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Cointrin330
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AA RDU 777/DL 763 LHR and CDG OPS

Wed Jun 07, 2017 12:59 am

Today I flew out of RDU to NYC and watched both the Delta 767-300ER land from CDG and the American 777-200ER from LHR arrive. For the AA 777, it seemed as though the reverse thrust or braking mechanisms were applied very hard because the plane came to a very quick stop after what seemed like a very high deceleration on arrival, and then it taxied to its usual gate. Similarly, the Delta 767 featured the same type of arrival.

RDU can handle most major wide bodies, so was curious if this is normal, or is there something about the runway that requires wide bodies to brake hard on arrival?
 
rajincajun01
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Re: AA RDU 777/DL 763 LHR and CDG OPS

Wed Jun 07, 2017 1:50 am

Runway 5L/23R is 10000 ft. More than enough for these birds. That being said, the runway is nearing the end of its life (3-5 years remaining.

747s regularly use this runway during the holiday season for freighters. The AN225 has used this runway before as well.
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atcsundevil
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Re: AA RDU 777/DL 763 LHR and CDG OPS

Wed Jun 07, 2017 2:08 am

They probably just wanted to avoid overshooting the most convenient turn off to the terminal for a shorter taxi. Sometimes missing the best turn offs means a lengthier taxi time. Pilots want to go home just as badly as the passengers. Conversely, they'll sometimes use minimal braking to ride out the length of a runway to put themselves closer to the terminal at higher speed. It's all dependent on the location of their gate relative to the runway, because pilots are almost always considering that when weather conditions are good. I'm not speaking about KRDU specifically, but it could be a possible explanation.
 
Dominion301
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Re: AA RDU 777/DL 763 LHR and CDG OPS

Wed Jun 07, 2017 2:19 am

atcsundevil wrote:
They probably just wanted to avoid overshooting the most convenient turn off to the terminal for a shorter taxi. Sometimes missing the best turn offs means a lengthier taxi time. Pilots want to go home just as badly as the passengers. Conversely, they'll sometimes use minimal braking to ride out the length of a runway to put themselves closer to the terminal at higher speed. It's all dependent on the location of their gate relative to the runway, because pilots are almost always considering that when weather conditions are good. I'm not speaking about KRDU specifically, but it could be a possible explanation.


It can also depend upon how much traffic is behind you and what ATC would like you to do.
 
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jetpixx
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Re: AA RDU 777/DL 763 LHR and CDG OPS

Wed Jun 07, 2017 2:48 am

I was coaching baseball in Rolesville tonight - and saw the DL 763 climbing out east on the way to CDG and told my six-year-old third baseman to look up, and asked if he knew where France is...because that's where they are going - lol. True story.
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Cebo29
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Re: AA RDU 777/DL 763 LHR and CDG OPS

Wed Jun 07, 2017 5:06 am

AA RDU-LHR UPGRADED TO 772 FROM 763
DAL RDU-CDG UPGRADED TO 763 FROM 75W
VERY NICE FOR RDU
MORE UPGRADES COMING
 
RDUDDJI
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Re: AA RDU 777/DL 763 LHR and CDG OPS

Wed Jun 07, 2017 12:13 pm

rajincajun01 wrote:
Runway 5L/23R is 10000 ft. More than enough for these birds. That being said, the runway is nearing the end of its life (3-5 years remaining.

747s regularly use this runway during the holiday season for freighters. The AN225 has used this runway before as well.


5L/23R has been under maintenance for a few months. However, I think they try to have it open everyday for the LHR CDG arrivals/departures. Not sure where the OP saw them land, but it's possible it was on 5R/23L which is 7500ft.
Sometimes we don't realize the good times when we're in them
 
AWACSooner
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Re: AA RDU 777/DL 763 LHR and CDG OPS

Wed Jun 07, 2017 12:39 pm

[quote="Cebo29"][/quote]
I see you finally got that all-caps upgrade to your keyboard as well...congrats.
 
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jfklganyc
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Re: AA RDU 777/DL 763 LHR and CDG OPS

Wed Jun 07, 2017 1:23 pm

ATC is never a factor in these decisions unless you're prioritizing people pleasing over aviating.

Unless assigned a LAHSO, the whole runway is yours for as long as you need it.

ATC may ask you to hustle off or try to make an intersection, but it is not a restriction, and if you are a good pilot, you will not pull any extreme measures to get this done. If an aircraft is on short final behind you and they go around, that is an ATC issue...not a pilot issue.

Granted, pilots try to help out ATC vacating a runway when reasonable...but it is low on the landing priority list.

In this case, the pilots have crossed he pond, they are tired and they want off the runway to the gate as quickly as possible. This may lead to a jamming on the brakes and a quick turn off.

This also falls into the same category as above.

Most of the time you are saving a minute of two. That's what throwing passengers into the seat backs in front of them on a 10000 ft runway gets you.

There are some airports like LGA where rolling through a the runway intersection lengthens your taxi substantially. But in RDU this situation does not exist.
 
rajincajun01
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Re: AA RDU 777/DL 763 LHR and CDG OPS

Wed Jun 07, 2017 2:04 pm

RDUDDJI wrote:
rajincajun01 wrote:
Runway 5L/23R is 10000 ft. More than enough for these birds. That being said, the runway is nearing the end of its life (3-5 years remaining.

747s regularly use this runway during the holiday season for freighters. The AN225 has used this runway before as well.


5L/23R has been under maintenance for a few months. However, I think they try to have it open everyday for the LHR CDG arrivals/departures. Not sure where the OP saw them land, but it's possible it was on 5R/23L which is 7500ft.


AA173 would have had to been fairly light to land on 5R. It is extremely rare to happen (once a year at most rare). The RDUAA ops team almost always finds a way to open 5L/23R for these flights.

Construction on a new, longer 5L/23R is supposed to begin soon just west of the current one. The current runway will be converted to a taxiway, allowing westerly expansion of T2.
A319 A320 A321 A330 B1900 B717 B727 B737 B757 B767 B777 B787 C172 C402 CR2 CR7 CRJ9 DH8 E120 ERJ135 ERJ145 E170/175/190 L1011 MD80 MD90 SF340
 
JetBlueCLT
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Re: AA RDU 777/DL 763 LHR and CDG OPS

Wed Jun 07, 2017 5:02 pm

Cebo29 wrote:
AA RDU-LHR UPGRADED TO 772 FROM 763
DAL RDU-CDG UPGRADED TO 763 FROM 75W
VERY NICE FOR RDU
MORE UPGRADES COMING


Still won't match big brother.... CLT ;)
Pittsburgh Penguins, Steelers, Pirates and Charlotte Hornets Fan
 
BoeingGuy
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Re: AA RDU 777/DL 763 LHR and CDG OPS

Wed Jun 07, 2017 5:08 pm

AWACSooner wrote:
Cebo29 wrote:

I see you finally got that all-caps upgrade to your keyboard as well...congrats.


And telling us something is is already stated in the subject of the thread.
 
BoeingGuy
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Re: AA RDU 777/DL 763 LHR and CDG OPS

Wed Jun 07, 2017 5:10 pm

rajincajun01 wrote:
RDUDDJI wrote:
rajincajun01 wrote:
Runway 5L/23R is 10000 ft. More than enough for these birds. That being said, the runway is nearing the end of its life (3-5 years remaining.

747s regularly use this runway during the holiday season for freighters. The AN225 has used this runway before as well.


5L/23R has been under maintenance for a few months. However, I think they try to have it open everyday for the LHR CDG arrivals/departures. Not sure where the OP saw them land, but it's possible it was on 5R/23L which is 7500ft.


AA173 would have had to been fairly light to land on 5R. It is extremely rare to happen (once a year at most rare). The RDUAA ops team almost always finds a way to open 5L/23R for these flights.

Construction on a new, longer 5L/23R is supposed to begin soon just west of the current one. The current runway will be converted to a taxiway, allowing westerly expansion of T2.


A 777 can easily land on a 7500 foot runway. Doesn't have to be fairly light.
 
rajincajun01
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Re: AA RDU 777/DL 763 LHR and CDG OPS

Wed Jun 07, 2017 6:31 pm

BoeingGuy wrote:
rajincajun01 wrote:
RDUDDJI wrote:

5L/23R has been under maintenance for a few months. However, I think they try to have it open everyday for the LHR CDG arrivals/departures. Not sure where the OP saw them land, but it's possible it was on 5R/23L which is 7500ft.


AA173 would have had to been fairly light to land on 5R. It is extremely rare to happen (once a year at most rare). The RDUAA ops team almost always finds a way to open 5L/23R for these flights.

Construction on a new, longer 5L/23R is supposed to begin soon just west of the current one. The current runway will be converted to a taxiway, allowing westerly expansion of T2.


A 777 can easily land on a 7500 foot runway. Doesn't have to be fairly light.


I wasn't clear. It can easily do it (minimum is around 5400 ft). Talking to an AA 772 captain, they prefer not using that runway unless thy are light and no other option is available.
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77H
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Re: AA RDU 777/DL 763 LHR and CDG OPS

Wed Jun 07, 2017 10:25 pm

BoeingGuy wrote:
rajincajun01 wrote:
RDUDDJI wrote:

5L/23R has been under maintenance for a few months. However, I think they try to have it open everyday for the LHR CDG arrivals/departures. Not sure where the OP saw them land, but it's possible it was on 5R/23L which is 7500ft.


AA173 would have had to been fairly light to land on 5R. It is extremely rare to happen (once a year at most rare). The RDUAA ops team almost always finds a way to open 5L/23R for these flights.

Construction on a new, longer 5L/23R is supposed to begin soon just west of the current one. The current runway will be converted to a taxiway, allowing westerly expansion of T2.


A 777 can easily land on a 7500 foot runway. Doesn't have to be fairly light.


Every Saturday, UA flies ORD-OGG-ORD with a 772, which is 271 NM longer than RDU-LHR. OGG's runway is 6995 ft. UA also uses the high density, 772/A (non-ER) on the route which has a lower thrust engines and a lower MTOW. The more powerful 77E that AA uses on RDU-LHR would have no problems with RDUs 7500 ft runway much less the 10000 ft runway.

77H
 
Cointrin330
Topic Author
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Re: AA RDU 777/DL 763 LHR and CDG OPS

Thu Jun 08, 2017 12:58 am

Didn't AA fly many different wide bodies into RDU in the early 1990's hub era? I recall 762ER's operating LGW/ORY and DC10's thrown in on some domestic runs as well. RDU had no problem handling those then, either, right?
 
Cebo29
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Re: AA RDU 777/DL 763 LHR and CDG OPS

Fri Jun 09, 2017 1:38 am

No problems for these aircraft types in RDU. It will get better with the runway/terminal expansion on it's 2040 plan. That's why more aircraft upgrades coming.
 
Cebo29
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Re: AA RDU 777/DL 763 LHR and CDG OPS

Fri Jun 09, 2017 1:54 am

AWACSooner wrote:
Cebo29 wrote:

I see you finally got that all-caps upgrade to your keyboard as well...congrats.


Indeed...works wonders when you don't have glasses..let it sink in
 
packcheer
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Re: AA RDU 777/DL 763 LHR and CDG OPS

Fri Jun 09, 2017 3:37 am

Given the location of Terminal 2, I bet the heaviest braking was to get turned off 5L / 23R and into the gate. The Terminal is pretty much at the approach end of 5L , so landing on 5L would give the crew incentives to brake and get turned around to head to the terminal.

Also, what would the speed difference be for a 767 / 777 when exiting the runway at a "high speed" exit vs, normal perpendicular exits? This runway is only traditional perpendicular exits.
Things that fly, Girls and Planes...
 
Cebo29
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Re: AA RDU 777/DL 763 LHR and CDG OPS

Fri Jun 09, 2017 9:18 am

BoeingGuy wrote:
AWACSooner wrote:
Cebo29 wrote:

I see you finally got that all-caps upgrade to your keyboard as well...congrats.


And telling us something is is already stated in the subject of the thread.


Still revelant to the thread...no need to read it if you don't want to.
 
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TheLion
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Re: AA RDU 777/DL 763 LHR and CDG OPS

Sat Jun 10, 2017 10:28 am

Cebo29 wrote:
BoeingGuy wrote:
AWACSooner wrote:
I see you finally got that all-caps upgrade to your keyboard as well...congrats.


And telling us something is is already stated in the subject of the thread.


Still revelant to the thread...no need to read it if you don't want to.


All the lols at this silly banter :D
 
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ERJ170
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Re: AA RDU 777/DL 763 LHR and CDG OPS

Sat Jun 10, 2017 10:48 am

I just wanna hear what upgrades are coming!?!?!?!?!!!!
Aiming High and going far..
 
RDUDDJI
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Re: AA RDU 777/DL 763 LHR and CDG OPS

Sat Jun 10, 2017 2:04 pm

JetBlueCLT wrote:

Still won't match big brother.... CLT ;)


Don't hate, it's unbecoming.
Sometimes we don't realize the good times when we're in them
 
Indy
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Re: AA RDU 777/DL 763 LHR and CDG OPS

Sat Jun 10, 2017 5:24 pm

RDUDDJI wrote:
JetBlueCLT wrote:

Still won't match big brother.... CLT ;)


Don't hate, it's unbecoming.


I love RDU. I think it is a gorgeous and welcoming airport. Can't wait to go there again some day. Still hope to call the area home. Would be nice to have access to the European nonstop flights.
IND to RDU to OKC in 18 months. This is what my life has become.

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