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LAXintl
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ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Tue Jan 17, 2017 3:31 pm

American Airlines has been named the recipient of the 2017 ATW Airline of the Year, taking the top honor of the 43nd annual ATW Airline Industry Achievement Awards.

American Airlines was selected by ATW’s editorial board in recognition achievements by American’s this past year.

The integration of American and US Airways was practically flawless despite it being the largest, most complex airline merger in history, editors noted.
Throughout the integration process, American has maintained a close eye on delivering profitability and shareholder return while also investing more than $3 billion in new customer products. American is also spending billions more to upgrade its fleet with hundreds of new aircraft.

“The creation of the ‘New American’ has been a remarkable journey for employees, customers and investors. American Airlines has never been in better shape to deliver more to all of its stakeholders and that is because of the leadership skills of American’s executive team and the dedication and hard work of its employees around the world,” ATW editor-in-chief Karen Walker said.

http://atwonline.com/daily-news/america ... rline-year

=

Congrats AA and its employees
:champagne:
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
DLPMMM
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Tue Jan 17, 2017 3:37 pm

It is interesting to look at the different ratings airlines get when measured against different benchmarks.

Just yesterday we had the Wall Street Journal's ratings of USA airlines which placed AA dead last.

That said, AA has been stepping up their hard product and soft product game, and has done a very good job at merger integration so far.

The proof of strategy and competence in execution will only be truly seen in the long term results for all the airlines.

Congrats AA.
 
commavia
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Tue Jan 17, 2017 3:54 pm

Congratulations, indeed.

It's pretty obvious that AA still has major work to do - in several areas including operational reliability and resiliency, and brand and product consistency. But I also think it's pretty hard to argue that - as the ATW Editorial Board stated - AA's merger integration thus far has been pretty much flawless, both in terms of operational and IT integration/cutover, and effect on the financial performance of the company. That alone is a monumental achievement.

And congrats to AA employees on the two free positive space tickets - that is definitely a very nice, and very meaningful, thank you to airline employees. :)
 
ILNFlyer
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Tue Jan 17, 2017 4:02 pm

You gotta be kidding me.
 
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chepos
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Tue Jan 17, 2017 4:05 pm

My favorite thing is the two roundtrip space positive tickets.
Fly the Flag!!!!
 
flyguy84
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Tue Jan 17, 2017 4:41 pm

So they are last (in the US) according to the WSJ which was based off of tangible metrics, but ATW just decides to name them the airline of the year (worldwide) just because. lol... what a joke.
SFO
 
Prost
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Tue Jan 17, 2017 6:19 pm

Both make sense: the WSJ ranked AA last based upon certain metrics, yet ATW named AA airline of the year for pulling off a difficult merger relatively flawlessly.

You can argue that the performance metrics the WSJ uses show that AA didn't pull off the merger as effortlessly as ATW seems to feel, but the two ranking are not mutually exclusive.
 
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hispanola
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Tue Jan 17, 2017 6:27 pm

Congratulations to American Airlines! :D They deserve it after all of the improvements that they've made and for (nearly) flawlessly completing one of the most complex mergers in history. Haters gonna hate.
✈️
 
uberflieger
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Tue Jan 17, 2017 6:31 pm

flyguy84 wrote:
ATW just decides to name them the airline of the year (worldwide) just because

ATW didn't 'just decide' and you are all too aware of the reasons, but maybe a little jealous? ;)

Creating the world's largest and full service airline by merging a run into the ground legacy and a pseudo LCC with a bad reputation, and doing it as flawlessly as Parker & team have been, most certainly is deserving of recognition. Congratulations to my hometown airline! :trophy:
 
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william
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Tue Jan 17, 2017 6:33 pm

I think AA has won this before..........When Crandall was CEO and AA was the innovator with SABRE and new Frequent Flyer program.
 
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piedmontf284000
Posts: 468
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Tue Jan 17, 2017 6:34 pm

Here are the past ATW Award winners...AA should feel pretty good about this award.

