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dc10lover
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Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 7:08 am

The pilot-shortage crisis at Alaska Air subsidiary Horizon Air continues after multiple flight cancellations. The airline is contracting with SkyWest as well as bringing in Alaska Airlines jets to handle hundreds of flights in the fall.

http://www.seattletimes.com/business/bo ... -the-fall/
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PlanesNTrains
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 7:29 am

Well, it sounds like they have a plan to cover for the canceled flights so that's good.

More interesting is the proposal to send QX trainees oversees to get time in someone's Q300s then have them come back once they get to 1500 hours.
-Dave


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dc10lover
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 8:05 am

With the order of 30 Embraer 175's and 33 options, do they have enough pilots / flight attendants to fly these aircraft?
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fortytwoeyes
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:12 am

What "major international airline" is still flying Q300s?
 
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readytotaxi
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:23 am

If you do not pay enough people will not work for you, and then it costs you more in the long run.
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RyanairGuru
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 11:06 am

fortytwoeyes wrote:
What "major international airline" is still flying Q300s?


Air Canada and Qantas immediately come to mind.
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clrd4t8koff
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 11:22 am

RyanairGuru wrote:
fortytwoeyes wrote:
What "major international airline" is still flying Q300s?


Air Canada and Qantas immediately come to mind.


I believe also AA has Q300's inherited from US.
 
nikeherc
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 11:48 am

fortytwoeyes wrote:
What "major international airline" is still flying Q300s?

It doesn't have to be a major International airline, it just has to be a foreign airline with less restrictive regulation.
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amcnd
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 12:49 pm

No 23 yearold in the PNW will want to go to Asia and "get some time" when Compass or SkyWest will hire them and they both have SEA bases..
 
JBoy
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 1:09 pm

If they don't have the 1500 hours, Compass or SkyWest can't hire them. That's the idea.
 
MIflyer12
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 1:33 pm

That's really a very well done, objective piece in the 'Seattle Times' which the OP hyperlinked. I would encourage all to read it. It points out that there are no quick, easy solutions after Horizon management worked itself into this hole. Parking ~10% of a fleet for months on end is never a good way to make money.
 
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Super80Fan
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 1:40 pm

Good job Alaska Air Group. This is what happens when you try to take the CHEAP way out.
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c933103
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 1:43 pm

Do they really need to put those pilots into Q300 in order to get hours instead of just whatever other aircrafts?
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TerminalD
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 1:56 pm

PlanesNTrains wrote:
Well, it sounds like they have a plan to cover for the canceled flights so that's good.

More interesting is the proposal to send QX trainees oversees to get time in someone's Q300s then have them come back once they get to 1500 hours.

I would guess they have to underbid the cost of their existing (at the other airline) pilots who are probably pay protected AND pay the QX ones living expenses, etc. Big bucks. Wouldn't be surprised if this costs $15-20,000 per month per pilot. I wonder how they will keep the pilots from taking their hours and heading to B6? LOL

Also, they can only get 100 hours per month if they are flying live flights. So if they are at 800 hours now (which is still a lot), it will take 7 months to get to 1500.
50 pilots x 7 months x $15-20,000 per month = ~$6m! :o One airplane takes at least 3 sets of two pilots. So, that would given them 8 planes worth of pilots (I'm aware these are all copilots, but keeping it simple).
 
Maverick623
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 2:06 pm

TerminalD wrote:
I wonder how they will keep the pilots from taking their hours and heading to B6? LOL


Generally this is taken care of by a contract that has the airline cover the costs as a "loan" to the pilot, and the pilot has to stay employed for X number of years, or else pay back the costs.
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DiamondFlyer
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 2:29 pm

Maverick623 wrote:
TerminalD wrote:
I wonder how they will keep the pilots from taking their hours and heading to B6? LOL


Generally this is taken care of by a contract that has the airline cover the costs as a "loan" to the pilot, and the pilot has to stay employed for X number of years, or else pay back the costs.


Ah yes, training contracts, the sure sign of a shit employer. If they throw a training contract on it, it's only going to make their situation worse.
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PlanesNTrains
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 4:23 pm

RyanairGuru wrote:
fortytwoeyes wrote:
What "major international airline" is still flying Q300s?


Air Canada and Qantas immediately come to mind.


Since they referenced "overseas" I believe in the article, I'm guessing QantasLink would be a good guess.

DiamondFlyer wrote:
Maverick623 wrote:
TerminalD wrote:
I wonder how they will keep the pilots from taking their hours and heading to B6? LOL


Generally this is taken care of by a contract that has the airline cover the costs as a "loan" to the pilot, and the pilot has to stay employed for X number of years, or else pay back the costs.


Ah yes, training contracts, the sure sign of a shit employer. If they throw a training contract on it, it's only going to make their situation worse.


These guys won't be getting jobs anywhere due to their hours. If Alaska says "We'll get you flying NOW and cover those costs IF you work for us X number of years", I see nothing wrong with that. I have a friend who is a doctor - she signed a contract to live in a remote village in Alaska for four years in exchange for her tuition expenses. She didn't have to do it, but it was a good fit for her so she did. Who cares? It's the predicament that AS is in, so if they are getting creative to get them out of it, so be it.
-Dave


MAX’d out on MAX threads. If you are starting a thread, and it’s about the MAX - stop. There’s already a thread that covers it.
 
DiamondFlyer
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 4:32 pm

PlanesNTrains wrote:
RyanairGuru wrote:
fortytwoeyes wrote:
What "major international airline" is still flying Q300s?


Air Canada and Qantas immediately come to mind.


Since they referenced "overseas" I believe in the article, I'm guessing QantasLink would be a good guess.

DiamondFlyer wrote:
Maverick623 wrote:

Generally this is taken care of by a contract that has the airline cover the costs as a "loan" to the pilot, and the pilot has to stay employed for X number of years, or else pay back the costs.


Ah yes, training contracts, the sure sign of a shit employer. If they throw a training contract on it, it's only going to make their situation worse.


These guys won't be getting jobs anywhere due to their hours. If Alaska says "We'll get you flying NOW and cover those costs IF you work for us X number of years", I see nothing wrong with that. I have a friend who is a doctor - she signed a contract to live in a remote village in Alaska for four years in exchange for her tuition expenses. She didn't have to do it, but it was a good fit for her so she did. Who cares? It's the predicament that AS is in, so if they are getting creative to get them out of it, so be it.


Or they could stop playing games and just increase pay and quality of life to make it a job people want to take. But that's a foreign concept to the union busting types that seem to live on this forum these days.
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Polot
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 4:37 pm

DiamondFlyer wrote:
Or they could stop playing games and just increase pay and quality of life to make it a job people want to take. But that's a foreign concept to the union busting types that seem to live on this forum these days.

According to everyone here there is a (looming?) pilot shortage. That means airlines are going to have to start coming up with creative ways of getting future pilots up to 1500 hr so the pilots can actually take that increase pay and quality of life and fly for the airline in the first place.
 
DiamondFlyer
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 4:40 pm

Polot wrote:
DiamondFlyer wrote:
Or they could stop playing games and just increase pay and quality of life to make it a job people want to take. But that's a foreign concept to the union busting types that seem to live on this forum these days.

According to everyone here there is a (looming?) pilot shortage. That means airlines are going to have to start coming up with creative ways of getting future pilots up to 1500 hr so the pilots can actually take that increase pay and quality of life and fly for the airline in the first place.


Sure, there might be down the road. But regionals who offer something in either compensation, career progression or variety in bases (or a combination of the above) have no problem getting pilots to show up. The AA owned regionals are hiring well. Delta's owned regional is hiring well. Skywest is hiring well. Its the lower tier carriers that can't get people to show, and are trying to gimmick their way to staffing.
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PlanesNTrains
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 5:12 pm

DiamondFlyer wrote:
PlanesNTrains wrote:
RyanairGuru wrote:

Air Canada and Qantas immediately come to mind.


Since they referenced "overseas" I believe in the article, I'm guessing QantasLink would be a good guess.

DiamondFlyer wrote:

Ah yes, training contracts, the sure sign of a shit employer. If they throw a training contract on it, it's only going to make their situation worse.


These guys won't be getting jobs anywhere due to their hours. If Alaska says "We'll get you flying NOW and cover those costs IF you work for us X number of years", I see nothing wrong with that. I have a friend who is a doctor - she signed a contract to live in a remote village in Alaska for four years in exchange for her tuition expenses. She didn't have to do it, but it was a good fit for her so she did. Who cares? It's the predicament that AS is in, so if they are getting creative to get them out of it, so be it.


Or they could stop playing games and just increase pay and quality of life to make it a job people want to take. But that's a foreign concept to the union busting types that seem to live on this forum these days.


I'm a union-busting type?

It sounds like AS/QX allowed themselves to get behind the 8 ball, and now they're screwed until they get it fixed. If it's because of wages, then this is the free market at work. SkyWest pilots get more flying and more hours and better pay - what's the problem?
-Dave


MAX’d out on MAX threads. If you are starting a thread, and it’s about the MAX - stop. There’s already a thread that covers it.
 
flyoregon
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 5:13 pm

readytotaxi wrote:
If you do not pay enough people will not work for you, and then it costs you more in the long run.


And if you treat your people like crap, they'll go somewhere else.

I heard rumor that Dir. of Ops Brad Lambert resigned and there is speculation CEO Dave Campbell will be resigning soon?

It's really a shame that QX has won the race to the bottom when for so long is was one of the premier regionals to fly for. It seems like when AS and QX entered the CPA, the QX brand and culture went to hell. I do think that it was a necessary move for Horizon, but it's sad to see.

What are the odds of SkyWest buying Horizon like they did with ExpressJet/ASA?
 
dc10lover
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 5:25 pm

DiamondFlyer wrote:
Polot wrote:
DiamondFlyer wrote:
Or they coul byd stop playing games and just increase pay and quality of life to make it a job people want to take. But that's a foreign concept to the union busting types that seem to live on this forum these days.

According to everyone here there is a (looming?) pilot shortage. That means airlines are going to have to start coming up with creative ways of getting future pilots up to 1500 hr so the pilots can actually take that increase pay and quality of life and fly for the airline in the first place.


Sure, there might be down the road. But regionals who offer something in either compensation, career progression or variety in bases (or a combination of the above) have no problem getting pilots to show up. The AA owned regionals are hiring well. Delta's owned regional is hiring well. Skywest is hiring well. Its the lower tier carriers that can't get people to show, and are trying to gimmick their way to staffing.

Because of higher pay, I believe pilots would rather fly (regional) jets instead. And with all the aircraft ordered by other competing airlines, I think this will hurt Alaska even more as Alaska needs more pilots.
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PlanesNTrains
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 5:26 pm

Regardless of the pay etc, letting themselves get into this much of a bind seems irresponsible, unless it was part of a broader plan to divest QX (which I doubt). I don't know who is responsible, but if one or two heads roll because of it, that's probably not a bad thing.
-Dave


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ucdtim17
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 5:27 pm

Some 737 flights are showing up on PDX-OAK for Sept/Oct. Hopefully we'll see more; it's pretty limited as of right now.
 
VolvoBus
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 5:36 pm

I wonder what rates SkyWest are getting for the flying?

What a lovely opportunity to say ' We are the only Regional who can take this on with this timescale. These are our rates. Take it or leave it. Yes, it is called a whipsaw. '
 
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rikkus67
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 5:38 pm

Quick question: Why would pilots be gaining hours on Dash 8-300Q / Q300? Horizon flies the Q400... I'm sure familiarization is minimal, but still....
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atl100million
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 5:40 pm

Beyond just Horizon, the impact is on Alaska which has prided itself for its operational reliability but that is quickly turning out not to be the case. It is precisely because AS' strength is concentrated in the NW that news like this is spread over a higher percentage of its market. Add in that Virgin America has long struggled with operational reliability because of the frequent delay situation at SFO and the AS brand is becoming less and less known for operational reliability.
 
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Polot
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 5:42 pm

rikkus67 wrote:
Quick question: Why would pilots be gaining hours on Dash 8-300Q / Q300? Horizon flies the Q400... I'm sure familiarization is minimal, but still....

Probably whoever they found to make such an agreement with only has Q300s. The most important thing to QX is that the pilots get the hours necessary so that the pilots can fly for QX. They will be trained specifically to QX's standards when they come back like any airline does with new hires.
 
PlanesNTrains
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 5:51 pm

ucdtim17 wrote:
Some 737 flights are showing up on PDX-OAK for Sept/Oct. Hopefully we'll see more; it's pretty limited as of right now.


Customers will be happy, that's for sure. That has seemed like a complaint in the past with AS/QX - that this route should be flown by jets.

rikkus67 wrote:
Quick question: Why would pilots be gaining hours on Dash 8-300Q / Q300? Horizon flies the Q400... I'm sure familiarization is minimal, but still....


I just saw what Polot said - I agree.

atl100million wrote:
Beyond just Horizon, the impact is on Alaska which has prided itself for its operational reliability but that is quickly turning out not to be the case. It is precisely because AS' strength is concentrated in the NW that news like this is spread over a higher percentage of its market. Add in that Virgin America has long struggled with operational reliability because of the frequent delay situation at SFO and the AS brand is becoming less and less known for operational reliability.


They have time to fix this. Their reputation is still one of overall reliability so as long as they are subbing flying in rather than just canceling, it might help.
-Dave


MAX’d out on MAX threads. If you are starting a thread, and it’s about the MAX - stop. There’s already a thread that covers it.
 
PlanesNTrains
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 5:59 pm

rikkus67 wrote:
Quick question: Why would pilots be gaining hours on Dash 8-300Q / Q300? Horizon flies the Q400... I'm sure familiarization is minimal, but still....


Weird that this posted again - forum fluke? Anyhow, see above.
-Dave


MAX’d out on MAX threads. If you are starting a thread, and it’s about the MAX - stop. There’s already a thread that covers it.
 
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rikkus67
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 6:00 pm

Quick question: Why would pilots be gaining hours on Dash 8-300Q / Q300? Horizon flies the Q400... I'm sure familiarization is minimal, but still....
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PlanesNTrains
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 6:00 pm

rikkus67 wrote:
Quick question: Why would pilots be gaining hours on Dash 8-300Q / Q300? Horizon flies the Q400... I'm sure familiarization is minimal, but still....


Great question! lol
-Dave


MAX’d out on MAX threads. If you are starting a thread, and it’s about the MAX - stop. There’s already a thread that covers it.
 
kabq737
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 7:24 pm

Do we think we could see Delta start to add flights to more regional airports in the West out of SEA? It would make sense. It could be easy market to pick up and extra feed for other flights. It would also be a way to establish bigger brand loyalty in the Pacific NW.
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KCaviator
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 7:31 pm

rikkus67 wrote:
Quick question: Why would pilots be gaining hours on Dash 8-300Q / Q300? Horizon flies the Q400... I'm sure familiarization is minimal, but still....


It doesn't matter what type of aircraft you're flying to get the hours needed to qualify for an Airline Transport Pilot (ATP) certificate, which is needed to fly for an airline like Horizon.

This is why the whole 1,500-hour rule is bogus. Pilots can rent a Cessna 172 and fly around all day until they get 1,500 and they'd still qualify. There's no real benefit, in terms of experience and skill, of doing that. But if you're building time in a 300, you'd be greatly more experienced than the majority of pilots the regionals are hiring today.
 
amcnd
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 8:49 pm

Well..the Old AS CRJ700's are surprisingly closer to the TUS hanger today.. And SkyWest just put its 1000'th CTP graduate into initial ground school.. meanwhile at QX...
"In an internal memo to Horizon cabin crews last week, Kieran Whitney, director of Crew Resources at Alaska Airlines, said that starting in September, SkyWest will supply up to six Bombardier CRJ 50-seat or 70-seat regional jets to fly in place of the Q400s, which seat up to 76"
 
dc10lover
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 8:52 pm

kabq737 wrote:
Do we think we could see Delta start to add flights to more regional airports in the West out of SEA? It would make sense. It could be easy market to pick up and extra feed for other flights. It would also be a way to establish bigger brand loyalty in the Pacific NW.

Out of Wenatchee & Yakima, use a 50 passenger CRJ 200 to Seattle.
"The Best Setting For A Window Air Conditioner Is Actually Medium Cool / Medium Fan Speed"
 
thegoldenargosy
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Tue Jul 25, 2017 10:51 pm

flyoregon wrote:
readytotaxi wrote:
If you do not pay enough people will not work for you, and then it costs you more in the long run.


And if you treat your people like crap, they'll go somewhere else.

I heard rumor that Dir. of Ops Brad Lambert resigned and there is speculation CEO Dave Campbell will be resigning soon?

It's really a shame that QX has won the race to the bottom when for so long is was one of the premier regionals to fly for. It seems like when AS and QX entered the CPA, the QX brand and culture went to hell. I do think that it was a necessary move for Horizon, but it's sad to see.

What are the odds of SkyWest buying Horizon like they did with ExpressJet/ASA?


Someone I know actually quit Horizon in the middle of ground school. He said that the culture there was horrible. He's now happily flying for an AA owned regional.
 
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Acey559
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Wed Jul 26, 2017 2:07 am

I quit QX last year for this reason. Granted, for me it wasn't a place I was planning to stay anyhow, but it expedited my exit. When we were pleading for more money and 1224 sold us down the river, the company kept telling us they didn't need to pay more because it's Horizon and people want to fly there. Total BS, especially in this day and age. I feel bad for the guys and gals still there but the company has done them zero favors and only have themselves to blame. Unfortunately for employees and customers.
 
n7371f
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Wed Jul 26, 2017 4:26 am

Several of the mothballed CR7's the OO flew for AS have been moved back into the TUS hangar for RTS. A couple of CRJ's in SkyWest liveries will also be transferred to the Pac NW. A contact at OO told me they're making "great" money to help bail out AAG.

Just atrocious management at QX and, honestly AS, for taking the Embraer order to the last second to squeeze concessions and leave QX with no wiggle room to deploy new aircraft. Heads should roll.
 
n7371f
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Wed Jul 26, 2017 4:29 am

Acey559 wrote:
I quit QX last year for this reason. Granted, for me it wasn't a place I was planning to stay anyhow, but it expedited my exit. When we were pleading for more money and 1224 sold us down the river, the company kept telling us they didn't need to pay more because it's Horizon and people want to fly there. Total BS, especially in this day and age. I feel bad for the guys and gals still there but the company has done them zero favors and only have themselves to blame. Unfortunately for employees and customers.


That's an element of the entire AAG culture that everybody loves Alaska/Horizon, whether it's the customer or the employee. It's being tested at QX right now and AS will find out just how much everyone loves their product when they start tearing apart Virgin's brand in the next 3 years.
 
F9Animal
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Wed Jul 26, 2017 6:42 am

Wow, it saddens me to see QX going through this. They used to be the darling of the regional airline industry.

Please correct me if I am wrong. Didn't the pilots agree to low pay in order to secure the flying of the new 175? I recall the airline put a RFP to other regionals, and offered the pilots at QX the chance to get the 175's for accepting lower pay? I could be wrong, but I am sure that is what I recall.

The obvious solution would be to offer better pay. I also recall QX pilots filing a lawsuit when QX tried to offer signing bonuses for new pilots. Could this be biting them in the arse?? Maybe AS needs to step in and help fix the problems.
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MIflyer12
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Wed Jul 26, 2017 10:35 am

PlanesNTrains wrote:
They have time to fix this. Their reputation is still one of overall reliability so as long as they are subbing flying in rather than just canceling, it might help.


Objective facts are going to undermine that reputation for operational performance very quickly. From the June 2017 traffic release,

Alaska on time: 82.9%, down 3.6 points from a year earlier

Horizon on-time: 79.8%, down 4.8 points

Virgin America on-time: 67.1%, down 5.4 points
 
MIflyer12
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Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Wed Jul 26, 2017 10:41 am

dc10lover wrote:
kabq737 wrote:
Do we think we could see Delta start to add flights to more regional airports in the West out of SEA? It would make sense. It could be easy market to pick up and extra feed for other flights. It would also be a way to establish bigger brand loyalty in the Pacific NW.

Out of Wenatchee & Yakima, use a 50 passenger CRJ 200 to Seattle.


CR2s may be better than nothing but DL has been strictly a 2-class op at SEA for a while now. 70-seat CR7s may be too much plane for Delta to fill out of places like Wenatchee and Yakima. One can't say if DL has the slack (in summer), in the right places, with the right aircraft, to add a bunch of opportunistic flying on short notice. Into SLC - maybe. Into SEA - doubt it.
 
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Jamake1
Posts: 1015
Joined: Mon May 17, 2004 2:30 pm

Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Wed Jul 26, 2017 10:53 am

If I'm not mistaken, AAG's Q2 results come out today. I hope the industry analysts on the conference call take Tilden and Co. to task for the ongoing reliability and recruitment issues at QX.

This could also be an opportune time for DL to seize on QX's operational reliability woes by adding new cities and/or frequencies in historically AS/QX dominated PNW markets...
Come fly the sun.
 
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intotheair
Posts: 2012
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2014 12:49 pm

Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Wed Jul 26, 2017 10:55 am

n7371f wrote:
Several of the mothballed CR7's the OO flew for AS have been moved back into the TUS hangar for RTS. A couple of CRJ's in SkyWest liveries will also be transferred to the Pac NW. A contact at OO told me they're making "great" money to help bail out AAG.

Just atrocious management at QX and, honestly AS, for taking the Embraer order to the last second to squeeze concessions and leave QX with no wiggle room to deploy new aircraft. Heads should roll.


Has OO really not reassigned those CR7 frames to other carriers? How many of them are left?

It certainly is sad. I used to live in EUG and enjoyed all those Q400 flights up to PDX and SEA to connect onward. I lived in SFO before then, and I now live in LAX. AS is a great airline, and I want to see them succeed. As I understand the regional sector in US aviation, I thought AS was in someways ahead of the curve by having an in-house regional operation. But seeing all these issues now, I can't help but wonder if the legacies are in for these same problems down the road, especially considering that they are all pretty much maxed out on scope with all those sexy 76-seat RJs.
300 319 320 321 332 333 345 346 380 717 733 734 735 73G 738 739 7M9 744 752 753 762 763 772 77W 788 789 CR2 CR7 CR9 CRK Q400 E175 DC10 MD82 MD90 ——— AA AF AS AY AZ B6 BA BR DL F9 FI GA HA KF LH MI QX SK SN SQ UA US VY WN
 
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Jamake1
Posts: 1015
Joined: Mon May 17, 2004 2:30 pm

Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Wed Jul 26, 2017 11:01 am

n7371f wrote:

That's an element of the entire AAG culture that everybody loves Alaska/Horizon, whether it's the customer or the employee. It's being tested at QX right now and AS will find out just how much everyone loves their product when they start tearing apart Virgin's brand in the next 3 years.
.

Great post.
Come fly the sun.
 
xdlx
Posts: 977
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2008 12:29 pm

Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Wed Jul 26, 2017 11:12 am

How much could a Q300 or Q400 Level IV sim cost? Running this 24h a day, should get your time up rather quickly!
The 1500H do not have to be on type? how about a King Air 350 if the Sim is non existent?
 
amcnd
Posts: 237
Joined: Sun Mar 29, 2015 4:19 am

Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Wed Jul 26, 2017 12:15 pm

xdlx wrote:
How much could a Q300 or Q400 Level IV sim cost? Running this 24h a day, should get your time up rather quickly!
The 1500H do not have to be on type? how about a King Air 350 if the Sim is non existent?


You can only use so many hours in a sim towards the hours required,
 
amcnd
Posts: 237
Joined: Sun Mar 29, 2015 4:19 am

Re: Horizon Air scheduling havoc will continue into the fall

Wed Jul 26, 2017 12:17 pm

[quote="

Has OO really not reassigned those CR7 frames to other carriers? How many of them are left?

.[/quote]

No, they are the AG tail numbers that Alaska had control of.. 8 left that i can see.

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