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rutankrd
Posts: 3080
Joined: Mon Sep 08, 2003 6:08 am

Re: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 6:20 pm

A company is obligated to trade up until the following are activated at the SAME time for a PLC a statement to the city and appointment of the receivers. This typically happens about 07.30 UK time for many GB businesses.

The elephant in the room here is Grey Bull they may be about to pull the plug - they have been looking for a buyer for some time and they want their money for their next venture "steel"

Grey Bull may have given the CAA early warning

Just a quick heads up right now Monarch has just three scheduled departures from the UK left today to Ibiza from Manchester/Gatwick and Birmingham. If these leave on time and are a back over night by 7.30am ALL the fleet should back in the UK real tragedy emerging if true.
 
rutankrd
Posts: 3080
Joined: Mon Sep 08, 2003 6:08 am

Re: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 6:23 pm

There is an unverified third hand comment on dried fruit of a tourist scheduled to return on ZB655 being notified of change of operator for their flight to TS655 !
 
MadridSpotter
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Jun 15, 2014 2:51 pm

Re: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 6:23 pm

They are denying everything though, and people don't believe them... We'll see.
 
davies2911
Posts: 90
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2011 3:47 pm

Re: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 6:25 pm

As someone in Spain at the moment booked to fly home with them on Friday can the op (or anyone for that matter) provide a source for this? Or even the time the announcement would be made if true?
 
303dk
Posts: 509
Joined: Sat Aug 27, 2016 11:26 pm

Re: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 6:27 pm

Their social media team is now telling people that their flights are ATOL protected. Change in message
 
32andBelow
Posts: 5408
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 6:29 pm

303dk wrote:
Their social media team is now telling people that their flights are ATOL protected. Change in message

RIP for sure then.
 
rutankrd
Posts: 3080
Joined: Mon Sep 08, 2003 6:08 am

Re: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 6:30 pm

303dk wrote:
Their social media team is now telling people that their flights are ATOL protected. Change in message


Thats it then its is true shutters coming down - The news will be full of this come breakfast time
 
luftaom
Posts: 782
Joined: Thu May 20, 1999 4:29 pm

Re: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 6:35 pm

rutankrd wrote:
A company is obligated to trade up until the following are activated at the SAME time for a PLC a statement to the city and appointment of the receivers. This typically happens about 07.30 UK time for many GB businesses.



A positive obligation to trade? Where does that come from?

There's a positive obligation not to trade whilst insolvent. Administrators are appointed by the directors. Receivers are appointed by the secured creditor(s). An entity with securities listed has a continuous disclosure obligation - which bites during trading hours.

The timing is generally all revolves around when the technical triggers for insolvency are triggered - in which case it is the directors appointing administrators, with the secured creditor swiftly appointing receivers or it is when an event of default has been triggered under the facility agreements (and either the lenders call for all outstanding amounts to be repayed, or there is some kind of forebearance agreement in place with the lenders and the lenders pull the pin on that arrangement), in which case the secured lenders appoint a receiver with the directors inevitably appointing administrators shortly thereafter.
airliners.net's passenger - simultaneously connecting and flying direct.
 
BHXLOVER
Posts: 220
Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2015 2:20 pm

Re: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 6:37 pm

by738 wrote:
Have ZB aircraft been noticeably moved to remote stands at BHX?


The last time I flew from BHX a lot of Monarch flights were operating from remote stands anyway.
 
fuaeir
Posts: 3
Joined: Sun Sep 25, 2016 4:15 pm

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 6:38 pm

Boeing 737-800 of Miami Air inbound to LPA from Gander due just before midnight
 
by738
Posts: 3141
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2000 7:59 am

Re: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 6:41 pm

BHXLOVER wrote:
by738 wrote:
Have ZB aircraft been noticeably moved to remote stands at BHX?


The last time I flew from BHX a lot of Monarch flights were operating from remote stands anyway.


That goes without saying, but there was a suggestion that there was an obvious unusual move of aircraft to remote stands.
 
MadridSpotter
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Jun 15, 2014 2:51 pm

Re: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 6:41 pm

303dk wrote:
Their social media team is now telling people that their flights are ATOL protected. Change in message


This was in response to someone asking what would he do if they actually went bust, not confirming anything.
 
Armodeen
Posts: 1277
Joined: Wed Aug 28, 2013 10:17 am

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 6:41 pm

So very sad. I have flown ZB many times and always enjoyed.

I was going to book a flight to AGP today, but i'll wait and see till tomorrow.
 
303dk
Posts: 509
Joined: Sat Aug 27, 2016 11:26 pm

Re: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 6:42 pm

by738 wrote:
BHXLOVER wrote:
by738 wrote:
Have ZB aircraft been noticeably moved to remote stands at BHX?


The last time I flew from BHX a lot of Monarch flights were operating from remote stands anyway.


That goes without saying, but there was a suggestion that there was an obvious unusual move of aircraft to remote stands.

That will probably happen in the early morning hours as the northbound red eyes arrive in the UK
 
Scorpio
Posts: 5050
Joined: Thu Oct 04, 2001 3:48 am

Re: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 6:49 pm

MadridSpotter wrote:
303dk wrote:
Their social media team is now telling people that their flights are ATOL protected. Change in message


This was in response to someone asking what would he do if they actually went bust, not confirming anything.

Indeed. They even flat-out denied the rumor in the very same tweet. Sounds like 303dk is deliberately trying to make it appear as if this tweet says a lot more than it actually does...
 
Andy33
Posts: 2570
Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2009 9:30 am

Re: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 6:54 pm

dewie93 wrote:
32andBelow wrote:
Is there like no capacity available in Europe? All these widebodies ferrying 12+ hours?


They may for a day or morning, but not for a week or so! Plus many carriers are packed as it is with thomas cook having borrowed a couple of a320's this summer from Avion Express & SmartLynx.


In a "normal" year a fair proportion of Northern Europeans go to Turkey in the summer. Quite a few of these flights would be directly with, or subcontracted to, Turkish carriers. This year the Turkish market has collapsed, in much the same way the Egyptian and Tunisian markets did though not quite as severely. Package holiday companies have filled the gap by utilising every property they can find inside the EU, especially in Spain. But they can't use the Turkish carriers to fly their customers wholly within the EU, because they don't have traffic rights, so the spare capacity inside the EU/EEA is squeezed.

Assuming that the Monarch situation turns out to be as serious as it appears to be, there are a lot more airports that will need rescue flights, and many of these couldn't take anything much bigger than a 757 or A321, so what local spare capacity exists would probably be concentrated on these smaller airports, while the large ones that can handle widebodies get them.


And this brings another point. Canadian and US carriers do not have traffic rights to fly passengers between Spain and the UK - unless of course the UK and Spanish CAAs waive the rules. So this is clearly something organised at a very high level, and with some preparation. There may be other non-EU carriers involved elsewhere, we just haven't noticed the odd 737 or A320.
 
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FlyCaledonian
Posts: 1994
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2003 6:18 am

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:01 pm

I just don't buy that if this is planned why ZB would still be taking so many bookings on their website.

* Lanzarote in December (from LGW) - 117 bookings in last 24 hours
* Venice in December (from LGW) - 39 bookings in last 24 hours
* Tenerife (South) in December (from MAN) - 162 bookings in last 24 hours
* Majorca in December (from MAN) - 161 bookings in last 24 hours

Now it seems that something is going on and I am wondering if - unfortunately - a holiday company who sends their customers on ZB flights could be in trouble. If that is so and there is going to be a need to fly people back, then having additional aircraft to add additional capacity when ZB have staff already managing check-ins at key locations could be necessary.
Let's Go British Caledonian!
 
32andBelow
Posts: 5408
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:02 pm

FlyCaledonian wrote:
I just don't buy that if this is planned why ZB would still be taking so many bookings on their website.

* Lanzarote in December (from LGW) - 117 bookings in last 24 hours
* Venice in December (from LGW) - 39 bookings in last 24 hours
* Tenerife (South) in December (from MAN) - 162 bookings in last 24 hours
* Majorca in December (from MAN) - 161 bookings in last 24 hours

Now it seems that something is going on and I am wondering if - unfortunately - a holiday company who sends their customers on ZB flights could be in trouble. If that is so and there is going to be a need to fly people back, then having additional aircraft to add additional capacity when ZB have staff already managing check-ins at key locations could be necessary.

That makes no sense though. They could just fly the people out on the normal flights and maybe get paid by the government instead.
 
Alexdk
Posts: 242
Joined: Thu Oct 01, 2015 9:08 pm

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:04 pm

How can UA just stop operating 2 large planes? Are they going for retirement afterwards?
 
32andBelow
Posts: 5408
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:06 pm

Alexdk wrote:
How can UA just stop operating 2 large planes? Are they going for retirement afterwards?

They have a 747 charter business. This is going into the one of the slowest travel periods of the whole year. They got planes.
 
Varsity1
Posts: 2301
Joined: Mon May 02, 2016 4:55 am

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:07 pm

Alexdk wrote:
How can UA just stop operating 2 large planes? Are they going for retirement afterwards?


They have spare 747's for military, sports and VIP charter.
 
DDR
Posts: 1738
Joined: Sat Sep 28, 2013 11:09 pm

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:08 pm

Any UA crew on here? Has the company given a reason for these flights?
 
Alexdk
Posts: 242
Joined: Thu Oct 01, 2015 9:08 pm

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:10 pm

Varsity1 wrote:
Alexdk wrote:
How can UA just stop operating 2 large planes? Are they going for retirement afterwards?


They have spare 747's for military, sports and VIP charter.


But these particular planes have been operating scheduled flights every day before this situation.
 
303dk
Posts: 509
Joined: Sat Aug 27, 2016 11:26 pm

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:12 pm

Alexdk wrote:
Varsity1 wrote:
Alexdk wrote:
How can UA just stop operating 2 large planes? Are they going for retirement afterwards?


They have spare 747's for military, sports and VIP charter.


But these particular planes have been operating scheduled flights every day before this situation.

They have 20 (maybe 21... 1 went to VCV a couple weeks ago) operating something like 6 routes. There's slack in the fleet
 
Varsity1
Posts: 2301
Joined: Mon May 02, 2016 4:55 am

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:13 pm

Alexdk wrote:
Varsity1 wrote:
Alexdk wrote:
How can UA just stop operating 2 large planes? Are they going for retirement afterwards?


They have spare 747's for military, sports and VIP charter.


But these particular planes have been operating scheduled flights every day before this situation.


Aircraft coming out of MX or reserve will fly those lines. These will sit reserve/charter or hit MX facilities if they have deferred items.
 
32andBelow
Posts: 5408
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:13 pm

Alexdk wrote:
Varsity1 wrote:
Alexdk wrote:
How can UA just stop operating 2 large planes? Are they going for retirement afterwards?


They have spare 747's for military, sports and VIP charter.


But these particular planes have been operating scheduled flights every day before this situation.

That doesn't mean there aren't planes that could take additional flights. Someone airlines will split flight lines so more planes get rotated around
 
Varsity1
Posts: 2301
Joined: Mon May 02, 2016 4:55 am

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:15 pm

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/ ... s-11936873

The airline is openly denying that the UAL charters have anything to do with Monarch. This will devolve into a huge PR mess if rumors are true.
 
by738
Posts: 3141
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2000 7:59 am

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:18 pm

They will not be caring about the PR mess after the effect....
 
rlwynn
Posts: 1523
Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2000 3:35 am

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:18 pm

Will not matter for they will be gone.
I can drive faster than you
 
rrapynot
Posts: 72
Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2016 2:27 am

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:22 pm

Let's say all these ad-hoc charters are nothing to do with Monarch. What other explanations are there?
 
Alexdk
Posts: 242
Joined: Thu Oct 01, 2015 9:08 pm

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:22 pm

ZB285 TFS-LGW may be their last flight ever?
Last edited by Alexdk on Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:27 pm, edited 2 times in total.
 
02hilliert
Posts: 479
Joined: Fri Feb 16, 2007 6:52 pm

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:24 pm

Is it possible that a cruise company has gone bust and passengers are being repatriated by air?

Monarch passengers will only be repatriated theoretically if they are a Monarch Holidays customer, rather than a Monarch Airlines customer...

I firmly believe that these are just a set of strange coincidences that has resulted in press putting 2 and 2 together and getting 5...

Monarch will still be here this time next week!
Next Up: Back to the US - Charlotte & Kansas City
 
[email protected]
Posts: 16616
Joined: Sat Jan 13, 2001 6:29 pm

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:29 pm

It is almost as though most here want the airline to cease to exist.
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
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blooBirdie
Posts: 182
Joined: Sat Sep 27, 2003 9:15 am

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:32 pm

Looking on Flightradar24 the last outbound MON plane has just landed at VCE. No other outbound flights!
 
Andy33
Posts: 2570
Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2009 9:30 am

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:38 pm

There's a set of overnight Ibizas, one from each of Birmingham, Gatwick, and Manchester that are due to leave in a couple of hours time. That's the last of today's flights. The schedule is due to start again in the morning at around 05:30. What will actually happen remains to be seen. Either grounding, or normal operation?
 
TC957
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Joined: Wed May 23, 2012 1:12 pm

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:41 pm

But cruise ships are not based in PMI or TFS or NAP - BCN, yes. And if it was charters for a cruise co, why just fly back to the UK ? There will be dozens of nationalities on any given cruise. Something doesn't add up with all these ad hoc charters if Monarch says it's not for them.
 
JobsaGoodun
Posts: 117
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2004 6:35 pm

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:43 pm

Just three months ago on 27th June, The Telegraph reported that despite moving into profit, Monarch were looking to raise £35million in short term capital and issued a 'going concern' warning. Cash is king for any airline and although they may be profitable, if they can't pay their bills each month and Greybull choose not to help, then very sadly there isn't anywhere else to go.

I genuinely hope this isn't the case as I have friends employed by Monarch.
 
APYu
Posts: 516
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2007 10:23 pm

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:45 pm

For ATOL protection to kick in the liquidation has to have happened no? While ZB are still taking money why would the CAA offer to help. And by letting them continue to trade they would be creating more issues for pax to be resolved.
The CAA would also have to open a brief tender process which I think we would have heard about.
I don't understand what's going on with these flights, and sincerely hope the rumours are not true, but the CAA arranging all this before a liquidation, and over a weekend, seems surprising to me, given what we have seen in previous liquidations.
We'd like to welcome in particular our Executive Club members and those joining us from our Oneworld alliance partners.
 
JobsaGoodun
Posts: 117
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2004 6:35 pm

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:49 pm

Hate to say it but who's to say that the CAA might be funding these repatriations (if true)?

Could it be that Greybull are funding this as part of an orderly wind down of Monarch having failed to find a buyer? Unconventional for sure but....
 
02hilliert
Posts: 479
Joined: Fri Feb 16, 2007 6:52 pm

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:50 pm

TC957 wrote:
But cruise ships are not based in PMI or TFS or NAP - BCN, yes. And if it was charters for a cruise co, why just fly back to the UK ? There will be dozens of nationalities on any given cruise. Something doesn't add up with all these ad hoc charters if Monarch says it's not for them.


Because the UK CAA are probably more reactive to situations like this thanks to ATOL, they have been doing it for years in response to tour operator failings... Yes, cruise ships are not based in any of those cities, but all of those cities are visited by cruise ships, and if a cruise line has gone bust then ships will stop where they are...

As I mentioned previously, there will be no need to deploy aircraft to carry passengers affected by an airline failure, only a tour operator failure. So, if Monarch Holidays has gone, the that might explain it, but the number of affected passengers will not be huge...

I believe this is all being blown out of proportion and a lot of people will have to eat their words tomorrow... Unfortunately, there won't be apologies by press for mis-reporting the story, but I do not believe that Monarch are going anywhere right now...
Next Up: Back to the US - Charlotte & Kansas City
 
Danfearn77
Posts: 616
Joined: Thu Jul 10, 2008 11:52 pm

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:52 pm

These ad hoc charters seem to be centred around a few destinations it seems, MON have a lot broader network. Let's say it's true, what about all the other pax stuck in the dozens of other destinations?
Eagles may soar high, but weasels dont get sucked into jet engines!
 
32andBelow
Posts: 5408
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:53 pm

02hilliert wrote:
TC957 wrote:
But cruise ships are not based in PMI or TFS or NAP - BCN, yes. And if it was charters for a cruise co, why just fly back to the UK ? There will be dozens of nationalities on any given cruise. Something doesn't add up with all these ad hoc charters if Monarch says it's not for them.


Because the UK CAA are probably more reactive to situations like this thanks to ATOL, they have been doing it for years in response to tour operator failings... Yes, cruise ships are not based in any of those cities, but all of those cities are visited by cruise ships, and if a cruise line has gone bust then ships will stop where they are...

As I mentioned previously, there will be no need to deploy aircraft to carry passengers affected by an airline failure, only a tour operator failure. So, if Monarch Holidays has gone, the that might explain it, but the number of affected passengers will not be huge...

I believe this is all being blown out of proportion and a lot of people will have to eat their words tomorrow... Unfortunately, there won't be apologies by press for mis-reporting the story, but I do not believe that Monarch are going anywhere right now...

Then someone should say what the flights are for to ease concerns. Is it classified?
 
APYu
Posts: 516
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2007 10:23 pm

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:54 pm

They'd focus initially on their big destinations which are the ones being mentioned
We'd like to welcome in particular our Executive Club members and those joining us from our Oneworld alliance partners.
 
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OA260
Posts: 25379
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Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:59 pm

Lots of speculation going around from everything that the aircraft have been moved to remote stands at MAN to its their handling agents ( Aviator ) that have gone bust. Even seen a manager from Monarch posting on FB denying there is any shut down etc... time will tell.
 
TC957
Posts: 4059
Joined: Wed May 23, 2012 1:12 pm

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 8:04 pm

There should be plenty of spare capacity around Europe's charter fleet now that high season has passed to fetch pax from those airports that can't take wide-bodies that MON operate to. I suspect Titan are in for a busy week should the worse happen to MON.
Anyone here from UA or Omni willing to say why they've been positioned across the Atlantic ?
 
by738
Posts: 3141
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2000 7:59 am

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 8:15 pm

would be surprised if there was spare capacity. This is still in summer schedules with some holiday weekends and school holidays over next month.
 
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OA260
Posts: 25379
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Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 8:24 pm

Reports that passengers currently down in AGP are being told TS will operate their flight back to MAN tomorrow. ( If true ) .
 
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seemyseems
Posts: 451
Joined: Fri Jan 02, 2009 12:42 am

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 8:27 pm

I hope they bloody don't, my parents flew out with them today!

OA260 wrote:
Lots of speculation going around from everything that the aircraft have been moved to remote stands at MAN to its their handling agents ( Aviator ) that have gone bust. Even seen a manager from Monarch posting on FB denying there is any shut down etc... time will tell.


ZB is handled by Swissport
seemyseems in ATL
 
rrapynot
Posts: 72
Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2016 2:27 am

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 8:27 pm

OA260 wrote:
Reports that passengers currently down in AGP are being told TS will operate their flight back to MAN tomorrow. ( If true ) .


Can you cite the reports?
 
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seemyseems
Posts: 451
Joined: Fri Jan 02, 2009 12:42 am

Re: Rumor: Monarch to cease ops?

Sun Sep 25, 2016 8:33 pm

I forgot to check the stands by Staff West in MAN, did anyone else see the aircraft lined up?
seemyseems in ATL
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