User avatar
Zkpilot
Posts: 4354
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2006 8:21 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Mon Nov 07, 2016 9:49 pm

ZK-NBT wrote:
NZ321 wrote:
Also, if you look at fleet numbers for wide body - notwithstanding transition periods between fleets - to what degree has there actually been growth? There was a time when there were 8 or 9 763, 8 744 and 8 772 (i.e. 24 wide body). That was after withdrawal of the 762 but before arrival of 77W. Today there is 9 789, 8 772, 7 77W and 2 763. How much capacity have we really added? Given the rumoured non-painting (can only mean departure) of 4 772 that would mean that we'd be flat in terms of capacity growth with the inbound 789. Thoughts?


Once the last 772's entered in late 06 early 07 the 763 was only 5 which it remained until this year. So it was 21 wide bodies over 3 types today there are 26 over 3 which looks like it will remain flat with 2 763's leaving and 2 789's arriving in 2017, higher utilisation in peak times though.

Yes and also more Tasman services/PI are being operated by A320 freeing up the WB fleet for long haul flights.

The 77E question comes down to fuel... pure and simple... if fuel stays relatively cheap then they will stay on, if it goes up by a certain amount then they will go as the 789 is more fuel efficient. What that fuel price is I'm not sure - I would think if oil goes up $20 per barrel then that might be around the level where they start getting phased out. It might be gradual like the 763 where they reduced to 5 frames to start with.
64 types. 42 countries. 24 airlines.
 
ZKOXA
Posts: 84
Joined: Sat Oct 29, 2016 9:47 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Tue Nov 08, 2016 8:12 pm

Does anyone know why there is a Dutch Government Fokker F70 in the country at the moment?

ZKOXA
 
User avatar
SelandiaBaru
Posts: 95
Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2013 2:39 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Tue Nov 08, 2016 8:27 pm

ZKOXA wrote:
Does anyone know why there is a Dutch Government Fokker F70 in the country at the moment?

ZKOXA


Dutch Royal visit
 
User avatar
mariner
Posts: 19473
Joined: Fri Nov 23, 2001 7:29 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Tue Nov 08, 2016 8:27 pm

ZKOXA wrote:
Does anyone know why there is a Dutch Government Fokker F70 in the country at the moment?

ZKOXA


Something to do with the visit to NZ of the Dutch King and Queen?

mariner
aeternum nauta
 
Motorhussy
Posts: 3620
Joined: Thu Mar 30, 2000 7:49 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Tue Nov 08, 2016 10:03 pm

mariner wrote:
ZKOXA wrote:
Does anyone know why there is a Dutch Government Fokker F70 in the country at the moment?

ZKOXA


Something to do with the visit to NZ of the Dutch King and Queen?

mariner


It's quite a pretty orange Fokker. It's flown past my living room window a few times lately. Funny how the design looks quite antiquated now.

Image

Photo: SilverFoxNL
come visit the south pacific
 
User avatar
LamboAston
Posts: 628
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2015 6:46 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:08 am

When are the CHC-PER direct flights resuming, and with what aircraft?
AS350, B733/4/7/8, B744/8, B762/3, B77E/L/W, B789, A319, A320, A321, A332, A346, A380, AT73/5/6, Q300, Q400, CR2/7, E190, S340, B1900C/D, E110 (E for epic)
NZ, EK, QF, SQ, UA, US, CO, FZ, FR, U2, BA, VA, VS, MH, EI, EY, LH, EN, NM, TG, GZ
 
PA515
Posts: 1556
Joined: Tue Nov 06, 2007 6:17 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:38 am

LamboAston wrote:
When are the CHC-PER direct flights resuming, and with what aircraft?


CHC-PER is 10 Dec 2016 to 29 Apr 2017 with the 789.

PA515
 
ZK-NBT
Posts: 7046
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2000 5:42 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:38 am

LamboAston wrote:
When are the CHC-PER direct flights resuming, and with what aircraft?


December? I think. 789 2 weekly.

Zkpilot wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
NZ321 wrote:
Also, if you look at fleet numbers for wide body - notwithstanding transition periods between fleets - to what degree has there actually been growth? There was a time when there were 8 or 9 763, 8 744 and 8 772 (i.e. 24 wide body). That was after withdrawal of the 762 but before arrival of 77W. Today there is 9 789, 8 772, 7 77W and 2 763. How much capacity have we really added? Given the rumoured non-painting (can only mean departure) of 4 772 that would mean that we'd be flat in terms of capacity growth with the inbound 789. Thoughts?


Once the last 772's entered in late 06 early 07 the 763 was only 5 which it remained until this year. So it was 21 wide bodies over 3 types today there are 26 over 3 which looks like it will remain flat with 2 763's leaving and 2 789's arriving in 2017, higher utilisation in peak times though.

Yes and also more Tasman services/PI are being operated by A320 freeing up the WB fleet for long haul flights.

The 77E question comes down to fuel... pure and simple... if fuel stays relatively cheap then they will stay on, if it goes up by a certain amount then they will go as the 789 is more fuel efficient. What that fuel price is I'm not sure - I would think if oil goes up $20 per barrel then that might be around the level where they start getting phased out. It might be gradual like the 763 where they reduced to 5 frames to start with.


Depends on the leasing agreements and resale value as well. Wide body usage on short haul has increased more than ever, 7-8 777/787 shorthauls somedays.
 
User avatar
LamboAston
Posts: 628
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2015 6:46 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Fri Nov 11, 2016 2:24 am

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7agm7 ... WhvNm5rVWs
EK A380 in CHC looking oversized. Sorry about low quality, and I couldn't get image to show up, so had to post link.
AS350, B733/4/7/8, B744/8, B762/3, B77E/L/W, B789, A319, A320, A321, A332, A346, A380, AT73/5/6, Q300, Q400, CR2/7, E190, S340, B1900C/D, E110 (E for epic)
NZ, EK, QF, SQ, UA, US, CO, FZ, FR, U2, BA, VA, VS, MH, EI, EY, LH, EN, NM, TG, GZ
 
User avatar
LamboAston
Posts: 628
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2015 6:46 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Fri Nov 11, 2016 2:27 am

PA515 wrote:
LamboAston wrote:
When are the CHC-PER direct flights resuming, and with what aircraft?


CHC-PER is 10 Dec 2016 to 29 Apr 2017 with the 789.

PA515


Is there going to be domestic ferry flights, or are the aircraft going to do something like AKL-PER-CHC-PER-AKL?
AS350, B733/4/7/8, B744/8, B762/3, B77E/L/W, B789, A319, A320, A321, A332, A346, A380, AT73/5/6, Q300, Q400, CR2/7, E190, S340, B1900C/D, E110 (E for epic)
NZ, EK, QF, SQ, UA, US, CO, FZ, FR, U2, BA, VA, VS, MH, EI, EY, LH, EN, NM, TG, GZ
 
User avatar
LamboAston
Posts: 628
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2015 6:46 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Fri Nov 11, 2016 2:59 am

Looks like ZK-MVJ has been temporarily taken out of service, cancelling NZ5363, and 5364
AS350, B733/4/7/8, B744/8, B762/3, B77E/L/W, B789, A319, A320, A321, A332, A346, A380, AT73/5/6, Q300, Q400, CR2/7, E190, S340, B1900C/D, E110 (E for epic)
NZ, EK, QF, SQ, UA, US, CO, FZ, FR, U2, BA, VA, VS, MH, EI, EY, LH, EN, NM, TG, GZ
 
PA515
Posts: 1556
Joined: Tue Nov 06, 2007 6:17 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Fri Nov 11, 2016 4:18 am

LamboAston wrote:
Is there going to be domestic ferry flights, or are the aircraft going to do something like AKL-PER-CHC-PER-AKL?


Seasonal PER the same as 2015/2016 with slight time changes.
AKL-PER 1855/2120 Mo Th Fr, PER-CHC 2325/1025 Mo Fr, CHC-PER 1440/1655 Tu Sa, PER-AKL 0700/1810 We Fr Su.

PA515
 
ZKOXA
Posts: 84
Joined: Sat Oct 29, 2016 9:47 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Fri Nov 11, 2016 4:37 am

LamboAston wrote:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7agm7lfL-HdbFA4cWhvNm5rVWs
EK A380 in CHC looking oversized. Sorry about low quality, and I couldn't get image to show up, so had to post link.


Just from looking at the photo, the A380 sure does look oversized. Now, please correct me if I'm wrong and for my lack of knowledge, but is the A380 only using 1 jet bridge at Christchurch? Also if this is so, are there any other airports which only use 1 jet bridge?

ZKOXA
 
User avatar
77west
Posts: 946
Joined: Sat Jun 13, 2009 11:52 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Fri Nov 11, 2016 5:50 am

ZKOXA wrote:
LamboAston wrote:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7agm7lfL-HdbFA4cWhvNm5rVWs
EK A380 in CHC looking oversized. Sorry about low quality, and I couldn't get image to show up, so had to post link.


Just from looking at the photo, the A380 sure does look oversized. Now, please correct me if I'm wrong and for my lack of knowledge, but is the A380 only using 1 jet bridge at Christchurch? Also if this is so, are there any other airports which only use 1 jet bridge?

ZKOXA


Per Google Earth for confirmation, pretty sure all the gates at CHC only have 1 bridge per gate. I suppose they could use a staircase like they do at domestic jet gates for the rear door, but not sure if the Intl. gates are set up for this.
77West - AW109S - BE90 - JS31 - B1900 - Q300 - ATR72 - DC9-30 - MD80 - B733 - A320 - B738 - A300-B4 - B773 - B77W
 
NPL8800
Posts: 122
Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2016 5:00 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Fri Nov 11, 2016 6:11 am

ZKOXA wrote:
LamboAston wrote:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7agm7lfL-HdbFA4cWhvNm5rVWs
EK A380 in CHC looking oversized. Sorry about low quality, and I couldn't get image to show up, so had to post link.


Just from looking at the photo, the A380 sure does look oversized. Now, please correct me if I'm wrong and for my lack of knowledge, but is the A380 only using 1 jet bridge at Christchurch? Also if this is so, are there any other airports which only use 1 jet bridge?

ZKOXA


Currently only a single air bridge operation, believe there will be a 2nd opening in December
 
User avatar
sunrisevalley
Posts: 5392
Joined: Tue Jul 06, 2004 3:26 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Fri Nov 11, 2016 2:46 pm

I note NZ31 EZE-AKL diverted to RAR on the 9th. Does anyone know the reason why?
 
User avatar
aerorobnz
Posts: 8318
Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2001 3:43 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Fri Nov 11, 2016 2:55 pm

sunrisevalley wrote:
I note NZ31 EZE-AKL diverted to RAR on the 9th. Does anyone know the reason why?