2015 Southwest Airlines
2014 Delta Air Lines
2013 All Nippon Airways
2012 Air New Zealand
2011 Emirates
2010 Air New Zealand
2009 Asiana
2008 Singapore
2007 ANA
2006 Cathay Pacific
2005 Air France/KLM
2004 Qantas
2003 Southwest
2002 Japan Airlines
2001 Continental
2000 Lufthansa
1998 Delta Air Lines
1997 KLM/Northwest
1996 Continental
1995 Qantas
1994 Lufthansa
1993 20 years of excellence awards
1992 British Airways
1991 Southwest
1990 Alaska
1989 Singapore
1988 American
1987 Cathay
1986 British Airways
1985 KLM
1984 Piedmont
1983 SAS
1982 Lufthansa
1981 American
1980 Japan Airlines
1979 Republic
1978 Swissair
1977 Delta Air Lines
1976 Air France, British Airways
1975 Pan American
1974 United
 
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DolphinAir747
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Tue Jan 17, 2017 7:46 pm

chepos wrote:
My favorite thing is the two roundtrip space positive tickets.


Do all employees get that every year?
 
9w748capt
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Tue Jan 17, 2017 7:50 pm

All this when AAdvantage is as worthless a program as it's ever been.
 
wn676
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Tue Jan 17, 2017 7:51 pm

DolphinAir747 wrote:
chepos wrote:
My favorite thing is the two roundtrip space positive tickets.


Do all employees get that every year?


No, they don't. Positive space is rarely handed out like this, which makes it kind of a big deal.
Tiny, unreadable text leaves ample room for interpretation.
 
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KTPAFlyer
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Tue Jan 17, 2017 8:18 pm

Every airline has its share of good and bad:

Delta: Excellent operation, well-run airline, foward thinking management, invests in ground and cabin product.

FF Program is nothing to brag about, TPAC network requires a lot of work, holdout on 77W and 787.

American: Expanding route network, aggressive fleet renewal program, FF not completely worthless yet.

Inconsistent cabin product, high fares, IIRROPS is a weakness, questionable decisions by management.

United: Hands down best overall network (hub strategy, very strong TPAC network, only carrier with India, Singapore nonstops), invests in future fleet, excellent management (Oscar Munoz, Scott Kirby), innovative on hard product with Polaris, pricing with basic economy.
 
flyguy84
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Tue Jan 17, 2017 10:28 pm

uberflieger wrote:
flyguy84 wrote:
ATW just decides to name them the airline of the year (worldwide) just because

ATW didn't 'just decide' and you are all too aware of the reasons, but maybe a little jealous? ;)

Creating the world's largest and full service airline by merging a run into the ground legacy and a pseudo LCC with a bad reputation, and doing it as flawlessly as Parker & team have been, most certainly is deserving of recognition. Congratulations to my hometown airline! :trophy:


Yeah it doesn't matter that the completion factor and on-time rate is abysmal.
SFO
 
pa747sp
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Tue Jan 17, 2017 11:01 pm

piedmontf284000 wrote:
Here are the past ATW Award winners...AA should feel pretty good about this award.

2015 Southwest Airlines
2014 Delta Air Lines
2013 All Nippon Airways
2012 Air New Zealand
2011 Emirates
2010 Air New Zealand
2009 Asiana
2008 Singapore
2007 ANA
2006 Cathay Pacific
2005 Air France/KLM
2004 Qantas
2003 Southwest
2002 Japan Airlines
2001 Continental
2000 Lufthansa
1998 Delta Air Lines
1997 KLM/Northwest
1996 Continental
1995 Qantas
1994 Lufthansa
1993 20 years of excellence awards
1992 British Airways
1991 Southwest
1990 Alaska
1989 Singapore
1988 American
1987 Cathay
1986 British Airways
1985 KLM
1984 Piedmont
1983 SAS
1982 Lufthansa
1981 American
1980 Japan Airlines
1979 Republic
1978 Swissair
1977 Delta Air Lines
1976 Air France, British Airways
1975 Pan American
1974 United


The depressing thing about the airline industry...

