors, and hope, remain alive.

amadorE175 wrote:
"PAL senior vice president for corporate planning Angelito Alvarez, for his part, said the airline is also looking into mounting flights from Manila to Chicago and Seattle."

I know a few years back PAL was talking about SAN as a possible destination and I was still holding out some hope that they would. However, based on this, it looks like other cities are a higher priority for PAL right now. Maybe if they continue with their expansion and add more planes on top of their current orders they'd be open to the idea of coming to San Diego. It's a shame. A PAL A350 would look quite pretty landing during sunset.

IMO, that [MNL-YVR-SAN] ship has sailed, years ago. However, if PAL will start nonstop MNL-NYC with the new a/c, that might leave YVR available for another tag-on to another city....

In 2008, PAL DID formally apply to the DOT for authority to fly MNL-YVR-SAN. If anyone sees that application revived or updated, please share it with us! Until that time, I continue to believe PAL has moved on from their previous interest in SAN. Unfortunately. I agree that seeing the Sunburst sitting in SAN would be a very pretty sight.

bb

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2017 4:59 pm
by SANMAN66
Yahnih wrote:
Condor airlines officially dropped the route to San Diego in 2018. Hoping for a Thomas Cook announcement


http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/bus ... story.html

I wonder if Condor would have considered SAN-MUC Instead of FRA? A MUC flight could stay seasonal
with Condor. It just seems as if Lufthansa scared them off!

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2017 5:02 pm
by SANMAN66
SANAV8R wrote:
north ramp for parking (where the JL 787 is currently parked)


Is the JAL bird still there?

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2017 5:35 pm
by User001
SANMAN66 wrote:
Yahnih wrote:
Condor airlines officially dropped the route to San Diego in 2018. Hoping for a Thomas Cook announcement


http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/bus ... story.html

I wonder if Condor would have considered SAN-MUC Instead of FRA? A MUC flight could stay seasonal
with Condor. It just seems as if Lufthansa scared them off!


Condor are pulling their entire long haul programme from Munich so if the Thomas Cook group are to keep a presence in San Diego then it's Frankfurt or Manchester only.

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2017 5:55 pm
by blacksoviet
Would a Condor flight to Manchester force BA to down-gauge to 777 year-round?

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2017 6:06 pm
by User001
I would say it's unlikely. There should be enough market demand for a daily B744 to LHR and a 2 weekly A330 to Manchester. What may cause a BA downgrade is if Norwegian try LGW-SAN.

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2017 6:10 pm
by Yahnih
I think MAN is totally different market so I don't see why there would need to be an equipment change. Also, "hoping" was my own hope, not from the article.

I really hope an Asia flight comes soon.. there's no competitor for JAL flights out of Asia to SD so their prices are 20% to 50% more than LA and I'm still taking a stopover in either LAX/SFO or NRT to get back home. Flying into SAN immigration is way better than LAX (even though I use Global entry, nothing beats flying over your home after a long flight).

Just like the previous poster said, as much as PAL makes sense.. they have priorities to make themselves more "world class" to achieve 5-Star. So I feel they're aiming for more "prestige" routes and attract more attention elsewhere, even though San Diego has one of the largest Filipino populations. JAL takes that market as well, their local promotions include SAN-MNL at various Asian grocery markets in SD. Also, fyi, Asiana and PAL both offer shuttle service to LAX from San Diego. So ....maybe they're doing well with that. (Filipinos and Koreans make up the majority of our Asian population in San Diego)

I just really hope China Eastern is the one that bites for China (they're aircraft seems to most updated and provide seamless transfers out of their Shanghai hub) And also Korean Air. They both have the 787/a359 on order. Also our little airport is proving we can handle most wide bodies except for maybe the 747-8 and a380.

Come on SD!

Also, where is this Iran demand coming from? Did I miss something ??? Why is there a strong discussion with Iran TIJ etc..

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2017 6:14 pm
by Yahnih
User001 wrote:
I would say it's unlikely. There should be enough market demand for a daily B744 to LHR and a 2 weekly A330 to Manchester. What may cause a BA downgrade is if Norwegian try LGW-SAN.


I feel if Norwegian came, they would try their Paris route rather than LGW. But, I could see them trying to take away from BA. I feel like SAN is some sort of battleground.. with LH scaring of Condor.. I feel it's a matter of time before Airlines realize the potential of SAN. I think in a matter of years, SAN might be a more lucrative choice than LAX and people will be driving down here for flights.

I do hope, we keep bringing in these world-class carriers. I'm not saying OAK is an LCC hangout, but they have become some sort of Norwegian mini-hub up there. (Id like to avoid that). I see SAN (with the new ex-SJC president) will somehow fit right in between the class of SJC and SFO...not too big, not too small. But just right! SAN is the perfect mix of business and travelers. We are a tourist destination but we also do have a strong tech/pharm/bio/military/ market too. I love the variety SAN is getting and will continue to get.

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2017 6:22 pm
by Yahnih
blacksoviet wrote:
One more mishap like this and JAL will threaten to reduce service to 3x weekly. This GPU is unacceptable.


I doubt this would ever happen. I've flown JAL frequently different times of the year. I've been lucky to fly both their business (please update our aircraft with the new lie flats) and economy sections from time to time and each time those cabins were pretty much over 80-90% full.

However, JAL 788 are low configuration. I'm hoping we can get a 789 or a350 soon! (But that's hopeful wishing) it may happen though if we don't get another Asia flight for awhile

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2017 7:12 pm
by blacksoviet
How many international gates will be in the new Terminal 1?

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2017 8:24 pm
by mrpippy
SANMAN66 wrote:
SANAV8R wrote:
north ramp for parking (where the JL 787 is currently parked)


Is the JAL bird still there?


Looks like it flew to NRT yesterday as JAL8065, probably a ferry/positioning flight.

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2017 8:47 pm
by Devilfish
Yahnih wrote:
Just like the previous poster said, as much as PAL makes sense.. they have priorities to make themselves more "world class" to achieve 5-Star. So I feel they're aiming for more "prestige" routes and attract more attention elsewhere, even though San Diego has one of the largest Filipino populations.

I doubt PAL would put 'prestige' ahead of making money if there was plenty to be had on MNL-SAN-MNL. Ethnic concentration alone does not guarantee a successful route once you factor in the necessities of opening that extra station. Just look at LAX-CEB where the prerequisites were deemed abundantly present. As pointed out in #431 above, MNL-JFK transition to a nonstop operation with the A359 next year might allow the start of MNL-YVR-SAN...though I feel its flourishing is as elusive as the A338 achieving serial production.

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 1:51 am
by SANFan
blacksoviet wrote:
How many international gates will be in the new Terminal 1?

Ummmm, blacksoviet, I would suggest you take some time and read through this thread, as well as doing some research on SAN.org. IMO, a lot of your ongoing questions have easily-found answers, especially earlier on this thread. It's nice to have someone curious about SAN-related things but perhaps be a bit more selective about your questions.

And please try to differentiate between your opinions and thoughts, and confirmable facts that you can provide links or references to.

It is nice to have you here on the SAN-thread and I look forward to your future posts.

(These are my thoughts and may or may not be shared by other regulars here on the SAN-thread.)

bb

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 2:15 am
by SANFan
Devilfish wrote:
Yahnih wrote:
Just like the previous poster said, as much as PAL makes sense.. they have priorities to make themselves more "world class" to achieve 5-Star. So I feel they're aiming for more "prestige" routes and attract more attention elsewhere, even though San Diego has one of the largest Filipino populations.

I doubt PAL would put 'prestige' ahead of making money if there was plenty to be had on MNL-SAN-MNL. Ethnic concentration alone does not guarantee a successful route once you factor in the necessities of opening that extra station. Just look at LAX-CEB where the prerequisites were deemed abundantly present. As pointed out in #431 above, MNL-JFK transition to a nonstop operation with the A359 next year might allow the start of MNL-YVR-SAN...though I feel its flourishing is as elusive as the A338 achieving serial production.

Thanks 'fish for your usual sharp and insightful thoughts on all things Philippines, PAL, and regarding SAN-MNL.

I was just wondering if the military might be another important part of traffic between SAN and MNL? I have no idea but have heard that the JAL flights carry a healthy amount of military business and I think I remember hearing somewhere that MNL was the final destination of at least some of that traffic.

IF there is still/again interest by PR in MNL-SAN, I have no idea if it would be for nonstop service, or the previous idea of a tag-on to MNL-YVR (which the actual application to the U.S. DOT back in '08 was for. Now that SAN seems to be in an "attractive" position regarding intercontinental air service interest, I suppose it is possible that PR could be re-interested in our corner of the U.S....

If you, Devilfish, hear or see anything that might be of interest to us San Diego av-geeks, it would be very much appreciated if you would share it with us here. Thanks in advance, my friend.

Hey SANMAN66, what do you think about military interest in a SAN-MNL flight? I know you were one of the original 'pushers' of the SAN-MNL connection back in 2007/8 prior to the FAA downgrade when everything went "Poof"! Do you think it's time to jump-start our interest in the idea of PAL coming to SAN on a regular basis?

bb

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 8:03 am
by Yahnih
Devilfish wrote:
Yahnih wrote:
Just like the previous poster said, as much as PAL makes sense.. they have priorities to make themselves more "world class" to achieve 5-Star. So I feel they're aiming for more "prestige" routes and attract more attention elsewhere, even though San Diego has one of the largest Filipino populations.

I doubt PAL would put 'prestige' ahead of making money if there was plenty to be had on MNL-SAN-MNL. Ethnic concentration alone does not guarantee a successful route once you factor in the necessities of opening that extra station. Just look at LAX-CEB where the prerequisites were deemed abundantly present. As pointed out in #431 above, MNL-JFK transition to a nonstop operation with the A359 next year might allow the start of MNL-YVR-SAN...though I feel its flourishing is as elusive as the A338 achieving serial production.


To be honest I think Cebu didn't succeed because marketing was low. Being mixed Filipino myself, many people didn't know within the Philippines and California until I told people. The penetration was low in terms of market exposure. Plus, remember CEB is not MNL, so it wouldn't be fair to compare the "ethnic concentration" factor for the San Diego loads. I think an MNL - YVR - SAn may work. But I can tell u first hand.. lots of San Diegans would prefer the nonstop. I know lots of people on buddy passes that took Delta and most of them would be coming from San Diego on their SD - LAX - NRT - MNL route. Also many take Cathay and EVA.

Yes, SEA and ORD could potentially be money making routes. I'd rather SAN than SEA, considering YVR is right there.

Also, PAL has become competitive recently on flights. My top return flights (in terms of fare) have from ICN to LAX/SAN with a stopover in MNL. I know the China carriers have been pushing prices down.

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 5:04 pm
by SANMAN66
SANFan wrote:
Hey SANMAN66, what do you think about military interest in a SAN-MNL flight? I know you were one of the original 'pushers' of the SAN-MNL connection back in 2007/8 prior to the FAA downgrade when everything went "Poof"! Do you think it's time to jump-start our interest in the idea of PAL coming to SAN on a regular basis?

bb


Oh absolutely! In a way I'm still a little bit angry that PAL lost interest so fast after the Philippines regained the FAA
upgrade. I'm sure SDIA pushed the idea that San Diego is a Navy town, in addition to the large Filipino population here.
But now I hear that JAL is handling the MNL-bound pax just nicely. The pax simply connect at NRT. I suspect that since
there was a large demand, from SAN to NRT and MNL, is the reason why JAL used a 777 while the 787 ban was still on. I also
believe that PR missed out on an opportunity when they lost interest in SAN, and JAL seized the opportunity. SDIA could
jump-start interest in landing PR, but I don't think the pax numbers will be as high as before they were before JAL
came in.

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 5:14 pm
by SANMAN66
mrpippy wrote:
SANMAN66 wrote:
SANAV8R wrote:
north ramp for parking (where the JL 787 is currently parked)


Is the JAL bird still there?


Looks like it flew to NRT yesterday as JAL8065, probably a ferry/positioning flight.


Probably flew back to NRT to reposition and return as flight#66 to SAN! :rotfl:

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 5:24 pm
by SANMAN66
Yahnih wrote:
I feel if Norwegian came, they would try their Paris route rather than LGW. But, I could see them trying to take away from BA.


That is my feeling too! My guess is that Norwegian would try Paris to try to get a jump on
the SAN-CDG route before AF shows up! Going after BA in SAN would be a little too
bold I would think, since BA is very well entrenched here!

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 7:54 pm
by SANFan
SANMAN66 wrote:
mrpippy wrote:
SANMAN66 wrote:

Is the JAL bird still there?


Looks like it flew to NRT yesterday as JAL8065, probably a ferry/positioning flight.


Probably flew back to NRT to reposition and return as flight#66 to SAN! :rotfl:

And I bet it brought its own extension cord!

bb

Re: What's happening lately at SAN?

Posted: Fri Jul 28, 2017 3:34 pm
by SANAV8R
SANFan wrote:
I was just wondering if the military might be another important part of traffic between SAN and MNL? I have no idea but have heard that the JAL flights carry a healthy amount of military business and I think I remember hearing somewhere that MNL was the final destination of at least some of that traffic.


There really isn't the military traffic between the two countries anymore. The U.S. doesn't have huge bases like Subic Bay or Clark over there anymore. And the current Duterte administration has become unpredictable in upholding longstanding joint defense agreements between the U.S. and the Philippines instead planning to engage with Russia and China (and also clashing with them on territorial rights in the South China Sea). Although it was also announced recently that the U.S. would help upgrade some Philippine military facilities. Most of the MNL bound traffic would likely be VFR or Business.

I'm sure JL probably carries a number of SAN originating passengers flying to get to places like NAS Atsugi or MCAS Iwakuni or even Guam, although any official travel would be done by the contract carrier (which in GSA for SANNRT/SANTYO FY17 is AA)