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qf789
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Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Wed Oct 05, 2016 1:10 pm

Qantas is set to announce Boeing 787 seats and initial routes on 27 October 2016

Qantas is poised to reveal its Boeing 787 seats and the aircraft’s first routes at a media event on Thursday October 27, as the airline takes the next step towards the Dreamliner’s debut in late 2017.

The first international route for the red-tailed Boeing 787 will be one from Qantas’ existing network, with all-new destinations to follow as Qantas builds up its 787 fleet.

It’s expected that the Boeing 787 will also appear on a series of domestic flights on a short-term basis so that pilots and cabin crew can become accustomed to the new bird.


http://www.ausbt.com.au/qantas-set-to-r ... utes-seats

I am thing first international route will either be SYD-HKG or SYD-SIN
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Wed Oct 05, 2016 1:27 pm

Will QF open up new routes with the 787s or just replace older aircraft on existing routes?
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Wed Oct 05, 2016 1:30 pm

CARST wrote:
Will QF open up new routes with the 787s or just replace older aircraft on existing routes?

Straight from the article:

The first international route for the red-tailed Boeing 787 will be one from Qantas’ existing network, with all-new destinations to follow as Qantas builds up its 787 fleet.
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Wed Oct 05, 2016 1:30 pm

CARST wrote:
Will QF open up new routes with the 787s or just replace older aircraft on existing routes?


The 787 is being brought in to replace the ageing Boeing 747 in the fleet, but with the extended range and efficiency of the 787-9, QF will be starting new routes, including plans for a non-stop service to London from Perth
 
raylee67
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Wed Oct 05, 2016 1:32 pm

Can QANTAS really open new routes with the 787 on order?

There are only 8 787s on firm order, right?
And according to this news article, the 787 will be used to replace the remaining 5 744s in fleet:
http://australianaviation.com.au/2015/0 ... itability/

And I suppose when you use 789 to replace 744, you would need to increase frequency on the route unless you want to actually reduce capacity on those 744 routes. So logically, QANTAS would probably need all 8 789s to replace the 5 744s, just to replace the capacity on a 1-on-1 basis. So if QANTAS is not to reduce capacity on the 744 routes, it won't be able to open new routes with the current order of 789.

Does this mean QANTAS is going to convert some of the options into firm order soon?
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Wed Oct 05, 2016 1:35 pm

CARST wrote:
Will QF open up new routes with the 787s or just replace older aircraft on existing routes?


Both, as reported initially will be run on domestic runs and towards the end of next year will be placed on an existing route into Asia. QF is expected to announce their first ULH destination (tipped to be a route such as MEL-DFW or PER-LHR) in early 2017 which will start in early 2018
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Wed Oct 05, 2016 1:59 pm

raylee67 wrote:
And according to this news article, the 787 will be used to replace the remaining 5 744s in fleet:


QF has plenty of flexibility with the 744s - the general expectation is that only the two oldest frames (which still have older seats) will be retired in the short term and the rest of the fleet will keep going into next decade. QF has always kept their cards close to their chest.

raylee67 wrote:
Does this mean QANTAS is going to convert some of the options into firm order soon?


Not likely until after the existing orders have entered service - "We have to demonstrate we can make money out of the eight we have,” he said. “Once we’ve done that, we’ll be comfortable in ordering more."(Bloomberg).

Hopefully that means a follow-up order in 2018 rather than 2019 once the whole fleet are in service.
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Wed Oct 05, 2016 2:01 pm

I wouldn't be surprised if the media event coincides with an announcement of a A380/747ERs cabin refresh, which they really need for product consistency especially in J and PE (though they could announce this at the AGM on the 21st).

I don't see any Asian or EU routes working with the first tranche of 787s. A330s have more capacity that are really needed on HKG and SIN given the rumoured seat count of the 787s is 225-250.

Based on the current timeline, I'll place my bets on SYD-YVR 3/4x pw initially before moving to daily once their 3rd 787 is delivered. It's still an existing route, but it would make a bit more noise with the local media because YVR is only seasonal.

I don't see PER routes unless the WA Government throws money at QF.
Last edited by getluv on Wed Oct 05, 2016 2:08 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Wed Oct 05, 2016 2:06 pm

Is the general feeling that they will use the same business and economy seats they are installing on the A330s and the existing Premium Economy seat? They are good options, but I'm always interested to see airlines come up with new designs. :)
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Wed Oct 05, 2016 2:13 pm

CBBW wrote:
Is the general feeling that they will use the same business and economy seats they are installing on the A330s and the existing Premium Economy seat? They are good options, but I'm always interested to see airlines come up with new designs. :)


I have heard about a revolutionary design for the Premium Economy, so we'll see what they come up with.
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Wed Oct 05, 2016 2:43 pm

AsiaTravel wrote:
CBBW wrote:
Is the general feeling that they will use the same business and economy seats they are installing on the A330s and the existing Premium Economy seat? They are good options, but I'm always interested to see airlines come up with new designs. :)


I have heard about a revolutionary design for the Premium Economy, so we'll see what they come up with.


Correct, refer to the following article

http://www.ausbt.com.au/qantas-boeing-7 ... um-economy
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Wed Oct 05, 2016 2:44 pm

CBBW wrote:
Is the general feeling that they will use the same business and economy seats they are installing on the A330s


This is my impression regarding the J seats, which is a win - those seats are fantastic.
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Wed Oct 05, 2016 3:39 pm

YVR seems like a logical bet, their seasonal services have been doing pretty well by all accounts and YVR-Australia is a growing market. I definitely think there's room for two daily YVR-SYD (AC x1 & QFx1), if QF can position its flight times to arrive in the evening it would offer a good alternative to those who don't want to arrive in the morning or fly AC.
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Wed Oct 05, 2016 4:02 pm

getluv wrote:
the rumoured seat count of the 787s is 225-250.

According to the article 235. That is very low density. It makes me think there will be quite decent legroom in Y and that the W cabin will also be very spacious. No doubt QF is planning some very, very long haul routes with the 789.

AsiaTravel wrote:
I have heard about a revolutionary design for the Premium Economy

Exciting! I wonder what they have in mind.
Upcoming flights:
April/May: AM MEX-SCL 788 (J), AM EZE-MEX 789 (J).
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Wed Oct 05, 2016 10:42 pm

qf789 wrote:
Qantas is set to announce Boeing 787 seats and initial routes on 27 October 2016

Qantas is poised to reveal its Boeing 787 seats and the aircraft’s first routes at a media event on Thursday October 27, as the airline takes the next step towards the Dreamliner’s debut in late 2017.

The first international route for the red-tailed Boeing 787 will be one from Qantas’ existing network, with all-new destinations to follow as Qantas builds up its 787 fleet.

It’s expected that the Boeing 787 will also appear on a series of domestic flights on a short-term basis so that pilots and cabin crew can become accustomed to the new bird.


http://www.ausbt.com.au/qantas-set-to-r ... utes-seats

I am thing first international route will either be SYD-HKG or SYD-SIN


Or maybe BKK. Could be any of the Asian routes where the aircraft can get a round trip in easily in 24 hrs and just keep repeating. QF and their mate EK do both fly BKK-SYD / SYD-BKK so perhaps a 789 with fewer seats than the 333 would be an interesting experiment for QF for a period of time?

If it's a longer route, maybe SFO?
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Thu Oct 06, 2016 12:02 am

YVR seems a good guess to me 3/4 weekly, an Asian route with 1 frame maybe as a temporary measure? SIN or HKG most likely IMO, until they have 3 aircraft and a bit of slack to start a daily long haul requiring 2 frames. Where will 787 maintanence be done? MEL? If so MEL-DFW makes a bit of sense as the first new route.
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Thu Oct 06, 2016 12:33 am

I remember reading this article last year, at just over 9,000 miles, is it even possible?

http://www.ausbt.com.au/why-we-could-see-qantas-fly-sydney-chicago-on-the-boeing-787
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Thu Oct 06, 2016 1:26 am

789 cannot make SYD-ORD. But in can make MEL-DFW-ORD round trip.
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Thu Oct 06, 2016 1:30 am

The 787's will initially based in Melbourne, as Qantas has put out initial internal offers for pilots to take 787 roles based in Melbourne.
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Thu Oct 06, 2016 1:45 am

ZK-NBT wrote:
YVR seems a good guess to me 3/4 weekly, an Asian route with 1 frame maybe as a temporary measure? SIN or HKG most likely IMO, until they have 3 aircraft and a bit of slack to start a daily long haul requiring 2 frames. Where will 787 maintanence be done? MEL? If so MEL-DFW makes a bit of sense as the first new route.


