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goacom
Posts: 127
Joined: Sat Feb 14, 2009 2:37 am

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Wed May 10, 2017 7:45 pm

devmapper wrote:
wilcal wrote:

Also, Dallas is preferred by people from Austin, which happens to be a significant technology hubs with a growing Indian diaspora.


I'm not too sure about folks from Austin preferring Dallas. Besides the longer drive, the sole highway between Dallas and Austin is a real pain. Dallas can also suffer from weather issues in the winter. As a person who lives in Austin, Houston is far preferable to Dallas.
 
VTORD
Posts: 748
Joined: Sat Dec 22, 2012 9:45 pm

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Wed May 10, 2017 7:51 pm

hayzel777 wrote:

My bad....I stand corrected. Thanks...
 
TigerFlyer
Posts: 218
Joined: Tue Apr 25, 2017 7:51 pm

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Wed May 10, 2017 8:00 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
TigerFlyer wrote:
The backstory on this is that Air India is one of the worst run airlines in the world. In a competitive marketplace they would long since have ceased flying. They remain alive because of massive government subsidies. And they are able to acquire new aircraft because of ExIm financing at below market rates. No private lender would consider them period. Consequently AI is adding new flights and US carriers have withdrawn from the market.



Not one sentence you wrote is true.

Delta sued Air India/EXIM in federal district court, lost it, lost on appeal as well. They are not even sovereign guaranteed by Indian government.

Close to 60 AI narrow bodies and 15xB777s are financed from global financiers, because India has no aviation financier or leasing company. First few were EXIM guaranteed, but AI has to get a bridge loans while EXIM approves the finance. EXIM was in shambles later, and AI continued bridge loans and SLB cycle.

AI's 23xB787s/2xB744s are leased from Investec of UK and DVB of Germany.
There were fourteen responses to 14xA320NEO lease RFP, AFALCO won the contract,
Bank of China is the lessor for 5xA320SLs.
Avation PLC is the lessor for first batch of 8xATR72s
Dubai Aviation is lessor for next batch of 10 x ATR72s

There is not a shred of evidence to prove your statement, but this is a.net, you have enough support.


Every word is true. Air India received $3.4 billion in ExIm fiananciang for the purchase of Boeing aircraft they could not otherwise have afforded. Think about that number. $3.4 billion from US taxpayers. It is unfortunate that the court of appeals did not properly apply the statute which requires consideration of the impact on US industry. i.e. Airlines, not just Boeing.

AI has been kept afloat by their government. Secure in that knowledge is the only reason that lessors and lenders would ever consider doing business with them.
 
devmapper
Posts: 219
Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2017 10:15 pm

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Wed May 10, 2017 8:34 pm

goacom wrote:
devmapper wrote:
wilcal wrote:

Also, Dallas is preferred by people from Austin, which happens to be a significant technology hubs with a growing Indian diaspora.


I'm not too sure about folks from Austin preferring Dallas. Besides the longer drive, the sole highway between Dallas and Austin is a real pain. Dallas can also suffer from weather issues in the winter. As a person who lives in Austin, Houston is far preferable to Dallas.


I think more people from Austin connect via DFW than IAH. AUS-DFW is the busiest domestic route out of Austin, and even DAL has higher traffic than IAH. I guess we don't really have any numbers on how many people just choose to drive US-290 over flying, and that might change things.

I don't know why AI is focused on serving Texas. When I flew to India out of Austin, I connected to the AI JFK-DEL flight from an AA flight. Bags were checked through to the destination.
 
dtw2hyd
Posts: 8478
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Wed May 10, 2017 9:04 pm

TigerFlyer wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:
TigerFlyer wrote:
The backstory on this is that Air India is one of the worst run airlines in the world. In a competitive marketplace they would long since have ceased flying. They remain alive because of massive government subsidies. And they are able to acquire new aircraft because of ExIm financing at below market rates. No private lender would consider them period. Consequently AI is adding new flights and US carriers have withdrawn from the market.



Not one sentence you wrote is true.

Delta sued Air India/EXIM in federal district court, lost it, lost on appeal as well. They are not even sovereign guaranteed by Indian government.

Close to 60 AI narrow bodies and 15xB777s are financed from global financiers, because India has no aviation financier or leasing company. First few were EXIM guaranteed, but AI has to get a bridge loans while EXIM approves the finance. EXIM was in shambles later, and AI continued bridge loans and SLB cycle.

AI's 23xB787s/2xB744s are leased from Investec of UK and DVB of Germany.
There were fourteen responses to 14xA320NEO lease RFP, AFALCO won the contract,
Bank of China is the lessor for 5xA320SLs.
Avation PLC is the lessor for first batch of 8xATR72s
Dubai Aviation is lessor for next batch of 10 x ATR72s

There is not a shred of evidence to prove your statement, but this is a.net, you have enough support.


Every word is true. Air India received $3.4 billion in ExIm fiananciang for the purchase of Boeing aircraft they could not otherwise have afforded. Think about that number. $3.4 billion from US taxpayers. It is unfortunate that the court of appeals did not properly apply the statute which requires consideration of the impact on US industry. i.e. Airlines, not just Boeing.

AI has been kept afloat by their government. Secure in that knowledge is the only reason that lessors and lenders would ever consider doing business with them.


First of all you have no clue how EXIM works. Read both case filings and come back to discuss. Original estimated amount was $3.4 Billion, that also loan guarantee, not a loan.

AI took delivery of B777s by the time loan guarantee was approved. DL/ATA/ALPA sued Air India/Boeing/EXIM. AI took deliveries thru bridge finance and SLB.

Because of all this mess AI didn't even had finance to take first delivery. Bridge loan for first two deliveries was arranged by Boeing, because neither EXIM nor GOI provided funding and AI haven't even issued RFP for commercial borrowing.

AI doesn't even own B788s, they are leased.

There is record of bridge loan RFP for every B788

You are probably an ME3 supporter trying to defect blame to AI. Just like some US3 fans rub the service cancellations on AI.

Guess what these US stations were served by AI even before ME3 came into business and ULH planes were built.
All posts are just opinions.
 
