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qf789
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Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sat Dec 10, 2016 2:51 am

Australian Aviation Thread Part 148 is now open for discussion, please continue to add your updates here

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1347815

In Part 147 we discussed

QF initial 787 routes
QF PER-LHR non-stop ongoing discussion
QF celebrates 96th birthday
SQ SIN-CGK-SYD flights to operate as nonstop SIN-SYD instead
Australian tough stance on bio-security
Pro & cons of transferring in DXB
DOT denies QF/AA joint venture
MU to go double daily 77W to both SYD & MEL
Perth Airport awarded capital city airport of the year
MEL suffers a fuel shortage due to fuel not passing quality testing
QF announces weekly Hobart-Ningbo freighter service
Flight diversions due to fuel shortage at MEL
Jetgo announces WGA-BNE
SQ217/218 SIN-MEL to go A380 year round
JQ’s delivery flights on 2 new A321’s
QR to launch CBR sometime in 2017/2018
Batik Air to start PER-DPS in the near future
Several passengers injured on a MU flight on decent into SYD
VN begins 787 service to both MEL & SYD
QF resumes MEL-CHC
LATAM to start SCL-MEL in Oct 17
First numbers on SQ SIN-CBR-WLG released
Flypelican to begin DBO-CBR in Jan 17
OZ revised A380 schedule to SYD
Both EK & EY say they have no plans to fly to CBR
PR looking at expanding Australian services with A321neo
3rd repainted roo (VH-QPI) returns to service
Australia & China announce open skies
CX to fly A350 to BNE in March 17
MU closes reservations for 3 weekly XIY-WUH-SYD
3 VA 737’s damaged in 2 separate incidents
TT begins MEL-CBR
QF expecting huge growth in US market
QF to announce to PER-LHR soon
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Gemuser
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:01 am

From LionelHutz, post 201 in Part 147:
Maybe, it is slightly less Y seats with a 789 daily double SYD-LAX, but a substantial bump for J and Y+. MEL-DFW could then be operated by the A388.
Whatever happens as the 789's are introduced there should be some interesting changes to QF flights to the US.

Really can not see that happening. Two B789 will be more expensive than one A380 to operate and SYD-LAX is unlikely to benefit from the extra frequency as they will have very similar schedules, as in the past when QF operated up to three daily on the route. I doubt that the extra premium seats will make up the difference.

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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:35 am

From: redroo in reply 294 in Part 147:
Question is that if the PER LHR is successful what will happen to the QF1, QF9, the A380 than run this route and first class.

Long term I can see DXB becoming a terminator for QF and all Europe flying going through PER. This should free up a380? But what to do with the aircraft.


This one I really, really can't see happening.
I really can't see the PER-LHR service having much effect on QF1/2 & QF9/10 [maybe some short term as everybody tries it out]. It offers no advantage to most east coast passengers, maybe the few who won't fly via DXB. Except maybe the city the B789s fly from to PER; SYD, MEL & BNE are possible and a BNE-PER-LHR service seems to make some sense especially if paired with a BNE-LAX-JFK B789 service.

All "European flying going via PER"!!! What are you smoking? First QF do NOT fly their own metal to Europe, only LHR, all European flying currently connects via DXB, are you seriously suggesting that PER could replace DXB for European flying!!! Even if the B789s allow QF services to Europe [say FRA & CDG] they will also go through DXB or DWC. Do not under estimate the power of that connecting hub.

While I wish it every success, I do have grave doubts about the long term viability of a non stop PER-LHR flight, IMHO it will live or die by O&D traffic.

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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:39 am

Agree. It will be interesting to see if PER-LHR goes ahead what impact this will have at LHR for QF, I'd say like I said in the last thread maybe QF9/10 from MEL terminates at DXB and uses a 789 while the 2 freed up A380's can make SYD-LAX daily again and maybe SYD-HKG upgauges. I'm aware QF have more leased out LHR slots they could possible get back at some point but they said again recently the current LHR services were tough, whatever that means.
 
IndianicWorld
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:51 am

ZK-NBT wrote:
Agree. It will be interesting to see if PER-LHR goes ahead what impact this will have at LHR for QF, I'd say like I said in the last thread maybe QF9/10 from MEL terminates at DXB and uses a 789 while the 2 freed up A380's can make SYD-LAX daily again and maybe SYD-HKG upgauges. I'm aware QF have more leased out LHR slots they could possible get back at some point but they said again recently the current LHR services were tough, whatever that means.


I could see Emirates upgauge their remaining MEL-DXB service to an A380 and Qantas move to a 789 on MEL-DXB terminator service at some stage also.

I do hold some reservations though that PER-LHR will be a huge success, especially for East Coast pax, but at the end of the day if Qantas chooses to chase that opportunity go for it.

One thing to remember is that Qantas made a strategic decision to move down the Emirates partnership path to enable more connectivity via the DXB hub into more destinations than a reliance on LHR. Brexit is another complication on the horizon but its hard to read how that will effect things yet.

Interesting times.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sat Dec 10, 2016 4:04 am

Gemuser wrote:
I really can't see the PER-LHR service having much effect on QF1/2 & QF9/10 [maybe some short term as everybody tries it out]. It offers no advantage to most east coast passengers, maybe the few who won't fly via DXB. Except maybe the city the B789s fly from to PER; SYD, MEL & BNE are possible and a BNE-PER-LHR service seems to make some sense especially if paired with a BNE-LAX-JFK B789 service.


Image

For anyone outside of Perth, London would still be a one-stop, whether its through PER or DXB. I also doubt that AJ would put the enormous value of DXB at risk.

I think that PER-LHR stands a reasonable chance of success, but I can't say the same about PER-FRA or PER-CDG or PER to pretty much anywhere in Europe.

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IndianicWorld
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sat Dec 10, 2016 4:08 am

mariner wrote:
Gemuser wrote:
I really can't see the PER-LHR service having much effect on QF1/2 & QF9/10 [maybe some short term as everybody tries it out]. It offers no advantage to most east coast passengers, maybe the few who won't fly via DXB. Except maybe the city the B789s fly from to PER; SYD, MEL & BNE are possible and a BNE-PER-LHR service seems to make some sense especially if paired with a BNE-LAX-JFK B789 service.


Image

For anyone outside of Perth, London would still be a one-stop, whether its through PER or DXB. I also doubt that AJ would put the enormous value of DXB at risk.

I think that PER-LHR stands a reasonable chance of success, but I can't say the same about PER-FRA or PER-CDG or PER to pretty much anywhere in Europe.

mariner


Yep, the other routes listed just seem like recipes for red ink.

PER-LHR can at least tap into the significant British population that lives in western Australia to fill some seats.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sat Dec 10, 2016 5:02 am

I would imagine the flight will originate in Perth, connecting onto A330s flight actually offers a better product in economy and the same business class
 
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KruegerFlaps
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sat Dec 10, 2016 5:17 am

I still question the viability of PER-LHR non-stop on two grounds. First, it appears clear that the service depends on connecting traffic from the Eastern States, hence the argument about departing from the Qantas domestic terminal in Perth. Although Qantas did mention it would make things easier for a passenger from Karratha, this ease has never been considered for flights to Singapore. The real ease is that of premium passengers from elsewhere (not that I care where a passenger actually originates from). If after the novelty has worn off it fails to attract sufficient numbers from interstate, is it likely to be continued?

Secondly, the reported unwillingness of both Qantas and Perth Airport to pay for Border Protection themselves and the cap in hand to the State Government for funding. If the flight was going to be a guaranteed huge success, why would there have been pressure on Barnett to stump up the money? I can see the attraction for Qantas shareholders but is there a real benefit to the State?

Personally, I would be reluctant to see State funding provided given that Qantas has threatened to abandon long haul flights out of Perth altogether if it doesn't get its way. Qantas has previously abandoned international routes out of Perth and if the non-stop route proves not to be the gold mine promised, they are obviously willing to drop it. Unless a cast iron legally enforceable guarantee can be provided that Qantas will repay any State monies provided if they do abandon it after the fanfare of publicity has died down, then we could simply be throwing money away.
Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves. - William Pitt Speech, 1783
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sat Dec 10, 2016 5:32 am

IndianicWorld wrote:
PER-LHR can at least tap into the significant British population that lives in western Australia to fill some seats.


That certainly. I suspect that VFR will be a decent component of the flights. Also, a lot of Perth/WA businesses - especially mining - still have an umbilical cord to London.

Add in the connecting traffic from the east coast - and there will be some - and add in anyone who doesn't want to transit DXB, I don't think there's an undue amount of risk associated with the route.

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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sat Dec 10, 2016 8:14 am

JQ 787 VH-VKJ has been stuck in HNL since the 29th of November when it suffered a bird strike shortly after departing from MEL. After a post flight inspection it was revealed that one engine received bird strike damage and required an engine change

http://avherald.com/h?article=4a1dd9e0&opt=0
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sat Dec 10, 2016 10:00 am

Does anybody know the reason(s) why QF171/2 has been operated by a Mainline 737 instead of a Jetconnect 737? It seems odd that it's been only operated by mainline since July? Is it because of the recent maintenance of the Jetconnect, because that's what I assumed but please correct me if I have been misguided. And one final question, when do Qantas plan to reinstate the route with the Jetconnect fleet, as I will be on this particular flight in a few weeks?

Any information will be highly regarded!

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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sat Dec 10, 2016 10:36 am

While there was maintanence going on which probly played a part initially QF have recently increased CHC-BNE and added CHC-MEL meaning Jetconnect simply don't have enough aircraft to cover all the flying, mainline have been doing 1 of the daily SYD-AKL flights to since October.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sat Dec 10, 2016 11:01 am

mariner wrote:
IndianicWorld wrote:
PER-LHR can at least tap into the significant British population that lives in western Australia to fill some seats.


That certainly. I suspect that VFR will be a decent component of the flights. Also, a lot of Perth/WA businesses - especially mining - still have an umbilical cord to London.

Add in the connecting traffic from the east coast - and there will be some - and add in anyone who doesn't want to transit DXB, I don't think there's an undue amount of risk associated with the route.

mariner


What connecting traffic from the east? What sane person in syd/mel/bne would fly that route unless the fare is truly rock bottom? Can they do 2000 SYD-LHR return in J?

AJ should have just replaced all the 744s in the fleet with the 789s. Not like they have enough pilots to fly all their aircrafts anyway.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sat Dec 10, 2016 12:07 pm

downdata wrote:
mariner wrote:
IndianicWorld wrote:
PER-LHR can at least tap into the significant British population that lives in western Australia to fill some seats.


That certainly. I suspect that VFR will be a decent component of the flights. Also, a lot of Perth/WA businesses - especially mining - still have an umbilical cord to London.

Add in the connecting traffic from the east coast - and there will be some - and add in anyone who doesn't want to transit DXB, I don't think there's an undue amount of risk associated with the route.

mariner


What connecting traffic from the east? What sane person in syd/mel/bne would fly that route unless the fare is truly rock bottom? Can they do 2000 SYD-LHR return in J?

AJ should have just replaced all the 744s in the fleet with the 789s. Not like they have enough pilots to fly all their aircrafts anyway.


I'd fly it from SYD if given the chance. If I want to fly to LHR, at present I have a personal preference to avoid a Mid East stop/transfer so I would avoid QF, pick another airline and go via Asia. However, my preference would be QF, so I would use it, 18 hours on a 787 isn't going to be any worse than 16 hours on a 380.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sat Dec 10, 2016 6:15 pm

downdata wrote:
What connecting traffic from the east? What sane person in syd/mel/bne would fly that route unless the fare is truly rock bottom?


I imagine quite a lot of connecting traffic, enough to sustain the flight at least. Other than the historical technological achievement, which surely counts for something, it's a flight to London and anyone who wants to go there is a potential customer. The enormous Qantas FF base will count for something as well and this route will provide an alternative to DXB on their favourite airline.

I guess the key - as I see it - is in that alternative.

There are people who don'lt like and won't use the DXB transit - most obviously a lot of the Jewish community, for example. They have long and publicly expressed reservations about the Emirates tie-up, and I imagine more than a few will be happy to cock a snoop at DXB and still be able to fly their national airline. However successful the Emirates connection may be, there are many others who would prefer an alternative routing to DXB, plenty of Australians - hate to say it - who would prefer not transiting through a Muslim country.

Within my experience, most passengers don't apply the stringent rules of a.net to their choices, they simply want to get there, safely, preferably (but not necessarily) with an airline they like and trust. Anecdotally, because of a cock-up with Eurostar, and a missed flight to EZE, I had to make a last minute booking back to NZ from Europe, and the best available (and far form the cheapest) was Air France/Air NZ with a seven hour layover at PVG. What surprised me was the number of French people, and several in business class, who had purposely chosen this somewhat arduous connection/long journey time and were travelling on to NZ with me. The innate power of a national carrier counts for something..

Hey, I could be wrong, I'm no expert in traffic management - LOL - but I welcome the route, on several levels.

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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sat Dec 10, 2016 7:44 pm

Personally I've always found transit in Dubai a zoo and if possible I avoid it, as do my colleagues (except one). No one in my office likes the A380 Skybed either when compared to the A330 Suite. So to avoid DXB and use the suite a PER-LHR 787 would be attractive. Coupled with the relative ease of domestic terminal departure/arrival on the east coast and the fact my Australia-London flights often involve entering or leaving via Brisbane it would get QF back in the game for my business. However, not sure if I'd book it in economy if I was paying personally as I'm wary of the 787 after flying it a couple of times down the back.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sat Dec 10, 2016 11:32 pm

Ryanair01 wrote:
Personally I've always found transit in Dubai a zoo and if possible I avoid it, as do my colleagues (except one). No one in my office likes the A380 Skybed either when compared to the A330 Suite. So to avoid DXB and use the suite a PER-LHR 787 would be attractive. Coupled with the relative ease of domestic terminal departure/arrival on the east coast and the fact my Australia-London flights often involve entering or leaving via Brisbane it would get QF back in the game for my business. However, not sure if I'd book it in economy if I was paying personally as I'm wary of the 787 after flying it a couple of times down the back.


No idea how domestic terminal is easier than international, but PER return is sure as hell going to be much more difficult
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sat Dec 10, 2016 11:35 pm

jupiter2 wrote:
downdata wrote:
mariner wrote:

That certainly. I suspect that VFR will be a decent component of the flights. Also, a lot of Perth/WA businesses - especially mining - still have an umbilical cord to London.

Add in the connecting traffic from the east coast - and there will be some - and add in anyone who doesn't want to transit DXB, I don't think there's an undue amount of risk associated with the route.

mariner


What connecting traffic from the east? What sane person in syd/mel/bne would fly that route unless the fare is truly rock bottom? Can they do 2000 SYD-LHR return in J?

AJ should have just replaced all the 744s in the fleet with the 789s. Not like they have enough pilots to fly all their aircrafts anyway.


I'd fly it from SYD if given the chance. If I want to fly to LHR, at present I have a personal preference to avoid a Mid East stop/transfer so I would avoid QF, pick another airline and go via Asia. However, my preference would be QF, so I would use it, 18 hours on a 787 isn't going to be any worse than 16 hours on a 380.


No the a/c type does not matter if one is flying 12+ hrs in Y which i think is already insane. The problem is PER.

Also, if you have FF status with QF, i don't see why other oneworld carriers are not better options (e.g. JL, CX) which offer superior services at comparable prices.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sun Dec 11, 2016 12:28 am

'd fly it from SYD if given the chance. If I want to fly to LHR, at present I have a personal preference to avoid a Mid East stop/transfer so I would avoid QF, pick another airline and go via Asia. However, my preference would be QF, so I would use it, 18 hours on a 787 isn't going to be any worse than 16 hours on a 380.[/quote]

No the a/c type does not matter if one is flying 12+ hrs in Y which i think is already insane. The problem is PER.

Also, if you have FF status with QF, i don't see why other oneworld carriers are not better options (e.g. JL, CX) which offer superior services at comparable prices.[/quote]

Well the 787 should make a difference as far as climate control on board with it's lower altitude setting, seating comfort in Y, well that will always be debated, especially in these forums, but even at 9 across, that's not a big turn off for me, leg room is more important.

FF status and airline choice, doesn't always make the difference. I'm partial to certain airlines and whenever possible, if the price, routing and timings are right, I will stick to my preferred airline. I've flown JL to Europe and I like them, but the lack of direct on going connections makes a difference, CX are not an option as far as I'm concerned, if to LHR my other main option would be BA. There are plenty of people like me, brand loyal, price sensitive to a point and routing sensitive.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sun Dec 11, 2016 1:13 am

AusBt is reporting that AJ will formally announce PER-LHR today. Flight is tipped to be routed MEL-PER-LHR-PER-MEL. The gate used will be a swing gate so it can be used for domestic flights as well

http://www.ausbt.com.au/qantas-to-fly-b ... early-2018
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sun Dec 11, 2016 1:43 am

qf789

How do you think the swing gate will work which one of the gates in T3 would work?
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sun Dec 11, 2016 2:17 am

I would imagine it would have to be either gate 16 or 17. These are the only ones with enough space around them for additional infrastructure. Its going to be hard segregating international arrivals in a single level terminal unless they have immigration straight after getting off the plane. Will a baggage carousel be lost to international in that case ?
Will be interesting to see if the Singapore and Auckland flights move too....and then jetstar would be in T1, would the international business lounge stay open?
For frequent fliers traveling in economy I would hope they would be allowed use of the business lounge traveling internationally as the Qantas club is pretty woeful
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sun Dec 11, 2016 2:26 am

An advantage of this flight would be getting 1-stop connections to alot of domestic destinations in the UK from Pertn which would cater to a large portion of Brits living in Perth and vice versa, for Brits wanting to travel to Cairns, Kalgoorlie, Broome etc.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sun Dec 11, 2016 2:29 am

downdata wrote:
jupiter2 wrote:
downdata wrote:

What connecting traffic from the east? What sane person in syd/mel/bne would fly that route unless the fare is truly rock bottom? Can they do 2000 SYD-LHR return in J?

AJ should have just replaced all the 744s in the fleet with the 789s. Not like they have enough pilots to fly all their aircrafts anyway.


I'd fly it from SYD if given the chance. If I want to fly to LHR, at present I have a personal preference to avoid a Mid East stop/transfer so I would avoid QF, pick another airline and go via Asia. However, my preference would be QF, so I would use it, 18 hours on a 787 isn't going to be any worse than 16 hours on a 380.


No the a/c type does not matter if one is flying 12+ hrs in Y which i think is already insane. The problem is PER.

Also, if you have FF status with QF, i don't see why other oneworld carriers are not better options (e.g. JL, CX) which offer superior services at comparable prices.


What connecting traffic from the East? There is heaps!: Well along with those passengers who don't like transiting DXB from SYD/MEL, it also gives pax from BNE/ADL/CBR/DRW a one stop option to LHR with Qantas. So that traffic along with the PER locals would easily fill this flight, even if the cheapest fares aren't sold/offered on this route.

As for your comment about flying on other oneworld carriers which you think have superior service is purely your opinion and that option to fly those carriers exist if people like you choose, however there are many of us out there who much prefer the Qantas service and products.

And yes as others have said, 17-18 hours on the 787 isn't any worse than 16hrs on the A380, one or two hours longer in the scheme of things and avoiding DXB is a win in my books, plus the added inch of legroom over the A380 will be appreciated as a bonus.
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sun Dec 11, 2016 2:38 am

waoz1 wrote:
qf789

How do you think the swing gate will work which one of the gates in T3 would work?


As mentioned above I would think it will probably gate 16 or 17.
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sun Dec 11, 2016 2:38 am

Another announcement possible this soon:

QR to launch A380 on MEL-DOH in mid 2017.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sun Dec 11, 2016 2:48 am

Perth airport confirms PER-LHR going ahead

Perth Airport and Qantas have reached agreement on the use of Terminal 3 (T3) to facilitate the operation of the non-stop iconic service from Perth to London, on the airline’s new state-of-the-art Boeing 787-9 Dreamliner aircraft
.

State government will be chipping in $14 million for upgrades.

QF has made an in principle agreement with Perth airport to move all ops over to new terminal by 31 December 2025

http://www.perthairport.com.au/Home/cor ... -agreement
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sun Dec 11, 2016 3:11 am

qf789 wrote:
Perth airport confirms PER-LHR going ahead

Good news for the airport and Qantas, particularly with the State Government subsidy being provided for infrastructure.

I note that the news may not be so good for MEL, with Qantas reportedly planning on scrapping the MEL-LHR A380 service. No doubt EK will be able to pick up some of the slack there to make up for whatever seats they lose in PER to the 787 flight.

http://www.ausbt.com.au/qantas-to-axe-m ... 80-flights
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sun Dec 11, 2016 4:37 am

Qantas press release

http://www.qantasnewsroom.com.au/media- ... to-london/

Flights to start in March 2018 with tickets to go on sale April 2018
QF will also move flights to SIN & AKL to T3/T4
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sun Dec 11, 2016 4:45 am

Probably no space for JQ/3K flights with 1 gate....this will rule out any upgrades for the international business lounge...if indeed it will stay open.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sun Dec 11, 2016 5:18 am

log0008 wrote:
Another announcement possible this soon:

QR to launch A380 on MEL-DOH in mid 2017.

This is good new for Melbourne, and over due for QR.

I posted in the other thread, shall say it here too. Doubt QF will cancel MEL-DXB-LHR. Can EK increase their flights? I thought they had maxed out. If anything this will free up capacity on MEL-DXB-EU/Afric which is a good growth market for the MEL diaspora. DXB-LHR will be fine
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sun Dec 11, 2016 5:23 am

smi0006 wrote:
log0008 wrote:
Another announcement possible this soon:

QR to launch A380 on MEL-DOH in mid 2017.

This is good new for Melbourne, and over due for QR.

I posted in the other thread, shall say it here too. Doubt QF will cancel MEL-DXB-LHR. Can EK increase their flights? I thought they had maxed out. If anything this will free up capacity on MEL-DXB-EU/Afric which is a good growth market for the MEL diaspora. DXB-LHR will be fine


The Aus/UAE bilateral was increased on the 1 Oct 16 from 137 flights per week to 151 flights per week
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sun Dec 11, 2016 5:35 am

Surprised this route is going ahead, thought it was all PR hot air when first mentioned. I don't see QF9/10 going anywhere, MEL continental Europe is a massive market, not everyone wants to go to London. Without QF9 Mel passengers won't be on QF metal for any of their journey, and QF and EK are metal neutral on DXB to LHR so I don't think they will have trouble filling that leg.

I just landed at MEL and there is a JQ A320 parked on the side of the taxiway near the 16 Threshold with a pair of airstairs to door 1R, at first I was wondering if something had gone wrong with that aircraft, but it looked Parked and closed up. Is MEL that short of handstands they are having to park aircraft on taxiways :/
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qf2220
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Sun Dec 11, 2016 6:09 am

I said last thread that I think PER is going to be used to test the legs of the 789 and see how far they can be stretched.

Lots of aircraft have started at one range and ended much longer. Look a the 777.
 
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VirginFlyer
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Mon Dec 12, 2016 2:11 am

I thought this was worthy of its own thread, but wanted to post it here too so it wasn't missed:

A second Sydney airport will become a certainty today, with Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull and Federal Infrastructure Minister Paul Fletcher signing off on the Badgerys Creek plan.

The Airport Plan was formulated after decades of debate about the Badgerys Creek site.

Stage One of Western Sydney Airport is due to be operational in the mid 2020s, with a single runway and facilities for about 10 million passengers a year.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-12-12/w ... ff/8111176

More details of the plan are at http://westernsydneyairport.gov.au

V/F
It is not for him to pride himself who loveth his own country, but rather for him who loveth the whole world. The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens. —Bahá'u'lláh
 
georgiabill
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Mon Dec 12, 2016 5:45 pm

Could the QF 789'S fly SYD to Europe without severe payload hit? In the Perth thread I asked about IST( Only used IST because TK has expressed interest in flying between IST and SYD in the past) Or will Perth be used as QF'S European gateway? If the 789 cannot fly SYD Europe non stop without a major payload hit could the 778 or 779 do it?
 
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A330freak
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Tue Dec 13, 2016 1:07 am

QF announces MEL-LAX 6 times weekly on the 789 from December 15 2017
Passengers flying from Melbourne to Los Angeles will be the first to experience the Qantas 787-9 Dreamliner when the inaugural international service takes-off on 15 December next year*.

The Qantas Dreamliner will carry 236 passengers in a three-class configuration and complement the daily Airbus A380 service already flying from Melbourne to Los Angeles. Operating six times per week, the Dreamliner will replace the 747 service that currently operates on this route alongside the A380.

http://www.qantasnewsroom.com.au/media- ... ner-route/
 
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Dan23
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Tue Dec 13, 2016 1:25 am

jrfspa320 wrote:
Probably no space for JQ/3K flights with 1 gate....this will rule out any upgrades for the international business lounge...if indeed it will stay open.

There will be 3 swing gates at T3:

Mr Joyce said that construction of the international western hub would start at the southern end of Terminal 3 in April and would be completed by December and would feature state-of-the-art art custom facilities.

“It will be a premium fit-out in line with our other terminal facilities such as Singapore and Hong Kong,” said Mr Joyce.

Head of Qantas International Gareth Evans said that the new international hub would have three “swing gate” aero-bridges and Qantas’ flights to Singapore and Auckland would also operate form the new facility.

“Up till 8am it will be domestic and then it will swing to being international until 8pm,” said Mr Evans.

https://thewest.com.au/news/wa/skys-the ... b88325272z
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AsiaTravel
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Tue Dec 13, 2016 2:12 am

Dan23 wrote:
jrfspa320 wrote:
Probably no space for JQ/3K flights with 1 gate....this will rule out any upgrades for the international business lounge...if indeed it will stay open.

There will be 3 swing gates at T3:

Mr Joyce said that construction of the international western hub would start at the southern end of Terminal 3 in April and would be completed by December and would feature state-of-the-art art custom facilities.

“It will be a premium fit-out in line with our other terminal facilities such as Singapore and Hong Kong,” said Mr Joyce.

Head of Qantas International Gareth Evans said that the new international hub would have three “swing gate” aero-bridges and Qantas’ flights to Singapore and Auckland would also operate form the new facility.

“Up till 8am it will be domestic and then it will swing to being international until 8pm,” said Mr Evans.

https://thewest.com.au/news/wa/skys-the ... b88325272z


I wonder if QF is gonna make PER-AKL daily and year round now, with the right timing it could be a good feeder to LHR flights.
 
smi0006
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Tue Dec 13, 2016 2:20 am

A330freak wrote:
QF announces MEL-LAX 6 times weekly on the 789 from December 15 2017
Passengers flying from Melbourne to Los Angeles will be the first to experience the Qantas 787-9 Dreamliner when the inaugural international service takes-off on 15 December next year*.

The Qantas Dreamliner will carry 236 passengers in a three-class configuration and complement the daily Airbus A380 service already flying from Melbourne to Los Angeles. Operating six times per week, the Dreamliner will replace the 747 service that currently operates on this route alongside the A380.

http://www.qantasnewsroom.com.au/media- ... ner-route/


Interesting, I wonder if this is in lieu of the planned AA service from LAX, and should have been to DFW? Will this free up the 744 for daily MEL-HKG? SIN is 10 weekly 330 from MEL too?

I wonder once they have the frames if this was to go daily would it pick up the JFK tag from BNE?
Last edited by smi0006 on Tue Dec 13, 2016 2:28 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
log0008
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Tue Dec 13, 2016 2:22 am

Yes it will free up the 744 for daily MEL-HKG.
 
a7ala
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Tue Dec 13, 2016 2:25 am

AsiaTravel wrote:
I wonder if QF is gonna make PER-AKL daily and year round now, with the right timing it could be a good feeder to LHR flights.


I would have thought PER-WLG would be a better option if an aircraft can do it. There are plenty of 1-stop options between AKL and LHR, but a service via PER would be the only option for a 1-stop while the runway at WLG is short?
 
IndianicWorld
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Tue Dec 13, 2016 2:49 am

Qantas' first route as always going to go on an existing route as per the airlines statements.

The AA talk certainly has been interesting and may or may not eventuate in future, but I do hope that Melbourne-Dallas can be launched. Making such a move certainly will add choice and reduce the LAX focus that is currently experienced in the non-stop Melbourne-North America market.
 
jrfspa320
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Tue Dec 13, 2016 2:56 am

3 swing gates! Well that would certainly create enough room for JQ/3K to move too. I wonder if it will be gates 16 & 17 plus 17A&B or could the 21 to 25 gates be rebuilt, may be easier as international arrivals could exit into T3 arrivals with other gates existing into T4...all will be revealed I guess.
 
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LionelHutz
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Tue Dec 13, 2016 3:18 am

smi0006 wrote:
A330freak wrote:
QF announces MEL-LAX 6 times weekly on the 789 from December 15 2017
Passengers flying from Melbourne to Los Angeles will be the first to experience the Qantas 787-9 Dreamliner when the inaugural international service takes-off on 15 December next year*.

The Qantas Dreamliner will carry 236 passengers in a three-class configuration and complement the daily Airbus A380 service already flying from Melbourne to Los Angeles. Operating six times per week, the Dreamliner will replace the 747 service that currently operates on this route alongside the A380.

http://www.qantasnewsroom.com.au/media- ... ner-route/


Interesting, I wonder if this is in lieu of the planned AA service from LAX, and should have been to DFW? Will this free up the 744 for daily MEL-HKG? SIN is 10 weekly 330 from MEL too?

I wonder once they have the frames if this was to go daily would it pick up the JFK tag from BNE?


Interesting announcement on the 787 for QF.

I know QF operates the 744 on MEL-HKG Friday-Sunday but I'm still not convinced everyday is the best use for the freed-up 744..
I believe it generally warrants the 744 on Friday-Sunday, but I question whether you would get the consistent load factors to overcome the operating expense of a 744 vs the A330?
Also with the number of low cost Chinese airlines flying into MEL, and the government uncapping of Chinese flights, I see more pressure on this route emerging.
There was an interesting article on Bloomberg today regarding Chinese airlines https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... l-carriers

The 787 cabin and capacity would be quite attractive on LAX-JFK IMO, but you're looking at a round-trip of about 48 hours, which would realistically require to go to 3 aircraft for daily operation.
 
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A330freak
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Tue Dec 13, 2016 3:30 am

log0008 wrote:
Another announcement possible this soon:

QR to launch A380 on MEL-DOH in mid 2017.

Now being reported by AUSBT


Qantas partner Qatar Airways will upgrade its daily Melbourne-Doha flights to its flagship Airbus A380 aircraft from June 30 2017.


http://www.ausbt.com.au/qatar-airways-p ... -melbourne
 
Qantas16
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Tue Dec 13, 2016 3:45 am

a7ala wrote:
AsiaTravel wrote:
I wonder if QF is gonna make PER-AKL daily and year round now, with the right timing it could be a good feeder to LHR flights.


I would have thought PER-WLG would be a better option if an aircraft can do it. There are plenty of 1-stop options between AKL and LHR, but a service via PER would be the only option for a 1-stop while the runway at WLG is short?


Sure, but the LHR-WLG is significantly smaller than LHR-AKL. Just because it would be the only 1-stop option, doesn't make it profitable! Not withstanding that the market between PER-WLG is likely also very small (relative) and would require an A332 for ~16 hours everyday. It's not going to happen. With an A321LR in the future... anything's possible, but I'd see it being much more likely operated by NZ than QF.
 
smi0006
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Tue Dec 13, 2016 3:54 am

LionelHutz wrote:
smi0006 wrote:
A330freak wrote:
QF announces MEL-LAX 6 times weekly on the 789 from December 15 2017

http://www.qantasnewsroom.com.au/media- ... ner-route/


Interesting, I wonder if this is in lieu of the planned AA service from LAX, and should have been to DFW? Will this free up the 744 for daily MEL-HKG? SIN is 10 weekly 330 from MEL too?

I wonder once they have the frames if this was to go daily would it pick up the JFK tag from BNE?


Interesting announcement on the 787 for QF.

I know QF operates the 744 on MEL-HKG Friday-Sunday but I'm still not convinced everyday is the best use for the freed-up 744..
I believe it generally warrants the 744 on Friday-Sunday, but I question whether you would get the consistent load factors to overcome the operating expense of a 744 vs the A330?
Also with the number of low cost Chinese airlines flying into MEL, and the government uncapping of Chinese flights, I see more pressure on this route emerging.
There was an interesting article on Bloomberg today regarding Chinese airlines https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... l-carriers

The 787 cabin and capacity would be quite attractive on LAX-JFK IMO, but you're looking at a round-trip of about 48 hours, which would realistically require to go to 3 aircraft for daily operation.


By moving the 744 it's a fair amount of freight capacity - and may also allow a 330 to be freed up for MEL-PVG?

I hope we see a top up order of 789, how big is the current order, and how many will MEL-LAX 6 weekly use, and Daily PER-LHR?

Exciting news around the QR 380, a nice improvement for MEL J pax! I'm sure QF and EK are thrilled that QF will have to host their F pax in the very nice QF F lounge via Oneworld.

Should be noted with Perth, JQ/3K may not need gates. Effective stand off bays with bussing can be quick for low cost carriers. May speed up turn times.
Last edited by smi0006 on Tue Dec 13, 2016 4:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
jrfspa320
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread Part 148

Tue Dec 13, 2016 4:03 am

Dan23 wrote:
jrfspa320 wrote:
Probably no space for JQ/3K flights with 1 gate....this will rule out any upgrades for the international business lounge...if indeed it will stay open.

There will be 3 swing gates at T3:

Mr Joyce said that construction of the international western hub would start at the southern end of Terminal 3 in April and would be completed by December and would feature state-of-the-art art custom facilities.

“It will be a premium fit-out in line with our other terminal facilities such as Singapore and Hong Kong,” said Mr Joyce.

Head of Qantas International Gareth Evans said that the new international hub would have three “swing gate” aero-bridges and Qantas’ flights to Singapore and Auckland would also operate form the new facility.

“Up till 8am it will be domestic and then it will swing to being international until 8pm,” said Mr Evans.

https://thewest.com.au/news/wa/skys-the ... b88325272z


8am-8pm is a significant amount of time....which leads me to think it will be a morning departure to London, based of current QF Intl departure times of 12pm and 4pm to SIN and 6pm to AKL. Also this means jetstar will stay in T1 based on those timings...
Not sure how these gates work with arrivals as both Singapore flights arrive outside this time

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