dtw2hyd wrote:

If you take money to provide a specific service there is a contract. In this case, money is for specific seat assignment.

CoC has no legal standing, it is just a dynamic/living feel good self-serving prophecy. Even SCOTUS cannot rule if corporate attorneys are updating CoC every Monday.

I beg to differ - the US DOT states:

It is important to understand that each individual airline (also referred to as carrier) has its own contract of carriage, which is the legally binding contract between the carrier and its passengers.

https://www.transportation.gov/sites/do ... Travel.pdf

What a miserable excuse for a human being.
A prime example of so many things that are so wrong with ociety in general and some segments of the traveling public in particular.
I, for one, hope she never sets foot on Delta again

This is a nothing burger compared to "United Nearly Killed My Infant Son", etc, etc,etc......

People who live in glass houses.....

TheFlyingDisk wrote:

dtw2hyd wrote:

If you take money to provide a specific service there is a contract. In this case, money is for specific seat assignment.

CoC has no legal standing, it is just a dynamic/living feel good self-serving prophecy. Even SCOTUS cannot rule if corporate attorneys are updating CoC every Monday.

I beg to differ - the US DOT states:

It is important to understand that each individual airline (also referred to as carrier) has its own contract of carriage, which is the legally binding contract between the carrier and its passengers.

https://www.transportation.gov/sites/do ... Travel.pdf

That is a tip to the customer, not law or legal advice. Like, don't pickup a hitchhiker near a prison. It would be better if DOT/FAA writes CoC, but that is against capitalism.

Until a CoC is put through the legal system, no one knows its validity or enforceability. At every opportunity to test CoC, airlines are chickening out and settling with victim customers. Why not prove it in court and teach a lesson to passengers.

Also, CoC doesn't override Business, Contract, and Merchantile laws. If it is a complementary seat assignment, for sure airline can do whatever it wants.

Good grief. Now we have a celebrity that has taken to shaming another passenger complete with picture on Twitter due to the airline's mistake. What a class act. I applaud Delta for publicly denouncing such an immature action regardless of who it was. She should have dealt with the problem like an adult.

burnsie28 wrote:

flyingclrs727 wrote:

Indy wrote:

Is she upset that a woman got her seat or that an attractive woman got her seat? She is just mad that she had to gate check her broom.

She was mad that they took the premium economy seat she had paid extra for to a short woman who doesn't need the leg room. BTW Ann Coulter is 6 feet (183 cm) tall. I don't Blame her for being upset.

It was posted in another site that she put in for an upgrade, got the upgrade but it was a middle seat, and decided to take her original seat, which at that point had been given away.

This sounds very plausible considering the m.o. of the complaining passenger.


In my opinion, Delta would be very wise to consider banning her from their planes. She is without a doubt more trouble than she is worth.

wjcandee wrote:

Forget for a second that you hate her and her behavior. Let's look instead at what the airline did, because that's what merits discussion.

I can't agree with you this time, friend. If this had happened to someone other than Ann Coulter, someone normal, whether famous or not, almost everything would have gone down differently. We cannot divorce the situation from the passenger any more than we can divorce the situation from the airline. Would this have happened on Singapore? No, probably not. The fact that it happened on Delta is relevant, just as is the fact that it happened to a very well-known pot-stirrer.

This is the boy who cried wolf. The passenger in question is known for taking small things and exaggerating the truth beyond all recognition, then complaining about them widely. This is one of her publicity stunts, and it appears to have worked.

Her tweeting a fellow passenger and calling her names is utterly dispicable, but it's also something Coulter has done before. If I were assigned to sit next to her on a plane, I would ask to be moved.

(Also, note that nothing I said has anything to do with her politics (about which I do not care), and everything to do with who she is personally.)

wjcandee wrote:

As someone who regularly flies DL and likes the airline, I'm frankly shocked that they would do this to someone, because it means that they could do it to me.

Do WHAT to you? All we have is Ann Coulter's side of the story, and she's a known exaggerator.

CO953 wrote:

One more thought, and PLEASE don't flame me for this - I'm just posing a possibility, which does happen occasionally. In looking at the three passengers in Coulter's photo, from their facial structure they appear to me to likely be family. They also appear to be of some mid-Eastern origin - maybe Arab or Persian or other. In some cultures, there are certain societal rules about women needing a male to accompany them in public places.

I actually have another related answer as to why Coulter posted the photo. When I heard that she had posted a photo, I thought "the woman is either Black or Middle Eastern, and this is a dog-whistle to her constituents." Coulter has expressed her dislike or hatred for these groups in the past.

Again, you cannot divorce the situation from the passenger doing the complaining when you know so very much about the passenger's previous antics.

If she was already in Comfort Plus and put in for an upgrade, that would have been an upgrade to FC. There are no middle seats there.

Revelation wrote:

spacecadet wrote:

I just read Delta's statement on this, on their own web site. First of all, it's absolutely bizarre. Keep in mind this is Delta *themselves* talking:

Delta issued the following statement in response to Coulter’s insults:

"We are sorry that the customer did not receive the seat she reserved and paid for. More importantly, we are disappointed that the customer has chosen to publicly attack our employees and other customers by posting derogatory and slanderous comments and photos in social media. Her actions are unnecessary and unacceptable.

Each of our employees is charged with treating each other as well as our customers with dignity and respect. And we hold each other accountable when that does not happen.

Delta expects mutual civility throughout the entire travel experience.

We will refund Ms. Coulter's $30 for the preferred seat on the exit row that she purchased."

The airline said that Coulter originally booked seat 15F, which is located by the window in an exit row, however; within 24 hours of the flight’s departure, the customer changed to seat 15D, which is by the aisle. At the time of boarding, Delta inadvertently moved Coulter to 15A, a window seat, when working to accommodate several passengers with seating requests.

Why does it read as if a third party news outlet wrote it? Why are they quoting themselves? This isn't standard press release style, and it really should be a little more personal than that anyway. This is almost beyond cold and detached and into the realm of weird.

Beyond that, they admit that it was their mistake. Again, they admit it, while seemingly trying to deflect some of the blame onto her for changing her seat assignment herself 24 hours in advance. I have no idea what that should have to do with anything. Are their computers not fast enough to keep up with 24 hours notice? I don't know why this is even in the press release. That seems like the kind of personal detail that Delta is complaining about in her tweets. Are they trying to shame her somehow for changing seats? Are they trying to say she shouldn't have cared about a window seat because that's what she booked initially? None of this matters.

All that matters is that Coulter's seat assignment at the time of check-in was 15D, and she was "inadvertently" moved to seat 15A by Delta. That's Delta's fault and they need to take responsibility for it. Everything else that happened afterwards is noise that wouldn't have happened but for Delta's error. And maybe if they'd fixed it sooner, it wouldn't have happened at all.

That said, Coulter should apologize too. But Delta needs to take the initiative and *fix this*.

You nailed it by calling the statement bizarre. Very preachy and high-handed. "Her actions are unnecessary and unacceptable" -- as if they get to be the judge of what is acceptable or not. If it were me, I would say her actions are disappointing and/or regrettable and leave it at that. Instead they double down and continue to moralize -- "Delta expects mutual civility throughout the entire travel experience" which translates to "we can do whatever we want to you and we expect you to accept it without complaint" -- ugh!

That is how I took it as well.

This is the type of situation that can finally change some of these ridiculous policies on the airlines. My opinion is the airline industry has some of the most broken customer service policies. Policies the general public until recently has just taken it. We take it because the fear of security hauling us off for daring to complain. 9-11 has ramped this up imo. But Social Media and smartphones is turning this back a bit as everybody can get on Twitter or record an incident.

I had a flight from MDW to MSP in March. We got on the CRJ and they had the heat turned upto 11. It had to be over 100 degrees in the back of the plane. When we all asked why it was so hot the FA gave us an answer of the sensors are in the door. Like the pilot has no control over the heat. If I had a twitter account Ed Bastion would had received a nasty tweet asking why his airplane has the heat so hot it feels like Cancun in July. That gets their attention. No more having to go though a call center to complain to somebody making $12 an hour taking your complaint that gets put into a pile.

TheFlyingDisk wrote:

This is why, rather than screaming that "X Air Line sucks!" or "Y Airways is shit!" it would be wiser to get educated on the intricacies of flying commercial so that you can cover your bases when the airlines tries to pull one on you.

Are you serious? So a paying passenger following the airline seat selection process is not doing enough? Your statement if said in jest is dead on to show how crazy some airline policies/operational procedures are.

airzona11 wrote:

TheFlyingDisk wrote:

This is why, rather than screaming that "X Air Line sucks!" or "Y Airways is shit!" it would be wiser to get educated on the intricacies of flying commercial so that you can cover your bases when the airlines tries to pull one on you.

Are you serious? So a paying passenger following the airline seat selection process is not doing enough? Your statement if said in jest is dead on to show how crazy some airline policies/operational procedures are.

People always argue that the conditions of carriage is heavily biased in favour of the airline. In this case if your preferred seat is reassigned you will not be refunded. Hence by knowing the CoC you'd be able to fight for your right so that the CoC at least can be neutral for the passenger and you will be able to avoid some of the crazy SOPs.

Screaming "Delta sucks!" or "BA is bloody awful!" isn't going to help anything. That's what I'm saying.

TVNWZ wrote:

If she was already in Comfort Plus and put in for an upgrade, that would have been an upgrade to FC. There are no middle seats there.

She paid $30 for the exit row seat which are free for Medallions. Clearly she has no status with DL and therefore could not have "put in for an upgrade" (either for C+ or F). I think we can safely dismiss this now as an unfounded rumor.

michman wrote:

TVNWZ wrote:

If she was already in Comfort Plus and put in for an upgrade, that would have been an upgrade to FC. There are no middle seats there.

She paid $30 for the exit row seat which are free for Medallions. Clearly she has no status with DL and therefore could not have "put in for an upgrade" (either for C+ or F). I think we can safely dismiss this now as an unfounded rumor.

It's definitely clear that Coulter hasn't told the whole story -- the whole story may not even be available to her. (But flown off the handle she has.)

Ann Coulter, special snowflake.

D L X wrote:

Do WHAT to you? All we have is Ann Coulter's side of the story, and she's a known exaggerator.

Delta has acknowledged by press release that they "inadvertently" moved her to XXA from XXD when "attempting to accommodate other passengers' seating requests". Seriously. That's their explanation. For getting on the plane and telling her that she had to move and offering no explanation. I would really like to know whether that family involved an airline employee or relative or friend of one, and the gate agent just highhandedly moved the already-loaded self-loading freight, not expecting it to push back.

wjcandee wrote:

D L X wrote:

Do WHAT to you? All we have is Ann Coulter's side of the story, and she's a known exaggerator.

Delta has acknowledged by press release that they "inadvertently" moved her to XXA from XXD when "attempting to accommodate other passengers' seating requests". Seriously. That's their explanation. For getting on the plane and telling her that she had to move and offering no explanation. I would really like to know whether that family involved an airline employee or relative or friend of one, and the gate agent just highhandedly moved the already-loaded self-loading freight, not expecting it to push back.

Whatever Delta did or didn't do is a cause for Coulter to remedy with Delta.
She shouldn't act like a dirty little snowflake all over twitter.
She had a exit row seat, which already gave more leg room on a short flight from Palm Beach to LGA. 30 bucks from Delta should have been refunded and has been. The rest of her tirade is just theatrical antics for ratings.

Seriously, who cares? It's Ann Coulter.

I assume her boomstick was being serviced.

ual763 wrote:

pallvidar wrote:

So we can't put our political opinions aside for a few moment to discuss Delta's mistake regardless of who was at the receiving end of it?

Apparently not. Thought people could keep it more civil.

There must be something we aren't being told. If she actually bought the ticket, ie: paid for it, then why did they want to bump her out? Would love to hear the real reason. I would have expected to be asked to move and offered a seat in F. Havent seen where that was on the table. This is a puzzle

Ann Coulter has managed to get her name back in the media. Stay tuned for a new book or tour announcement.

Also, I thought seat purchases were non-refundable. Did DL make an exception because she is a D-list celebrity?

Just been reading about this on the BBC.

Apparently she is saying she spent $10,000 of her time,(at what hourly rate) pre selecting her seat, chosing her flight and then periodically reviewing her option.

How much would it cost to charter her own flight.

ual763 wrote:

This also brings up the question.... If you reserve a seat and are a paying customer, can an airline legally force you to move in order to seat families together? Not saying she was right to post a pic of the other pax involved, but can she legally be forced to give up her seat in this manner?

Yes. It is in their contract of carriage. Just like when you go to a restaurant they can move you to another table if necessary.

wjcandee wrote:

Everyone in PR knows that you never, ever blame the customer; you let the customer make themself look stupid and you answer politely and sincerely. They go low, we go high. It is always the most-effective strategy.

Here, DL's PR people have given non-apology apologies and somewhat snarky answers that demonstrate that they figure that everyone hates Colter, and the media won't care, so they can be asses about it.

But to me, what they did was wrong and their reaction was worse and it's starting to make me think twice about how I feel about the brand.

It was a textbook display of what not to do by Delta. I suspect there is an employee who has lost his or her's ability to tweet on behalf of the company.

I'm not sure they figured "everyone hates Ann Coulter" -- no evidence to support that -- but it would be a pretty foolish assumption. She has made several million dollars as a speaker and author over the years. The number of people who buy her books and pay to listen to her proves that everyone does not hate her.

Shoot! I'd give up my seat just so I wouldn't have to sit next to her!

IPFreely wrote:

wjcandee wrote:

Everyone in PR knows that you never, ever blame the customer; you let the customer make themself look stupid and you answer politely and sincerely. They go low, we go high. It is always the most-effective strategy.

Here, DL's PR people have given non-apology apologies and somewhat snarky answers that demonstrate that they figure that everyone hates Colter, and the media won't care, so they can be asses about it.

But to me, what they did was wrong and their reaction was worse and it's starting to make me think twice about how I feel about the brand.

It was a textbook display of what not to do by Delta. I suspect there is an employee who has lost his or her's ability to tweet on behalf of the company.

I'm not sure they figured "everyone hates Ann Coulter" -- no evidence to support that -- but it would be a pretty foolish assumption. She has made several million dollars as a speaker and author over the years. The number of people who buy her books and pay to listen to her proves that everyone does not hate her.

Why should Delta apologize when they have not done anything wrong? Should celebrities like Ann Coulter have different rules apply to them?

D L X wrote:

wjcandee wrote:

Forget for a second that you hate her and her behavior. Let's look instead at what the airline did, because that's what merits discussion.

I can't agree with you this time, friend. If this had happened to someone other than Ann Coulter, someone normal, whether famous or not, almost everything would have gone down differently. We cannot divorce the situation from the passenger any more than we can divorce the situation from the airline. Would this have happened on Singapore? No, probably not. The fact that it happened on Delta is relevant, just as is the fact that it happened to a very well-known pot-stirrer.

This is the boy who cried wolf. The passenger in question is known for taking small things and exaggerating the truth beyond all recognition, then complaining about them widely. This is one of her publicity stunts, and it appears to have worked.

Her tweeting a fellow passenger and calling her names is utterly dispicable, but it's also something Coulter has done before. If I were assigned to sit next to her on a plane, I would ask to be moved.

(Also, note that nothing I said has anything to do with her politics (about which I do not care), and everything to do with who she is personally.)

wjcandee wrote:

As someone who regularly flies DL and likes the airline, I'm frankly shocked that they would do this to someone, because it means that they could do it to me.

Do WHAT to you? All we have is Ann Coulter's side of the story, and she's a known exaggerator.

1. This KEEPS happening. Ann Coulter didn't invent the airline-screwed-me-over-heres-the-video-rant trend. She just took it to a new, obnoxious level.
2. Delta ADMITS moving her involuntarily.

D L X wrote:

CO953 wrote:

One more thought, and PLEASE don't flame me for this - I'm just posing a possibility, which does happen occasionally. In looking at the three passengers in Coulter's photo, from their facial structure they appear to me to likely be family. They also appear to be of some mid-Eastern origin - maybe Arab or Persian or other. In some cultures, there are certain societal rules about women needing a male to accompany them in public places.

I actually have another related answer as to why Coulter posted the photo. When I heard that she had posted a photo, I thought "the woman is either Black or Middle Eastern, and this is a dog-whistle to her constituents." Coulter has expressed her dislike or hatred for these groups in the past.

Again, you cannot divorce the situation from the passenger doing the complaining when you know so very much about the passenger's previous antics.

I think this is WAY over-thinking it. And I thought we were trying to move past victim-shaming a la David Dao, where his past somehow vindicated his beating?

jeffrey1970 wrote:

IPFreely wrote:

wjcandee wrote:

Everyone in PR knows that you never, ever blame the customer; you let the customer make themself look stupid and you answer politely and sincerely. They go low, we go high. It is always the most-effective strategy.

Here, DL's PR people have given non-apology apologies and somewhat snarky answers that demonstrate that they figure that everyone hates Colter, and the media won't care, so they can be asses about it.

But to me, what they did was wrong and their reaction was worse and it's starting to make me think twice about how I feel about the brand.

It was a textbook display of what not to do by Delta. I suspect there is an employee who has lost his or her's ability to tweet on behalf of the company.

I'm not sure they figured "everyone hates Ann Coulter" -- no evidence to support that -- but it would be a pretty foolish assumption. She has made several million dollars as a speaker and author over the years. The number of people who buy her books and pay to listen to her proves that everyone does not hate her.

Why should Delta apologize when they have not done anything wrong? Should celebrities like Ann Coulter have different rules apply to them?

Because they've admitted they did something wrong.

Again, people are getting hung up on the "who" here. The "who" is why we're hearing about it, but the "what" is what should bother us more. This isn't about Ann Coulter (I doubt anyone is going to change their opinions of her after this), it's about how airlines treat their passengers at times that is just not ok. IMHO of course.

And to wjcandee, I seriously doubt we'll ever know why the switch took place, who it was, etc. Unfortunately. It'd be nice to have some closure, whether it was a family-and-friends thing or a flying-home-to-see-her-dying-mother-and-needs-to-be-with-her-family-right-now thing.

jeffrey1970 wrote:

IPFreely wrote:

wjcandee wrote:

Everyone in PR knows that you never, ever blame the customer; you let the customer make themself look stupid and you answer politely and sincerely. They go low, we go high. It is always the most-effective strategy.

Here, DL's PR people have given non-apology apologies and somewhat snarky answers that demonstrate that they figure that everyone hates Colter, and the media won't care, so they can be asses about it.

But to me, what they did was wrong and their reaction was worse and it's starting to make me think twice about how I feel about the brand.

It was a textbook display of what not to do by Delta. I suspect there is an employee who has lost his or her's ability to tweet on behalf of the company.

I'm not sure they figured "everyone hates Ann Coulter" -- no evidence to support that -- but it would be a pretty foolish assumption. She has made several million dollars as a speaker and author over the years. The number of people who buy her books and pay to listen to her proves that everyone does not hate her.

Why should Delta apologize when they have not done anything wrong? Should celebrities like Ann Coulter have different rules apply to them?

Delta admitted they were wrong by moving somebody out of an assigned seat they paid for in advance. And the rules are the problem. It is not customer service friendly to allude to reserving a seat only to have it taken away at the airlines whim. Because they bury their ability to change your seat in their carriage rules doesnt make it right.

You mentioned a table at a restaurant. A more appropriate metaphor would be if you paid extra for seasoned sour cream and the restaurant decided not to serve it to you. Then told you tough luck without explanation.

Too many are letting their dislike of Coulter cloud their reasoning that this practice in the airline industry needs to stop.

bennett123 wrote:

Just been reading about this on the BBC.

Apparently she is saying she spent $10,000 of her time,(at what hourly rate) pre selecting her seat, chosing her flight and then periodically reviewing her option.

How much would it cost to charter her own flight.

Yes, that is her valuing her time at $10,000. To buy something for $30. Let that sink in.

It's an attempt at gaining sympathy, or even trying to force Delta to pay her $10k, but it's absolutely warrant-less. Even if her time was worth $10,000 (in which case she must have spent entirely too long), her valuation of her time is immaterial to any damages.

D L X wrote:

bennett123 wrote:

Just been reading about this on the BBC.

Apparently she is saying she spent $10,000 of her time,(at what hourly rate) pre selecting her seat, chosing her flight and then periodically reviewing her option.

How much would it cost to charter her own flight.

Yes, that is her valuing her time at $10,000. To buy something for $30. Let that sink in.

It's an attempt at gaining sympathy, or even trying to force Delta to pay her $10k, but it's absolutely warrant-less. Even if her time was worth $10,000 (in which case she must have spent entirely too long), her valuation of her time is immaterial to any damages.

If her time is really that valuable, she could buy a domestic first class ticket cheaper than messing around with upgrades to premiun economy.

Best joke on the NET: Dang, they bumped Coulter? this is going to force me to fly Delta again!

Elementalism wrote:

You mentioned a table at a restaurant. A more appropriate metaphor would be if you paid extra for seasoned sour cream and the restaurant decided not to serve it to you. Then told you tough luck without explanation.

How is that an appropriate metaphor here when the passenger was given a seat literally in the same row as what she'd initially reserved with all the same amenities?

Elementalism wrote:

jeffrey1970 wrote:

IPFreely wrote:

It was a textbook display of what not to do by Delta. I suspect there is an employee who has lost his or her's ability to tweet on behalf of the company.

I'm not sure they figured "everyone hates Ann Coulter" -- no evidence to support that -- but it would be a pretty foolish assumption. She has made several million dollars as a speaker and author over the years. The number of people who buy her books and pay to listen to her proves that everyone does not hate her.

Why should Delta apologize when they have not done anything wrong? Should celebrities like Ann Coulter have different rules apply to them?

Delta admitted they were wrong by moving somebody out of an assigned seat they paid for in advance. And the rules are the problem. It is not customer service friendly to allude to reserving a seat only to have it taken away at the airlines whim. Because they bury their ability to change your seat in their carriage rules doesnt make it right.

You mentioned a table at a restaurant. A more appropriate metaphor would be if you paid extra for seasoned sour cream and the restaurant decided not to serve it to you. Then told you tough luck without explanation.

Too many are letting their dislike of Coulter cloud their reasoning that this practice in the airline industry needs to stop.

I would simplify it down to this: Apologize in the moment. Explain to the extent possible why you are doing this. Let them know you'll comp them a few drinks or get them a mileage certificate or something within their control, and if that's not enough, encourage them to call the airline and seek a refund. I mean, sometimes things happen and the passenger is going to be inconvenienced. You just need to do everything possible to make it acceptable to the customer.

It sounds like from Delta's statement that they kindly asked her to move. She declined (I'm guessing more assertively than kindly, but whatever). At that point, they told her that unfortunately she was going to need to move. It sounds like at that point she felt like it went south, but maybe her initial response to them ("No, I'm not moving. I spent a long time searching out this seat, I paid extra for the legroom, and I'm not moving. I'm sorry.") may have made them uncomfortable and they just went in and did their move and had as few words as possible out of self-protection. The thing is, that's just how it goes sometimes. You need to keep the apologies going and keep bending over backwards unless you want a long, crappy flight (or twitter tirade).

I wasn't there - I don't know the whole story. Even the folks who are saying they've heard from the inside weren't really there, and probably wouldn't empathize with the customer anyhow based on the responses on here. I'm taking it all in and suggesting that along the line something different probably should/could have been done by Delta to have made this go down better rather than just forging full speed ahead in the face of an unhappy customer.

winginit wrote:

Elementalism wrote:

You mentioned a table at a restaurant. A more appropriate metaphor would be if you paid extra for seasoned sour cream and the restaurant decided not to serve it to you. Then told you tough luck without explanation.

How is that an appropriate metaphor here when the passenger was given a seat literally in the same row as what she'd initially reserved with all the same amenities?

I think it's going to be pretty difficult to defend her displeasure at being moved to a window from an aisle in the same row. Apparently it was important to her. After all, she's made it clear that she spent a lot of time selecting her seat - just to have it taken away. In that situation, the FA doesn't know (or care?) that she is vested in getting that particular seat. They just know they want her to move for their own purposes, and don't realize they are walking into a hornet's nest. For as obnoxious as she was in the tweets, she was still their customer and they probably could have done more to accept that she wanted that seat and, unless it was THAT important to them, they should have just left her there.

PlanesNTrains wrote:

I think it's going to be pretty difficult to defend her displeasure at being moved to a window from an aisle in the same row

And I think that's the main takeaway here. Ann Coulter is obviously a polarizing figure, so reactions to this I had thought would be split pretty evenly across political views, but just in skimming the headlines of news outlets that lean both ways I would say common opinion is categorizing Coulter as being in the wrong here more so than Delta.

PlanesNTrains wrote:

Mir, if the FA/Gate Agents don't have time to handle Ann Coulter appropriately, why do they have time to handle the other passenger? is it really that hard to handle it better than "We have to move you, and I don't know why"?

Once she found out that she had a different seat, she should have taken it up with the gate agent. She would have gotten a new boarding pass with a different seat number as soon as she scanned her original one. Given how much time she says she spent picking out her seat, she should have known right away that it wasn't the one she selected, and asked the gate agent about it. They've got the ability to do things to correct the problem. The flight attendants don't, and the statement of 'I don't know why you were assigned a different seat than the one you booked' is almost certainly a completely truthful one.

And the amount of time spent on figuring out the issue considering the difference is between an aisle seat in the exit row and a window seat in the exit row (it's not like she got reassigned to a middle seat in economy) is not worth taking a delay over. Delta's passengers take on-time performance seriously, which means Delta does as well, and there were a lot of other people on that plane who wanted to get where they were going. At that point, the best thing to do is to take it up with the airline after the flight. The airline apologizes, it refunds the money spent on the seat selection, and the situation is over.

Or at least that's what should happen with rational people who aren't on an ego trip.

PlanesNTrains wrote:

1. This KEEPS happening. Ann Coulter didn't invent the airline-screwed-me-over-heres-the-video-rant trend. She just took it to a new, obnoxious level.
2. Delta ADMITS moving her involuntarily.

Sure.

"This" is really of the incredibly minor irritant variety as opposed to some of the other negative PR events the airlines have recently suffered. Being moved from an aisle to a window (as I have learned from wjcandee) is an utterly bs reason to lose one's mind as she has done. And it is ABSOLUTELY NO REASON to post a picture of another passenger so you can vilify her as well. Saying Coulter was "screwed over" by being moved from this seat with extra legroom to THAT seat with extra legroom is a real stretch.

Perhaps Delta shouldn't have moved her. But also, perhaps my daughter shouldn't have moved my cheese. This is definitely BFD.

Guys, if you can't see this as Coulter trying to get some press, they you haven't been paying attention to Coulter over the years. THIS. IS. WHAT. SHE. DOES.

I actually have another related answer as to why Coulter posted the photo. When I heard that she had posted a photo, I thought "the woman is either Black or Middle Eastern, and this is a dog-whistle to her constituents." Coulter has expressed her dislike or hatred for these groups in the past.

Again, you cannot divorce the situation from the passenger doing the complaining when you know so very much about the passenger's previous antics.

I think this is WAY over-thinking it. And I thought we were trying to move past victim-shaming a la David Dao, where his past somehow vindicated his beating?

I've been a minority all my life. Trust me, we can spot a bigot and bigoted acts. Look at Coulter's twitter feed: you will find something bigoted in the first 50 posts, particularly about Muslims. When you're appropriately fingered for your bigotry there, you lose the benefit of the doubt here.

A more appropriate metaphor would be if you paid extra for seasoned sour cream and the restaurant decided not to serve it to you.

Not if what wjcandee reported is correct that she was moved from one seat to another seat in the same row. But I do agree that you got the magnitude right. She's complaining about seasoned sour cream, not being bashed in the head and dragged out bleeding.

PlanesNTrains wrote:

I would simplify it down to this: Apologize in the moment. Explain to the extent possible why you are doing this. Let them know you'll comp them a few drinks or get them a mileage certificate or something within their control, and if that's not enough, encourage them to call the airline and seek a refund. I mean, sometimes things happen and the passenger is going to be inconvenienced. You just need to do everything possible to make it acceptable to the customer.

It sounds like from Delta's statement that they kindly asked her to move. She declined (I'm guessing more assertively than kindly, but whatever). At that point, they told her that unfortunately she was going to need to move. It sounds like at that point she felt like it went south, but maybe her initial response to them ("No, I'm not moving. I spent a long time searching out this seat, I paid extra for the legroom, and I'm not moving. I'm sorry.") may have made them uncomfortable and they just went in and did their move and had as few words as possible out of self-protection. The thing is, that's just how it goes sometimes. You need to keep the apologies going and keep bending over backwards unless you want a long, crappy flight (or twitter tirade).

I wasn't there - I don't know the whole story. Even the folks who are saying they've heard from the inside weren't really there, and probably wouldn't empathize with the customer anyhow based on the responses on here. I'm taking it all in and suggesting that along the line something different probably should/could have been done by Delta to have made this go down better rather than just forging full speed ahead in the face of an unhappy customer.

I wasn't there either, but given the person's history (which as I've stated, I can't divorce from these events) I have a very difficult time assuming that she was an innocent babe in the woods while Delta played the big bad wolf. If this were Sean Hannity, I'd immediately believe him! (But he'd probably never photograph another customer and tweet it.) But I can't for Coulter. Too much history to ignore. Again, THIS IS WHAT SHE DOES.

Then there's the question of what do you do when the customer makes clear that there is nothing that the customer will accept? And what do you do when the customer attacks another customer?

winginit wrote:

Elementalism wrote:

You mentioned a table at a restaurant. A more appropriate metaphor would be if you paid extra for seasoned sour cream and the restaurant decided not to serve it to you. Then told you tough luck without explanation.

How is that an appropriate metaphor here when the passenger was given a seat literally in the same row as what she'd initially reserved with all the same amenities?

Because she paid for something and didnt get it. She bought a specific seat, paid an extra fee for that seat, and then never got it.

D L X wrote:

PlanesNTrains wrote:

1. This KEEPS happening. Ann Coulter didn't invent the airline-screwed-me-over-heres-the-video-rant trend. She just took it to a new, obnoxious level.
2. Delta ADMITS moving her involuntarily.

Sure.

"This" is really of the incredibly minor irritant variety as opposed to some of the other negative PR events the airlines have recently suffered. Being moved from an aisle to a window (as I have learned from wjcandee) is an utterly bs reason to lose one's mind as she has done. And it is ABSOLUTELY NO REASON to post a picture of another passenger so you can vilify her as well. Saying Coulter was "screwed over" by being moved from this seat with extra legroom to THAT seat with extra legroom is a real stretch.

Perhaps Delta shouldn't have moved her. But also, perhaps my daughter shouldn't have moved my cheese. This is definitely BFD.

Guys, if you can't see this as Coulter trying to get some press, they you haven't been paying attention to Coulter over the years. THIS. IS. WHAT. SHE. DOES.

I actually have another related answer as to why Coulter posted the photo. When I heard that she had posted a photo, I thought "the woman is either Black or Middle Eastern, and this is a dog-whistle to her constituents." Coulter has expressed her dislike or hatred for these groups in the past.

Again, you cannot divorce the situation from the passenger doing the complaining when you know so very much about the passenger's previous antics.

I think this is WAY over-thinking it. And I thought we were trying to move past victim-shaming a la David Dao, where his past somehow vindicated his beating?

I've been a minority all my life. Trust me, we can spot a bigot and bigoted acts. Look at Coulter's twitter feed: you will find something bigoted in the first 50 posts, particularly about Muslims. When you're appropriately fingered for your bigotry there, you lose the benefit of the doubt here.

A more appropriate metaphor would be if you paid extra for seasoned sour cream and the restaurant decided not to serve it to you.

Not if what wjcandee reported is correct that she was moved from one seat to another seat in the same row. But I do agree that you got the magnitude right. She's complaining about seasoned sour cream, not being bashed in the head and dragged out bleeding.[/quote]

It's absolutely FWP. Having said that, I don't understand the boarding pass issue. Are you saying that she was issued a boarding pass with the wrong seat number, failed to notice it, went to the seat she thought she had, was told to move, didn't like it, and should have then exited the aircraft and spoken with the gate agent? Personally, I would not ever think to get off a plane that is preparing to depart, but that's just me I guess. I also would like to know more about how the whole seating thing happened - you seem to know more than I do about how it came to be that she was in the wrong spot or otherwise moved.

I have nothing to say to defend AC or her actions - I'd never in a million years say that was ok, professional, respectful, or anything else. That doesn't take away from the fact that she didn't get the seat she wanted and didn't feel she was given an understanding or an apology of why? Based on your description above, I believe her, as apparently the FAs don't have time for such things.

Anyhow, her personality, character, behavior, etc isn't my concern, and I don't defend it at all. It's ridiculous. My concern is, as a passenger, feeling appreciated for my business and treated that way, rather than be told to move from my carefully chosen seat with no real explanation or apology or what not.

D L X wrote:

PlanesNTrains wrote:

I would simplify it down to this: Apologize in the moment. Explain to the extent possible why you are doing this. Let them know you'll comp them a few drinks or get them a mileage certificate or something within their control, and if that's not enough, encourage them to call the airline and seek a refund. I mean, sometimes things happen and the passenger is going to be inconvenienced. You just need to do everything possible to make it acceptable to the customer.

It sounds like from Delta's statement that they kindly asked her to move. She declined (I'm guessing more assertively than kindly, but whatever). At that point, they told her that unfortunately she was going to need to move. It sounds like at that point she felt like it went south, but maybe her initial response to them ("No, I'm not moving. I spent a long time searching out this seat, I paid extra for the legroom, and I'm not moving. I'm sorry.") may have made them uncomfortable and they just went in and did their move and had as few words as possible out of self-protection. The thing is, that's just how it goes sometimes. You need to keep the apologies going and keep bending over backwards unless you want a long, crappy flight (or twitter tirade).

I wasn't there - I don't know the whole story. Even the folks who are saying they've heard from the inside weren't really there, and probably wouldn't empathize with the customer anyhow based on the responses on here. I'm taking it all in and suggesting that along the line something different probably should/could have been done by Delta to have made this go down better rather than just forging full speed ahead in the face of an unhappy customer.

I wasn't there either, but given the person's history (which as I've stated, I can't divorce from these events) I have a very difficult time assuming that she was an innocent babe in the woods while Delta played the big bad wolf. If this were Sean Hannity, I'd immediately believe him! (But he'd probably never photograph another customer and tweet it.) But I can't for Coulter. Too much history to ignore. Again, THIS IS WHAT SHE DOES.

Then there's the question of what do you do when the customer makes clear that there is nothing that the customer will accept? And what do you do when the customer attacks another customer?

Sorry - I didn't see your second reply or I would have combined it. I'll have to defer to your inside knowledge on this because I had not heard that she was issued a boarding pass for a window seat, didn't notice it, went to her previously selected seat, sat down, was asked and then told to move, and ... well, then it went from there. What I will say, though, is that the short answer to your question is apologize, explain, or say you'll get an explanation. Being on-time doesn't excuse treating people poorly, not respecting their choices, or whatever. BUT - again - I wasn't there, and you seem to have more inside scoop on it than I do, so I'll wait to hear more.

PlanesNTrains wrote:

D L X wrote:

PlanesNTrains wrote:

I would simplify it down to this: Apologize in the moment. Explain to the extent possible why you are doing this. Let them know you'll comp them a few drinks or get them a mileage certificate or something within their control, and if that's not enough, encourage them to call the airline and seek a refund. I mean, sometimes things happen and the passenger is going to be inconvenienced. You just need to do everything possible to make it acceptable to the customer.

It sounds like from Delta's statement that they kindly asked her to move. She declined (I'm guessing more assertively than kindly, but whatever). At that point, they told her that unfortunately she was going to need to move. It sounds like at that point she felt like it went south, but maybe her initial response to them ("No, I'm not moving. I spent a long time searching out this seat, I paid extra for the legroom, and I'm not moving. I'm sorry.") may have made them uncomfortable and they just went in and did their move and had as few words as possible out of self-protection. The thing is, that's just how it goes sometimes. You need to keep the apologies going and keep bending over backwards unless you want a long, crappy flight (or twitter tirade).

I wasn't there - I don't know the whole story. Even the folks who are saying they've heard from the inside weren't really there, and probably wouldn't empathize with the customer anyhow based on the responses on here. I'm taking it all in and suggesting that along the line something different probably should/could have been done by Delta to have made this go down better rather than just forging full speed ahead in the face of an unhappy customer.

I wasn't there either, but given the person's history (which as I've stated, I can't divorce from these events) I have a very difficult time assuming that she was an innocent babe in the woods while Delta played the big bad wolf. If this were Sean Hannity, I'd immediately believe him! (But he'd probably never photograph another customer and tweet it.) But I can't for Coulter. Too much history to ignore. Again, THIS IS WHAT SHE DOES.

Then there's the question of what do you do when the customer makes clear that there is nothing that the customer will accept? And what do you do when the customer attacks another customer?

Sorry - I didn't see your second reply or I would have combined it. I'll have to defer to your inside knowledge on this because I had not heard that she was issued a boarding pass for a window seat, didn't notice it, went to her previously selected seat, sat down, was asked and then told to move, and ... well, then it went from there. What I will say, though, is that the short answer to your question is apologize, explain, or say you'll get an explanation. Being on-time doesn't excuse treating people poorly, not respecting their choices, or whatever. BUT - again - I wasn't there, and you seem to have more inside scoop on it than I do, so I'll wait to hear more.

My bad, didn't mean to imply i have any special information.

I'm guessing based on Delta's generally decent customer service, and Ann Coulter's history of being generally difficult to people.

Elementalism wrote:

winginit wrote:

Elementalism wrote:

You mentioned a table at a restaurant. A more appropriate metaphor would be if you paid extra for seasoned sour cream and the restaurant decided not to serve it to you. Then told you tough luck without explanation.

How is that an appropriate metaphor here when the passenger was given a seat literally in the same row as what she'd initially reserved with all the same amenities?

Because she paid for something and didnt get it. She bought a specific seat, paid an extra fee for that seat, and then never got it.

And yet by every definition that exists, she unquestionably received a highly comparable product no?

She's a cretin because she implies in her tweet that she lost her "PRE-BOOKED" "extra room seat" to another passenger She omits that she still received an extra-room seat in the same aisle, on the window instead of the aisle.

Poor thing.

Mir wrote:

PlanesNTrains wrote:

Mir, if the FA/Gate Agents don't have time to handle Ann Coulter appropriately, why do they have time to handle the other passenger? is it really that hard to handle it better than "We have to move you, and I don't know why"?

Once she found out that she had a different seat, she should have taken it up with the gate agent. She would have gotten a new boarding pass with a different seat number as soon as she scanned her original one. Given how much time she says she spent picking out her seat, she should have known right away that it wasn't the one she selected, and asked the gate agent about it. They've got the ability to do things to correct the problem. The flight attendants don't, and the statement of 'I don't know why you were assigned a different seat than the one you booked' is almost certainly a completely truthful one.

And the amount of time spent on figuring out the issue considering the difference is between an aisle seat in the exit row and a window seat in the exit row (it's not like she got reassigned to a middle seat in economy) is not worth taking a delay over. Delta's passengers take on-time performance seriously, which means Delta does as well, and there were a lot of other people on that plane who wanted to get where they were going. At that point, the best thing to do is to take it up with the airline after the flight. The airline apologizes, it refunds the money spent on the seat selection, and the situation is over.

Or at least that's what should happen with rational people who aren't on an ego trip.

They switched her seat after she had already boarded and sat down. There was no new boarding pass printed at the gate. Let's get our facts straight.

D L X wrote:

My bad, didn't mean to imply i have any special information.

I'm guessing based on Delta's generally decent customer service, and Ann Coulter's history of being generally difficult to people.

Well, that's fine. I just thought you were saying that's what happened. I hadn't heard it described that way before but admit to not really following it that closely. From what I had gathered from Delta's statement as well as hers, she had a window seat, changed to an aisle a day before, went to that seat, then was forced to move to a window. Beyond that, who knows.

Ignoring, for my purposes here, my opinions about the passenger involved, here's something that describes the REAL PROBLEM here better than I could: The real problem with Ann Coulter's seat fiasco.

Aptivaboy wrote:

the issue is with Delta apparently switching her seat.

It's not even an issue, so what's to discuss.

The only reason it is "an issue" is because of who she is.

What scares me is that she views the Daily Mail as "Liberal".
https://twitter.com/AnnCoulter/status/8 ... 1151353856

Are liberals slow? They always think tweeting is a HUGE time suck. @MailOnline: Coulter "spent her entire weekend berating the airline"

In all honesty, the airline messed up a bit, but hardly big time. It would have been wise to unequivocally apologise, if only to reassure the rest of us who may want to spend $30 reserving a seat.

And having done that, they should inform Ms Coulter that publicly embarrassing her fellow passengers is unacceptable, and that, should she travel with them again, others sat nearby may reasonably feel uncomfortable. Given that, Delta would rather she didn't consider them when making future travel plans as she would not be welcome.

michman wrote:

Mir wrote:

PlanesNTrains wrote:

Mir, if the FA/Gate Agents don't have time to handle Ann Coulter appropriately, why do they have time to handle the other passenger? is it really that hard to handle it better than "We have to move you, and I don't know why"?

Once she found out that she had a different seat, she should have taken it up with the gate agent. She would have gotten a new boarding pass with a different seat number as soon as she scanned her original one. Given how much time she says she spent picking out her seat, she should have known right away that it wasn't the one she selected, and asked the gate agent about it. They've got the ability to do things to correct the problem. The flight attendants don't, and the statement of 'I don't know why you were assigned a different seat than the one you booked' is almost certainly a completely truthful one.

And the amount of time spent on figuring out the issue considering the difference is between an aisle seat in the exit row and a window seat in the exit row (it's not like she got reassigned to a middle seat in economy) is not worth taking a delay over. Delta's passengers take on-time performance seriously, which means Delta does as well, and there were a lot of other people on that plane who wanted to get where they were going. At that point, the best thing to do is to take it up with the airline after the flight. The airline apologizes, it refunds the money spent on the seat selection, and the situation is over.

Or at least that's what should happen with rational people who aren't on an ego trip.

They switched her seat after she had already boarded and sat down. There was no new boarding pass printed at the gate. Let's get our facts straight.

Switched AFTER boarding? Do you know this as fact? I haven't seen this anywhere. From what I understand her seat was switched to 15a from 15D before boarding. After getting on a/c she sat in 15a. Flight Attendant Went to brief the exit rows and was asked by coulter why her seat was changed, of course the flight attendant had no idea, as she was assisting with bags and exit row briefing. she then takes picture of Flight Attendant And also takes picture of passenger sitting in 15 D.

Interesting how some posters say take this women out of the equation, but if the same posters would take DELTA Out of the equation I believe they would also be singing a different tune.

cokepopper wrote:

Interesting how some posters say take this women out of the equation, but if the same posters would take DELTA Out of the equation I believe they would also be singing a different tune.

It's funny that when some random person complains about something similar, this board is filled with complaints that the person is only looking to get a big pay day, and that airlines only guarantee to fly you somewhere, and nothing more, but many here are quick to defend her and blast Delta.

I saw this on NBC News
http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/del ... ry-n783566

After some confusion, according to the airline, a flight attendant stepped in to ask the affected passengers to return to the seats on their respective tickets. Everyone, including Coulter, complied and the flight departed and landed without further incident, according to Delta.

If that's accurate - and yes, it's from DL - that means she's been whining for the past two days because she was asked to change seats, and after objecting, was able to return to the seat she spent so much time carefully selecting.

scbriml wrote:

Aptivaboy wrote:

the issue is with Delta apparently switching her seat.

It's not even an issue, so what's to discuss.

The only reason it is "an issue" is because of who she is.

Just because you don't care where you sit, or care if they move you without giving you a reason, doesn't mean everyone does. Beyond that, obviously I agree that if she hadn't broadcasted her tirade we'd never have heard about it.