IIRC something like a aircraft defect.resulting in higher fuel burn that warranted refuelling.
Flown to 147 Airports in 62 Countries on 83 Operators and counting. Wanderlust is like Syphilis, once you have the itch it's too late for treatment.
 
User avatar
VirginFlyer
Posts: 5264
Joined: Sun Sep 10, 2000 12:27 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Fri Nov 11, 2016 3:29 pm

sunrisevalley wrote:
I note NZ31 EZE-AKL diverted to RAR on the 9th. Does anyone know the reason why?

According to the thread NZ begins operating the 787-9 on the AKL-EZE route:

Whoopeecock wrote:
ZKOXA wrote:
NZ31 from EZE-AKL diverted to RAR this morning, does anyone know the reason? RAR seems to be a long way norton but it was probably the nearest diversion airport.

ZKOXA


From a friend who was on the flight this morning, and woke up surprised to see they were about to land in RAR, "There was a spoiler flap on the wing that didn't sit down. It created drag & fuel loss, so they had to make a call 3hrs into the flight whether to turn back to BA or divert. Landed in AKL safe 5hrs late"


V/F
It is not for him to pride himself who loveth his own country, but rather for him who loveth the whole world. The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens. —Bahá'u'lláh
 
User avatar
sunrisevalley
Posts: 5392
Joined: Tue Jul 06, 2004 3:26 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Fri Nov 11, 2016 7:50 pm

[ZKOXA[/quote]

From a friend who was on the flight this morning, and woke up surprised to see they were about to land in RAR, "There was a spoiler flap on the wing that didn't sit down. It created drag & fuel loss, so they had to make a call 3hrs into the flight whether to turn back to BA or divert. Landed in AKL safe 5hrs late"[/quote]]

Interesting to have identified one of the diversion points on this route. Presumably fuel was added and the problem was left to be dealt with on arrival in AKL.
 
User avatar
LamboAston
Posts: 628
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2015 6:46 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Sat Nov 12, 2016 3:21 am

What is the Alliance F50 that just departed from Blenheim doing? Looks like it is tracking towards Queenstown. The aircraft (VH-FKO) has been flying around NZ for over a week.
AS350, B733/4/7/8, B744/8, B762/3, B77E/L/W, B789, A319, A320, A321, A332, A346, A380, AT73/5/6, Q300, Q400, CR2/7, E190, S340, B1900C/D, E110 (E for epic)
NZ, EK, QF, SQ, UA, US, CO, FZ, FR, U2, BA, VA, VS, MH, EI, EY, LH, EN, NM, TG, GZ
 
777ER
Head Moderator
Topic Author
Posts: 10061
Joined: Fri Dec 19, 2003 5:04 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Sat Nov 12, 2016 4:57 am

LamboAston wrote:
What is the Alliance F50 that just departed from Blenheim doing? Looks like it is tracking towards Queenstown. The aircraft (VH-FKO) has been flying around NZ for over a week.

Its used by Tauck Tours for the New Zealand runs. Very expensive way to add an F50 to the flown list
Head Forum Moderator
[email protected]
Flown: 1900D,S340,Q300,AT72-5/6,DC3,CR2/7,E145,E70/75/90,A319/20/21,A332/3,A359,A380,F100,B717,B733/4/8/9,B742/4,B752/3,B763,B772/3, B789
With: NZ,SJ,QF,JQ,EK,VA,AA,UA,DL,FL,AC,FJ,SQ,TG,PR
 
NZ6
Posts: 1249
Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2010 6:50 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Sat Nov 12, 2016 8:55 am

nascarnut wrote:
Where to now for AIAL.
With 2016 being a year of significant expansion as far as airlines and the AIAL trying to cope while spending little money. The expansion of the terminal beyond gates 13/14 to take 2 or 3 additional A380's has begun. Additional hardstands by taxiway Lima well underway.
With both Domestic and International gates reaching their limits several times throughout the day, how quickly can the AIAL create additional space for domestic operations. They appear to have International covered short term by replacing grass with concrete.
Will the continue to pursue additional carriers into AKL.
Air Nuigini PX was talked about for awhile from POM
Garuda GA ex DPS or JKT was also talked about but has gone quiet.
Cebu is now looking at International expansion and have mentioned NZ and Australia
How many more Chinese carriers will look at the market or will the incumbents, CZ, CA, MU look at additional cities as they have done in SYD/MEL.
Could the likes of ANA, EVA Air, Vietnam Airlines start looking again.
The US is pretty well set unless Delta or Air Canada make a move. Air Canada would only do it in cooperation with NZ. Delta would need a strong VA to assist them.
South America, your left with GIG/GRU with SCL and EZE taken care of.
Maybe now it's time for the airport to look at consolidating it's position and become a truly first class airport and provide the facilities the airlines and passengers are paying for. There can be nothing worse than flying 13 hours in economy, landing in AKL, spend 30 minutes waiting on a gate, only to end up at a remote gate and get bussed to an overcrowded arrivals hall. The experience must leave a sour taste for some passengers.
I hope for New Zealands sake, growth continues and the airport becomes more proactive than reactive. It would be a shame to see airlines look else where simply because the airport is not up to standard,


AKLI is in a brown stuff. I raised this a few months ago, maybe March/April this year. I know NZ are looking at it's options.

Re the 772's and 4 not being painted. Don't read anything into this. They will be in the fleet for the next several years at least and the source you have, may I repeat MAY only be talking about not being painted in their next maintenance slot. They have ALL just gone through a multi million dollar cabin upgrade. They are staying for a while longer.

Watch this space re 787 though.
 
ZK-NBT
Posts: 7046
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2000 5:42 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Sat Nov 12, 2016 9:37 am

What options would those be or at least what sort of options for NZ? Any hints? Regards times at AKL NZ could look to add another long haul bank to go with the

1900-2015 LAX, SFO, IAH, YVR, HNL, EZE, PER, plus SYD, MEL, BNE as well in there
2300-0115 LAX-LHR, HKG, PVG, NRT, SIN

I note next year SGN is showinga 1015 departure, DPS 1030, not sure on PER yet shows 1425 atm for winter 17. NRT is 0845 in winter, they love Japan will KIX stay yearround?

I doubt CHC will get to much love maybe 1-2 existing long hauls could be added there, LAX, PVG, HKG, NRT? But they don't want to canabilize AKL either.

They will look to add more AKL- HKG,PVG to connect to EZE, PVG is increasing but the slots are rubbish and HKG slots are hard to get.

ORD?

Now to spend some time with my wife
 
User avatar
sunrisevalley
Posts: 5392
Joined: Tue Jul 06, 2004 3:26 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Sat Nov 12, 2016 2:08 pm

[quote="ZK-NBT

ORD?]

Would be a logical destination for the 274 seat 789. Would allow the reduction of ~3t of payload capability in exchange for additional fuel.
 
NZ321
Posts: 1120
Joined: Fri Jul 31, 2015 8:00 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Sat Nov 12, 2016 8:45 pm

So when is the earliest the new AKL intl terminal gates will be open?
Plane mad!
 
NPL8800
Posts: 122
Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2016 5:00 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Sat Nov 12, 2016 9:37 pm

NZ321 wrote:
So when is the earliest the new AKL intl terminal gates will be open?


The 2016 Annual Report states that the 2 additional contact gates are expected to be opening in December 2017
 
User avatar
LamboAston
Posts: 628
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2015 6:46 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Sat Nov 12, 2016 10:19 pm

Hong Kong Airlines A330 has just departed from Auckland for the second time. No-one posted about the inaugural surprisingly
AS350, B733/4/7/8, B744/8, B762/3, B77E/L/W, B789, A319, A320, A321, A332, A346, A380, AT73/5/6, Q300, Q400, CR2/7, E190, S340, B1900C/D, E110 (E for epic)
NZ, EK, QF, SQ, UA, US, CO, FZ, FR, U2, BA, VA, VS, MH, EI, EY, LH, EN, NM, TG, GZ
 
DavidByrne
Posts: 1486
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2007 4:42 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Sun Nov 13, 2016 7:06 am

ZK-NBT wrote:
Regards times at AKL NZ could look to add another long haul bank to go with the

1900-2015 LAX, SFO, IAH, YVR, HNL, EZE, PER, plus SYD, MEL, BNE as well in there
2300-0115 LAX-LHR, HKG, PVG, NRT, SIN
. . .

They will look to add more AKL- HKG,PVG to connect to EZE, PVG is increasing but the slots are rubbish and HKG slots are hard to get.


If NZ is serious about being a carrier from Asia to South America, then it needs to look very carefully at how arrivals from Asia mesh with departures for South America. Right now, it doesn't appear that this has been given a lot of priority, but if NZ is serious about this, and can perhaps envisage a time in the next few years when they might be serving EZE daily and GRU as well, then they do have to look very carefully at how these flights connect. The present pattern, of morning arrivals from Asia and evening departures for South America, is not a serious attempt to win this market.

A bank that's focused to South America also needs to have good connections from Australia - at least from SYD, BNE and MEL, which means in practical terms that it can't be earlier than about 1630-ish if that flight is a return from an outbound early morning flight from AKL. But it's the Asian connecting flights that need to be very carefully considered. In the ideal world, they'd leave their Asian departure point before midnight, and arrive in AKL as close to the departure for South America as practical, allowing perhaps a couple of hours for the connection.

Looking at NZ's four year-round Asian ports, this might mean the following for winter departures. All of these could be a return flight from a morning departure from AKL (providing connectivity in the other direction. However, this would come at a cost in terms of fleet utilisation, which is why a second daily flight on each of these sectors makes a lot of sense - timings of the second flight can be used to maximise utilisation, with fewer concerns about connectivity at the AKL end.
PVG-AKL 2359/1535
NRT-AKL 2359/1340
HKG-AKL 2359/1450
SIN-AKL 2359/1340

These could all feed into a bank departing AKL at 1700-ish. Note that Houston already has a 1600 departure in the coming winter, which seriously limits Australian connecting traffic, especially from BNE. But the big issue will obviously be slots at the Asian end - all four of the airports concerned (with the exception of SIN?) are seriously slot-constrained, and the airline may have to patiently acquire appropriate slots over a period in order to make this work. They should be starting this now.

