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n471wn
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SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Mon Nov 21, 2016 5:48 pm

Last week WN retired the last 737-300 built in the 1980's when N658SW was flown to Tucson. The oldest flying 300 now in the fleet was built in 1991. 89 more 300's this year will be retired and sadly this will include the late deliveries in the 1997 time frame which are not that much older than the early 700's
 
Sooner787
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Mon Nov 21, 2016 6:05 pm

Do you mean 80 more -300's will be retired in the next 12 months?

Or by the end of 2016????
 
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flyingclrs727
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Mon Nov 21, 2016 6:10 pm

So will any of the newer 300's be converted into freighters?
 
WN732
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Mon Nov 21, 2016 6:29 pm

31 years is a really good service life though. They definitely got all the use out of it that they could. Amazing if you look at the history of the airframe.

http://www.airfleets.net/ficheapp/plane-b737-23332.htm
 
MSPNWA
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Mon Nov 21, 2016 6:33 pm

The days of no winglets (or equivalent device) at WN is over.

I always wanted to fly on one of the second-hand -300s, but I always got a WN original.
 
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hOMSaR
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Mon Nov 21, 2016 6:34 pm

WN732 wrote:
31 years is a really good service life though. They definitely got all the use out of it that they could. Amazing if you look at the history of the airframe.

http://www.airfleets.net/ficheapp/plane-b737-23332.htm


Anyone know why this plane had four different registrations while with Air Europa?
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wnflyguy
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Mon Nov 21, 2016 7:01 pm

Sooner787 wrote:
Do you mean 80 more -300's will be retired in the next 12 months?

Or by the end of 2016????

80 left to go to retirement from now until September 2017.

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JeremyB
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Mon Nov 21, 2016 8:29 pm

hOMSaR wrote:
WN732 wrote:
31 years is a really good service life though. They definitely got all the use out of it that they could. Amazing if you look at the history of the airframe.

http://www.airfleets.net/ficheapp/plane-b737-23332.htm


Anyone know why this plane had four different registrations while with Air Europa?


It was leased from BouAS, during almost 6 years it was re-registered four times. It was probably leased from BouAS as extra capacity, I'm not exactly sure though as it's even predating me.
 
n471wn
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Mon Nov 21, 2016 8:38 pm

Sorry as I did mean by the end of 2017
 
Sooner787
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Mon Nov 21, 2016 8:46 pm

n471wn wrote:
Sorry as I did mean by the end of 2017



No problem. Still, 80 jets retired in a 12 month time frame

is pretty aggressive schedule
 
claymii
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Mon Nov 21, 2016 9:21 pm

Does anyone know how much more fuel efficient the 737-7MAX or the 737-700 in comparison to the 737-300 is?
 
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ATA L1011
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Mon Nov 21, 2016 10:02 pm

claymii wrote:
Does anyone know how much more fuel efficient the 737-7MAX or the 737-700 in comparison to the 737-300 is?
According to Wikepedia on average the CFM56-3 engine on the classic gave a 25% increase in fuel efficiency over the older -200s P&W engines along with much much lower noise levels. The improved CFM56-7 turbofan engine on the 737 Next Generation on average is 7% more fuel-efficient than the previous CFM56-3 in the 737 classics. The CFM International LEAP-1B engines on the Max are expected to be 10-12% on average more efficient than the CFM56-7B engines on the 737 Next Generation family.
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Misster
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 1:23 am

Sorry this thread is incorrect. 697 sw is still active and flying . Built in 1988 according to airlfleets.
 
WN732
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 1:26 am

Misster wrote:
Sorry this thread is incorrect. 697 sw is still active and flying . Built in 1988 according to airlfleets.



You're right. Currently as WN1780 DAL-MCI.
 
BiggerJetsPlz
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 2:57 am

N658SW had 98,287 flight hours and 61,299 cycles in October. Pretty amazing...
 
southsidesilver
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 3:41 am

I only recently flew on N658SW from SFO-LAX. Had a nice ride on it, I was shocked with how much leg room I had on the plane, have to love those comfy seats and extra leg room. Those days will all be gone soon.

The planes interior was very aged, but it was great to be on it.
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RacheyFlies
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 3:45 am

Is the 737-300 is the one that previously involved in the TACA Air crash, I knew that plane was repaired and was taken to Southwest in 1990's.

But when will all their 733 retires?
The best plane I've flown is an A380. They were the biggest and the best than other plane I've been on. :lol:
 
n471wn
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 3:52 am

Misster wrote:
Sorry this thread is incorrect. 697 sw is still active and flying . Built in 1988 according to airlfleets.


You are right and I do not know how I missed it but I did SO I can say that this is the last 80's built 300 flying so I am sure it is close to the end
 
usflyguy
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 4:03 am

697 is gone the first week of December.
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SXDFC
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 5:16 am

A/C 697 was the -300 involved in the TACA incident, as usflyguy stated its likely to be retired in December.

