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flybynight
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Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 11:21 pm

I believe both UA and DL will have retired all their 747's by the end of 2018, or shortly thereafter.

So how is this for a crazy and unlikely idea (and please, for those who are so serious they have to call this dumb, have a sense of humor!):

Keep one 744. Fly it at slightly higher ticket price and market it as "Flying the Queen of the Sky".
Wouldn't you pay $50 extra to fly, say, Seattle to Tokyo on a DL 744 or SFO to LHR on a UA 744!!?

This isn't going to happen, I know that, but I think there is at least a little merit to it.
Heia Norge!
 
MaxTrimm
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 11:26 pm

Cool idea, but when you think about the percentage of the travelling population that even cares they are flying on 747, it makes this idea very improbable. They would certainly be losing money.
One could only wish!!
 
RacheyFlies
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 11:26 pm

Not for DL, DL will retired it during 2017 I think. Then UA retired it in 2018.
DL 747 routes is reduced as many upcoming planes is retired.
The best plane I've flown is an A380. They were the biggest and the best than other plane I've been on. :lol:
 
SCAT15F
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 11:50 pm

Maybe if it was all first class with a piano bar...
 
SCAT15F
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 11:53 pm

...with Delta's classic livery or Northwest's bowling scheme from the '80's
 
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11725Flyer
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 11:56 pm

Once UA and DL rid themselves of their 747s, will they be scrapped or perhaps picked up by a cargo or passenger airline?
 
VX321
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Tue Nov 22, 2016 11:56 pm

I think that the queen of the sky moniker may be forgotten by many which means a lot of people will be scratching their heads as to why one flight is called that.Heck,most people don't know the difference between an Airbus A380 or a 747!
 
blacksoviet
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Wed Nov 23, 2016 12:11 am

Might as well make it a 747-300 flight. That way they can advertise the fact that the flight has a human flight engineer.
 
superjeff
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Wed Nov 23, 2016 12:24 am

flybynight wrote:
I believe both UA and DL will have retired all their 747's by the end of 2018, or shortly thereafter.

So how is this for a crazy and unlikely idea (and please, for those who are so serious they have to call this dumb, have a sense of humor!):

Keep one 744. Fly it at slightly higher ticket price and market it as "Flying the Queen of the Sky".
Wouldn't you pay $50 extra to fly, say, Seattle to Tokyo on a DL 744 or SFO to LHR on a UA 744!!?

This isn't going to happen, I know that, but I think there is at least a little merit to it.


Many years ago, Mohawk Airlines, a regional carrier based in upstate New York, marketed their DC3 services as "Gaslight" service with 1800's style decor, to compete against more modern equipment. It was a success. In the early 1970's, Alaska Airlines did the same thing with their Convair 880's, offering "1890's" services, with flight numbers in the high 1800's. Both were successful. So it has been done.
 
RacheyFlies
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Wed Nov 23, 2016 12:31 am

blacksoviet wrote:
Might as well make it a 747-300 flight. That way they can advertise the fact that the flight has a human flight engineer.

Maybe also the 747-200B too. Maybe that's another they can advertise too.
The best plane I've flown is an A380. They were the biggest and the best than other plane I've been on. :lol:
 
Cointrin330
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Wed Nov 23, 2016 1:50 am

11725Flyer wrote:
Once UA and DL rid themselves of their 747s, will they be scrapped or perhaps picked up by a cargo or passenger airline?


The Delta 747-400's are all ex-NW aircraft and they're some of the earliest builds of the -400 variant. Believe NW took its newest 747-400's in 1994/95 (the -400 was introduced in 1989). Delta did retire I think the first NW 747-400 last year, but the remaining 7 are among the oldest flying around. The UA birds are also getting up in age, being mostly early 1990's and maybe a few mid-1990's (1995-6) builds. I also believe that there are fuel tank modifications that all 747-400's must go through by 2019 and that is the other catalyst for DL and UA retiring theirs by 2017 and 2018 respectively as those mods are very expensive.
 
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hongkongflyer
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Wed Nov 23, 2016 2:36 am

I can't believe if any "normal" passanger is willing to pay extra just to fly the 747 (did they actually know which model they are flying?).
Especially for UA's 747, most of then will even avoid 747 if they are flying in Y beacuse of the lack of PTV for such a long haul flight.
 
michman
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Wed Nov 23, 2016 4:50 am

Cointrin330 wrote:
11725Flyer wrote:
Once UA and DL rid themselves of their 747s, will they be scrapped or perhaps picked up by a cargo or passenger airline?


The Delta 747-400's are all ex-NW aircraft and they're some of the earliest builds of the -400 variant. Believe NW took its newest 747-400's in 1994/95 (the -400 was introduced in 1989). Delta did retire I think the first NW 747-400 last year, but the remaining 7 are among the oldest flying around. The UA birds are also getting up in age, being mostly early 1990's and maybe a few mid-1990's (1995-6) builds. I also believe that there are fuel tank modifications that all 747-400's must go through by 2019 and that is the other catalyst for DL and UA retiring theirs by 2017 and 2018 respectively as those mods are very expensive.


And you would be wrong. The newest build NW 747-400's were delivered in 1999 and 2002. N671US - N674US and N676NW - N677NW.
 
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Wed Nov 23, 2016 5:01 am

SCAT15F wrote:
Maybe if it was all first class with a piano bar...


LOVE the idea!

Retro flights!

Y with 9 abreast seating and 34" pitch.

The new A350 DeltaOne seat with a retro upper deck lounge with piano bar.

Delta Widget livery.

LAX to LHR and HKG
JFK to LHR and HKG
 
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adamblang
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Wed Nov 23, 2016 5:03 am

I thought regulations going into effect in 2018 were rendering the frames not airworthy for passenger operations?
 
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delta747tlv
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Wed Nov 23, 2016 5:28 am

Ship 6301 will be part of the Delta Museum in ATL

http://www.theairloomproject.com/
 
SCAT15F
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Wed Nov 23, 2016 5:39 am

michman wrote:
Cointrin330 wrote:
11725Flyer wrote:
Once UA and DL rid themselves of their 747s, will they be scrapped or perhaps picked up by a cargo or passenger airline?


The Delta 747-400's are all ex-NW aircraft and they're some of the earliest builds of the -400 variant. Believe NW took its newest 747-400's in 1994/95 (the -400 was introduced in 1989). Delta did retire I think the first NW 747-400 last year, but the remaining 7 are among the oldest flying around. The UA birds are also getting up in age, being mostly early 1990's and maybe a few mid-1990's (1995-6) builds. I also believe that there are fuel tank modifications that all 747-400's must go through by 2019 and that is the other catalyst for DL and UA retiring theirs by 2017 and 2018 respectively as those mods are very expensive.


And you would be wrong. The newest build NW 747-400's were delivered in 1999 and 2002. N671US - N674US and N676NW - N677NW.




You know it! ...Although I have to admit I am partial to the CF6 powered -400's in terms of looks (engine nozzle design). I'd pay the extra even though I'm in the less than 40k income bracket...
 
weekendppl
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Wed Nov 23, 2016 5:58 am

$50 premium per seat? That's probably at best 10% of the regular fare for the seat you are proposing. A 10% premium would be a teeny tiny fraction of what it would cost to maintain and operate a fleet of one. Crews, recurrent training for flight and ground crews, maintaining the training sims, procedure maintenance, manuals, AD compliance, spares and consumables, GSE, it goes on and on and on. And that's before you get to things like the D-check that last aircraft in the fleet is needing very shortly after it is withdrawn. Neat idea. No economic way it would or could happen.
 
rta
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Wed Nov 23, 2016 6:57 am

While somewhat cool, the main problem is that most passengers won't be willing to pay extra to fly on a particular type of aircraft
 
hotelima
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Wed Nov 23, 2016 8:29 am

Nevertheless, its a cool idea, but in a pure retro point of view, nothing comparable to the flights in the Senator class 1958 ambience intended within two years by LH in the L 1649A Starliner presently in restoration at Auburn (ME) airport !
 
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OA940
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Wed Nov 23, 2016 8:44 am

Actually that's pretty smart. But never gonna happen.
A350/CSeries = bae
 
rebr
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Wed Nov 23, 2016 9:05 am

Since you described it as a "crazy idea" I thought you'd come up with something like "lets bring some A.netters together and buy one of them" :)
 
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OzarkD9S
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Wed Nov 23, 2016 12:52 pm

rta wrote:

While somewhat cool, the main problem is that most passengers won't be willing to pay extra to fly on a particular type of aircraft


Concorde being the exception of course.

Those 744s will end up at Family Airlines flying $99 one-ways between LAS and JFK. :rotfl:
Next up: STL DEN PSP DEN STL
 
frmrCapCadet
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Wed Nov 23, 2016 3:08 pm

The world does need a small fleet of cVLA (340s, 747s, maybe a few 380s). Evacuations from civil disasters, faster recoveries from major shutdowns. When nursing homes evacuate, say Katrina, a plane holding patients, staff, their children, pets going to some empty and available building are needed. Again Katrina getting 500 people at a time out, and to scattered cities would work the best.

After the Iceland volcano airline shutdown most Americans stuck in England would have settled for getting to any airport close in the US, and likewise in the other direction.

I could see all of the major air forces in the world having a few of these planes, manned by reservists and available the world around.
Buffet: the airline business...has eaten up capital...like..no other (business)
 
RacheyFlies
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Wed Nov 23, 2016 3:13 pm

The worlds first 744 is now no longer active and now it parked in the museum near where the old DC-9 parked in the same place too.
The best plane I've flown is an A380. They were the biggest and the best than other plane I've been on. :lol:
 
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aerolimani
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Fri Nov 25, 2016 3:20 am

superjeff wrote:
Many years ago, Mohawk Airlines, a regional carrier based in upstate New York, marketed their DC3 services as "Gaslight" service with 1800's style decor, to compete against more modern equipment. It was a success. In the early 1970's, Alaska Airlines did the same thing with their Convair 880's, offering "1890's" services, with flight numbers in the high 1800's. Both were successful. So it has been done.

Oh, wow. That is amazing!! Thank you for educating me, and brightening my day. :)

Image
 
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Fri Nov 25, 2016 4:40 pm

I am just sad that UNITED (a former 747 backbone airline) didn't bite and take a dozen 747-8i. I think if any US airline could make a 747-8 work in pax service- it would have been UA. When I see a UNITED 744 at SFO, I get really sad knowing that their days are numbered.
To Most the Sky is The Limit, For me, the Sky is Home.
 
MoonC
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Fri Nov 25, 2016 5:28 pm

OzarkD9S wrote:
rta wrote:

While somewhat cool, the main problem is that most passengers won't be willing to pay extra to fly on a particular type of aircraft


Concorde being the exception of course.

Those 744s will end up at Family Airlines flying $99 one-ways between LAS and JFK. :rotfl:


Or Baltia Air Lines! They are already a 747 "operator" after all. :D
 
BobbyPSP
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Fri Nov 25, 2016 6:24 pm

Delta could charter the aircraft (or a great marketing/promotion idea inhouse) until the mods are required. Remove enough seats to give true 36" in Y. Don't sell full capacity allowing generous amount of middle seats empty. Understand it will still have a large capacity.

While restricted to current Y dinner ware, bring back the steak dinners, Champagne flights; traditional early 747 service. Likewise upgrade Delta one where they can: full trolley service, salads tossed to order, canapés, appetizers, etc.

They could do transcons then say a LHR turn. Doesnt have to be dozens of flights (would be nice if there were the demand for it). For the baby boomers this was their first jet experience as masses started crossing the Atlantic.

I believe it could work with the right partnerships. Between here, flyer talk, PPrune, and on should have plenty of interest
 
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lightsaber
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Fri Nov 25, 2016 11:06 pm

MaxTrimm wrote:
Cool idea, but when you think about the percentage of the travelling population that even cares they are flying on 747, it makes this idea very improbable. They would certainly be losing money.
One could only wish!!

We could wish, but neither DL or UA is setup to keep a *very* limited pilot pool for one plane. They would also have to train FAs to fly the type. It simply isn't worth it for either for too small of a fleet.

It also costs a bit more to carry a passenger in a 744 than a 777, A350, 787, or even an A330 (in particular the upcoming NEO).

Lightsaber
Winter is coming.
 
727LOVER
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Sat Nov 26, 2016 5:19 am

Did DL use 744 on ATL-MSP this Thanksgiving weekend like the last 2 years?
"We must accept finite disappointment, but never lose infinite hope." - Martin Luther King, Jr.
 
Cush
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Sat Nov 26, 2016 5:28 am

I love United, but I will never step foot on their ancient 747's. Fly Trans-Pacific without personal IFE? No thanks.....
Fly me to the moon let me play among the stars.
 
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intotheair
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Sat Nov 26, 2016 5:41 am

The ideas in this thread are laughable. UA charges $100, sometimes $150 each way just for an E+ seat on longhaul flights. What makes you think they'd only charge $50 on some sort of special 747 flight? Some of my favorite flights were in the upper decks of UA 747s, but sadly, those days are coming to an end. And while it's fun to look at the past with rose colored glasses, the truth is that today's airplanes and premium seats are better by all measures.
300 319 320 321 332 333 345 346 380 717 733 734 735 73G 738 739 744 752 753 762 763 772 77W 788 789 CR2 CR7 CR9 CRK Q400 E175 DC10 MD82 MD90
AA AF AS AY AZ B6 BA BR DL F9 FI GA HA KF LH MI QX SK SN SQ UA US VY WN
 
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delta747tlv
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Sat Nov 26, 2016 8:27 am

727LOVER wrote:
Did DL use 744 on ATL-MSP this Thanksgiving weekend like the last 2 years?

6302 (N662US) will be running domestic for the weekend

26NOV
DL1640 DTW-ATL dep0710 arr0914
DL967 ATL-SEA dep1115 arr1327
DL1114 SEA-ATL dep1455 arr2228

27NOV
DL967 ATL-SEA dep1115 arr1327
DL1114 SEA-ATL dep1455 arr2228

28NOV
DL2005 ATL-DTW dep0725 arr0916

Bonus:
you can also catch the 744 doing a special extra section LAS-NRT for CES2017
 
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flybynight
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Mon Nov 28, 2016 5:53 pm

intotheair wrote:
The ideas in this thread are laughable. UA charges $100, sometimes $150 each way just for an E+ seat on longhaul flights. What makes you think they'd only charge $50 on some sort of special 747 flight? Some of my favorite flights were in the upper decks of UA 747s, but sadly, those days are coming to an end. And while it's fun to look at the past with rose colored glasses, the truth is that today's airplanes and premium seats are better by all measures.


There is always someone who has to take himself so seriously. And you read the thread wrong. I never said pay $50 for a seat on a 744.

Premium seats might better than their counterparts from 20 years ago, but I would say economy seats are actually worse, at least when it comes to the most precious commodity - leg room.
Heia Norge!
 
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intotheair
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Mon Nov 28, 2016 6:17 pm

flybynight wrote:
intotheair wrote:
The ideas in this thread are laughable. UA charges $100, sometimes $150 each way just for an E+ seat on longhaul flights. What makes you think they'd only charge $50 on some sort of special 747 flight? Some of my favorite flights were in the upper decks of UA 747s, but sadly, those days are coming to an end. And while it's fun to look at the past with rose colored glasses, the truth is that today's airplanes and premium seats are better by all measures.


There is always someone who has to take himself so seriously. And you read the thread wrong. I never said pay $50 for a seat on a 744.

Premium seats might better than their counterparts from 20 years ago, but I would say economy seats are actually worse, at least when it comes to the most precious commodity - leg room.


We're talking about the same thing, so no need to be combative. Yes, I read the thread correctly. I am speaking in terms of ancillary fees. If it's, say, $600 roundtrip SFO-NRT, and UA charges $100/$150 extra just for an E+ seat, then there's no way UA could make money charging only $50 over the usual fare in order to cover the costs for 747 flights. Sure, it's a crazy idea, as you admit, so...what else is there to say? If we're talking about things we'd love to see that we know would never happen, why not aim higher than a $50 fee on a 747 economy seat in the future? Why not start a thread to muse about how great it would be if Boeing developed a supersonic 747 to get you to Tokyo even faster, and if UA and DL had free flights like Ryanair? And a full kitchen to prepare boeuf bourguignon and serve Dom in Y too? Now that would be awesome!
300 319 320 321 332 333 345 346 380 717 733 734 735 73G 738 739 744 752 753 762 763 772 77W 788 789 CR2 CR7 CR9 CRK Q400 E175 DC10 MD82 MD90
AA AF AS AY AZ B6 BA BR DL F9 FI GA HA KF LH MI QX SK SN SQ UA US VY WN
 
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ua900
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Mon Nov 28, 2016 11:40 pm

Add a lounge in economy for good measure.

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Bricktop
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Mon Nov 28, 2016 11:51 pm

hotelima wrote:
Nevertheless, its a cool idea, but in a pure retro point of view, nothing comparable to the flights in the Senator class 1958 ambience intended within two years by LH in the L 1649A Starliner presently in restoration at Auburn (ME) airport !

It's a fabulous idea, but there would have to be a dress code. No slobs in sweatpants etc. Jacket and tie only please. Or as Basil's newspaper ad said from the classic Fawlty Towers episode with the gourmet night, no riff raff. :rotfl:
 
fun2fly
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Re: Crazy idea for UA and DL's 747's

Tue Nov 29, 2016 12:07 am

Bricktop wrote:
hotelima wrote:
Nevertheless, its a cool idea, but in a pure retro point of view, nothing comparable to the flights in the Senator class 1958 ambience intended within two years by LH in the L 1649A Starliner presently in restoration at Auburn (ME) airport !

It's a fabulous idea, but there would have to be a dress code. No slobs in sweatpants etc. Jacket and tie only please. Or as Basil's newspaper ad said from the classic Fawlty Towers episode with the gourmet night, no riff raff. :rotfl:


You'd probably have a good following if you also outlawed kids! In a weird way, I think it could work, but probably only for airlines with the 748i in service...come on LH!

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