Ironically, the coming summer when PVG moves to 10x weekly the "new" flight does arrive at 1910 on WeFrSu, perfect for connections to EZE. However, the "cost" is an 0245 departure from PVG, hardly conducive to attracting premium traffic. I hope we can see moves to acquire better slots for PVG and the other Asian ports over the next few years, in conjunction with market growth to support a second daily flight, with South America in mind.
This is not my beautiful house . . . This is not my beautiful wife
 
zkeoj
Posts: 1177
Joined: Sun Feb 27, 2005 3:00 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Sun Nov 13, 2016 11:07 pm

Hi Everybody

I often got help with registrations from you guys, but here is a tricky one: I have seen this one in the Viaduct in Auckland on a super yacht (Senses from George Town). I googled the yacht and photos, and all I got was pictures of N407SF. However, the helicopter in the pic is not the same - its rego starts with N1*** (not N4***). Does anybody know the registration for this one?

http://www.airport-data.com/aircraft/ph ... 45682.html (Just fyi, I uploaded under N407SF because you must have a rego to upload. Will change it as soon as I have the real one)

Many thanks
micha
 
User avatar
LamboAston
Posts: 628
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2015 6:46 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Sun Nov 13, 2016 11:57 pm

https://c2.staticflickr.com/4/3867/1465 ... 820c_b.jpg
Does this look about right? It was further down the search
AS350, B733/4/7/8, B744/8, B762/3, B77E/L/W, B789, A319, A320, A321, A332, A346, A380, AT73/5/6, Q300, Q400, CR2/7, E190, S340, B1900C/D, E110 (E for epic)
NZ, EK, QF, SQ, UA, US, CO, FZ, FR, U2, BA, VA, VS, MH, EI, EY, LH, EN, NM, TG, GZ
 
zkeoj
Posts: 1177
Joined: Sun Feb 27, 2005 3:00 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Mon Nov 14, 2016 12:33 am

LamboAston wrote:
https://c2.staticflickr.com/4/3867/14652535293_895b91820c_b.jpg
Does this look about right? It was further down the search


That's amazing - thanks so much! Did you use google, or another search engine? I used google and this didn't come up, even though I tried various search terms. Anyway, thanks so much for your help!!!

Cheers
micha
 
User avatar
mariner
Posts: 19473
Joined: Fri Nov 23, 2001 7:29 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Mon Nov 14, 2016 7:04 am

DavidByrne wrote:
If NZ is serious about being a carrier from Asia to South America, then it needs to look very carefully at how arrivals from Asia mesh with departures for South America. Right now, it doesn't appear that this has been given a lot of priority, but if NZ is serious about this, and can perhaps envisage a time in the next few years when they might be serving EZE daily and GRU as well, then they do have to look very carefully at how these flights connect. The present pattern, of morning arrivals from Asia and evening departures for South America, is not a serious attempt to win this market..


I agree with you but I assume its a work in progress, which progress may take some time. Meanwhile, I'll take what I can get.

When I went to Vietnam a few weeks ago, we left AKL at 1.45 pm, arriving too late in SGN to get a viable connection to Hanoi - which is where I wanted to go. Next season, next year, they've changed the flight times. AKL-SGN leaves three hours earlier (10.15 am) allowing for a viable to connection to Hanoi, which now appears in the drop-down menu.

I fell a little bit in love with Hanoi, and this change would encourage me to go back next year.

mariner
aeternum nauta
 
zkncj
Posts: 3305
Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2005 4:57 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Mon Nov 14, 2016 7:55 am

With the current earthquake issues in the South Island, restricting road/ferry traffic between AKL and CHC. Are there additional freight flights on?
 
ZK-NBT
Posts: 7046
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2000 5:42 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Mon Nov 14, 2016 8:40 pm

Re NZ to South America I think they are in it for the long haul, they have increased EZE seasonally and hope to make it daily in a few years. I think you will see an increase in Asian flying which is happening but slots are hard to get.

Re IAH I wonder weather they will have it at 1600 ex AKL again, it was 1830 last summer now 1920. EZE doesn't arrive until 1645 in winter. If they add ORD though which will be a long flight they may go for an earlier departure?
 
User avatar
LamboAston
Posts: 628
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2015 6:46 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Mon Nov 14, 2016 9:01 pm

Two SQ 772s for CHC today
AS350, B733/4/7/8, B744/8, B762/3, B77E/L/W, B789, A319, A320, A321, A332, A346, A380, AT73/5/6, Q300, Q400, CR2/7, E190, S340, B1900C/D, E110 (E for epic)
NZ, EK, QF, SQ, UA, US, CO, FZ, FR, U2, BA, VA, VS, MH, EI, EY, LH, EN, NM, TG, GZ
 
ZK-NBT
Posts: 7046
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2000 5:42 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Mon Nov 14, 2016 9:38 pm

LamboAston wrote:
Two SQ 772s for CHC today


Yep they will run 9-10 weekly for the next 2 or so months.

And a CX 343 to AKL again, 359 must be broken or delayed somewhere.
 
DavidByrne
Posts: 1486
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2007 4:42 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Tue Nov 15, 2016 12:24 am

ZK-NBT wrote:
Re NZ to South America I think they are in it for the long haul, they have increased EZE seasonally and hope to make it daily in a few years. I think you will see an increase in Asian flying which is happening but slots are hard to get.

Re IAH I wonder weather they will have it at 1600 ex AKL again, it was 1830 last summer now 1920. EZE doesn't arrive until 1645 in winter. If they add ORD though which will be a long flight they may go for an earlier departure?

ORD would be manageable with a 1700-ish departure. My suggestion would be to delay the IAH flight until the same bank, and then with EZE as well (which would give a 1400-ish arrival into EZE) in that same bank there would be a bit of mass to be supported by flights from the east coast of Australia. Flights from ADL, CNS and PER will still need to feed into a 1930-2030 bank, along with other services from SYD, MEL, BNE. Potential HBA flights would probably need to feed into the later bank, too, while potential CBR flights could probably make the 1700-ish bank. So all in all you might have, with a bit of jiggling of timetables

1700 bank: In from Asia, SYD, MEL, BNE, OOL, MCY, (CBR?)
Out to EZE, IAH, PPT, (ORD?)

1900 bank: In from SYD, MEL, BNE, PER, ADL, CNS
Out to SFO, LAX, YVR, HNL, RAR

Interesting also to note that NZ does not appear to place huge priority on competing for traffic from Australia to APW and TBU. Outbound, especially, many of the "connections" offered take nearly 24 hours, three sectors and an overnight stop. Given the number of Pacific Islanders resident in Australia, you'd have thought they'd try a little harder there too?
This is not my beautiful house . . . This is not my beautiful wife
 
ZK-NBT
Posts: 7046
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2000 5:42 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Tue Nov 15, 2016 1:00 am

Interesting thoughts David, i agree. Surely HBA and CBR will come?

Interesting re the pacific TBU does have some 1700 ex AKL, APW some 1550 which connects from SYD, MEL and somedays BNE. 2 A320s would be just slightly more seats than 1 789, 772 to places like RAR but frequency is not as important on these routes.
 
User avatar
sunrisevalley
Posts: 5392
Joined: Tue Jul 06, 2004 3:26 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Tue Nov 15, 2016 1:06 am

[quote="DavidByrne Out to EZE, IAH, PPT, (ORD?)

I estimate AKL-ORD eastbound at 15hr 10min and westbound at 16hrs. I have seen a 77W flight plan of 15hr 55min on what was an average day. Basically interpolating LAX times for the additional distance. I would estimate available turn round time at ORD to be less than 4hrs.
 
User avatar
Zkpilot
Posts: 4354
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2006 8:21 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Tue Nov 15, 2016 3:54 am

DavidByrne wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
Regards times at AKL NZ could look to add another long haul bank to go with the

1900-2015 LAX, SFO, IAH, YVR, HNL, EZE, PER, plus SYD, MEL, BNE as well in there
2300-0115 LAX-LHR, HKG, PVG, NRT, SIN
. . .

They will look to add more AKL- HKG,PVG to connect to EZE, PVG is increasing but the slots are rubbish and HKG slots are hard to get.


If NZ is serious about being a carrier from Asia to South America, then it needs to look very carefully at how arrivals from Asia mesh with departures for South America. Right now, it doesn't appear that this has been given a lot of priority, but if NZ is serious about this, and can perhaps envisage a time in the next few years when they might be serving EZE daily and GRU as well, then they do have to look very carefully at how these flights connect. The present pattern, of morning arrivals from Asia and evening departures for South America, is not a serious attempt to win this market.

A bank that's focused to South America also needs to have good connections from Australia - at least from SYD, BNE and MEL, which means in practical terms that it can't be earlier than about 1630-ish if that flight is a return from an outbound early morning flight from AKL. But it's the Asian connecting flights that need to be very carefully considered. In the ideal world, they'd leave their Asian departure point before midnight, and arrive in AKL as close to the departure for South America as practical, allowing perhaps a couple of hours for the connection.

Looking at NZ's four year-round Asian ports, this might mean the following for winter departures. All of these could be a return flight from a morning departure from AKL (providing connectivity in the other direction. However, this would come at a cost in terms of fleet utilisation, which is why a second daily flight on each of these sectors makes a lot of sense - timings of the second flight can be used to maximise utilisation, with fewer concerns about connectivity at the AKL end.
PVG-AKL 2359/1535
NRT-AKL 2359/1340
HKG-AKL 2359/1450
SIN-AKL 2359/1340

These could all feed into a bank departing AKL at 1700-ish. Note that Houston already has a 1600 departure in the coming winter, which seriously limits Australian connecting traffic, especially from BNE. But the big issue will obviously be slots at the Asian end - all four of the airports concerned (with the exception of SIN?) are seriously slot-constrained, and the airline may have to patiently acquire appropriate slots over a period in order to make this work. They should be starting this now.

Ironically, the coming summer when PVG moves to 10x weekly the "new" flight does arrive at 1910 on WeFrSu, perfect for connections to EZE. However, the "cost" is an 0245 departure from PVG, hardly conducive to attracting premium traffic. I hope we can see moves to acquire better slots for PVG and the other Asian ports over the next few years, in conjunction with market growth to support a second daily flight, with South America in mind.


Agreed.
I do wonder about the PER flight - that really should connect in time for the first bank so that it can connect with all ports since PER is the one city (ok potentially ADL/HBA/CBR/MCY/NTL) that NZ really does have an advantage with the one stop to a variety of destinations.

As you have mentioned for Asia NZ is building up to double daily for many destinations. This is where the 789 is great as it offers the great economics without being too big to fill!

I am actually starting to think that NZ might skip the 779 and just have a 787 fleet (789+7810). My previous thinking was that they would want the big bird for LHR however I think perhaps they could operate a 2nd UK/EU service from either LAX or SFO (maybe ORD) so they wouldn't be losing any capacity (and actually grow). This could have some decent cost savings by just having one aircraft type.
LAX capacity would itself decrease however with an increase of flights to other destinations that would make more space on those flights for O&D traffic.

Would look something like:
AKL-LAX-LHR x7
AKL-LAX-MAN/FRA** x7
AKL-SFO-LHR** x7
AKL-IAH x7
**AKL-ORD x7
**AKL-EWR x7
AKL-YVR x7
AKL-HNL x7
AKL-RAR-LAX x2

AKL-EZE x7
AKL-NRT x11
AKL-KIX x3
AKL-PVG x14
AKL-HKG x14
AKL-SIN x7
AKL-MNL x3
AKL-SGN x3
AKL-DPS x3
**AKL-ICN x5
**AKL-GRU x7
**AKL-SCL x7

** = new routes.

There might even be the possibility of PDX/SEA or DEN

Image
64 types. 42 countries. 24 airlines.
 
DavidByrne
Posts: 1486
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2007 4:42 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Tue Nov 15, 2016 4:09 am

Zkpilot wrote:
I do wonder about the PER flight - that really should connect in time for the first bank so that it can connect with all ports since PER is the one city (ok potentially ADL/HBA/CBR/MCY/NTL) that NZ really does have an advantage with the one stop to a variety of destinations.

In an ideal world, you're of course correct, but PER requires an 0600/0700 departure just to connect with the current evening bank. To meet a 1700-ish bank the departure time would need to be 0400/0500. Just don't think that's going to attract meaningful custom.

Another option for PER, at least in summer, might be to combine a seasonal PER-CHC service with a seasonal CHC-LAX service. Same plane, no "transfer" as such required.

You mention NTL as well - I see no reason why in the medium term this shouldn't be a serious consideration, given that SJ did it 3x weekly for a period when traffic was significantly lower than it is today. Suggestions that it might "cannibalise" SYD traffic are not credible if the market is growing the way that it is. If NZ is serious about getting the most from its Australian feed then it needs to be working hard on those ports where it has, as you say, a natural advantage.
This is not my beautiful house . . . This is not my beautiful wife
 
DavidByrne
Posts: 1486
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2007 4:42 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Tue Nov 15, 2016 4:13 am

And why not DRW-AKL as well in the medium term - roughly the same distance as PER, so able to feed into the 1900 bank?
This is not my beautiful house . . . This is not my beautiful wife
 
User avatar
LamboAston
Posts: 628
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2015 6:46 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Tue Nov 15, 2016 5:06 am

DavidByrne wrote:
Zkpilot wrote:
I do wonder about the PER flight - that really should connect in time for the first bank so that it can connect with all ports since PER is the one city (ok potentially ADL/HBA/CBR/MCY/NTL) that NZ really does have an advantage with the one stop to a variety of destinations.

In an ideal world, you're of course correct, but PER requires an 0600/0700 departure just to connect with the current evening bank. To meet a 1700-ish bank the departure time would need to be 0400/0500. Just don't think that's going to attract meaningful custom.

Another option for PER, at least in summer, might be to combine a seasonal PER-CHC service with a seasonal CHC-LAX service. Same plane, no "transfer" as such required.

You mention NTL as well - I see no reason why in the medium term this shouldn't be a serious consideration, given that SJ did it 3x weekly for a period when traffic was significantly lower than it is today. Suggestions that it might "cannibalise" SYD traffic are not credible if the market is growing the way that it is. If NZ is serious about getting the most from its Australian feed then it needs to be working hard on those ports where it has, as you say, a natural advantage.


Now that SQ are more than daily into CHC, and EK are flying the A380 in, and CZ are flying the 788 in, the only major gap is the Americas, which could be filled by an NZ 789 doing that and the PER flights, which they could rotate back to AKL through the LAX-RAR-AKL route.
AS350, B733/4/7/8, B744/8, B762/3, B77E/L/W, B789, A319, A320, A321, A332, A346, A380, AT73/5/6, Q300, Q400, CR2/7, E190, S340, B1900C/D, E110 (E for epic)
NZ, EK, QF, SQ, UA, US, CO, FZ, FR, U2, BA, VA, VS, MH, EI, EY, LH, EN, NM, TG, GZ
 
Qantas16
Posts: 711
Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2016 3:51 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Tue Nov 15, 2016 7:56 am

DavidByrne wrote:
And why not DRW-AKL as well in the medium term - roughly the same distance as PER, so able to feed into the 1900 bank?


DRW has a population of ~145,000, PER is 2 million. I doubt DRW is even on the horizon at the moment.
 
User avatar
zkojq
Posts: 3953
Joined: Fri Sep 02, 2011 12:42 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Tue Nov 15, 2016 8:47 am

ZK-NBT wrote:
What options would those be or at least what sort of options for NZ?

DavidByrne wrote:
Another option for PER, at least in summer, might be to combine a seasonal PER-CHC service with a seasonal CHC-LAX service. Same plane, no "transfer" as such required.

I think you could be onto something here and I made a post to this effect sometime earlier in the year. If some of the Australia-CHC flights were retimed, and a CHC-LAX-CHC service was added, some traffic could bypass AKL.

Consider this:
What if NZ6 was switched to a 789 (in a premium heavy configuration) and a CHC-LAX flight was added (lets call this NZ12 and assume that it gets operated by a 789 in the current configuration)?

Inbound to CHC flights would have be retimed to something like this:
NZ888 (SYD) 1700
NZ876 (OOL) 1700
VA100 (MEL) 1730
NZ804 (BNE) 1730

NZ12 could have a 1900/1930 departure, which would make for a 1.5-2 hour connection time. This would achieve:
- Increased LAX capacity.
- Freeing up space on NZ104/124/136 services for pax connecting to IAH/YVR/EZE.
- Freeing up a 77W for other uses (HKG anyone?).
- Relieving some pressure on the zoo that is AKL.

Thoughts?

DavidByrne wrote:
You mention NTL as well - I see no reason why in the medium term this shouldn't be a serious consideration, given that SJ did it 3x weekly for a period when traffic was significantly lower than it is today. Suggestions that it might "cannibalise" SYD traffic are not credible if the market is growing the way that it is.

I agree. Great way to connect NSW orienting traffic for whom OOL is too far North and SYD is too far South.
First to fly the 787-9
 
Sylus
Posts: 104
Joined: Fri Jan 30, 2015 10:14 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Tue Nov 15, 2016 11:56 am

I have always thought CHC-LAX could be a real possibility given they operated it in 2005~ with a 744 3 x weekly. A 787 is lower capacity and the market has grown significantly. Perhaps a year round service could be even possible, rather than a seasonal. A 788 seems like a good sized aircraft for the route, maybe a codeshare with a UA service?. If NZ doesn't take a stab at this route surely AA would have it on their radar?
 
User avatar
sunrisevalley
Posts: 5392
Joined: Tue Jul 06, 2004 3:26 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Tue Nov 15, 2016 7:55 pm

David,
I think your departure banks to North America are earlier than necessary. All aircraft spend some hours on the ground at IAH,LAX,SFO and YVR. I think there is room to reduce these times. For passengers who need connections to the east ,these should be transited through IAH. From what I can see the connection opportunities in IAH for the 1700 to 1830 outbound wave are many. Way better than LAX/SFO.
I would suggest to serve PER it be done as you suggest by a through plane via CHC to LAX. and on an as required weekly frequency. The schedule could look something like PER-CHC 1125 /2225 and on the return CHC-PER 0640/0825 The CHC-LAX would be something like 2359/1529 eastbound and 1900/0500 westbound. Good connections for PER at AKL are only available with a probably unacceptable lengthy layover of an aircraft at PER
 
DavidByrne
Posts: 1486
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2007 4:42 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Tue Nov 15, 2016 10:01 pm

sunrisevalley wrote:
I think your departure banks to North America are earlier than necessary. All aircraft spend some hours on the ground at IAH,LAX,SFO and YVR. I think there is room to reduce these times.
. . .

Good connections for PER at AKL are only available with a probably unacceptable lengthy layover of an aircraft at PER

I agree that the 1900-ish bank out of AKL could be moved a little later, and that this would make for more secure connections from some of the more distant Australian ports, PER included (assuming the current timetable pattern).

However, if you make a 1700-ish bank later, the longer the layover will be for Asian travellers to South America, which to some extent negates the purpose of the bank. Not totally, but it's certainly less attractive. It might in some cases also require a later connection being required for points further east of IAH, making for a later evening arrival - less attractive for some, I'm sure. But yes, there is a bit of flexibility in this bank, too.

I believe that a lot of the risk for both PER-CHC and CHC-LAX is removed by joining the two together and making it seasonal, with the season lengthening and frequency improving over the course of a few years to the point where it might be (say) year round with 3x weekly in winter and 5x weekly in summer, and using a timetable such as that suggested. PER could be very nicely served by combining this with PER-AKL services which could connect via a 1900 bank to North America, provide in combination a daily PER-North America service year-round, with higher frequencies in the summer, and with quite an efficient use of aircraft.
This is not my beautiful house . . . This is not my beautiful wife
 
DobboDobbo
Posts: 927
Joined: Thu Mar 03, 2016 1:02 am

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Tue Nov 15, 2016 10:56 pm

I understand UK originating traffic to NZ is in the process of exploding in 2017.

UK-CHC traffic is up by 10% on EK, there is a greater breakdown for UK-AKL traffic (per EK booking figures):

Gatwick + 113%
Heathrow + 109%
Manchester + 65%

Much of this has been put down to EK's non stop service to AKL from DXB. But there is early a resirgence at the UK and of the UK-NZ connection.

ANZ have previously been against other routes to the UK or Europe, preferring to use connections with *A partners through SFO, IAH, LAX, SIN.

I wonder whether this strategy would be reviewed (I sound like a broken record!) if the trends continue - but for now the codeshare arrangements and options via the Middle East seem to be an attractive proposition.
 
Bostrom
Posts: 843
Joined: Tue Feb 02, 2016 7:11 pm

Re: New Zealand Aviation Thread Part 183

Tue Nov 15, 2016 11:28 pm

Zkpilot wrote:
I am actually starting to think that NZ might skip the 779 and just have a 787 fleet (789+7810). My previous thinking was that they would want the big bird for LHR however I think perhaps they could operate a 2nd UK/EU service from either LAX or SFO (maybe ORD) so they wouldn't be losing any capacity (and actually grow). This could have some decent cost savings by just having one aircraft type.
LAX capacity would itself decrease however with an increase of flights to other destinations that would make more space on those flights for O&D traffic.


Why not a resumed AKL-HKG-LHR route instead? 450 km shorter than via LAX and avoids the trouble with a US stop.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos