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LAXintl
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Updated: SIA orders 39 Boeing Aircraft

Wed Feb 08, 2017 11:11 pm

According to Bloomberg SQ seems to have picked Boeing.

Order for about ~35 aircraft with about 20 777X plus top up order of 787-10s possible as soon as this week.


Boeing the Front-Runner for $13.8 Billion Singapore Air Order: Sources
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... -air-order

=
Last edited by SQ22 on Mon Oct 23, 2017 7:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Title changed after LOI became firm order
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ikolkyo
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Wed Feb 08, 2017 11:25 pm

Very interested in hearing the details of this, wondering if we will see a 777-10 or a higher capacity version of the 777-9 and maybe even some 778?
 
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Stitch
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Wed Feb 08, 2017 11:27 pm

ikolkyo wrote:
Very interested in hearing the details of this, wondering if we will see a 777-10 or a higher capacity version of the 777-9 and maybe even some 778?


Well if SQ does indeed order the 777-9, that will help them drive the development of the 777-10.
 
Flightsimboy
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 12:06 am

A350-2000 & A350-8000?? Where have these come from?
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 12:44 am

With 67 A350 already on order, I too believe SQ will split the order to Boeing to maintain the relationship...
 
Whalejet
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 12:47 am

This is only one airline though. Do aerospace manufacturers really build commercial jets for one consumer?
 
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Stitch
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 1:38 am

Flightsimboy wrote:
A350-2000 & A350-8000?? Where have these come from?


These are concept stretches of the A350 family being floated by Airbus.
 
SCAT15F
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 1:44 am

So, are SQ talking about the 10X or the 9X? This whole thing was about the 10X and A350-2000, NOT the 9X -unless they recently changed their plans.
 
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 1:53 am

SCAT15F wrote:
So, are SQ talking about the 10X or the 9X? This whole thing was about the 10X and A350-2000, NOT the 9X -unless they recently changed their plans.


Article in #127 says:

The aircraft to be purchased would replace aging Boeing models such as the 777-300ER, while giving Singapore Air or its low-cost subsidiaries rights to Boeing aircraft not yet on the market.


and:

Singapore Air also has reviewed a proposed, longer version of the twin-engine 777 that would carry as many as 450 passengers, a load previously handled only by four-engine jumbo jets, two of the people said.


So the proposed purchases are 9X but apparently they also have reviewed proposals for the -10X and have some unspecified rights to purchase them. At least that's how I read the article.
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 2:14 am

SCAT15F wrote:
So, are SQ talking about the 10X or the 9X? This whole thing was about the 10X and A350-2000, NOT the 9X -unless they recently changed their plans.


If they order, it will be for the 777-9 and if Boeing offers the 777-10 at a later date, they have the option to convert some or all of those undelivered orders to the larger model.
 
A320FlyGuy
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 3:02 am

Ahh....everything old is new again....galleys on the lower deck...cough L-1011 cough....
My other car is an A320-200
 
A320FlyGuy
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 3:06 am

intotheair wrote:
How much of the galleys can really be put below the main deck? I understand putting lavs underneath (I love the setup in LH's 346s), but it seems like it wouldn't be very efficient to put ovens and whatnot down a staircase as long as you're still serving a giant Y cabin with carts. Or maybe they can come up with some sort of dumb waiter/elevator scheme? That would be interesting.


http://www.airlinereporter.com/wp-conte ... ng-Aft.jpg

Nothing new....Lockheed pioneered the concept in the 1970s with the L-1011.
My other car is an A320-200
 
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 3:30 am

A320FlyGuy wrote:
intotheair wrote:
How much of the galleys can really be put below the main deck? I understand putting lavs underneath (I love the setup in LH's 346s), but it seems like it wouldn't be very efficient to put ovens and whatnot down a staircase as long as you're still serving a giant Y cabin with carts. Or maybe they can come up with some sort of dumb waiter/elevator scheme? That would be interesting.


http://www.airlinereporter.com/wp-conte ... ng-Aft.jpg

Nothing new....Lockheed pioneered the concept in the 1970s with the L-1011.


747's had them in the 70's as well. The first QF 747's had a galley on the lower deck, once got to ride the elevator to it when given a tour of one as a kid at the QF base in SYD. My father used to work at QF, so we got the all angles tour.
 
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 3:52 am

cool- thanks!
 
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 8:15 am

Be interesting to see if Boeing can convince them to (eventually) go 778 as well.

It's a stretch, but who knows, perhaps they can grow the initial three gateways beyond the A359/A359ULR within the next (half)-decade or so.
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 8:20 am

LAX772LR wrote:
Be interesting to see if Boeing can convince them to (eventually) go 778 as well.

It's a stretch, but who knows, perhaps they can grow the initial three gateways beyond the A359/A359ULR within the next (half)-decade or so.


It's a shrink ;)
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 8:24 am

keesje wrote:
It's a shrink ;)

Ha! But I'm talking about the proposal, not the aircraft.
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 8:28 am

Stitch wrote:
ikolkyo wrote:
Very interested in hearing the details of this, wondering if we will see a 777-10 or a higher capacity version of the 777-9 and maybe even some 778?


Well if SQ does indeed order the 777-9, that will help them drive the development of the 777-10.


Considering SQ have been loosing customers to the ME3 carriers for many years now, it would be interesting to see how these new aeroplanes allow SQ to compete. I suspect the USA market will be the gem that will alow them a reversal of fortunes.
 
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 8:44 am

I think these will replace the B777-300ER and the B777-200ER in the long run but not the A380. They are still taking delivery of 5 brand new A380s. They will order more in the future I think
 
parapente
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 8:49 am

As others have said.This order strongly appears to be for the 777-9.I fully expect to see that happen.Further down the line I believe we can expect to see a dash 10.From the very beginning it looked like such a stretch was planned into the 777X.It will of course replace the 748i.So it makes perfect sense.If they do build it the real looser would be the A380 IMHO.
 
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 8:49 am

United Airline wrote:
I think these will replace the B777-300ER and the B777-200ER in the long run but not the A380. They are still taking delivery of 5 brand new A380s. They will order more in the future I think


It will be intersting to see how the A380's are configured?

We could see a chnage in srategy with these new A380 aircraft.
 
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 9:01 am

LAX772LR wrote:
keesje wrote:
It's a shrink ;)

Ha! But I'm talking about the proposal, not the aircraft.

I believe he is aware of that and is just stretching your legs. :smile:
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 9:14 am

parapente wrote:
As others have said.This order strongly appears to be for the 777-9.I fully expect to see that happen.Further down the line I believe we can expect to see a dash 10.From the very beginning it looked like such a stretch was planned into the 777X.It will of course replace the 748i.So it makes perfect sense.If they do build it the real looser would be the A380 IMHO.

If reported correctly, appears to win the 9 order, Boeing has waived model hopping penalties if they offer a 10 later, and SQ switch 9 orders to 10.
 
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 9:28 am

Fantastic win of Boeing.......
 
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 9:34 am

So apparently SQ doesn't mind diluting their brand when they order these cramped 777's or will they configure them 9-abreast?
 
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 9:48 am

Reuters reports SQ signing for 20 777-9 and 19 787-10 with 6+6 options.
 
United Airline
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 9:54 am

Hope they will stay 3-3-3
 
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 9:56 am

I think they will carry on with the A380. They are still taking delivery of 5 extra A380s. I think the A380 will replace the A380 for SQ.

The B777-10X/A350-2000 are for B777-300ER replacement.
 
Oykie
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 10:00 am

Congratulations to Boeing and Singapore :-)

http://boeing.mediaroom.com/2017-02-09- ... 19-787-10s
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 10:02 am

SQ order the B777-9X and the posibility of -10 if is in the future.
 
 
chiraagnt
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SIA signs LOI for 39 Boeing Aircraft

Thu Feb 09, 2017 10:06 am

Hi guys,

I know this topic has been discussed on other threads as well but I feel this merits a topic of its own!

SINGAPORE - Singapore Airlines (SIA) has signed a letter of intent to buy 39 Boeing aircraft - 20 B777-9s and 19 B787s - for additional growth and fleet modernisation through the next decade.

The deal inked on Thursday also includes options for 12 more planes.


Thoughts on this being a potential replacement for which aircraft and SIA's future growth? Quite a large order book they have with Airbus and Boeing now for the entire group. Are the 787s destined for Scoot or are all these aircraft for the mainline? CAPA wrote an interesting article regarding SIA growth flatlining, so any information to be inferred from this new order? Purely replacements or growth?

Source: http://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/s ... billion-at
 
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keesje
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Re: SIA signs LOI for 39 Boeing Aircraft

Thu Feb 09, 2017 10:23 am

Congratulation to SQ & Boeing !

Image

An significant victory. SQ kept this 77W replacement requirement open for a long time. They ordered a pile of XWB's but never committed to -1000s, waiting for a Boeing offering. http://www.airbus.com/presscentre/pressreleases/press-release-detail/detail/singapore-airlines-finalises-order-for-up-to-50-more-a350-xwbs/
"Never mistake motion for action." Ernest Hemingway
 
ap305
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Re: SIA signs LOI for 39 Boeing Aircraft

Thu Feb 09, 2017 10:27 am

Congrats to Boeing although I will not be surprised if SQ still convert some a350 options to the -1000 at a later stage.
Racing, competing, is in my blood. It's part of me, it's part of my life; I've been doing it all my life. And it stands up before anything else- Ayrton Senna
 
An767
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Re: SIA signs LOI for 39 Boeing Aircraft

Thu Feb 09, 2017 10:28 am

chiraagnt wrote:
Hi guys,

I know this topic has been discussed on other threads as well but I feel this merits a topic of its own!

SINGAPORE - Singapore Airlines (SIA) has signed a letter of intent to buy 39 Boeing aircraft - 20 B777-9s and 19 B787s - for additional growth and fleet modernisation through the next decade.

The deal inked on Thursday also includes options for 12 more planes.


Thoughts on this being a potential replacement for which aircraft and SIA's future growth? Quite a large order book they have with Airbus and Boeing now for the entire group. Are the 787s destined for Scoot or are all these aircraft for the mainline? CAPA wrote an interesting article regarding SIA growth flatlining, so any information to be inferred from this new order? Purely replacements or growth?

Source: http://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/s ... billion-at


The article states it is for fleet modernisation. So assuming it is replacement of older 777's and growth and the 787-9's to replace the 333's , that i believe most are leased
AN767
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keesje
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Re: SIA signs LOI for 39 Boeing Aircraft

Thu Feb 09, 2017 10:35 am

In the past Boeing bought SQ's 17 A340s to get the 777 contract. It shows how determined Boeing is to have SQ on their operator list.
I wonder what was on the table this time to break the 777X Sales Drought. http://articles.latimes.com/1999/jun/19/business/fi-47994
"Never mistake motion for action." Ernest Hemingway
 
iahcsr
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 10:46 am

Seems the choice has been made: 20 779/ 19 787(9-10?)
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flipdewaf
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Re: SIA signs LOI for 39 Boeing Aircraft

Thu Feb 09, 2017 11:05 am

keesje wrote:
In the past Boeing bought SQ's 17 A340s to get the 777 contract. It shows how determined Boeing is to have SQ on their operator list.
I wonder what was on the table this time to break the 777X Sales Drought. http://articles.latimes.com/1999/jun/19/business/fi-47994

Probably a damn good aircraft!
A big fat twin probably suits SQ on routes where they don't have the ability to fill the A380. I don't imagine it will be packed to the gills all the way down at 10x.


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Re: SIA signs LOI for 39 Boeing Aircraft

Thu Feb 09, 2017 11:10 am

Forum Moderator
 
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 11:10 am

MoKa777 wrote:
Both could be great aircraft.

Thing is, the A350-2000 could be so much lighter.

However, as has been mentioned above about its wing being proportioned to handle additional growth, the 777-10X could be a real heavy lifter...

That's the difference I have always noticed between Boeing and Airbus products - 2 different and likely unintentional strategies: Airbus aircraft are more clinical (in a good way) and Boeing is more "balls to the wall"... that is just my opinion.


IMU the MTOW growth of the 777 family is more or less maxed out.
It already has the highest runway loading around.
And it retains the old wingbox ( raising eyebrows ) so there probably is no room for
even splaying out the wheels on the bogie to alleviate loads like on the A359.
could they do a center gear for the 777-10X ?
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BlueSky1976
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Re: SIA signs LOI for 39 Boeing Aircraft

Thu Feb 09, 2017 11:12 am

The rumor about upcoming Singapore 777-9 order has been circulating for more than two years now, I'm glad they've finally went for it!

keesje wrote:
I wonder what was on the table this time to break the 777X Sales Drought. http://articles.latimes.com/1999/jun/19/business/fi-47994


What sales drought?!? Boeing sold more 777-9s than Airbus did A350-1000s!
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Re: SIA signs LOI for 39 Boeing Aircraft

Thu Feb 09, 2017 11:14 am

Why on earth would SQ order yet more 787s? No question that the 787-9 is a fantastic aircraft, which I'm sure is making Scoot plenty of cash, but they've already got 50 787-10s on order (presumably with some flexibility to convert them back to -9s). Why would they want more?

As for the 777-9s, it's a LOI so that surely signals that they are trying to pressure Airbus into further stretching the A350-1000 (i think they call this the hypothetical A350-2000). I'll believe it when there's a firm contract in place. ;)

BlueSky1976 wrote:
What sales drought?!?

Last order from a named customer was in mid 2014 (ANA). 2.5 year drought.

BlueSky1976 wrote:
Boeing sold more 777-9s than Airbus did A350-1000s!

True, yet the A350-1000 has a wider customer base than the 777x FWIW. More blue-chip customers also.

KarelXWB wrote:
zkojq wrote:
Why on earth would SQ order yet more 787s? No question that the 787-9 is a fantastic aircraft, which I'm sure is making Scoot plenty of cash, but they've already got 50 787-10s on order (presumably with some flexibility to convert them back to -9s). Why would they want more?


SQ has a lot of 777s to replace. The A350s are mainly for growth, and A330 replacement.


Current SQ fleet is ~110 aircraft.

Current SQ orders;
-57 x A350
-49 x 787-10
-5 x A380s

(111 aircraft on order)

This LOI:
-20 x 777-9X
-19 x 787

(150 aircraft on order or LOI)

Seems a little steep, even appreciating the quick rate that SQ aircraft gets through aircraft (retiring them at 10-12 years etc). I hope they can make it work. Also, I hope that the 777x won't be 10 abreast at SQ.
Last edited by zkojq on Thu Feb 09, 2017 11:26 am, edited 2 times in total.
First to fly the 787-9
 
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KarelXWB
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Re: SIA signs LOI for 39 Boeing Aircraft

Thu Feb 09, 2017 11:16 am

zkojq wrote:
Why on earth would SQ order yet more 787s? No question that the 787-9 is a fantastic aircraft, which I'm sure is making Scoot plenty of cash, but they've already got 50 787-10s on order (presumably with some flexibility to convert them back to -9s). Why would they want more?


SQ has a lot of 777s to replace. The A350s are mainly for growth, and A330 replacement.
What we leave behind is not as important as how we've lived.
 
parapente
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Re: SIA signs LOI for 39 Boeing Aircraft

Thu Feb 09, 2017 11:28 am

I don't see any desperation on Boeings part.Why should there be?Singapore has a huge fleet of 777's particularly dash 3er's.The will need replacing.They have spoken about the need for extra internal space to compete with the ME3 offering (their deadly rivals).Their ground crews,pilots and air crew are all totally familiar with the 777.Whats not to like?This is a state of the art aircraft with the right capacity and range too.Of course Airbus would have loved this order to be A350-1000's.We can rest assured that they will have tried their hardest and that Singapore squeezed a great price out of Boeing.Good for them.Note both 350X and 777X offer 18" as standard in Y so nice commonality of soft product too.
Nope my concern if I was Airbus is the other part of the order.It does not make the headlines so much but is perhaps more profound and worrying.When BA ordered a bunch of 787-10's nobody said much but I certainly raised an eyebrow.This aircraft is in effect a short/medium range A359.This is (at least) the second time this has happened.It looked that it might happen at Emirates but the whole order has gone onto the back burner.But that does not mean its dead.For regional high density routes the -10 seems to be being preferred over the longer range (and more expensive?) 359.Perhaps Airbus should have continued with the mid range 'simple stretch' 351 (as well as the LR advanced model they have just launched?).
 
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ikolkyo
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Re: SIA signs LOI for 39 Boeing Aircraft

Thu Feb 09, 2017 11:43 am

parapente wrote:
I don't see any desperation on Boeings part.Why should there be?Singapore has a huge fleet of 777's particularly dash 3er's.The will need replacing.They have spoken about the need for extra internal space to compete with the ME3 offering (their deadly rivals).Their ground crews,pilots and air crew are all totally familiar with the 777.Whats not to like?This is a state of the art aircraft with the right capacity and range too.Of course Airbus would have loved this order to be A350-1000's.We can rest assured that they will have tried their hardest and that Singapore squeezed a great price out of Boeing.Good for them.Note both 350X and 777X offer 18" as standard in Y so nice commonality of soft product too.
Nope my concern if I was Airbus is the other part of the order.It does not make the headlines so much but is perhaps more profound and worrying.When BA ordered a bunch of 787-10's nobody said much but I certainly raised an eyebrow.This aircraft is in effect a short/medium range A359.This is (at least) the second time this has happened.It looked that it might happen at Emirates but the whole order has gone onto the back burner.But that does not mean its dead.For regional high density routes the -10 seems to be being preferred over the longer range (and more expensive?) 359.Perhaps Airbus should have continued with the mid range 'simple stretch' 351 (as well as the LR advanced model they have just launched?).


Dear Lord,

Please let this man learn about the space bar.
 
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KarelXWB
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Re: SIA signs LOI for 39 Boeing Aircraft

Thu Feb 09, 2017 11:43 am

zkojq wrote:
Also, I hope that the 777x won't be 10 abreast at SQ.


You can bet it will be 10-abreast, that's the whole point about the 777X.
What we leave behind is not as important as how we've lived.
 
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seahawk
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Re: SIA signs LOI for 39 Boeing Aircraft

Thu Feb 09, 2017 11:45 am

Great news for Boeing.
 
Newbiepilot
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Re: SQ to Decide Between A350-2000 and 777-10 By Year End, CNN

Thu Feb 09, 2017 11:58 am

Strato2 wrote:
So apparently SQ doesn't mind diluting their brand when they order these cramped 777's or will they configure them 9-abreast?


Boeing reshaped the frames and widened the fuselage on the 777-8/9. The economy cabin is 4 inches wider so it can probably be expected that they will have 10 abreast seating.
 
anshabhi
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Re: SIA signs LOI for 39 Boeing Aircraft

Thu Feb 09, 2017 12:07 pm

I think Vistara might also receive a few of them when it starts Intl operations in July 2018..
 
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Polot
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Re: SIA signs LOI for 39 Boeing Aircraft

Thu Feb 09, 2017 12:09 pm

zkojq wrote:
Current SQ orders;
-57 x A350
-49 x 787-10
-5 x A380s

(111 aircraft on order)

This LOI:
-20 x 777-9X
-19 x 787


SQ currently has 30 787-10s on order. With this LOI they will have 49.

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Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos