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dergay
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United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Sun Aug 28, 2016 9:15 am

Yet another incident at Glasgow Airport involving intoxicated pilots!


[url]
http://www.independent.ie/world-news/eu ... 01417.html[/url]
 
LCKip
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Sun Aug 28, 2016 9:44 am

It's sad that this happens all the time everywhere on the world. I can't understand why those professional people behave so unprofessional and irresponsible. They understand the consequences I guess, they never fly again and must look for another job with less pay.
 
by738
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Sun Aug 28, 2016 11:39 am

Someones been taking advantage if good Scottish hospitality! Perhaps a positive for Scottish Tourism if nothing else. Wonder how often cabin crew (and their crucial safety role) are drunk?
Why not do mandatory breath testing which has to be submitted pre flight? These tiny disposable alcohol testers are cents worth.
 
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FabDiva
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Sun Aug 28, 2016 12:15 pm

Or even have something built in. In the UK the largest operator of scheduled coaches has fitted breath test equipment to all their coaches. A breath test has to be done when a new driver takes over (enforced by the change of driver cards in the Tachograph data logger) or if the engine has been off for more then 15 mins. The engine won't start until the test is passed.
 
SCQ83
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Sun Aug 28, 2016 12:20 pm

I saw Scotland and crew arrest and knew it had to be alcohol-related!
 
bgm
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Sun Aug 28, 2016 12:52 pm

The pilots went native. :)
 
klwright69
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Sun Aug 28, 2016 12:56 pm

Yes, well Glasgow Newark left 9 hours late yesterday. I guess now we know the reason?

This is a shocking story. I remember the Northwest pilots who got in trouble with this in Fargo ND many years ago.
Last edited by klwright69 on Sun Aug 28, 2016 1:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
ltbewr
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Sun Aug 28, 2016 1:02 pm

To me airlines need to take a more pro-active part in reducing the use of alcohol by pilots and crews when off-duty and not just 'bottle to throttle' or on duty rules. Add in time changes and affects on body rhythms, that even if 0.0 at flight time a hangover from alcohol use the night before, can affect personal performance if something goes wrong (like the WN flight with the engine problem on Saturday) putting the persons on board at risk.
Perhaps improvements in all ongoing training, regular reviews to determine if the pilot/crew members have attitudes as to drinking that may mean counseling to reduce alcohol use should be considered. The airlines have too much invested in these employees, don't need the hassles of inconvenience to passengers, disruption of schedules and cost when pilots or crew are unable to do their duty. In some cases, it may mean negotiations with unions, but good labor union leaders will see the positive value of higher levels of professionalism and responsibility as to their members.
 
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exunited
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Sun Aug 28, 2016 2:01 pm

Getting fired should be automatic - no option for rehab, no excuses, no support from the union if there is irrefutable evidence. A black eye for the company and ALL professional pilots by these individuals.

BTW it's the flying first officer and relief pilots, not the Capt involved
 
CO 757-300
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Sun Aug 28, 2016 3:01 pm

Are there details as to whether they were "freshly" drunk? Or were they sober at the time but with lingering breath / BAC from the previous evening? Big difference in my opinion.
 
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adamblang
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Sun Aug 28, 2016 3:04 pm

LCKip wrote:
I can't understand why those professional people behave so unprofessional and irresponsible.

I'd guess because they're alcoholics who haven't realized it yet and started working on pulling their lives together yet.
 
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AirPacific747
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Sun Aug 28, 2016 3:32 pm

I just taxied past the 757 they were supposed to pilot back to the US. It's parked at a remote stand. (I assume that's why there was a UA 757 on remote stand)
 
dfwjim1
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Sun Aug 28, 2016 3:41 pm

ltbewr wrote:
To me airlines need to take a more pro-active part in reducing the use of alcohol by pilots and crews when off-duty and not just 'bottle to throttle' or on duty rules. Add in time changes and affects on body rhythms, that even if 0.0 at flight time a hangover from alcohol use the night before, can affect personal performance if something goes wrong (like the WN flight with the engine problem on Saturday) putting the persons on board at risk.
Perhaps improvements in all ongoing training, regular reviews to determine if the pilot/crew members have attitudes as to drinking that may mean counseling to reduce alcohol use should be considered. The airlines have too much invested in these employees, don't need the hassles of inconvenience to passengers, disruption of schedules and cost when pilots or crew are unable to do their duty. In some cases, it may mean negotiations with unions, but good labor union leaders will see the positive value of higher levels of professionalism and responsibility as to their members.


