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Revelation
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Sun Feb 12, 2017 9:04 pm

SWADawg wrote:
Yeah, I'm a Commercial Airline Pilot, so I think I do understand how the profession works these days since I've been in it for close to 20 years. I take no pleasure in seeing a fellow pilot in a situation like this, but the fact is the FAA takes these types of events very seriously. They can and most likely will suspend her medical which she must possess in order to fly as a pilot for United Airlines. There is nothing that comes into play with the ADA, or any other entity that can change that outcome. Pilots have different sets of rules that they must adhere to in order to exercise their privileges as a professional pilot, and while I don't always agree with the FAA's sometimes zero tolerance policies especially when it comes to areas of psychological issues, those are the rules that I and every commercial pilot must operate under. ALPA does have programs in place to help pilots that may be struggling with drugs, alcohol abuse, divorce, death of a loved one, you name it. But the caveat is that the pilot has to voluntarily come forward and ask for help before there is an incident like this and not after. I do hope this pilot gets the help she needs, but I'm under absolutely no illusion that she will be allowed back in the air anytime soon.


I agree. I feel sorry for her and hope she works through her issues, but in the world where Lublitz showed what one can do in a locked cockpit, her case is going to get a lot of scrutiny.
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Swadian
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Sun Feb 12, 2017 9:09 pm

"You're fired!"
 
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flymco753
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Sun Feb 12, 2017 9:10 pm

Don't you ever read some of these stories about craziness that happens in airplanes and ask, "what kind of stuff are they smoking?" ...or is that only me?
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readytotaxi
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Sun Feb 12, 2017 9:22 pm

spacecadet wrote:
coolian2 wrote:
The a.net understanding, or lack thereof, about mental issues out in force again


It takes a certain amount of age and life experience to begin to understand mental issues. All humans have the capacity for something like this, whatever their job. There's no on/off switch for the part of the brain that feels emotions, and you probably wouldn't want there to be because that's the same part of the brain that keeps pilots from crashing their plane into a warehouse because they're bored.

All a person needs to trigger a breakdown like this is a particularly devastating event, or a series of such events. For most people, the emotional upheaval they go through is temporary. But many need help to get through it, and it's neither unusual nor is it grounds for dismissal from *any* job. Also, at times like this, it's actually a legal requirement under the ADA for employers to be *more* understanding and accommodating, not less. And the reason for that is because the writers of that law understood that any human being can go through something like this, and no one should be persecuted for it.

Probably about 90% of all the people you meet over the age of 40 have had some kind of mental or emotional breakdown at some time in their lives. And those people are flying planes, driving trains and buses, operating construction equipment, running various parts of government, performing medical and surgical procedures, etc. You simply cannot expect anyone in any profession - be it a pilot or anything else - to be anything less than human.


Yep, one of the better posts out there tonight. :checkmark:
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NoTime
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Sun Feb 12, 2017 9:27 pm

MartijnNL wrote:
texdravid wrote:
I hope she's done and hope some union rule doesn't get her back into that seat ever.

Why do you hope she's done? Don't you think she needs help?


Those two items are not mutually exclusive.
 
sadiqutp
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Sun Feb 12, 2017 9:29 pm

A youtube video has been posted, It doesn't seem as sensational as reported. I hope she gets better
https://youtu.be/iqhN6t8_ECg
 
Flighty
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Sun Feb 12, 2017 9:34 pm

I am not a pilot or anything relevant to this conversation but I think pilots should have a relatively clean psychological record. Yes, mentally ill people deserve lots of consideration, and they can achieve many wonderful things. Flying a US registered airline jet as an officer is really not one of the things they should be doing. If you can't hold it together in the cockpit, you are declaring and proving yourself unfit for the job. How do you un-prove that, well that is an interesting question, and in this age of social media, youtube and corporate liability, I just can't see how you do it.

Bottom line for me is, everybody has a worst day of your life. If you're having that day, don't show up for the cockpit. And if I may make an unkind generalization, I doubt this was a unique day for her. Rock solid people don't get flaky past age 25 or so. She has probably always been compromised, and probably will continue to be. She knew intellectually that this would end her flight, and if not, she shouldn't be flying anyway.

I don't have the psychology or character to be an ATP and plenty of other people don't either.
 
gkpetery
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Sun Feb 12, 2017 9:45 pm

If she was in the plane cockpit... even with another pilot flying the plane, if I had a chance, I would get off the plane. You never know how she may react in the sky once the place was off the ground. I'd rather be late than dead
 
barney captain
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Sun Feb 12, 2017 10:20 pm

This may not be a mental disorder or stress related at all. I am familiar with similar situations where sudden bizarre behavior was a direct result of a brain tumor and the individual was completely unaware of how their actions appeared.

How about we let her get properly diagnosed before we continue the "unprofessional behavior" drivel and the demands for the end of her career?
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Tedd
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Sun Feb 12, 2017 10:37 pm

barney captain wrote:
This may not be a mental disorder or stress related at all. I am familiar with similar situations where sudden bizarre behavior was a direct result of a brain tumor and the individual was completely unaware of how their actions appeared.

How about we let her get properly diagnosed before we continue the "unprofessional behavior" drivel and the demands for the end of her career?


While your `handle` is unfortunate, what you say above are my sentiments entirely. Hope things improve for her,
& that she has a career to return to in due course.
 
aircatalonia
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Sun Feb 12, 2017 11:13 pm

Imagine a gate agent going to work in plain clothes and lecturing paying assengers about politics. Me thinks she would lose her job on the spot.

I say give her a second chance, at check in or reservations
 
Gasman
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Sun Feb 12, 2017 11:26 pm

A few points in no particular order

- Yes, mental health issues require understanding; but when you're in a profession where other people's lives depend on your performance; your own issues must take a back seat to those of the people you're responsible for.

- I agree pilots should have a relatively clean mental health record. Yes, "mental illness" in terms of anxiety and depression is exceedingly common; however the bizarre behaviour that this woman has demonstrated is not. This will be career ending. It would be completely indefensible if she were to have another meltdown on the job 1, 5 or 20 years down the track.

- It is possible that the behaviour demonstrated could be the result of prescription or illicit drugs. If prescription it raises the issue of how were they prescribed, was she given appropriate advice and counselling, and was the airline informed.

- There are other systems issues in question also. How did she make it to the cockpit out of uniform? Could anyone have intervened earlier? Was her behaviour before she boarded the aircraft normal in every other way? It seems unlikely.

(Disclaimer - I am a medical doctor, but not in a mental health field)
 
QueenoftheSkies
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 13, 2017 1:11 am

She's done. As someone who used to work there and had similar incident,not to this extreme, I know this first hand. The reason? Bad publicity and/or damage the company image. Mind you, my issue was verified medical situation. It didn't matter.
 
tp1040
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 13, 2017 1:42 am

If a Southwest FA had done this, people would be calling for her head.
 
mcdu
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 13, 2017 1:46 am

rnav2dlrey wrote:
the hogan assessment proves its effectiveness once again....

This pilot was hired well prior to the Hogan.
 
30west
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 13, 2017 3:17 am

Where do I start , these post prove my belief that 90% of people have no idea what they are talking about.

Hogan wasn't around when pilot was hired, the pilot will lose her medical first and first use sick/vacation then go on LTD its in the contract, the union will assist the pilot into the FAA approved EAP/HIMS program where it could go either way as far as flying again, if the pilot were to jump thru all the hoops someday my guess is couple of years the pilot may return to the line. The pilot would be requalified as a Captain and be in an extended monitoring program. (though on rare occasion a deal is cut to keep a job but must stay as F/O, unlikely in this case).

As far as being fired, that is not how it works, even alcohol /drug addiction won't get you fired anymore unless a second occurrence happens, the HIMS program at the US airlines are extremely successful approaching 90% success rate at returning pilots to the company, after a very rigorous and extended monitoring program.
 
wjcandee
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 13, 2017 3:51 am

The Big Networks and Big Papers, as well as the Associated Press, are just printing the UA statement without any of the colorful details that are in the European papers and local reports. They aren't even showing pictures or video. They are not releasing her name even though they know it, etc. They obviously feel that they have to report the story, but they have edited it into something so plain vanilla that anyone reading it without knowing the other facts would wonder why it is being reported at all.

This pilot is being treated very respectfully by the Big Media (CNN, ABC, NBC, CBS, etc.), which is very, very odd, given how well the story is documented and how colorful it is. These are the same media types who will happily publish rumours, unauthorized photos, tweets, Instagram photos, unverified untruths, etc., when the story is colorful, but for some reason, here they are not publishing verified and verifiable information and instead sticking to official sources. It's not that she's a female pilot, it's something else. And if so, shame on them. One day I would love to see them treat everyone as fairly as they are treating this unfortunate person.

I'm curious: what is it about this pilot that makes the media disinclined to invade her privacy when they happily invade everyone else's? Why are they being so dignified all of a sudden? (I'm not saying that they should invade her privacy; I'm simply curious why she is clearly getting special treatment.)

Thoughts? Bueller? Bueller?
 
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lebda
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 13, 2017 3:59 am

ltbewr wrote:
It seems this alleged pilot was either under the influence of drugs or had a mental health breakdown. One has to wonder if there had been signs before of this person's mental health, but too many afraid to say something and health privacy laws getting in the way. Who knows if this pilot had been in uniform and didn't say this stuff if could have ended up as another 'Germanwings' suicide disaster.


Please don't say that. Most mentally ill people are not interested in harming others.
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FlyUSAir
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 13, 2017 4:18 am

UA quickly needs to distance themselves from this rouge pilot. Otherwise the public will liken it to B6 191 or even Germanwings.
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Gasman
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 13, 2017 4:22 am

30west wrote:
Where do I start , these post prove my belief that 90% of people have no idea what they are talking about.
As far as being fired, that is not how it works, even alcohol /drug addiction won't get you fired anymore unless a second occurrence happens, the HIMS program at the US airlines are extremely successful approaching 90% success rate at returning pilots to the company, after a very rigorous and extended monitoring program.


I'm afraid *you* have demonstrated a less than total idea of what you're talking about.

Sure, a drug/alcohol addiction that is controlled and discovered incidentally might well be rehabilitated; but a pilot that turns up to work clearly under the influence of drugs/alcohol and behaves inappropriately with the passengers will never occupy a seat in the cockpit thereafter.

This woman has demonstrated features of a hypomanic psychotic episode. Possibly it was reactive to her divorce; but 99% of divorced individuals manage to get through it without needing to behave like this at work. She has demonstrated behavior that is completely inconsistent with operating a commercial aircraft, and there could never be sufficient assurance with all the pharmacotherapy and/or psychotherapy in the world that it won't happen again.
 
30west
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 13, 2017 5:05 am

Gasman

Ahh... how do I say it nicely, you're wrong , personally involved with returning pilots in mental illness situations and substance abuse situations, it has happened at this and other airlines I have worked at in the past. Takes a long time and more don't make it back than do make it back when its the mental illness situation.

As far as your alcohol/drugs you're 100% wrong again, no idea where you work but the majority of rehabbed pilots are actually caught while at work (layover, reporting or post flight) Its a rare occurrence actually but like I said 90% get their job back after completing the program at an ALPA carrier, maybe you don't work at an ALPA carrier.
 
zionite
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 13, 2017 6:30 am

Had this been an AI or ME3 incident, by this time, Delta would be out on radios and hoarding to ban them and this thread on A.net would be 5 pages long. :box:
 
Gasman
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 13, 2017 7:00 am

30west wrote:
Gasman

Ahh... how do I say it nicely, you're wrong , personally involved with returning pilots in mental illness situations and substance abuse situations, it has happened at this and other airlines I have worked at in the past. Takes a long time and more don't make it back than do make it back when its the mental illness situation.

As far as your alcohol/drugs you're 100% wrong again, no idea where you work but the majority of rehabbed pilots are actually caught while at work (layover, reporting or post flight) Its a rare occurrence actually but like I said 90% get their job back after completing the program at an ALPA carrier, maybe you don't work at an ALPA carrier.


Please provide me with examples of pilots who have been intoxicated at work, behave inappropriately around passengers, and then returned to work in cockpit of a legacy carrier.
 
stratosphere
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 13, 2017 7:37 am

Gasman wrote:
30west wrote:
Gasman

Ahh... how do I say it nicely, you're wrong , personally involved with returning pilots in mental illness situations and substance abuse situations, it has happened at this and other airlines I have worked at in the past. Takes a long time and more don't make it back than do make it back when its the mental illness situation.

As far as your alcohol/drugs you're 100% wrong again, no idea where you work but the majority of rehabbed pilots are actually caught while at work (layover, reporting or post flight) Its a rare occurrence actually but like I said 90% get their job back after completing the program at an ALPA carrier, maybe you don't work at an ALPA carrier.


Please provide me with examples of pilots who have been intoxicated at work, behave inappropriately around passengers, and then returned to work in cockpit of a legacy carrier.


Didn't exactly behave inappropriately around passengers. But indeed there is cases of being intoxicated and even going to prison and getting back in the cockpit.

https://thestorybehindthebook.wordpress ... le-prouse/
 
davescj
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 13, 2017 12:33 pm

[quote="Gasman"

Please provide me with examples of pilots who have been intoxicated at work, behave inappropriately around passengers, and then returned to work in cockpit of a legacy carrier.[/quote]

On A.Net a month or so ago, someone asked this very question about examples of pilots who were caught intoxicated and on duty. There were a couple of examples of people who were returned to work. I apologize I don't have the link, but it was int eh civil aviation forum. I think the subject like was "where are they know" or something similar.
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anjin
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 13, 2017 1:23 pm

Give her a break, Company, Union, Staff and friend support her, get well, get back to work and the rest of us move on please
 
mcdu
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 13, 2017 1:24 pm

Gasman wrote:

Please provide me with examples of pilots who have been intoxicated at work, behave inappropriately around passengers, and then returned to work in cockpit of a legacy carrier.


Examples? UA pilot arrested in London several years ago for being impaired is back flying. The two pilots involved in the Scottish incident in August 2016 are still employed.

UA provides a rehabilitation program that attempts to fix everyone. It is a matter of debate amongst the pilot group if it is best to rehab or set free.
 
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United787
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 13, 2017 3:19 pm

Everyone seems to be making this a black or white issue. I have a lot of empathy for this woman as she obviously has some serious issues, either situational with her divorce or maybe mental illness. Plus, when you think of all she is done to get as far as she has as a pilot and she may have just thrown it all away, it makes me sad for her. BUT, as a passenger, it would make me very concerned if I Iearned that she is allowed to fly again. I am not a mental health expert but I believe we still have a lot to learn about mental health and professionals can't predict how people will act in the future or force to people to take their meds. Pilots should be held to a higher standard, too many lives are in their hands.
 
apfpilot
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 13, 2017 4:17 pm

Gasman wrote:
30west wrote:
Gasman

Ahh... how do I say it nicely, you're wrong , personally involved with returning pilots in mental illness situations and substance abuse situations, it has happened at this and other airlines I have worked at in the past. Takes a long time and more don't make it back than do make it back when its the mental illness situation.

As far as your alcohol/drugs you're 100% wrong again, no idea where you work but the majority of rehabbed pilots are actually caught while at work (layover, reporting or post flight) Its a rare occurrence actually but like I said 90% get their job back after completing the program at an ALPA carrier, maybe you don't work at an ALPA carrier.


Please provide me with examples of pilots who have been intoxicated at work, behave inappropriately around passengers, and then returned to work in cockpit of a legacy carrier.


http://www.upi.com/Archives/1990/08/14/ ... 650606400/

Bob Kirschner from this flight now flies for Atlas.
Opinions are my own and do not reflect an endorsement or position of my employer.
 
DXTraveler
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 13, 2017 4:30 pm

CATIIIevery5yrs wrote:
SWADawg wrote:
She's probably done. The FAA will probably suspend her medical due to psychological reasons and it will be very difficult and time consuming for her to get it back. If she does manage to get it back, she will still face discipline from UA for her actions. Pilots rightly or wrongly are held to a higher standard than most other jobs and there will be severe ramifications for her actions unfortunately. Hopefully she gets the help she needs, but her career as a professional pilot maybe over.



I don't think you understand how the profession works these days. They'll get a formal explanation from the pilot and most likely the pilot won't miss their next trip. The FAA won't get involved at all. It's a company thing not federal. Through industry cultural changes there's a lot more willingness and mandate to find out what went wrong for any given event, fix it, and learn from it.


OK since you do seem to know how the profession works, watch the video and explain how any airline would let her make her next trip, regardless of the explanation. It scares the hell out of me think someone in the "profession" such as yourself would be so reckless, both for her safety and those of the passengers.
 
slider
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 13, 2017 4:41 pm

30west wrote:
Where do I start , these post prove my belief that 90% of people have no idea what they are talking about.

Hogan wasn't around when pilot was hired, the pilot will lose her medical first and first use sick/vacation then go on LTD its in the contract, the union will assist the pilot into the FAA approved EAP/HIMS program where it could go either way as far as flying again, if the pilot were to jump thru all the hoops someday my guess is couple of years the pilot may return to the line. The pilot would be requalified as a Captain and be in an extended monitoring program. (though on rare occasion a deal is cut to keep a job but must stay as F/O, unlikely in this case).

As far as being fired, that is not how it works, even alcohol /drug addiction won't get you fired anymore unless a second occurrence happens, the HIMS program at the US airlines are extremely successful approaching 90% success rate at returning pilots to the company, after a very rigorous and extended monitoring program.



Spot on. I say that not because I want or don’t want her back flying—I’m ambivalent but very wary about her overall mental makeup—but because real life is far more gray than what most posters here are stating.

But the union will work with the airline, she’ll get her counseling or whatever, show contrition (whether genuine or not—I feel it will be once she realizes she literally just threw away possible DECADES of investment into her career, not to mention earnings potential) and they’ll clear her to fly again. Now, whether the FAA does is another thing altogether. I know some pilots who’ve had minor medical deals but took 6-9 months just to get cleared. This is something FAR more egregious and critical. I don’t know if an “industry” or FAA standard exists for benchmarking someone’s mental health, but it should exist.

And I’m of the belief that all pilots should undergo a routine re-evaluation beyond merely the Hogan at employment time. Moreover, if her grounding is protracted, who wants to fly with her? She’s going to be damaged goods. Even in the pilot ranks, there will be many sympathetic people, to be sure, but when you’re contemplating going wheels up, do you want her on the flight deck with you? I would not.

Frankly, I’m sick and tired of bizarre shit like this happening to UA as well. They just can’t catch a break.



And I totally agree with Gasman and his assessment as well.
 
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b727fa
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 13, 2017 5:11 pm

Gasman wrote:
30west wrote:
Gasman

Ahh... how do I say it nicely, you're wrong , personally involved with returning pilots in mental illness situations and substance abuse situations, it has happened at this and other airlines I have worked at in the past. Takes a long time and more don't make it back than do make it back when its the mental illness situation.

As far as your alcohol/drugs you're 100% wrong again, no idea where you work but the majority of rehabbed pilots are actually caught while at work (layover, reporting or post flight) Its a rare occurrence actually but like I said 90% get their job back after completing the program at an ALPA carrier, maybe you don't work at an ALPA carrier.


Please provide me with examples of pilots who have been intoxicated at work, behave inappropriately around passengers, and then returned to work in cockpit of a legacy carrier.

http://www.nytimes.com/1990/10/27/us/pr ... drunk.html
My comments/opinions are my own and are not to be construed as the opinion(s) of my employer.
 
Gasman
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Tue Feb 14, 2017 1:23 am

b727fa - in the example you gave above, the pilots went to prison; and the example given by apfpilot in #79 is in *no way* comparable to the situation in discussion here. Those pilots broke "bottle to throttle" time; a very serious but not irredeemable offence. Whereas the pilot in question in this current thread will almost certainly be shown to have been suffering from a psychotic episode. Yes, it's very sad; and I can see that her situation was probably not self-inflicted (although we don't know) but it's highly, highly unlikely she'll ever be allowed in the cockpit of a commercial aircraft again.
 
CATIIIevery5yrs
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 20, 2017 6:36 am

SWADawg wrote:
CATIIIevery5yrs wrote:
SWADawg wrote:
She's probably done. The FAA will probably suspend her medical due to psychological reasons and it will be very difficult and time consuming for her to get it back. If she does manage to get it back, she will still face discipline from UA for her actions. Pilots rightly or wrongly are held to a higher standard than most other jobs and there will be severe ramifications for her actions unfortunately. Hopefully she gets the help she needs, but her career as a professional pilot maybe over.



I don't think you understand how the profession works these days. They'll get a formal explanation from the pilot and most likely the pilot won't miss their next trip. The FAA won't get involved at all. It's a company thing not federal. Through industry cultural changes there's a lot more willingness and mandate to find out what went wrong for any given event, fix it, and learn from it.


Yeah, I'm a Commercial Airline Pilot, so I think I do understand how the profession works these days since I've been in it for close to 20 years. I take no pleasure in seeing a fellow pilot in a situation like this, but the fact is the FAA takes these types of events very seriously. They can and most likely will suspend her medical which she must possess in order to fly as a pilot for United Airlines. There is nothing that comes into play with the ADA, or any other entity that can change that outcome. Pilots have different sets of rules that they must adhere to in order to exercise their privileges as a professional pilot, and while I don't always agree with the FAA's sometimes zero tolerance policies especially when it comes to areas of psychological issues, those are the rules that I and every commercial pilot must operate under. ALPA does have programs in place to help pilots that may be struggling with drugs, alcohol abuse, divorce, death of a loved one, you name it. But the caveat is that the pilot has to voluntarily come forward and ask for help before there is an incident like this and not after. I do hope this pilot gets the help she needs, but I'm under absolutely no illusion that she will be allowed back in the air anytime soon.


If you're a commerical airline pilot, a SWAPA person as your name suggests, your SWA culture has failed you once again.
 
SAAFNAV
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 20, 2017 1:57 pm

aviatorcraig wrote:
Just think for a minute about the potential of her being a Federal Flight Deck Officer and legally carrying a weapon...


Yeah, imagine how much more damage she could do with 15 rounds in a magazine, vs flying a plane into the ground.

Mentally disturbed is mentally disturbed, and no matter your weapon, if you are pushed to the extreme anyone could do what they 'need' to do.
I suggest not using your political agenda against the FFDO program instead of focusing on the issue here.
L-382 Loadmaster; ex C-130B Navigator
 
mcdu
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Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 20, 2017 2:26 pm

CATIIIevery5yrs wrote:

If you're a commerical airline pilot, a SWAPA person as your name suggests, your SWA culture has failed you once again.


I know if I she were to return I wouldn't want to be the one to fly with her.

While the method listed by SWAPA may not be the UAL HIMS method I would prefer that mehtod to the one UA has in place.

If she were to return and have a repeat performance can you imagine fallout? UA needs to balance that risk and hopefully they will not allow her the opportunity to reoffend.
 
gzm
Posts: 364
Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2014 1:52 pm

Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 20, 2017 6:29 pm

aircatalonia wrote:
Imagine a gate agent going to work in plain clothes and lecturing paying assengers about politics. Me thinks she would lose her job on the spot.

I say give her a second chance, at check in or reservations

First of all, there are passengers who shouldn't be allowed onboard yet they are: those who lose their temper at the gate and who threaten you.Once,a passenger who had family problems-perfectly normal-threatened to hit me with a fire extinguisher.The reason? his flight was late.I called the station control to deny him boarding, to no avail.I called the police,they came over and the only thing they told me:"you were right and you lost your point!" He was allowed to board like a gentleman.Some passengers openly took his side.... Or,take for instance those pilots who routinely will let a co-pilot perform a difficult approach in torrential rain, only to crash-land. Once I wrote about that in a similar Greek site.I said: "it is common secret" only to be rebuked."If we didn't do that,they would never practice" and I had to apologize. Some pilots think they are instructors. Finally,there are those who have never given the slightest sign of incompetence,yet the worst happens,so what is the point? And now,to reply to your comment, you say
I say give her a second chance, at check in or reservations
You are speaking about the lady pilot."Throw her a bone",not even in Flight Dispatch. As for myself,after various minor episodes at the gates(and six applications for a transfer to the check in) the general manager of passenger service had only this to say arrogantly: "why is gzm doing all this?just because he wants a transfer?" You see the futility my friend: If they like her,they will help her.If not, that's the chance they have been waiting for. And that's all,folks!
 
747megatop
Posts: 1748
Joined: Wed May 23, 2007 8:22 am

Re: Uniformless UA Pilot Removed From Flight After Bizarre Rant

Mon Feb 20, 2017 9:12 pm

spacecadet wrote:
coolian2 wrote:
have had some kind of mental or emotional breakdown at some time in their lives. And those people are flying planes, driving trains and buses, operating construction equipment,

...or could be holding the "top job" in govt and running the country & the free world.

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