With regards to the future of the newer -300s, I'd imagine they will likely be good candidates for a freighter conversion.
 
n471wn
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 5:20 am

RacheyFlies wrote:
Is the 737-300 is the one that previously involved in the TACA Air crash, I knew that plane was repaired and was taken to Southwest in 1990's.

But when will all their 733 retires?

No the TACA a/c was retired some time ago and unless the plans change all the 300's will be gone by Oct 2017
 
indcwby
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 5:24 am

MSPNWA wrote:
The days of no winglets (or equivalent device) at WN is over.

I always wanted to fly on one of the second-hand -300s, but I always got a WN original.


I flew on one when original a/c went MX and we had an old bird (didn't get reg) but knew she was old when the flight path aircraft took from MCO-HOU was completely over land instead of the typical Gulf of Mexico crossing. Also, the poor bird was warm for an evening flight. The packed flight reminded me of flight back in the day that I took with AI from BOM - COK, per the sweaty factor.
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n471wn
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 5:45 am

n471wn wrote:
RacheyFlies wrote:
Is the 737-300 is the one that previously involved in the TACA Air crash, I knew that plane was repaired and was taken to Southwest in 1990's.

But when will all their 733 retires?

No the TACA a/c was retired some time ago and unless the plans change all the 300's will be gone by Oct 2017


I just researched it and YES you are right as N697SW is the famous TACA a/c that did indeed land on that dike and was repaired and flew off the dike!!
 
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BMWdrvr75
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 6:12 am

I remember when we received 657, 658, and 659 from Western Pacific....We flew them for a few months with the WestPac interiors 138 seats, 3 lavs, no froward windscreen and a full size galley in the back. I always wondered why we never adopted using the galleys like all the other airlines. It would seem like an easier process to take the old carts off and put the new ones on. 22 years and I just never understood why.....
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737tanker
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 2:50 pm

indcwby wrote:
I flew on one when original a/c went MX and we had an old bird (didn't get reg) but knew she was old when the flight path aircraft took from MCO-HOU was completely over land instead of the typical Gulf of Mexico crossing. Also, the poor bird was warm for an evening flight. The packed flight reminded me of flight back in the day that I took with AI from BOM - COK, per the sweaty factor.

The age of the aircraft has nothing to do with whether the flight was over the Gulf or land as all of WN's planes can fly over the Gulf. Your flight was most likely over land due to weather over the Gulf. In fact I have flown NGs over the land instead of the Gulf because I didn't want to deal with thunderstorms that were along the Gulf route.
 
Cubsrule
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 3:25 pm

737tanker wrote:
indcwby wrote:
I flew on one when original a/c went MX and we had an old bird (didn't get reg) but knew she was old when the flight path aircraft took from MCO-HOU was completely over land instead of the typical Gulf of Mexico crossing. Also, the poor bird was warm for an evening flight. The packed flight reminded me of flight back in the day that I took with AI from BOM - COK, per the sweaty factor.

The age of the aircraft has nothing to do with whether the flight was over the Gulf or land as all of WN's planes can fly over the Gulf. Your flight was most likely over land due to weather over the Gulf. In fact I have flown NGs over the land instead of the Gulf because I didn't want to deal with thunderstorms that were along the Gulf route.


Yup. FLL-HOU is a closer call, though the Great Circle route does stay within 162nm of an alternate.
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Flighty
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 4:13 pm

Blown away that it has +98,000 hours and landed on a dike before. Incredible aircraft and attaboy WN maintenance.
 
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wilcharl
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 5:07 pm

https://planefinder.net/data/aircraft/N697SW Shows ship 697 still flying around. This is the same aircraft that TACA airlines landed on the levy in Louisiana years ago
 
na
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 5:16 pm

89 retirements in 12 months is an aggressive schedule. How many will be retired until this year´s end then? A dozen, or more? And how many were retired since the end of the summer season?
Anyone knows why the secondhand 733s were retired later than most of the original early-built SW 733s of the same age?
 
indcwby
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 5:29 pm

737tanker wrote:
indcwby wrote:
I flew on one when original a/c went MX and we had an old bird (didn't get reg) but knew she was old when the flight path aircraft took from MCO-HOU was completely over land instead of the typical Gulf of Mexico crossing. Also, the poor bird was warm for an evening flight. The packed flight reminded me of flight back in the day that I took with AI from BOM - COK, per the sweaty factor.

The age of the aircraft has nothing to do with whether the flight was over the Gulf or land as all of WN's planes can fly over the Gulf. Your flight was most likely over land due to weather over the Gulf. In fact I have flown NGs over the land instead of the Gulf because I didn't want to deal with thunderstorms that were along the Gulf route.


I did leave out the part that aircraft flew with MEL and Captain did say that our flight path would put us through some bumpy weather. After arriving into HOU, I did look up wx radar and usual Gulf routing was clear. I assumed the MEL had something to do with it.
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RayChuang
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 6:12 pm

I'm actually surprised WN would retired those late-production 733's so early. They could have stayed around a few more years in intra-California and intra-Texas service until maybe 2019 or so.
 
MSPNWA
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 6:18 pm

na wrote:
Anyone knows why the secondhand 733s were retired later than most of the original early-built SW 733s of the same age?


From what I understand, the second-hand frames weren't used as heavily in their early years, so they had fewer cycles than the WN originals.
 
sparkyontheseas
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 6:22 pm

BMWdrvr75 wrote:
I remember when we received 657, 658, and 659 from Western Pacific....We flew them for a few months with the WestPac interiors 138 seats, 3 lavs, no froward windscreen and a full size galley in the back. I always wondered why we never adopted using the galleys like all the other airlines. It would seem like an easier process to take the old carts off and put the new ones on. 22 years and I just never understood why.....


This is a good question and I can only speculate on the answer. Those carts are kinda expensive, thread from the carpet gets stuck in the wheels and they clog up the aisle. If you notice in the galleys the most of the frequently used items are within easy reach meaning no bending over.

From the provisioning view its easier to stock the galleys from the trucks then to load the carts on to the trucks, swap out on the aircraft. Hope that you don't load a used cart onto an outbound aircraft or put too many soda carts on and forget the liquor cart. Unload the carts from the truck. Search out fresh carts that are hopefully restocked correctly for ones next set of flights. Also you'd have to have a set of agents restocking those carts.

Anyways I have done it both ways and by far prefer that Southwest does it cart less.
My staments are my own opinion and not that of my employer.
 
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BMWdrvr75
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 8:54 pm

RayChuang wrote:
I'm actually surprised WN would retired those late-production 733's so early. They could have stayed around a few more years in intra-California and intra-Texas service until maybe 2019 or so.

I think they are trying to "own" the California Market and realize that the -300s with no internet will not compete well with Alaska who's fleet is newer, has internet and charging ports, and as a superior inflight product to offer the California business traveler (not to mention the parternships and cities AS can offer.) The boys/gal's in Dallas laugh and say they run a California airline in Texas. However, Alaska is offering a great product with more destinations in California.... WN take note...California will slip away from WN just as it did at AirCal via American and PSA via USAir.... Californians like their perks, great service and more award destinations. We are not as loyal as the Texans who will die for Southwest. It is my humble opinion that the folks at WN marketing and inflight think that passing out small drinks and peanuts on a tray and wifi -700,s with no charging options makes their inflight product superior...they are truly living in the glass palace in Dallas.
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Cubsrule
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 9:05 pm

BMWdrvr75 wrote:
RayChuang wrote:
I'm actually surprised WN would retired those late-production 733's so early. They could have stayed around a few more years in intra-California and intra-Texas service until maybe 2019 or so.

I think they are trying to "own" the California Market and realize that the -300s with no internet will not compete well with Alaska who's fleet is newer, has internet and charging ports, and as a superior inflight product to offer the California business traveler (not to mention the parternships and cities AS can offer.) The boys/gal's in Dallas laugh and say they run a California airline in Texas. However, Alaska is offering a great product with more destinations in California.... WN take note...California will slip away from WN just as it did at AirCal via American and PSA via USAir.... Californians like their perks, great service and more award destinations. We are not as loyal as the Texans who will die for Southwest. It is my humble opinion that the folks at WN marketing and inflight think that passing out small drinks and peanuts on a tray and wifi -700,s with no charging options makes their inflight product superior...they are truly living in the glass palace in Dallas.


I'm not sure charging matters all that much on intra-California stage lengths, and that seems to be the only downside for WN. On the plus side, WN's eastbound network is generally much stronger than AS's, and WN's awards are much more generous.
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
 
WN732
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 10:57 pm

BMWdrvr75 wrote:
RayChuang wrote:
I'm actually surprised WN would retired those late-production 733's so early. They could have stayed around a few more years in intra-California and intra-Texas service until maybe 2019 or so.

I think they are trying to "own" the California Market and realize that the -300s with no internet will not compete well with Alaska who's fleet is newer, has internet and charging ports, and as a superior inflight product to offer the California business traveler (not to mention the parternships and cities AS can offer.) The boys/gal's in Dallas laugh and say they run a California airline in Texas. However, Alaska is offering a great product with more destinations in California.... WN take note...California will slip away from WN just as it did at AirCal via American and PSA via USAir.... Californians like their perks, great service and more award destinations. We are not as loyal as the Texans who will die for Southwest. It is my humble opinion that the folks at WN marketing and inflight think that passing out small drinks and peanuts on a tray and wifi -700,s with no charging options makes their inflight product superior...they are truly living in the glass palace in Dallas.


Oh please, not this again. If your phone or other device can't make it in the hour or less flight on any intra-CA route, maybe it's time to upgrade. And don't even begin to tell me that AS is eating WN's lunch using CRJ's, ERJ's and Q400's. WN is holding it's own very well against their competition.

Don't speak for all Californian's either. I live in Fresno, but I am happy to drive to the Bay area or even LA to catch a WN flight. I know many people who do the same. AS is good, but they are not that great as you make them seem. And they have done nothing to lower prices in the smaller CA cities either, such as FAT. If I wanted to go anywhere on AS, I'd have to fly on an itty bitty regional jet, or even a Q400. How does that compete with a full size 737, where I will get a free drink and a free bag. Did we forget that WN offers free bags? With CA's new plastic bag laws, WN seems to offer the only free bag policy in the whole state... That's a huge plus. Not to mention the massive amounts of frequency they offer. So no, AS won't be stomping them out.
 
737tanker
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Wed Nov 23, 2016 1:37 am

indcwby wrote:
737tanker wrote:
indcwby wrote:
I flew on one when original a/c went MX and we had an old bird (didn't get reg) but knew she was old when the flight path aircraft took from MCO-HOU was completely over land instead of the typical Gulf of Mexico crossing. Also, the poor bird was warm for an evening flight. The packed flight reminded me of flight back in the day that I took with AI from BOM - COK, per the sweaty factor.

The age of the aircraft has nothing to do with whether the flight was over the Gulf or land as all of WN's planes can fly over the Gulf. Your flight was most likely over land due to weather over the Gulf. In fact I have flown NGs over the land instead of the Gulf because I didn't want to deal with thunderstorms that were along the Gulf route.


I did leave out the part that aircraft flew with MEL and Captain did say that our flight path would put us through some bumpy weather. After arriving into HOU, I did look up wx radar and usual Gulf routing was clear. I assumed the MEL had something to do with it.

It sounds like that since the aircraft was warm and the Captain said that there was an MEL then I would guess that an inop pack was the MEL. That would limit the aircraft to a max altitude of FL 250. Additionally with that MEL overwater operations can be no lower than FL 250, so that prohibits westbound flights over the Gulf. So again the overland route has nothing to do with the age of the aircraft as I have flown NGs with an inoperative pack.
 
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BMWdrvr75
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Thu Nov 24, 2016 9:57 am

WN732 wrote:
BMWdrvr75 wrote:
RayChuang wrote:
I'm actually surprised WN would retired those late-production 733's so early. They could have stayed around a few more years in intra-California and intra-Texas service until maybe 2019 or so.

I think they are trying to "own" the California Market and realize that the -300s with no internet will not compete well with Alaska who's fleet is newer, has internet and charging ports, and as a superior inflight product to offer the California business traveler (not to mention the parternships and cities AS can offer.) The boys/gal's in Dallas laugh and say they run a California airline in Texas. However, Alaska is offering a great product with more destinations in California.... WN take note...California will slip away from WN just as it did at AirCal via American and PSA via USAir.... Californians like their perks, great service and more award destinations. We are not as loyal as the Texans who will die for Southwest. It is my humble opinion that the folks at WN marketing and inflight think that passing out small drinks and peanuts on a tray and wifi -700,s with no charging options makes their inflight product superior...they are truly living in the glass palace in Dallas.


Oh please, not this again. If your phone or other device can't make it in the hour or less flight on any intra-CA route, maybe it's time to upgrade. And don't even begin to tell me that AS is eating WN's lunch using CRJ's, ERJ's and Q400's. WN is holding it's own very well against their competition.

Don't speak for all Californian's either. I live in Fresno, but I am happy to drive to the Bay area or even LA to catch a WN flight. I know many people who do the same. AS is good, but they are not that great as you make them seem. And they have done nothing to lower prices in the smaller CA cities either, such as FAT. If I wanted to go anywhere on AS, I'd have to fly on an itty bitty regional jet, or even a Q400. How does that compete with a full size 737, where I will get a free drink and a free bag. Did we forget that WN offers free bags? With CA's new plastic bag laws, WN seems to offer the only free bag policy in the whole state... That's a huge plus. Not to mention the massive amounts of frequency they offer. So no, AS won't be stomping them out.

I am so sorry to speak as a 22 year flight attendant that gets asked everytime I work a A trip by one of our valued CUSTOMERS where is a PowerPort, can we buy on board, ear buds?. i'm so sorry that I gave Alaska Airlines kudos for really stepping up in California. I live in Los Angeles and Palm Springs area and more and more I am hearing people say they're flying Alaska so of course you're from Fresno, my apologies you must get the "California market" As someone who works on the aircraft and hears from a lot of frequent fliers "oh no here we go again" work the 737 day in and day out and then you can say oh no here we go again . Customers are asking for a PowerPorts asking for Hawaii asking for Canada.... something Southwest refuses to do. Or better yet I am a 22 year employee who also has a professional job college-educated and is executive platinum at American. My entire family is in SEA for Thanksgiving. Consequently, sitting around the table this evening and talking about how we all flew Alaska here and paid for tickets from SNA ONT and SMF. Three (3) of us work for WN ( CA- 30 years, Flight Attendant 22 and 12 years) none of us flew our own airline. We are just asking the boys/and gals in DAL stop looking for "YES" people and the small group of frequent fliers and stop pretending to be a big boy airline operating like the regional airline. I'm sorry to offend and I'm sure I'm going to get nasty comments on this but try working it day in and day out you would understand .
We Make Flying Easy......Come fly the Silver Bird........Something Special in the Air......
 
traindoc
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Fri Nov 25, 2016 12:53 am

Just flew SAT-PHX today (11/24) on a WN 733. Dumpy and poorly maintained interior. Good riddance!
 
n471wn
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Fri Nov 25, 2016 1:37 am

traindoc wrote:
Just flew SAT-PHX today (11/24) on a WN 733. Dumpy and poorly maintained interior. Good riddance!


Oh but that legroom on the non-Evolved 733's is worth all the other failings!!
 
SXDFC
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Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Fri Nov 25, 2016 1:52 am

BMWdrvr75 wrote:
WN732 wrote:
BMWdrvr75 wrote:
I think they are trying to "own" the California Market and realize that the -300s with no internet will not compete well with Alaska who's fleet is newer, has internet and charging ports, and as a superior inflight product to offer the California business traveler (not to mention the parternships and cities AS can offer.) The boys/gal's in Dallas laugh and say they run a California airline in Texas. However, Alaska is offering a great product with more destinations in California.... WN take note...California will slip away from WN just as it did at AirCal via American and PSA via USAir.... Californians like their perks, great service and more award destinations. We are not as loyal as the Texans who will die for Southwest. It is my humble opinion that the folks at WN marketing and inflight think that passing out small drinks and peanuts on a tray and wifi -700,s with no charging options makes their inflight product superior...they are truly living in the glass palace in Dallas.


Oh please, not this again. If your phone or other device can't make it in the hour or less flight on any intra-CA route, maybe it's time to upgrade. And don't even begin to tell me that AS is eating WN's lunch using CRJ's, ERJ's and Q400's. WN is holding it's own very well against their competition.

Don't speak for all Californian's either. I live in Fresno, but I am happy to drive to the Bay area or even LA to catch a WN flight. I know many people who do the same. AS is good, but they are not that great as you make them seem. And they have done nothing to lower prices in the smaller CA cities either, such as FAT. If I wanted to go anywhere on AS, I'd have to fly on an itty bitty regional jet, or even a Q400. How does that compete with a full size 737, where I will get a free drink and a free bag. Did we forget that WN offers free bags? With CA's new plastic bag laws, WN seems to offer the only free bag policy in the whole state... That's a huge plus. Not to mention the massive amounts of frequency they offer. So no, AS won't be stomping them out.

I am so sorry to speak as a 22 year flight attendant that gets asked everytime I work a A trip by one of our valued CUSTOMERS where is a PowerPort, can we buy on board, ear buds?. i'm so sorry that I gave Alaska Airlines kudos for really stepping up in California. I live in Los Angeles and Palm Springs area and more and more I am hearing people say they're flying Alaska so of course you're from Fresno, my apologies you must get the "California market" As someone who works on the aircraft and hears from a lot of frequent fliers "oh no here we go again" work the 737 day in and day out and then you can say oh no here we go again . Customers are asking for a PowerPorts asking for Hawaii asking for Canada.... something Southwest refuses to do. Or better yet I am a 22 year employee who also has a professional job college-educated and is executive platinum at American. My entire family is in SEA for Thanksgiving. Consequently, sitting around the table this evening and talking about how we all flew Alaska here and paid for tickets from SNA ONT and SMF. Three (3) of us work for WN ( CA- 30 years, Flight Attendant 22 and 12 years) none of us flew our own airline. We are just asking the boys/and gals in DAL stop looking for "YES" people and the small group of frequent fliers and stop pretending to be a big boy airline operating like the regional airline. I'm sorry to offend and I'm sure I'm going to get nasty comments on this but try working it day in and day out you would understand .


IMHO the new "heart" seats should have came with power ports, however I've heard there is a lot of extra mx involved.. Btw check your PM..
 
alasizon
Posts: 2597
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2007 8:57 pm

Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Fri Nov 25, 2016 2:50 am

SXDFC wrote:

IMHO the new "heart" seats should have came with power ports, however I've heard there is a lot of extra mx involved.. Btw check your PM..


I've heard about the supposed added MX many times, but does anyone know how much additional MX it actually takes?
Airport (noun) - A construction site which airplanes tend to frequent
 
flyfresno
Posts: 1042
Joined: Tue May 02, 2006 6:18 am

Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Sat Nov 26, 2016 2:34 am

WN732 wrote:
AS is good, but they are not that great as you make them seem. And they have done nothing to lower prices in the smaller CA cities either, such as FAT. If I wanted to go anywhere on AS, I'd have to fly on an itty bitty regional jet, or even a Q400. How does that compete with a full size 737, where I will get a free drink and a free bag.


1) Alaska *HAS* lowered fares out of Fresno. Perhaps not as low as fares out of Bay Area airports, but certainly much cheaper than they used to be and cheap enough that driving to the Bay makes much less sense. SAN, PDX, and SEA are regularly for sale at $89, $125, and $125 during non-peak periods (most of January after the first week, for instance). This has led other airlines to lower fares to those cities as well (DL and AA both have fares around $115 to SEA with a connection on the same days). SMF (a larger airport and market, but a more fair comparison than the Bay) was cheaper on those same dates, but not by enough that driving 3 hours each way would make sense (SAN, PDX, and SEA on SWA on the same dates were $76, $99, and $99, respectively). OAK was slightly cheaper than SMF, but it's also a much larger market, and economies of scale certainly help. Before AS came in, all of three of those markets were way, way more expensive to fly to from FAT, AND there were no non-stops.

2) Fresno is a smaller market, and while it has been lucky enough to secure 737 and A319 service on a couple routes, you are right that you will likely be on a larger aircraft if you choose to fly out of the Bay Area. However, you might be surprised to learn that the seats on the E175 that Alaska uses for most of its flights out of FAT are actually a bit larger than the seats on the 737 (32" X 18.25" on the E175, 32" X 17" on the 737). Both aircraft have wifi and larger bins as well as first class seats; the biggest thing you are missing out on in the E175 is power (only available in the front of the a/c) and seatback TVs, although Southwest doesn't have those anyway. Alaska consistently wins awards for top customer service, even more than Southwest.

3) RJs make it possible for service to exist to smaller markets (although some airlines still fly RJs between larger markets), and without them, FAT and many other cities would probably have 1/2 as many choices of destinations and flight times. Additionally, many airlines use RJs to develop markets, and I suspect that's what AS is doing in FAT. They have asked the airport to install jetways that they can have exclusive use of, and while it might just be for the E175, one has to wonder if they are anticipating having 737 service on one of their routes as their customer base grows in the Central Valley.

3) That all said, I have a lot of friends who are loyal to SWA, go out of their way to fly on them (perhaps not as out of the way as you do, but they will connect once or even twice instead of taking a non-stop), and mostly cite their boarding process, free bag, and refund/change policy as reasons that they continue to choose them. But I don't understand sitting in a cramped car for 2-3 hours, in traffic (it's certainly much, much smaller than any RJ), just to be able to fly on a 737.

SWA will probably be the next domestic airline to serve FAT, but who knows when that will be (I think you would need to see AS doing at least 4 flights per day to SAN and 4-5 per day to SEA, as well as G4 doing at least 2-3 per day to LAS and mainline service on at least 2-3 of the PHX flights on AA, and perhaps even 1-2 mainline to DEN on UA, before SWA would even consider the market). Driving to OAK/SJC/SFO to fly on them isn't making that happen any sooner.
 
dc10lover
Posts: 1594
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2014 6:11 pm

Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Sat Nov 26, 2016 2:51 am

I so wish Southwest would add new cities they do not serve. Bellingham, Washington - Oakland, California daily. Draw some passengers from Vancouver, Canada.
Why endure the nightmare and congestion of LAX when BUR, LGB, ONT & SNA is so much easier to fly in and out of. Same with OAK & SJC when it comes to SFO.
 
coolian2
Posts: 2483
Joined: Sun Oct 22, 2006 3:34 pm

Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Sat Nov 26, 2016 3:06 am

BMWdrvr75 wrote:
WN732 wrote:
BMWdrvr75 wrote:
I think they are trying to "own" the California Market and realize that the -300s with no internet will not compete well with Alaska who's fleet is newer, has internet and charging ports, and as a superior inflight product to offer the California business traveler (not to mention the parternships and cities AS can offer.) The boys/gal's in Dallas laugh and say they run a California airline in Texas. However, Alaska is offering a great product with more destinations in California.... WN take note...California will slip away from WN just as it did at AirCal via American and PSA via USAir.... Californians like their perks, great service and more award destinations. We are not as loyal as the Texans who will die for Southwest. It is my humble opinion that the folks at WN marketing and inflight think that passing out small drinks and peanuts on a tray and wifi -700,s with no charging options makes their inflight product superior...they are truly living in the glass palace in Dallas.


Oh please, not this again. If your phone or other device can't make it in the hour or less flight on any intra-CA route, maybe it's time to upgrade. And don't even begin to tell me that AS is eating WN's lunch using CRJ's, ERJ's and Q400's. WN is holding it's own very well against their competition.

Don't speak for all Californian's either. I live in Fresno, but I am happy to drive to the Bay area or even LA to catch a WN flight. I know many people who do the same. AS is good, but they are not that great as you make them seem. And they have done nothing to lower prices in the smaller CA cities either, such as FAT. If I wanted to go anywhere on AS, I'd have to fly on an itty bitty regional jet, or even a Q400. How does that compete with a full size 737, where I will get a free drink and a free bag. Did we forget that WN offers free bags? With CA's new plastic bag laws, WN seems to offer the only free bag policy in the whole state... That's a huge plus. Not to mention the massive amounts of frequency they offer. So no, AS won't be stomping them out.

I am so sorry to speak as a 22 year flight attendant that gets asked everytime I work a A trip by one of our valued CUSTOMERS where is a PowerPort, can we buy on board, ear buds?. i'm so sorry that I gave Alaska Airlines kudos for really stepping up in California. I live in Los Angeles and Palm Springs area and more and more I am hearing people say they're flying Alaska so of course you're from Fresno, my apologies you must get the "California market" As someone who works on the aircraft and hears from a lot of frequent fliers "oh no here we go again" work the 737 day in and day out and then you can say oh no here we go again . Customers are asking for a PowerPorts asking for Hawaii asking for Canada.... something Southwest refuses to do. Or better yet I am a 22 year employee who also has a professional job college-educated and is executive platinum at American. My entire family is in SEA for Thanksgiving. Consequently, sitting around the table this evening and talking about how we all flew Alaska here and paid for tickets from SNA ONT and SMF. Three (3) of us work for WN ( CA- 30 years, Flight Attendant 22 and 12 years) none of us flew our own airline. We are just asking the boys/and gals in DAL stop looking for "YES" people and the small group of frequent fliers and stop pretending to be a big boy airline operating like the regional airline. I'm sorry to offend and I'm sure I'm going to get nasty comments on this but try working it day in and day out you would understand .

Let's play "Spot the AS employee"
Q300/ATR72-600/737-200/-300/-400/-700/-800/A320/767-200/-300/757-200/777-300ER/
747-200/-300/-400/ER/A340-300/A380-800/MD-83/-88/CRJ-700/-900
 
flyfresno
Posts: 1042
Joined: Tue May 02, 2006 6:18 am

Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Sat Nov 26, 2016 4:57 am

coolian2 wrote:
BMWdrvr75 wrote:
WN732 wrote:

Oh please, not this again. If your phone or other device can't make it in the hour or less flight on any intra-CA route, maybe it's time to upgrade. And don't even begin to tell me that AS is eating WN's lunch using CRJ's, ERJ's and Q400's. WN is holding it's own very well against their competition.

Don't speak for all Californian's either. I live in Fresno, but I am happy to drive to the Bay area or even LA to catch a WN flight. I know many people who do the same. AS is good, but they are not that great as you make them seem. And they have done nothing to lower prices in the smaller CA cities either, such as FAT. If I wanted to go anywhere on AS, I'd have to fly on an itty bitty regional jet, or even a Q400. How does that compete with a full size 737, where I will get a free drink and a free bag. Did we forget that WN offers free bags? With CA's new plastic bag laws, WN seems to offer the only free bag policy in the whole state... That's a huge plus. Not to mention the massive amounts of frequency they offer. So no, AS won't be stomping them out.

I am so sorry to speak as a 22 year flight attendant that gets asked everytime I work a A trip by one of our valued CUSTOMERS where is a PowerPort, can we buy on board, ear buds?. i'm so sorry that I gave Alaska Airlines kudos for really stepping up in California. I live in Los Angeles and Palm Springs area and more and more I am hearing people say they're flying Alaska so of course you're from Fresno, my apologies you must get the "California market" As someone who works on the aircraft and hears from a lot of frequent fliers "oh no here we go again" work the 737 day in and day out and then you can say oh no here we go again . Customers are asking for a PowerPorts asking for Hawaii asking for Canada.... something Southwest refuses to do. Or better yet I am a 22 year employee who also has a professional job college-educated and is executive platinum at American. My entire family is in SEA for Thanksgiving. Consequently, sitting around the table this evening and talking about how we all flew Alaska here and paid for tickets from SNA ONT and SMF. Three (3) of us work for WN ( CA- 30 years, Flight Attendant 22 and 12 years) none of us flew our own airline. We are just asking the boys/and gals in DAL stop looking for "YES" people and the small group of frequent fliers and stop pretending to be a big boy airline operating like the regional airline. I'm sorry to offend and I'm sure I'm going to get nasty comments on this but try working it day in and day out you would understand .

Let's play "Spot the AS employee"


AS employee posing as WN employee?

I don't think SWA will lose California anytime soon, but they are certainly facing more competition on routes they used to have monopolies on.
 
User avatar
BMWdrvr75
Posts: 87
Joined: Wed Jul 08, 2015 6:23 pm

Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Sat Nov 26, 2016 7:14 am

flyfresno wrote:
coolian2 wrote:
BMWdrvr75 wrote:
I am so sorry to speak as a 22 year flight attendant that gets asked everytime I work a A trip by one of our valued CUSTOMERS where is a PowerPort, can we buy on board, ear buds?. i'm so sorry that I gave Alaska Airlines kudos for really stepping up in California. I live in Los Angeles and Palm Springs area and more and more I am hearing people say they're flying Alaska so of course you're from Fresno, my apologies you must get the "California market" As someone who works on the aircraft and hears from a lot of frequent fliers "oh no here we go again" work the 737 day in and day out and then you can say oh no here we go again . Customers are asking for a PowerPorts asking for Hawaii asking for Canada.... something Southwest refuses to do. Or better yet I am a 22 year employee who also has a professional job college-educated and is executive platinum at American. My entire family is in SEA for Thanksgiving. Consequently, sitting around the table this evening and talking about how we all flew Alaska here and paid for tickets from SNA ONT and SMF. Three (3) of us work for WN ( CA- 30 years, Flight Attendant 22 and 12 years) none of us flew our own airline. We are just asking the boys/and gals in DAL stop looking for "YES" people and the small group of frequent fliers and stop pretending to be a big boy airline operating like the regional airline. I'm sorry to offend and I'm sure I'm going to get nasty comments on this but try working it day in and day out you would understand .

Let's play "Spot the AS employee"


AS employee posing as WN employee?

I don't think SWA will lose California anytime soon, but they are certainly facing more competition on routes they used to have monopolies on.

The disconnect between the folks at headquarters in Dallas and the flight crews for Southwest is very real. Many of us are commuters and get the privilege of flying other airlines. Me personally, when I am purchasing tickets I try to fly American every time if I can. When I travel on business for my principal job I do not nor am I allowed to use my travel privileges. Furthermore, if I was an AS employee I certainly would not be on here begging WN to step of their service levels both in the cabin and with new cities. I personally have the opportunity to continue to fly for Southwest and be a high school principal. I just want WN to provide a consistent high quality product we can all be proud of. This is not the 90s we cannot sustain the same service on a LAX - LAS flight as we do on an LAX - LIR flight it just isn't working anymore.
We Make Flying Easy......Come fly the Silver Bird........Something Special in the Air......
 
SWADawg
Posts: 573
Joined: Tue Dec 03, 2013 6:43 pm

Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Sat Nov 26, 2016 4:03 pm

BMWdrvr75 wrote:
flyfresno wrote:
coolian2 wrote:
Let's play "Spot the AS employee"


AS employee posing as WN employee?

I don't think SWA will lose California anytime soon, but they are certainly facing more competition on routes they used to have monopolies on.

The disconnect between the folks at headquarters in Dallas and the flight crews for Southwest is very real. Many of us are commuters and get the privilege of flying other airlines. Me personally, when I am purchasing tickets I try to fly American every time if I can. When I travel on business for my principal job I do not nor am I allowed to use my travel privileges. Furthermore, if I was an AS employee I certainly would not be on here begging WN to step of their service levels both in the cabin and with new cities. I personally have the opportunity to continue to fly for Southwest and be a high school principal. I just want WN to provide a consistent high quality product we can all be proud of. This is not the 90s we cannot sustain the same service on a LAX - LAS flight as we do on an LAX - LIR flight it just isn't working anymore.

I agree with pretty much everything you said about WN's current outdated product. There is a huge disconnect in Dallas about how outdated the onboard product is. The attitude seems to be that sure we could make the inflight product better, we just don't want to, nor do we think we should have to. That kind of thinking is going to eventually cost WN customers to competitors ESPECIALLY in California. Hopefully some positive changes to the product will be made, but judging by the minimal enhancements made to both the -800 and the MAX-8 cabin and the basic lack of inseat power, I'm not holding my breath.
My posts are my opinion only and do not reflect the views of Southwest Airlines
 
barney captain
Posts: 2350
Joined: Tue Nov 06, 2001 5:47 pm

Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Sat Nov 26, 2016 10:20 pm

Sooner787 wrote:
Do you mean 80 more -300's will be retired in the next 12 months?

Or by the end of 2016????


I'm sure he meant within the next year, so yes 12 months or so. I believe though that it will be closer to 9 months from now.
Southeast Of Disorder
 
n471wn
Topic Author
Posts: 1717
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 12:23 am

Re: SWA retires its last a/c built in the 1980's

Sat Dec 03, 2016 3:14 am

As the thread poster I have acknowledged that I was wrong when I said that the last 1980's 300 series had been retired. I was off one a/c and that was N697SW. But now my post is correct as N697SW was ferried this morning from Houston to Marana. No idea why Marana as all the others went to Tucson and Stuttgart Arkansas.

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