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lucianflyboy
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's tomorrow

Tue Aug 23, 2016 4:16 pm

AWACSooner wrote:
N5814D wrote:
I'll miss the Mad Dog, rode on that bird plenty of times from KOKC to various destinations...Matter of fact, the last one I took was KDFW-KOKC withthe coolest F/A ever. Had a great conversation about aviation and received free cocktails on a flight so short that there was no proper beverage service.


Just about any flight from OKC to the Metroplex is pretty much this:
*DING* We are leveled off. You can now use your large electronic devices...
2 second later...
*DING* We have begun our initial descent into the Dallas-Fort Worth area, please put away and stow your large electronic devices.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Truth! Same from DFW - IAH/SAT/TUL/AUS/LBB/MAF/ACT/AMA/ABI/GGG/TYR Up and down!
 
dfwjim1
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Tue Aug 23, 2016 4:30 pm

jco613 wrote:
So I just happened to be at FLL today to spot...and I totally blew it:

Arrived at the South Side 10R spotting area to hear "Ops 5 we need to reposition for a water cannon salute for a retiring pilot"

Then I looked up the flight and realized it was a Super 80. I figured I should just stay there even though they were taking off on 10L. The water cannon salute happened BEHIND the fire station and I got some blurry shots on my iPad of the plane taking off. Likely the last Super 80 ever at FLL. My question is, why FLL? Did the pilots (assuming they are all retiring as well) choose their airport? FLL does not normally see Super 80s, so it was shocking to me.

The Super 80 was a horrible plane as a passenger, but there is something about the bare metal shine on a sunny day that is just intoxicating.

Oh, and I left after that figuring my luck had run out. As I drove home, DL brought a rare August 767 in followed by Envoy's weekly flight from Guantanamo. Oh well.


Hey, at least you were there to capture some of the action!
 
airzona11
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Tue Aug 23, 2016 4:31 pm

This is an impressive logistical/ops event.

On a capacity basis, how much is AA reducing the fall flying? I assume these birds weren't flying a full schedule with high utilization (unless they were) at the end. But 20 planes is a lot even for an airline the size of AA. Are they reducing it 5/10/20 planes worth? Curious to know.
 
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dennypayne
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Tue Aug 23, 2016 4:41 pm

jco613 wrote:
The Super 80 was a horrible plane as a passenger


Horrible? Maybe if you got stuck in the back, but it's one of the quieter rides up towards the front, with no wing/engine obstruction to the view. With a seat on the 2 side near the front of economy, in first, or even in the exit row it was far from horrible. It's certainly more comfortable overall than the 738. I for one will miss them.
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flyingsundevil
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Tue Aug 23, 2016 4:44 pm

dptpa wrote:
I asked the pilots and they said they would all head back to DFW on scheduled ENY flights. I suppose they are blocking a certain amount of seats on each flight to get them home?


They are operating an extra two flights today, ENY3300 and ENY3376.
 
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ams747757
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Tue Aug 23, 2016 4:55 pm

Sad. We all knew it was coming but that doesn't make it any better when it actually happens like this. I see N494AA is still flying, not on this massive list, which is the only MD I've had a chance to fly on. I wasn't aware that PHL was still getting MD's, I'm guessing it was only for DFW-PHL? I thought ORD was pretty much A320/321, and DFW seemed to be mostly A32x with some 737s mixed in when I last searched it.
 
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767333ER
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's tomorrow

Tue Aug 23, 2016 5:09 pm

Beatyair wrote:
The MD's (140 seats) where replaced by A319's (128 seats) in Calgary. We occasionally get one and sad to see them go, but they are old.

We had them coming to YYC daily in back the winter and I made a point if going one day just to see it. That day ended up being a more exciting day at the airport than I had expected.

The MD-80 isn't totally gone yet, but when it is it will be missed.
Been on: 732 733 734 73G 738 752 763 A319 A320 A321 CRJ CR7 CRA/CR9 E145 E175 E190 F28 MD-82 MD-83 C172R C172S P2006T PA-28-180

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william
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Tue Aug 23, 2016 5:12 pm

If you have plane finder or Flight Radar you might want to look at Roswell now.
 
GG22
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Tue Aug 23, 2016 5:14 pm

FR24 looks quite amazing @ KROW right now
 
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Boeing778X
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Tue Aug 23, 2016 5:19 pm

N403A is arriving at ROW now! Congrats 403 on your long life!
United Airlines: $#!ttin' On Everyone Since 1931
 
stxbohn
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Tue Aug 23, 2016 5:31 pm

dptpa wrote:
ckfred wrote:
Here's my dumb question. How are they going to get all of the pilots back, presumably to DFW? Twenty airplanes means 40 pilots. Considering that service between ROW and DFW is all Embrear 135s and 145s, that's a lot of seats needed, just to deadhead crews back to DFW.


I was asking myself the exact same thing. I'm a controller at ORD and just worked N570AA operating as AAL9660 out. I asked the pilots and they said they would all head back to DFW on scheduled ENY flights. I suppose they are blocking a certain amount of seats on each flight to get them home?



Suspect return flights:

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/ASQ2820 - appears to normally be a SAF flight but going to ROW today
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/AAL3300 - appears to normally be a AMA flight doing ROW today
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/ENY3376
 
Sooner787
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Tue Aug 23, 2016 5:57 pm

william wrote:
If you have plane finder or Flight Radar you might want to look at Roswell now.



Looks like ROW is being attacked by Super 80's LOL
 
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OneSexyL1011
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Tue Aug 23, 2016 5:58 pm

Just a couple pics I saw online posted in the DC9 Facebook group a few mins ago.... (not my photos)

Image
Image
 
phllax
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Tue Aug 23, 2016 6:02 pm

ckfred wrote:
Here's my dumb question. How are they going to get all of the pilots back, presumably to DFW? Twenty airplanes means 40 pilots. Considering that service between ROW and DFW is all Embrear 135s and 145s, that's a lot of seats needed, just to deadhead crews back to DFW.


A Delta 717!
 
commavia
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Tue Aug 23, 2016 6:12 pm

As discussed in the earlier thread, what a sad day. The eventual end of the MD80 in AA operation has been well known and expected for several years now, but it still certainly marks the (highly bittersweet) end of an era. In a way, the MD80 represents a different age of aviation, and a different time for AA - shiny, bare metal MD80s have been indelibly linked to the image of AA for three decades, through times both very good and very bad. As someone who has cumulatively spent thousands of hours on hundreds of AA MD80 flights, I am very sad to see them go.
 
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reidar76
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Tue Aug 23, 2016 6:55 pm

MD80s brings back memories. :-)

I very frequently flew with SK between SVG-LHR in the early 90s to mid-90s, always operated with MD80s.

The MD80s were replaced by 737-600 from 1996 (SK was launch customer for the 737-600). The MD80s were very noisy (and I think their operations was severely restricted in Norway) and you could smell fuel during pushback and taxiing. Back in those days I was smoking and the only aircraft you were allowed smoke on were the MD80s. The cabin was filed with cigarette smoke before reaching cruising altitude, because of the bad air conditioning. Those were the days. Smoking and free alcohol (as much as you could drink) even in economy class (at that time called pleasure class by SK).

It is amazing DL has kept flying those old birds.
Last edited by reidar76 on Tue Aug 23, 2016 7:00 pm, edited 3 times in total.
 
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piedmont762
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Tue Aug 23, 2016 6:56 pm

Surprised 1986-1987 birds were still in the fleet considering AA has been constantly retiring 757s from 1991-1993ish.

They had their time but would like to see the ex-TWA 1997-1999 planes hang around longer. They are pretty unique.
 
n471wn
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's tomorrow

Tue Aug 23, 2016 6:59 pm

Beatyair wrote:
The MD's (140 seats) where replaced by A319's (128 seats) in Calgary. We occasionally get one and sad to see them go, but they are old.

Not that old as a good many of them were built in 1998 and 1999
 
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N14AZ
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Tue Aug 23, 2016 7:13 pm

I really hope someone will be there to take some pictures of this "event"...
 
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BN727227Ultra
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Tue Aug 23, 2016 7:15 pm

At least in the short term, OMA still has their two MadDog services daily to DFW out of six R/Ts.
 
jeffrey0032j
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's tomorrow

Tue Aug 23, 2016 7:17 pm

n471wn wrote:
Beatyair wrote:
The MD's (140 seats) where replaced by A319's (128 seats) in Calgary. We occasionally get one and sad to see them go, but they are old.

Not that old as a good many of them were built in 1998 and 1999

Thats as new as the oldest A319s around.
 
727LOVER
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's tomorrow

Tue Aug 23, 2016 7:42 pm

n471wn wrote:
Beatyair wrote:
The MD's (140 seats) where replaced by A319's (128 seats) in Calgary. We occasionally get one and sad to see them go, but they are old.

Not that old as a good many of them were built in 1998 and 1999

Some of those were delivered to TWA after AA started receiving 737-800s

The first 738 was delivered to AA in Feb 1999...when in 1999 was the last 3 MD-80s delivered to TWA?

I'm thinking there are about 4 of the 738s delivered BEFORE about 4 of the MD-80s
"We must accept finite disappointment, but never lose infinite hope." - Martin Luther King, Jr.
 
777PHX
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's tomorrow

Tue Aug 23, 2016 7:52 pm

727LOVER wrote:
n471wn wrote:
Beatyair wrote:
The MD's (140 seats) where replaced by A319's (128 seats) in Calgary. We occasionally get one and sad to see them go, but they are old.

Not that old as a good many of them were built in 1998 and 1999

Some of those were delivered to TWA after AA started receiving 737-800s

The first 738 was delivered to AA in Feb 1999...when in 1999 was the last 3 MD-80s delivered to TWA?

I'm thinking there are about 4 of the 738s delivered BEFORE about 4 of the MD-80s


Of course the 738s are still a generation ahead of the MD80, regardless of individual airframe age.
 
Sooner787
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Tue Aug 23, 2016 8:29 pm

I guess the last 2 S80's have left DFW for ROW?
 
TW870
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Tue Aug 23, 2016 10:19 pm

ckfred wrote:
A slightly off-topic observation. I flew ORD-DEN-ORD last month, MD-80s both ways. It seems to me that on both landings, the pilots didn't use reverse thrust. Are pilots going easy with reverse thrust on landings, to save wear and tear on the engines? I seem to recall the same thing with the F100s, as they started the retirement draw down.


I doubt it has to do with the draw-down, although I would certainly be corrected by someone who works for AA. But most airlines SOPs require light thrust reverse in windy operating conditions (or even in all operating conditions), because the target-type thrust reversers disrupt airflow over the rudder, which reduces rudder effectiveness. The higher the EPR in reverse, the less effective the rudder. I haven't read the latest reports on the DL incident at LGA last winter, but high EPRs in reverse in gusty crosswind conditions on an icy runway was rumored to be one of the reasons they lost directional control on rollout.
 
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dennypayne
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Tue Aug 23, 2016 11:52 pm

USA Today story about todays retirements, with a lot of pictures (not from today though).

http://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/fl ... /89198186/
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dennypayne
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Wed Aug 24, 2016 12:00 am

And it looks like Airways flew out there on one of them - looking forward to that story in print!

https://twitter.com/airwayslive?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw
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RayChuang
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Wed Aug 24, 2016 12:22 am

Some 14 years ago, I suggested on the old A.net forum that AA completely re-engine their entire S80 fleet with a more modern engine like the Pratt & Whitney PW6024.

Imagine if AA had actually done that. It's likely the entire S80 fleet--with far less need to worry about fuel consumption and noise emissions--would probably have underwent a major modernization with 717-200-style EFIS cockpits and other long-life extensions akin to what NW did with their D9 fleet in the 1990's. And they would probably have served AA well into the 2020's.

But now, AA is rapidly phasing out their S80 fleet, replaced by a combination of 737's and A320 Family planes.
 
commavia
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Wed Aug 24, 2016 12:30 am

This Friday just one of AA's fifteen flights DFW-ORD is an MD80 ... wow ... times they are a-changin'
 
Max752
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Wed Aug 24, 2016 12:39 am

Wow, it's actually happening. It's going to be quite odd not seeing the MD80s parked up and down the C concourse at STL once they leave the fleet. I'm really going to miss these bird.

Yet, even with these mass retirements and routine retirements, STL is MD-80apolis. For example;
    STL to ORD; Only one MD-80 flight replaced by 738s
    STL to DFW; Only two MD-80 flights replaced by 738s

Other than those three changes, STL won't see any change when it comes to the MD-80. It does, however, make sense as STL has a very experienced maintenance crew working at the MD-80 hanger.

Guessing the farewell tour will look a little like this; ORD-STL-DFW.

-Max
Super 80, pff, more like Stupid 80 | TravelUpdate.com & TheCollegePoints.com |
 
thegoldenargosy
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Wed Aug 24, 2016 12:54 am

I remember flying SEA-ORD-PVD all on the Super 80 in 2003.
 
Chuska
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Wed Aug 24, 2016 2:59 am

Eagle operated two extra DFW-ROW turns today with E-145's, ENY3300 and ENY 3175/3376. 3300 departed ROW at 1345, that should have been enough to deadhead out, I'm guessing, 40 crew members.
 
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jetblastdubai
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Wed Aug 24, 2016 3:37 am

Will there be a short-term over-staffing issue with pilots and FAs? Will they bump some more junior crew members and force upgrade/differences training or will the reserve list just grow by a few pages overnight?
 
TW870
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Wed Aug 24, 2016 3:56 am

jetblastdubai wrote:
Will there be a short-term over-staffing issue with pilots and FAs? Will they bump some more junior crew members and force upgrade/differences training or will the reserve list just grow by a few pages overnight?


Highly unlikely. Pilot bids have been in process for many months, and everyone who flew MD-80s today knows where they are headed, either remaining on the fleet or transitioning to a different seat. FAs are qualified on all aircraft and this reduction in block hours will not result in any displacement from domiciles, etc. Transition to the fall shoulder schedule always involves a major reduction in block hours. The way you handle it from a crew scheduling perspective is to increase vacation allotments, reduce the amount of time in each person's line, and then grant day at a time unpaid leave (trip drops). The summer is tough for crew because it is very difficult to get time off. Once this schedule transition hits, you can restore some of that flexibility.
 
rta
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Wed Aug 24, 2016 4:27 am

AA posted a couple tweets commemorating the Super 80s. #Super80Sendoff

commavia wrote:
This Friday just one of AA's fifteen flights DFW-ORD is an MD80 ... wow ... times they are a-changin'


Wow, that really puts things into perspective. I thought this route would be one of the few to remain MD80 strong until the end.

On a related note, I'm interested in knowing how they decided to coordinate the retirements. Surely it costs more to ferry these aircrafts from certain parts of the country, like the East Coast. So why initiate ferries from PHL, RDU, PIT... and even a place like FLL that almost never sees MD80 service?
 
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ATA L1011
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Wed Aug 24, 2016 4:58 am

dennypayne wrote:
And it looks like Airways flew out there on one of them - looking forward to that story in print!

https://twitter.com/airwayslive?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

Good find dennypayne, thanks for sharing that link :)!!!
Treat others as you expect to be treated!
 
iahcsr
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Wed Aug 24, 2016 7:52 am

That's what? 120-160 excess sets of MD80 flight crews that have to retrain on other aircraft types. Going to be a lot of sitting reserve for a few months.
Working Hard, Flying Right Friendly....
 
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United_fan
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Wed Aug 24, 2016 11:36 am

So are they going to be parted out and scrapped,or are they for sale ?
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wn676
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Wed Aug 24, 2016 12:10 pm

rta wrote:
AA posted a couple tweets commemorating the Super 80s. #Super80Sendoff

commavia wrote:
This Friday just one of AA's fifteen flights DFW-ORD is an MD80 ... wow ... times they are a-changin'


Wow, that really puts things into perspective. I thought this route would be one of the few to remain MD80 strong until the end.

On a related note, I'm interested in knowing how they decided to coordinate the retirements. Surely it costs more to ferry these aircrafts from certain parts of the country, like the East Coast. So why initiate ferries from PHL, RDU, PIT... and even a place like FLL that almost never sees MD80 service?


Just a guess, but it probably made the transition between schedules really easy. They could send all of those planes out to RON at an outstation without having to worry about getting them into position for the fall schedule the next day; any frames that would be "stranded" at those outstations because of the change would just become S80s on the last day since they'd be ferrying to ROW regardless. So instead of having some kind of bridge schedule, they could run normal ops and get a few more revenue sections in that would have otherwise not been possible.
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par13del
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Wed Aug 24, 2016 12:19 pm

Sooner787 said it and OneSexyL1011 confirmed it visually, ROW was attached by MD-80's, hope the Air Force, Navy and Marines engaged in some intercept missions, would have been good training.
A sad day for lovers of aviation who are not in ROW, we will miss the variety.
 
727LOVER
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Wed Aug 24, 2016 12:59 pm

"We must accept finite disappointment, but never lose infinite hope." - Martin Luther King, Jr.
 
ckfred
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Wed Aug 24, 2016 2:29 pm

TW870 wrote:
ckfred wrote:
A slightly off-topic observation. I flew ORD-DEN-ORD last month, MD-80s both ways. It seems to me that on both landings, the pilots didn't use reverse thrust. Are pilots going easy with reverse thrust on landings, to save wear and tear on the engines? I seem to recall the same thing with the F100s, as they started the retirement draw down.


I doubt it has to do with the draw-down, although I would certainly be corrected by someone who works for AA. But most airlines SOPs require light thrust reverse in windy operating conditions (or even in all operating conditions), because the target-type thrust reversers disrupt airflow over the rudder, which reduces rudder effectiveness. The higher the EPR in reverse, the less effective the rudder. I haven't read the latest reports on the DL incident at LGA last winter, but high EPRs in reverse in gusty crosswind conditions on an icy runway was rumored to be one of the reasons they lost directional control on rollout.


I could see the ORD landing being in a crosswind, but probably not at DEN, considering the runway layout. We landed on 16L. So, I assumed that either pilots are going easy on the reverse thrust or, with 12,000 feet of runway, to do a long roll-out to save on the taxi time to the gate.
 
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Keith2004
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Wed Aug 24, 2016 3:19 pm

reidar76 wrote:
MD80s brings back memories. :-)

I very frequently flew with SK between SVG-LHR in the early 90s to mid-90s, always operated with MD80s.

The MD80s were replaced by 737-600 from 1996 (SK was launch customer for the 737-600). The MD80s were very noisy (and I think their operations was severely restricted in Norway) and you could smell fuel during pushback and taxiing. Back in those days I was smoking and the only aircraft you were allowed smoke on were the MD80s. The cabin was filed with cigarette smoke before reaching cruising altitude, because of the bad air conditioning. Those were the days. Smoking and free alcohol (as much as you could drink) even in economy class (at that time called pleasure class by SK).

It is amazing DL has kept flying those old birds.


Glad I wasn't around for that. Sounds like a recipe for misery.

I will miss the MD-80s though, Those shiny Birds were fun to Spot....And fun to fly...Up front

I have a Flight Coming up in a MD-90 in First and I look forward to it

I guess Delta will be the go to For MD Flights soon, wonder when DL will Phase them out

Could Mainline T-Tails Be A memory come 2020s?
 
skymiler
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Wed Aug 24, 2016 3:20 pm

Are you sure some will not go to ATL and get a widget? 28 years is young for an MD product! LOL
I love to fly, and it shows!
 
deltal1011man
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Wed Aug 24, 2016 5:14 pm

skymiler wrote:
Are you sure some will not go to ATL and get a widget? 28 years is young for an MD product! LOL

get a widget? no
will DL buy some for parts or buy parts directly? probably.
 
braniff2hav
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Wed Aug 24, 2016 5:22 pm

Talk about feeling old. I vividly recall working for American Airlines in the very early 80's. Walking to to my living room and switching the channel from MTV to CNN and there was a report that American Airlines had reached an agreement to lease (which was unique at the time) up to 500 of the new "Super 80" aircraft from manufacturer McDonnell-Douglas. We were always jealous that we only saw 727-100 and 200's at my station .. never got the 'brand new bird' ... the Super 80. Oh welll .... time marches on. I still enjoy the ride on the S80 because it's quiet and smooth.
 
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Seabear
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Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2016 3:05 pm

Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Wed Aug 24, 2016 5:50 pm

Other than the last few rows, I always found the Mad Dog to be a pleasure, especially with the 2-3 seating. We had our first, and probably last, opportunity to fly DFW-FAT in F last August, definitely the quietest flight we've ever experienced.
 
sparkyjet
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Wed Aug 24, 2016 5:54 pm

I'm feeling old now as I remember back in the early 90s when the S80s were arriving from Long Beach at the rate of one or two per week!
 
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eksath
Crew
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Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Wed Aug 24, 2016 6:07 pm

N565AA Retirement 08/23/2016 .
FLL departure in pictures. See gallery below:

Image

Image

The rest of the gallery is here at:
http://www.atapattu.net/Special-Project ... /n-hwTw32/
World Wide Aerospace Photography
 
DUSdude
Posts: 145
Joined: Tue May 08, 2007 4:20 am

Re: AAL to retire 20 MD-80's on 23rd August 2016

Wed Aug 24, 2016 9:40 pm

Two of the birds retiring today are in my flight log. I know many hate the MD80 from the passenger experience. I loved them as long as I was up front on the side with two seats. :-)

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