jayunited
Posts: 2392
Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2013 12:03 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Fri May 12, 2017 1:10 pm

globalcabotage wrote:
Probably nothing out of ORD unless Parker has ideas. Nothing has been added there internationally for a couple of years, although T5 at peak times is full and will be that way for a couple of more years.



I completely agree I think I think ORD will perhaps see an expansion of their seasonal service this year ORD-FCO has already started it seasonal service has been extended into October. ORD-DUB/EDI/SNN may have their seasonal service extended next year as well and perhaps ORD-DUB may be upgaged from a 757 to a 763 in 2018 but I don't think ORD will see any new international flights in 2018, The focus at ORD is really on domestic expansion.

From LAX I think UA will add LAX-BNE, LAX-HKG, If UA could secure a frequency I think UA would add LAX-PEK (all flights operated using 789's)
From EWR I think UA might add additional flights to South America, they are already relaunching EWR-EZE, I think EWR-GIG might be next but perhaps seasonal.
I think IAD, ORD, and IAH will maintain the status quo with no additional international flights but perhaps some upgages in equipment.

UA is starting to grow DEN domestically and I think that growth will fuel some international flights. I think one of the 6 daily LHR flights UA operates out of EWR will be switched over to operate DEN-LHR, (or perhaps UA may try to get their hands on another LHR slot) and I also think we will see UA launch DEN-FRA, (both flight utilizing 788's.).

Although I know this will probably never happen I would love to see ORD-TLV, and ORD-BOM/DEL
Last edited by jayunited on Fri May 12, 2017 1:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
SFOtoORD
Posts: 1185
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2007 2:26 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Fri May 12, 2017 1:11 pm

If LAX gets a new intl route it either needs to be a route already flown out of SFO or one that has uniquely high LAX O&D. If it's the former I'd guess HKG or FRA. If the latter then I'd guess BNE or South Pacific (NAN or PPT). And maybe my wild guess is SGN.
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
Posts: 7453
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2002 11:45 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Fri May 12, 2017 1:19 pm

[url][/url]Good wish-lists but what sort of capacity guidance has UA given for FY17 and into FY18 by region?

That should indicate where any sort of growth is to occur. Most guidance shows that much of the capacity growth in the near-term is going to be domestic as that is where growth has been the most positive. Pacific isn't really a shining star at the moment. Atlantic is holding steady but has yield pressure from all the increased capacity and ULCC flying.

How much of the new air-frames coming on in the near-term is allocated to back-fill 744 replacements?
 
FSDan
Posts: 2786
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:27 pm

Re: United's future International Expansion

Fri May 12, 2017 1:44 pm

I could see EWR-ICN and EWR-BLR on 789s.

From LAX, it would be interesting to see a completely new market like LAX-SGN (get there before VN, but probably too low yielding...), LAX-CHC (in partnership with NZ, but probably too small of a market...), or LAX-EZE. All long shots for sure, but would be much more interesting than LAX-CDG/FCO or LAX-BNE.
This is my signature until I think of a better one.
 
United1
Posts: 3906
Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2003 9:21 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Fri May 12, 2017 2:00 pm

PSU.DTW.SCE wrote:
[url][/url]Good wish-lists but what sort of capacity guidance has UA given for FY17 and into FY18 by region?

That should indicate where any sort of growth is to occur. Most guidance shows that much of the capacity growth in the near-term is going to be domestic as that is where growth has been the most positive. Pacific isn't really a shining star at the moment. Atlantic is holding steady but has yield pressure from all the increased capacity and ULCC flying.

How much of the new air-frames coming on in the near-term is allocated to back-fill 744 replacements?


United doesn't really break capacity increases out by region ahead of time...but you can get an idea where its going to.

Domestic: 3.5-4.5%
International: 1-2%
Consolidated: 2.5-3.5%

Looking back however we can see where UA has grown YTD:

Domestic 3.4%
Mainline 5.4%
Regional (4.3%)
International 2.5%
Atlantic (2%)
Pacific 7.3%
Latin America 2.2%
Mainline 2.3%
Regional (0.8%)
Consolidated 3.0%
I know the voices in my head aren't real but sometimes their ideas are just awesome!!!
 
LAXdude1023
Posts: 5954
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:16 pm

Re: United's future International Expansion

Fri May 12, 2017 2:22 pm

More than anything, from IAH, I would be far more interested in UA doing some domestic expansion as opposed to international expansion.
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD BRING BACK THE PAYWALL!!!!
 
caverunner17
Posts: 265
Joined: Tue Jun 14, 2016 9:50 pm

Re: United's future International Expansion

Fri May 12, 2017 2:41 pm

strfyr51 wrote:
caverunner17 wrote:
jhsusman wrote:
With the International "A" concourse expanding in DEN to handle more widebodies: DEN - LHR, DEN - CDG, DEN - ZRH

With Norwegian adding DEN-LGW, I can't see UA flying DEN-LHR, except perhaps seasonally. I could see a seasonal DEN-CDG though.

ZRH doesn't have the O&D Traffic and if you're going to connect on an LH group flight, might as well be through MUC or FRA which LH already flies.

question?? What would Norwegian flying anywhere have to do with United?? Your Logic escapes me.