YoungDon
Posts: 653
Joined: Thu May 31, 2001 9:33 am

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Wed May 10, 2017 9:28 pm

devmapper wrote:
goacom wrote:
devmapper wrote:


I'm not too sure about folks from Austin preferring Dallas. Besides the longer drive, the sole highway between Dallas and Austin is a real pain. Dallas can also suffer from weather issues in the winter. As a person who lives in Austin, Houston is far preferable to Dallas.


I think more people from Austin connect via DFW than IAH. AUS-DFW is the busiest domestic route out of Austin, and even DAL has higher traffic than IAH. I guess we don't really have any numbers on how many people just choose to drive US-290 over flying, and that might change things.

I don't know why AI is focused on serving Texas. When I flew to India out of Austin, I connected to the AI JFK-DEL flight from an AA flight. Bags were checked through to the destination.


Definitely true that more people connect via DFW than IAH, from AUS, but as you mentioned a large number of people make that drive to Houston instead of paying the connection premium. Plus AA is just bigger at DFW than UA is at IAH. Not sure if I'd call it a preference moreso than a necessity. DFW works better for most of the traffic flows out of Austin (East, North, West) than Houston (which is less convenient for anything other than southerly connections.)

As far as AI goes, I tend to be skeptical that they will serve either DFW or IAH from DEL - long route, and mostly VFR traffic to both metros. We'll see though!
 
CaliguyNYC
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Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Wed May 10, 2017 9:30 pm

YouGeeElWhy wrote:
CaliguyNYC wrote:
I think after a 16 hour flight form the US the 2 hour domestic Indian flight on a 737 or A320 doesn't bother most people especially since food is served. Also AI offers wide body international connectors to BOM & HYD at a min. I think the main advantage is the AI flights arrive the US early than the EU flights (7am vs 10:30am) and when going to India you can usually arrive at the secondary town by 7/8pm which is a pleasure to 11pm or overnight at DEL and then 8am the next morning.
Agian good for Indians traveling to the US, not great for people in the US traveling to India.


Huh what I wrote applies equally to a US origin pax as an Indian one. Most Americans could care less about one short leg being on a 737 or A320. See connecting traffic in the US to International and EU connections from hubs. The flight times of AI's nonstops are very attractive to US origin pax (I would argue even more than Indian). Its Americans that hate landing at 1am and leaving at 4am. Indians will "take it." Look what ever it is AI doesn't need to please 100% of the pax. AI is proving that some typical things that pax around the world liked (good flight times, nonstops, connections within the country you are going) also work with US-India traffic.
 
9w748capt
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Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Wed May 10, 2017 9:32 pm

Why are people posting that AA and AI don't interline? Just checked on expertflyer and confirmed that AA and AI still do have an interline agreement. Of course the question would be (if AI does indeed start DFW) AA and AI would cooperate on XXX-DFW-India routes, especially given QR and EY's relationships with AA. But it is indeed possible to through-ticket and check bags through AA-AI (and vice versa).
 
9w748capt
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Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Wed May 10, 2017 9:35 pm

YouGeeElWhy wrote:
CaliguyNYC wrote:
I think after a 16 hour flight form the US the 2 hour domestic Indian flight on a 737 or A320 doesn't bother most people especially since food is served. Also AI offers wide body international connectors to BOM & HYD at a min. I think the main advantage is the AI flights arrive the US early than the EU flights (7am vs 10:30am) and when going to India you can usually arrive at the secondary town by 7/8pm which is a pleasure to 11pm or overnight at DEL and then 8am the next morning.
Agian good for Indians traveling to the US, not great for people in the US traveling to India.


Why not? What's wrong with arriving at DEL in the early afternoon leaving plenty of time to connect onward to secondary cities so you'd arrive there by 9-10 PM? Doesn't that sound like a perfect strategy? Eons ago when IT was going to join oneworld, I remember AA had retimed ORD-DEL to arrive earlier into DEL to allow more onward connections. Of course we know how that went, but it's kind of shocking to me that neither 9W or AI have tried this yet. There's no reason AI can't serve DEL from major cities in the US/Canada and have a bank of domestic flights that departs 7-8PM allowing connectivity to pretty much all of India via DEL.
 
devmapper
Posts: 219
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Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Wed May 10, 2017 9:55 pm

9w748capt wrote:
Why are people posting that AA and AI don't interline? Just checked on expertflyer and confirmed that AA and AI still do have an interline agreement. Of course the question would be (if AI does indeed start DFW) AA and AI would cooperate on XXX-DFW-India routes, especially given QR and EY's relationships with AA. But it is indeed possible to through-ticket and check bags through AA-AI (and vice versa).


AA has a pretty good relationship with EY, not so much with QR, even though they are both members of Oneworld, which EY is not. Last October, when I missed the QR connection at JFK due to a delay in the AA flight from PHX, AA elected to rebook me on EY rather than QR.

Would AA choose to blindside UA by having a codeshare with AI? I am not sure if QR would be able to block it, and EY might not choose to care, considering 9W seems to be moving away from EY control and is getting cosy with DL/AF/KL. There would be pretty good connections at ORD and JFK, and any potential LAX and DFW flights. IAD would probably end up losing money. Don't think it would affect SFO too much, since AI is doing well enough at SFO on their own.
 
devmapper
Posts: 219
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Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Wed May 10, 2017 10:20 pm

9w748capt wrote:
Why not? What's wrong with arriving at DEL in the early afternoon leaving plenty of time to connect onward to secondary cities so you'd arrive there by 9-10 PM? Doesn't that sound like a perfect strategy? Eons ago when IT was going to join oneworld, I remember AA had retimed ORD-DEL to arrive earlier into DEL to allow more onward connections. Of course we know how that went, but it's kind of shocking to me that neither 9W or AI have tried this yet. There's no reason AI can't serve DEL from major cities in the US/Canada and have a bank of domestic flights that departs 7-8PM allowing connectivity to pretty much all of India via DEL.


AI does have two separate banks of domestic flights to major cities in India after the flights from US land around 3 PM IST. The first bank, which requires passengers to complete immigration and customs formalities at Delhi airport, leaves around 5 PM IST. The second bank allows passengers to complete immigration and customs formalities at the destination airport, leaves around 8 PM IST.
 
YouGeeElWhy
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Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Thu May 11, 2017 12:48 am

CaliguyNYC wrote:
Huh what I wrote applies equally to a US origin pax as an Indian one.

9w748capt wrote:
Why not? What's wrong with arriving at DEL in the early afternoon leaving plenty of time to connect onward to secondary cities so you'd arrive there by 9-10 PM


For me, it works leaving the US in the early/late evening, which the ME3 and US3/EU3 do, as I do not lose that day in the air which I can spend at work or with family. Either way, I am in the office in India the same day on the way over whether it is AI or ME3 or US3/EU3. On the way back I get the whole last day in the office in India and get back in the late afternoon/early evening, so I only have a few hours to survive before going to bed. Most people going India on business from the US would follow this pattern.

I could see how AI schedule would work for people traveling to the US from India on business as they get in early AM and have that whole work day.
 
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BawliBooch
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Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Thu May 11, 2017 1:01 am

VTORD wrote:
Remember the time when PTI also photoshopped Narendra Modi reviewing the floods from an aircraft (in TN I think....)?

It wasnt PTI that photoshopped the picture. It was the IT cell of his party.

devmapper wrote:
Which has been subsequently taken down!!! :shock: :o

Is it possible Ashwin Lohani was on a bender before going and posting something on Facebook?? Not that I am implying anything... :oops: :crazy:

Its amazing what just a glass of Lohani's favorite cashew feni can do! In another day & age, no self-respecting journalist would have run news stories based on someone's facebook feed.

But we live in an era of the new "Republic" - the era of "supari journalism". Publicity is the name of the game.

I don't see any of these routes listed on Lohani's FB post being launched. He will be in some Governor's mansion before the end of the year. I bet he is hoping to get Goa! :)
Mr.Kapoor's favorite poodle!
 
CaliguyNYC
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Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Thu May 11, 2017 1:26 am

YouGeeElWhy wrote:
CaliguyNYC wrote:
Huh what I wrote applies equally to a US origin pax as an Indian one.

9w748capt wrote:
Why not? What's wrong with arriving at DEL in the early afternoon leaving plenty of time to connect onward to secondary cities so you'd arrive there by 9-10 PM


For me, it works leaving the US in the early/late evening, which the ME3 and US3/EU3 do, as I do not lose that day in the air which I can spend at work or with family. Either way, I am in the office in India the same day on the way over whether it is AI or ME3 or US3/EU3. On the way back I get the whole last day in the office in India and get back in the late afternoon/early evening, so I only have a few hours to survive before going to bed. Most people going India on business from the US would follow this pattern.

I could see how AI schedule would work for people traveling to the US from India on business as they get in early AM and have that whole work day.


Look I dont mean to pick on you, but your original post wasn't focused on "you" but said "Americans". As an American, all be it of Indian origin, I can tell you everyone I know has hated the traditional flight schedules to/from India (I want good departure/arrival times for both the origin and return flights). The traditional path through Europe meant a 6/7pm NYC departure, "sleeping" for 5 hours, landing in Europe at 1am NYC time, waiting until 4am NYC to then fly to India, arrive like a zombie, have your family go to the airport at midnight (many dont feel safe traveling alone at that hour), etc. Literally hated by so many of us. AI's schedule is a choice, and I agree not for everyone, but much more typical to US origin air travel. Most flight to asia from NYC leave in the early afternoon and land in the afternoon in asia. So if a business traveler going NYC-Tokyo doesn't mind leaving at 1:30pm NYC time and arriving at 4:30pm Tokyo time (Jal's schedule - which causes you to lose business time), why is Ai's timings so odd? The fact is the current schedules of EU and ME3 carriers fits O&D between the US and EU or ME NOT India. Some dont care, but many clearly want to move on to civilized flight schedules. Plus EU flights and AI both leave India at ~1am but AI arrives at 7am in the US and EU carriers arrive at 11am - big difference. And the ME3 that usually leave India at 4am is a NIGHTMARE departure time slot chosen only because of lack of choice or cheap fare. AI is definitely not the best airline, but they are seeing success because people want what they are offering. India has the premium and Y demand for nonstop US flights, it has never had the strong local carriers to fight against the need of the EU and ME3 carriers to fill their EU-US and ME-US flights. I guess the laptop ban and/or AI GOI subsides to finally break the past.
 
Danfearn77
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Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Thu May 11, 2017 10:06 am

8herveg wrote:
Surprised MAN hasn't been announced - wasn't that one of their desired destinations?



MAN can absolutely handle an India non stop by its own merits. I'm surprised it has taken so long. I've always thought Jet could start something, with help from Virgin maybe? Could have connecting passengers from/onto USA services.
Eagles may soar high, but weasels dont get sucked into jet engines!
 
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unrave
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Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Thu May 11, 2017 10:19 am

BawliBooch wrote:
In another day & age, no self-respecting journalist would have run news stories based on someone's facebook feed.



Luddites.

Malcolm Turnbill, the Australian PM regularly uses FB to announce policy decisions. Is the Australian media idiots for reporting them? A facebook post from a verified account is as direct as it can get from the horse's mouth.
17April2019: RIP Jet Airways
 
klwright69
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Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Thu May 11, 2017 11:39 am

TLV will not begin according to media sources.

http://www.globes.co.il/en/article-air- ... 1001187941
 
VTORD
Posts: 748
Joined: Sat Dec 22, 2012 9:45 pm

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Thu May 11, 2017 11:53 am

unrave wrote:

Luddites.

Malcolm Turnbill, the Australian PM regularly uses FB to announce policy decisions. Is the Australian media idiots for reporting them? A facebook post from a verified account is as direct as it can get from the horse's mouth.


I am not familiar with Malcom Turnbull's media interaction practices but Modi is known to use social media extensively so if it's his habit why not. But to be fair in this case, it does appear a bit specious particularly when there is nothing on the official Air India Facebook page! Scroll down on Lohani's facebook page timeline and there is absolutely no evidence of him using his facebook to habitually announce "policy" as such.

Anyways, not sure if this was discussed already but where are they going to get the aircraft for these routes? They recently announced they are up gauging 1 DEL-MAA to a 777 but AFAIK, all the 777s are busy right now.
 
devmapper
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Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Thu May 11, 2017 3:10 pm

VTORD wrote:
Anyways, not sure if this was discussed already but where are they going to get the aircraft for these routes? They recently announced they are up gauging 1 DEL-MAA to a 777 but AFAIK, all the 777s are busy right now.

The majority of AI 77W fleet is under-utilized on the Gulf routes. As AI gets 320neos, it is replacing the 321 currently on domestic runs, which will be deployed on the Gulf routes. I think beyond a token 787 service to DXB, DOH and possibly AUH, AI will let IX handle all Gulf traffic. IX is reportedly in trying to get a codeshare agreement with FZ to increase its coverage in GCC.
http://gulfnews.com/business/aviation/air-india-express-eyes-tie-up-with-flydubai-1.2025762
 
vadodara
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Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Thu May 11, 2017 4:58 pm

LAXdude1023 wrote:

Ill be honest, I would have expected IAH first simply because of the Star Hub and nothing else.

DFW has a larger and much faster growing Indian community and the business ties that DFW has with India are growing exponentially. If you spend time in a place like Irving or Plano, its pretty overwhelming. Its not New Jersey or the Silicon Valley, but its about on par with places in the Chicago area.

Houston has Sugar Land, Missouri City, and Stafford which have very large Indian communities and the Westchase area has a ton of Indian businesses, but its got nothing on the suburbs north of Dallas.


Yep! Growth and diversity is all good, but India is not a single region. One stop to DEL to a secondary Indian city would certainly be advantageous for AI. That advantage disappears fast if it is a larger city like Bangalore or Hyderabad. In that regard, AI will be the #4 choice out of DFW. Add to that the 'expected' decline on the travel visa's issued and this may be a little shrinking market.

AI is better served by sticking to a UA hub and adding non-stops to EWR/ORD/IAD to likes of BOM/BLR/MAA etc.

Obsession with hubs is all good so long as the cash-flow supports it; if you are relying on govt. hand-out's to build your hub, life can be a little hard. Just ask Hogan.
 
goacom
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Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Thu May 11, 2017 5:57 pm

There is a ZERO chance that AI would have gotten these loans were it not backed up with the credit of the Govt of India. Besides the very fact of getting the loans, the favorable terms of the loans means that this is a defacto subsidy for AI, relative to its private competitors who cannot easily avail of such rates.

TigerFlyer wrote:

Every word is true. Air India received $3.4 billion in ExIm fiananciang for the purchase of Boeing aircraft they could not otherwise have afforded. Think about that number. $3.4 billion from US taxpayers. It is unfortunate that the court of appeals did not properly apply the statute which requires consideration of the impact on US industry. i.e. Airlines, not just Boeing.

AI has been kept afloat by their government. Secure in that knowledge is the only reason that lessors and lenders would ever consider doing business with them.
 
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Spiderguy252
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Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Thu May 11, 2017 6:03 pm

BawliBooch wrote:
In another day & age, no self-respecting journalist would have run news stories based on someone's facebook feed.


In another day and age, social media wouldn't exist and exert its influence on a daily basis like we have in this day and age.
Vahroone
 
goacom
Posts: 127
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Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Thu May 11, 2017 6:07 pm

These are all very good points. AI's single Delhi hub strategy has its limitations. AI's domestic network, while extensive, ranks near or at the bottom for on-time performance. Furthermore, Delhi often suffers from weather related issues in the winter. With India's road infrastructure improving, the option of driving to a secondary city is also becoming an option. Forget driving from Delhi to Pune though.

vadodara wrote:

Yep! Growth and diversity is all good, but India is not a single region. One stop to DEL to a secondary Indian city would certainly be advantageous for AI. That advantage disappears fast if it is a larger city like Bangalore or Hyderabad. In that regard, AI will be the #4 choice out of DFW. Add to that the 'expected' decline on the travel visa's issued and this may be a little shrinking market.

AI is better served by sticking to a UA hub and adding non-stops to EWR/ORD/IAD to likes of BOM/BLR/MAA etc.

Obsession with hubs is all good so long as the cash-flow supports it; if you are relying on govt. hand-out's to build your hub, life can be a little hard. Just ask Hogan.
 
indcwby
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Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Thu May 11, 2017 6:13 pm

vadodara wrote:
LAXdude1023 wrote:

Ill be honest, I would have expected IAH first simply because of the Star Hub and nothing else.

DFW has a larger and much faster growing Indian community and the business ties that DFW has with India are growing exponentially. If you spend time in a place like Irving or Plano, its pretty overwhelming. Its not New Jersey or the Silicon Valley, but its about on par with places in the Chicago area.

Houston has Sugar Land, Missouri City, and Stafford which have very large Indian communities and the Westchase area has a ton of Indian businesses, but its got nothing on the suburbs north of Dallas.


Yep! Growth and diversity is all good, but India is not a single region. One stop to DEL to a secondary Indian city would certainly be advantageous for AI. That advantage disappears fast if it is a larger city like Bangalore or Hyderabad. In that regard, AI will be the #4 choice out of DFW. Add to that the 'expected' decline on the travel visa's issued and this may be a little shrinking market.

AI is better served by sticking to a UA hub and adding non-stops to EWR/ORD/IAD to likes of BOM/BLR/MAA etc.

Obsession with hubs is all good so long as the cash-flow supports it; if you are relying on govt. hand-out's to build your hub, life can be a little hard. Just ask Hogan.


This is exactly what I was thinking too. Unless the fares were priced significantly less than the M3, I don't see your BLR/MAA/HYD/COK/TVM traffic wanting to go through DEL when they can have a nice stopover in DXB/DOH/AUH with a nicer experience.
A319, A320, A330, A340, B717, B727, B737, B747, B757, B767, B777, CRJ7, DC10, MD88, MD11, E145, E175
"Always remember that you fly an airplane with your head, not your hands."
 
CaliguyNYC
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Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Thu May 11, 2017 6:42 pm

"can have a nice stopover in DXB/DOH/AUH" - look all pax are not the same. There are many pax who do not consider transiting in the ME "nice". Plus if you miss your connection in DEL, chance are you can be rebooked in a reasonable amount of time. AI doesn't need everyone to want to connect through DEL, just a few pax from a slew of different cities. Which carrier one chooses is based on price, FF program, timings, luggage allowance, food, where you want to connect etc. Doesn't the AI ORD-DEL-HYD flight have a large amount of people starting or ending in HYD? So I guess some people will connect through DEL.
 
texdravid
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Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Thu May 11, 2017 6:44 pm

Color me Unimpressed. Sure for the North Indian Delhi traffic DFW-DEL is nice but it won't change the habits of South Indians, like Mallus and Tamils.

The ME3 have a nicer product and better transit options than one has to endure in Delhi.

If South Indians have to do one stop to their Indian cities, why go for AI and their unreliability, their Babu attitude and unpleasant situations?

AI is an North Indian airline for North Indians and government Babus.
Tort reform now. Throw lawyers in jail later.
 
VTORD
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Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Thu May 11, 2017 6:52 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:
"can have a nice stopover in DXB/DOH/AUH" - look all pax are not the same. There are many pax who do not consider transiting in the ME "nice".

:checkmark:
+ there will be quite a few who will not care where they transit or the duty free experience....
 
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Irehdna
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Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Thu May 11, 2017 6:54 pm

texdravid wrote:
Color me Unimpressed. Sure for the North Indian Delhi traffic DFW-DEL is nice but it won't change the habits of South Indians, like Mallus and Tamils.

The ME3 have a nicer product and better transit options than one has to endure in Delhi.

If South Indians have to do one stop to their Indian cities, why go for AI and their unreliability, their Babu attitude and unpleasant situations?

AI is an North Indian airline for North Indians and government Babus.


It is important to note that India is more than the cities served by ME3. There are many people who prefer to travel with as few stops as possible, and for some, AI is their best option. Take for example Pune-JFK. No ME3 served PNQ; the only 1-stop option for this route is via DEL on AI. Otherwise you would have to do PNQ-DEL-DXB-JFK or PNQ-HYD-DOH-JFK, which are far less desirable than PNQ-DEL-JFK, even if it means travelling on a "world-class" airline or not for part of the journey. Other examples of 2nd-tier cities are Madurai, Goa, Surat, Varanasi, the list goes on and on.

However, I agree that when you hit larger cities like BOM/MAA/HYD, then ME3 is a far better option. To travel from BOM-JFK will be much more desirable on EK or EY via DXB/AUH than AI via DEL, unless AI can heavily under-cut on price.
 
devmapper
Posts: 219
Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2017 10:15 pm

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Thu May 11, 2017 7:40 pm

Irehdna wrote:
However, I agree that when you hit larger cities like BOM/MAA/HYD, then ME3 is a far better option. To travel from BOM-JFK will be much more desirable on EK or EY via DXB/AUH than AI via DEL, unless AI can heavily under-cut on price.


A number of people have claimed that the ME3 hubs are preferable to DEL from a connection stand-point. If that is truly the case, then what explains the success AI has had with the DEL-SFO flight? Wouldn't SFO, serving the entire Bay area, have a much higher mix of premium passengers than DFW, who should normally prefer EK/QR/EY over AI any day of the week? After all, the ME3 offer much superior hard and soft products (at least before the laptop ban). AI should be losing the shirt on its back on this flight. So why is EY severely downgrading SFO in favor of DFW?.

One explanation of this might be that AIs flight is not only acceptable to the Indian diaspora in the San Francisco-Bay Area CSA, but it might actually be preferable. This essentially means that those complaining about DEL as a connecting hub do not know what they are talking about and are only voicing their inner prejudices.
The other explanation is that there is not much of a market to BLR, HYD or MAA from SFO. If that is the case, then there should be even lower demand for non-stop flights to those cities from DFW. Either way, I don't really see a case for a non-stop ULH flight from any of the south Indian cities to USA.
 
dtw2hyd
Posts: 8478
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Thu May 11, 2017 8:16 pm

ME3 hubs are better is a myth spread by ME3 fans and who never visited India. DEL/BOM are a breeze even on EU carriers. Read AI is even more proactive helping transit passengers.

International transits are difficult at DEL is also myth on a.net.

BLR-SFO will do better is another myth. I recall reading a BLR-SFO non-stop would pickup 7 additional Bangalore passengers while losing 30+ international transit passengers at DEL. AI did the right thing. Also the people likely use AI are from HYD not from BLR. US client managers visiting India most likely use LH, SQ or ME3.

DFW offered a two year incentive to EY. If AI waits almost two years, it can also get same incentive.
All posts are just opinions.
 
vin2basketball
Posts: 235
Joined: Sun Dec 06, 2009 7:31 pm

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Thu May 11, 2017 10:00 pm

devmapper wrote:
Irehdna wrote:
However, I agree that when you hit larger cities like BOM/MAA/HYD, then ME3 is a far better option. To travel from BOM-JFK will be much more desirable on EK or EY via DXB/AUH than AI via DEL, unless AI can heavily under-cut on price.


A number of people have claimed that the ME3 hubs are preferable to DEL from a connection stand-point. If that is truly the case, then what explains the success AI has had with the DEL-SFO flight? Wouldn't SFO, serving the entire Bay area, have a much higher mix of premium passengers than DFW, who should normally prefer EK/QR/EY over AI any day of the week? After all, the ME3 offer much superior hard and soft products (at least before the laptop ban). AI should be losing the shirt on its back on this flight. So why is EY severely downgrading SFO in favor of DFW?.

One explanation of this might be that AIs flight is not only acceptable to the Indian diaspora in the San Francisco-Bay Area CSA, but it might actually be preferable. This essentially means that those complaining about DEL as a connecting hub do not know what they are talking about and are only voicing their inner prejudices.
The other explanation is that there is not much of a market to BLR, HYD or MAA from SFO. If that is the case, then there should be even lower demand for non-stop flights to those cities from DFW. Either way, I don't really see a case for a non-stop ULH flight from any of the south Indian cities to USA.


As someone who recently flew both South India - DXB (the best of the ME3) - USA and South India - DEL - NYC within the last year in premium cabins, I don't know that I'd agree that the DEL transit experience is that much worse than DXB. Terminal 3 at DEL has really changed the game here - the food options and overall terminal experience are somewhat comparable now, DXB does have more shopping if that's your thing. AI certainly has its problems from a PaxEx perspective, but the 9-abreast seating in the 777-300ER is definitely better than the 10-abreast cattle class on EK/QR/EY. Connecting via DEL vs. via an ME3 airport wasn't that different, I still had to re-clear security in both places (which is the main time lag/concern).

In a premium cabin, AI's J class is arguably better than EK's 2-3-2 crapshoot (A380 excepted) and the hard product is maybe 80-85% as good as EY/QR. But the price point is usually 20-30% better on AI than on EK, and that has to play a role. EK/EY F class are clearly a cut above, but that's a tiny minority of pax anyway. In terms of the airport lounge and ground experience EK/EY/QR are clearly better with the chauffeur service and the like, but saving $1-2k roundtrip will cure a lot of ills.
 
TigerFlyer
Posts: 218
Joined: Tue Apr 25, 2017 7:51 pm

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Fri May 12, 2017 4:23 am

dtw2hyd wrote:
TigerFlyer wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:


Not one sentence you wrote is true.

Delta sued Air India/EXIM in federal district court, lost it, lost on appeal as well. They are not even sovereign guaranteed by Indian government.

Close to 60 AI narrow bodies and 15xB777s are financed from global financiers, because India has no aviation financier or leasing company. First few were EXIM guaranteed, but AI has to get a bridge loans while EXIM approves the finance. EXIM was in shambles later, and AI continued bridge loans and SLB cycle.

AI's 23xB787s/2xB744s are leased from Investec of UK and DVB of Germany.
There were fourteen responses to 14xA320NEO lease RFP, AFALCO won the contract,
Bank of China is the lessor for 5xA320SLs.
Avation PLC is the lessor for first batch of 8xATR72s
Dubai Aviation is lessor for next batch of 10 x ATR72s

There is not a shred of evidence to prove your statement, but this is a.net, you have enough support.


Every word is true. Air India received $3.4 billion in ExIm fiananciang for the purchase of Boeing aircraft they could not otherwise have afforded. Think about that number. $3.4 billion from US taxpayers. It is unfortunate that the court of appeals did not properly apply the statute which requires consideration of the impact on US industry. i.e. Airlines, not just Boeing.

AI has been kept afloat by their government. Secure in that knowledge is the only reason that lessors and lenders would ever consider doing business with them.


First of all you have no clue how EXIM works. Read both case filings and come back to discuss. Original estimated amount was $3.4 Billion, that also loan guarantee, not a loan.

AI took delivery of B777s by the time loan guarantee was approved. DL/ATA/ALPA sued Air India/Boeing/EXIM. AI took deliveries thru bridge finance and SLB.

Because of all this mess AI didn't even had finance to take first delivery. Bridge loan for first two deliveries was arranged by Boeing, because neither EXIM nor GOI provided funding and AI haven't even issued RFP for commercial borrowing.

AI doesn't even own B788s, they are leased.

There is record of bridge loan RFP for every B788

You are probably an ME3 supporter trying to defect blame to AI. Just like some US3 fans rub the service cancellations on AI.

Guess what these US stations were served by AI even before ME3 came into business and ULH planes were built.



There is no disputing that AI is a recipient of massive ExIm and Indian government subsidy. While we can debate the nuances of bridge fianancing, the fact is that the real money AI received for the 777s came from ExIm and US taxpayers. ExIm confirms this. http://www.exim.gov/news/ex-im-bank-air ... ransaction

As a result, DL who had invested in 777LRs to fly JFK-DEL was forced to drop the route in the face of subsidized competition by the government of India. And, unwittingly US taxpayers.

Not a fan of the ME3 either. Simply put, there should be much stricter scrutiny of any and all subsidy in international air transport to carriers operating to the US.
 
anshabhi
Posts: 2261
Joined: Thu Oct 20, 2016 10:40 am

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Fri May 12, 2017 5:06 am

what are you trying to say? they were not subsidies or donations. They were loans which AI is still struggling to pay
I don't understand why would ExIm give AI several billion $ for free..
 
indcwby
Posts: 332
Joined: Sat Dec 18, 2010 7:32 pm

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Fri May 12, 2017 6:32 am

devmapper wrote:
Either way, I don't really see a case for a non-stop ULH flight from any of the south Indian cities to USA.


No, it wouldn't make sense to have one either. No one is saying that there should be a non-stop flight to South India. However, If one has a choice to fly via AI or M3 and their destination was in one of the major Metros of South India, many would go with M3. Surprisingly, you'll find cheaper fares with them as well. Now, there may be a time where AI does catch up and clean up it's tarnished past, but frankly, it will be a M3 choice.
A319, A320, A330, A340, B717, B727, B737, B747, B757, B767, B777, CRJ7, DC10, MD88, MD11, E145, E175
"Always remember that you fly an airplane with your head, not your hands."
 
abrelosojos
Posts: 4322
Joined: Sun May 29, 2005 6:48 am

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Fri May 12, 2017 6:47 am

texdravid wrote:
Color me Unimpressed. Sure for the North Indian Delhi traffic DFW-DEL is nice but it won't change the habits of South Indians, like Mallus and Tamils.

The ME3 have a nicer product and better transit options than one has to endure in Delhi.

If South Indians have to do one stop to their Indian cities, why go for AI and their unreliability, their Babu attitude and unpleasant situations?

AI is an North Indian airline for North Indians and government Babus.


= I come back to A.Net India forum after such a long hiatus, but am comforted by your continued North India bashing. It has been like 10 years. I wonder how you are in person :).

Good on Air India overall. Time to make an India trip, and do some reports!

Saludos,
Alex
Live, and let live.
 
dtw2hyd
Posts: 8478
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Fri May 12, 2017 11:18 am

TigerFlyer wrote:
There is no disputing that AI is a recipient of massive ExIm and Indian government subsidy. While we can debate the nuances of bridge fianancing, the fact is that the real money AI received for the 777s came from ExIm and US taxpayers. ExIm confirms this. http://www.exim.gov/news/ex-im-bank-air ... ransaction

As a result, DL who had invested in 777LRs to fly JFK-DEL was forced to drop the route in the face of subsidized competition by the government of India. And, unwittingly US taxpayers.

Not a fan of the ME3 either. Simply put, there should be much stricter scrutiny of any and all subsidy in international air transport to carriers operating to the US.


Again, read the filing by EXIM to the court. AI and EXIM promised to the court AI will not use any EXIM guaranteed aircraft to US. Hence no unfair competition. AI can send any B777 and most B787s to US. Only few B787s violate the promise and court ruling.

That was a failed plea by DL to a US court.

Why US3 cannot succeed on Indian routes
-US3 don't want to serve Indian food to Indian passengers on a flight to India. 16+ hours without food for a paid passenger, while others are enjoying Angus beef.
-US3 FAs won't help senior citizens or disabled.
-Crew won't speak any Indian language and show condescending attitude towards non-English speakers.
-If the passenger didn't understand the "instructions", cops will be called hence the possibility of drag and drop.
These are the same reasons they are making news within US

AI FAs take good care of the fragile, hence the loyalty.
All posts are just opinions.
 
dtw2hyd
Posts: 8478
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Fri May 12, 2017 11:38 am

texdravid wrote:
Color me Unimpressed. Sure for the North Indian Delhi traffic DFW-DEL is nice but it won't change the habits of South Indians, like Mallus and Tamils.

The ME3 have a nicer product and better transit options than one has to endure in Delhi.

If South Indians have to do one stop to their Indian cities, why go for AI and their unreliability, their Babu attitude and unpleasant situations?

AI is an North Indian airline for North Indians and government Babus.


Keralites literally run world's largest international airline, why do they need Air India. They can send handpicked frame and crew to Kerala.

EK stands for English Keralite.
All posts are just opinions.
 
sand26391
Posts: 674
Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2014 11:47 am

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Fri May 12, 2017 11:41 am

[quote="dtw2hyd"]ME3 hubs are better is a myth spread by ME3 fans and who never visited India. DEL/BOM are a breeze even on EU carriers. Read AI is even more proactive helping transit passengers.

BLR-SFO will do better is another myth. I recall reading a BLR-SFO non-stop would pickup 7 additional Bangalore passengers while losing 30+ international transit passengers at DEL. AI did the right thing. Also the people likely use AI are from HYD not from BLR.
/quote]

Oh well.... ur myth abt HYD having more SFO pax than BLR is BUSTED.
https://twitter.com/PriyankKharge/statu ... 5999145984
 
dtw2hyd
Posts: 8478
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Fri May 12, 2017 11:57 am

sand26391 wrote:
Oh well.... ur myth abt HYD having more SFO pax than BLR is BUSTED.
https://twitter.com/PriyankKharge/statu ... 5999145984


Again that includes LH,SQ,ME3. Those premium travelers are not going to fly AI, even if it is a non-stop.

ME3 carried 300,000 over last quarter from/to HYD, ie 1666 PDEW. 60% of it transit. Considering HYD is EK's #1 US connecting point, which one AI should target.
All posts are just opinions.
 
sand26391
Posts: 674
Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2014 11:47 am

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Fri May 12, 2017 12:11 pm

Thankfully they dont fly AI & choose LH,BA,ME3 etc....Its kinda a blessing in disguise that AI doesnt have many flights to BLR or use wide-bodies. Pax have better choice flying to the US
 
dtw2hyd
Posts: 8478
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Fri May 12, 2017 12:47 pm

I guess feelings are mutual. Thanks to Bangalore one of the active AI frame is recorded as scrapped, and you guys fly only planes with original parts from delivery.

All AI has is pilots who knows which engine to shutdown.
All posts are just opinions.
 
CaliguyNYC
Posts: 1251
Joined: Tue Sep 27, 2016 7:27 pm

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Fri May 12, 2017 1:58 pm

Fortunately for the Indian airline industry actual customers could care less about things like connecting in North India or this odd HYD vs BLR debate. Seriously, I don't even understand these deep bigotries that are expressed in Indian aviation forums (sorry that is what it seems - do people even read what they write?). Fact is AI is getting people to connect in DEL (and many of these are from the South and Gujarat). Another fact, India is a big enough market to support at least one (if not two - but no more) world class hubs. DEL will absolutely be the first - because of (a) AI, (b) lack of competing airports in the Northern region and (c) modern airport with several runways and room to grow. I only ever fly into BOM and remember the days when Indian aviation was all BOM focused. BOM has no room so it won't be this huge hub - I am surviving so should the BLR, MAA, HYD people. Finally, while MAA and HYD might put more butts in seats, BLR has more premium seats to fund nonstops. If any airport in the South gets a US nonstop, it will be BLR (but even that isn't happening for awhile - BOM will be preferred because of J/Y demand mix). And while I am at it, AMD is not getting a nonstop US flight either. There isn't enough premium demand period plus many of the premium Gujarati demand is actually flying to BOM anyway.
 
User avatar
unrave
Posts: 2682
Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2015 6:37 am

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Fri May 12, 2017 2:36 pm

AI is absolutely right is focussing on developing DEL as a hub for all its long haul travel. The lack of competing airports in the region and and a master plan of eventually supporting up to 110m (130m?) pax bodes well for AI's network. But AI should do more to ensure smaller Indian cities are better connected to the afternoon bank in DEL. My personal gripe is that AI does not have a non stop flight to CJB in spite of being the 19th busiest airport in the country.
17April2019: RIP Jet Airways
 
anshabhi
Posts: 2261
Joined: Thu Oct 20, 2016 10:40 am

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Fri May 12, 2017 2:55 pm

This North Indians vs South Indians bigotry is incredible.
 
blrsea
Posts: 1950
Joined: Fri May 20, 2005 2:22 am

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Fri May 12, 2017 3:11 pm

unrave wrote:
AI is absolutely right is focussing on developing DEL as a hub for all its long haul travel. The lack of competing airports in the region and and a master plan of eventually supporting up to 110m (130m?) pax bodes well for AI's network. But AI should do more to ensure smaller Indian cities are better connected to the afternoon bank in DEL. My personal gripe is that AI does not have a non stop flight to CJB in spite of being the 19th busiest airport in the country.


Totally agree on AI focusing on DEL and having more connecting flights from tier-II cities. Many people from South do connect at AI. And given AI's piddly fleet, having two hubs is a recipe for disaster. And the distance from South India to North America is pretty long, even more than DXB-N America, and I doubt whether it even makes economic sense. And for such flights, you need good loads consistently. EK for e.g has daily flights to US, but has feeds coming in from not just India, but whole of South Asia, ME and Africa.

Better concentrate on DEL hub, launch more flights from DEL to other countries, and importantly expand domestic network. That's more realistic doable goal which AI should concentrate on.
 
dtw2hyd
Posts: 8478
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Fri May 12, 2017 3:14 pm

It is not the question of North vs South (or) HYD vs BLR.

You cannot tarnish airline image for years claiming it has bad mx practices/loss making non-stops and turnaround ask for a non-stop to your city which is already well connected to Europe.

AI should replace all WB dom tags with A320NEOs and also close Mumbai crew base. AI wasting $$Millions on deadheading crew from Mumbai base.
All posts are just opinions.
 
User avatar
unrave
Posts: 2682
Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2015 6:37 am

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Fri May 12, 2017 4:15 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:

AI should replace all WB dom tags with A320NEOs and also close Mumbai crew base.

That is how you start Shiv Sena riots. Politics has always trumped economic sense when it comes to Air India
17April2019: RIP Jet Airways
 
SATexan
Posts: 277
Joined: Wed Jul 22, 2009 6:49 pm

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Fri May 12, 2017 4:21 pm

abrelosojos wrote:
Good on Air India overall. Time to make an India trip, and do some reports!
Alex

Alex, Long time no trip report! Been waiting for one...

CaliguyNYC wrote:
"can have a nice stopover in DXB/DOH/AUH" - look all pax are not the same

Very well said! Not all passengers are the same. Over the years myself and lot of my coworkers and friends/families have been to India. I very often hear them complain about the ME3 and Qatar in particular. Denied bassinets, Seats getting changed at check-in and pre-selected seats not getting honored, the "desi" gate agents working for ME3 at the airports imposing their own rules, Priorities given to ME pax over Indians, the cattle herd type "boxing" of passengers at airport gates, long check-in times at airports, random baggage weighing and fees imposed at the gate areas, lack of midflight snacks, terrible AVML food, duty free shops not giving change back etc., Also, lets not act like the ME3 offer some gourmet food in Y. The food is just as good in AI economy. Plus, their flights (particularly QR and EY) arrive in India at ungodly hours. So there are passengers who are willing to try alternatives to the ME3 and that's where AI comes into the picture.

I have no doubt that AI can create their own niche in DFW or IAH. Whether it is a daily service or just a thrice weekly service, I am not sure. But there will be people willing to fly on AI. The market is there. Additionally, there will be enough people driving to either airports from Austin, San Antonio, Oklahoma City, New Orleans and remote parts of South Texas where literally every single one of the motels are owned by Indians. These people are already driving to airports to get on ME3 and I bet they'd be willing to do the same for AI.

dtw2hyd wrote:
ME3 hubs are better is a myth spread by ME3 fans and who never visited India. DEL/BOM are a breeze even on EU carriers. Read AI is even more proactive helping transit passengers.

:checkmark: :checkmark:

dtw2hyd wrote:
Keralites literally run world's largest international airline, why do they need Air India.

Air India express runs craptons of flights from Kerala to the Middle east.

dtw2hyd wrote:
I guess feelings are mutual. Thanks to Bangalore one of the active AI frame is recorded as scrapped, and you guys fly only planes with original parts from delivery.

No "You Guys" finger pointing please. Explain, what exactly has AI done to Bangalore? They don't even fly to Dubai or Singapore from there. Air India express serves a bunch of tiny airports but not BLR. AI's presence has historically been minimal and have always neglected BLR despite the FACT that it is still THE premier tech destination in India. Outside of the doomed Kingfisher no other carrier has ever operated a true hub out of BLR. The market is there and growing rapidly for the past decade. Yet AI continues to look elsewhere. If Hyderabad was such a high yield market then how come BA is the only European carrier in town??
 
subramak1
Posts: 196
Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2016 10:21 pm

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Fri May 12, 2017 4:29 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
ME3 hubs are better is a myth spread by ME3 fans and who never visited India. DEL/BOM are a breeze even on EU carriers. Read AI is even more proactive helping transit passengers.

International transits are difficult at DEL is also myth on a.net.

BLR-SFO will do better is another myth. I recall reading a BLR-SFO non-stop would pickup 7 additional Bangalore passengers while losing 30+ international transit passengers at DEL. AI did the right thing. Also the people likely use AI are from HYD not from BLR. US client managers visiting India most likely use LH, SQ or ME3.

DFW offered a two year incentive to EY. If AI waits almost two years, it can also get same incentive.


INTL Transit in Delhi is a breeze. I flew DEN ORD DEL MAA last year. It was more painful transiting in ORD.

In DEL you exit the plane and walk a 100 meters , they guide you to security check for transit passengers. You clear the security take the escalators and you are back in the terminal.

In all it took 20 mins or so.

Get me an airport that beats this experience.

Subu
 
manny
Posts: 563
Joined: Sat Sep 09, 2006 8:59 am

Re: AI plans several new long hauls for 2017

Fri May 12, 2017 4:54 pm

I cannot believe how short sighted some people are. Airline travel is a very important part of any countries infrastructure. That is why you need strong country based airlines. ME3 airlines are there to profit from passengers as much as they can. They do not have an interest in any countries development. Tomorrow if Indian based airlines stop providing competing services than what is to stop ME3 airlines from racking the fares up and gouging these very passengers who are today busy singing their praises. They do not even care two hoots for Indians or their country. Infact Dubai has been used for lot of anti Indian activities. To top that there have been some time periods when EK and rest of the outside airlines have raise there fares dramatically to test how much the abuse the Indian travel market is willing to bear.
That is why when it comes to infrastructure like air connectivity most developed nations do not allow any outside airline to completely takeover any market. So try taking over the French international market like EK has in India or have an Indian entity completely buy a German airline. Than the very people preaching the world about free market would be out with pitchforks placing every hurdle they can.
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