n757tw
Topic Author
Posts: 118
Joined: Mon May 01, 2000 11:52 am

AA @ PHX question - why aren't the flaps retracted all the way on arrival

Tue Aug 30, 2016 7:58 pm

I noticed last week when transiting PHX that the majority of AA aircraft at the gates still hadn't retracted their flaps and leading edge all the way. At first I noticed it on my own arriving aircraft and thought it might be an oversight, but I noticed a majority of aircraft in the same configuration, however not 100%. That evening it wasn't extraordinarily hot or anything, just a chance of rain.

Does anyone know why PHX is special in this regards?
 
wn676
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Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2005 5:33 am

Re: AA @ PHX question - why aren't the flaps retracted all the way on arrival

Tue Aug 30, 2016 8:04 pm

It's an Airbus-specific thing when temperatures exceed 86°F. They keep the flaps in the 1+F configuration to prevent bleed duct overheat warnings in the wings. So obviously not limited to PHX but it is quite noticeable here since we spend quite a few days above that temperature. Apparently newer Airbus aircraft don't suffer this problem but for airline fleets that include both the old and new design, for simplicity, they usually adapt the procedure fleet-wide.
Tiny, unreadable text leaves ample room for interpretation.
 
n757tw
Topic Author
Posts: 118
Joined: Mon May 01, 2000 11:52 am

Re: AA @ PHX question - why aren't the flaps retracted all the way on arrival

Thu Sep 01, 2016 1:32 am

When looking for a pattern I did notice that most A32X examples did have this, but also the Boeings. Does the same condition exist on the 737/757?

Also it regularly is above 86F in DFW, and I've never observed this anywhere else then PHX.
 
maxpower1954
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Joined: Thu Sep 25, 2008 1:14 am

Re: AA @ PHX question - why aren't the flaps retracted all the way on arrival

Thu Sep 01, 2016 4:02 am

wn676 is almost correct - it's 100 degrees F, not 86 degrees. The only places we do this regularly are PHX and LAS.

Russ Farris
 
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hufftheweevil
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Re: AA @ PHX question - why aren't the flaps retracted all the way on arrival

Thu Sep 01, 2016 4:50 am

Some airlines might use a different threshold. For example, Frontier routinely leaves their flaps down, here in PHL, even on days that are hot but not near 100F.
Huff
 
luv2cattlecall
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Re: AA @ PHX question - why aren't the flaps retracted all the way on arrival

Thu Sep 01, 2016 7:19 am

Since they need flaps again on takeoff anyway, is there any specific advantage to retracting them all the way in normal ops at cooler airports?
 
greg3322
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Re: AA @ PHX question - why aren't the flaps retracted all the way on arrival

Thu Sep 01, 2016 9:34 am

luv2cattlecall wrote:
Since they need flaps again on takeoff anyway, is there any specific advantage to retracting them all the way in normal ops at cooler airports?


Less chance someone will run into the flaps when they are retracted.
 
n757tw
Topic Author
Posts: 118
Joined: Mon May 01, 2000 11:52 am

Re: AA @ PHX question - why aren't the flaps retracted all the way on arrival

Thu Sep 01, 2016 4:00 pm

Thanks everyone, its pretty interesting to hear why its done.

Does it also apply to Boeings? Or just older Airbus equipments?
 
maxpower1954
Posts: 1067
Joined: Thu Sep 25, 2008 1:14 am

Re: AA @ PHX question - why aren't the flaps retracted all the way on arrival

Fri Sep 02, 2016 3:17 am

On the Boeings I've flown 727, 737-200/300/400, 757 and 767 - no. And negative on the DC-8, DC-10 and Fokker F28.

Russ Farris
 
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CALTECH
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Re: AA @ PHX question - why aren't the flaps retracted all the way on arrival

Fri Sep 02, 2016 1:37 pm

maxpower1954 wrote:
wn676 is almost correct - it's 100 degrees F, not 86 degrees. The only places we do this regularly are PHX and LAS.


In the AMM and MX tips, it says 86' F, which is a nice even 30' C.Had one the other day,
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