bw50505
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Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Wed Jun 07, 2017 2:48 pm

Edelweiss Air will begin flights from Zurich (Kloten) to San Diego on Friday, 9 June. They will be operated by the A340-300 on Monday and Friday, and end in late October/early November.

EDW18 from ZRH is scheduled to make its first landing at SAN on 9 June at 1730L.
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/EDW1 ... /LSZH/KSAN

The return flight to ZRH, EDW19, is scheduled to depart SAN at 1920L.
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/EDW19 (I can't get a permalink to this flight yet)


List of SAN international long haul flights as of 9 June:

BAW to LHR - B77W daily
CFG to FRA - B763 2x weekly Mon, Thr (3rd weekly added 24 June on Saturday)
EDW to ZRH - A343 2x weekly Mon, Fri
JAL to NRT - B788 daily

(Domestic widebodies to SAN include HAL to HNL - A332 daily and DAL B763 (A and ER models) on various routes)
Last edited by bw50505 on Wed Jun 07, 2017 3:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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jnev3289
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Wed Jun 07, 2017 3:04 pm

Does Edelweiss make money? Seems like a strange airline. Any outfit trotting out A340s anywhere is a red flag to me
 
bw50505
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Wed Jun 07, 2017 3:13 pm

jnev3289 wrote:
Does Edelweiss make money? Seems like a strange airline. Any outfit trotting out A340s anywhere is a red flag to me


They get their A340s second-hand from Swiss International Airlines. I don't know if they are profitable but, being part of the LH Group, I bet they would've been canned by now if they weren't.
 
DALCE
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Wed Jun 07, 2017 3:24 pm

Edelweiss is very careful with picking new destinations. Often you see them increasing frequency after a couple of seasons. FE. ZRH-CPT has been twice weekly for some years, but will be increased to 3x weekly next winter. TPA, same story as they started 2x wk and now they fly 3x wk.
A large part of their seats are being sold via travelpartners like Kuoni etc. So a relative low number of seats is sold separately.
I bet they are more profitable than OS, SN & LH per Y-class seat..... ;)
flown: F50,F70,CR1,CR2,CR9,CS3,E75,E90,143,AR8,AR1,733,735,736,73G,738,
753,763,744,77W,788,319,320,321,333,AB6.
 
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jnev3289
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Wed Jun 07, 2017 3:30 pm

Interesting it shows up on Kayak as a SWISS flight, operated by Edelweiss. Airlines within airlines are very confusing to me
 
DALCE
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Wed Jun 07, 2017 3:31 pm

Edelweiss is fully owned by Swiss, who in their turn belong to the Deutsche Lufthansa AG, which is the mothership of LH,OS,SN, 4U, EW etc.
It's soooooo simple......;) ;)

More seriously, basically Swiss is codesharing on the Edelweiss flights, nothing more nothing less. Happens all the time
flown: F50,F70,CR1,CR2,CR9,CS3,E75,E90,143,AR8,AR1,733,735,736,73G,738,
753,763,744,77W,788,319,320,321,333,AB6.
 
axiom
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Wed Jun 07, 2017 4:05 pm

Should also add that Edelweiss has the same lie flat business seat at Swiss, IIRC -- so the product is very decent.

Congrats to SAN. I know WK's success at TPA was a big factor in luring LH, and now the group flies 8x weekly to TPA. Hopefully this portends more good things for SAN!

Now we just need that SAN-TPA nonstop.
 
rbrunner
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Wed Jun 07, 2017 4:24 pm

DALCE wrote:
Edelweiss is fully owned by Swiss, who in their turn belong to the Deutsche Lufthansa AG, which is the mothership of LH,OS,SN, 4U, EW etc.
It's soooooo simple......;) ;)

More seriously, basically Swiss is codesharing on the Edelweiss flights, nothing more nothing less. Happens all the time


Sorry, not exactly. Both Swiss and Edelweiss are owned by Air Trust, a LH company in Switzerland. They are actually sister companies.
Watch this video from about 2:28.

https://youtu.be/7TmfYIhXhZo
 
BENAir01
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Wed Jun 07, 2017 4:38 pm

Congrats to all parties involved! Also, Monday will now have 4 wife bodies at SAN, pretty crazy!
Why is flying so expensive? And why is flying well so much more?
 
BENAir01
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Wed Jun 07, 2017 4:39 pm

Congrats to all parties involved! Also, Monday will now have 4 wide bodies at SAN, pretty crazy!
Why is flying so expensive? And why is flying well so much more?
 
DALCE
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:41 am

rbrunner wrote:
DALCE wrote:
Edelweiss is fully owned by Swiss, who in their turn belong to the Deutsche Lufthansa AG, which is the mothership of LH,OS,SN, 4U, EW etc.
It's soooooo simple......;) ;)

More seriously, basically Swiss is codesharing on the Edelweiss flights, nothing more nothing less. Happens all the time


Sorry, not exactly. Both Swiss and Edelweiss are owned by Air Trust, a LH company in Switzerland. They are actually sister companies.
Watch this video from about 2:28.

https://youtu.be/7TmfYIhXhZo



I stand corrected....it's even more simple ;)
Thanks for correcting me, one can learn everyday
flown: F50,F70,CR1,CR2,CR9,CS3,E75,E90,143,AR8,AR1,733,735,736,73G,738,
753,763,744,77W,788,319,320,321,333,AB6.
 
bw50505
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Fri Jun 09, 2017 1:24 pm

EDW18 appears to be en route but not visible on Flightaware. However, FR24 shows an on time departure from ZRH of EDW18P, operated by HB-JMF.
 
dfwjim1
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Fri Jun 09, 2017 5:48 pm

bw50505 wrote:
Edelweiss Air will begin flights from Zurich (Kloten) to San Diego on Friday, 9 June. They will be operated by the A340-300 on Monday and Friday, and end in late October/early November.

EDW18 from ZRH is scheduled to make its first landing at SAN on 9 June at 1730L.
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/EDW1 ... /LSZH/KSAN

The return flight to ZRH, EDW19, is scheduled to depart SAN at 1920L.
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/EDW19 (I can't get a permalink to this flight yet)


List of SAN international long haul flights as of 9 June:

BAW to LHR - B77W daily
CFG to FRA - B763 2x weekly Mon, Thr (3rd weekly added 24 June on Saturday)
EDW to ZRH - A343 2x weekly Mon, Fri
JAL to NRT - B788 daily

(Domestic widebodies to SAN include HAL to HNL - A332 daily and DAL B763 (A and ER models) on various routes)


I am curious as to why Edelweiss is running flights from June through late October and not continuing through the winter months? It seems like San Diego would be a popular destination for Europeans who want to get out of the cold and enjoy some time in Southern California where the winter weather is fairly moderate.
 
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VCEflyboy
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Fri Jun 09, 2017 6:29 pm

How many a343 services does the USA see beside this one? South African? Any other?
 
910A
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Fri Jun 09, 2017 6:37 pm

Right off the top of my head..LH to SJC/TPA/DTW/ATL/PHL TN to PPT/CDG, AF to MSP/DTW
 
PhilInBRN
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Fri Jun 09, 2017 6:52 pm

dfwjim1 wrote:
I am curious as to why Edelweiss is running flights from June through late October and not continuing through the winter months? It seems like San Diego would be a popular destination for Europeans who want to get out of the cold and enjoy some time in Southern California where the winter weather is fairly moderate.


Most likely, the LH Group is of the opinion that during the winter months all of their flights to LAX provide sufficient capacity to SoCal. Furthermore, Swiss people tend to vacation between June and October. The demand for winter vacations has increased in recent years. However, a look at WK's destination map for W17/18 shows that their winter destinations are all regions where one can swim during the winter months (CPT, MRU, CUN, HAV, TPA, GIG, PUJ, MLE, HKT, SJO).
That being said, if the flights to SAN turn out to be successful I could see the season being extended to something like April to November.
 
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LAX772LR
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Fri Jun 09, 2017 8:29 pm

jnev3289 wrote:
Any outfit trotting out A340s anywhere is a red flag to me

Though, not for any real substantive reason.

Of all the A340s, the A343 was the one who held its own against the equivalent 777 variant most effectively. It's far more efficient (and performance-capable) than people here give it credit for, and its primary weakness was the in-home competition from the ever-increasingly capable A333.

And on top of all that, they're PAID! Flying a fully amortized A340 against an XXX that you're paying $1million+ per month for, is still a competitive proposition.


VCEflyboy wrote:
How many a343 services does the USA see beside this one? South African? Any other?

Lufthansa, Air France, Air Tahiti Nui, Iberia, and Philippines all still fly A343s to the USA. Probably a few others that I'm missing as well.
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
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jnev3289
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Fri Jun 09, 2017 8:36 pm

LAX772LR wrote:
VCEflyboy wrote:
How many a343 services does the USA see beside this one? South African? Any other?

Lufthansa, Air France, Air Tahiti Nui, Iberia, and Philippines all still fly A343s to the USA. Probably a few others that I'm missing as well.

Hmmmm... Notice anything about those carriers? Outside of LH, they're all pretty atrocious product-wise and probably financially. Thats not even including the worst of them all, SAA (and even LH is far from stellar)
 
SonomaFlyer
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Fri Jun 09, 2017 8:59 pm

jnev3289 wrote:
LAX772LR wrote:
VCEflyboy wrote:
How many a343 services does the USA see beside this one? South African? Any other?

Lufthansa, Air France, Air Tahiti Nui, Iberia, and Philippines all still fly A343s to the USA. Probably a few others that I'm missing as well.

Hmmmm... Notice anything about those carriers? Outside of LH, they're all pretty atrocious product-wise and probably financially. Thats not even including the worst of them all, SAA (and even LH is far from stellar)



I don't think the 343 has anything to do with whether an airline has an "atrocious" product. As was mentioned, these a/c which are owned by the LH group are paid off and well maintained. Saving a $1M/month on lease or finance costs does a lot to make up for fuel efficiency differences. You also have to account for the fact that given the mission to ZRH from SAN, there are only so many a/c that can perform this mission without leaving a bunch of people and/or cargo behind. The 343 is one of those aircraft.
 
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jnev3289
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Fri Jun 09, 2017 9:01 pm

Well there isn't an airline in the world who is going to spend a dime upgrading the cabin of an A340, so there is somewhat of a relation between A/C and product in this case.

Side Note: I absolutely LOVE the A340 from a looks standpoint, it's really unfortunate the economics of it are nearly the worst around.
 
mandargb
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Fri Jun 09, 2017 9:04 pm

It will be interesting to see the slow climber out of SAN -:)
9/27 is 9400ft.
It will be interesting for spotters to spot the 340 from Parking Garage on south side when 27 is being used for take off.
Would love to see 343 to SAN.
 
SonomaFlyer
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Fri Jun 09, 2017 9:35 pm

jnev3289 wrote:
Well there isn't an airline in the world who is going to spend a dime upgrading the cabin of an A340, so there is somewhat of a relation between A/C and product in this case.

Side Note: I absolutely LOVE the A340 from a looks standpoint, it's really unfortunate the economics of it are nearly the worst around.


For an airline like PR, I'd agree. I don't think the same is the case for airlines in the LH group.
 
dfwjim1
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Fri Jun 09, 2017 9:40 pm

LAX772LR wrote:
jnev3289 wrote:
Any outfit trotting out A340s anywhere is a red flag to me

Though, not for any real substantive reason.

Of all the A340s, the A343 was the one who held its own against the equivalent 777 variant most effectively. It's far more efficient (and performance-capable) than people here give it credit for, and its primary weakness was the in-home competition from the ever-increasingly capable A333.

And on top of all that, they're PAID! Flying a fully amortized A340 against an XXX that you're paying $1million+ per month for, is still a competitive proposition.


VCEflyboy wrote:
How many a343 services does the USA see beside this one? South African? Any other?

Lufthansa, Air France, Air Tahiti Nui, Iberia, and Philippines all still fly A343s to the USA. Probably a few others that I'm missing as well.


Of course probably 90% of the flying public could really care less about the type of plane that they are on as long as it is neat and clean inside and gets them to their destination safely.
 
asuflyer
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Fri Jun 09, 2017 10:42 pm

jnev3289 wrote:
Well there isn't an airline in the world who is going to spend a dime upgrading the cabin of an A340, so there is somewhat of a relation between A/C and product in this case.



Edelweiss just received their first A340's last year from Swiss and they completed refurbished the economy interiors and IFE.
 
axiom
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Fri Jun 09, 2017 10:56 pm

asuflyer wrote:
jnev3289 wrote:
Well there isn't an airline in the world who is going to spend a dime upgrading the cabin of an A340, so there is somewhat of a relation between A/C and product in this case.



Edelweiss just received their first A340's last year from Swiss and they completed refurbished the economy interiors and IFE.


Indeed, and the WK business class product is almost certainly the best in class against other leisure carriers. Same seat at Swiss if I recall, just a reduced count.

LH also recently invested in a full seat refit for their low-J A343s that run to PHL/YUL/TPA/SJC.
 
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ro1960
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Fri Jun 09, 2017 11:38 pm

BENAir01 wrote:
Congrats to all parties involved! Also, Monday will now have 4 wife bodies at SAN, pretty crazy!


I personally prefer the husband bodies ;)
You may like my airport photos:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/aeroports
 
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LAX772LR
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Sat Jun 10, 2017 12:57 am

jnev3289 wrote:
LAX772LR wrote:
VCEflyboy wrote:
How many a343 services does the USA see beside this one? South African? Any other?

Lufthansa, Air France, Air Tahiti Nui, Iberia, and Philippines all still fly A343s to the USA. Probably a few others that I'm missing as well.

Hmmmm... Notice anything about those carriers? Outside of LH, they're all pretty atrocious product-wise and probably financially. Thats not even including the worst of them all, SAA (and even LH is far from stellar)

I'm trying to find relevance between that statement and the fact that these airlines fly A343s.... but coming up short. Help me out here.
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
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jnev3289
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Sat Jun 10, 2017 1:00 am

LAX772LR wrote:
jnev3289 wrote:
LAX772LR wrote:

Lufthansa, Air France, Air Tahiti Nui, Iberia, and Philippines all still fly A343s to the USA. Probably a few others that I'm missing as well.

Hmmmm... Notice anything about those carriers? Outside of LH, they're all pretty atrocious product-wise and probably financially. Thats not even including the worst of them all, SAA (and even LH is far from stellar)

I'm trying to find relevance between that statement and the fact that these airlines fly A343s.... but coming up short. Help me out here.

Oh, I did that already in the post you quoted, immediately following the statement... Did you not read it? They aren't very well run airlines outside of LH
 
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LAX772LR
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Sat Jun 10, 2017 1:11 am

jnev3289 wrote:
LAX772LR wrote:
jnev3289 wrote:
Hmmmm... Notice anything about those carriers? Outside of LH, they're all pretty atrocious product-wise and probably financially. Thats not even including the worst of them all, SAA (and even LH is far from stellar)

I'm trying to find relevance between that statement and the fact that these airlines fly A343s.... but coming up short. Help me out here.

Oh, I did that already in the post you quoted, immediately following the statement... Did you not read it? They aren't very well run airlines outside of LH

Oh, I read it... but I was seeking an actually substantive/corroborative source, not just one person's biased opinion.
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
dcajet
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Sat Jun 10, 2017 2:12 am

VCEflyboy wrote:
How many a343 services does the USA see beside this one? South African? Any other?


AR to MIA, only on 2 weekly flights out of 16x w.
"Unattended children will be given espresso and a free kitten"
 
FriscoHeavy
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Sat Jun 10, 2017 2:13 am

I'd love for some people to get some video of some take offs from SAN.

C'mon SAN spotters
Whatever
 
bw50505
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Sat Jun 10, 2017 2:46 am

FriscoHeavy wrote:
I'd love for some people to get some video of some take offs from SAN.

C'mon SAN spotters


At this rate it will be a night video, it has yet to pushback from the gate at sunset.
 
sdbravo
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Sat Jun 10, 2017 4:38 am

A couple pics of the first Edelweiss landing in SAN...

https://flic.kr/p/VrzgwT
https://flic.kr/p/V3UoDh

Took off around 8. I didn't catch the exact time, but I was in Liberty Station and it was pretty spectacular watching it climb.
 
jetwet1
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Sat Jun 10, 2017 5:41 am

jnev3289 wrote:
Well there isn't an airline in the world who is going to spend a dime upgrading the cabin of an A340, so there is somewhat of a relation between A/C and product in this case.

Side Note: I absolutely LOVE the A340 from a looks standpoint, it's really unfortunate the economics of it are nearly the worst around.


Not even close to being nearly the worst around, the economics of a 343 is within a hair of a 772, except no monthly payment.
 
QueenoftheSkies
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Sat Jun 10, 2017 5:48 am

sdbravo wrote:
A couple pics of the first Edelweiss landing in SAN...

https://flic.kr/p/VrzgwT
https://flic.kr/p/V3UoDh

Took off around 8. I didn't catch the exact time, but I was in Liberty Station and it was pretty spectacular watching it climb.


Thank you for that! Their livery is so odd yet appealing to me, figures!
 
TYCOON
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Sat Jun 10, 2017 6:54 am

jnev3289 wrote:
LAX772LR wrote:
VCEflyboy wrote:
How many a343 services does the USA see beside this one? South African? Any other?

Lufthansa, Air France, Air Tahiti Nui, Iberia, and Philippines all still fly A343s to the USA. Probably a few others that I'm missing as well.

Hmmmm... Notice anything about those carriers? Outside of LH, they're all pretty atrocious product-wise and probably financially. Thats not even including the worst of them all, SAA (and even LH is far from stellar)


jnev3289, have you ever flown all of these airlines who you claim have atrocious products? I have flown three of them regularly in front and in back (IB, AF and LH) and I'd say they all have very decent products compared to US carriers and even carriers from other parts of the world. Of the three, AF's product blows the other two out of the water. Best inflight service in my view... so far from being an atrocious product. I do however prefer the new AF business class which is not available on the A340s.
 
MartijnNL
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Sat Jun 10, 2017 7:05 am

VCEflyboy wrote:
How many a343 services does the USA see beside this one? South African? Any other?

SAS (SK) operates the A340-300 from Copenhagen to Chicago O'Hare, Newark and San Francisco.
 
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ro1960
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Sat Jun 10, 2017 7:37 am

If you have a FB account you can see shots of the first arrival:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1762358107423810/permalink/1847396595586627/
You may like my airport photos:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/aeroports
 
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LAX772LR
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Sat Jun 10, 2017 8:05 am

Beautiful.

Image
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
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ro1960
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Tue Jun 13, 2017 5:22 pm

You may like my airport photos:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/aeroports
 
910A
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Tue Jun 13, 2017 5:41 pm

So what's going to happen to this route, when LH takes it over next year?
 
910A
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Tue Jun 13, 2017 5:43 pm

 
bw50505
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:11 pm

910A wrote:
So what's going to happen to this route, when LH takes it over next year?


LH is going to fly FRA-SAN, not ZRH-SAN like EDW. LH is not "taking over" this route from Condor; Condor is part of the Thomas Cook Group and not LH (although each of those entities are former LH Group subsidiaries).
 
SonomaFlyer
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Tue Jun 13, 2017 8:19 pm

Word is spreading of SAN being a great destination for European travelers. I'm happy to hear LH adding service to FRA. Will this be service on a 359 or different a/c?
 
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SANFan
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Thu Jun 15, 2017 3:20 pm

I've seen a few posts expecting that Cityline will op the new LH SAN-service, with the A343. The route will apparently be open for sale in July so we will learn more specifics at that point.

Nothing official yet but it seems to me that the announcements that I've seen all talk about "Lufthansa" starting service at SAN, not Jump, Cityline, etc. If I remember correctly, when SJC-FRA and TPA-FRA were initially announced (last year?), it was clear that it was Jump that would be op'ing the flights, was it not?...

Also, from things that were said at some of the SDCRAA board meetings earlier this year, I wouldn't be real surprised if yet another Euro carrier announces service here to start next summer. When some of the buzz about LH starts to wear off, just stay tuned folks! (And don't forget that 2 more FIS-capable gates will be added by summer of 2019, for a total of 6!)

bb
 
axiom
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Re: Edelweiss Air inaugural ZRH-SAN on Friday 9 June

Thu Jun 15, 2017 3:31 pm

TPA was announced in the general media as Lufthansa. Only the av blogs dwelled on the CL aspect, because it was the first route to be launched with that configuration .There is nothing external facing about the "jump" aspect from a marketing perspectlittle experience -- it's sold as the Lufthansa experience, and sans titles on the outside the plane, it is.

ANet rumor has it the Jump experiment is ending, with the CL birds returning to mainline. I've also heard that TPA is going mainline next year, which might free up a CL bird if the first rumor isn't true. To be seen.

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