Does anyone know why there isn't a non stop flight between Houston (IAH) and New York (JFK)?? Or have i been mistaken. Thanks for replies in advance!

Not hard to figure out.
UAL dropped JFK.

DL, AA and I believe CO have tried it. All have failed. Combined with UA no longer in JFK, it kind of speaks for itself unfortunately.

now the closest you can get is on jetBlue down the road at Hobby HOU-JFK

That's crazy. A major hub in the 4th largest metropolitan area in the country doesn't even have direct flights to the busiest international airport in the country, in the largest metropolitan area.

MaxTrimm wrote:

That's crazy. A major hub in the 4th largest metropolitan area in the country doesn't even have direct flights to the busiest international airport in the country, in the largest metropolitan area.

Yeah seems odd to me as well. But historically IAH-JFK never seems to work and many such as Pan Am, Eastern, TWA, CO, I believe that DL and AA have taken a shot at the route with no success, I too would like to know why.

MaxTrimm wrote:

That's crazy. A major hub in the 4th largest metropolitan area in the country doesn't even have direct flights to the busiest international airport in the country, in the largest metropolitan area.

Not crazy at all. JFK is not the preferred airport for non-transcon domestic O&D, and what international connectivity is offered over JFK can generally be replicated, and then some, at United's megahub at EWR.

MaxTrimm wrote:

That's crazy. A major hub in the 4th largest metropolitan area in the country doesn't even have direct flights to the busiest international airport in the country, in the largest metropolitan area.

It might seem that way, but IAH has a massive amount of international service that makes pretty much all of what you can do out of JFK redundant.

Not sure it is sustainable .... at least in the last 25 years. IAH has so much international service to Europe there isn't much benefit to a JFK connection really. I'm sure B6 has run the numbers and if it were worthwhile they would be in the market - what with all their interline partners.

Delta usually flies it with a CR9. When did it end?

I cant imagine, with all the feed DL has at JFK, that houston isnt there...but as of now it's not

braniff2hav wrote:

Not sure it is sustainable .... at least in the last 25 years. IAH has so much international service to Europe there isn't much benefit to a JFK connection really. I'm sure B6 has run the numbers and if it were worthwhile they would be in the market - what with all their interline partners.

They are in the market via HOU, along with BOS - those markets rotate seasonally between E190 and 320

Actually during the time of CO, they tried it twice. They route came and went twice, maybe even three times. One effort was around the time of 9/11. The word on here was that CO had had good loads on those flights. However, the flights were low yield, lots of connections on foreign carriers at JFK. At one point CO was at 4x a day during one of their attempts.
Not long ago, I am pretty sure AA was in this market also. I haven't read all the posts to see if this was already mentioned though.

braniff2hav wrote:

Not sure it is sustainable .... at least in the last 25 years. IAH has so much international service to Europe there isn't much benefit to a JFK connection really. I'm sure B6 has run the numbers and if it were worthwhile they would be in the market - what with all their interline partners.

well, as I noted B6 is in the market and has been for many years, flying HOU-JFK.

As others have noted it does not add much. I flew JFK-IAH on DL years ago, and if they route had to return to IAH, DL would be my guess; but I doubt it will happen.

If anyone would do this, it should be DL. However, it looks like they have tried and thought better of it. Timing a flight into JFK to connect ot the Euro bank of flights would be nice, but I guess they think that ATL offers a similar level of service.
It's pretty much impossible to connect from IAH onto an AZ flight, as DL also does not serve ORD from IAH.

jfklganyc wrote:

Delta usually flies it with a CR9. When did it end?

I cant imagine, with all the feed DL has at JFK, that houston isnt there...but as of now it's not

They moved it (and CVG) to HOU. CVG moved back to IAH and JFK-HOU got cut.
I believe JFK-HOU went when LGA-IAH started but I'm not 100% on that.

IAHWorldflyer wrote:

It's pretty much impossible to connect from IAH onto an AZ flight, as DL also does not serve ORD from IAH.

You can do that via CDG or AMS if you want to stay with Skyteam, or connect through STL on DL the whole way. Doesn't AZ also fly to LAX? I know that's a back track, but still fits your question.

They flew JFK IAH after the HOU attempt

It was flown until recently...I didnt even know it ended.

If you are going into the downtown Houston, dont know why anyone would want to go IAH

jfklganyc wrote:

They flew JFK IAH after the HOU attempt

It was flown until recently...I didnt even know it ended.

If you are going into the downtown Houston, dont know why anyone would want to go IAH

Why does flying into IAH not make sense to go downtown? That statement doesn't make sense.

IAH to downtown Houston: let's say 19 miles

DEN to downtown Denver: let's say 27 miles

ORD to downtown Chicago: let's say 18 miles

JFK to midtown New York City: let's say 18 miles of stopped traffic

DTW to downtown Detroit: let's say 22 miles

stlgph wrote:

jfklganyc wrote:

They flew JFK IAH after the HOU attempt

It was flown until recently...I didnt even know it ended.

If you are going into the downtown Houston, dont know why anyone would want to go IAH

Why does flying into IAH not make sense to go downtown? That statement doesn't make sense.

IAH to downtown Houston: let's say 19 miles

DEN to downtown Denver: let's say 27 miles

ORD to downtown Chicago: let's say 18 miles

JFK to midtown New York City: let's say 18 miles of stopped traffic

DTW to downtown Detroit: let's say 22 miles

Because Hobby to downtown is 11 miles.

Keep in mind the travel demo. Most traveling for business prefer ewr and lga. I am sure most tourist traveling to NYC are using lga or ewr also. JFK isn't needed for international connections from Houston anymore. All of that adds up to weak Houston-JFK demand.

jfklganyc wrote:

They flew JFK IAH after the HOU attempt

It was flown until recently...I didnt even know it ended.

If you are going into the downtown Houston, dont know why anyone would want to go IAH

Referring to AA right? I'm pretty sure AA flew JFK-IAH which was launched within the last 2-3 years. I had no idea it dropped.

piedmont762 wrote:

Referring to AA right? I'm pretty sure AA flew JFK-IAH which was launched within the last 2-3 years. I had no idea it dropped.

AA never flew JFK-HOU. AA flew JFK-IAH for a brief period (I believe only about 18 months) starting in April 2013. AA also flew LGA-HOU, 3x daily MD80s, for several years in the late 1990s and up until around 9/11 - the flights continued to/from AUS. Interestingly, for a shorter period, AA also flew DCA-HOU, 2-3x daily MD80s, continuing to/from SAT, and LAX-HOU, 2x daily MD80s from 1999 until also around 9/11 (if I remember correctly).

While there might be a case for UA HOU-EWR as it could be that UA has a large Mileage Plus passenger base wishing for a well timed HOU-EWR/EWR-HOU to avoid driving across Houston, having a huge F.F. passenger base isn't the case in favour of an UA IAH-JFK/JFK-IAH, specially if UA already flies IAH-LGA. Perhaps for those on deep Long Island, an EWR-ISP may be more suitable.
Any possible new UA IAH-JFK must be timed to offer inmediate connections to/from those (Transatlantic) Star Alliance flights not available from EWR (or IAD, ORD and IAH).
And flying IAH-JFK on a E145 is out of the question.

2travel2know2 wrote:

While there might be a case for UA HOU-EWR as it could be that UA has a large Mileage Plus passenger base wishing for a well timed HOU-EWR/EWR-HOU to avoid driving across Houston, having a huge F.F. passenger base isn't the case in favour of an UA IAH-JFK/JFK-IAH, specially if UA already flies IAH-LGA. Perhaps for those on deep Long Island, an EWR-ISP may be more suitable.
Any possible new UA IAH-JFK must be timed to offer inmediate connections to/from those (Transatlantic) Star Alliance flights not available from EWR (or IAD, ORD and IAH).

UA really isn't big on flying to alternate airports near its hubs, from its other hubs, so I don't see EWR-HOU happening. There's no way such a service could appeal to business travelers if it didn't have a comparable frequency to EWR-IAH, which would essentially force UA to double its capacity.

I'm pretty sure there aren't any *A flights that fit that description. Any route served from JFK is also served from IAH or a UA hub with shuttle service to IAH.

I think Houston-New York has a lot of capacity already. Perhaps AA or DL could add capacity but they would have to offer more than just 1 daily so the outlay is not worth it. United has pricing power because of some competitive advantages. I would say Flagship hubs in both markets and a big FF base. Pricing power means that AA or DL would get pounded. UA would dilute their yields because they would probably set the price in the market. Starting a route between two business centers with fewer than three daily flights is not adequate for the business pax, who would probably prefer LGA as was mentioned by several posters. JFK-IAH would require a big investment and dumping capacity to be run off by UA, that has a sizable fortress at IAH

commavia wrote:

piedmont762 wrote:

Referring to AA right? I'm pretty sure AA flew JFK-IAH which was launched within the last 2-3 years. I had no idea it dropped.

AA never flew JFK-HOU. AA flew JFK-IAH for a brief period (I believe only about 18 months) starting in April 2013. AA also flew LGA-HOU, 3x daily MD80s, for several years in the late 1990s and up until around 9/11 - the flights continued to/from AUS. Interestingly, for a shorter period, AA also flew DCA-HOU, 2-3x daily MD80s, continuing to/from SAT, and LAX-HOU, 2x daily MD80s from 1999 until also around 9/11 (if I remember correctly).

I never asked about JFK to HOU, only IAH

2travel2know2 wrote:

While there might be a case for UA HOU-EWR as it could be that UA has a large Mileage Plus passenger base wishing for a well timed HOU-EWR/EWR-HOU to avoid driving across Houston, having a huge F.F. passenger base isn't the case in favour of an UA IAH-JFK/JFK-IAH, specially if UA already flies IAH-LGA. Perhaps for those on deep Long Island, an EWR-ISP may be more suitable.
Any possible new UA IAH-JFK must be timed to offer inmediate connections to/from those (Transatlantic) Star Alliance flights not available from EWR (or IAD, ORD and IAH).
And flying IAH-JFK on a E145 is out of the question.

Definitely not. UA (mostly from CO) already had a nasty reputation for flying 145s on 3-4 hour flights and on IAH to JFK would be a total disaster.

UAs best bet is to fly a 757 or 753 on LGA to IAH instead

piedmont762 wrote:

UAs best bet is to fly a 757 or 753 on LGA to IAH instead

Which they already fly. ~7x daily all mainline on a mix of 737s and A320s. DL flies the route 4x daily with E170s or CRJ900s.

CO tried HOU-EWR something like 10 years ago (or what is HOU-JFK?), but it didn't work out. I think they pulled the route around the same time WN pulled out of IAH.

bvseball wrote:

Does anyone know why there isn't a non stop flight between Houston (IAH) and New York (JFK)??

Maybe because Houston travelers who want to go to Manhattan would prefer flying into LGA. DL flies it. UA flies it. WN also flies HOU-LGA.

UA is #1 in Houston and has its primary TATL hub at EWR, diminishing demand for JFK connections. IAH also has pretty good levels of TATL service, lessening the need for onward NYC-area connections.

Maybe DL thinks it can poach some TATL traffic and will start a couple of well-timed IAH-JFK. It would be competing with its own LGA service on Houston-NYC O&D, and with its own ATL TATL onnections, however.

As for B6 IAH-JFK ... well, maybe.

I don't think IAH/HOU - NYC is exactly underserved. If there's room in the market it might be for a ULCC. Then it's a question of room (slots and/or gates) at the airports.

commavia wrote:

MaxTrimm wrote:

That's crazy. A major hub in the 4th largest metropolitan area in the country doesn't even have direct flights to the busiest international airport in the country, in the largest metropolitan area.

Not crazy at all. JFK is not the preferred airport for non-transcon domestic O&D, and what international connectivity is offered over JFK can generally be replicated, and then some, at United's megahub at EWR.

Bingo. People don't often realize that even AA only do 2x daily DFWJFK and DL 1x daily DFWJFK and that's with massive international networks out of JFK on the other end. Given UA doesn't have that JFK presence it's maybe not that surprising that IAHJFK hasn't worked.

MIflyer12 wrote:

bvseball wrote:

Does anyone know why there isn't a non stop flight between Houston (IAH) and New York (JFK)??

Maybe because Houston travelers who want to go to Manhattan would prefer flying into LGA. DL flies it. UA flies it. WN also flies HOU-LGA.

UA is #1 in Houston and has its primary TATL hub at EWR, diminishing demand for JFK connections. IAH also has pretty good levels of TATL service, lessening the need for onward NYC-area connections.

Maybe DL thinks it can poach some TATL traffic and will start a couple of well-timed IAH-JFK. It would be competing with its own LGA service on Houston-NYC O&D, and with its own ATL TATL onnections, however.

As for B6 IAH-JFK ... well, maybe.

I don't think IAH/HOU - NYC is exactly underserved. If there's room in the market it might be for a ULCC. Then it's a question of room (slots and/or gates) at the airports.

B6 at IAH in lieu of the current HOU service?

Does DL fully codeshare the KLM and Air France flights from IAH? Assuming that they do, what would be the point of connecting to JFK to get onto Delta's European flights? Plus you can connect via Atlanta from IAH and HOU right now anyway. JFK is primarily an international gateway as is which doesn't do much for Houston given IAH's extensive collection of direct routes.

klakzky123 wrote:

Does DL fully codeshare the KLM and Air France flights from IAH? Assuming that they do, what would be the point of connecting to JFK to get onto Delta's European flights? Plus you can connect via Atlanta from IAH and HOU right now anyway. JFK is primarily an international gateway as is which doesn't do much for Houston given IAH's extensive collection of direct routes.

I believe they do. I've seen Delta come up on Orbitz for searches of European flights from Houston. When you click on the flight information, the flights are actually operated by KLM or Air France.

From Houston, JFK is only useful for connecting to flights on foreign airlines that have their only flight to the United States at JFK. Even so, flying to a European hub and connecting there is better.

I wonder if B6 would move to IAH from HOU once they start flying TATL. Although one stop TATL connections would be a huge plus for Hobby. Tough call. A lot of businesses in Houston are shifting their operations focus North towards The Woodlands and West out towards Katy (I-10 between downtown and Katy is often referred to as the "Energy Corridor"), with more tech-oriented jobs and a new ExxonMobil campus in the Woodlands. Halliburton also has their campus on the North side of the Beltway, almost due south of IAH. Of course most companies management offices are in downton, but most of the workers are being spread out.

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/DAL8840
Delta 763 N173DZ carrying olympians JFK-IAH. JFK-IAH is a thing!

drerx7 wrote:

stlgph wrote:

jfklganyc wrote:

They flew JFK IAH after the HOU attempt

It was flown until recently...I didnt even know it ended.

If you are going into the downtown Houston, dont know why anyone would want to go IAH

Why does flying into IAH not make sense to go downtown? That statement doesn't make sense.

IAH to downtown Houston: let's say 19 miles

DEN to downtown Denver: let's say 27 miles

ORD to downtown Chicago: let's say 18 miles

JFK to midtown New York City: let's say 18 miles of stopped traffic

DTW to downtown Detroit: let's say 22 miles

Because Hobby to downtown is 11 miles.

so?
it's another 8 miles and IAH has the better services.
there are other things in life to worry about.

stlgph wrote:

so?
it's another 8 miles and IAH has the better services.
there are other things in life to worry about.

That stretch of I-45 between IAH and downtown is hell. You will be spending 30-45 minutes just in traffic in a personal car on a good day vs. the 15 minutes HOU to downtown.

Its simple. INTL traffic gets routed via EWR and NYC destination traffic gets routed to LGA. There really is no need for an IAH-JFK route unless it is out of hobby on a non-UA carrier. EWR is too dominant of a hub to IAH's largest carrier, UA

At one time CO was 4x daily on JFK-IAH. The previous try they were only twice daily. They were 737's, not express.

CO flew express between JFK and CLE.

CO also did HOU-EWR. I believe EWR was the only destination from HOU. This was years ago.

Both routes were not successful obviously.

I did not know DL dropped JFK-IAH. That is really making a statement.

I think UA is really done with JFK this time.

retaliashun wrote:

That stretch of I-45 between IAH and downtown is hell. You will be spending 30-45 minutes just in traffic in a personal car on a good day vs. the 15 minutes HOU to downtown.

Which still is a valid argument for a well timed UA E175 Monday-Saturday morning HOU-EWR and Sunday-Friday evening EWR-HOU.
Does Star Alliance have any JFK service which demands feed from IAH big enough to support at least fly E175 IAH-JFK-IAH (the smallest bearable aircraft on that route) to offer easy transfers between UA and that Star Alliance airline?

MaxTrimm wrote:

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/DAL8840
Delta 763 N173DZ carrying olympians JFK-IAH. JFK-IAH is a thing!

All the Olympic athletes are being outfitted for the Ralph Lauren uniforms at the convention center in downtown Houston, so that is likely why. Many are flying to Brasil from Houston after the fittings.

"All the U.S. Olympic teams are stopping in Houston on the way to Rio. The U.S. Olympic Committee's team processing setup will be in Houston. Athletes will get uniforms, credentials, etc. before heading to Brazil."

http://www.chron.com/sports/rockets/art ... 305464.php

2travel2know2 Posts: 2303Joined: 6 years ago










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retaliashun wrote:

That stretch of I-45 between IAH and downtown is hell. You will be spending 30-45 minutes just in traffic in a personal car on a good day vs. the 15 minutes HOU to downtown.
Which still is a valid argument for a well timed UA E175 Monday-Saturday morning HOU-EWR and Sunday-Friday evening EWR-HOU.
Does Star Alliance have any JFK service which demands feed from IAH big enough to support at least fly E175 IAH-JFK-IAH (the smallest bearable aircraft on that route) to offer easy transfers between UA and that Star Alliance airline?


Answer to your question: NO. And even if there was, UA is NOT going to put planes on a route just to provide feed to a partner UNLESS it was proven that there was local demand and good fares. Transit traffic, especially to a gateway such as JFK, tends to be low yield and not worth the effort, especially when an airline has better things to do with its resources. UA will NOT open a new station - HOU - just because there's traffic in Houston on its roadways, sorry. That's just not going to happen. ever.

retaliashun wrote:

stlgph wrote:

so?
it's another 8 miles and IAH has the better services.
there are other things in life to worry about.

That stretch of I-45 between IAH and downtown is hell. You will be spending 30-45 minutes just in traffic in a personal car on a good day vs. the 15 minutes HOU to downtown.

I disagree with you completely, and I live in the first ward 0.1 miles from downtown Houston. I chose IAH every time. You actually have I-45, Hardy toll road (always 70mph and dumps you right into IAH) and I-59 (which is usually free flowing).
On the contrary, going south on I-45 towards HOU is always hit or miss.
Not to mention IAH is a better airport with a lot more service.

Ill go one better. I live in Meyerland just south of the Galleria. I NEVER use HOU. I cannot stand Hobby. I don't necessarily love Bush, but Ill take it every time.

When I fly, I rarely go around rush hour. It takes 30 minutes to get to Bush going around 610 to 45, Hardy, or 59.