Over-saturated market.

You have a legacy (BA) on the route that has huge feed from the Euro side + captures the premium demand on DEN-LHR. Norwegian will begin to capture the leisure side of DEN-LON.

UA already flies to LHR from LAX, SFO, IAH, ORD, EWR and IAD. It would rather feed connecting pax through another hub if LHR bound or through MUC/FRA if bound elsewhere in Europe.

Not to mention, it's out of 752 range, the 763 is tire-speed limited at DEN, so you'd have to use a 77E or 788 on the route..... which again, would mean penetrating the market from BA to support the increase of 200+ seats/day.
 
dmstorm22
Posts: 579
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 1:49 pm

Re: United's future International Expansion

Fri May 12, 2017 2:53 pm

FSDan wrote:
I could see EWR-ICN and EWR-BLR on 789s.

From LAX, it would be interesting to see a completely new market like LAX-SGN (get there before VN, but probably too low yielding...), LAX-CHC (in partnership with NZ, but probably too small of a market...), or LAX-EZE. All long shots for sure, but would be much more interesting than LAX-CDG/FCO or LAX-BNE.


Selfishly, I would love EWR-BLR. And in theory I get the idea. While not Bay Area, there could be enough front-of-the-plane traffic to fill Business and VFR to fill Y. UA has been able to make two India non-stops work from EWR.

I would just worry that the level of VFR isn't high enough for BLR (and there would be some cannibalization from the DEL and BOM flights, though small).
 
nadavatar64
Posts: 270
Joined: Mon Jun 30, 2014 2:44 pm

Re: United's future International Expansion

Fri May 12, 2017 3:34 pm

I think UA can easily pull off ORD-TLV or LAX-TLV, considering how well they are doing on EWR-TLV and SFO-TLV. As others have said, I think BNE or FRA could be next from LAX, but I think UA first needs to fill the SFO-MEL hole.
 
klwright69
Posts: 2702
Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2000 4:22 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Fri May 12, 2017 4:14 pm

No one has mentioned UA opening another gateway to India. Say SFO?
 
B747forever
Posts: 13814
Joined: Mon May 21, 2007 9:50 pm

Re: United's future International Expansion

Fri May 12, 2017 4:20 pm

strfyr51 wrote:
caverunner17 wrote:
jhsusman wrote:
With the International "A" concourse expanding in DEN to handle more widebodies: DEN - LHR, DEN - CDG, DEN - ZRH

With Norwegian adding DEN-LGW, I can't see UA flying DEN-LHR, except perhaps seasonally. I could see a seasonal DEN-CDG though.

ZRH doesn't have the O&D Traffic and if you're going to connect on an LH group flight, might as well be through MUC or FRA which LH already flies.

question?? What would Norwegian flying anywhere have to do with United?? Your Logic escapes me.


Competition! UA couldn't make DEN-LHR work when they only had BA on the route. With DY also serving DEN-LON it makes it even less likely that UA will return on DEN-LHR.
Work Hard, Fly Right
 
CHI787ORD
Posts: 817
Joined: Sat Jun 11, 2005 11:27 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Fri May 12, 2017 9:29 pm

klwright69 wrote:
No one has mentioned UA opening another gateway to India. Say SFO?


Two people including myself have mentioned ORD-BOM
 
klwright69
Posts: 2702
Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2000 4:22 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Sat May 13, 2017 5:37 pm

I kind of doubt UA will return to DENLHR.
What about more Spain and Portugal routes from other hubs?
 
ASQ400
Posts: 342
Joined: Sat Apr 22, 2017 12:21 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Sat May 13, 2017 9:30 pm

strfyr51 wrote:
caverunner17 wrote:
jhsusman wrote:
With the International "A" concourse expanding in DEN to handle more widebodies: DEN - LHR, DEN - CDG, DEN - ZRH

With Norwegian adding DEN-LGW, I can't see UA flying DEN-LHR, except perhaps seasonally. I could see a seasonal DEN-CDG though.

ZRH doesn't have the O&D Traffic and if you're going to connect on an LH group flight, might as well be through MUC or FRA which LH already flies.

question?? What would Norwegian flying anywhere have to do with United?? Your Logic escapes me.

Competition.
If Norwegian is in there, there's less money for UA to make
TLV, BRU, ZRH, CDG, FRA, EWR, JFK, DEN, SFO, AUS, RNO, SEA, YYC, YYZ, IAH, ATL, IAD, DCA, ORD, SJC, SNA
 
klwright69
Posts: 2702
Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2000 4:22 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Sun May 14, 2017 9:22 am

Someone suggested new routes to Venezuela.
In a different world, maybe. But not in this one.
Routes from LAX to Europe or Latin America might undermine currents routes in place through other hubs. But you never know.
 
User avatar
intotheair
Posts: 1822
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2014 12:49 pm

Re: United's future International Expansion

Sun May 14, 2017 9:29 am

jayunited wrote:
UA is starting to grow DEN domestically and I think that growth will fuel some international flights. I think one of the 6 daily LHR flights UA operates out of EWR will be switched over to operate DEN-LHR, (or perhaps UA may try to get their hands on another LHR slot) and I also think we will see UA launch DEN-FRA, (both flight utilizing 788's.).

Although I know this will probably never happen I would love to see ORD-TLV, and ORD-BOM/DEL


While it's true UA is growing DEN domestically, I'm still skeptical we'll see any more longhaul flights on UA metal from DEN. LHR would make a lot of sense, but again, UA only has so many slots, and could they make DEN-LHR work if BA is already on it along with DY on DEN-LGW? Also, what would UA metal on DEN-FRA do that the current LH flight can't do? They already send the 744 to FRA and the MUC flight is back as a 333 in the winter and 346 in the summer. That's a fair amount of capacity, and it doesn't really matter from a financial perspective that both of those flights are on LH metal.

I would *love* to see DEN-CDG or DEN-BRU happen, but I won't hold my breath on either of those.
300 319 320 321 332 333 345 346 380 717 733 734 735 73G 738 739 744 752 753 762 763 772 77W 788 789 CR2 CR7 CR9 CRK Q400 E175 DC10 MD82 MD90
AA AF AS AY AZ B6 BA BR DL F9 FI GA HA KF LH MI QX SK SN SQ UA US VY WN
 
bobnwa
Posts: 4514
Joined: Fri Dec 22, 2000 12:10 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Sun May 14, 2017 5:37 pm

Mortyman wrote:
Would be nice if they would return to OSL

Who would it be nice for? Don't think it is winner in the financial area
 
theSFOspotter
Posts: 178
Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2014 9:51 pm

Re: United's future International Expansion

Sun May 14, 2017 5:57 pm

klwright69 wrote:
No one has mentioned UA opening another gateway to India. Say SFO?



Doesn't make too much sense since AI already operates SFO-DEL daily with the 77L and occasional 77W. With all of the ME3 now in SFO (QR in 2018 with 77W) they would have to offer the cheapest fare and great connection times.
Q-400 A319 A320 B737-300/400/700/800/900ER B757-200/300 B787-8
 
SFOtoORD
Posts: 1185
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2007 2:26 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Sun May 14, 2017 6:12 pm

theSFOspotter wrote:
klwright69 wrote:
No one has mentioned UA opening another gateway to India. Say SFO?



Doesn't make too much sense since AI already operates SFO-DEL daily with the 77L and occasional 77W. With all of the ME3 now in SFO (QR in 2018 with 77W) they would have to offer the cheapest fare and great connection times.


I don't think any of those things would stop UA given they also would likely carry the greatest O&D in the market. I think the issue is that BLR would be the best choice, but likely too long for current AC in the fleet.
 
airfrnt
Posts: 2157
Joined: Fri Jul 02, 2004 2:05 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Sun May 14, 2017 7:12 pm

For UA to really run grow DEN, it is going to have to really commit to DEN as a international gateway to build up enough mass to kick out BA, and defend against Norwegian. I don't think that's in the cards any time soon.
 
manny
Posts: 563
Joined: Sat Sep 09, 2006 8:59 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Sun May 14, 2017 7:16 pm

Whatever happens, DEN will get ignored again. I wish DL was based of DEN instead of SLC. Than DEN would have had a lot more transatlantic flights.
 
User avatar
intotheair
Posts: 1822
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2014 12:49 pm

Re: United's future International Expansion

Sun May 14, 2017 7:41 pm

manny wrote:
Whatever happens, DEN will get ignored again. I wish DL was based of DEN instead of SLC. Than DEN would have had a lot more transatlantic flights.


I'm not so sure of that. Let's take a look at what SLC has:

SLC has longhaul service to LHR, CDG, and AMS (10x weekly in summer).
Soon, DEN will have LHR, LGW (2-3x weekly), FRA, MUC, KEF, and NRT.

So both SLC and DEN have service to LHR and two European partner hubs. The only differences are that the TATL flights aren't on UA metal, though DEN also has the flight to KEF, and DEN has been able to sustain the NRT flight unlike SLC. If you crunched the seat numbers, there are probably more longhaul seats from DEN too. I don't think DL or KL fly anything larger than a 767/A330/787 class of planes into SLC, whereas BA and LH send 747s into DEN everyday, and LH upgauges the MUC flight to an A346 in the summer.

In an alternate world, if UA and not Western had moved from Stapleton to SLC and if DEN were a DL hub today, I don't think there would be much difference aside from that more of the flights would be on DL metal, and they would connect to CDG and AMS instead of FRA and MUC.

In short, DEN's longhaul network seems pretty appropriate for what it is, and it's nothing to sneeze at.
300 319 320 321 332 333 345 346 380 717 733 734 735 73G 738 739 744 752 753 762 763 772 77W 788 789 CR2 CR7 CR9 CRK Q400 E175 DC10 MD82 MD90
AA AF AS AY AZ B6 BA BR DL F9 FI GA HA KF LH MI QX SK SN SQ UA US VY WN
 
ozflier
Posts: 3
Joined: Tue Jan 24, 2017 5:49 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Mon May 15, 2017 8:26 am

TWA772LR wrote:
Expansion on IAH-Colombia with the Avianca deal seems likely.
The return of IAH-LOS has been rumored among the IAH gate agents, but that's exactly what it is, a gate agent rumor.
LAXintl wrote:
LAX will get a new flight per employee townhall last week...

LAX-BNE anyone?

In the past UA have flown to BNE as an addon to the LAX service to SYD.
Not sure how successful it was.
Then some years after it ceased , the LAX-AKL service was rumoured to be under consideration to extend to BNE.
Didn't happen.
Would be great to see a Star Alliance service on stop from BNE- the USA.
 
klwright69
Posts: 2702
Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2000 4:22 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Mon May 15, 2017 12:14 pm

When evaluation more India service, I doubt AI will scare off UA.
 
BG777300ER
Posts: 378
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2005 3:22 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Mon May 15, 2017 1:59 pm

As someone said, I think LAX-FCO would be interesting with the 787-8, considering Alitalia is close to going under. If UA jumps early enough, perhaps they take what Alitalia leaves behind on this route.
 
SonomaFlyer
Posts: 2216
Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2010 2:47 pm

Re: United's future International Expansion

Mon May 15, 2017 2:17 pm

strfyr51 wrote:
caverunner17 wrote:
jhsusman wrote:
With the International "A" concourse expanding in DEN to handle more widebodies: DEN - LHR, DEN - CDG, DEN - ZRH

With Norwegian adding DEN-LGW, I can't see UA flying DEN-LHR, except perhaps seasonally. I could see a seasonal DEN-CDG though.

ZRH doesn't have the O&D Traffic and if you're going to connect on an LH group flight, might as well be through MUC or FRA which LH already flies.

question?? What would Norwegian flying anywhere have to do with United?? Your Logic escapes me.


Norwegian entering a given market puts big pressure on yields. If the market itself is small, that will make it far less likely an airline like UA will enter the market. This is especially true given they serve LHR from six other U.S. cities. Slots are precious and UA isn't about to blow a slot pair on a route with like Denver at this point.
 
LAXdude1023
Posts: 5954
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:16 pm

Re: United's future International Expansion

Mon May 15, 2017 2:47 pm

SonomaFlyer wrote:
strfyr51 wrote:
caverunner17 wrote:
With Norwegian adding DEN-LGW, I can't see UA flying DEN-LHR, except perhaps seasonally. I could see a seasonal DEN-CDG though.

ZRH doesn't have the O&D Traffic and if you're going to connect on an LH group flight, might as well be through MUC or FRA which LH already flies.

question?? What would Norwegian flying anywhere have to do with United?? Your Logic escapes me.


Norwegian entering a given market puts big pressure on yields. If the market itself is small, that will make it far less likely an airline like UA will enter the market. This is especially true given they serve LHR from six other U.S. cities. Slots are precious and UA isn't about to blow a slot pair on a route with like Denver at this point.


I just cant see UA using a LHR slot on DEN when the market isnt that big and they have two other competitors flying that route.
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD BRING BACK THE PAYWALL!!!!
 
User avatar
intotheair
Posts: 1822
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2014 12:49 pm

Re: United's future International Expansion

Mon May 15, 2017 3:09 pm

LAXdude1023 wrote:
I just cant see UA using a LHR slot on DEN when the market isnt that big and they have two other competitors flying that route.


I agree. I think they probably could have made it work with a 2-class 788 if BA were the only ones still flying it. But the questions remain: could that same 788 make more money elsewhere, and could that LHR slot make more money as another frequency to EWR, where demand is substantially higher?

I would love to see more international expansion at DEN, but I don't think it's going to come from UA. There aren't very many destinations left that would make a strong financial and operational case for UA. The biggest unserved market is DEN-CDG, but it's still not quite large enough to support a daily nonstop. Other Star hubs like BRU, ZRH, and VIE? Could be interesting, but those have to be even smaller O&D markets. I also have trouble imagining such flights could work on connections too seeing as there's already a ton of connecting opportunity through FRA and MUC.

An SN flight to BRU and a Thalys train to Gare du Nord would be a pleasant way of getting to Paris from DEN if a nonstop weren't available, but I will stop dreaming now.
Last edited by intotheair on Mon May 15, 2017 3:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
300 319 320 321 332 333 345 346 380 717 733 734 735 73G 738 739 744 752 753 762 763 772 77W 788 789 CR2 CR7 CR9 CRK Q400 E175 DC10 MD82 MD90
AA AF AS AY AZ B6 BA BR DL F9 FI GA HA KF LH MI QX SK SN SQ UA US VY WN
 
UAL777UK
Posts: 2349
Joined: Sun Nov 20, 2005 1:16 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Mon May 15, 2017 3:16 pm

LAXdude1023 wrote:
SonomaFlyer wrote:
strfyr51 wrote:
question?? What would Norwegian flying anywhere have to do with United?? Your Logic escapes me.


Norwegian entering a given market puts big pressure on yields. If the market itself is small, that will make it far less likely an airline like UA will enter the market. This is especially true given they serve LHR from six other U.S. cities. Slots are precious and UA isn't about to blow a slot pair on a route with like Denver at this point.


I just cant see UA using a LHR slot on DEN when the market isnt that big and they have two other competitors flying that route.


Agreed, UA have been there, seen that and got that T-Shirt and it did not work. They will not waste a hugely valuable slot at LHR for another go at that. If LHR were to get anything it would be as pointed out earlier, maybe the second LAX flight.

I think as I have already said that UA should go for SFO-DEL, however it looks like LAX will get dibs this time round so it will be interesting to see what comes to fruition.
 
commavia
Posts: 11489
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2005 2:30 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Mon May 15, 2017 3:42 pm

BG777300ER wrote:
As someone said, I think LAX-FCO would be interesting with the 787-8, considering Alitalia is close to going under. If UA jumps early enough, perhaps they take what Alitalia leaves behind on this route.


I find that highly, highly doubtful. LAX-FCO is a long-stage-length, leisure-oriented and highly-seasonal market. Seeing as United's transatlantic network - owing to United's hub structure in the U.S. and partner structure in Europe - is already arguably the least Southern Europe/leisure/seasonal-oriented of the US3, I highly doubt United would attempt LAX-FCO. If - hypothetically - Alitalia liquidates, I think the far more likely response from United would be a combination of more capacity on its existing Italy flights (in the form of added frequencies and/or larger aircraft), and possibly shifting some of its existing U.S.-FCO flights from seasonal to year-round.

As was discussed recently in another thread - if anything, LAX-FCO would be far better suited to a European longhaul/low-cost carrier like Level or Norwegian.

LAXdude1023 wrote:
I just cant see UA using a LHR slot on DEN when the market isnt that big and they have two other competitors flying that route.


Agree. United would be better off adding frequency to an existing route to another United fortress hub.
 
LAXdude1023
Posts: 5954
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:16 pm

Re: United's future International Expansion

Mon May 15, 2017 4:14 pm

commavia wrote:
BG777300ER wrote:
As someone said, I think LAX-FCO would be interesting with the 787-8, considering Alitalia is close to going under. If UA jumps early enough, perhaps they take what Alitalia leaves behind on this route.


I find that highly, highly doubtful. LAX-FCO is a long-stage-length, leisure-oriented and highly-seasonal market. Seeing as United's transatlantic network - owing to United's hub structure in the U.S. and partner structure in Europe - is already arguably the least Southern Europe/leisure/seasonal-oriented of the US3, I highly doubt United would attempt LAX-FCO. If - hypothetically - Alitalia liquidates, I think the far more likely response from United would be a combination of more capacity on its existing Italy flights (in the form of added frequencies and/or larger aircraft), and possibly shifting some of its existing U.S.-FCO flights from seasonal to year-round.

As was discussed recently in another thread - if anything, LAX-FCO would be far better suited to a European longhaul/low-cost carrier like Level or Norwegian.

LAXdude1023 wrote:
I just cant see UA using a LHR slot on DEN when the market isnt that big and they have two other competitors flying that route.


Agree. United would be better off adding frequency to an existing route to another United fortress hub.


If UA were to get a hold of an extra slot, its best used from LAX or EWR IMO. IAD and ORD are solid with 3x daily frequencies. IAH and SFO are solid with 2x daily frequencies. EWR could always use one more and LAX could also be made to work.
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD BRING BACK THE PAYWALL!!!!
 
diesel33
Posts: 325
Joined: Tue Mar 16, 2004 10:28 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Mon May 15, 2017 4:29 pm

I am curious about UA's double-daily flights between San Francisco and Shanghai.

I know UA had some trouble securing slots for their second flight. Currently, departures from San Francisco are the following: UA857 at 13:20 and UA891 at 16:10. Are the slots for UA891, what UA had originally requested or was this the next best thing?

I think it would be great if UA started a second bank of East Asia bound flights after midnight that allow for arrivals early in the morning in Asia similar to their schedule for their flight to Singapore. Additionally, this would give passengers in the Midwest and East Coast the option of taking the morning non-stop departures from EWR/ORD or take late afternoon/evening flights to SFO and continue onto Asia in time for the work day.

Are there any issues in their flight crew work rules that prohibit these types of international long-haul flights (e.g. 12AM or 1AM departures)?
 
User avatar
AVENSAB727
Posts: 1363
Joined: Sun Jul 01, 2012 4:02 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Mon May 15, 2017 4:42 pm

With UA getting their 787 10s next year, this could make room for more expansion, I can see the 787 10 on some international routes out of IAH, like IAH- South America/ AMS/NRT
Always look on the bright side of Life!
 
LAXdude1023
Posts: 5954
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:16 pm

Re: United's future International Expansion

Mon May 15, 2017 8:18 pm

AVENSAB727 wrote:
With UA getting their 787 10s next year, this could make room for more expansion, I can see the 787 10 on some international routes out of IAH, like IAH- South America/ AMS/NRT


I doubt it. Outside adding a couple of other routes like CLO and GYE, I dont know how much more capacity IAH-South America needs. In the long run, here is what were looking at in terms of IAH-South America effective end of October:

CCS: daily 737
BOG: 2x daily 737
UIO: daily 737
LIM: daily 767
SCL: daily 767
EZE: daily 777
GRU: daily 763
GIG: daily 763

Would love to see CLO and GYE come back, but I doubt were going to get much more capacity than that.
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD BRING BACK THE PAYWALL!!!!
 
User avatar
TWA772LR
Posts: 6986
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2011 6:12 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Mon May 15, 2017 9:35 pm

LAXdude1023 wrote:
AVENSAB727 wrote:
With UA getting their 787 10s next year, this could make room for more expansion, I can see the 787 10 on some international routes out of IAH, like IAH- South America/ AMS/NRT


I doubt it. Outside adding a couple of other routes like CLO and GYE, I dont know how much more capacity IAH-South America needs. In the long run, here is what were looking at in terms of IAH-South America effective end of October:

CCS: daily 737
BOG: 2x daily 737
UIO: daily 737
LIM: daily 767
SCL: daily 767
EZE: daily 777
GRU: daily 763
GIG: daily 763

Would love to see CLO and GYE come back, but I doubt were going to get much more capacity than that.

Seasonal Cartagena? Some 757s being repositioned to South America(especially BOG with the AV deal)?

BTW, I never thought I'd see IAH-GIG become a 763.
When wasn't America great?


The thoughts and opinions shared under this username are mine and are not influenced by my employer.
 
LAXdude1023
Posts: 5954
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:16 pm

Re: United's future International Expansion

Mon May 15, 2017 9:50 pm

TWA772LR wrote:
LAXdude1023 wrote:
AVENSAB727 wrote:
With UA getting their 787 10s next year, this could make room for more expansion, I can see the 787 10 on some international routes out of IAH, like IAH- South America/ AMS/NRT


I doubt it. Outside adding a couple of other routes like CLO and GYE, I dont know how much more capacity IAH-South America needs. In the long run, here is what were looking at in terms of IAH-South America effective end of October:

CCS: daily 737
BOG: 2x daily 737
UIO: daily 737
LIM: daily 767
SCL: daily 767
EZE: daily 777
GRU: daily 763
GIG: daily 763

Would love to see CLO and GYE come back, but I doubt were going to get much more capacity than that.

Seasonal Cartagena? Some 757s being repositioned to South America(especially BOG with the AV deal)?

BTW, I never thought I'd see IAH-GIG become a 763.


CTG is overwhelmingly centered in Florida and New York. Its going to be hard to make a case for a flight from Houston. The IAH-Colombia market is really only two cities: BOG and (to a lesser degree) CLO. IAH doesnt generate much to MDE or CTG nor does really anywhere west of the Mississippi.

Im not really surprised by IAH-GIG being a 763. Its been a 788. The 763 is only a downgrade of 4 seats. They are relatively comparable.
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD BRING BACK THE PAYWALL!!!!
 
Italianflyer
Posts: 660
Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2007 3:06 pm

Re: United's future International Expansion

Mon May 15, 2017 10:24 pm

I can see PAL joining STAR before seeing UA metal from the mainland to MNL.
Otherwise it will be more connecting the dots between existing cities or another secondary Chinese (or Indian) city. It's not really Kirbys m.o. to do off the wall route experiments so I can't see going back to Africa, the Middle East or lesser developed Latin America.
 
PierreCNF
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon Apr 17, 2017 2:54 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Mon May 15, 2017 11:37 pm

SFO-GRU?
Maybe IAH-CNF could work 3 or 4 times week with 763.
 
globalcabotage
Posts: 534
Joined: Wed Nov 25, 2009 10:42 pm

Re: United's future International Expansion

Tue May 16, 2017 2:22 am

2019 will be the year ORD gets some love. T5 will have 9 new gates and there will be a UA/AA turf war for the prime 1pm to 6pm time. Given 2.5 flights times 9 gates opens up 22ish flights that will go fast (along with other airlines and more Pre-clearance that will add a few more flights).

ORD could get
ICN
LIS
MAN
MXP
OSL
TLV
ATH (seasonal)
 
Pyrex
Posts: 4697
Joined: Thu Aug 25, 2005 7:24 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Tue May 16, 2017 4:06 am

Will any of these new routes displace an international 757 that can be deployed elsewhere? I still don't understand why UA does not fly daily or at least 5 times a week EWR-OPO - it is the right size for the market and they could probably displace the 2x weekly TP A330 pretty easily, lots of Star Alliance elites in OPO that just hate having to connect through LIS most days of the week and have no loyalty to TP whatsoever. I imagine fares would probably be decent, too, with lots of business flyers and lots of connections through EWR to other points in the U.S.
Read this very carefully, I shall write this only once!
 
User avatar
DLHAM
Posts: 404
Joined: Sat Dec 31, 2016 1:10 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Tue May 16, 2017 4:19 am

globalcabotage wrote:
2019 will be the year ORD gets some love. T5 will have 9 new gates and there will be a UA/AA turf war for the prime 1pm to 6pm time. Given 2.5 flights times 9 gates opens up 22ish flights that will go fast (along with other airlines and more Pre-clearance that will add a few more flights).

ORD could get
ICN
LIS
MAN
MXP
OSL
TLV
ATH (seasonal)


Maybe they could give ORD-HAM a try. Sooner or later it could get uncomfortable for UA on EWR-HAM with a good possibility of Eurowings or norwegian entering the HAM - NY market in the future.

Hamburg and Chicago are sister cities, there are pretty much passengers on that route with a lot of potential. One third of these passengers are flying for business reasons.
My Instagram Account: Instagram
 
United1
Posts: 3906
Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2003 9:21 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Tue May 16, 2017 4:38 am

DLHAM wrote:
globalcabotage wrote:
2019 will be the year ORD gets some love. T5 will have 9 new gates and there will be a UA/AA turf war for the prime 1pm to 6pm time. Given 2.5 flights times 9 gates opens up 22ish flights that will go fast (along with other airlines and more Pre-clearance that will add a few more flights).

ORD could get
ICN
LIS
MAN
MXP
OSL
TLV
ATH (seasonal)


Maybe they could give ORD-HAM a try. Sooner or later it could get uncomfortable for UA on EWR-HAM with a good possibility of Eurowings or norwegian entering the HAM - NY market in the future.

Hamburg and Chicago are sister cities, there are pretty much passengers on that route with a lot of potential. One third of these passengers are flying for business reasons.


Norwegian is possible but Eurowings will probably never ever the market as its a subsidiary of LH. Remember UA and LH operate a joint venture across the Atlantic so highly unlikely they will want a wholly owned LCCs competing against their own mainline flights.
I know the voices in my head aren't real but sometimes their ideas are just awesome!!!
 
United1
Posts: 3906
Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2003 9:21 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Tue May 16, 2017 4:39 am

Pyrex wrote:
Will any of these new routes displace an international 757 that can be deployed elsewhere? I still don't understand why UA does not fly daily or at least 5 times a week EWR-OPO - it is the right size for the market and they could probably displace the 2x weekly TP A330 pretty easily, lots of Star Alliance elites in OPO that just hate having to connect through LIS most days of the week and have no loyalty to TP whatsoever. I imagine fares would probably be decent, too, with lots of business flyers and lots of connections through EWR to other points in the U.S.


UA has lots of slack in the 752 fleet...OPO is probably a bit too low yielding to make a flight work.
I know the voices in my head aren't real but sometimes their ideas are just awesome!!!
 
User avatar
DLHAM
Posts: 404
Joined: Sat Dec 31, 2016 1:10 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Tue May 16, 2017 4:42 am

United1 wrote:
DLHAM wrote:
globalcabotage wrote:
2019 will be the year ORD gets some love. T5 will have 9 new gates and there will be a UA/AA turf war for the prime 1pm to 6pm time. Given 2.5 flights times 9 gates opens up 22ish flights that will go fast (along with other airlines and more Pre-clearance that will add a few more flights).

ORD could get
ICN
LIS
MAN
MXP
OSL
TLV
ATH (seasonal)


Maybe they could give ORD-HAM a try. Sooner or later it could get uncomfortable for UA on EWR-HAM with a good possibility of Eurowings or norwegian entering the HAM - NY market in the future.

Hamburg and Chicago are sister cities, there are pretty much passengers on that route with a lot of potential. One third of these passengers are flying for business reasons.


Norwegian is possible but Eurowings will probably never ever the market as its a subsidiary of LH. Remember UA and LH operate a joint venture across the Atlantic so highly unlikely they will want a wholly owned LCCs competing against their own mainline flights.


Youre right, didnt think about that. I think MIA and LAX or SFO would be more likely for EW from HAM.
My Instagram Account: Instagram
 
User avatar
intotheair
Posts: 1822
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2014 12:49 pm

Re: United's future International Expansion

Tue May 16, 2017 6:02 am

United1 wrote:
DLHAM wrote:
globalcabotage wrote:
2019 will be the year ORD gets some love. T5 will have 9 new gates and there will be a UA/AA turf war for the prime 1pm to 6pm time. Given 2.5 flights times 9 gates opens up 22ish flights that will go fast (along with other airlines and more Pre-clearance that will add a few more flights).

ORD could get
ICN
LIS
MAN
MXP
OSL
TLV
ATH (seasonal)


Maybe they could give ORD-HAM a try. Sooner or later it could get uncomfortable for UA on EWR-HAM with a good possibility of Eurowings or norwegian entering the HAM - NY market in the future.

Hamburg and Chicago are sister cities, there are pretty much passengers on that route with a lot of potential. One third of these passengers are flying for business reasons.


Norwegian is possible but Eurowings will probably never ever the market as its a subsidiary of LH. Remember UA and LH operate a joint venture across the Atlantic so highly unlikely they will want a wholly owned LCCs competing against their own mainline flights.


But it's still not competition. EW is under the Lufthansa Group umbrella, and therefore, EW's TATL flights are covered under the A++ joint venture. United (and probably to some extent, Air Canada too) would/will get a cut of the revenue from any such flight on EW metal. I would imagine that, if a case for ORD-HAM were presented, the A++ airlines would run projections of what sort of impact that would cause on other flights. UA, AC, and LH Group are effectively a merged airline across the Atlantic.

With that said, I don't know if I see much of a case for those flights. I would guess EWR-HAM is already pretty well served, and most, if not all, of EW's longhaul network is coming out of CGN right now, nothing longhaul out of HAM yet. Maybe we'll see the return of ORD-DUS first, or perhaps ORD-CGN as an analogue.
300 319 320 321 332 333 345 346 380 717 733 734 735 73G 738 739 744 752 753 762 763 772 77W 788 789 CR2 CR7 CR9 CRK Q400 E175 DC10 MD82 MD90
AA AF AS AY AZ B6 BA BR DL F9 FI GA HA KF LH MI QX SK SN SQ UA US VY WN
 
fun2fly
Posts: 1533
Joined: Tue Dec 26, 2006 8:44 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Tue May 16, 2017 10:39 am

United1 wrote:
Pyrex wrote:
UA has lots of slack in the 752 fleet...OPO is probably a bit too low yielding to make a flight work.


TAP has this covered for the Star Alliance. I agree, it's a nice niche route, but so were many of the canceled 752 routes out of EWR. Not a lot of them stick and DL beat then CO to a few that work like NCE, AGP, etc.
 
User avatar
STT757
Posts: 13973
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2000 1:14 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Tue May 16, 2017 12:14 pm

TWA772LR wrote:
LAXdude1023 wrote:
AVENSAB727 wrote:
With UA getting their 787 10s next year, this could make room for more expansion, I can see the 787 10 on some international routes out of IAH, like IAH- South America/ AMS/NRT


I doubt it. Outside adding a couple of other routes like CLO and GYE, I dont know how much more capacity IAH-South America needs. In the long run, here is what were looking at in terms of IAH-South America effective end of October:

CCS: daily 737
BOG: 2x daily 737
UIO: daily 737
LIM: daily 767
SCL: daily 767
EZE: daily 777
GRU: daily 763
GIG: daily 763

Would love to see CLO and GYE come back, but I doubt were going to get much more capacity than that.

Seasonal Cartagena? Some 757s being repositioned to South America(especially BOG with the AV deal)?

BTW, I never thought I'd see IAH-GIG become a 763.


I think Cartagena, Cali, Medellin make sense from EWR. All were previously flown from by AV from EWR with 757s. I think the 73G would be perfect for CLO and MDE from EWR, with the A320 or 738 for CTG.
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
LAXdude1023
Posts: 5954
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:16 pm

Re: United's future International Expansion

Tue May 16, 2017 1:28 pm

STT757 wrote:
TWA772LR wrote:
LAXdude1023 wrote:

I doubt it. Outside adding a couple of other routes like CLO and GYE, I dont know how much more capacity IAH-South America needs. In the long run, here is what were looking at in terms of IAH-South America effective end of October:

CCS: daily 737
BOG: 2x daily 737
UIO: daily 737
LIM: daily 767
SCL: daily 767
EZE: daily 777
GRU: daily 763
GIG: daily 763

Would love to see CLO and GYE come back, but I doubt were going to get much more capacity than that.

Seasonal Cartagena? Some 757s being repositioned to South America(especially BOG with the AV deal)?

BTW, I never thought I'd see IAH-GIG become a 763.


I think Cartagena, Cali, Medellin make sense from EWR. All were previously flown from by AV from EWR with 757s. I think the 73G would be perfect for CLO and MDE from EWR, with the A320 or 738 for CTG.


Given that IAH is the chosen Latin America hub, you'd probably see them there first.
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD BRING BACK THE PAYWALL!!!!
 
User avatar
STT757
Posts: 13973
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2000 1:14 am

Re: United's future International Expansion

Tue May 16, 2017 1:29 pm

LAXdude1023 wrote:
STT757 wrote:
TWA772LR wrote:
Seasonal Cartagena? Some 757s being repositioned to South America(especially BOG with the AV deal)?

BTW, I never thought I'd see IAH-GIG become a 763.


I think Cartagena, Cali, Medellin make sense from EWR. All were previously flown from by AV from EWR with 757s. I think the 73G would be perfect for CLO and MDE from EWR, with the A320 or 738 for CTG.


Given that IAH is the chosen Latin America hub, you'd probably see them there first.


True, but the Colombian population of New Jersey is more than double that of Texas.
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
LAXdude1023
Posts: 5954
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:16 pm

Re: United's future International Expansion

Tue May 16, 2017 2:38 pm

STT757 wrote:
LAXdude1023 wrote:
STT757 wrote:

I think Cartagena, Cali, Medellin make sense from EWR. All were previously flown from by AV from EWR with 757s. I think the 73G would be perfect for CLO and MDE from EWR, with the A320 or 738 for CTG.


Given that IAH is the chosen Latin America hub, you'd probably see them there first.


True, but the Colombian population of New Jersey is more than double that of Texas.


It doesn't matter. NJ is also home to more Brazilians, Ecuadorans, Argentinans, and Peruvians. Yet, where does UA put its capacity? It's Houston.
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD BRING BACK THE PAYWALL!!!!

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos