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Did EI ever consider the 777-200 ER
Just wondering did EI ever take a serious look at the 777-200ER. It was launched around the time EI was looking at the A330?
Re: Did EI ever consider the 777-200 ER
I dont know, but would think the 772ER would have been too big / too much range for EI routes, certainly back then..
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Re: Did EI ever consider the 777-200 ER
The A330 was probably a better fit and had crew training advantages when they needed crew ex A320 - they may even have been able to negotiate better terms with airbus as a result of a larger combined order. They didn't need the range advantages back then either
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Re: Did EI ever consider the 777-200 ER
I believe they took 3 or 4 of the Air Inter A333 used and got a good deal?
Re: Did EI ever consider the 777-200 ER
I'm sure they looked at it. They would've been negligent to not.
But clearly decided that it wasn't the frame for them... and reasonably so: it's a lot of both capacity and range, for a relatively small airline who didn't fly, nor plan to fly, routes of any demanding distance.
But clearly decided that it wasn't the frame for them... and reasonably so: it's a lot of both capacity and range, for a relatively small airline who didn't fly, nor plan to fly, routes of any demanding distance.
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
Re: Did EI ever consider the 777-200 ER
They needed the 330s much earlier. They were the second operator to take delivery.
Re: Did EI ever consider the 777-200 ER
And wasn't there some political influence on the decision to go Airbus too, given the amount of EU aid Ireland was receiving at the time ?
Re: Did EI ever consider the 777-200 ER
JannEejit wrote:And wasn't there some political influence on the decision to go Airbus too, given the amount of EU aid Ireland was receiving at the time ?
Or, for all the reasons above it was simply the better fitting plane for EIs geographical position and route structure?
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Re: Did EI ever consider the 777-200 ER
Also on the 330 they chose GE instead of RR engines. I always wondered how this came about. But it seems to have been a close relationship regarding engine development / improvements.
I'm surprised this didn't give Boeing a chance with the 787 as the 330NEO and 350 are exclusively RR.
I'm surprised this didn't give Boeing a chance with the 787 as the 330NEO and 350 are exclusively RR.
Last edited by RandWkop on Wed Apr 19, 2017 8:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Did EI ever consider the 777-200 ER
It was looked at but was never a serious option for EI at that time. As suggested above too big of an aircraft,EU politics and they wanted an all Airbus fleet.
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- TheGeordielad
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Re: Did EI ever consider the 777-200 ER
col wrote:I believe they took 3 or 4 of the Air Inter A333 used and got a good deal?
No only 1 EI-ORD
Re: Did EI ever consider the 777-200 ER
OA260 wrote:It was looked at but was never a serious option for EI at that time. As suggested above too big of an aircraft,EU politics and they wanted an all Airbus fleet.
I don't think an all Airbus fleet mattered when they originally went for the 330....
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- Clydenairways
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Re: Did EI ever consider the 777-200 ER
aerorobnz wrote:The A330 was probably a better fit and had crew training advantages when they needed crew ex A320 - they may even have been able to negotiate better terms with airbus as a result of a larger combined order. They didn't need the range advantages back then either
They were a 737 operator at the time..... The A330 was the first airbus for EI.
At the time, EI had a very small TA operation with just 3 747's.... I understand that another option considered was to replace the 747-100 with some second hand 747-200's with GE engines.
Also the A330 cargo capacity enabled them to get rid of both the DC8F as well as the 747's.
Re: Did EI ever consider the 777-200 ER
Some of the EI 747 fleet were leased over the years to other airlines during quiet periods as far as I recall, probably due to their size and the seasonal nature of Irish tourism. Aer Lingus Originally intended to replace the 747-100's with 767-300ERs and two 767s were leased from 1991-1994 approx, but they too spent periods being leased to other airlines and somewhere between that and the departure of the 747s in the mid 90's, the decision was made to order A330s instead. I don't think their first A330 delivery in 1994 was related to commonality with the A320 fleet because the first A321 was only delivered to the airline in 1998, with A320s following after that, and EI continued to operate 737s up until around 2005.
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- BrianDromey
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Re: Did EI ever consider the 777-200 ER
There is clearly posters on this thread who are typing what they would like to be true, but most of it isn't.
EI had an ageing 747 fleet, it was too big, too thirsty and had high cycles due to the SNN stopover. They had 2x 767-300s, which were intended for LAX, but the approval got tied up in red tape. Somehow, EI never got on with the 767 and quickly leased them out to other operators, for various periods. The 777 did launch around 1994, but a combination of availability, range and passenger capacity were too much for EI at that time.
Airbus are reputed to have offered a deal which EI couldn't refuse and the better cargo capability over the 767 must have been attractive too. The A330s were available quickly (so quickly one was delivered in white, with a 9 arrest Air Inter cabin). The later A330-200 was suitable for the west coast, once it was finally approved.
EI had an ageing 747 fleet, it was too big, too thirsty and had high cycles due to the SNN stopover. They had 2x 767-300s, which were intended for LAX, but the approval got tied up in red tape. Somehow, EI never got on with the 767 and quickly leased them out to other operators, for various periods. The 777 did launch around 1994, but a combination of availability, range and passenger capacity were too much for EI at that time.
Airbus are reputed to have offered a deal which EI couldn't refuse and the better cargo capability over the 767 must have been attractive too. The A330s were available quickly (so quickly one was delivered in white, with a 9 arrest Air Inter cabin). The later A330-200 was suitable for the west coast, once it was finally approved.
Re: Did EI ever consider the 777-200 ER
BrianDromey wrote:Airbus are reputed to have offered a deal which EI couldn't refuse and the better cargo capability over the 767 must have been attractive too. The A330s were available quickly (so quickly one was delivered in white, with a 9 arrest Air Inter cabin).
I think that's probably the most likely explanation for the A330 order. Its order books upon launch weren't exactly overflowing, so Aer Lingus were probably in a position to get a great deal on them. I think Airbus took an order for only one A330 frame in 1993. Am I right in saying that one of the original 3 A330s that EI ordered was actually built for Air Inter but transferred to EI after it was built?
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- TheGeordielad
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Re: Did EI ever consider the 777-200 ER
EI321 wrote:BrianDromey wrote:Airbus are reputed to have offered a deal which EI couldn't refuse and the better cargo capability over the 767 must have been attractive too. The A330s were available quickly (so quickly one was delivered in white, with a 9 arrest Air Inter cabin).
I think that's probably the most likely explanation for the A330 order. Its order books upon launch weren't exactly overflowing, so Aer Lingus were probably in a position to get a great deal on them. I think Airbus took an order for only one A330 frame in 1993. Am I right in saying that one of the original 3 A330s that EI ordered was actually built for Air Inter but transferred to EI after it was built?
I don't think so.They had 5 older A333s.They took delivery of 4 A333s in 1993/1994 and they were delivered directly to Aer Lingus but then in 1997 they took delivery of A330-301 EI-ORD in 1997 and it spend 4 or 3 years at air inter.I don't believe of the 4 delivered 1993/1994 were for anyone but Aer Lingus which that's where they ended up.
Re: Did EI ever consider the 777-200 ER
From my rather vague memory of the time all the initial A330s delivered to EI had at the time of construction been intended for Air Inter but the French airline had for whatever reason wished to offload the hulls and with Airbus keen to launch the aircraft on transatlantic operations a significant discount was offered to EI allowing them to be amongst the first to press the aircraft into service and the very first to launch longhaul operations.
Aer Lingus was instrumental in route proving the A330s ETOPS capabilities across the Atlantic. This was of massive importance to Airbus as it attempted to prove to the world that twin engines was the future at a time when many airlines felt nervous about the concept of flying over the Atlantic with just 2 engines. Something which BA and UA were doing for Boeing with the 777 not long after.
Please feel free to correct my facts if iv missed something.
Aer Lingus was instrumental in route proving the A330s ETOPS capabilities across the Atlantic. This was of massive importance to Airbus as it attempted to prove to the world that twin engines was the future at a time when many airlines felt nervous about the concept of flying over the Atlantic with just 2 engines. Something which BA and UA were doing for Boeing with the 777 not long after.
Please feel free to correct my facts if iv missed something.
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