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seansasLCY
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Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 11:06 am

http://westjet2.mediaroom.com/index.php?s=43&item=1232

Westjet has ordered 10 787-9 plus options for 10 more. Looks like they will be growing the long haul routes!
 
CBBW
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Re: Westjet orders 20 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 11:08 am

Wow!
I really did not expect that. I had to check the date on the media release.
 
Flying-Tiger
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 11:10 am

From the press release:

As part of this purchase agreement, WestJet is converting 15 firm orders for the Boeing 737 MAX that were to be delivered between 2019 and 2021 to options available between 2022 and 2024.
Flown: A319/320/321,A332/3,A343/346, A359, A380,AT4,AT7,B712, B732/3/4/5/7/8/9,B742/4,B752/3, B762/763,B772/77W,CR2/7/9/K,ER3/4,E70/75/90/95, F50/70/100,M11,L15,SF3,S20, AR8/1, 142/143,... 330.860 miles and counting.
 
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Dutchy
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 11:17 am

Flying-Tiger wrote:
From the press release:

As part of this purchase agreement, WestJet is converting 15 firm orders for the Boeing 737 MAX that were to be delivered between 2019 and 2021 to options available between 2022 and 2024.


Interesting switch: 15 737M to 10 787, changing short haul to more long haul destinations. Congrats to Boeing and WestJet.
Many happy landings, greetings from The Netherlands!
 
Dominion301
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 11:37 am

Flying-Tiger wrote:
From the press release:

As part of this purchase agreement, WestJet is converting 15 firm orders for the Boeing 737 MAX that were to be delivered between 2019 and 2021 to options available between 2022 and 2024.


When are WestJet getting this first MAX?

CBBW wrote:
Wow!
I really did not expect that. I had to check the date on the media release.


It was pretty obvious heading into year 2 of 767 ops that a widebody order would be in the pipeline. I would have been shocked if this had gone to Airbus.
 
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longhauler
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 11:47 am

I am very happy to see this. The 787 is a fine aircraft and will do well for Westjet.
Just because I stopped arguing, doesn't mean I think you are right. It just means I gave up!
 
whywhyzee
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 11:53 am

The converted 737 max frames become options, they could be looking to soften the burden of taking on all those frames at once. Not to mention if fuel prices remain stable, they can hold onto more NG's longer then initially planned. Good news all around!
 
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ikolkyo
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 11:57 am

Dutchy wrote:
Flying-Tiger wrote:
From the press release:

As part of this purchase agreement, WestJet is converting 15 firm orders for the Boeing 737 MAX that were to be delivered between 2019 and 2021 to options available between 2022 and 2024.


Interesting switch: 15 737M to 10 787, changing short haul to more long haul destinations. Congrats to Boeing and WestJet.


They didn't convert any orders to the 787, just changed from firm MAX orders to options for the MAX beteeen 2022 and 2024.
 
anshabhi
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 11:59 am

I feel like India could be a possible destination for them!
 
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longhauler
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 12:03 pm

anshabhi wrote:
I feel like India could be a possible destination for them!

I am hoping for China.

With 11 Chinese carriers (including Taiwan and HK) flying to Canada now, maybe Westjet will be more successful in getting further access to China than Air Canada.
Just because I stopped arguing, doesn't mean I think you are right. It just means I gave up!
 
chiki
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 12:06 pm

Congrats to all parties, this will be quite a big increase on the longhaul capacity for them. I bet the conversions will be the Max 7
 
YVRing
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 12:16 pm

That's awesome.

I wonder if they might lease some additional 767s or 787s in the short term to further expand/learn how to fly long haul. I suspect there would be additional learning opportunities in opening non-LGW overseas posts in the near-term before they kick the long haul expansion into high gear. Two years is also a long time with alot of European and Asian LCCs offering additional service to North America.

I also have to wonder how AC responds. Although I suspect WS and AC mainline won't be going head to head on long haul routes right away. Will they take on additional 787s for Rouge? Will this see additional routes "Rouged" when they see WS competition. WS with their reported lower costs flying fuel efficient 787s has got to be annoying for any AC Mainline routes or Rouge routes on less efficient aircraft.

I also I personally hope they consider offering long haul routes from YVR instead of making me back track to Calgary :)
 
N292UX
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 12:24 pm

Now this is interesting! Pretty cool to see a new airline getting 787's. Congrats to Boeing and WestJet!
 
ahj2000
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 12:32 pm

BEgone ancient 767s :)
Any cabin details? I wouldn't be surprised if they introduced an actual J cabin with the 789, especially if they go to Asia.
-Andrés Juánez
 
sagechan
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 12:36 pm

Good for WS and Boeing. Id assume these replace the 767s. 10 frames is not a lot. While WS does do non-daily flying its still roughly 1 frame per R/T TATL, and 2 frames TPAC, so not sure how much true growth this brings, just makes reliability and efficiency better with a little growth.
717, 733, 734, 738, 739, 744, 752, 763, 772, 77W, 789, A319, A320, A321, A332, A333, A359, MD88, CRJ, CR7, CR9, DH1, DH2, DH3, S340, ER4, E170, E175, E190/CO, NW, US, AC, NH, AA, UA, DL, WN, WS, SK, VY, LA, QF, AR, AV, MH, KA, AS
 
ACDC8
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 12:49 pm

Hoping they'll update their bland livery with the delivery of these birds.
A Grumpy German Is A Sauerkraut
 
texl1649
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 12:52 pm

Are these the 767s from qantas that have been relative "dogs"?

Somehow it seems they didn't plan to retire them this quickly, anyway. Future Amazon Air conversions?
 
Softaero
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 12:54 pm

longhauler wrote:
anshabhi wrote:
I feel like India could be a possible destination for them!

I am hoping for China.

With 11 Chinese carriers (including Taiwan and HK) flying to Canada now, maybe Westjet will be more successful in getting further access to China than Air Canada.

Probably not. While a huge market, China - Canada is dominated by Chinese airlines that are often subsidized by provincial governments to open new long-haul routes. I can't see how WestJet can compete on cost and/or service.
According to all known laws of aviation, there is no way a bee should be able to fly
 
Whiteguy
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 12:58 pm

texl1649 wrote:
Are these the 767s from qantas that have been relative "dogs"?

Somehow it seems they didn't plan to retire them this quickly, anyway. Future Amazon Air conversions?


While there's no definitive date for the B767 retirements this was always the plan....
 
Boeing744
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 1:02 pm

Wow, good for WestJet.

Canada is really becoming the land of 737s and 787s.
 
whywhyzee
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 1:20 pm

From what I have heard from multiple people within Westjet, they will be more AC then Rouge if that makes any sense. Plans, at least as of now, are to have a proper J/Y+/Y service to offer a competitive alternative against AC. The 767's will also remain in the fleet after the 787 arrives, likely will do more Hawaii/shorter haul flights. The way I picture it based on what I have been told is a full service carrier (where they seem to be moving towards anyhow, they are far from LCC, their current services aren't all that much different from any of the competition) but on the same token, they probably aren't going to be your business airline ala BA/UA. With their following, at least withim Canada, they stand a good chance of winning a lot of customers away from AC that would prefer their service, but need to fly long haul and as a result, have limited options.
 
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Jawaiiansky66
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 1:49 pm

I wonder if they will tweak their brand and make it more universal/relevant to global travel?

WestJet is a pretty regional/low cost concept and is a bit confusing if you are flying to Europe and Asia. Easy Jet and Air Asia brands have a more international cache.
 
whywhyzee
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 2:00 pm

Jawaiiansky66 wrote:
I wonder if they will tweak their brand and make it more universal/relevant to global travel?

WestJet is a pretty regional/low cost concept and is a bit confusing if you are flying to Europe and Asia. Easy Jet and Air Asia brands have a more international cache.


They will probably focus on Canada point of sale, which seems to be the large majority of all traffic into/out of Canada. For this, they need not adjust their brand, that would if anything, reduce brand awareness in their home and largest market. I think they should embrace their brand strength, they have a 'cool factor' which sets them apart. Think of it like the BA/VS relationship. BA is squarely the classy, more 'professional' (I struggle to find the right word) carrier, where as VS has that similar cool factor, they attract a different crowd. I think WS and AC share a similar relationship, and that can be WS' advantage going forward. People appreciate their service, among Canadians, its overwhelmingly positive towards WS. Once this long haul expansion begins, they will have the ability to sell that to the world. Will ti be popular amongst international travellers, we will see, but with a very dynamic home market with multiple rapidly growing cities (Toronto, Vancouver), they have the backing to launch and grow.
 
rlo4934
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 2:37 pm

Ever read something yet your mind sees it differently? I was reading the headline and my mind was seeing "10 737-9" and thinking, isn't this old news? Then I opened up the link and saw the picture and read the article. Awesome!
 
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hOMSaR
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 2:40 pm

Jawaiiansky66 wrote:
I wonder if they will tweak their brand and make it more universal/relevant to global travel?

WestJet is a pretty regional/low cost concept and is a bit confusing if you are flying to Europe and Asia. Easy Jet and Air Asia brands have a more international cache.


I don't get it. How is "WestJet" regional, but "Air Asia" is not?
I was raised by a cup of coffee.
 
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caoimhin
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 2:45 pm

ACDC8 wrote:
Hoping they'll update their bland livery with the delivery of these birds.


Was thinking the same. The 789 is such a striking aircraft to start, but the right livery can really make it stand out.

Congratulations to Boeing and WestJet.
 
Noise
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 2:54 pm

hOMSaR wrote:
Jawaiiansky66 wrote:
I wonder if they will tweak their brand and make it more universal/relevant to global travel?

WestJet is a pretty regional/low cost concept and is a bit confusing if you are flying to Europe and Asia. Easy Jet and Air Asia brands have a more international cache.


I don't get it. How is "WestJet" regional, but "Air Asia" is not?


In general, I don't believe the name "WestJet" is regional, however in Canada the name "WestJet" does have a somewhat regional connotation/association that I think would be hard for them to break out of unless they rebrand. Not to mention the fact that their tail and logo is essentially a snowcapped "Rocky Mountain" which is strongly associated with Western Canada.
 
Noise
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 2:56 pm

It's important to note that branding is huge but it isn't everything. Also, if you think geopolitically, Canada is indeed located in "the West".
 
jbs2886
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 3:37 pm

Noise wrote:
hOMSaR wrote:
Jawaiiansky66 wrote:
I wonder if they will tweak their brand and make it more universal/relevant to global travel?

WestJet is a pretty regional/low cost concept and is a bit confusing if you are flying to Europe and Asia. Easy Jet and Air Asia brands have a more international cache.


I don't get it. How is "WestJet" regional, but "Air Asia" is not?


In general, I don't believe the name "WestJet" is regional, however in Canada the name "WestJet" does have a somewhat regional connotation/association that I think would be hard for them to break out of unless they rebrand. Not to mention the fact that their tail and logo is essentially a snowcapped "Rocky Mountain" which is strongly associated with Western Canada.


Yes, Southwest has that problem in the US, too.....
 
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OA940
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 3:41 pm

Damn, they really go for it. I don't think they're gonna launch J, but a more modern W and personal IFE would go a long way.
A350/CSeries = bae
 
lucianflyboy
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Re: Westjet orders 20 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 3:46 pm

CBBW wrote:
Wow!
I really did not expect that. I had to check the date on the media release.


same!!! :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:
 
cumulushumilis
Posts: 230
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 3:51 pm

whywhyzee wrote:
Jawaiiansky66 wrote:
I wonder if they will tweak their brand and make it more universal/relevant to global travel?

WestJet is a pretty regional/low cost concept and is a bit confusing if you are flying to Europe and Asia. Easy Jet and Air Asia brands have a more international cache.


They will probably focus on Canada point of sale, which seems to be the large majority of all traffic into/out of Canada. For this, they need not adjust their brand, that would if anything, reduce brand awareness in their home and largest market. I think they should embrace their brand strength, they have a 'cool factor' which sets them apart. Think of it like the BA/VS relationship. BA is squarely the classy, more 'professional' (I struggle to find the right word) carrier, where as VS has that similar cool factor, they attract a different crowd. I think WS and AC share a similar relationship, and that can be WS' advantage going forward. People appreciate their service, among Canadians, its overwhelmingly positive towards WS. Once this long haul expansion begins, they will have the ability to sell that to the world. Will ti be popular amongst international travellers, we will see, but with a very dynamic home market with multiple rapidly growing cities (Toronto, Vancouver), they have the backing to launch and grow.



Surprisingly point of sale outside of Canada has been driving a lot of growth in the international Canadian market. O&D traffic is strong but the holy grail is the 5th freedom marketplace. One only has to look at the transborder/international cnx traffic off inbound International flights which at times can total over 50 percent of the load.. WS and AC have strong transborder/Caribbean/Mexico networks and airports such as YYZ, YVR and to a lesser extent YUL and YYC are rapidly becoming hubs to onward destinations. AC has a strong presence in this marketplace, so it is only natural to see WS get into this business.
Last edited by cumulushumilis on Tue May 02, 2017 4:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
Bricktop
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 3:53 pm

rlo4934 wrote:
Ever read something yet your mind sees it differently? I was reading the headline and my mind was seeing "10 737-9" and thinking, isn't this old news? Then I opened up the link and saw the picture and read the article. Awesome!

That's exactly what I did.
 
Skywatcher
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 3:56 pm

My thoughts for what they're worth;
-Canada domestic and Canada/USA is saturated. International is the way to go for growth.
-I suspect that this deal had a lot to do with changing the 15 737 MAX orders into options. Maybe WestJet was too ambitious in their medium range growth plans? (tanking AB market etc.).
-I tried to book a trip to Calgary/Banff/Vancouver this June. No rental cars available and all high end hotels booked solid. The Asian tourists are pushing demand beyond capacity I believe. Will WestJet try to tap into this? BTW-we're going to NF instead.
 
hiflyeras
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 4:52 pm

Very exciting for everyone at WestJet! Congrats to Gregg and his team!
 
marktci
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 4:55 pm

Skywatcher wrote:
My thoughts for what they're worth;
-I tried to book a trip to Calgary/Banff/Vancouver this June. No rental cars available and all high end hotels booked solid. The Asian tourists are pushing demand beyond capacity I believe. Will WestJet try to tap into this? BTW-we're going to NF instead.


I'd look to a lot of Canadians choosing to vacation domestically as another cause, for the 150th birthday, the weaker Canadian dollar, and the political situation south of the border.
 
ScottB
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 5:11 pm

Jawaiiansky66 wrote:
WestJet is a pretty regional/low cost concept and is a bit confusing if you are flying to Europe and Asia. Easy Jet and Air Asia brands have a more international cache.


You think bright orange and the Cooper Black typeface (which positively screams 1970s!) give Easy Jet "international cachet?" Maybe in the sense that Easy Jet's color is international orange? By the same token, I associate the Air Asia X brand with horrible, cramped, 9-across A330s more so than "international cachet."

whywhyzee wrote:
The converted 737 max frames become options, they could be looking to soften the burden of taking on all those frames at once. Not to mention if fuel prices remain stable, they can hold onto more NG's longer then initially planned.


Agreed completely, converting 737MAX orders to 787-9s accomplishes two goals: it keeps their capital expenditure under control and it pivots the narrowbody fleet plan toward keeping the NG 737s around longer with fuel prices likely to stay at more modest levels for the foreseeable future. The operating expense benefit of the MAX is less attractive against the higher cap ex of new aircraft versus retaining fully depreciated frames.
 
yycdel
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 5:16 pm

Which 737s did they convert to options? MAX7?
 
Newbiepilot
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 5:19 pm

This has been an order probably in work for a while. We had a discussion on the forum a year ago regarding weather considering both the 787 and A330neo. Back then there were some thinking that it was an even shot between the two planes.

viewtopic.php?t=603201

Glad to see them finally decide on their future widebody fleet after getting the used 767s to test out international service.
 
Whiteguy
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 5:24 pm

yycdel wrote:
Which 737s did they convert to options? MAX7?


Previous Max order was 25 7s, 30 Max8s and 10 Max9s.......now 20 Max7s, 23 Max8s and 7 Max9s...
 
MartijnNL
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 5:30 pm

sagechan wrote:
10 frames is not a lot.

From 4 widebody aircraft to 10 and possibly 20 is not a lot? To me that looks like a huge expansion.
 
CX747
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 5:32 pm

Fuel prices are still low and look to remain so. Switching from the Max to the 787 helps expand in one area while allowing perfectly good assets (737NGs) the ability to operate in an environment they fit into. Congratulations to Westjet and Boeing.
"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." D. Eisenhower
 
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Polot
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 5:34 pm

MartijnNL wrote:
sagechan wrote:
10 frames is not a lot.

From 4 widebody aircraft to 10 and possibly 20 is not a lot? To me that looks like a huge expansion.

Especially since, unless Westjet goes all out and introduces a proper J, their 789s will seat a lot more than their 763s.
 
bmacleod
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 5:44 pm

Looks like WS wants to resurrect CP.

Looking how CP was created from PWA and CPair now WS appears headed same direction?

It would appear AC has a real fight for survival....or maybe not?
"What good are wings without the courage to fly?" - Atticus
 
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aemoreira1981
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 5:49 pm

Potential growth into SkyTeam down the line? I see potential for feed into AMS, CDG, ICN, and possibly PVG, with widening JVs with KL, KE, and AF.
 
PanzerPowner
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 5:51 pm

Let me throw this out here now. YVR-MNL let's see some competition for once.
If not, let's throw a bone to CEB
Well uh, I obviously decided to refine this but i dont know how.
 
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aerolimani
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 5:59 pm

Softaero wrote:
longhauler wrote:
anshabhi wrote:
I feel like India could be a possible destination for them!

I am hoping for China.

With 11 Chinese carriers (including Taiwan and HK) flying to Canada now, maybe Westjet will be more successful in getting further access to China than Air Canada.

Probably not. While a huge market, China - Canada is dominated by Chinese airlines that are often subsidized by provincial governments to open new long-haul routes. I can't see how WestJet can compete on cost and/or service.

Westjet's own press release says the following:
With a range of more than 14,000 kilometres, the Dreamliner will give WestJet the ability to serve new destinations in Asia and South America, and to expand its service offerings into the European market.

While there are other destinations in Asia besides China, I doubt that WS would ignore China.

As to expanded service to Europe, I've heard rumours of Barcelona.
 
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Polot
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 6:00 pm

aemoreira1981 wrote:
Potential growth into SkyTeam down the line? I see potential for feed into AMS, CDG, ICN, and possibly PVG, with widening JVs with KL, KE, and AF.

They also partner with AA, BA, CX, QF, JL, etc. Westjet follows AS's strategy of being a codeshare whore, I don't think they have any interest in joining Skyteam or Oneworld when they can benefit from airlines found in both.
 
nadavatar64
Posts: 270
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 6:01 pm

bmacleod wrote:
Looks like WS wants to resurrect CP.

Looking how CP was created from PWA and CPair now WS appears headed same direction?

It would appear AC has a real fight for survival....or maybe not?


AC is not in a crucial threat. They have been dealing with competition very well, and the AC Rouge was a brilliant idea, serving the low end pax with suited aircrafts. I do hope that this WS expansion will help reducing fares.
 
TahnaLos
Posts: 1
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Re: Westjet orders 10 787-9

Tue May 02, 2017 6:03 pm

Pondering the possibilities here:

AC 787s are pretty crowded, with 3-3-3 seating in economy. I expect WS to do the same, the question is the pitch. I'm sure they will try to shave a few parts of an inch in certain area to fit more rows. The 789s should do the trick with adding more capacity.

Also pondering the use of the 763s on domestic routes. YYZ-YYC is one possibility while YYZ-YVR is the other. The planes are already showing their age and while it was good to have them to try out intercontinental, they will probably let the 789s take over and put 763 on domestic duty. Makes sense if you cancel some of the 73M orders.

I'm pretty excited to hear about this. *Alliance fan here, but always willing to look up new competition when it comes in.

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