Pan Am - gone
Republic - gone
Swissair - gone
Piedmont - gone
Continental - gone
Northwest - gone
And many of the rest have been bankrupt, or close to it.
Nothing seems as good since the VC10.
 
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11725Flyer
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Wed Jan 18, 2017 12:06 am

9w748capt wrote:
All this when AAdvantage is as worthless a program as it's ever been.


DisAAdvantage
 
FWAERJ
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Wed Jan 18, 2017 12:07 am

Missing from the list: Etihad was the 2016 ATW Airline of the Year.

But still, congrAAtulations to AA. It takes guts to smoothly pull off a merger on the level AA/US was. And now that AA has gotten the operations side under control, they're now focusing on product - many of the longest DFW ERJ routes are moving to CR9s or E175s. In the case of my home airport FWA, they were the first to have non-seasonal 70-seat RJ service on DFW, and is following it up with CLT less than six months later. And midsize L-AA cities like CVG and CMH that were all Eagle ERJs for eons are now getting larger planes - even mainline in some cases.

piedmontf284000 wrote:
Here are the past ATW Award winners...AA should feel pretty good about this award.

2015 Southwest Airlines
2014 Delta Air Lines
2013 All Nippon Airways
2012 Air New Zealand
2011 Emirates
2010 Air New Zealand
2009 Asiana
2008 Singapore
2007 ANA
2006 Cathay Pacific
2005 Air France/KLM
2004 Qantas
2003 Southwest
2002 Japan Airlines
2001 Continental
2000 Lufthansa
1998 Delta Air Lines
1997 KLM/Northwest
1996 Continental
1995 Qantas
1994 Lufthansa
1993 20 years of excellence awards
1992 British Airways
1991 Southwest
1990 Alaska
1989 Singapore
1988 American
1987 Cathay
1986 British Airways
1985 KLM
1984 Piedmont
1983 SAS
1982 Lufthansa
1981 American
1980 Japan Airlines
1979 Republic
1978 Swissair
1977 Delta Air Lines
1976 Air France, British Airways
1975 Pan American
1974 United
B721/722/731/732/733/735/73G/738/739/742/752/753/762/763, A300/319/320, DC-9/10, MD-82/83/88/90, ERJ-140/145, CRJ-200/700, Q200, SF340, AS350
 
777PHX
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Wed Jan 18, 2017 12:13 am

9w748capt wrote:
All this when AAdvantage is as worthless a program as it's ever been.


And it's still better than Skypesos.
 
9w748capt
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Wed Jan 18, 2017 12:42 am

777PHX wrote:
9w748capt wrote:
All this when AAdvantage is as worthless a program as it's ever been.


And it's still better than Skypesos.


You sure about that? AA award availability is absolutely abysmal these days. The worst that I can ever remember. Here's something to munch on before dinner: http://mommypoints.boardingarea.com/201 ... age-miles/
 
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11725Flyer
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Wed Jan 18, 2017 1:05 am

777PHX wrote:
9w748capt wrote:
All this when AAdvantage is as worthless a program as it's ever been.


And it's still better than Skypesos.


Doubtful. I recently checked out a TPA-LAS-TPA itinerary and DisAAdvantage was far worse.
 
grbauc
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Wed Jan 18, 2017 1:47 am

9w748capt wrote:
All this when AAdvantage is as worthless a program as it's ever been.


Maybe to you not to me. Its just not the same has it was. Better for some not so for others.
 
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Boeing778X
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Wed Jan 18, 2017 1:51 am

Got a space positive round trip ticket as a result! Corporate must be very happy for this award!
United Airlines: $#!ttin' On Everyone Since 1931
 
grbauc
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Wed Jan 18, 2017 1:54 am

9w748capt wrote:
777PHX wrote:
9w748capt wrote:
All this when AAdvantage is as worthless a program as it's ever been.


And it's still better than Skypesos.


You sure about that? AA award availability is absolutely abysmal these days. The worst that I can ever remember. Here's something to munch on before dinner: http://mommypoints.boardingarea.com/201 ... age-miles/


Its all subjective i have AA and DL miles and I was Able to Get a Cathay/AA award LAX to DPS and a LAX To LHR/AMS on AA but Not with my DL miles. I feel the frustration on using miles I try and burn them has I fly them. But going off that article I had the opposite experience.
 
grbauc
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Wed Jan 18, 2017 2:00 am

Boeing778X wrote:
Got a space positive round trip ticket as a result! Corporate must be very happy for this award!

congrats
 
777PHX
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Wed Jan 18, 2017 2:00 am

9w748capt wrote:
777PHX wrote:
9w748capt wrote:
All this when AAdvantage is as worthless a program as it's ever been.


And it's still better than Skypesos.


You sure about that? AA award availability is absolutely abysmal these days. The worst that I can ever remember. Here's something to munch on before dinner: http://mommypoints.boardingarea.com/201 ... age-miles/



Because some housewife with a blog is clearly the ultimate authority on reward plan value...
 
pa747sp
Posts: 230
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Wed Jan 18, 2017 2:04 am

777PHX wrote:
9w748capt wrote:
777PHX wrote:

And it's still better than Skypesos.


You sure about that? AA award availability is absolutely abysmal these days. The worst that I can ever remember. Here's something to munch on before dinner: http://mommypoints.boardingarea.com/201 ... age-miles/



Because some housewife with a blog is clearly the ultimate authority on reward plan value...


Why wouldn't she be? Maybe she flies a lot, or even is just very savvy and does lots of research.
Nothing seems as good since the VC10.
 
777PHX
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Wed Jan 18, 2017 2:50 am

pa747sp wrote:
777PHX wrote:
9w748capt wrote:

You sure about that? AA award availability is absolutely abysmal these days. The worst that I can ever remember. Here's something to munch on before dinner: http://mommypoints.boardingarea.com/201 ... age-miles/



Because some housewife with a blog is clearly the ultimate authority on reward plan value...


Why wouldn't she be? Maybe she flies a lot, or even is just very savvy and does lots of research.


Because any idiot with internet access can write a blog, that doesn't make them an educated source as to what they speak.
 
krisair747
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Wed Jan 18, 2017 3:23 am

Its nice to see that AA is also thanking, and/or recognizing, the "other" 7 Regional Carriers that make up the American Family....oh wait....they didn't. Classy.
Open your heart and push the limits
 
JAAlbert
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Wed Jan 18, 2017 5:05 am

What is a space positive ticket? Did I miss this in the article?
 
alasizon
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Wed Jan 18, 2017 5:33 am

JAAlbert wrote:
What is a space positive ticket? Did I miss this in the article?


Each AA, PSA, Piedmont, Envoy and AA Credit Union employee was given two positive space round trips as a thank you for the hard work required to pull of the merger that earned the award. A positive space ticket guarantees the employee a seat on the plane just as if they were a revenue passenger and puts them ahead of all other non-revs when it comes to upgrading to the premium cabin(s). Basically, its just like a paid ticket except you aren't entitled to any compensation if a flight cancels, is delayed, etc.
Airport (noun) - A construction site which airplanes tend to frequent
 
737max8
Posts: 640
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Wed Jan 18, 2017 6:08 am

alasizon wrote:
JAAlbert wrote:
What is a space positive ticket? Did I miss this in the article?


Each AA, PSA, Piedmont, Envoy and AA Credit Union employee was given two positive space round trips as a thank you for the hard work required to pull of the merger that earned the award. A positive space ticket guarantees the employee a seat on the plane just as if they were a revenue passenger and puts them ahead of all other non-revs when it comes to upgrading to the premium cabin(s). Basically, its just like a paid ticket except you aren't entitled to any compensation if a flight cancels, is delayed, etc.


I'm not 100% certain, but I do believe positive space riders may not be able to fly on the plane if it is oversold. It's not quite guaranteed. (but to be fair to your point, so could a revenue passenger, but not before a positive space rider). I believe it does take your seat out of inventory though, so if all the math works out you should usually always be fine :)
The thoughts and opinions expressed in my comments do not represent that of any airline or affiliate.
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alasizon
Posts: 2602
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2007 8:57 pm

Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Wed Jan 18, 2017 6:18 am

737max8 wrote:
alasizon wrote:
JAAlbert wrote:
What is a space positive ticket? Did I miss this in the article?


Each AA, PSA, Piedmont, Envoy and AA Credit Union employee was given two positive space round trips as a thank you for the hard work required to pull of the merger that earned the award. A positive space ticket guarantees the employee a seat on the plane just as if they were a revenue passenger and puts them ahead of all other non-revs when it comes to upgrading to the premium cabin(s). Basically, its just like a paid ticket except you aren't entitled to any compensation if a flight cancels, is delayed, etc.


I'm not 100% certain, but I do believe positive space riders may not be able to fly on the plane if it is oversold. It's not quite guaranteed. (but to be fair to your point, so could a revenue passenger, but not before a positive space rider). I believe it does take your seat out of inventory though, so if all the math works out you should usually always be fine :)


Since it is required that you book 21 days in advance, I believe that should solve all those issues.
Airport (noun) - A construction site which airplanes tend to frequent
 
737max8
Posts: 640
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Wed Jan 18, 2017 6:22 am

alasizon wrote:
737max8 wrote:
alasizon wrote:

Each AA, PSA, Piedmont, Envoy and AA Credit Union employee was given two positive space round trips as a thank you for the hard work required to pull of the merger that earned the award. A positive space ticket guarantees the employee a seat on the plane just as if they were a revenue passenger and puts them ahead of all other non-revs when it comes to upgrading to the premium cabin(s). Basically, its just like a paid ticket except you aren't entitled to any compensation if a flight cancels, is delayed, etc.


I'm not 100% certain, but I do believe positive space riders may not be able to fly on the plane if it is oversold. It's not quite guaranteed. (but to be fair to your point, so could a revenue passenger, but not before a positive space rider). I believe it does take your seat out of inventory though, so if all the math works out you should usually always be fine :)


Since it is required that you book 21 days in advance, I believe that should solve all those issues.


What does a 21 day window have to do with a flight being oversold or not? If it is, and everyone shows up, someone has to be left behind. And it surely won't be a revenue passenger that has to be compensated over a PS rider.
The thoughts and opinions expressed in my comments do not represent that of any airline or affiliate.
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alasizon
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Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2007 8:57 pm

Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Wed Jan 18, 2017 6:40 am

737max8 wrote:
alasizon wrote:
737max8 wrote:

I'm not 100% certain, but I do believe positive space riders may not be able to fly on the plane if it is oversold. It's not quite guaranteed. (but to be fair to your point, so could a revenue passenger, but not before a positive space rider). I believe it does take your seat out of inventory though, so if all the math works out you should usually always be fine :)


Since it is required that you book 21 days in advance, I believe that should solve all those issues.


What does a 21 day window have to do with a flight being oversold or not? If it is, and everyone shows up, someone has to be left behind. And it surely won't be a revenue passenger that has to be compensated over a PS rider.


In fact, it actually will be if the positive space person is confirmed on that flight. I know it sounds odd, but positive space folks are counted as a seat sold. The 21 day window ensures it is not the positive space person that oversells the flight but rather revenue passengers.

I personally have bumped a revenue passenger off a flight before that was weight restricted and although if I were a revenue pax, I would have been denied boarding, but since I was positive space on company business, the next revenue passenger was denied instead.
Airport (noun) - A construction site which airplanes tend to frequent
 
WA707atMSP
Posts: 1910
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Wed Jan 18, 2017 12:57 pm

One interesting coincidence about the ATW award: Every time AA has won Airline of the Year, Air Transport World has published a story about how United is under achieving.

The January, 1982 issue of Air Transport World had an article about how AA was airline of the year because, thanks to Al Casey's leadership, AA had made a big turn around by restructuring its route system and fleet very aggressively since deregulation. The same magazine had an article about how United was floundering, and had yet to come up with a way to make money in a deregulated airline industry.

The January, 1989 issue of Air Transport World had an article about how AA was airline of the year because, under Robert Crandall, American had become the most profitable and innovative airline of the 1980s. The next month, Air Transport World had an article about how UA was recovering from the Allegis debacle, and was trying to catch up with AA and DL.

The December, 2016 / January 2017 issue of Air Transport World had an article about how UA is struggling to capitalize on the UA/CO merger's potential. Sure enough, the February, 2017 issue of ATW says that American has made their merger achieve its potential far quicker than UA did.
 
737max8
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Wed Jan 18, 2017 2:53 pm

alasizon wrote:
737max8 wrote:
alasizon wrote:

Since it is required that you book 21 days in advance, I believe that should solve all those issues.


What does a 21 day window have to do with a flight being oversold or not? If it is, and everyone shows up, someone has to be left behind. And it surely won't be a revenue passenger that has to be compensated over a PS rider.


In fact, it actually will be if the positive space person is confirmed on that flight. I know it sounds odd, but positive space folks are counted as a seat sold. The 21 day window ensures it is not the positive space person that oversells the flight but rather revenue passengers.

I personally have bumped a revenue passenger off a flight before that was weight restricted and although if I were a revenue pax, I would have been denied boarding, but since I was positive space on company business, the next revenue passenger was denied instead.


Thanks for the info, perhaps different airlines have different meanings of Positive Space. What you described sounds more like a Must Ride. I can't imagine at every airline a revenue pax would be pulled before nonrev on Positive Space (and for business travel, Must Ride would be given, not Pos Space). It's all so interesting! But very cool of AA to give those to their employees. Well done!
The thoughts and opinions expressed in my comments do not represent that of any airline or affiliate.
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diverdave
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Wed Jan 18, 2017 4:05 pm

pa747sp wrote:
777PHX wrote:
9w748capt wrote:

You sure about that? AA award availability is absolutely abysmal these days. The worst that I can ever remember. Here's something to munch on before dinner: http://mommypoints.boardingarea.com/201 ... age-miles/



Because some housewife with a blog is clearly the ultimate authority on reward plan value...


Why wouldn't she be? Maybe she flies a lot, or even is just very savvy and does lots of research.


Mommypoints is a well respected blog within the frequent flier community.

David
 
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KTPAFlyer
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Thu Jan 19, 2017 1:52 am

Image
 
LawAndOrder
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Thu Jan 19, 2017 2:37 am

KTPAFlyer wrote:
Image


Why is this hysterical to me? Congrats I guess, funny that Southwest won last year or so doesn't seem like they bragged much about it. I remember reading it I actually have the publication. Funny that they offered two positive space tickets didn't Delta do that recently.....great me to moment, United your next!
 
9w748capt
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Thu Jan 19, 2017 3:03 am

777PHX wrote:
9w748capt wrote:
777PHX wrote:

And it's still better than Skypesos.


You sure about that? AA award availability is absolutely abysmal these days. The worst that I can ever remember. Here's something to munch on before dinner: http://mommypoints.boardingarea.com/201 ... age-miles/



Because some housewife with a blog is clearly the ultimate authority on reward plan value...


So you can't actually dispute the content of her post, right? You'd rather pick on her gender. Classy.
 
pa747sp
Posts: 230
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Thu Jan 19, 2017 3:43 am

777PHX wrote:
pa747sp wrote:
777PHX wrote:


Because some housewife with a blog is clearly the ultimate authority on reward plan value...


Why wouldn't she be? Maybe she flies a lot, or even is just very savvy and does lots of research.


Because any idiot with internet access can write a blog, that doesn't make them an educated source as to what they speak.



True, but you didn't say 'idiot', you said 'housewife'. In the context of your sentence she is unqualified because she is a housewife. That, right there, is sexism.
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EA CO AS
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Thu Jan 19, 2017 6:11 am

pa747sp wrote:
777PHX wrote:
pa747sp wrote:

Why wouldn't she be? Maybe she flies a lot, or even is just very savvy and does lots of research.


Because any idiot with internet access can write a blog, that doesn't make them an educated source as to what they speak.



True, but you didn't say 'idiot', you said 'housewife'. In the context of your sentence she is unqualified because she is a housewife. That, right there, is sexism.


Oh come on. Even "idiots" can fly pretty frequently on company business, giving them substantially more credibility when speaking about FF programs than a stay-at-home parent. Crying "SEXIST!" is unwarranted here.
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
MSPNWA
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Thu Jan 19, 2017 6:17 am

WA707atMSP wrote:
The December, 2016 / January 2017 issue of Air Transport World had an article about how UA is struggling to capitalize on the UA/CO merger's potential. Sure enough, the February, 2017 issue of ATW says that American has made their merger achieve its potential far quicker than UA did.


The anti-UA bias is too obvious. If we're just comparing the two, there's no objective reason to say AA should win the award this year versus UA. AA is a mess right now. Naming them airline of the year is ridiculous.
 
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Thu Jan 19, 2017 10:32 am

MSPNWA wrote:
WA707atMSP wrote:
The December, 2016 / January 2017 issue of Air Transport World had an article about how UA is struggling to capitalize on the UA/CO merger's potential. Sure enough, the February, 2017 issue of ATW says that American has made their merger achieve its potential far quicker than UA did.


The anti-UA bias is too obvious. If we're just comparing the two, there's no objective reason to say AA should win the award this year versus UA. AA is a mess right now. Naming them airline of the year is ridiculous.


Air Transport World is the most respected airline industry trade magazine. It's been published for 53 years, is written by professional journalists, and most definitely does NOT have any sort of bias in favor or against any airline or aircraft manufacturer.

Air Transport World's article about United includes interviews with both Oscar Munoz and Scott Kirby. Both Kirby and Munoz freely admit that UA fell behind AA and DL in recent years. Kirby says United "let the domestic system slide because it wasn't historically profitable". Kirby also discusses United's plans for basic economy, and ways United will be revising its schedule to improve connectivity at its hubs, to catch up with American. Munoz discusses how he hopes United's labor agreements will improve employee morale, which suffered from the merger and UA's bankruptcy, and how he is spending more time meeting with rank and file employees because "If we don't engage with our own people, we can't possibly engage with our customers".

I don't think even the most pro-UA people on this website would say that these comments constitute an anti-UA bias, especially because they came from UA's top two leaders.

Even the pro-AA people on this website like Commavia and MAH4546 agree that AA has unresolved problems. However, unlike UA, AA was able to complete its merger without any operational difficulties, and has moved far more quickly to exploit the synergies of the AA/US route system than UA did, and that is why AA was awarded Airline of the Year.
 
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Thu Jan 19, 2017 1:45 pm

EA CO AS wrote:
pa747sp wrote:
777PHX wrote:

Because any idiot with internet access can write a blog, that doesn't make them an educated source as to what they speak.



True, but you didn't say 'idiot', you said 'housewife'. In the context of your sentence she is unqualified because she is a housewife. That, right there, is sexism.


Oh come on. Even "idiots" can fly pretty frequently on company business, giving them substantially more credibility when speaking about FF programs than a stay-at-home parent. Crying "SEXIST!" is unwarranted here.