How about making it a rule that crew members are not allowed to drink anytime while traveling on company business? Of course once they are home and off duty they can do whatever they want drinking wise.
 
777PHX
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Sun Aug 28, 2016 4:11 pm

CO 757-300 wrote:
Are there details as to whether they were "freshly" drunk? Or were they sober at the time but with lingering breath / BAC from the previous evening? Big difference in my opinion.


Doesn't make a difference.

Drunk is drunk.
 
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CALTECH
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Sun Aug 28, 2016 7:45 pm

Hearing they were relatively new hires, Supposedly 2014 and 2015.

Something in the water ?.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pcnFbCCgTo4
 
aviatorcraig
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Sun Aug 28, 2016 8:48 pm

dfwjim1 wrote:
ltbewr wrote:
How about making it a rule that crew members are not allowed to drink anytime while traveling on company business?


I don't think we need stop aircrew having a glass of wine with their dinner if they are not flying until the following day. However, when one glass becomes several glasses then it is bad judgement... these guys get paid to have good judgement.
 
by738
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Sun Aug 28, 2016 9:03 pm

AirPacific747 wrote:
I just taxied past the 757 they were supposed to pilot back to the US. It's parked at a remote stand. (I assume that's why there was a UA 757 on remote stand)

That is correct. I think another 757 and crew came up from LHR and left around 7pm. I presume once police clear it the remote stand 757 can be ferried elsewhere or back to EWR.
 
sandyb123
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Sun Aug 28, 2016 9:05 pm

It was only a few weeks ago an Air Transat crew were arrested for the same reasons at GLA. Are they more on top of their monitoring at GLA than other ports?

Sandyb123
 
by738
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Sun Aug 28, 2016 9:59 pm

nothing more than coincidence. Happens across the world all the time. They will defintely be more wary now after two events, as will any unsuspecting future tipsy crews who will have a lower threshold now for the D+V sick call...
 
CO 757-300
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Sun Aug 28, 2016 11:00 pm

777PHX wrote:
CO 757-300 wrote:
Are there details as to whether they were "freshly" drunk? Or were they sober at the time but with lingering breath / BAC from the previous evening? Big difference in my opinion.


Doesn't make a difference.

Drunk is drunk.


Question I asked is whether or not it was there was a blatant and belligerent attempt to fly intoxicated or was this instead a case of negligently overindulging the night before. If the latter, while no doubt feeling "groggy" (and certainly not at a level of awareness required to fly a transatlantic flight with 170 souls en-tow) the parties tried to "power through" only to be caught by their smell or breath, still reeking from the previous evening. From experience, though I may be certain of a clear and straight mind, morning after a night of hard play, whatever lingers in my blood may suggest otherwise given a toxicology test.

I am attempting to expand the discussion in this forum by asking about the intent at play here, the legal frameworks notwithstanding.
 
Viscount724
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Mon Aug 29, 2016 12:08 am

exunited wrote:
Getting fired should be automatic - no option for rehab, no excuses, no support from the union if there is irrefutable evidence. A black eye for the company and ALL professional pilots by these individuals.

BTW it's the flying first officer and relief pilots, not the Capt involved


Why would GLA-EWR require a relief pilot? Schedule block time shows 6:45 eastbound and 7:30 westbound. What's UA's limit for relief pilots? At most carriers it's usually more like 9 hours.
 
panam330
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Mon Aug 29, 2016 12:21 am

Viscount724 wrote:
Why would GLA-EWR require a relief pilot? Schedule block time shows 6:45 eastbound and 7:30 westbound. What's UA's limit for relief pilots? At most carriers it's usually more like 9 hours.


Anything over 8 hours of scheduled block in either direction will require augmentation in both directions, contractually. In this case, 7:45 scheduled westbound should in theory be 2 pilots, but with augmentation you gain quite a few hours of additional FDP - and we crew EDI/GLA with 3 pilots because of that. EWR-SNN/DUB is not usually augmented, for example.
 
CONTACREW
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Mon Aug 29, 2016 12:25 am

Viscount724 wrote:
exunited wrote:
Getting fired should be automatic - no option for rehab, no excuses, no support from the union if there is irrefutable evidence. A black eye for the company and ALL professional pilots by these individuals.

BTW it's the flying first officer and relief pilots, not the Capt involved


Why would GLA-EWR require a relief pilot? Schedule block time shows 6:45 eastbound and 7:30 westbound. What's UA's limit for relief pilots? At most carriers it's usually more like 9 hours.


Any trip that's blocked in over 8 hours gets an augmented crew. Example EWR-OSL is blocked in at 7hr 35mn but because the return trip is blocked in at 8hr 20mn it gets an extra pilot. Also trips that have longer then 24 hour layovers (2 or more days) will also have an augmented crew.
 
futureualpilot
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Mon Aug 29, 2016 4:06 am

by738 wrote:
Someones been taking advantage if good Scottish hospitality! Perhaps a positive for Scottish Tourism if nothing else. Wonder how often cabin crew (and their crucial safety role) are drunk?
Why not do mandatory breath testing which has to be submitted pre flight? These tiny disposable alcohol testers are cents worth.


Because hundreds of thousands of airline flights operate around the planet every day flown by crews who follow the rules and can uphold the responsibilities and professionalism demanded of them. Because 99.9999% of us are able to conduct ourselves in accordance with the laws and regulations to which we are subject and dont need to be punished for the mistakes of others. By your logic drivers everywhere should be subject to breathalyzers prior to operating a motor vehicle because other people drive drunk.

Of course this is bad and needs to be dealt with. I sincerely doubt you'll find a pilot out there that will defend showing up over the limit/under the influence. But let's not react emotionally and demand that the hundreds of thousands of professionals who conduct themselves appropriately day in and day out be treated as the bad guys who can't be trusted because of the actions of an infinitesimally small minority.
 
bmacleod
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Mon Aug 29, 2016 1:24 pm

Thanks to UK Glasgow airport security staff for keeping a sharp eye on drunk (or appearance/like) pilots.

Looks like they're 2 for 2.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/air-transat-pilots-arrest-1.3684955
 
jetblueguy22
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Mon Aug 29, 2016 5:17 pm

exunited wrote:
Getting fired should be automatic - no option for rehab, no excuses, no support from the union if there is irrefutable evidence. A black eye for the company and ALL professional pilots by these individuals.

BTW it's the flying first officer and relief pilots, not the Capt involved

A union would never throw a member under the bus like that, and if I was paying union dues, they better be there doing everything they can to protect me.

Give the guys a chance. Go to rehab, go sober, and submit to random tests. If you show up to work drunk, you clearly have some issues that require professional help, not career destruction.
 
Fiend
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Mon Aug 29, 2016 5:37 pm

jetblueguy22 wrote:
exunited wrote:
Getting fired should be automatic - no option for rehab, no excuses, no support from the union if there is irrefutable evidence. A black eye for the company and ALL professional pilots by these individuals.

BTW it's the flying first officer and relief pilots, not the Capt involved

A union would never throw a member under the bus like that, and if I was paying union dues, they better be there doing everything they can to protect me.

Give the guys a chance. Go to rehab, go sober, and submit to random tests. If you show up to work drunk, you clearly have some issues that require professional help, not career destruction.


Pilots are responsible for the safety of the passengers and the aircraft. If caught under the influence of alcohol pilots should lose their license and also their job!!!
 
brucek
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Mon Aug 29, 2016 5:38 pm

I'm a mere private pilot with an instrument rating and 200 hours TT in a C172, and I don't fly now because of a disqualifying medical issue. However, when I did fly, I wouldn't even use Listerine in the morning prior to flying, as it had an alcohol base. I enjoy a beer and wine as much as anyone, but would always quit way before the 8 hour limit. The FAA regulation goes on to say (paraphrasing) that any mental impairment from any substance is a non-starter to fly, so if it's been 10 hours since you last drank but you're hung over, it's meant to be a cause for not flying. Maybe I'm just over-cautious, and maybe thousands of hours creates a jaded approach to this rule? Anyway, accidentally being intoxicated doesn't cut it with me...
 
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longhauler
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Mon Aug 29, 2016 5:50 pm

bmacleod wrote:
Thanks to UK Glasgow airport security staff for keeping a sharp eye on drunk (or appearance/like) pilots.
Looks like they're 2 for 2.

Not even close.

In fact, most of these occurrences end up as false alarms. At .009, the breathalyzer is far more restrictive than the law blood test .02.

.009 will be set off by mouthwash, one glass of wine the evening before, etc. Not to mention, the breathalyzer does have a false positive possiblity. Blood of .02 does not. And ... .02 is required for conviction.

That is why over 90% of these news item cases end up thrown out. So we can put down our pitchforks and stop building the gallows. Rest assured, when the crew is exonerated (as they were in last month's GLA Transat case) it won't make front page news or a message thread here. Pathetic.
 
tonystan
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Mon Aug 29, 2016 6:02 pm

I'm laughing at the nanny state reaction by so many here.

The cases of crew being caught over the limit are so few and far between that banning crew from having a legal tiffle whilst down route is an extreme overreaction. You may aswell ban them from drinking in their own homes off duty on their own time considering they could still rock up for duty over the limit should they wish to.

No, none of this ridiculous childish chastising. These guys may even end up being innocent but if not they made a very poor judgement which they will always regret, enough punishment if you ask me.
 
IPFreely
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Mon Aug 29, 2016 6:13 pm

bmacleod wrote:
Thanks to UK Glasgow airport security staff for keeping a sharp eye on drunk (or appearance/like) pilots.


It's Scotland. If any security staff is experienced at spotting drunks, it would be the Scots.
 
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JannEejit
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Mon Aug 29, 2016 6:34 pm

longhauler wrote:
bmacleod wrote:
Thanks to UK Glasgow airport security staff for keeping a sharp eye on drunk (or appearance/like) pilots.
Looks like they're 2 for 2.

Not even close.

In fact, most of these occurrences end up as false alarms. At .009, the breathalyzer is far more restrictive than the law blood test .02.

.009 will be set off by mouthwash, one glass of wine the evening before, etc. Not to mention, the breathalyzer does have a false positive possiblity. Blood of .02 does not. And ... .02 is required for conviction.

That is why over 90% of these news item cases end up thrown out. So we can put down our pitchforks and stop building the gallows. Rest assured, when the crew is exonerated (as they were in last month's GLA Transat case) it won't make front page news or a message thread here. Pathetic.


Was the Transat case thrown out then ? Last I heard they were bailed on surrender of passports and to be honest I wasn't expecting to hear much more.
 
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JannEejit
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Mon Aug 29, 2016 6:42 pm

IPFreely wrote:
bmacleod wrote:
Thanks to UK Glasgow airport security staff for keeping a sharp eye on drunk (or appearance/like) pilots.


It's Scotland. If any security staff is experienced at spotting drunks, it would be the Scots.


The Transat crew were reported by their own cabin colleagues as having been spotted out drinking the night before, and as far as I'm aware nothing regarding their actual blood alcohol levels has ever been divulged. This could also be the case here with the United incident, and it's interesting that the FO and relief FO have been arrested, not the captain, which to me sounds like another case of inter-crew reporting and not a pair of drunk guys attempting to get past security, we'll find out in the coming days.
 
by738
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Mon Aug 29, 2016 6:44 pm

The TS case hasnt even been heard yet so im not sure where thats coming from...
 
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JannEejit
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Mon Aug 29, 2016 6:52 pm

by738 wrote:
The TS case hasnt even been heard yet so im not sure where thats coming from...


That's what I thought too, and have been trying to get an update.
 
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FlyingJhawk
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Mon Aug 29, 2016 6:52 pm

Any chance that the Scots keep an unofficial eye on airline crew at the hotels? Perhaps alert security in advance of the pilots showing up at the airport?
 
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FabDiva
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Mon Aug 29, 2016 7:00 pm

OK assuming Scottish law is similar to English law* the Breathalyser is not admissible in court. However a positive breath test will lead to arrest on suspicion of driving/flying under the influence" - the suspects will then be taken to a Police station for a second test under controlled conditions which is admissible in court, the result of which will decide if they are to be charged or released.

*I would check but my Scottish Law Student friend is otherwise engaged.
 
Bald1983
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Mon Aug 29, 2016 7:21 pm

ltbewr wrote:
To me airlines need to take a more pro-active part in reducing the use of alcohol by pilots and crews when off-duty and not just 'bottle to throttle' or on duty rules. Add in time changes and affects on body rhythms, that even if 0.0 at flight time a hangover from alcohol use the night before, can affect personal performance if something goes wrong (like the WN flight with the engine problem on Saturday) putting the persons on board at risk.
Perhaps improvements in all ongoing training, regular reviews to determine if the pilot/crew members have attitudes as to drinking that may mean counseling to reduce alcohol use should be considered. The airlines have too much invested in these employees, don't need the hassles of inconvenience to passengers, disruption of schedules and cost when pilots or crew are unable to do their duty. In some cases, it may mean negotiations with unions, but good labor union leaders will see the positive value of higher levels of professionalism and responsibility as to their members.


One of the problems we have in this society is that we seek to treat adults like children. This is not because United did not train its pilots enough. This is because, (Allegedly as I do believe the presumption of innocence applies in the UK as well) of two jerks who knew the rules, thought they could break the rules, and get away with it. What really needs to happen is that these two morons never even get to look at an airplane the rest of their lives and serve a lot of time in jail.
 
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exunited
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Mon Aug 29, 2016 7:50 pm

jetblueguy22 wrote:
exunited wrote:
Getting fired should be automatic - no option for rehab, no excuses, no support from the union if there is irrefutable evidence. A black eye for the company and ALL professional pilots by these individuals.

BTW it's the flying first officer and relief pilots, not the Capt involved

A union would never throw a member under the bus like that, and if I was paying union dues, they better be there doing everything they can to protect me.

Give the guys a chance. Go to rehab, go sober, and submit to random tests. If you show up to work drunk, you clearly have some issues that require professional help, not career destruction.


Sorry, going to disagree. These guys showed up impaired to fly 150 innocent people. End of career as it should be. Unions should spend their efforts on behalf of the 99.9999% that are good, not waste resources on the tiny fraction who have knowingly put people at risk, but everyone pays dues and I get that aspect but there needs to be a limit to what they will stand behind.
 
F9Animal
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Mon Aug 29, 2016 7:57 pm

longhauler wrote:
bmacleod wrote:
Thanks to UK Glasgow airport security staff for keeping a sharp eye on drunk (or appearance/like) pilots.
Looks like they're 2 for 2.

Not even close.

In fact, most of these occurrences end up as false alarms. At .009, the breathalyzer is far more restrictive than the law blood test .02.

.009 will be set off by mouthwash, one glass of wine the evening before, etc. Not to mention, the breathalyzer does have a false positive possiblity. Blood of .02 does not. And ... .02 is required for conviction.

That is why over 90% of these news item cases end up thrown out. So we can put down our pitchforks and stop building the gallows. Rest assured, when the crew is exonerated (as they were in last month's GLA Transat case) it won't make front page news or a message thread here. Pathetic.



I am happy to hear this. I also hope these pilots are also exonerated if they are innocent. I will give a thumbs up to Glasgow for being vigilant.

I also hope that pilots who do have alcohol problems realize the zero tolerance. If anything, I hope those suffering from this terrible addiction get help for it.

I will stay on the safe side and assume these pilots are innocent until proven guilty. I really hope they are innocent though. This could destroy their career. :(
 
Bald1983
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Mon Aug 29, 2016 8:27 pm

jetblueguy22 wrote:
exunited wrote:
Getting fired should be automatic - no option for rehab, no excuses, no support from the union if there is irrefutable evidence. A black eye for the company and ALL professional pilots by these individuals.

BTW it's the flying first officer and relief pilots, not the Capt involved

A union would never throw a member under the bus like that, and if I was paying union dues, they better be there doing everything they can to protect me.

Give the guys a chance. Go to rehab, go sober, and submit to random tests. If you show up to work drunk, you clearly have some issues that require professional help, not career destruction.


You just made an argument against unions. These pilots are adults and professionals. if the allegations are true, they need to be thrown under the bus and have the bus back up on them a few times, figuratively thinking.
 
IPFreely
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Mon Aug 29, 2016 8:52 pm

by738 wrote:
The TS case hasnt even been heard yet so im not sure where thats coming from...


These cases usually start out with pilots facing maximum criminal charges and maximum company penalties, I.e. termination of employment. After the pilots' union lawyers go to work there is usually a deal where they plead guilty to reduced charges or receive suspended sentences, and are eligible to return to duty following a suspension and completion of some type of rehab program. Especially if it's a first offense. Other pilots and union loyalists are quick to call deals like this "exoneration". That's probably where it's coming from.
 
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JannEejit
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Mon Aug 29, 2016 9:08 pm

Released on bail following appearance today at Paisley Sherriff Court...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-g ... t-37213170
 
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longhauler
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Mon Aug 29, 2016 11:14 pm

JannEejit wrote:
by738 wrote:
The TS case hasnt even been heard yet so im not sure where thats coming from...


That's what I thought too, and have been trying to get an update.
by738 wrote:
The TS case hasnt even been heard yet so im not sure where thats coming from...

The results of the blood test showed a blood alcohol level less than what is required for conviction.
 
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JannEejit
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Tue Aug 30, 2016 9:19 am

If that's true then why were they bailed and required to surrender their passports on the second court appearance, which was a full week after the first one ? Does it take a week to process a blood test ?
 
VC10er
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Tue Aug 30, 2016 10:50 am

To me, this is a deadly serious issue that even transcends alcohol. I'm no fan of a "nanny state" either, but we all know substance abuse takes on a very broad array intoxicants and is a global pandemic. The stigma of which is so bad that sufferers often fear seeking help. Look at what is going on with opiates in the USA right now. I firmly believe in "due process"...these pilots are innocent until proven otherwise given the devastating impact this could have on their lives, I hope that a fair investigation happens, and I think the union has a role to play to assure they get fair legal treatment. If guilty, I agree that they should never fly a plane again. Needless to say, pilots have a unique and massive responsibility in society vs most other jobs, but I do fear that fear keeps suffering crews from seeking treatment.
Are crews randomly tested for drugs and alcohol? Do airlines provide medical assistance/support (perhaps anonymous) to any folks suffering from any addiction problems? My family has dealt with the insidious disease and it could effect ANYONE.
 
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longhauler
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Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Tue Sep 06, 2016 3:11 am

JannEejit wrote:
If that's true then why were they bailed and required to surrender their passports on the second court appearance, which was a full week after the first one ? Does it take a week to process a blood test ?

Apparently, it takes 4 to 6 weeks.

The results were received, but they have to stand before a judge to have the charges "officially" dismissed.
 
ThePointblank
Posts: 3829
Joined: Sat Jan 17, 2009 11:39 pm

Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Tue Sep 06, 2016 6:42 am

exunited wrote:
jetblueguy22 wrote:
exunited wrote:
Getting fired should be automatic - no option for rehab, no excuses, no support from the union if there is irrefutable evidence. A black eye for the company and ALL professional pilots by these individuals.

BTW it's the flying first officer and relief pilots, not the Capt involved

A union would never throw a member under the bus like that, and if I was paying union dues, they better be there doing everything they can to protect me.

Give the guys a chance. Go to rehab, go sober, and submit to random tests. If you show up to work drunk, you clearly have some issues that require professional help, not career destruction.


Sorry, going to disagree. These guys showed up impaired to fly 150 innocent people. End of career as it should be. Unions should spend their efforts on behalf of the 99.9999% that are good, not waste resources on the tiny fraction who have knowingly put people at risk, but everyone pays dues and I get that aspect but there needs to be a limit to what they will stand behind.

The problem is that a union has a legal duty of fair representation for their members, no matter what the case. This is something that is recognized by the US Supreme Court (and many other jurisdictions around the world). In fact, if a union does not fairly represent their employees in a dismissal case, the union can be sued by the former employee for breach of this duty as it is considered an unfair labour practice.
 
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JannEejit
Posts: 1804
Joined: Sat Jun 18, 2016 4:04 pm

Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Fri Mar 10, 2017 1:21 pm

United FO has received a 10 month jail sentence today for his part in this case.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-39232447
 
FlyUSAir
Posts: 387
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 6:26 am

Re: United Airlines (UA) Pilots Arrested in Glasgow

Fri Mar 10, 2017 1:52 pm

JannEejit wrote:
United FO has received a 10 month jail sentence today for his part in this case.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-39232447


Good.

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