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TK787
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Turkish Aviation May 2017

Mon May 01, 2017 12:41 am

Hello there Turkish Aviation fans,
Welcome to our May edition. It is almost summer and we can all feel it.

You can find the Turkish Aviation April 2017 thread here:
viewtopic.php?p=19507647#p19507647



-Borajet no more?? Rumors say TK will get all its pilots and the jets. Let’s see what happens.
-It seems like after pondering the idea for a while, TK will receive TC-LCK (77W) instead of IR. Questions still remain: Did TK want to sell it? Will TK try to sell it in the near future? What happened at the end?
-TK’s Ilker Ayci says, all TK’s parked planes are flying now. Let’s see what Yakamoz has to say about this :)
-Electronics bans to US and UK still on. TK will be handing out laptops to J customers next week.
-Also, there was the "How come ESB doesn't get more nonstop international flights"posts, please continue here also.

Please join with your view, news, photos, rumors and good old sense of humor. Stay away from personal attacks and political mumbo jumbo :)
Most importantly, Happy Landings and Safe Travels to all.
 
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TK105
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Mon May 01, 2017 6:16 am

President Erdogan is visiting India today. Lets see, if he can pursuade Indian side to change the bileteral for more rights for TK.
The future is in the skies.
 
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globetrotter94
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Mon May 01, 2017 8:09 am

TK105 wrote:
President Erdogan is visiting India today. Lets see, if he can pursuade Indian side to change the bileteral for more rights for TK.


I certainly hope so, especially for cities like Kolkata and Amritsar, which are just crying for a direct link to Europe, and which TK earlier stated it was interested in flying to.
6E, 9W, AF, AI, B6, BA, BI, BR, CA, DN, GA, IC, JL, KB, KL, KU, NH, QR, SQ, TG, TK, UA, VS
 
anshabhi
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Mon May 01, 2017 8:25 am

Kolkata specially.. For western European airlines, CCU takes 12+ hours, which means multiple aircraft need to be deployed. This is one of the major reasons why it doesn't have any flight to Europe.
For TK however, CCU would take only 10 hours.

The only problem is bilaterals can't be increased until Indian airlines use atleast 80% of their quota. As of now, I don't see enough O&D demand for any Indian airline to fly to Turkey...
 
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OA260
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Mon May 01, 2017 8:27 am

TK787 wrote:
Hello there Turkish Aviation fans,
Welcome to our May edition. It is almost summer and we can all feel it.

-Borajet no more?? Rumors say TK will get all its pilots and the jets. Let’s see what happens.
-It seems like after pondering the idea for a while, TK will receive TC-LCK (77W) instead of IR. Questions still remain: Did TK want to sell it? Will TK .


Thanks for the new thread . It would be a shme to see Borajet go.
 
northstar80
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Mon May 01, 2017 9:29 am

Hi Friends, I have been flying heavily lately and wanted to share with you some observations..
- SAW: Horrible for international departures. A nightmare in the mornings. I will not use SAW again for international flights unless it is my only option. Last week, I waited 30 minutes in the entrance security, 20 minutes to check in, 45 minutes for OHAL Green passport counter.. I spent 40 minutes in the passport controls (thank you for placing only 4 passport officers), just when I made about half the line, I figured out that there is a Fastpass for 30tl. I went out of the main line and bought the fastpass, otherwise I would have missed the flight. Is SAW doing this deliberately to sell more Fastpass? All in all nightmare experience. Completely opposite of IST Ataturk.

- Boarding process for TK is still a mess. Both at IST/SAW and outstations. At one point they were annoucing the start of the boarding and priority to travellers with babies, Business Class and Elite/Elite Plus. But I have not seen this lately, in neither of my around 10 flights. Maybe now it is not used anymore? As soon as boarding starts, people pile up at the entrance of the gate and the whole thing turns into chaos.

- Why does TK rarely announce the delays in flights in the airport screens? I noticed that they rarely do this. In fact, in my last flight, which was supposed to take off at 6:55, and start of boarding was 5:55, the screens showed no delay until 6:30 and showed only 30 minutes. I boarded at 7:30, 1 hour and 30 minutes later than scheduled and the screens were still showing 30 minutes. (in this case the plane arrived very late from its arriving flight, so TK knew the delay from hours ago). I have this happen to me all the time, do you guys also have similar experiences? It puts passengers off seriously, because, you run to the gate expecting the boarding to start, then just wait there for 90 minutes without an announcement.
 
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Yakamoz
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Mon May 01, 2017 11:41 am

Thanks for the new thread, TK787!

TK787 wrote:
-TK’s Ilker Ayci says, all TK’s parked planes are flying now. Let’s see what Yakamoz has to say about this :)


Well, do not believe what some managers say. :)
But AFAIK the situation is better than last month. As of today, 29 planes not flying for more than 4 days. Here are the birds:

Image

20 of 29 planes not flying for more than 30 days. 9 of 29 are not flying since 2016.

This birds will leave fleet:

TC-JAI --> Cobalt Air
TC-JPU --> Viva Colombiaco
TC-JPV --> Viva Colombiaco
TC-JLM/JLN/JLP --> Shaheen Air
TC-JNG --> Eurowings

4 more A320 and 1 A330-200 (TC-JNF) will leave the fleet this year too.
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Tue May 02, 2017 2:52 pm

TK and COPA commencing codesharing. TK will initially place its code on CM flights from PTY to:

David Panama
Porto Alegre, Rio de Janeiro, Manaus, Belo Horizonte & Sao Paulo in Brazil;
Santo Domingo and Punta Cana in Dominican Republic;
Guayaquil and Quito in Ecuador;
San Salvador El Salvador;
Asunción Paraguay
Lima in Peru.

Pending governmental approvals will be expanded to cover flights to:
Cancun, Guadalajara and Mexico City Mexico;
Managua Nicaragua;
San José Costa Rica
Montevideo Uruguay

CM will place its code on service to IST to begin with and in future add up to 22 beyond markets on TK.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Tue May 02, 2017 3:25 pm

Regarding Erdogan's India state visit, looks like per the official communique that among many things, the parties agreed to expand "trade, tourism and transportation" between them. Hopefully that includes more air service.

I also found it interesting that the Turkish side stated that in addition to TK desires, Atlasjet also wants to enter the India market. Turkish side also encourage Air India to establish more cooperative ventures with TK.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
anshabhi
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Tue May 02, 2017 3:40 pm

LAXintl wrote:
Regarding Erdogan's India state visit, looks like per the official communique that among many things, the parties agreed to expand "trade, tourism and transportation" between them. Hopefully that includes more air service.

I also found it interesting that the Turkish side stated that in addition to TK desires, Atlasjet also wants to enter the India market. Turkish side also encourage Air India to establish more cooperative ventures with TK.


I feel like there's a scope for some Indian carrier to try IST. DEL-IST, whenever​ I check is usually more expensive DEL-LHR, despite being 2 hours shorter. Around $750 for 6.5 hour roundtrip..

Probably 6E should consider it when it begins stretching its NEOs.
 
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globetrotter94
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Tue May 02, 2017 10:51 pm

Rather interesting news here about TK considering acquisition of Borajet E-190s. Could this be the beginning of a regional arm for TK--or perhaps incorporation into Anadolujet, or a regional subsidiary?

http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/turkis ... sCatID=349
6E, 9W, AF, AI, B6, BA, BI, BR, CA, DN, GA, IC, JL, KB, KL, KU, NH, QR, SQ, TG, TK, UA, VS
 
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LinaRibo
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Wed May 03, 2017 6:28 am

Good to hear. Much agitated and shaken by these circumstances with Erdogan and Turkish airfleet
 
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TK787
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Wed May 03, 2017 2:29 pm

Ohhhhh , TK :(
Why everything has to be sooooo difficult?
Earlier in the year I made reservations but I was told I could not select seats until today; 3 months out. Today I call and get the seats I wanted, but.... (there is always a but)...... not for the return. I have to call back again; 3 months from my return, to get the return seat assignments.
 
B777LRF
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Wed May 03, 2017 2:53 pm

Turkey has, for around 10 years, been in the top 3 of leisure destinations for tourists from the Nordics. Now they're gone from the rankings, with e.g. Danish travel agencies advising they'll cut offers to Turkey by a further 30% compared to last year. Keep that in mind, compared to last year - not the hay-days of 2014.

Tourism seems to be in terminal decline, owing to a mix of factors including the worsening security situation, the 'coup' attempt and Erdogans antics on the national and global scene. Perhaps, with the new-found love between Turkey and Russia, Turkey may win back some of what it lost with the help of Russian tourists. Great idea if you ask me; the Russian tourists get Turkey and the rest of us get the rest of the Med.*

*Some travel agencies have begun advertising 'no Russian tourists at this hotel'. I've seen Russian tourists 'in action', and I'll go to extremes in order to avoid that again.
Signature. You just read one.
 
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LH748
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Wed May 03, 2017 6:57 pm

TK787 wrote:
Ohhhhh , TK :(
Why everything has to be sooooo difficult?
Earlier in the year I made reservations but I was told I could not select seats until today; 3 months out. Today I call and get the seats I wanted, but.... (there is always a but)...... not for the return. I have to call back again; 3 months from my return, to get the return seat assignments.


Oh I remember this situation when I had booked FRA-IST-LAX-IST-FRA some time ago. First I found it odd that I could not select seats at booking and then they made me come back again to do it all.
Wondering what reasoning is behind this decision. Except for TK I have not come across such a procedure with any other airline.
306 310 318 319 320 321 333 343 388 ATR72 733 737 738 739 743 744 748 752 753 763 764 772 77W 788 CRJ7 CRJ9 E170 F100 MD11 RJ1H
AA AB AC AF AK AZ BA DE DL EW FD FR HF HG IB IR MF KU LH LT LX OD TG TK TP UA VJ VN WN W6 YP YW
 
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Spiderguy252
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Wed May 03, 2017 7:04 pm

There are plenty of destinations that Indian carriers will explore before touching Turkey.

How about Malaysia, which AI and 9W have waved the white flag on years ago? Air Asia, Malindo and MH seem to be mopping up all the traffic, I find it difficult to believe that no Indian carrier can launch KUL in spite of having multiple dailies and good yields on BKK/SIN/HKG.

Or Kenya, which AI last flew during 2009? Vietnam? South Africa? 9W operated to both these places until earlier this decade. Or the big one - more of a presence in China.

Turkey surely doesn't justify flights for the moment when there are these lower hanging fruit waiting to be plucked.
Vahroone
 
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TK105
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Wed May 03, 2017 7:59 pm

Turkey imports around 6B$ goods from India and exports only 600M$ to India annually. If you look at custom taxes, Turkey applies a few percent on Indian goods. On the other hand, Turkish goods receives up to 100% tax at Indian borders. Now please tell us which way to go? Apply 500% tax to Indian goods, based on your above methodology?
The future is in the skies.
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Thu May 04, 2017 12:32 am

LH748 wrote:
Wondering what reasoning is behind this decision. Except for TK I have not come across such a procedure with any other airline.


Its simply because TK schedules very dynamically with lots of aircraft swaps, so opening seat reservations too early would cause the need to move and reassign seats potentially multiple times for customers.

Several others do similar - in Europe for example KLM does - https://www.klm.com/travel/us_en/about/ ... arture.htm

Multiple carriers in Asia region (KE, CI, etc) also do the same particularly for economy class.

Anyhow, to me and for bulk of customers its really not an issue when something like 85% of industry reservations occur within last 100 days.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
blrsea
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Thu May 04, 2017 2:27 am

TK105 wrote:
Turkey imports around 6B$ goods from India and exports only 600M$ to India annually. If you look at custom taxes, Turkey applies a few percent on Indian goods. On the other hand, Turkish goods receives up to 100% tax at Indian borders. Now please tell us which way to go? Apply 500% tax to Indian goods, based on your above methodology?


The trade is as per WTO rules. India is not singling out Turkey. If so, Turkey would have taken India to WTO. Trade imbalances will always be there with all countries. WTO agreement is made to ensure that a country treats all other equally. India cannot for e.g., just charge more duty on Turkey and less for other countries for same product, unless there is dumping or anything like that involved.Same goes for Turkey too.

One shouldn't compare WTO trade rules to civil aviation, as it isn't covered. And countries use that flexibility to make sure both countries can benefit from it, either economically, politically or diplomatically.
 
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globetrotter94
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Thu May 04, 2017 5:36 pm

TK105 wrote:
Turkey imports around 6B$ goods from India and exports only 600M$ to India annually. If you look at custom taxes, Turkey applies a few percent on Indian goods. On the other hand, Turkish goods receives up to 100% tax at Indian borders. Now please tell us which way to go? Apply 500% tax to Indian goods, based on your above methodology?


Indian trade policies are very protective in general. This does not only affect Turkey, but rather, it affects most countries, except the few with which India has signed FTAs.

Basically, the only way under the current system to increase flying rights between India and Turkey is to increase people-to-people and business contacts until O&D traffic increases to the point where an Indian airline is incentivized to start flights to Turkey. There are already efforts towards achieving this, what with PM Modi inviting Turkish infrastructure/construction companies to do business in India, and also consideration of a Indo-Turkish FTA. Indian tourism to Turkey is also increasing quite significantly, so all in all, it is quite possible that the situation may change in the near- to mid-term.

As an Indian with a great respect for Turkish culture, language, and history, as well as great admiration for TK itself, I certainly hope this happens sooner rather than later.
6E, 9W, AF, AI, B6, BA, BI, BR, CA, DN, GA, IC, JL, KB, KL, KU, NH, QR, SQ, TG, TK, UA, VS
 
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ankaraflyjet
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Thu May 04, 2017 6:22 pm

There is a report for Dubai and Emirates at anna.aero and the analysis concerning ESB is interesting and wanted to share the statistics here;

It is evident TK is reluctant to see ESB grow as an international hub as they are suppressing it to be a sole-feeder to their IST based operation but that should not limit ESB's options by others to launch flights in my opnion.

Top 15 unserved routes from Dubai as of 2016
(Estimated O&D traffic and connection potential from Emirates destinations, pax numbers)
Source: OAG Traffic Analyser data. *Excludes Emirates destinations in the same geographical region.

BERLIN TEGEL 1,470,121
MONTREAL 785,219
NAGOYA 649,405
ANKARA 454,162
GOTHENBURG 429,472
HANGZHOU 373,990
KINHASA 310,420
VARANASI 299,867
NAGPUR 279,269
DOUALA 257,745
TABRIZ 215,130
PATNA 154,160
DAVAO 119,933
BHUBANESHWAR 64,953
SRINAGAR 32,518

So among the list TXL cannot be served due to Germany UAE bilateral that does not give slots for a 5th destination in Germany,YUL is because they are permitted to one destination in Canada and that is YYZ for EK, NGO was dropped 5 years ago and can be reinstated with a smaller long haul a/c, ESB is 4th in the list. According to the report ESB is the most likely new destination by EK to be considered, may be they can do Dubai-Tabriz-Ankara-Tabriz-Ankara to launch two new routes at one flight and can justify a wide body or pair ESB with an extension to SAW ( DXB-ESB-SAW-ESB-DXB) and relaunch SAW with ESB at the same time...Any thoughts???



TK787 wrote:
Hello there Turkish Aviation fans,
Welcome to our May edition. It is almost summer and we can all feel it.

You can find the Turkish Aviation April 2017 thread here:
viewtopic.php?p=19507647#p19507647



-Borajet no more?? Rumors say TK will get all its pilots and the jets. Let’s see what happens.
-It seems like after pondering the idea for a while, TK will receive TC-LCK (77W) instead of IR. Questions still remain: Did TK want to sell it? Will TK try to sell it in the near future? What happened at the end?
-TK’s Ilker Ayci says, all TK’s parked planes are flying now. Let’s see what Yakamoz has to say about this :)
-Electronics bans to US and UK still on. TK will be handing out laptops to J customers next week.
-Also, there was the "How come ESB doesn't get more nonstop international flights"posts, please continue here also.

Please join with your view, news, photos, rumors and good old sense of humor. Stay away from personal attacks and political mumbo jumbo :)
Most importantly, Happy Landings and Safe Travels to all.
 
flyingqueen
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Thu May 04, 2017 7:01 pm

When will Turkish Airlines fly to Australia? I thought via DPS?
 
TheGeordielad
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Thu May 04, 2017 7:50 pm

[quote="ankaraflyjet"]There is a report for Dubai and Emirates at anna.aero and the analysis concerning ESB is interesting and wanted to share the statistics here;

It is evident TK is reluctant to see ESB grow as an international hub as they are suppressing it to be a sole-feeder to their IST based operation but that should not limit ESB's options by others to launch flights in my opnion.

Top 15 unserved routes from Dubai as of 2016
(Estimated O&D traffic and connection potential from Emirates destinations, pax numbers)
Source: OAG Traffic Analyser data. *Excludes Emirates destinations in the same geographical region.

BERLIN TEGEL 1,470,121
MONTREAL 785,219
NAGOYA 649,405
ANKARA 454,162
GOTHENBURG 429,472
HANGZHOU 373,990
KINHASA 310,420
VARANASI 299,867
NAGPUR 279,269
DOUALA 257,745
TABRIZ 215,130
PATNA 154,160
DAVAO 119,933
BHUBANESHWAR 64,953
SRINAGAR 32,518

So among the list TXL cannot be served due to Germany UAE bilateral that does not give slots for a 5th destination in Germany,YUL is because they are permitted to one destination in Canada and that is YYZ for EK, NGO was dropped 5 years ago and can be reinstated with a smaller long haul a/c, ESB is 4th in the list. According to the report ESB is the most likely new destination by EK to be considered, may be they can do Dubai-Tabriz-Ankara-Tabriz-Ankara to launch two new routes at one flight and can justify a wide body or pair ESB with an extension to SAW ( DXB-ESB-SAW-ESB-DXB) and relaunch SAW with ESB at the same time...Any thoughts???

-----------

I can definalty see EK starting ESB but most likely with a direct flight.
 
TheGeordielad
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Thu May 04, 2017 7:55 pm

flyingqueen wrote:
When will Turkish Airlines fly to Australia? I thought via DPS?

Since the military coup and the unfortunate attacks in turkey and Istanbul mainly (Rip to does that have unfortunately passed away)
TK has focus on maintening current routes and I believe aren't too bothered about adding too many new destinations. This is what I remember seeing.
 
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mafaky
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Thu May 04, 2017 8:03 pm

flyingqueen wrote:
When will Turkish Airlines fly to Australia? I thought via DPS?


Not in the foreseeable future, I'm afraid.

No recent hearings about that DPS stopover, anyway!...
A veteran Electronics & Communications Engineer from Istanbul-Turkey, highly interested in civil and military aviation.
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Thu May 04, 2017 9:04 pm

Turkish Airlines has elevated the standing of the Cargo division and created its first C-suite executive Turhan Ozen as Chief Cargo Officer who comes from freight forwarder background.

Below an interview with him:
Turkish Cargo’s new boss brings forwarders to the fore
http://aircargoworld.com/turkish-cargos ... o-the-fore


Regarding DXB-ESB, those O&D number listed in Reply#24 are nonsense as they combine just about every potential beyond connection market and assumes there is no other options or competition for such traffic to flow via. In reality no demand near the listed daily 1245 passengers for simply a Dubai flight.
Though in my opinion if anyone would fly the route, then someone like FlyDubai would be better placed using a 737 as fit its their network strategy.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
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ankaraflyjet
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Fri May 05, 2017 1:13 am

The article also suggests FlyDubai opiton, rather than the airline the market seems to be there, let's hope we will be able to see this materializing...Of course TK would be most preferred as being Turkish citizens we favor our National airline more than any other. TK's 737-900's are very suitable for the route..

LAXintl wrote:
Turkish Airlines has elevated the standing of the Cargo division and created its first C-suite executive Turhan Ozen as Chief Cargo Officer who comes from freight forwarder background.

Below an interview with him:
Turkish Cargo’s new boss brings forwarders to the fore
http://aircargoworld.com/turkish-cargos ... o-the-fore


Regarding DXB-ESB, those O&D number listed in Reply#24 are nonsense as they combine just about every potential beyond connection market and assumes there is no other options or competition for such traffic to flow via. In reality no demand near the listed daily 1245 passengers for simply a Dubai flight.
Though in my opinion if anyone would fly the route, then someone like FlyDubai would be better placed using a 737 as fit its their network strategy.
 
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KarelXWB
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Fri May 05, 2017 8:06 am

Another A330 comes out of storage:

Airbus A330 -223 1221 TC-JIY Turkish Airlines ferried 03may17 AYT-IST after storage ex PT-MVV
What we leave behind is not as important as how we've lived.
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Fri May 05, 2017 4:47 pm

MEA and TK signed codeshare on each other's service between Beirut and Istanbul effective late May. Currently ME operates double daily and TK has 3x daily.
According to the press release per Lebanese ambassador, Turkey is the #1 outbound market for Lebanese tourist.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
stylo777
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Fri May 05, 2017 6:00 pm

Dear Yakamoz, I find your TK fleet analysis very useful and informative. I truly appreciate your work and time you put into it.
I would also love to see the same for KK, 8Q and/or PC. It's a lot of work for sure, but maybe you'll consider it.
 
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Yakamoz
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Fri May 05, 2017 8:00 pm

stylo777 wrote:
Dear Yakamoz, I find your TK fleet analysis very useful and informative. I truly appreciate your work and time you put into it.
I would also love to see the same for KK, 8Q and/or PC. It's a lot of work for sure, but maybe you'll consider it.


Thank you for your kind words!
I do this sort of fleet analysis for all Turkish carrier's but haven't shared until now in detail. I check all birds in my Excel sheet (580+) every 2 weeks, sometimes every week.

The situation at KK is very good, no birds on ground. Some new special liveries on birds.

8Q has some birds in maintenance, others do not fly for unknown reasons.

Pegasus has some birds that will leave the fleet (TC-AAV/AAY/AAY/ABP) but overall very active fleet. New birds TC-CRC and -CRD have been sold to ALC and will leave fleet after delivery. New paint in EMA and lease to TAROM.
 
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AirbusA343
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Sat May 06, 2017 11:04 am

TC-JIV has been ferried to SAW. The only A332 left are now TC-JIM, TC-JIN, TC-JNE and TC-JNF/JNG if they count. TC-JUI made a weird flight to Ljubljana.
 
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TK105
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Sat May 06, 2017 8:21 pm

Newly released DHMI April 2017 traffic statistics give us some good news or at least some hope. Overall Turkey traffic is no more negative, but at 0% growth. Other than IST, generally all major airports perform good in this circuimstances including AYT which is around 0%. IST is still at -4% which means TK is also down around -2%. ESB is performing good at +7% (intl +22%). I think we still need to see results for May or even June to predict 2017 tourism performance of Turkey.

Next week's IDEF2017 will be the most important exhibition of Turkey for years. I'm looking forward for it. Visiting TR-Jet, TAI and other local aviation companies will be very exhiting.
The future is in the skies.
 
Jetty
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Sat May 06, 2017 8:27 pm

TK105 wrote:
Next week's IDEF2017 will be the most important exhibition of Turkey for years.

:? I'ts held every two years, and always in Turkey. How can it be the most important exhibition for years?
 
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OA260
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Sat May 06, 2017 8:32 pm

TK105 wrote:
I think we still need to see results for May or even June to predict 2017 tourism performance of Turkey.



Turkish Tourism are running free trips for press and travel agents to try to get people selling it again. I have seen deals for would be tourists EUR199 in 4* hotels from Dublin for 7 nights and they are finding it hard to fill seats even at those prices !
 
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TK105
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Sat May 06, 2017 8:50 pm

Jetty wrote:
I'ts held every two years, and always in Turkey. How can it be the most important exhibition for years?

Because recently Turkey is going through some major achievements in aviation technology and IDEF2017 is the podium for it.
The future is in the skies.
 
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KarelXWB
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Sat May 06, 2017 9:06 pm

AirbusA343 wrote:
TC-JIV has been ferried to SAW. The only A332 left are now TC-JIM, TC-JIN, TC-JNE and TC-JNF/JNG if they count. TC-JUI made a weird flight to Ljubljana.


I understood TC-JIM is undergoing maintenance right now.
What we leave behind is not as important as how we've lived.
 
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ankaraflyjet
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Sun May 07, 2017 2:10 am

ESB still is the leader in terms of growth numbers among Turkey's big five airports and the international traffic growth of 22% at a time when TK (other than Moscow, Jeddah and Medina for the month of March, Frankfurt added in April) has refrained itself from the capital is very impressive in my opinion.

TK should look at reinstating the following flights (these routes were operated by TK before at different times);

ESB-FRA-ESB (should be yearround)
ESB-DUS-ESB
ESB-CDG(or ORY)-ESB
ESB-MUC-ESB (codeshare with LH can be tried again)
ESB-BRU-ESB (codeshare with SN will be a good idea)
ESB-AMS-ESB
ESB-CPH-ESB (will commence as seasonal next month but can be year-round)
ESB-ARN-ESB (codeshare with SK will be a good idea)
ESB-ZRH-ESB (codeshare with LX will be a good idea) (**)
ESB-GVA-ESB (yearround) (codeshare with LX will be a good idea) (**)
ESB-IKA-ESB
ESB-TEB-ESB

(*) TK's first ever international flight historically was Ankara-Athens via Istanbul on 12 February 1947 so this flight should be given TK001 number as a vintage prestige flight
(**) ZRH and GVA flights can be a triangle route as ESB-ZRH-GVA-ESB also

TK should introduce the following new routes;

ESB-DXB-ESB
ESB-FCO-ESB
ESB-ATH-ESB (seasonal only) (Codeshare with Aegean will be a good idea) (*)
ESB-BEI-ESB (codeshare with ME will be a good idea)
ESB-LHR-ESB (could be LGW too if LHR slots are full or shift one of the IST-LHR-IST flights to ESB and replace the IST LHR lost capacity by making IST LHR IST exclusively a widebody operated route 777 and/or 330, now it is a mix of wide and narrow body)

Upon these routes launched TK should look into;

ESB-JFK-ESB (3 weekly)
ESB-IAD-ESB (2 weekly)
or alternatively ESB-JFK-IAD-JFK-ESB (Codeshare with UA is a good idea)

TK should concentrate on International to Domestic traffic via ESB and international to international traffic via IST ideally that will take some pressure off IST too..

TK105 wrote:
Newly released DHMI April 2017 traffic statistics give us some good news or at least some hope. Overall Turkey traffic is no more negative, but at 0% growth. Other than IST, generally all major airports perform good in this circuimstances including AYT which is around 0%. IST is still at -4% which means TK is also down around -2%. ESB is performing good at +7% (intl +22%). I think we still need to see results for May or even June to predict 2017 tourism performance of Turkey.

Next week's IDEF2017 will be the most important exhibition of Turkey for years. I'm looking forward for it. Visiting TR-Jet, TAI and other local aviation companies will be very exhiting.
 
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TK105
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Sun May 07, 2017 6:50 am

ankaraflyjet wrote:
TK should concentrate on International to Domestic traffic via ESB and international to international traffic via IST ideally that will take some pressure off IST too..

I agree every sentence in your message. If Ankara People were not this much nationalistic, TK Ankara operations would have collapsed by now and we could have seen many airlines in ESB. Unfortunately todays government is Ankarafobic and I do not forsee any of these flights happening soon.

Ankara used to have a big banking industry too, which all were forced to move to Istanbul in recent years (I know : a lot of people who had to resign, separated families, divorces, you name it). In todays communication standards we have, there is no reasonable explanation moving a complete banking industry to another city (OK it helped a lot to construction industry and people benefiting from it, you know what I mean). Perhaps in some 20-30 years, some people have a desire to have a seperate administration for Bosporus and Dardanels like after 1st WW, a la Hong Kong or Singapore, then it makes perfectly sense of course.

I'm personally frequent flyer to some of these routes you mention (AMS, DXB and lately IKA after the end of sanctions). For DXB, I already use QR and I'm sure EK will come someday as TK can not avoid this forever. In other topics, EK's desire for ESB is already being discussed. For IKA, I'll use TK till IR renews its fleet as it is already flying to ESB.
The future is in the skies.
 
LJ
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Sun May 07, 2017 7:08 am

OA260 wrote:
TK105 wrote:
I think we still need to see results for May or even June to predict 2017 tourism performance of Turkey.



Turkish Tourism are running free trips for press and travel agents to try to get people selling it again. I have seen deals for would be tourists EUR199 in 4* hotels from Dublin for 7 nights and they are finding it hard to fill seats even at those prices !


Turkish airlines (like Onur and AtlasGlobal) have moved capacity from Western Europe to Russia. AtlasGlobal even intends to open AYT-BGW twice weekly during peak Summer. As such I wouldn't be surprised if traffic figures for AYT remain flat for the year. Moreover, due to the bad weather in Western Europe and the (sometimes ridiculous) high prices you pay for a Summer holidays in Spain, Portugal and other popular destinations, Turkey may actually have a chance to get some bookings (as it's really dirt cheap to have a Summer holiday in Turkey during Summer peak season nowadays). Moreover, some tour operators are offering free rebooking in case of an event in Turkey which might increase the security risk (at least that's what they do here in The Netherlands).
 
anshabhi
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Sun May 07, 2017 4:44 pm

TBH, I found Erodgan's wishes quite funny. He wanted everything that India doesn't wants to give!
 
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mafaky
Posts: 720
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Sun May 07, 2017 6:29 pm

anshabhi wrote:
TBH, I found Erodgan's wishes quite funny. He wanted everything that India doesn't want to give!

We have a saying in Turkish (I don't know its equivalence in English...):
"Thou who wishes to ask for things has a black face; those who don't give are Negros..."

It's commercial politics; you ask for one thousand items, and can get only one hundred in return; but you still say "thank you!" and walk away!..."
A veteran Electronics & Communications Engineer from Istanbul-Turkey, highly interested in civil and military aviation.
 
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Yakamoz
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Sun May 07, 2017 8:08 pm

TK announced a loss of 373m $ in Q1/2017. I don't think TK will introduce a base in ESB for intl traffic when they couldn't earn money from IST/SAW.
 
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ankaraflyjet
Posts: 477
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Sun May 07, 2017 10:05 pm

Yes but ESB has positive growth numbers and IST and SAW do not, why not invest in growing markets and get stuck with those in decline?

Yakamoz wrote:
TK announced a loss of 373m $ in Q1/2017. I don't think TK will introduce a base in ESB for intl traffic when they couldn't earn money from IST/SAW.
 
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Yakamoz
Posts: 544
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Mon May 08, 2017 5:15 am

[*]
ankaraflyjet wrote:
Yes but ESB has positive growth numbers and IST and SAW do not, why not invest in growing markets and get stuck with those in decline?

Yakamoz wrote:
TK announced a loss of 373m $ in Q1/2017. I don't think TK will introduce a base in ESB for intl traffic when they couldn't earn money from IST/SAW.


The point is growth does not mean earning money. I am with you, ESB should get more intl connections, but in my opinion TK have to solve first problems anf invest later. Why not Pegasus? They do their staff not bad, better than TK these days?
 
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ankaraflyjet
Posts: 477
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Mon May 08, 2017 5:52 am

Sure Pegasus could do it too, not the North America segment though....

Yakamoz wrote:
[*]
ankaraflyjet wrote:
Yes but ESB has positive growth numbers and IST and SAW do not, why not invest in growing markets and get stuck with those in decline?

Yakamoz wrote:
TK announced a loss of 373m $ in Q1/2017. I don't think TK will introduce a base in ESB for intl traffic when they couldn't earn money from IST/SAW.


The point is growth does not mean earning money. I am with you, ESB should get more intl connections, but in my opinion TK have to solve first problems anf invest later. Why not Pegasus? They do their staff not bad, better than TK these days?
 
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TK105
Posts: 586
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Mon May 08, 2017 7:00 am

OA260 wrote:
Turkish Tourism are running free trips for press and travel agents to try to get people selling it again. I have seen deals for would be tourists EUR199 in 4* hotels from Dublin for 7 nights and they are finding it hard to fill seats even at those prices !

It was 450€ again in the best times. This is what a Russian tourist spends a day or less than half of KSA tourist's spending daily.

It is no secret that average Euro Tourist spending is comparable to average Syrian Refugee spending.

I think Turkish Tourism should focus new markets more and target highly populated upper medium class of India, Pakistan, Iran, Central Asia, Russia, Ukraine and Arabic Peninsula.
The future is in the skies.
 
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TK787
Topic Author
Posts: 4294
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Mon May 08, 2017 11:23 am

News all over the Turkish Aviation sites say that the laptop ban to the US to be extended to all European arrivals.
In the past threads I made a point that this laptop ban could go either way. The US/UK can not single out MiddleEast/Muslim countries without clear justification. So either they had to drop it or to extend it to more countries.
Let's see how the US3 is going to deal with this. Europeans will adopt to ME3/TK standards on this.
 
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OA260
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Mon May 08, 2017 12:18 pm

TK787 wrote:
News all over the Turkish Aviation sites say that the laptop ban to the US to be extended to all European arrivals.


This was reported back around 25th April in many media outlets. It would not be a surprise to be honest and like all other things people will adapt to it.
 
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mafaky
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Re: Turkish Aviation May 2017

Mon May 08, 2017 1:58 pm

Sure Pegasus could do it too, not the North America segment though....


When the subject is ESB originating flights say to Europe & Middle East TK and other airlines have to think twice about the passenger portfolio. ESB pax are not only common people. There are diplomats, politicians, bureucrats, some holding owners and executives (a frequent contributor in this topic TK105 should be one of these latter...) who will be more willing/affording to fly on business class even for 3-4 hr. duration flights. I'm pretty sure that the 16 seat J cabin of QR's daily a320 flights show high load factors, from EB. If TK wants to open a third and lasting hub here at ESB, they have to be careful and consistent in their J Class product Assuming they have to operate only with narrow bodies (738 and 321s) they really must allocate planes with real J Class hardware: not the so-called J Class with 3+3 seats abreast with middle seats left empty. They definitely must use 2+2 abreast, good-reclining and wide seats with adequate pitch.

In this sense Pegasus is out of the game, anyway!... They can only serve the LCC pax, from ESB if there's a big demand.
A veteran Electronics & Communications Engineer from Istanbul-Turkey, highly interested in civil and military aviation.

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