Oh ok - so only middle managers flying in suits would know how to maximize their frequent flyer miles, right? Not some regular ol Joe Shmoe like me (or the mommypoints blogger) who spend our own time and money figuring these things out? Good lord some of you are just pathetic.
 
pa747sp
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Fri Jan 20, 2017 4:18 am

EA CO AS wrote:
pa747sp wrote:
777PHX wrote:

Because any idiot with internet access can write a blog, that doesn't make them an educated source as to what they speak.



True, but you didn't say 'idiot', you said 'housewife'. In the context of your sentence she is unqualified because she is a housewife. That, right there, is sexism.


Oh come on. Even "idiots" can fly pretty frequently on company business, giving them substantially more credibility when speaking about FF programs than a stay-at-home parent. Crying "SEXIST!" is unwarranted here.


If it's not warranted when someone makes a sexist remark, when is it?

He didn't mention a stay-at-home parent. He said a 'housewife'. That is a gender specific term.

Quite apart from being sexist, its also not logical. In my job I deal with a lot of people who manage their partners frequent flyer accounts. They may not fly much themselves, but they know a lot about the programmes, because they spend time comparing them. I would say they have a lot more knowledge than their partners. Whatever their gender.
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Fri Jan 20, 2017 6:36 am

pa747sp wrote:
EA CO AS wrote:
pa747sp wrote:


True, but you didn't say 'idiot', you said 'housewife'. In the context of your sentence she is unqualified because she is a housewife. That, right there, is sexism.


Oh come on. Even "idiots" can fly pretty frequently on company business, giving them substantially more credibility when speaking about FF programs than a stay-at-home parent. Crying "SEXIST!" is unwarranted here.


If it's not warranted when someone makes a sexist remark, when is it?

He didn't mention a stay-at-home parent. He said a 'housewife'. That is a gender specific term.

Quite apart from being sexist, its also not logical. In my job I deal with a lot of people who manage their partners frequent flyer accounts. They may not fly much themselves, but they know a lot about the programmes, because they spend time comparing them. I would say they have a lot more knowledge than their partners. Whatever their gender.



You're trying very hard to split hairs, here. On the average, it's pretty fair to say that a typical housewife/homemaker/stay-at-home-mom/stay-at-home-parent probably doesn't have the same level of insight and credibility on speaking about frequent flier programs than others with more direct interaction with them like the typical "road warrior" business traveler does. Arguing otherwise is foolish, and trying to make hay out of the choice of word he used is unnecessary.
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
pa747sp
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Re: ATW Airline of the Year: AA

Fri Jan 20, 2017 7:27 am

EA CO AS wrote:
pa747sp wrote:
EA CO AS wrote:

Oh come on. Even "idiots" can fly pretty frequently on company business, giving them substantially more credibility when speaking about FF programs than a stay-at-home parent. Crying "SEXIST!" is unwarranted here.


If it's not warranted when someone makes a sexist remark, when is it?

He didn't mention a stay-at-home parent. He said a 'housewife'. That is a gender specific term.

Quite apart from being sexist, its also not logical. In my job I deal with a lot of people who manage their partners frequent flyer accounts. They may not fly much themselves, but they know a lot about the programmes, because they spend time comparing them. I would say they have a lot more knowledge than their partners. Whatever their gender.



You're trying very hard to split hairs, here. On the average, it's pretty fair to say that a typical housewife/homemaker/stay-at-home-mom/stay-at-home-parent probably doesn't have the same level of insight and credibility on speaking about frequent flier programs than others with more direct interaction with them like the typical "road warrior" business traveler does. Arguing otherwise is foolish, and trying to make hay out of the choice of word he used is unnecessary.


There's no splitting of hairs. His statement was clearly sexist. That you use the term 'typical housewife' is also telling. He wasn't talking about a 'typical housewife' - he was referring to one who has a blog that deals specifically with the topic. His contention was that, despite the fact that the person concerned writes on this subject, her views should not be taken seriously because she is a housewife.

He made a sexist statement about a specific person. Trying to defend it by saying it might apply to 'typical housewives' is obfuscation.
Nothing seems as good since the VC10.

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