Hello there Turkish Aviation fans,

You can find the last months thread here:
viewtopic.php?p=19329805#p19329805



Few notes to start the conversation with:
-Morgan Freeman is the new spokesperson for TK and the commercial will air during the Super Bowl on Feb 5th.
-Atlas signs a code share agreement with AF
-IST-ATL was to go from 77W to 333 this month. IIRC, due to long range and headwinds the flights can only be 80% or so full. I wonder if this the case with the MIA flights that are operated by the same type, A333.

Welcome and please continue with your news, views, pictures, rumors and good old sense of humor.
Happy flights and Safe landings to all.

As of yesterday, TK ended it's TK-46/47 service to Osaka-Kansai.

Congrats to TK's 51st city in Africa !

I know TK is diverting much traffic from historic players like AF + SN on the continent.

mercure1 wrote:

Congrats to TK's 51st city in Africa !

I think it was only few years back TK's Hamdi Topcu said the number of African destinations will go to 35 and I had a hard time believing it then.

globetrotter94 wrote:

As of yesterday, TK ended it's TK-46/47 service to Osaka-Kansai.

That's a shame. Flew it a few years ago, and had a nice TK experience.
Thanks for the new thread TK787,
Hello all, i'm new. Aviation fan, love Turkey.
I've been following the thread since the last time i visited which was the saturday after the 'coup'. I switched alliances by then, due to other factors.
Cheers!
Peter

Hello everyone.

Some random bits of news;

o Turkish Cabin Interiors has entered into distribution agreement with GA Telesis covering North America and China markets for the sale of its galleys and aircraft cabin interior products as well as all rotable galley equipment.

o Regarding the Super Bowl, TK will offer live coverage of the game broadcast onboard on February 5th.

o New TK CEO Bilal Eksi gave an interview with ATW this week reaffirming TK has no plans to cancel aircraft on order, but infact was reviewing options for additional orders as it plots its future growth plans made possible with the new airport.

o Meanwhile Temel Kotil over at Turkish Aircraft Industries says in interview with Aviation Week he sees revenues of TAI grow at 25% annually over the next 10-years. Says growth will be both organic and outside such as TAI in 2016 acquiring German component company Grunewald Stade GmbH. He says TAI looking at other engineering or manufacturing companies in Europe, US and Asia. He forecast 50% of revenue of TAI will be workload for companies like Airbus, Lockheed, Sikorsky, Lockheed and Boeing, while rest will come from the many indigenous aerospace products.

[photoid][/photoid]Here are some pictures of the 3rd airport http://i.hizliresim.com/r6kZ7a.jpg http://i.hizliresim.com/PnWPgd.jpg photo taken 22 January this year

I was doing some work and had access to detailed visitor statistics to the United States.

Turkish nations arrivals to the US have been on steady increase over the last decade.

Here are the Turkish national arrivals in the U.S. per fiscal year(Oct-Sep)

2015 - 226,665
2014 - 214,958
2013 - 192,113
2012 - 175,933
2011 - 167,767
2010 - 148.097

For more detailed info, the 2015 fiscal year arrivals were broken down in following categories.

TOTAL: 226,665
TOURISM: 177,911
STUDENTS: 31,645
WORK: 9,145
GOVT: 5,365
OTHER: 2,525
NON-CATEGORIZED: 74

Hello friends. I am from Izmir, Turkey and love TK.
I learn so many things in this thread. First of all Thank you TK787. And also LAXintl and mafaky. Thank you friends who participate in this thread.
(I just wanted to say hi)

Welcome to the thread, thanks for kind words. But I am a newby here and like yourself I have been learning from day one from our great contributors like LAXintl, Stylo, Baha, Wing, TKfan, OA260, mercure1, leftyboarder, Pilotaydin and many others over the years
And I am not talking about Civil aviation or Turkish Aviation, we learn about internet etiquette and common sense social media communication.
Thank you all.
Here is a quick question:
"TK flies to many destinations in Iraq, but I see that many flights that could possibly fly over Syria and Iraq are circling around them; over Iran or the Med.sea." So why can TK and others can fly to war zone countries but not over fly them? Thanks.

There's a very recent news in the Turkish Press that THY has (or is about to) signed a code-share agreement with an undisclosed PARAGUAY based airline. There's actually no formal announcement from TK side, the source of the information is the Ministery of Foreign Affairs (in fact the Minister, himself...).

It's not April the 1st, yet!... Anyone, with any sound and safe comments?

For those of you who can comprehend Turkish:

http://www.airlinehaber.com/thy-ortak-u ... -imzaladi/

TK787 wrote:

Welcome to the thread, thanks for kind words. But I am a newby here and like yourself I have been learning from day one from our great contributors like LAXintl, Stylo, Baha, Wing, TKfan, OA260, mercure1, leftyboarder, Pilotaydin and many others over the years
And I am not talking about Civil aviation or Turkish Aviation, we learn about internet etiquette and common sense social media communication.
Thank you all.
Here is a quick question:
"TK flies to many destinations in Iraq, but I see that many flights that could possibly fly over Syria and Iraq are circling around them; over Iran or the Med.sea." So why can TK and others can fly to war zone countries but not over fly them? Thanks.

Wow, thank you for mentioning me in there

By the way, the Minister of Transport (among other things) mentioned that the first runway at new IST (as there is no code yet) is complete, when in reality this doesn't seem like true. Also, he mentions that the construction realization rate is 42%, which means that more than half of construction remains to be done. We have - supposedly - 1 year left till opening. I don't care if they make a fool of themselves by opening it early but I am worried about safety and security in an airport opening before completion.

PARAGUAY, who knows
TK in Africa comes to mind. TK used to fly to 17 destinations in Africa and then said it would double that number by ordering the 737-900s. Now, 51 destinations. I have a feeling TK is really trying hard to tap into the South American market but it is not that easy with NO historical/cultural/religious ties and no simple solutions in terms of equipment.

TK787 wrote:

.

Thanks for a new thread and the mention. I called A3 for a redemption and was offered MIA-IST-LHR in J. Thinking of going for it but just hope they dont cut it by December.

By the way, the Minister of Transport (among other things) mentioned that the first runway at new IST (as there is no code yet) is complete, when in reality this doesn't seem like true. Also, he mentions that the construction realization rate is 42%, which means that more than half of construction remains to be done. We have - supposedly - 1 year left till opening. I don't care if they make a fool of themselves by opening it early but I am worried about safety and security in an airport opening before completion.

I am so full on this subject, that I can write a five page (and mostly biased) essay on this. I don't want to do that, for the moment. What I can only say now is the Minister's comments (those for the New Airport) are mostly typical politician BS, far away from technical and operational realities.

mafaky wrote:

There's a very recent news in the Turkish Press that THY has (or is about to) signed a code-share agreement with an undisclosed PARAGUAY based airline. There's actually no formal announcement from TK side, the source of the information is the Ministery of Foreign Affairs (in fact the Minister, himself...).

It's not April the 1st, yet!... Anyone, with any sound and safe comments?

For those of you who can comprehend Turkish:

http://www.airlinehaber.com/thy-ortak-u ... -imzaladi/

That sounds absolutely insane. The only Paraguayan airline (apart from LATAM Paraguay, a subsidiary of LATAM) that I know of is Amaszonas Paraguay, a subsidiary of the Bolivian regional airline Amaszonas. Amaszonas Paraguay has exactly one (1) aircraft in its fleet, a CRJ-200, and the only international destinations flown from ASU are MVD (Montevideo, Uruguay) and IQQ (Iquique, Chile), so totally disconnected from the current (and any immediate future) TK network. May I suggest that TK get code-share agreements in place with AV and CM instead, from their respective quite impressive hubs at BOG and PTY? That would actually make sense. Lots of sense.

djxxa wrote:

globetrotter94 wrote:

As of yesterday, TK ended it's TK-46/47 service to Osaka-Kansai.

That's a shame. Flew it a few years ago, and had a nice TK experience.
Thanks for the new thread TK787,
Hello all, i'm new. Aviation fan, love Turkey.
I've been following the thread since the last time i visited which was the saturday after the 'coup'. I switched alliances by then, due to other factors.
Cheers!
Peter

Why did Turkish Airlines end flights to Osaka? It's been part of there network for a long time, maybe it wasn't profitable?

How is TK now preforming in the US? have the loads improved? I am interested in Miami, Atlanta, and Houston. Which is the best preforming of the three now?

miaintl wrote:

How is TK now preforming in the US? have the loads improved? I am interested in Miami, Atlanta, and Houston. Which is the best preforming of the three now?

I'm sure Miami is doing good. Not related to how well the route is doing, I'm sure a lot of Jewish and Israeli passengers are flying MIA-IST-TLV and TLV-IST-MIA as direct flights between MIA and TLV do not exist.

Atlanta will be downgraded from a 77W to A333, but the route seems to be doing well at the moment.

Houston has been flown for quite a while now, and other than frequency reductions it must be doing well at the moment.

NichCage wrote:

Why did Turkish Airlines end flights to Osaka? It's been part of there network for a long time, maybe it wasn't profitable?

Same reason many longhaul carriers walked away from Osaka. This is the 2nd time KIX was dropped by TK.

NichCage wrote:

I'm sure Miami is doing good. Not related to how well the route is doing, I'm sure a lot of Jewish and Israeli passengers are flying MIA-IST-TLV and TLV-IST-MIA as direct flights between MIA and TLV do not exist.

Atlanta will be downgraded from a 77W to A333, but the route seems to be doing well at the moment.

Houston has been flown for quite a while now, and other than frequency reductions it must be doing well at the moment.

Are you speaking with facts or all personal conjecture?

Yes MIA must be doing so well its being reduced to 4x weekly periods over next two months..

Greetings from DXB and thanks to TK787 for another thread.

I came to DXB via ESB-DOH-DXB routing on QR. I now see that QR up-gauged ESB-DOH to A321 from A320 and the plane was 100% full both on J & Y. I think soon we will see this route getting a wide body. This is no surprise as ESB-DOH-DXB routing is a peaceful total pleasure in comparison to IST-DXB experience on TK or EK. Looks like QR is becoming the east direction replica of LH for ESB passengers looking for alternative.

I think Jan2017 DHMI statistics, due to be published in few days, will be a very important early indication for how things will be in 2017. Lets hope for a good result.

TK105 wrote:

Greetings from DXB and thanks to TK787 for another thread.

I came to DXB via ESB-DOH-DXB routing on QR. I now see that QR up-gauged ESB-DOH to A321 from A320 and the plane was 100% full both on J & Y. I think soon we will see this route getting a wide body. This is no surprise as ESB-DOH-DXB routing is a peaceful total pleasure in comparison to IST-DXB experience on TK or EK. Looks like QR is becoming the east direction replica of LH for ESB passengers looking for alternative.

I think Jan2017 DHMI statistics, due to be published in few days, will be a very important early indication for how things will be in 2017. Lets hope for a good result.

Why doesn't an airline like FlyDubai fly between ESB and DXB? Is there even a market between ESB and DXB? Also, why is Qatar Airways flying to ESB for? What market do they serve at ESB?

Yes MIA must be doing so well its being reduced to 4x weekly periods over next two months.. [/quote]

MIA is only going to 4x weekly for two weeks. It will be back to 5x weekly in March and then daily in June.

NichCage wrote:

Why doesn't an airline like FlyDubai fly between ESB and DXB?

Because of bilaterals. Turkey refuses to open rest of the Turkish Market to UAE other than IST and SAW.

Is there even a market between ESB and DXB?

We do not know exact figures but I guess even only O&D traffic between ESB-DXB can sustain a daily NB flight.

Also, why is Qatar Airways flying to ESB for?

Because Qatar and Turkish Government on duty have good relations and Turkish government favors QR. By this, QR gets a reasonable connecting traffic.

What market do they serve at ESB?

Iran, India, Pakistan, Thailand, Australia and of course the Gulf. I think quite a percentage of the passengers travel to Australia.

leftyboarder wrote:

By the way, the Minister of Transport (among other things) mentioned that the first runway at new IST (as there is no code yet) is complete, when in reality this doesn't seem like true..

Actually I think the first runway is indeed done, or very close to it.
A European engineering firm is scheduled to audit and certify it in March. They will audit runway and help categorize things like its weight bearing capability, its slope, magnetic heading etc. This is required before CAA can publish the data.

LAXintl wrote:

Actually I think the first runway is indeed done, or very close to it.
A European engineering firm is scheduled to audit and certify it in March. They will audit runway and help categorize things like its weight bearing capability, its slope, magnetic heading etc. This is required before CAA can publish the data.

But, is this kind of auditing the only action necessary and sufficient for the certification of the runway? Or is this only the certification that engineering has been done properly and the data you have mentioned can go on official records? I guess after this the runway has to be calibrated and tested by the SHGM (possibly not alone but under international supervision), then comes the calibration and testing for ILS and other equipment that should be installed in the meantime. These latter should be the responsibility of SHGM [the CAA of Turkish State], not IGA's. The runway markings have to be done and needless to say all runway lighting and associated control equipment must be installed and finished/tested/approved.

All these take time. But how long, with the best/shortest estimations? Anyone has any solid idea?

BTW, somewhere I had read, that the present single runway at Dubai's new Al Maktoom Airport had taken around two (2) years for this entire testing/certification cycle; which looked pretty much unbelievable to me...

LAXintl wrote:

NichCage wrote:

Why did Turkish Airlines end flights to Osaka? It's been part of there network for a long time, maybe it wasn't profitable?

Same reason many longhaul carriers walked away from Osaka. This is the 2nd time KIX was dropped by TK.

What reason is that? High landing fees?

Just noted that last weeks Airline Weekly newsletter has table detailing the fastest growing domestic air travel markets of the last decade.

Turkey ranks number 2 - with 307% growth for the last decade (for reference Vietnam was the top growth nation). This growth was fueled by government deregulation of airline sector, reduction of burdens like ticket taxes, evolution towards consumer based driven economy, and overall strong national GDP expansion.

Overall Turkey also in 2016 ranked as the worlds 10th largest air travel market overall - larger than all European markets besides UK and Germany.

mafaky wrote:

But, is this kind of auditing the only action necessary and sufficient for the certification of the runway? Or is this only the certification that engineering has been done properly and the data you have mentioned can go on official records? I guess after this the runway has to be calibrated and tested by the SHGM (possibly not alone but under international supervision), then comes the calibration and testing for ILS and other equipment that should be installed in the meantime. These latter should be the responsibility of SHGM [the CAA of Turkish State], not IGA's. The runway markings have to be done and needless to say all runway lighting and associated control equipment must be installed and finished/tested/approved.

All these take time. But how long, with the best/shortest estimations? Anyone has any solid idea?

BTW, somewhere I had read, that the present single runway at Dubai's new Al Maktoom Airport had taken around two (2) years for this entire testing/certification cycle; which looked pretty much unbelievable to me...

No idea of how things must be legally done in Turkey, but I know the CAA requires someone to provide various tech data points regarding a runway before it can be published in the formal Turkey AIP. I suppose its IGA that contracted with the European firm to come and audit the runway and provide the CAA the required information.
Also I dont know who is responsible for things like ILS systems in Turkey. Here in the US the airport builds them and then FAA comes out with a calibration flight test to certify them.

Regarding timeframes and your mention of Dubai, as comparison here at LAX in 2006 they built an entire new 12,000ft runway in 8 months with about 2 additional months for adjacent taxiways. New runway was operational 4 days early from plan.

globetrotter94 wrote:

What reason is that? High landing fees?

Japan is very Tokyo centric when it comes to longhaul travel demand. Markets like KIX/NGO don't provide the demand nor revenue(yield) comparable to Tokyo region which has made it challenging to support longhaul routes.

-IST-ATL was to go from 77W to 333

Just curious, could this leg ever swap over to the 332 or just the 333?

comairguycvg wrote:

-IST-ATL was to go from 77W to 333

Just curious, could this leg ever swap over to the 332 or just the 333?

In theory, yes. But highly unlikely. Where would that 332 come from?

MalevTU134 wrote:

comairguycvg wrote:

-IST-ATL was to go from 77W to 333

Just curious, could this leg ever swap over to the 332 or just the 333?

In theory, yes. But highly unlikely. Where would that 332 come from?

I was just wondering if ATL would ever see the retro paint scheme.

LAXintl wrote:

Japan is very Tokyo centric when it comes to longhaul travel demand. Markets like KIX/NGO don't provide the demand nor revenue(yield) comparable to Tokyo region which has made it challenging to support longhaul routes.

Having grown up in the Osaka region, and routinely travelled back there in recent years, I agree with Tokyo's advantage on long-haul travel.

However, TK has also seriously scaled down IST-NRT from 1 77W+1 A333 (don't quite remember if it was daily, or only some days a week that saw 2 frequencies) to just 1 A333 daily.

On the other hand, the last time I flew the IST-KIX route was in June, 2016, and at that time, they were regularly subbing in A333s in place of the regular A332s, and flight was completely full (although that says nothing about yields). I certainly hope this route cancellation is only due to present instability in Turkey, and that the market will recover (flight will be reinstated) as things get better--it really was a very convenient flight for me, and my favorite way to go home for holidays.

Also, this is quite belated, but I would like to thank all of you for your informative answers so far. As evident, I am new to airliners.net, and this has been a great welcome.

I am not Turkish, but absolutely adore Turkish language and culture (especially cuisine), and am openly a TK "fan-boy". I have been following these Turkish aviation threads and the forum in general as a guest for a long time, but am only jumping in now. Hope to learn lots more on interesting developments in Turkish aviation!

Teşekkürler!

Some fleet news..

5 A319, 7 A320, 2 or 5 A332 will leave TK fleet this year. Some Boeings will transfer to Ajet.

3 B77W and 6 A333 will entry (2 A321 entered) the fleet.

Btw the only wet-leased B747 Freighter is no more listed in their fleet, maybe as a result of the accident.

Freebird wet-leased now 3 A320 to Vietjet in Vietnam. And Pegasus has sent 4 B738 to PIA. 3 Corendon B738 is flying for Spicejet.

Borajet and Tailwind are more or less grounded nearly half of their fleet.

TK is operating the Casablanca route with a 77W starting the 26/3 for 5 out of 7 weekly flights.

comairguycvg wrote:

I was just wondering if ATL would ever see the retro paint scheme.

There is always a chance ATL A333 must be taking a load penalty to make that West bound flight. Yesterdays A333 IST-ATL flight was 11:42. So, who knows you might see the pijamas

Also, thanks Yakamoz with the fleet news.
-AnadoluJet has only 12 738s, can they utilize more jets?
-Pegasus were to get 5 x 320NEOS this year, is that old information still correct?
-Someone please correct me; AFAIK 3 TK 77W's (-JJK, JJM, -JJP) had been on the ground for at least 2 weeks now.

TK787 wrote:

PARAGUAY, who knows
TK in Africa comes to mind. TK used to fly to 17 destinations in Africa and then said it would double that number by ordering the 737-900s. Now, 51 destinations. I have a feeling TK is really trying hard to tap into the South American market but it is not that easy with NO historical/cultural/religious ties and no simple solutions in terms of equipment.

TK regularly proves you don't need historical/cultural/religious ties (and even if they did have ties, they weren't always positive) to start a route...though I do tend to think religion plays a big role in the formation of some Africa routes.

Indeed, for South America, the aircraft utilization/type is the bigger issue. I can see SCL and LIM in TK's sights, having potential both for O&D and connecting traffic. But then, how could they connect more dots? That's where elevation and 5th freedom rights come into play (vis-a-vis UIO and LPB)

TK787 wrote:

comairguycvg wrote:

I was just wondering if ATL would ever see the retro paint scheme.

There is always a chance ATL A333 must be taking a load penalty to make that West bound flight. Yesterdays A333 IST-ATL flight was 11:42. So, who knows you might see the pijamas

Also, thanks Yakamoz with the fleet news.
-AnadoluJet has only 12 738s, can they utilize more jets?
-Pegasus were to get 5 x 320NEOS this year, is that old information still correct?
-Someone please correct me; AFAIK 3 TK 77W's (-JJK, JJM, -JJP) had been on the ground for at least 2 weeks now.

Anadolujet has 12 B738 of TK, 22 of XQ. They will take over some SAW domestic routes of TK next summer.
I get an information Pegasus will take delivery of their deliveries earlier as planned and get off the Boeing fleet.
Yes, at the moment 3 B77W on the ground. JJP is grounded due to economic reasons, JJM for maintenance, JJK no idea.

As of today, 48 TK birds on ground for more than 3 days, 40 of them for more than 10 days;
6 A319, 8 A320, 3 A321, 15 A332, 3 A333, 1 B737. 9 B738, 3 B777.

Btw CEO Bilal Eksi said they have 25 aircraft on ground for delay reasons, just 8 are stored. I don't really know how he can lie, when approx. 13 birds are stored in Antalya since end of last summer season. And the best: he will sue people who has written that. A big LOL.

Yakamoz wrote:

Some fleet news..

5 A319, 7 A320, 2 or 5 A332 will leave TK fleet this year. Some Boeings will transfer to Ajet.

3 B77W and 6 A333 will entry (2 A321 entered) the fleet.

Btw the only wet-leased B747 Freighter is no more listed in their fleet, maybe as a result of the accident.

Freebird wet-leased now 3 A320 to Vietjet in Vietnam. And Pegasus has sent 4 B738 to PIA. 3 Corendon B738 is flying for Spicejet.

Borajet and Tailwind are more or less grounded nearly half of their fleet.

TC-LJK 777 has been in storage at PAE since December and not expected to be going anywhere soon "due to poor economic situation in Turkey" (not my words).

Here's a recent picture from another forum. If that behind this guy is the first runway it looks nowhere near finished. Maybe it's the second?


http://wowturkey.com/t.php?p=/tr762/n13s013_a_6.jpg

According to my analysis of today, Turkish Airlines plans to decrease weekly flights by %7 compared to last summer season.

For the comparison, I took 2nd week of July.

Yakamoz wrote:

3 B77W and 6 A333 will entry (2 A321 entered) the fleet.

There are 7 A333s on order at Intrepid, what happend with the 7th A333?

Here is a photo of the runways published October 6, 2016.



http://ia.sabah.com.tr/11b1a3/650/344/0 ... 56844.jpeg

KarelXWB wrote:

Yakamoz wrote:

3 B77W and 6 A333 will entry (2 A321 entered) the fleet.

There are 7 A333s on order at Intrepid, what happend with the 7th A333?

TC-LOE delivered in December. 6 more will entry.

Yakamoz wrote:

KarelXWB wrote:

Yakamoz wrote:

3 B77W and 6 A333 will entry (2 A321 entered) the fleet.

There are 7 A333s on order at Intrepid, what happend with the 7th A333?

TC-LOE delivered in December. 6 more will entry.

Missed that one, thank you.

leftyboarder wrote:

Here's a recent picture from another forum. If that behind this guy is the first runway it looks nowhere near finished. Maybe it's the second?
http://wowturkey.com/t.php?p=/tr762/n13s013_a_6.jpg

Yes indeed, what you see behind the guy are the partial construction of the second runway and related taxiroutes. Behind these you can see the construction of the ATC Tower rising plus some small hills. The first runway and its taxiroutes etc. are located behind these, beyond the visual range of that photo...

TK getting great brand placement out of the game

Still waiting for the spot

Seems to have sponsored every channels coverage

WOW!!! That is money well spent. Awesome spot for TK!!!
Below link is a bit longer, the one aired during Superbowl was a :30 spot. I am sooooo glad they did not use some "East meets West" type of music.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_gv6fRejLM