Since the JQ 787 base is already in MEL, it makes sense for QF to have them done there for the first couple of frames. I'm hearing MEL-LAX might be one of the earlier routes (to replace 747's operating on QF95/96, NOT the A380 flights), with MEL-DFW to follow when more of the aircraft come online. I can see QF95/96 being dropped once MEL-DFW starts.

Something floating around about MEL-BKK being transferred back to mainline, 787 or not, I'm not sure.
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Thu Oct 06, 2016 2:18 am

kriskim wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
YVR seems a good guess to me 3/4 weekly, an Asian route with 1 frame maybe as a temporary measure? SIN or HKG most likely IMO, until they have 3 aircraft and a bit of slack to start a daily long haul requiring 2 frames. Where will 787 maintanence be done? MEL? If so MEL-DFW makes a bit of sense as the first new route.


Since the JQ 787 base is already in MEL, it makes sense for QF to have them done there for the first couple of frames. I'm hearing MEL-LAX might be one of the earlier routes (to replace 747's operating on QF95/96, NOT the A380 flights), with MEL-DFW to follow when more of the aircraft come online. I can see QF95/96 being dropped once MEL-DFW starts.

Something floating around about MEL-BKK being transferred back to mainline, 787 or not, I'm not sure.


To me, an initial MEL-SIN route makes the most sense with the aircrafts first long haul being MEL-LAX to replace the 744 on QF95/96 as you suggest. I agree MEL-DFW is a logical follow. The 744 off of MEL-LAX can then be used to make MEL-HKG a daily 744 service which nicely increases capacity into HKG without QF needing to go through the hassle of obtaining slots for a second daily service. Ticks all of the boxes in terms of:

1. Increasing capacity into Asia - (which QF has been doing)
2. Expanding North America - (A 2nd daily DFW service makes the most logical sense)

I'd also not be surprised to hear of an A380 upgrade program. The Skybed 2's on the A380 are yesterdays news and, in my humble opinion, QF needs to standardise long haul business on the excellent A330 business seat. It's a darn comfortable seat and far more so than the Skybed 2's.
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Thu Oct 06, 2016 2:48 am

globalcabotage wrote:
789 cannot make SYD-ORD. But in can make MEL-DFW-ORD round trip.


Highly unlikely QF would operate a DFW-ORD tag if they did indeed fly MEL-DFW. AA can cover the domestic leg easily..
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Thu Oct 06, 2016 3:38 am

globalcabotage wrote:
789 cannot make SYD-ORD.

That, and it would pass right over LAX... rendering it even more nonsensical.
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Thu Oct 06, 2016 7:23 am

AsiaTravel wrote:
CBBW wrote:
Is the general feeling that they will use the same business and economy seats they are installing on the A330s and the existing Premium Economy seat? They are good options, but I'm always interested to see airlines come up with new designs. :)


I have heard about a revolutionary design for the Premium Economy, so we'll see what they come up with.


10% more space for twice the cost?
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Thu Oct 06, 2016 7:34 am

dptpa wrote:
I remember reading this article last year, at just over 9,000 miles, is it even possible?

http://www.ausbt.com.au/why-we-could-see-qantas-fly-sydney-chicago-on-the-boeing-787


They are statute miles. It is 7829nm, and if you take a look at the 789 payload range, with 250 seats it can do it.

Ruscoe
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Thu Oct 06, 2016 8:30 am

Sydscott wrote:
kriskim wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
YVR seems a good guess to me 3/4 weekly, an Asian route with 1 frame maybe as a temporary measure? SIN or HKG most likely IMO, until they have 3 aircraft and a bit of slack to start a daily long haul requiring 2 frames. Where will 787 maintanence be done? MEL? If so MEL-DFW makes a bit of sense as the first new route.


Since the JQ 787 base is already in MEL, it makes sense for QF to have them done there for the first couple of frames. I'm hearing MEL-LAX might be one of the earlier routes (to replace 747's operating on QF95/96, NOT the A380 flights), with MEL-DFW to follow when more of the aircraft come online. I can see QF95/96 being dropped once MEL-DFW starts.

Something floating around about MEL-BKK being transferred back to mainline, 787 or not, I'm not sure.


To me, an initial MEL-SIN route makes the most sense with the aircrafts first long haul being MEL-LAX to replace the 744 on QF95/96 as you suggest. I agree MEL-DFW is a logical follow. The 744 off of MEL-LAX can then be used to make MEL-HKG a daily 744 service which nicely increases capacity into HKG without QF needing to go through the hassle of obtaining slots for a second daily service. Ticks all of the boxes in terms of:

1. Increasing capacity into Asia - (which QF has been doing)
2. Expanding North America - (A 2nd daily DFW service makes the most logical sense)

I'd also not be surprised to hear of an A380 upgrade program. The Skybed 2's on the A380 are yesterdays news and, in my humble opinion, QF needs to standardise long haul business on the excellent A330 business seat. It's a darn comfortable seat and far more so than the Skybed 2's.


I have similar thinking but expect they will actual drop the QF95/96 with MEL-DFW coming on line
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Thu Oct 06, 2016 8:58 am

Maybe SYD -HND could be first amongst the 789 routes.
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Thu Oct 06, 2016 9:32 am

TC957 wrote:
Maybe SYD -HND could be first amongst the 789 routes.


747 - 787 would be a bit of a pax loss on a high load maket
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Thu Oct 06, 2016 10:43 am

Sydscott wrote:
kriskim wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
YVR seems a good guess to me 3/4 weekly, an Asian route with 1 frame maybe as a temporary measure? SIN or HKG most likely IMO, until they have 3 aircraft and a bit of slack to start a daily long haul requiring 2 frames. Where will 787 maintanence be done? MEL? If so MEL-DFW makes a bit of sense as the first new route.


Since the JQ 787 base is already in MEL, it makes sense for QF to have them done there for the first couple of frames. I'm hearing MEL-LAX might be one of the earlier routes (to replace 747's operating on QF95/96, NOT the A380 flights), with MEL-DFW to follow when more of the aircraft come online. I can see QF95/96 being dropped once MEL-DFW starts.

Something floating around about MEL-BKK being transferred back to mainline, 787 or not, I'm not sure.


To me, an initial MEL-SIN route makes the most sense with the aircrafts first long haul being MEL-LAX to replace the 744 on QF95/96 as you suggest. I agree MEL-DFW is a logical follow. The 744 off of MEL-LAX can then be used to make MEL-HKG a daily 744 service which nicely increases capacity into HKG without QF needing to go through the hassle of obtaining slots for a second daily service. Ticks all of the boxes in terms of:

1. Increasing capacity into Asia - (which QF has been doing)
2. Expanding North America - (A 2nd daily DFW service makes the most logical sense)

I'd also not be surprised to hear of an A380 upgrade program. The Skybed 2's on the A380 are yesterdays news and, in my humble opinion, QF needs to standardise long haul business on the excellent A330 business seat. It's a darn comfortable seat and far more so than the Skybed 2's.


Makes perfect sense to me! Best idea I've heard yet.

I think we will see an upgraded version of the 330 seat, I can't recall the manufacturer, but I believe there is a model above. I would hope for something like the new DL seat, but that leaves F on the 380 in an awkward position. Hope to see the 380s refitted, not confident the remaining 744s would, could be wrong.
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Thu Oct 06, 2016 11:25 am

The 'revolutionary' new premium economy seats will be as revolutionary as the Air New Zealand ones from a few years ago, current speculation would have you believe.... But we all know what has happened with those ANZ seats in the past few months! I have heard that QF's new seats will be retrofitted to the existing fleet and that the A380s/747s will also get various upgrades, which aligns with postings above in this thread.
A warehouse in Sydney not too far from the airport may hold all of the answers.
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Thu Oct 06, 2016 12:08 pm

raylee67 wrote:
Does this mean QANTAS is going to convert some of the options into firm order soon?


Not likely until after the existing orders have entered service - "We have to demonstrate we can make money out of the eight we have,” he said. “Once we’ve done that, we’ll be comfortable in ordering more."(Bloomberg).

Hopefully that means a follow-up order in 2018 rather than 2019 once the whole fleet are in service.[/quote]

This is a strange answer from Qantas.
Do they really expect us to believe that they have spent a couple of billion with an unknown outcome!
QF must have already looked and found they can make money otherwise they would not have ordered.
I think it is much more likely the comment is for another reason, which I don't know but could be about keeping Boeing on it's toes with price, perhaps to put pressure on the pilots, or something else.
Quite clearly the 787 will be used to open new routes, if these are successful and growing they will upgrade them to the 779 as the true 747 replacement or possibly 351 or both.

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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Thu Oct 06, 2016 12:49 pm

If QF does replace 744 with 789 om AUS-USA i wonder how many routes to AA hubs get 1x QF and 1x AA 789s to up frequency, vs just QF change or double QF.
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Thu Oct 06, 2016 1:11 pm

There has also been a leak on facebook that the economy seats could be the Thompson Cozysuite as pictured below

Image

Image

Image

Image
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AsiaTravel
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Thu Oct 06, 2016 1:39 pm

qf789 wrote:
There has also been a leak on facebook that the economy seats could be the Thompson Cozysuite as pictured below


https://www.facebook.com/AIRLINESECRETS ... 5470248463

That could be an absolute game changer regarding my hate to the 787. 20" in Y would be great and for ULH flights it would make it more bearable.
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Thu Oct 06, 2016 2:04 pm

LAX772LR wrote:
globalcabotage wrote:
789 cannot make SYD-ORD.

That, and it would pass right over LAX... rendering it even more nonsensical.


Why exactly? I would venture to say that airlines all over the world fly over current destinations to get to another.
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Thu Oct 06, 2016 4:20 pm

dptpa wrote:
Why exactly? I would venture to say that airlines all over the world fly over current destinations to get to another.

That works in medium and shorter-longhauls.

For:
  • What would be the 2nd longest scheduled flight ever attempted by any airline;
  • Requiring an ULH aircraft type that they don't have;
  • To a destination that they've never entered even with the 1stops they've willingly done throughout the world in the past;
  • When it flies directly over their primary gateway to that region of the world (which also serves as a hub to their j/v partner);
  • To service a market that provides arguably no significant 1stop access that the combo of LAX/DFW/JFK don't already?

....very unlikely, any time remotely foreseeable.
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Thu Oct 06, 2016 10:53 pm

YVR makes a lot of sense as the first permanent destination but doubtful it will be the first actual revenue destination. I would venture the first week or two AKL will take the honours, followed by a relatively high frequency port in Asia (not HND, but perhaps NRT, SIN, HKG) which will allow the aircraft to rotate between SYD, MEL and BNE operations. Remember aircraft #1 will be supporting crew training in its initial role so it makes no sense to have it operating 14hr one-way flights (YVR, LAX) with similar length layovers, or even 9-10hr one-way flights (HND) with 16hr layovers.

dptpa wrote:
LAX772LR wrote:
globalcabotage wrote:
789 cannot make SYD-ORD.

That, and it would pass right over LAX... rendering it even more nonsensical.


Why exactly? I would venture to say that airlines all over the world fly over current destinations to get to another.


They do, but not on ultra-long haul flights where it makes infinitely more sense to just land in the 'overflown' port and transfer the pax for the more distant port to the extensive domestic network of your significant other, i.e. it makes no sense for QF to fly over the top of LAX, at which it already has four daily flights (including the codeshare on the AA flight) whereby QF pax can transfer to AA's domestic services.
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Fri Oct 07, 2016 12:17 am

sagechan wrote:
If QF does replace 744 with 789 om AUS-USA i wonder how many routes to AA hubs get 1x QF and 1x AA 789s to up frequency, vs just QF change or double QF.

Depends on exactly what you mean.
SYD/MEL-LAX will NOT be B789, already A380 and will be for at least the next decade.
SYD-DFW, most likely will stay A380, MEL-DFW will start with B789, but my guess is that within a few years it will need an A380 or two B789s, the A380 should win that one.
B789 could be used to pioneer an extra frequency from both SYD/MEL, but that's a problem if you have robust growth.
BNE-LAX, could go B789 but I understand that the decrease in capacity could be a problem, possibly room for AA IF they are willing to make the investment.
SYD-SFO same as BNE-LAX, although SFO seems unlikely for AA.
SYD-YVR definitely B789
This leaves the question of what to do about JFK. The current B744 is the BNE-LAX aircraft, if that goes B789 then JFK goes A380 or B789 both choices have problems.

To comment on your question specifically: maybe LAX-MEL could use an AA B77W or B787 rather than the second flight, which not currently daily, going B789. IF BNE-LAX goes B789, then an AA B787 may make sense. Beyond these two possibilities I don't see much attraction for AA. To be honest I really doubt the profitability of AA LAX-SYD/AKL flights in the long run. Will it be 3rd time's the charm for AA? Who knows, watch this space,

Gemuser
 
mpdpilot
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Fri Oct 07, 2016 1:18 am

Gemuser wrote:
SYD/MEL-LAX will NOT be B789, already A380 and will be for at least the next decade.


I think the talk is that MEL-LAX would maintain the A380 flight 93 and the x2wk flight 95 with the 744 would switch to the 789, and perhaps increase frequency. QF could then operate both SYD and MEL double daily to LAX, conceivably.

Gemuser wrote:
SYD-DFW, most likely will stay A380, MEL-DFW will start with B789, but my guess is that within a few years it will need an A380 or two B789s, the A380 should win that one.
.

I know times could change but, suggesting that in a few years QF will operate 2 daily A380s to DFW seems a little far fetched for me. I think it would be more likely that DFW steadies with 1xA380 and 1x789, while LAX grows. I don't really think there is that much growth in the DFW markets that are not served via LAX (growing smaller as AA grows in LAX), that there will be that much growth in the coming years. And as mentioned why operate the flight to DFW when LAX works for most travellers and it is a shorter flight.

This is my thought on the AUS-USA market for QF A380s and where the 789 could go assuming they would only fly the 789 to the US (unlikely). I tend to think that if QF needs AA's feed to fill their planes (article) then less is more in the terms of capacity. Being daily or double daily is probably better than maintaining/growing capacity, but that is just me.

Qantas:
2x A380 SYD-LAX
1x A380 MEL-LAX
1x A380 SYD-DFW
1x B789 MEL-DFW
1x B789 BNE-LAX
1x B789 SYD-SFO
1x B789 SYD-YVR

I wanted to add AA's future offerings as well as they are QF's JV partner. Also, I tend to think in AA's eyes if they want to continue to grow at LAX, they need to be in these markets not just relying on the JV partner.

American
1x B77W SYD-LAX
1x B789 BNE-LAX
1x B788 AKL-LAX
1x B789 MEL-LAX
One mile of highway gets you one mile, one mile of runway gets you anywhere.
 
Gemuser
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Fri Oct 07, 2016 1:57 am

mpdpilot wrote:
I think the talk is that MEL-LAX would maintain the A380 flight 93 and the x2wk flight 95 with the 744 would switch to the 789, and perhaps increase frequency. QF could then operate both SYD and MEL double daily to LAX, conceivably.

This is where AA COULD come in, as the 2nd daily flight on MEL-LAX

mpdpilot wrote:
I know times could change but, suggesting that in a few years QF will operate 2 daily A380s to DFW seems a little far fetched for me. I think it would be more likely that DFW steadies with 1xA380 and 1x789, while LAX grows. I don't really think there is that much growth in the DFW markets that are not served via LAX (growing smaller as AA grows in LAX), that there will be that much growth in the coming years. And as mentioned why operate the flight to DFW when LAX works for most travellers and it is a shorter flight.


I see no reason why there could not be an A380 on MEL-DFW, as traffic increase, assuming it does [which I think it will] and there is availability of A380s

mpdpilot wrote:
This is my thought on the AUS-USA market for QF A380s and where the 789 could go assuming they would only fly the 789 to the US (unlikely). I tend to think that if QF needs AA's feed to fill their planes (article) then less is more in the terms of capacity. Being daily or double daily is probably better than maintaining/growing capacity, but that is just me.


And this is where many people fall down in discussing long haul routes from Australia. Given the distance & time zone differences there is no advantage in being double daily except to increase capacity and doing so is almost always more effective in using a larger aircraft. You can easily see this on LAX-SYD where all flights[QF, AA, UA, VA] leave between 10:00 pm & midnight. If you want to add capacity by adding another flight it just about has to go into the same time bank. This is why I think MEL-DFW will eventually be A380 and why IMHO the 8 ordered A380s will eventually arrive [despite the comments from AJ]. IMHO one role for the B789 at QF, [apart from pioneering new routes], will be in building capacity in situations where one A380 is not enough and 2 A380 is over kill, to start with.

Gemuser
 
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Fri Oct 07, 2016 2:37 am

AsiaTravel wrote:
qf789 wrote:
There has also been a leak on facebook that the economy seats could be the Thompson Cozysuite as pictured below


https://www.facebook.com/AIRLINESECRETS ... 5470248463

That could be an absolute game changer regarding my hate to the 787. 20" in Y would be great and for ULH flights it would make it more bearable.


The staggering might also help prevent very big people from spilling over into other people's seat space and injuring them, especially if the biggie is seated in the rear most seat in the staggered block.
DC10-10/30,MD82/88/90, 717,727,732/3/4/5/7/8/9ER,742/4,752/3,763/ER,772/E/L/3/W,788/9, 306,320,321,332/3,346,359,388
 
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jetfuel
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Fri Oct 07, 2016 5:03 am

AsiaTravel wrote:
qf789 wrote:
There has also been a leak on facebook that the economy seats could be the Thompson Cozysuite as pictured below


https://www.facebook.com/AIRLINESECRETS ... 5470248463

That could be an absolute game changer regarding my hate to the 787. 20" in Y would be great and for ULH flights it would make it more bearable.



The Airline Secrets on Facebook said it was just a RUMOUR. I am sure QF said the 787 would be 9 across so thats 17" wide seats :(
 
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qf789
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Fri Oct 07, 2016 10:01 am

jetfuel wrote:
I am sure QF said the 787 would be 9 across so thats 17" wide seats :(


QF have not mentioned seat width.

This is what they have said

the economy seats will be nine-across in a 3-3-3 arrangement, Joyce promises "we will be giving some very good seat pitch for economy seats given the lengths we’ll be flying
."

http://www.ausbt.com.au/qantas-ceo-prom ... figuration
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mpdpilot
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Fri Oct 07, 2016 6:14 pm

Gemuser wrote:
And this is where many people fall down in discussing long haul routes from Australia. Given the distance & time zone differences there is no advantage in being double daily except to increase capacity and doing so is almost always more effective in using a larger aircraft. You can easily see this on LAX-SYD where all flights[QF, AA, UA, VA] leave between 10:00 pm & midnight. If you want to add capacity by adding another flight it just about has to go into the same time bank. This is why I think MEL-DFW will eventually be A380 and why IMHO the 8 ordered A380s will eventually arrive [despite the comments from AJ]. IMHO one role for the B789 at QF, [apart from pioneering new routes], will be in building capacity in situations where one A380 is not enough and 2 A380 is over kill, to start with.

Gemuser


That makes a lot of sense, I would still say there are other reasons to go double daily to Australia. Aircraft flexibility, the 789 can be used in a lot more ways than an A380 can be. I would also say that due to the JV with AA, there are reasons why one flight would be AA and the other QF. I could see as you mentioned QF flying the A380 and AA flying the 789 on routes to increase capacity.

As for DFW-MEL, I guess I just don't see the growth requiring two A380s a day in DFW when they already have 3 at LAX, and with AA's growth at LAX, there are fewer and fewer routes that need to go via DFW to maintain the 1-stop flight.
One mile of highway gets you one mile, one mile of runway gets you anywhere.
 
Clarkxwb
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Fri Oct 07, 2016 10:03 pm

Financial history and considerations aside, I don't quite understand the painfully slow, measured cautious approach, and "wow" factor QF is taking in introducing the 789 into service. It's not like they are the launch customer and an inexperienced operator, and surely they have done their math, and repeated the process. The plane has been in service for awile now. Bring them in quickly I say.
 
crazyplane1234
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Sat Oct 08, 2016 2:29 am

Clarkxwb wrote:
Financial history and considerations aside, I don't quite understand the painfully slow, measured cautious approach, and "wow" factor QF is taking in introducing the 789 into service. It's not like they are the launch customer and an inexperienced operator, and surely they have done their math, and repeated the process. The plane has been in service for awile now. Bring them in quickly I say.

A while back, QF was losing quite a bit of money. The "painfully slow, measured cautious approach" is to ensure they don't rush into things, who knows what could go wrong?
 
Gemuser
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Sat Oct 08, 2016 3:11 am

mpdpilot wrote:
That makes a lot of sense, I would still say there are other reasons to go double daily to Australia. Aircraft flexibility, the 789 can be used in a lot more ways than an A380 can be. I would also say that due to the JV with AA, there are reasons why one flight would be AA and the other QF. I could see as you mentioned QF flying the A380 and AA flying the 789 on routes to increase capacity.

As for DFW-MEL, I guess I just don't see the growth requiring two A380s a day in DFW when they already have 3 at LAX, and with AA's growth at LAX, there are fewer and fewer routes that need to go via DFW to maintain the 1-stop flight.

I agree that, at the present time, AA seems interested in adding its own metal to Australian routes and QF would be happy with this as it saves them capital expenditure which is a BIG issue in Australia.

QF do NOT have three A380s into LAX. Both SYD/MEL - LAX is one A380 each. SYD has a daily AA B77W which replaced the second QF flight which was never a regular A380 rotation. MEL does have a second LAX flight one or two days a week but that is a B744 rotation. It is expected that the second QF flight will disappear if/when AA start MEL.

Just as a bit more information about restricted viable departure times: SYD-LAX QF dep 10:50, arrive LAX 6:30 same day; AA dep 11:55, arrive 7:55 same day. LAX - SYD QF 22:30, arrive 7:30 two days later; AA dep 22:40, arrive 7:45 two days later. VA, UA & DL have similar times. So most days have an A380, two B77Ws, a B77L & a B789 flying almost wing tip to wing tip on LAX- SYD.

Gemuser
 
Gemuser
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Sat Oct 08, 2016 3:19 am

Clarkxwb wrote:
Financial history and considerations aside, I don't quite understand the painfully slow, measured cautious approach, and "wow" factor QF is taking in introducing the 789 into service. It's not like they are the launch customer and an inexperienced operator, and surely they have done their math, and repeated the process. The plane has been in service for awile now. Bring them in quickly I say.

The problem is "CAPITAL EXPENDITURE". Raising capital in Australia is always an issue especially for capital intensive industries like airlines and especially so for Qantas which must remain at least, 50% Australian owned under the "Sale of Qantas" Act. A slow conservative approach is AJ trademark and who can blame him, it worked. Unfortunately this means a slow replacement of aircraft. It is believed that the B787 options will be confirmed only just before they expire, whenever that is. It also means the A380 have been deferred, perhaps indefinitely :( .

Gemuser
 
mpdpilot
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Sat Oct 08, 2016 3:39 am

Gemuser wrote:
QF do NOT have three A380s into LAX. Both SYD/MEL - LAX is one A380 each. SYD has a daily AA B77W which replaced the second QF flight which was never a regular A380 rotation. MEL does have a second LAX flight one or two days a week but that is a B744 rotation. It is expected that the second QF flight will disappear if/when AA start MEL.
Gemuser


I forgot about that schedule change, good catch. Sounds like we mostly agree on QF and AA's future in the USA-AUS market, just differing on how much growth there will be in the future.

I think that QF will keep its A380s for the busiest routes, but the 789 and 779/a3510 will better serve their growth needs. We will see.
One mile of highway gets you one mile, one mile of runway gets you anywhere.
 
mpdpilot
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Re: Qantas will reveal Boeing 787 routes, seats on 27 October 2016

Sat Oct 08, 2016 3:42 am

Gemuser wrote:
The problem is "CAPITAL EXPENDITURE". Raising capital in Australia is always an issue especially for capital intensive industries like airlines and especially so for Qantas which must remain at least, 50% Australian owned under the "Sale of Qantas" Act.


Why is that different in Australia?

I am excited to see how Qantas uses the 789 but 8 is a pretty small order. As I mentioned above I would think that 12 or more would serve them better.
One mile of highway gets you one mile, one mile of runway gets you anywhere.

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